Jobs Credits IBM for Microsoft Ascent, Slams Third-Rate Software

Steve Jobs says, "Microsoft has no taste." — Elon Musk - The Martian

Elon Musk - The Martian

While Microsoft leveraged an IBM windfall and stubborn opportunism to dominate the PC market, its software remains culturally bankrupt because the company lacks original taste.

AI-assisted summary of Steve Jobs says, "Microsoft has no taste." — original source. Check the original for full context.

Source published:

Key ideas

  • Steve Jobs attributes Microsoft's historic market launch to an IBM partnership he likens to a 'Saturn V booster,' combined with opportunistic persistence. (0:00)
  • Microsoft entered the application software market by gambling on the 1984 Macintosh, steadily refining initially flawed software until overtaking Lotus and dominating PC applications. (0:45)
  • Jobs sharply criticizes Microsoft for lacking taste and originality, arguing that despite earning their commercial success, they make 'third-rate products' devoid of cultural spirit. (1:34)
  • Comparing Microsoft to McDonald's, Jobs asserts that technology creators bear a philosophical responsibility to elevate society through refined craft and enlightened design. (2:30)

Detailed notes

## Background Published on YouTube by the channel "Elon Musk - The Martian" on January 25, 2020, this video features an archival interview segment described as an angry Steve Jobs sharing his unvarnished thoughts on Windows. The video's brief description also provides an external link to spiritual leader Sadhguru's commentary regarding Jobs.

## TL;DR In this interview excerpt, Steve Jobs examines the mechanics behind Microsoft's overwhelming market dominance, attributing their initial breakthrough to an IBM partnership he likens to a "Saturn V booster." He credits Bill Gates and his team for their relentless persistence and opportunistic gamble on early Macintosh applications, which allowed them to iterate until they dominated both Mac and PC software suites. However, Jobs mounts a blistering aesthetic critique, arguing that Microsoft's defining flaw is an utter lack of taste, original ideas, and cultural awareness. While admitting Microsoft worked hard and earned its commercial success, Jobs laments that their pedestrian, third-rate products fail to enlighten users or advance human culture.

## Atmosphere & style The interview exudes a candid, sharp, and deeply reflective energy, pairing precise historical business insight with unapologetic philosophical conviction. Jobs alternates effortlessly between wry amusement about his rivalry with Bill Gates and a solemn, impassioned frustration regarding the triumph of utilitarian mediocrity over artistic refinement. Listening to him feels like witnessing a master craftsman diagnose the soul of the tech industry, elevating software development from mere commerce into a vital cultural responsibility.

## Bulletin - [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=0s) Steve Jobs attributes Microsoft's historic market launch to an IBM partnership he likens to a 'Saturn V booster,' combined with opportunistic persistence. - [00:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=45s) Microsoft entered the application software market by gambling on the 1984 Macintosh, steadily refining initially flawed software until overtaking Lotus and dominating PC applications. - [01:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=94s) Jobs sharply criticizes Microsoft for lacking taste and originality, arguing that despite earning their commercial success, they make 'third-rate products' devoid of cultural spirit. - [02:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=150s) Comparing Microsoft to McDonald's, Jobs asserts that technology creators bear a philosophical responsibility to elevate society through refined craft and enlightened design.

## Key takeaways - [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=0s) Jobs compares Microsoft's trajectory to an ordinary, utilitarian vehicle like a Ford LTD rather than a luxury performance brand like BMW or Cadillac. - [00:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=15s) Microsoft's initial ascent was propelled by an alliance with IBM, which acted as a powerful corporate booster. - [00:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=30s) Bill Gates and Microsoft capitalized on their IBM opening through immense opportunism and relentless persistence. - [00:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=45s) Before the 1984 Macintosh launch, Microsoft was not a major competitor in applications, a market then led by Lotus. - [01:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=60s) Early Microsoft software for the Mac was terrible, but continuous iteration allowed the company to eventually dominate Mac applications. - [01:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=75s) Dominating Mac software provided Microsoft the springboard to conquer PC applications through Windows. - [01:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=94s) Jobs contends Microsoft's core defect is a profound lack of taste, operating in a cultural and aesthetic vacuum. - [01:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=110s) Jobs argues that Microsoft fails to think up original ideas and relies on copying concepts pioneered by others. - [02:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=125s) Proportionally spaced typography on personal computers exists because Apple drew on centuries of printing craftsmanship, an innovation Microsoft merely copied. - [02:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=140s) Jobs respects Microsoft's commercial success as earned, but explicitly decouples commercial dominance from product excellence. - [02:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=150s) Microsoft software is characterized as 'third-rate' and compared to mass-market fast food like McDonald's. - [03:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=180s) Jobs believes technology builders have a duty to expose users to human culture's finest refinements rather than settling for uninspired mediocrity.

## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=0s) The Saturn V Booster and Opportunistic Persistence

The interviewer opens the discussion by framing Microsoft as an unstoppable corporate juggernaut, comparing it to an ordinary, utilitarian car like a Ford LTD heading into the future rather than a luxury or performance vehicle like a Cadillac or a BMW. When asked how Microsoft pulled this off, Steve Jobs explains that their trajectory was not an isolated triumph of software innovation, but an ascent propelled by a massive legacy partner. Jobs reflects: “Well, Microsoft's orbit was made possible by a Saturn V booster called IBM.” He acknowledges with a grin that Bill Gates would likely be upset with him for saying so, but insists on the historical reality of the statement. At the same time, Jobs gives credit to Gates and Microsoft for seizing that unique opening and using it as leverage to generate even greater opportunities for themselves.

Jobs points out that prior to the release of the Macintosh in 1984, Microsoft was not even a player in the applications business, an arena completely dominated at the time by Lotus. Microsoft took an enormous gamble by agreeing to develop applications for the Mac. While Jobs bluntly recalls that their earliest Mac applications were terrible, he notes that Microsoft refused to give up, steadily improving their offerings until they took over the Macintosh application ecosystem. They then used that foothold alongside Windows to cross back into the personal computer space, ultimately dominating PC applications as well. Jobs identifies two defining traits behind this success: an exceptional opportunism, which he clarifies he does not mean in a negative sense, and a relentless, stubborn persistence: “They're like the Japanese. They just keep on coming.”

```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: Microsoft Growth Trajectory According to Steve Jobs accDescr: Flowchart illustrating how Microsoft leveraged IBM and the Macintosh to dominate PC applications. subgraph Launch["Launch and Revenue"] IBM["IBM Partnership<br>'Saturn V Booster'"] REV["Massive Sustained<br>Revenue Stream"] end subgraph MacStrategy["The Mac Application Gamble"] MAC["1984 Macintosh Apps<br>(Initially 'terrible')"] ITER["Continuous Iteration<br>& Improvement"] MACDOM["Domination of Mac<br>Applications Market"] end subgraph Expansion["PC Market Conquest"] WIN["Springboard via Windows"] PCDOM["Domination of PC<br>Applications Space"] end

IBM --> REV REV --> MAC MAC --> ITER ITER --> MACDOM MACDOM --> WIN WIN --> PCDOM ```

- Microsoft was absent from the software applications sector prior to 1984, during an era when Lotus dominated the market. - Microsoft's willingness to gamble on developing for the Macintosh laid the groundwork for their entire modern application suite. - The massive ongoing revenue stream generated by the original IBM deal provided the financial cushion that allowed Microsoft to iterate through early flawed software until they won market share.

---

[01:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=94s) "They Just Have No Taste": Cultural Vacuum and Third-Rate Products

Jobs turns from Microsoft's business acumen to a harsh critique of the philosophy behind their software. He asserts that their primary shortcoming is an utter lack of aesthetic and cultural sensibility, stating: “The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste.” Jobs emphasizes that he does not mean this as a minor or superficial criticism, but as a fundamental, sweeping flaw: Microsoft fails to conceive original ideas and injects virtually no cultural awareness into its catalog. To illustrate what he means by culture, Jobs cites proportionally spaced fonts, explaining that they originated from the centuries-old craftsmanship of typesetting and finely printed books. He contends that had Apple not introduced proportionally spaced typography on the Mac, Microsoft never would have incorporated it into its own operating system.

Jobs makes clear that his frustration does not stem from corporate jealousy, acknowledging: “I have no problem with their success. They've earned their success, for the most part.” Instead, what bothers him on a human and philosophical level is the mediocrity of what Microsoft delivers to the world: “I have a problem with the fact that they just make really third-rate products.” He laments that their software lacks soul, inspiration, and any spirit of enlightenment, calling it pedestrian and comparing the company's cultural footprint to mass-market fast food: “Microsoft's just, you know, it's McDonald's.” Jobs concludes that human progress depends on people taking the finest achievements of human culture and distributing them widely so that society learns to appreciate refinement and subtlety. He expresses deep sadness that Microsoft's dominant products completely fail to show deeper insight or genuine creativity.

- Jobs argues that Microsoft does not invent original concepts, but merely adopts ideas introduced by others, such as typographical fonts popularized by the Mac. - He explicitly separates Microsoft's commercial success from its product quality, stating that while they worked hard and earned their market position, their software remains third-rate. - In Jobs's view, technology companies have a responsibility to elevate humanity by exposing ordinary users to high-taste, enlightened design rather than settling for uninspired mass production.

## Notable quotes > [01:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=94s) The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste. — Steve Jobs

> [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU&t=0s) Microsoft's orbit was made possible by a Saturn V booster called IBM. — Steve Jobs

## Mentioned Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, Microsoft, IBM, Apple, Macintosh, Lotus, Windows, McDonald's, Ford LTD, Cadillac, BMW, Sadhguru

## Video description Angry Steve Jobs speaks on Windows in an interview.

Here is what Sadhguru has to say of Steve Jobs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOrECC0szww

[Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiOzGI4MqSU)

中文简报

乔布斯称微软崛起归功于IBM，痛批其软件沦为三流 尽管微软凭借IBM带来的意外之财与执着的机会主义主导了PC市场，但由于缺乏原创品味，其软件在文化层面依然匮乏。 在这段访谈节选里，史蒂夫·乔布斯分析了微软取得压倒性市场统治地位背后的机制，将其最初的突破归功于与IBM的合作，并将其比作“土星5号助推器”。他肯定了比尔·盖茨及其团队的不懈坚持，以及早期押注Macintosh应用的投机策略，这使他们能够不断迭代，直至统治Mac和PC的软件套件。然而，乔布斯从审美角度发起了严厉批评，认为微软最根本的缺陷在于完全缺乏品味、原创理念和文化意识。乔布斯虽承认微软工作拼搏并赢得了商业成功，但他感叹其平庸的三流产品未能启迪用户或推进人类文化。 史蒂夫·乔布斯将微软具有历史意义的市场启动归功于与IBM的合作（他将其比作“土星5号助推器”），以及带有机会主义色彩的不懈坚持。 (0:00) 微软通过押注1984年的Macintosh打入应用软件市场，不断改进最初存在缺陷的软件，直至超越Lotus并主导PC应用。 (0:45) 乔布斯严厉批评微软缺乏品味和原创性，认为尽管微软赢得了商业成功，但其制造的是缺乏文化精神的“三流产品”。 (1:34) 乔布斯将微软比作麦当劳，断言科技缔造者肩负着通过精湛工艺和开明设计来提升社会的哲学责任。 (2:30)

Source quotes

[1:34] Steve Jobs: The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste. [0:00] Steve Jobs: Microsoft's orbit was made possible by a Saturn V booster called IBM.

Original transcript

[0:00] That's why. What about Microsoft? I mean, that's the juggernaut now. It's a kind of a Ford LTD going into the future. It's definitely not a Cadillac. It's not a BMW. it's just... What's going on there? How did those guys do that? Thank you. Well, Microsoft's orbit was made possible by a Saturn V booster called IBM. and I know Bill would get upset with me for saying this, but of course it was true. Yeah. and um... much to Bill and Microsoft's credit, they used that fantastic opportunity to create more opportunity for themselves. Most people don't remember but until 1984 with the Mac, Microsoft was not in the applications business. It was dominated by Lotus. And Microsoft took a big gamble to write for the Mac. and they came out with applications that were terrible. But they kept at it, they made them better. And eventually they dominated the Macintosh application market and then used a springboard of Windows to get into the PC market with those same applications. and now they dominate the applications in the PC space too. They have two characteristics. I think they're very strong opportunists. And I don't mean that in a bad way. And two, they're like the Japanese. They just keep on coming. Now, they were able to do that because of the revenue stream. from the IBM deal. But nonetheless, they made the most of it, and I give them a lot of credit for that. The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste. They have absolutely no taste and what that means is... I don't mean that in a small way. I mean that in a big way. in the sense that They... They don't think of original ideas and they don't bring much culture into their product. And you say, "Well, why is that important?" Well, you know, proportionally spaced fonts come from typesetting and beautiful books. That's where one gets the idea. If it weren't for the Mac, they would never have that in their products. Um... And... So I guess. I am saddened, not by Microsoft's success. I have no problem with their success. they've earned their success. for the most part. I have a problem with the fact that they just make really third-rate products. Their products have no spirit to them. Their products have no in-- sort of spirit of enlightenment about them. they are very pedestrian and The sad part is that most customers don't don't have a lot of that spirit either. But the way that we're going to ratchet up our species, is to take the best... and to spread it around everybody so that everybody grows up with better things. and starts to understand the subtlety of these better things. Um... And And Microsoft's just, you know, it's McDonald's. So that's what saddens me. Not that Microsoft is one. but that Microsoft's products don't display more Um, more insight and more creativity. So.