Arthur Brooks Links Long-Term Happiness to Prefrontal Cortex Processing

亚瑟·布鲁克斯将长期幸福感与前额叶皮层处理联系起来 亚瑟·布鲁克斯认为，人类持久的幸福取决于通过刻意沉思、共同经历和为他人服务，将基本情绪驱动转移至前额叶皮层进行处理。 哈佛大学教授兼社会科学家亚瑟·布鲁克斯剖析了幸福的科学，将其重新阐释为不仅仅是一种感觉，而是愉悦、满足与意义的结合体。本次讨论探讨了如何通过四大核心支柱——信仰、家庭、友谊和有意义的工作——来构建有目标的人生，同时避开金钱和名望等中间目标的陷阱。布鲁克斯通过PANAS量表介绍了情绪人格特征，分析了爱情的神经化学机制，并提出了结构化日记和每日沉思等实用的元认知策略来管理恐惧与焦虑。 幸福感约有50%由基因决定，但幸福并非一种感觉，而是由享受、满足和意义三大核心要素构成的方向与生活方式。 (0:00) 单纯独自追逐快感容易陷入边缘系统的多巴胺回路；只有加入社交连接与回忆，才能将短暂快感转化为前额叶处理的真正享受。 (20:01) 满足感等于“拥有除以渴望”，持久满足的关键在于克制并减少欲望，而非无止境积累；金钱与外貌等目标常因适应效应陷入“抵达谬误”。 (28:32) 真正支撑长久幸福的四大支柱是信仰（超越性追求）、家庭、真实友谊以及服务他人的工作，而非金钱或名声等中间目标。 (30:56) 生命意义由连贯性、目标与重要性构成，通过践行道德准则、日常静心沉思与阅读智慧经典，能够摆脱习得性无助并找到人生价值。 (38:13)

Arthur Brooks argues that lasting well-being is not an elusive feeling or a fixed destination, but a measurable discipline requiring personal agency, emotional regulation, and intentional investments in relationships, purpose, and service. The Structure of Well-Being and Satisfaction (30:56) Brooks contends that treating happiness as a mere emotion is a primary obstacle to achieving it; feelings are merely the evidence of happiness, analogous to the smell of dinner signaling a meal. True well-being relies on balancing three distinct "macronutrients": enjoyment, satisfaction, and meaning. Enjoyment elevates animalistic pleasure into a higher cognitive experience by incorporating social connection and shared memory. Satisfaction requires deferred gratification—demonstrated by Walter Mischel's Stanford marshmallow experiments—yet is continually threatened by the hedonic treadmill and the "arrival fallacy," wherein achieving a desired goal yields only a temporary emotional high before baseline homeostasis resets. To counter this cycle, Brooks models satisfaction as "Haves divided by Wants," arguing that sustained contentment stems from managing desires downward rather than attempting to expand possessions or accolades indefinitely. While intermediate goals like fitness, wealth, or prestige offer diminishing returns, Brooks identifies four enduring pursuits that break the hedonic cycle: a transcendent philosophy or faith, family intimacy, deep personal friendships, and work that serves others. Social Contagion and Compassionate Boundaries (74:56) Drawing on longitudinal data from the Framingham Heart Study, Brooks illustrates that emotional and behavioral states—including obesity, divorce, and happiness—are socially contagious. Proximity intensifies this dynamic; having a close friend or family member living within a mile who becomes genuinely happier increases one's own odds of happiness by 25%. However, close contact with chronic negativity spreads an equally potent emotional virus that degrades personal resilience. To manage difficult relationships without sacrificing well-being, Brooks distinguishes empathy from compassion. While modern culture prioritizes empathy—absorbing and feeling another person's emotional distress—Brooks cautions that it frequently leads to paralysis, particularly in leadership and parenting. Compassion, by contrast, establishes strong emotional boundaries to provide what a person genuinely needs out of love, following an "oxygen mask" principle that requires maintaining one's own emotional stability before attempting to assist others. Metacognition and Regulating Negative Emotion (81:04) Longitudinal twin studies suggest that roughly 50% of baseline happiness is genetically inherited, with emotional intensity mapped across the Positive and Negative Affect Schedule (PANAS) into four distinct profiles: Cheerleaders, Poets, Judges, and Mad Scientists. While negative affect serves an evolutionary purpose by identifying survival threats, modern environments frequently convert episodic fear into unfocused, chronic anxiety driven by a steady release of stress hormones along the amygdala-adrenal axis. Brooks advocates metacognition—deliberately analyzing one's own thought processes—to shift emotional responses from the primitive limbic system to the executive prefrontal cortex. Simple interventions, such as a 10-minute journaling protocol detailing specific fears, worst-case scenarios, and practical actions, ground abstract anxieties into solvable challenges. Furthermore, rejecting Martin Seligman's concept of "learned helplessness" by focusing exclusively on choices within personal control prevents individuals from adopting a passive victim mindset that harms long-term health and lifespan. Constructing Purpose Through Transcendence and Service (46:29) Brooks defines meaning as comprising coherence (understanding life events), purpose (directional objectives), and significance (believing one's existence matters). Dismissing the cultural trope of waiting to passively "find" a singular purpose—which he terms the unhelpful "go find a rock" model—Brooks proposes a proactive protocol: articulating explicit moral values, practicing daily screen-free contemplation, and dedicating 15 minutes each day to foundational wisdom literature. Directing attention away from the self is essential to this framework. Citing experiments by Adam Waytz at Northwestern University, Brooks highlights that engaging in moral deeds generates significantly greater increases in well-being than self-care activities. Acting in alignment with an internal moral framework builds self-respect, while pivoting from personal gratification toward meaningful service provides a durable anchor against existential distress. Brooks concludes that while genetic baselines and external circumstances impose real constraints, individuals hold substantial agency over their psychological trajectory. Achieving durable happiness requires shifting focus away from uncontrollable external events and self-absorption, directing daily effort instead toward metacognitive emotional habits, robust boundaries against social negativity, and dedicated service to others.

哈佛大学教授亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）指出，幸福并非被动的情绪感受或终点状态，而是一门可通过神经科学与行为习惯主动管理的实践学科；个体持久的幸福感建立在内在能动性、三大核心要素的平衡以及对超越性人生支柱的深耕之上，而非对外在成就的盲目追逐。 解构幸福：三大核心营养素与多巴胺陷阱 (12:05) 布鲁克斯强调，将幸福等同于“感觉”是提升幸福感最大的认知误区。情绪仅是幸福的外在表征，恰如饭菜的香气仅是食物的证据。纯粹且不受负面情绪调节的绝对快乐在生物学上极其危险，负面情绪实质上发挥着预警与生存保护功能。科学意义上的幸福由三大“核心营养素”构成：享乐（Enjoyment）、满足感（Satisfaction）与意义感（Meaning）。 享乐必须与动物性的本能快感（Pleasure）相剥离。快感由边缘系统驱动，极易演变为成瘾行为；唯有加入“人际联结”与“记忆”两个要素，才能将体验引导至前额叶皮层，升华为真正的享乐。满足感则源自延迟满足与克服艰难后的喜悦，斯坦福大学著名的棉花糖实验表明，能够延迟满足的儿童在日后学业与人际上表现更佳。然而，生理与情绪的内稳态机制会催生“享乐适应跑道”，让成就带来的快感迅速归零。布鲁克斯指出，满足感的公式是“拥有物除以欲望”，盲目追求拥有的增量只会陷入“到达谬误”（Arrival Fallacy），长久满足的秘诀在于主动管理并降低欲望分母。 规避到达谬误：四大超越性支柱与自律实践 (30:56) 金钱、权力、快感与名声等外在指标仅能作为中间工具，若将其当作终极目标，必将触发享乐适应而导致失望。布鲁克斯结合自身指导政商领袖的研究指出，真正能够打破内稳态归零循环并带来持久幸福的四大超越性支柱为：信仰（或沉思性的哲学生活）、家庭、深层友谊，以及能够服务于他人的工作。 在日常实践中，目标设定必须基于内在动机而非外在虚荣。以健身为例，减掉腹部脂肪或追求体格外貌往往伴随着到达谬误——达标后并不会自动改变生活质量。布鲁克斯坚持每天清晨进行60分钟的高强度锻炼，其目的在于借助每日固定的程序消除意志力损耗的决策摩擦。神经生物学表明，积极情绪与消极情绪在边缘系统由独立区域处理，高强度运动能有效降低压力激素皮质醇并抑制消极情绪，为个体的心理稳定提供生理基础。 情绪传染与关系质量：同理心与慈悲的界限 (74:56) 人际网络具有深度的行为与心理传染性。著名的弗雷明汉心脏研究（Framingham Heart Study）跟踪数据显示，肥胖、离婚与幸福感均能在社交圈内横向传染。物理与情感距离越近，传染效应越强；若在一英里内有亲友变得更幸福，个体自身的幸福概率将提升25%。在亲密关系与社会交往中，布鲁克斯主张区分“同理心”（Empathy）与“慈悲”（Compassion）：同理心仅是感同身受并吸收他人的痛苦，极易导致情绪瘫痪；而慈悲则是带着情感边界与坚定意志，出于爱去给予对方真正所需的支持。 针对人群特质，外向者往往能捕获更多的短期即时愉悦，但更容易在失去群体关注时陷入孤独；内向者则倾向于建立稳固、小规模且非功利的“真正朋友”（Real Friends），而非工作社交中的“交易型朋友”（Deal Friends），因而在人生后半程拥有更高的意义感。此外，丧偶研究揭示了显著的性别差异：约60%的60岁男性将妻子视作唯一挚友，失去伴侣后身心状态急剧恶化；而仅有30%的女性将丈夫视作唯一挚友，女性更广泛的亲密支持网络赋予了其更强的生存韧性。 掌控能动性：以元认知将恐惧转移至理性中枢 (81:04) 双胞胎研究表明幸福感约有50%受遗传影响，但个体依然拥有巨大的主动调整空间。积极心理学创始人马丁·塞利格曼（Martin Seligman）的实验证实，当个体认为自身行为对结果毫无影响时，会陷入“习得性无助”。布鲁克斯警示，现代社会中将自我视为外在力量受害者的心态会严重摧毁生命质量与寿命。重获幸福的前提是确立个人能动性，并认识到自身对情绪反应拥有主导权。 元认知（思考你的思考）是阻断焦虑的核心工具。进化机制下，视皮层感知威胁后仅需74毫秒即可通过杏仁核与下丘脑刺激肾上腺素及皮质醇分泌，现代社会的模糊威胁使这种急性恐惧退化为长期的弥散性焦虑。布鲁克斯建议通过每日10分钟的恐惧书写，详细列出恐惧根源、最坏情况及应对方案，强行将原始情绪从边缘系统转移至前额叶皮层进行理性解析。同时，践行日常沉思并保持言行与个人道德底线一致，能有效避免内心精神冲突，维护核心自尊。 布鲁克斯总结认为，个体外部的大多数事物均不可控，试图掌控不可控因素是焦虑滋生的根本诱因。获取平和与意义的路径在于承认外界局限，将有限的认知资源彻底收回至自身掌控范围内，通过自律习惯、知行合一以及利他服务构建内在秩序。

## Background 本期访谈由播客《The Diary Of A CEO》（主持人斯蒂文·巴特利特）于 2024 年 1 月 18 日在 YouTube 平台发布。节目简介重点推介了哈佛大学教授阿瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）与其合著新书《Build the Life You Want》，旨在借助脑神经科学与行为心理学打破大众对幸福的刻板认知，并探讨人际传染、人生意义与焦虑应对等核心议题。 ## TL;DR 哈佛大学教授阿瑟·布鲁克斯在访谈中揭示，幸福感约有 50% 由基因决定，它并非转瞬即逝的感官快感，而是由享受、满足感与人生意义三大支柱共同构建的动态方向。他深入剖析了人们常陷入的“终点谬误”与享乐适应陷阱，阐明了情绪与生活状态具有强大的社交传染性，并借助 PANAS 情感模型分析了不同人格在亲密关系中的互补机制。最后，布鲁克斯提出了通过前额叶主导的“元认知”书写和利他奉献来化解焦虑、夺回个人能动性的实用科学路径。 ## Atmosphere & style 整场对话在严密硬核的跨学科剖析与高度坦诚的自我暴露之间达成平衡，基调既睿智理性又充满温情。两位对谈者如同知己般剖析各自的焦虑、家庭缺憾与奋斗执念，思维碰撞既有学者抽丝剥茧的幽默风趣，又有触及生存终极命题时的凝重深沉。整期播客带给听众一种如释重负的解脱感，在破除虚妄成功学的焦虑后，重获对生活秩序的平静掌控。 ## Bulletin - [04:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=257s) 双胞胎与行为遗传学研究证实，人类幸福基准线约有 50% 由基因决定，人格特质的遗传度介于 40% 到 80% 之间。 - [01:14:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4455s) 幸福感具有强烈的社交网络传染效应：根据弗雷明汉心脏研究，一英里内的亲友变得更快乐，个体的幸福概率将提升 25%，肥胖与离婚亦具类似传播性。 - [27:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1662s) 人类真正持久的满意度取决于公式“拥有 ÷ 欲望”，而减脂等世俗追求高达 95% 的失败率源于将希望寄托于孤立结果的“到达谬误”。 - [01:07:31](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4051s) 热恋期的大脑成像与冰毒成瘾惊人相似，多巴胺飙升与血清素骤降会诱发病态的反刍思维与猜疑，因而恋爱初期往往伴随着较低的真实幸福感。 ## Key takeaways - [15:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=938s) 幸福感不是一种感觉，而是方向；感觉只是幸福存在的副产物，正如饭菜香气不等于晚餐本身。 - [18:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1085s) 幸福建立在三大“宏量营养素”支柱之上：需要认知与社交参与的享受（Enjoyment）、历经奋斗挣扎获得的满足感（Satisfaction），以及由连贯性、目标与重要性构成的意义（Meaning）。 - [19:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1185s) 快感（Pleasure）由边缘系统驱使且极易成瘾，只有注入“他人”与“记忆”经由前额叶皮层加工后，才能升华为促进幸福的享受。 - [26:23](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1583s) 体内平衡（Homeostasis）机制会导致人陷入“享乐适应跑步机”，达成世俗目标后的喜悦转瞬即逝，管理欲望（想要得更少）是破除死循环的底层解法。 - [30:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1836s) 免于享乐跑步机吞噬的四根终极超越性支柱是：深层哲学与信仰、家庭亲情、真正的深厚友谊，以及服务于他人的工作。 - [34:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2088s) 体育锻炼在神经机制上并非凭空制造快乐，而是通过降低皮质醇等途径系统性消除“不快乐”；快乐与不快乐由不同脑区独立生成。 - [38:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2293s) 人生意义的自我诊断依赖两个终极追问：“你为什么活着？”与“你今天愿意为什么而献出生命？”，迷茫代表着人生探索的起点而非终局。 - [01:00:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3614s) 在 PANAS 情感分类中，人群分为疯科学家、啦啦队长、诗人与法官四种类型；亲密关系与团队合作中，寻求特质互补远优于寻找克隆体。 - [01:12:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4334s) 利他行为与志愿服务相比于单纯的自我关怀（Self-Care）能带来更显著的幸福感跃升，能将个体从自我中心的“心理大戏”中彻底解放。 - [01:19:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4768s) 外向者易于在短期社交中获得享乐，但内向者凭借更深沉稳定的核心友谊，往往享有更稳固的长期幸福与人生意义感。 - [01:21:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4865s) 焦虑的本质是“失去聚焦的恐惧”，运用元认知（Metacognition）通过书写将情绪拉入前额叶皮层进行理性拆解，是驯化恐惧的核心解药。 - [01:25:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=5130s) 面对生命中大量无法掌控的外部事件，重获主观能动性（Agency）与内心平静的唯一途径，是将全部精力重新收敛并聚焦于自身可控的事物上。 ## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=0s) 破解幸福密码：从群体趋势到认知误区 开篇短片中，哈佛大学教授、社会科学家兼畅销书作家阿瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）给出了一个惊人的自我测试结果：通过年复一年的系统性追踪，他如今的幸福感比五年前提升了整整 60%，原因在于他终于“破解了幸福的密码”。布鲁克斯指出，大众社会灌输给我们的幸福常识大多是错的。科学研究证实，个体的幸福感约有 50% 取决于遗传基因，内向者往往比外向者享有更持久的长期幸福，而幸福本身甚至像一种“思想病毒”，能在人群之间产生连锁传染。 在漫长的人生轨迹追踪研究中，科学家们发现人际关系对个体状态有着深远的影响：肥胖是会“传染”的，身边好友离婚会大幅拉高你的离婚概率，但同样地，朋友变得幸福也能直接感染你。然而令人担忧的是，经合组织（OECD）国家人群的整体幸福感自 1990 年前后起便持续走低。人类之所以难以获得持久快乐，一方面是因为真正的欣喜往往建立在克服困难与痛苦的基础上；另一方面则是普遍陷入了“终点谬误”（Arrival Fallacy）——误以为只要减掉小肚子或达成某个财务数字，人生就会立刻变得完美，殊不知 95% 的节食减肥最终都以失败告终，人从前进的“过程”中获得的满足感远胜于那个孤立的目标本身。 - 幸福感约有 50% 由基因决定，内向性格在长期幸福感上往往更具优势。 - 情绪与生活状态具备强传染性：密友的体态变化、婚姻破裂或幸福感提升，都会显著影响个人的生活轨迹。 - 减脂行业的失败率高达 95%，核心诱因在于将希望寄托于特定结果的“终点谬误”，忽视了奋斗过程带来的真实滋养。 --- ### [02:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=133s) 幸福学教授的使命与全球幸福感现状 在斯蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）插播完对常客听众的订阅呼吁后，访谈正式切入正题。被问及自己的本职工作时，布鲁克斯表示自己毕生致力于“借助人类幸福的科学与思想，振奋人心并将人们联结在一起”。虽然他在哈佛肯尼迪政府学院与哈佛商学院的技术头衔是领导力教授，但他真正的教学核心是“领导力与幸福学”。这是一门融合了社会心理学、神经科学、行为经济学与哲学的庞大交叉学科。他的教学目标是帮助未来的商业与政界领袖理解自己身为“幸福传播者”的角色，从而在带领团队走向成功的同时，把积极的影响辐射给下属与社会。 谈及当今世界的幸福现状，布鲁克斯直言学术界很难对不同国家进行草率的横向打分。针对联合国等机构每年发布的《全球幸福报告》（往往由丹麦等北欧国家拔得头筹），他提出了尖锐的批评：在 100 个国家各找 1000 个人询问“你如何评价自己的生活”，这种做法就像去问各国居民有多喜欢本国音乐，然后直接根据打分高低断定哪个国家的音乐最好一样，存在严重的评估偏差。科学上更可行的方法，是追踪同一文化与社会群体在时间维度上的均值变化。数据显示，包括美国和英国在内的多数经合组织国家，人均幸福感自 1990 年起便呈现出不可逆转的滑坡。面对 1992 年出生的斯蒂文，布鲁克斯幽默地打趣道：“幸福感下滑不是因为你出生了，问题出在我们这代人身上。” ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 幸福科学的学科构成与应用闭环 accDescr: 展示心理学、神经科学等底层学科如何汇聚为幸福科学，并赋能领导者以影响社会整体幸福感。 subgraph Disciplines ["交叉学科基础"] SP["社会心理学"] NS["神经科学"] BE["行为经济学"] PH["哲学思想"] end subgraph Science ["哈佛幸福学架构"] HS["幸福科学体系"] end subgraph Leadership ["领导力实践与赋能"] LEAD["未来政商领袖"] TEAM["组织与下属"] SOC["广泛社会福祉"] end SP --> HS NS --> HS BE --> HS PH --> HS HS --> LEAD LEAD --> TEAM TEAM --> SOC ``` --- ### [04:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=257s) 基因占五成：双胞胎研究与非天生快乐者 斯蒂文提出，当一个人将毕生精力投入某一特定课题时，背后往往交织着极深的个人渊源。布鲁克斯坦率承认，自己之所以深入研究幸福，正是因为他天生就不是一个快乐的人，其基线幸福感甚至远低于人群平均线，而这其中至少有一半是遗传基因在作祟。他借此普及了行为遗传学中著名的双胞胎追踪数据库：该研究收集了出生于 1930 年代中期至 1960 年代之间、因家庭变故在出生时被不同家庭收养、直到成年后才重聚的同卵双胞胎案例。这并非科学家的蓄意实验，而是真实历史际遇留下的宝贵样本。 当这些此前素未谋面的双胞胎在成年后相认时，场面极度温馨感人，但在 YouTube 感人重聚视频的背后，总有一群“拿着写字夹板、像我一样恼人的社会科学家”在对他们进行详尽的心理测量。测试数据一致表明，人类的人格特质中有 40% 到 80% 由基因决定，其余部分才受环境、经历和具体境遇塑造。这意味着大五人格特质（经验开放性、尽责性、外向性、宜人性、神经质）在极大程度上是天生的，幸福基准线也有约 50% 刻在 DNA 中。布鲁克斯开玩笑说：“斯蒂文，从字面意义上讲，你的母亲造就了你的不快乐——或者快乐，具体因人而异。” - 同卵双胞胎跨家庭抚养研究证实，个体人格特质的遗传度介于 40% 到 80% 之间。 - 大五人格模型的所有维度均受到强大的遗传控制，幸福感知力约有 50% 受天生基因影响。 - 认识到基因的决定性作用，有助于打破“无法快乐是个人道德缺陷”的错误认知，从而通过后天认知工具进行针对性弥补。 --- ### [05:55](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=355s) 重写人生剧本：打破童年轮回与代际亲情重建 聊起自己的原生家庭，布鲁克斯回忆称童年生活并不糟糕，但也颇为复杂。父母虽然彼此相爱也爱孩子，但由于各自深陷生活泥潭，当他步入青年时期后，与父母的交流便退化成了客套疏离的礼节性互动。他强调，世上没有任何人的童年是十全十美的，许多人终其一生都在为童年的缺憾所困扰，甚至觉得自己注定要重蹈覆辙。然而，人完全有能力“重写自己的历史剧本”：站在成年的视角回望过去，精准剔除那些造成伤害的变量，在未来的生活中主动做出反向选择。 布鲁克斯将这一哲学彻底贯彻到了自己的家庭规划中。他提到，斯蒂文未来结婚生子时也必须思考：童年经验中哪些该保留，哪些必须舍弃。过去，布鲁克斯的父母长年与他们分居两地（一方在巴塞罗那，一方在西雅图，而他们一家生活在纽约和华盛顿特区），导致自己的三个孩子在成长过程中几乎没有体会过深厚的祖辈亲情。如今已晋升为祖父的布鲁克斯立下铁律：绝不与孩子分隔两地，无论孩子们乐意与否，他每天都会雷打不动地拨打 FaceTime 视频电话，只要有机会就多陪孙子。为了下周能帮子女看护小外孙，他甚至毫不犹豫地推掉了大量商界行程。 --- ### [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=448s) 希望的力量与丧偶效应的“男女不对称” 斯蒂文随后将话题引向生命中的“希望感”，询问是否有科学证据表明心存希望的人在罹患重疾或面对衰老时存活率更高。他特别提到一个常见的社会现象：许多相伴一生的九旬老夫妻中，一旦一方离世，原本健康的另一方往往也会在短短数月内相继撒手人寰。布鲁克斯证实了这种规律的大体存在，但也抛出了一个反常识且略显冰冷的数据真相：这一丧偶效应存在极大的“性别不对称”——如果丈夫先走，妻子通常安然无恙，寡妇的幸福感甚至远高于鳏夫；但如果是妻子离世，失去伴侣的男性往往状况急转直下。 造成这种悬殊反差的根源在于男女社交网络的深刻差异。统计数据显示，大约 60% 的六十岁男性将自己的妻子视作唯一或最好的朋友；而同样年龄段的女性中，仅有约 30% 认为丈夫是自己最好的朋友。女性通常拥有更广泛深厚的同性密友圈子、更亲近的血亲联结以及与成年子女更紧密的情感纽带，而男性的情感寄托几乎完全被妻子垄断。一旦这种唯一的依赖瓦解，男性便会彻底陷入绝望。从神经与生理机制来看，失去希望会导致人彻底放弃自我关照：停止运动、缺乏心智刺激、饮食失序甚至滥用药物，这些生理退化在九旬高龄时是致命的。布鲁克斯最后严肃地告诫：无论是在 90 岁、59 岁还是斯蒂文所处的 31 岁，希望都是维持生命机能不可或缺的核心支柱。 - 伴侣离世对男性健康的摧毁力度远大于女性，鳏夫的死亡风险与心理退化显著高于寡妇。 - 60 岁男性中有 60% 将妻子视为最好朋友，而对应女性中仅有 30% 将丈夫视为最好朋友，凸显出中老年男性极其单薄的情感支持系统。 - 绝望会直接引发负面生理代偿：运动量骤降、社交闭锁、认知退化及不健康的生活方式，加速器官与生命的整体衰竭。 ### [09:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=570s) 幸福的科学实践与教学相长 亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）明确指出了自己工作的核心使命：通过向人们展示他们作为自己未来的行动主体（agent）能够有所作为，从而为他们带来希望，赋予他们更长寿、更美好、更成功的生活。自从全心投入这项事业以来，布鲁克斯建立了一套严密的身心健康测量机制。他强调自己从不在数据上弄虚作假，而是将幸福拆解为不同的“宏量营养素”（macronutrients）与微量营养素，年复一年、学期复学期地追踪评估。通过持续践行与学生相同的测试指标，布鲁克斯表示自己如今的幸福感比五年前提升了整整 60%。 面对史蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）关于这种提升是源于“对自身的改造”还是“作为学者的本职工作”的追问，布鲁克斯回答两者兼具。提升幸福感的底层逻辑包含三个不可割裂的闭环： 1. **理解科学（Understand the science）**：掌握幸福背后的神经生物学与心理学规律。 2. **践行于生活（Apply it to your life）**：在日常行为中身体力行。 3. **与他人分享（Share it with others）**：通过教授他人来强化记忆并形成自我问责。 布鲁克斯指出，当人们只是被动吸收信息时，这些想法往往停留在转瞬即逝的边缘系统（limbic system）冲动层面；唯有通过讨论和传授，大脑的前额叶皮层等执行中枢才会深度介入，将知识彻底内化。他顺势肯定了史蒂芬主持播客对自身的积极改变——在节目与私生活中持续探讨赋能他人、提升生命质量的科学议题，本身就是让自己变得更幸福、更成功的最佳途径。 --- ### [11:22](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=682s) 习得性无助与受害者心态的危害 当被问及“能动性”（agency，即相信自己对生活和未来拥有控制力而非无能为力）是否有严谨的研究支持时，布鲁克斯给出了肯定的答复，并追溯到积极心理学之父马丁·塞利格曼（Martin Seligman）在 20 世纪 60 年代末至 70 年代初的奠基性研究。塞利格曼是布鲁克斯的学术导师与挚友。在其早期的经典实验中，研究人员剥夺了受试对象的掌控感——例如让人们投硬币玩老虎机，却逐步让他们发现拉不拉摇杆的概率结果完全一样；而在著名的动物电击实验中，原本会主动跳避通电地板的狗，在发现无论怎么做都无法逃脱微弱电击后，最终会彻底放弃挣扎，趴在地板上哀鸣。 这种心理机制被称为“习得性无助”（learned helplessness）。布鲁克斯犀利地指出，现代社会的政治家、大众媒体和激进倡导者正在大规模向公众灌输这种无力感，劝说人们相信一切不幸都源于外部体制，自己只是无可奈何的受害者。一旦个体全盘接纳了“受害者身份”，就会迅速习得这种无助，导致生活品质大幅下降、事业受挫，甚至严重损耗预期寿命。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 习得性无助与受害者心态的恶性循环 accDescr: 展示外界负面暗示如何剥夺个体能动性，导致习得性无助并损害身心健康。 subgraph External["外部环境影响"] A["政治说辞 / 媒体渲染 / 激进倡导"] --> B["灌输无力感：'系统性不公，你无能为力'"] end subgraph Psychology["心理机制内化"] B --> C["接纳受害者身份认同"] C --> D["丧失个人能动性 (Lack of Agency)"] D --> E["习得性无助 (Learned Helplessness)"] end subgraph Outcome["现实后果"] E --> F["幸福感滑坡"] E --> G["生活与事业成功率下降"] E --> H["健康受损与寿命缩短"] end ``` --- ### [13:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=785s) 个人责任与难以下咽的“菠菜专栏” 针对能动性与掌控感的话题，史蒂芬分享了一个生动的案例：作家莫·乔达特（Mo Gawdat）在撰写新书时曾邀请 500 名读者参与在线 Google 文档内测，但只要一读到“个人责任”（personal responsibility）的章节，就有高达 8% 的人因抗拒而直接退出。布鲁克斯对此深有共鸣，并将其比喻为“菠菜”——营养极高但味道苦涩，人人都知道有益却往往避之不及。 布鲁克斯在《大西洋月刊》（*The Atlantic*）每周四撰写幸福科学专栏（每篇约 1200 至 1300 字）。他大约每两到三个月就会写一篇“菠菜专栏”，重申那些如同祖母教诲般质朴却逆耳的常识： - 想要幸福，先学会谦逊； - 想要幸福，学会改变自己的成见； - 遭遇分歧时，不要斥责对方愚蠢或邪恶，多倾听、少说教。 然而，在充斥着“我是对的，错全在别人”的极化社会中，这些要求自我反思的“菠菜文章”阅读量总是最低。针对史蒂芬提出的“似乎没人会自认是受害者”这一观察，布鲁克斯予以反驳：事实上，当今大量人群都在公开以受害者自居——无论是声称受害于资本主义制度、特权阶层，还是深层政府（Deep State）与各种阴谋论。布鲁克斯强调，每个人固然在某些方面都曾遭受不公，但真正的解脱力量绝非试图强行改变外部客观环境，而是转动自身思维内部的杠杆，从接纳个人责任和管理自己的情绪与承诺开始。 --- ### [15:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=938s) 幸福不是感觉：三大“宏量营养素”模型 关于“幸福是否是一种选择”，布鲁克斯澄清了一个核心误区：“纯粹的绝对幸福”是无法企及的，因为“幸福是一个方向，而非一个终点”；但**变得更幸福**（being happier）绝对是一种可以通过承诺与自我管理达成的选择。通往更幸福人生的第一步，是打破社会灌输的错误认知——**幸福根本不是一种感觉**。 布鲁克斯在哈佛商学院教授一门极其火爆的“幸福科学”研讨课（两班共 180 名 MBA 学生，候补名单多达 400 人，甚至流传着学生自建的盗版 Zoom 直播链接）。在第一堂课冷抽问学生“什么是幸福”时，大多数人都会脱口而出“幸福是和爱人在一起时的感受”或“做喜欢的事时的快感”。布鲁克斯毫不留情地纠正道： > “感觉仅仅是幸福存在的证据，就像闻到饭菜的香味是饭菜存在的证据一样，香味本身并不是晚餐。” 布鲁克斯进一步阐述，负面情绪对于生存至关重要，能让人保持警惕并在试错中学习成长。若没有负面情绪，人类很快就会面临毁灭。因此，追求没有负面情绪的纯粹幸福极其危险。真正的幸福建立在三项不可或缺的“宏量营养素”之上，它们需要维持平衡与高质量的摄入： | 宏量营养素 | 常见社会误区 | 科学本质与机制 | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **享受 / 乐趣 (Enjoyment)** | 混同于即时的生理愉悦（Pleasure） | 需前额叶皮层等高级认知系统介入，包含仪式感与社会连接 | | **满足感 (Satisfaction)** | 认为达成目标即可一劳永逸 | 伴随艰苦付出与多巴胺奖赏回路的平衡 | | **意义 (Meaning)** | 逃避痛苦与苦难 | 在经历挑战与负面事件后构建的人生连贯性与目的性 | 布鲁克斯将这三大支柱与膳食营养学进行了精妙对比：正如大众往往蛋白质摄入不足，却在饮食中充斥过量的高升糖指数碳水化合物一样；在心理层面，大多数人也陷入了严重的“宏量营养失衡”——错将边缘系统主导的原始感官“肉欲与快感”（Pleasure）误当成了需要前额叶参与的高阶“享受”（Enjoyment）。只有理清这三者的定义，才能确立真正科学、可落地的幸福策略。 ### [18:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1110s) 情绪的神经机制：负面情绪为何至关重要 亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）首先从大脑结构切入，阐释了人类情绪系统的底层运作逻辑。在人脑深处，存在着一套演化了超过4000万年的边缘系统（limbic system）。它接收来自脑干等基础原始结构的传入信号，并将外界环境发生的变化实时“转译”为信息。布鲁克斯明确指出：“所有情绪本质上都只是信息而已”，世界上根本不存在所谓的“好情绪”与“坏情绪”，即便某些情绪在当下显得不太适应（maladapted），它们的存在也是为了让人类活下去。 特别是在生存竞争中，负面情绪的作用远胜于正面情绪。人类之所以能够繁衍生息至今，正是依赖于被称为“四大核心负面情绪”的防御机制： - **愤怒（Anger）** - **悲伤（Sadness）** - **恐惧（Fear）** - **厌恶（Disgust）** 这些负面情绪在漫长的演化史中无数次将人类从死亡边缘拉回。边缘系统处理完这些生存信息后，会将其向上投射到新皮层，特别是位于额头正后方的前额叶皮层（prefrontal cortex）。前额叶皮层如同一个分析控制中枢，负责解析这些情绪的深层含义，并决定采取何种理性的应对策略。然而，现代人往往处于过度“反应性”（reactive）的状态，原因就在于神经信号传导过快，人们往往直接听凭边缘系统冲动行事，而没有给前额叶皮层留出足够的时间去介入与调节。布鲁克斯的大量学术与实践工作，正是致力于帮助人们学会如何让理性前额叶重新主导情绪反应。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 情绪信号在大脑中的传递与升华机制 accDescr: 展示从外部刺激通过脑干、边缘系统生成快感，再到前额叶皮层升华为享受的神经传导回路。 subgraph 原始信号与本能反应 A["外部刺激信号"] --> B["脑干与低级中枢"] B --> C["边缘系统<br/>（腹侧纹状体/奖赏中心）"] C -->|"驱动生存与繁衍"| D["原始快感（Pleasure）<br/>性、高糖、成瘾冲动"] end subgraph 理性整合与高级体验 C -->|"情绪信息上传"| E["前额叶皮层<br/>（理解、反思与规划）"] D -.->|"注入：社交他人 + 长期记忆"| E E --> F["真正享受（Enjoyment）<br/>完整人类体验"] end ``` --- ### [19:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1185s) 快感（Pleasure）与真正享受（Enjoyment）的界限 厘清大脑机制后，布鲁克斯深入剖析了“快感”（pleasure）与“真正享受”（enjoyment）的本质鸿沟。快感纯粹是边缘系统的产物，是大脑腹侧纹状体（ventral striatum）奖赏中枢受到刺激时发出的本能信号。这一机制不断对机体发出指令：“做这件事有利于你在远古环境生存并传递基因，因此感觉极佳，马上去做！”在更新世（Pleistocene）的残酷环境下，这种机制极具适应性，主要围绕着“性与糖”（sex and sugar）展开。赌博乃至现代社交媒体，本质上都是利用类似于老虎机的不可预测随机奖励机制，精准捕获了人类原始大脑的生化漏洞。 然而，现代科技与商业社会极大放大了这些本能诱因，将其膨胀为危害极大的成瘾产业： - **天然内啡肽与阿片类危机**：人类原本通过演化分泌内啡肽来抵御肉体创伤以便逃回洞穴，现代化学却将其提纯为致命的芬太尼（fentanyl），在美国每年导致高达10万人因药物过量死亡。 - **不可预测的奖赏中枢捕获**：人类对随机事件的奖励机制被老虎机和算法信息流彻底滥用。 - **繁衍冲动异化为色情产业**：原本为了延续物种的性冲动被异化为网络色情内容，强力绑架大脑神经回路，并在现实中瓦解真实的人际亲密关系。 追求快感纯粹是让自己困在动物本能的边缘系统中。任何能够让人成瘾的事物，一旦陷入强迫性的反复循环，最终只会削减个体的幸福感。但布鲁克斯强调，这并不意味着人们必须走向苦行僧式的生活（如绝对滴酒不沾或拒绝一切娱乐）。想要将低级“快感”转化为促进幸福的“享受”，必须注入两个不可或缺的高级要素：**他人（People）** 与 **记忆（Memory）**。 一旦在某种体验中加入了人际交往与共同记忆，这项活动就会脱离边缘系统的独霸，转移到前额叶皮层进行处理。此时，它才从一种纯粹的“动物本能反射”升华成为“完整的人类体验”。布鲁克斯据此提出了一条强有力的生活自查法则：**“如果一件事具有成瘾性，而你总是在独自一人时去做它，那么你很大概率做错了。”** 当被问及性与色情的问题时，布鲁克斯指出，色情与自慰通常是孤立的个体行为，它们将本应完整的繁衍生殖体验生硬截断在最低级的快感层面，无法上升至享受与幸福的维度。即便部分人群对此持有异议，但宏观数据表明，色情成瘾不仅无法带来更幸福的人生，反而具有极高的心理危害性。布鲁克斯打趣道，学界研究色情问题的大多是年轻人，自己作为一个59岁的大脑学者，如果成天专注于研究色情课题，“看起来未免有点太怪异猥琐了（creepy）”。 --- ### [23:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1390s) 商业营销中的“享受公式”：以啤酒与可口可乐为例 为了生动说明快感向享受的转化，布鲁克斯分析了快消巨头的广告心理学。安海斯-布希（Anheuser-Busch）等全球顶尖啤酒酿造商，从不会在广告中展现一个男人独自蜷缩在昏暗公寓里拼命灌下一整箱12罐装啤酒的画面——尽管现实中确实有很多人在这样酗酒，但这在所有人眼中都是极其危险、不负责任且极易滑向酗酒恶疾的行为。相反，品牌广告永远聚焦于一群好友或兄弟在阳光下碰杯开怀大笑的聚会场景。 | 体验维度 | 单纯快感（Pleasure / 易成瘾） | 真正享受（Enjoyment / 增进幸福） | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **神经通路** | 边缘系统、腹侧纹状体（奖赏回路） | 边缘系统激活后，经由前额叶皮层加工升华 | | **演化根源** | 满足生存与基因繁衍的本能反射 | 灵长类复杂社交与文明记忆构建 | | **典型行为** | 独处时狂喝一箱啤酒、沉迷网络色情、刷短视频 | 与朋友碰杯聚饮、长久维持的亲密恋爱关系 | | **转化公式** | 原始物质刺激（刺激物） | **刺激物 + 他人（People） + 记忆（Memory）** | | **广告意象** | 昏暗公寓中独自酗酒买醉（被品牌极力规避） | 朋友聚会、世界杯观赛时的欢聚开怀（品牌核心诉求） | 无论是啤酒还是可口可乐，品牌都致力于将自身产品同“幸福”绑定，而非等同于“单纯的感官刺激”甚至是“成瘾”。虽然可口可乐中的糖分和咖啡因确实具有成瘾性，但比起酒精等烈性神经物质，它们对多巴胺的异常激发程度相对温和。但无论如何，单纯依靠摄入糖分只能获取微弱的生理快感，唯有将汽水融入到“炎炎夏日与挚友同欢”或“共同观看世界杯比赛”这样充满社交与回忆的语境下，它才能跨越成为真正的享受。 --- ### [24:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1461s) 满足感（Satisfaction）：延迟满足与痛苦的价值 布鲁克斯接着转向幸福的第二大核心支柱——**满足感（Satisfaction）**。他给满足感下了一个精准的定义：“满足感是历经挣扎与奋斗之后所获得的喜悦（Satisfaction is the joy you get after struggle）。”史蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）作为白手起家的创业者，对此深有体会。布鲁克斯直言，所有杰出的成功创业者都拥有极其卓越的“延迟满足”（deferring gratification）能力。他们清楚知道当下一件艰巨困难的任务必须被攻克，而当坚持到最终获得巨大回报时，那种历经磨砺的甘甜才是至高无上的满足感。 人类心理机制中存在一个反直觉的特质：**我们必须经历挣扎和痛苦，才能品尝到真正的满足感与喜悦。** 越是擅长忍耐当下痛苦以换取未来回报的人，获得的满足感就越强烈，其整体幸福感也越高。 布鲁克斯回顾了20世纪60年代末由斯坦福大学心理学家沃尔特·米歇尔（Walter Mischel）主持的著名“棉花糖实验”： - **实验设置**：米歇尔在帕洛阿尔托的实验室中，让4至8岁的儿童单独坐在桌前，面前放置一颗棉花糖。研究人员告知孩子，自己需要离开去处理一个电话，如果等他回来时棉花糖还在，孩子就能额外得到第二颗作为奖励。 - **结果分布**：约5分钟后研究人员返回，多达**80%**的孩子未能抵制住诱惑吃掉了棉花糖；仅有**20%**的孩子成功做到了延迟满足。 - **长期跟踪**：尽管现代心理学对该实验存在各种关于家庭背景或环境信任度的争议，但核心结论依然稳固——那20%能够忍受痛苦等待第二颗棉花糖的孩子（布鲁克斯幽默地称他们为“年幼的史蒂芬·巴特利特们”），在成年后大多取得了非凡成就：学业更优异、职场更成功、人际与情感关系也更为稳固。无论是先天遗传还是后天抚育（布鲁克斯认为各占50%），核心道理从未改变：“好事情总是降临在懂得耐心等待的人身上。” --- ### [26:23](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1583s) 自然母亲的谎言：体内平衡与享乐适应跑步机 然而，在追求满足感的过程中，人类不可避免地面临一个巨大的演化陷阱，布鲁克斯将其称为“自然母亲撒下的弥天大谎”。演化本能不断在耳边低语：“只要你拿到了那个梦寐以求的目标，你就会从此永远幸福下去！”然而，事实完全相反。 人体在生理和心理上都受到严格的**体内平衡机制（Homeostasis）**制约。异常的生理或情绪波动都只是人体面临环境变化时的临时反应，机体必须迅速恢复到基准线状态，以保持应对下一次刺激的反应能力： - 就像一个人从跑步机上走下来时心跳飙升，如果不迅速回归基础心率，身体在几天内就会崩溃衰竭。 - 情感机制亦完全相同。当极端好事或坏事发生时，大脑为了提供趋利避害的动机，会欺骗我们这种状态会“天长地久”；但一旦目标达成，机体便会迅速重置基准线。 这就引发了奋斗者永恒的悲剧与困境：许多人拼命奋斗，以为“只要赚到十亿美元，一切就会变得完美”。然而，亿万富翁在真正赚到十亿美元的那一刻，脑海中浮现的第一个念头往往是：“看来我需要再赚十亿才行。”由于体内平衡机制的存在，人们不由自主地踏上了一条永不停歇的**“享乐适应跑步机”（hedonic treadmill）**，陷入了“要得更多、更多、永不满足”的无限死循环之中。 ### [27:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1662s) 满意度公式与“到达谬误” 许多在世俗意义上极其成功的人却深陷痛苦之中。要解开这个悖论并找到救赎之道，关键在于理解一个核心公式：**满意度 = 拥有（Haves）÷ 欲望（Wants）**。绝大多数人的策略是竭尽全力去“拥有更多”，然而真正的解法恰恰相反——必须学会管理欲望，也就是“想要得更少”。想要得更少并非消极避世，它背后涵盖了精神修养、自律、健身以及饮食等一整套身心管理体系，是获得持久满足感的基石。 当面对“人应当努力奋斗还是减少欲望”的矛盾时，东方传统哲学给出了深刻的洞见：奋斗本身并不是坏事，但奋斗的奖赏存在于过程之中。人们真正渴望的从来不是终点的到达，而是前进的过程本身。节食减肥行业便是一个极为典型的反面案例——这是全球最昂贵却又最失败的产业，高达95%的节食者最终都会反弹，几乎在一年内打回原形。究其原因，节食期间人们每天愿意舍弃美食，是因为有体重秤数字下降这一即时奖励；而一旦达到目标体重，原本承诺的美好并未降临，反而迎来了残酷的现实——恭喜你，余生再也不能碰喜欢的食物了。 这就是心理学上的“到达谬误”（Arrival Fallacy）：人们总幻想达成某个终极目标后生活便会一片甘甜，但当真正抵达时，迎接你的只有内稳态机制带来的迅速适应、空虚与巨大的沮丧。与其追逐那种幻想中的终点体验，不如把满足感建立在前进的旅程中。与达赖喇嘛密切共事长达十一年的经历中，曾有一句醍醐灌顶的教诲深刻总结了这一点：持久满足感的秘密，在于“渴望你所拥有的，而不是拥有你所渴望的”。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 欲望与满意度转化逻辑 accDescr: 对比传统追求更多与正确管理欲望带来的不同心理结果 subgraph Trap["死循环：追求拥有更多"] A["不断增加拥有物 (Haves)"] --> B["欲望 (Wants) 同步膨胀"] B --> C["陷入享乐适应与到达谬误"] C --> D["满意度停滞或崩溃"] end subgraph Virtuous["正向循环：管理欲望"] E["分母管理：想要得更少"] --> F["聚焦过程与微小进步"] F --> G["珍视当前所拥有的一切"] G --> H["获得持久且稳定的满意度"] end ``` --- ### [30:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1836s) 终极目标四支柱：超越享乐跑步机 随着新年伊始，大众往往会立下减重、存钱等各种宏大誓愿。然而，真正能让我们免于陷入享乐跑步机（Hedonic Treadmill）并在达成后不被内稳态拉回原点的事物，并不是金钱、权力、享乐和名声。能够越积累越幸福的终极目标只有四根支柱：**信仰（或深层的哲学生活）、家庭、深厚的友谊，以及能够服务于他人的工作**。金钱与名望本身并非罪恶，但它们充其量只能作为中间目标，用来辅助我们追求上述更深邃的人生意义。 面对“我就是讨厌自己肚子上的赘肉”这种极为普遍的现实焦虑，关键在于厘清“中间目标”与“终极目标”的界限。把减掉小腹脂肪或练出马甲线当成终极目标是危险且令人挫败的，因为即便减掉了脂肪，生活并不会自动变得美满。健身与减脂应当出于内在动机：为了能健康长寿地陪伴伴侣、为了将来膝下承欢含饴弄孙，而非为了迎合“别人会更爱我”的外在虚荣。 现实中存在一个滑稽却普遍的现象：很多男性在健身房里发誓一年要增肌15磅、刷掉全部体脂，他们幻想以此获得更多异性的青睐；然而辛辛苦苦坚持到秋天，往往发现根本没有女性因此多看他们两眼，反倒引来一群健身房壮汉围着拍肩膀夸赞“练得太壮了哥们儿”。这就是典型的到达谬误——人们错把次要的外在中间目标当成了改变生活的救命稻草，却忽略了为了看见下腹肌而拼命减掉最后几磅脂肪，在生理和人际关系层面上其实毫无实质价值。 - **四大超越性人生支柱**： - **信仰与哲学**：探寻超越自我的崇高力量，而非局限于特定宗教戒律。 - **家庭关系**：维系深厚且亲密的情感纽带，这在神经科学上至今仍具有神秘魅力。 - **真正的友谊**：培养能吐露心声的知己，这对成功人士而言尤为罕见与艰难。 - **服务他人的工作**：凭借自己的努力赢得成功，并将劳动力转化为对他人的贡献。 --- ### [34:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2088s) 健身的生物学真理：降低不快乐与情绪管理 健身的终极目标应当回归可持续的健康与心智调控，而非虚荣的外貌攀比。以每天坚持锻炼60分钟为例，这种习惯的建立并非为了自恋。日常自律中隐藏着一个看似矛盾的规律：“每天都去锻炼”反而比“能练就尽量练”要容易得多；正如每天都践行信仰、每天都坚持健康饮食，要远比随心所欲或只在方便时才去做简单得多。当行为被编排为雷打不动的日常程序后，自控力的消耗便会大幅降低。 从神经科学的角度来看，运动并不会直接凭空“创造”快乐，它的核心机制是**降低不快乐（Unhappiness）**。快乐与不快乐并非同一根数轴的正负极，积极情绪与消极情绪是由大脑边缘系统（Limbic System）中截然不同的区域独立生成的。这意味着一个人完全可以同时拥有极高水平的快乐体验和极高水平的消极情绪。 在这种情绪模型下，很多人属于典型的“疯狂科学家”（Mad Scientist）人格特征——既能体会到极其强烈的正面积极情绪，同时也承受着极高的负面情绪与焦虑。对于高皮质醇、易焦虑的人群来说，运动是一种精准的生化干预工具，它能直接冲刷并降低体内的皮质醇水平。因此，情绪管理必须双管齐下：一方面设法维系积极情绪的供给，另一方面通过日常的健身与习惯管理来系统性遏制负面情绪的蔓延。 ### [36:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2205s) 健身的终极目标与习惯坚持的力量 关于如何消除负面情绪，剧烈的体育锻炼（vigorous physical exercise）是最有效的途径之一。对话者提到当天正好是自己的“练腿日”（leg day），虽然练腿的过程极其痛苦，但练完后整个人感觉棒极了。这引出了对健身本质的领悟：最终的目标应当是追求“幸福”本身，至于减脂、消灭小腹赘肉这些短期的生理指标，不过是衡量大方向是否正确的阶段性标志。 很多人每年都会立下改变人生的健身新年誓愿，但绝大多数人都以失败告终。核心误区在于将目标定为“为了夏天练出六块腹肌”。一旦夏天结束，或者腹肌真正练成并收获了几句赞美之后，动力便会彻底蒸发。面对凛冬，单纯依赖意志力是绝不可能硬撑过去的。真正的破局点在于将目标设定为“持之以恒的习惯”（consistency and habits）——如果每天去健身房变成一种下意识的生活方式，人自然会更健康、更幸福、工作表现更优异。这种认知重构彻底改变了健身的可持续性。 - 追求外在短暂结果（如夏日腹肌）极易陷入动力枯竭，因为一旦达成便无以为继。 - 习惯与一致性（Consistency）超越单纯的意志力拼耗，能够持续反哺心理与身体状态。 --- ### [38:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2293s) 人生意义的三大支柱与两个终极追问 在探讨幸福的构成要素时，“意义”（Meaning）被定义为生命中的“为什么”（the why of your life），也是现代人——尤其是年轻人——最感到迷茫与艰难的部分。根据哲学家与社会心理学家的研究，意义由三大核心要素构成： ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 人生意义的三大构成要素 accDescr: 展示意义由连贯性、目标感和重要性三个维度构成的结构图。 subgraph Meaning["人生意义 (Meaning)"] A["连贯性 (Coherence)<br/>万事皆有其由，拥有对世界的合理解释"] B["目标感 (Purpose)<br/>生活有前进方向与追求，不陷于到达谬误"] C["重要性 (Significance)<br/>感受到自己的存在对世界至关重要"] end ``` - **连贯性（Coherence）**：相信万事发生皆有缘由，对世界运转和自身经历拥有一套自洽的解释逻辑。 - **目标感（Purpose）**：生命拥有清晰的方向和目标，稳步向前而不会陷入“到达谬误”（arrival fallacy）。 - **重要性（Significance）**：确信自己的存在是有分量的，明白“如果我不在这里，世界会有所不同”。 为了检测一个人是否存在“意义危机”（meaning crisis），可以浓缩为两个没有标准答案但必须发自内心回答的问题： 1. **你为什么活着？（Why are you alive?）** 2. **你今天愿意为什么而死？（For what are you willing to die today?）** 面对第一个问题，受访者提出这结合了“生之意义”（Ikigai）的概念：既包含个人从对话中学习成长的“趣味/自利”，也包含将知识传递给观众的“奉献/利他”。对话进一步梳理了价值的“执行次序”（order of operations）：如果把“利他与奉献”放在“趣味与冒险”之前，人生的意义感就会像植物扎根沃土一样蓬勃生长；反之，若单纯追逐好玩，意义感便无法确立。 --- ### [41:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2486s) 面对牺牲的抉择与意义危机的契机 针对第二个问题“你今天愿意为什么而献出生命？”，对话展现了极其坦诚的人性剖析。受访者表示自己愿意为了伴侣、兄弟姐妹赴死，但当被追问是否愿意为父母牺牲时，却坦承内心产生了犹豫；被问及是否愿意为某种理念或国家牺牲时，则认为需要具体情境和代价评估。 这种审视并非为了寻找某种道义上的完美答案，而是为了看清内心深处最真实的反应： - 最糟糕的回答并不是选错对象，而是回答“不知道”或“我什么都不在乎”。 - 意识到自己答不出这两个问题，并非绝路，而是一个巨大的“人生创业契机”（entrepreneurial opportunity）。你不需要跑去读哲学博士，也不必坐在喜马拉雅山洞口求教宗师，而是需要正式启动这场寻找答案的“愿景探索”（Vision Quest）。 - 很多年轻人的虚无感，正来源于机械论的浅薄答案——认为活着只是“精子与卵子相遇的生物偶然”，死则“无物值得牺牲”。 --- ### [43:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2628s) 破除“寻找使命”的复活节彩蛋陷阱 社交媒体上泛滥的心灵鸡汤常常灌输年轻人必须“去寻找人生使命”（find your purpose），这引发了普遍的焦虑与不配得感。这种话语暗含了两个极其危险的虚假前提：一是“寻找”（Find），暗示使命藏在外部某个角落需要像找彩蛋一样搜寻；二是“使命”是单数（Purpose），暗示人生只有唯一一个特定解。 这种现象被类比为商业管理中的“拿石头理论”（go find a rock theory of leadership）： - 老板对员工说“去给我拿块石头来”，员工费尽周折在满地石头的世界里挑了一块带回，老板却冷冰冰地说“不是这块”。 - 毫无方向地让年轻人“寻找使命”，只会让人在无边际的选择中陷入挫败与自我怀疑。 真正的使命不是向外碰运气，而是向内深挖核心价值观：通过厘清“为何而活”与“愿为何而死”来书写属于自己的使命宣言（mission statement）。许多西方年轻人远赴印度达兰萨拉（Dharamsala，十四世达赖喇嘛流亡后的居所）成为所谓的“灵性追寻者”（Seekers），误以为浸润在强大的精神气场中使命就会主动找上门来。事实上，跨文化的灵修体验固然能深化个人原有的信仰底蕴，但若只是盲目漂泊、被动等待所谓的“人生使命”从天而降，终究是一种彻头彻尾的迷思。 ### [46:27](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2787s) 未知即是冒险的起点：享受与意义的区别 很多听众在听到“你愿意为什么而死”以及“你为何而活”这两个终极提问时，内心往往会涌起强烈的恐慌与失落，因为他们发现自己根本给不出答案。然而在亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）看来，这非但不是坏事，反而是“天大的好消息”（"incredibly good news"）。这意味着你迎来了属于自己人生冒险的真正起点。那些值得你为之付出生命与热忱的事物一直客观存在于世界上，只是你此前从未主动去探寻，甚至一直在错误的维度里打转。 很多人常犯的错误，是把“我喜欢什么”或“我享受什么”当作寻找意义的指南针。享受（Enjoyment）固然是幸福的基柱之一，但它和意义（Meaning）完全处于幸福这棵大树的不同枝干上。若你试图通过“弄清自己享受什么”来推导“人生的意义何在”，就如同在错误的树枝上去够另一侧的果实，永远无法触及连贯性、重要性与目标感的核心。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 寻找人生意义的三步框架 accDescr: 展现从道德基石到深度沉思再到超越体验的进阶路径 subgraph Step1 ["第一步：道德基石 (Moral Foundations)"] A["明确对错与不可妥协的原则"] --> B["保持道德灵活性以持续进化"] B --> C["言行合一：消除行为与信念的背离"] end subgraph Step2 ["第二步：深度沉思 (Contemplation)"] D["放下手机与外部干扰"] --> E["激活默认模式网络 (DMN)"] E --> F["对抗负面偏见，专注感恩体验"] end subgraph Transcendence ["终极目标"] C --> G["获得超越感与内在能动性 (Transcendence & Agency)"] F --> G end ``` --- ### [47:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2853s) 寻找意义的第一步：确立道德底线与“言行合一” 对于茫然不知所措、甚至不知道穿上鞋走出家门后该往何处去的人，亚瑟开出了一套切实可行的三步行动方案。探索的起点并非立刻向外奔波，而是每天抽出15分钟进行真正的深度阅读，屏蔽垃圾资讯与新闻噪音，并拿起纸笔写下属于自己的“道德底线”（Moral non-negotiables）。你必须直面最基本的问题：我认为什么是对的，什么是错的？我的道德原则是什么？ 这些原则可以包括言论自由、平等对待他人或捍卫人的尊严等，并且它们会随着年龄的增长不断演变。亚瑟提醒道，在这个极化严重的时代，保持“道德灵活性”（Moral flexibility）至关重要。世界和文化战总是试图将人塑造成僵化的战士，剥夺人们自我修正的能力；而能够诚实承认“我过去的看法可能不全对”，恰恰是心智成熟与进化的体现。 这一逻辑深刻契合了卡尔·荣格（Carl Jung）的心理学洞见：幸福的本质在于弄清楚自己坚信什么，并据此去生活；而不幸的根源，则是自己的所作所为系统性地背离了内心的道德准则。当一个人在约会中违背自己认同的尊重底线，或者在现实中践踏自己的做人准则时，内心的煎熬便会油然而生。 --- ### [49:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=2990s) 违背原则的痛苦：低能动性与自我破坏 以伴侣间的背叛和出轨为例，几乎所有人都从自然法或道德直觉层面认定出轨是错误的，但为何背叛者自身会深陷痛苦？亚瑟指出，这种行为本质上是对自身得体感与正当性（Sense of propriety）的暴力摧残。在各大古老智慧与主流宗教传统（无论是基督教、伊斯兰教、犹太教还是印度教）中，“罪”（Sin）的核心定义从来不仅是“冒犯了神明”，更是“自我伤害与自我毁灭”。当你违背自己认同的准则行事时，你正在无形中削弱自我，摧毁自己作为一个正直、有尊严之人的自我认同。 史蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）对此敏锐地指出，这种矛盾本质上削弱了个体的“能动性”（Agency），让人陷入习得性无助： - 明知某件事是错误的却无法自控，等于在向潜意识灌输自己是“软弱无能的受害者”。 - 人们常常抱怨“我讨厌自己的饮食习惯”，并非单纯讨厌糖分或食物本身（亚瑟自嘲自己滴酒不沾却是个无可救药的“嗜糖狂”），而是讨厌被低级冲动完全支配的自己。 - 新年立志减重或健身的深层动力，往往并非为了露出腹肌血管，而是为了在道德层面与“理想中的自我”达成一致。 --- ### [52:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3131s) 第二步：通过深度沉思与感恩重塑认知 探寻人生意义的第二步是建立“沉思传统”（Contemplative tradition），唯有通过沉思，人才能体会到超越感（Transcendence）。在当今充斥着信息干扰的世界中，许多人追捧正念冥想（Mindfulness meditation），其实其内核极其简单：放下手机，静坐下来，全神贯注于“活着”这一事实本身。 亚瑟特别提到了他在哈佛大学的同事艾伦·兰格（Ellen Langer）教授——她是哈佛大学心理学系首位获得终身教职的女性，约30年前出版了奠基之作《Mindfulness》，将正念概念引入西方世界。兰格教授提出，实践正念最绝妙的场景就是在乘坐火车时收起手机，双手平放在膝盖上，安静地凝视窗外。哪怕每天只进行5分钟纯粹的凝思，关闭外部刺激，大脑的“默认模式网络”（Default Mode Network, DMN）便会自然激活，引导你思考那些真正具有长期道德价值与存在意义的事物。 史蒂芬随即分享了自身的经历：他在基督教家庭长大，18岁前每顿家庭晚餐大家都会围坐在一起作谢恩祷告，但随着成年后失去宗教信仰，他也停止了祷告。然而他最近意识到，即便不信神，祷告中蕴含的“感恩练习”完全值得保留。亚瑟深表赞同并指出： - 史蒂芬停止祷告仅仅是因为觉得“电话线那头没有人倾听”，但感恩对象完全可以内化为对生活本身的审视。 - 人类大脑受进化机制驱使，天然携带着强烈的“消极偏见”（Negativity bias）。在远古丛林中，身后突然折断的树枝声绝不会让你以为是朋友来访，而只会预警致命捕食者；这种偏见虽然保证了生存，却导致现代人极易陷入怨恨与痛苦。 - 主动沉思生活中丰沛的感恩之源，正是对抗这种原始消极偏见、重获心智自由的解毒剂。 ### [55:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3305s) “风之电话”与重构成年人的信仰 在日本遭受地震和海啸重创后，曾有人设立了一座未接通电话线的电话亭，被称为“风之电话”（The Wind Phone）。先后有超过三万人走进这座电话亭，拿起悬空的听筒，向逝去的亲人倾诉哀思。阿瑟·布鲁克斯借此比喻指出，很多人在成长过程中之所以放弃祈祷或沉思，是因为他们执着于孩童时期的宗教观——认为祈祷必须像打电话一样拥有直通上帝的专线。当成年后的认知意识到这种机制并不存在时，人们往往就彻底停止了精神沉思。 然而，数据与人生历程均表明，随着年龄渐长，人们往往会重新对信仰产生兴趣。这并不意味着倒退回儿时非黑即白的幼稚信仰，而是发展出一种更加成熟、能包容生命复杂性的成年人信仰。现实生活本就充满混乱与难以解释的苦难，与其因童年时接触到的荒诞神话而彻底排斥灵性，不如保持开放的心态。重新审视那些曾经被弃之不顾的精神传统，人们往往会发现其中隐藏着过去未曾领悟的深层意涵。 ### [56:24](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3384s) 每天15分钟智慧阅读：藏传佛教的求道协议 在藏传佛教探寻生命意义的修行框架中，顶层是“智慧”（Wisdom），而智慧的获取必须仰赖广泛的研读与知识积累。现代人获取优质信息的途径极其丰富，播客等新媒介都是极佳的渠道，但阅读古老智慧经典的地位依然无可替代。阿瑟建议人们走进深厚的智慧传统：去读斯多葛学派哲学家的教诲，读亚里士多德的《尼各马可伦理学》，读《薄伽梵歌》，读《古兰经》，或者读《圣经》。 建立这项习惯并不需要庞大的时间投入，每天只要从15分钟的专注研读开始即可。令人讽刺的是，许多人宁愿日复一日花几个小时漫无目的地刷社交媒体动态，却常年念叨着“真希望我有时间读读经典”，结果连15分钟都舍不得拿出来。每天只需抽出15分钟翻开马可·奥勒留的《沉思录》或塞内卡的道德书简，心智便能获得难以置信的滋养。理清“我究竟相信什么”、每天留出片刻沉思、并坚持15分钟经典阅读——这一整套源自古老传统的协议，不仅是阿瑟为他人开出的处方，也是他身体力行改变人生的实用工具。 ### [57:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3463s) 与奥普拉合著《Build the Life You Want》的幕后故事 摆在录音桌上的新书《Build the Life You Want》（打造你想要的生活）封面同时署着阿瑟·布鲁克斯与奥普拉·温弗瑞（Oprah Winfrey）的名字。面对主持人的好奇，阿瑟幽默地调侃起两人的结缘：某天他接到了一个电话，对方自我介绍说“我是奥普拉·温弗瑞”，阿瑟的第一反应简直像在听人说“我是蝙蝠侠”一样不可思议。事实证明，奥普拉一直是他《大西洋月刊》周四专栏“如何构筑生活”（How to Build a Life）的忠实读者，并且在他上一本书《从优秀到卓越》（From Strength to Strength）发售当天就读完了全书。 随后，阿瑟受邀参加了奥普拉的《Super Soul》播客，两人一拍即合、相谈甚欢。他们虽然背景迥异——阿瑟是严谨的学者，而奥普拉拥有无与伦比的世界级媒体平台——但目标完全一致：以幸福与爱为纽带，激励并联结大众。阿瑟特别感慨，奥普拉早已参透了财富、名望与权力的本质，她彻底打破了自我膨胀的枷锁，将这些巨大的资源全心全意用于服务他人。奥普拉曾感慨，如果自己经营了25年的王牌电视脱口秀还没停播，她一定会邀请阿瑟上30次节目，然后帮他开创属于自己的专属节目；但既然脱口秀已经结束，她提议“让我为你主持一本书吧”。于是，在2022至2023年的冬天，阿瑟前往加州圣克莱门特，与住在蒙特西托的奥普拉频繁往返碰头，共同完成了这部著作。该书的核心逻辑在于：唯有学会像专业人士一样管理自己的情绪与感受，人才能摆脱杂念的内耗，全力聚焦于生命中真正重要的事情。 ### [01:00:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3614s) PANAS 情感分类：四种截然不同的人格类型 在书中，阿瑟引入了基于心理学正负情感量表（PANAS）的情绪特征评估体系。每个人感受到的基本情绪种类大致相同，如喜悦、兴趣、愤怒、悲伤、恐惧和厌恶等，但不同个体感受积极情感（Positive Affect）与消极情感（Negative Affect）的神经反应强度却存在天壤之别。根据正负情感强度的交叉组合，人群大致可划分为四种各占约四分之一的典型人格画像。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 基于 PANAS 模型的四种情绪人格类型 accDescr: 横轴为消极情感强度，纵轴为积极情感强度，划分出疯科学家、啦啦队长、诗人和法官四象限。 subgraph Quadrants["PANAS 情感强度象限分布"] direction TB subgraph TopRow["高积极情感 (High Positive Affect)"] direction LR MS["【疯科学家 Mad Scientist】<br>高积极 / 高消极<br>大喜大悲，兼具狂热与内耗"] CL["【啦啦队长 Cheerleader】<br>高积极 / 低消极<br>天生乐观，淡化威胁与冲突"] end subgraph BottomRow["低积极情感 (Low Positive Affect)"] direction LR P["【诗人 Poet】<br>低积极 / 高消极<br>易反刍反思，富于创造与浪漫"] J["【法官 Judge】<br>低积极 / 低消极<br>情绪平稳客观，临危不乱"] end end ``` - **疯科学家（Mad Scientist）——高积极、高消极**：情绪峰谷极其剧烈（High highs and low lows），既能体会到极度的高亢狂喜，也会陷入极度的痛苦低谷。主持人史蒂文正属于这一类型。 - **啦啦队长（Cheerleader）——高积极、低消极**：对积极情绪的体验极其敏锐，而对消极情绪的钝感极强。他们总是心态阳光、习惯往好处看，习惯淡化环境中的潜在威胁。虽然这是许多人梦寐以求的状态，但啦啦队长往往并不适合担任企业首席执行官（CEO）。因为他们极难正视危机、厌恶听到坏消息，也极度抗拒向下属传达严厉反馈或解雇不称职的员工，容易让团队内部陷入不切实际的盲目乐观。 - **诗人（Poet）——低积极、高消极**：大脑中的腹外侧前额叶皮层（vlPFC）极其活跃，这使他们成为天生的“反刍思维者”（ruminators）。他们极易在脑海中反复回放负面细节、尴尬经历或自我怀疑，但也正因这部分脑区的高度发育，他们拥有非凡的艺术创造力（能写出商业计划书或交响乐）以及深沉的浪漫倾向（迷恋本质上也是对某个人的强烈反刍）。阿瑟还引述了演员雷恩·威尔森（Rain Wilson，《办公室》中德怀特的扮演者）的洞见：许多喜剧演员往往深陷抑郁，是因为他们学会了一种元认知技巧——用幽默这种替代性情绪来对冲内心的无尽悲伤。 - **法官（Judge）——低积极、低消极**：情绪起伏极度平缓，对快乐和痛苦的反应均较为克制淡然。他们临危不乱、处变不惊，是极其理想的外科医生、审判法官或特勤局特工人选——毕竟在开刀手术的关键时刻，谁也不希望主刀医生像神经质的疯科学家那样因突发状况而当场惊呼崩溃。 ### [01:04:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3852s) 疯狂科学家与拉拉队员：寻找互补而非克隆体 亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）指出，人格的四个象限各有天赋和使命，而绝大多数优秀的企业家都属于“疯狂科学家”（Mad Scientist）类型。他们之所以投身创业，是因为渴望深刻而强烈的感受——他们的世界里一切都是极致且高强度的，很少有人能做到全然佛系或彻底放松。斯蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）对此深有共鸣，坦言团队也常觉得自己身上带有一股逼人的强烈气场。当斯蒂芬提到自己的伴侣是一位充满正能量与高积极情绪的“拉拉队员”（Cheerleader）时，亚瑟笑称自己也娶了一位拉拉队员。这种组合虽然常有甜蜜，但也难免伴随摩擦：拉拉队员往往无法理解疯狂科学家为何在一切顺利时依然阴云密布、挑剔细节，例如会困惑地抱怨：“为什么你总盯着拼写错误不放？你就不能积极乐观一点吗？” 然而，亲密关系中最理想的配对往往正是这种互补，而非寻找与自己完全一致的“克隆人”或“分身”。亚瑟强调，约会市场中人们常犯的最大错误就是寻找和自己一模一样的人。当今约会软件（Dating Apps）之所以频繁导致用户失望，正是因为算法和用户画像让大家按照政治倾向、音乐品味和生活区域精确筛选，结果找出来的对象像自己的“亲兄弟姐妹”一样毫无神秘感。亚瑟引述他成年孩子的话打趣道：“和跟自己太像的人约会一点都不性感，差异才性感。” 斯蒂芬深表赞同，并分享了自己的亲身经历：他原本绝不可能主动去寻找一个热衷灵性、相信脉轮（chakras）与不可见能量的伴侣，但他的女友恰恰是这样的人。这种巨大的差异不仅没有成为阻碍，反而将他拉入了全新的精神世界，让他开始相信以往嗤之以鼻的事物，真正从内在上“完整”了他。亚瑟指出，庆祝彼此的不同而不是试图把伴侣改造得更像自己，是维系健康关系的黄金法则；妄图改变对方本质上是一种自我中心主义（egotism）的表现，正如老话所说：“女人结婚时以为能改变丈夫，结果往往不能；男人结婚时以为妻子永远不会变，结果妻子变了。” --- ### [01:07:31](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4051s) 陷入热恋时的大脑：神经化学的连锁反应 在哈佛商学院（Harvard Business School），恋爱与亲密关系是亚瑟所教的工商管理硕士（MBA）学生最渴望探索的头号话题。这些平均年龄28岁、经历过职场历练的精英学生，极度渴望从神经科学的角度了解爱情发生的化学机制，以及人在什么时候会彻底丧失自我控制力。商学院甚至有专门的经典案例：某些首席执行官（CEO）因与下属发生不当关系而被解雇，在被辞退后失魂落魄地望着火车窗外喃喃自语：“我完全不知道事情是怎么演变成这样的。”亚瑟解释道，通过脑部扫描可以清楚揭示原因——陷入狂热恋爱的人，其大脑活动图像与冰毒（甲基苯丙胺，methamphetamine）成瘾者惊人地相似，大脑在特定阶段完全被化学物质所劫持。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 坠入爱河的神经化学级联反应 accDescr: 展示从荷尔蒙激发到多巴胺亢奋、血清素骤降导致反刍，最终形成催产素依恋的全过程。 subgraph Phase1["第一阶段：吸引点火"] A["性激素激增<br/>（睾酮 & 雌激素）"] --> B["外表吸引与生理冲动"] end subgraph Phase2["第二阶段：奖赏与反刍"] B --> C["多巴胺 & 去甲肾上腺素飙升<br/>（欣快感与奖赏预期）"] C --> D["血清素水平骤降<br/>（脑区过度活跃）"] D --> E["腹外侧前额叶皮层受刺激<br/>（沉迷、强迫性反刍与痴迷）"] end subgraph Phase3["第三阶段：深度绑定"] E --> F["催产素分泌<br/>（强效神经肽 / 荷尔蒙）"] F --> G["建立深层依恋<br/>（强烈愉悦与神经劫持）"] end ``` 这种坠入爱河的“神经化学级联反应”（neurochemical cascade）通常经历以下清晰的发展阶段： - **性激素点火**：初见时，睾酮（Testosterone）与雌激素（Estrogen）迅速释放，构成异性相吸与生理吸引的始发机制。 - **多巴胺与去甲肾上腺素激增**：随后多巴胺与去甲肾上腺素（Noradrenaline / Norepinephrine）急剧升高，带来极致的兴奋感（Euphoria）与对奖励的狂热预期。 - **血清素骤降与强迫性反刍**：原本负责带来平静与情绪稳定的神经调质——血清素（Serotonin）出现明显低谷。低血清素会激活大脑负责反刍思维的腹外侧前额叶皮层（vlPFC），导致人陷入强迫性的痴迷、茶饭不思与持续反刍（rumination）。 - **催产素的深度依恋绑定**：最后，被称为依恋激素的神经肽——催产素（Oxytocin）介入，促成极度深刻、带有强烈愉悦感的深度情感绑定。随着时间推移，大脑被这种机制牢牢俘获，其成瘾性使得当事人宛如瘾君子，无法单纯依靠道德说教来理智止损。 --- ### [01:10:25](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4225s) 恋爱初期并不等于幸福：嫉妒与演化心理学 当被问及“恋爱中的人是否更幸福”时，亚瑟给出了否定的统计学结论：至少在热恋初期，人们的实际幸福感并不高。虽然多巴胺能带来狂喜，但伴随低血清素而来的往往是痛苦的煎熬，其中充斥着严重的嫉妒、猜疑和监视行为（surveillance behaviors）。没有人会享受偷偷翻看或监视伴侣手机的过程，但这种病态行为在热恋期屡见不鲜，因为大脑正处于高度警戒状态，拼命评估对方是否存在背叛的可能。 从演化心理学角度来看，男女之间的嫉妒触发机制存在显著差异。亚瑟引用了德克萨斯大学奥斯汀分校（UT Austin）关于嫉妒心理学的权威研究： - **男性的头号嫉妒触发源**：目睹或想象伴侣与他人发生肉体性关系（Sexual Infidelity）。从演化生存机制分析，男性必须确保后代具有自己的基因，防止自身耗费资源却在为他人抚养后代；据某些统计估计，全球范围内有约 15% 的父亲身份存在错归（misattributed paternity）。 - **女性的头号嫉妒触发源**：目睹或想象伴侣对另一位异性说出“我爱你”（Emotional Infidelity）。女性在演化中承担着怀胎育儿的高昂成本，最深层的生存恐惧在于伴侣将情感与生存资源转移给其他女人及其子女。 亚瑟幽默地打趣称，幸运的是自己的孩子们长得都很像自己（除了领养的女儿），缓解了这种演化焦虑。由此也顺理成章地引出了关于幸福更深层的探讨：过度沉溺于自身的情绪与占有欲往往是痛苦的根源，唯有学会将焦点从自我身上移开，才能走向真正的安宁与幸福。 ### [01:12:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4334s) 利他行为与幸福感：为什么走出自我剧场能带来超脱 在探讨幸福感的来源时，亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）指出，许多严格的人类受试实验证明，将注意力从自我转移到他人身上是提升幸福感的关键。他提到了美国西北大学（Northwestern University）优秀的创新社会心理学家亚当·韦茨（Adam Waytz）所做的一项经典实验。研究人员召集了一批本科生——布鲁克斯打趣道，大学生是极佳的受试群体，因为“给他们 20 美元他们几乎愿意做任何事”——并将他们随机分成三组，进行持续数周的行为干预对比： 1. **道德行善组（Moral Deeds）**：去践行随机的善举（random acts of kindness）。 2. **道德意念组（Moral Thoughts）**：静坐并对他人抱持美好的祝愿与善念。 3. **自我关怀组（Self-Care）**：专注于能让自己感觉良好的自我照顾活动。 研究结果显示，践行道德善行的人幸福感提升最明显，其次是心存善念组，而专注于自我关怀的一组幸福感改善最弱。这一结论与布鲁克斯多年来对慈善捐赠和幸福感的研究不谋而合。他强调，孤独时最应该做的事情是去做志愿者；而统计数据显示，捐款的人往往在下一年更有可能赚到更多钱。这并非玄学，而是一种强大的心理投资机制：当你帮助他人时，你会将自己视作“积极改变的推动者”（an agent of positive change），从而获得赋能。“给予爱，就会得到爱”。如果在实验中让两组人分别去玩桌游或辅导六年级学生数学，辅导数学那组随后几天的情绪都会显著高涨。帮助他人能让人摆脱内心无休止的“心理大戏”（Psychodrama），让生命拥有超脱（Transcendent）的维度，不仅带来内心的平静与宏观视角，更在经验上确认了自己确实正在成为理想中的那个人。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 利他行为与幸福感层级图 accDescr: 展示从自我关怀到道德意念再到道德善行的幸福感递增层级，以及向外赋能带来的超脱视角。 subgraph Interventions["行为干预方式"] A["自我关怀 (Self-Care)<br/>关注自身愉悦"] B["道德意念 (Moral Thoughts)<br/>为他人送上善意祝愿"] C["道德善行 (Moral Deeds)<br/>随机善举、志愿服务、辅导他人"] end subgraph Impact["心理机制与收益"] D["摆脱自我内心的心理大戏"] E["视自己为积极改变的推动者"] F["获得生命超脱感、平静与更强幸福感"] end A -->|幸福感提升较低| B B -->|幸福感提升中等| C C -->|幸福感提升最高| D D --> E E --> F ``` ### [01:14:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4455s) 情绪传染病：负面情绪与生活方式的病毒式传播 布鲁克斯指出，情绪具有强烈的传染性（emotional contagion），消极情绪就像一种“思维病毒”（mind virus），而积极情绪同样如此。当他走进各类企业为高管团队授课时，通常能很快判断出整家公司正在流行哪种“情绪病毒”。这也正是企业首席执行官（CEO）的情绪健康与自我管理至关重要的原因。如果员工在早晨察觉到“老板今天过得很艰难”或“老板可能早餐时被数落了”，这种“一切都糟透了”的消极态度就会迅速在整个团队中蔓延。同样地，这种病毒在家庭中也会在成员之间依次传播。与负面情绪特质极高（high negative affect）的人共同生活非常艰难，因为他们会不断向周围辐射消极病毒，即便只是住在同一条街上的邻居，只要有足够频繁的接触，就会受到波及。 史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）援引布鲁克斯书中的数据提到：如果生活在一英里以内的朋友或家庭成员变得更快乐，你自己变得更快乐的概率会增加 25%。布鲁克斯解释，这一数据来自著名的“弗雷明汉心脏研究”（Framingham Heart Study）。该研究虽然最初在波士顿郊区追踪居民的心脏健康轨迹，但随着长期跟进，研究人员发现社交网络对生活方式有着惊人的传染效应： - **肥胖的传染**：当你的朋友变胖时，你发胖的几率会大幅提高。 - **离婚的传染**：当身边的朋友离婚时，你自身离婚的可能性也会上升。 - **幸福的传染**：朋友的生活满意度提升，也会直接带动你的幸福度。 - **传播规律**：地理距离越近、关系越亲密，这种情绪和行为的传染机制就越强。 ### [01:16:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4590s) 共情与慈悲的本质区别：戴好自己的氧气面罩 针对如何应对亲友带来的痛苦与问题，布鲁克斯做出了关键辨析：社会普遍过度推崇“共情”（Empathy），但真正需要的是“慈悲”（Compassion）。 - **共情（Empathy）**：直接感受他人的痛苦，将别人的负面情绪全盘吸收。高共情的人往往很难做好青春期孩子的父母，因为他们容易被孩子的痛苦瘫痪，陷入“我感同身受”却束手无策的状态。 - **慈悲（Compassion）**：像钢铁一般坚韧（hard as steel），出于真爱去付诸真正有益的实际行动。做父母不是做玩伴，“你不是他的哥们，你是他的父亲”，这意味着即便孩子当下不理解、不高兴，也要坚定地做正确的事。 国家福利系统同样需要更多理性的慈悲而非泛滥的感性共情。面对家庭成员的负面情绪传染，最核心的原则就像飞机遇险时的指示：“先给自己戴上氧气面罩”。只有先护持好自己的幸福感，才不会被对方的消极病毒拖垮，才能拥有真正帮扶对方的能力。布鲁克斯补充道，除非存在虐待（abuse），否则他绝不赞成家庭关系决裂。如今全美大约六分之一的人因为政治分歧而与家庭成员断绝往来，他直言这种行为“荒谬绝伦”，单纯的观点不合或对方情绪不佳绝不是斩断亲情的正当理由。 ### [01:18:27](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4707s) 中场赞助插播：LinkedIn Jobs 节目在此处插播了赞助商广告。史蒂文·巴特利特强调，打造世界级企业的核心始终在于人才。无论是他旗下的哪家公司，招聘时的首选渠道都是 LinkedIn Jobs。他介绍了该平台的几大优势：仅需大约 5 分钟即可免费发布招聘岗位；可在个人头像上添加“Hiring”徽框告知人脉网络；还可以设置筛选问题（screening questions）快速锁定与岗位需求高度匹配的人才。最后，史蒂文为播客听众提供了免费发布职位的专属通道（linkedin.com/doac）。 ### [01:19:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4768s) 外向者与内向者：谁更容易获得长久的幸福？ 谈及性格特质对幸福的影响，史蒂文询问外向者还是内向者更快乐。布鲁克斯表示，大量经典研究表明，外向者（Extroverts）往往表现出更高的正向情感（positive affect），日常情绪状态通常更昂扬、更外露。然而，内向者（Introverts）却拥有独特的长线优势： - **更深层的情感联结**：内向者建立的关系更为紧密深厚，能够维系长久稳固的友谊和伴侣关系，这些深层关系为他们提供了持久的情感支撑。 - **外向者的孤独困境**：外向者社交广泛但往往浮于表面，反而经常体会到强烈的孤独感。 对话随即转向史蒂文的个人性格。尽管史蒂文在公众面前充满活力，如同富有探究欲的“疯狂科学家”，但他坦言自己私底下绝对是个内向者。布鲁克斯问他：“你在聚会上会感到精疲力竭吗？”史蒂文看向身旁共事五年的团队成员杰基（Jackie），坦承自己其实只想一个人呆着，在聚会中很容易感到社交疲惫。 ### [01:20:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4812s) 内向与外向者的幸福差异与友谊圈子 史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）和亚瑟·布鲁克斯（Arthur Brooks）探讨了内向与外向在社交中的实际表现。当亚瑟问史蒂文在派对上是否会感到精力被迅速吸干时，史蒂文坦言自己甚至根本不去派对。亚瑟指出，史蒂文的底层特质显然是内向的，但优秀的创业者都掌握在必要时刻展现外向特质的技能。作为一个主持顶级播客的人，史蒂文如果完全封闭，根本不可能坐下来与人面对面交流；而史蒂文回应道，自己真正享受的是深度交流，极其厌恶无意义的客套闲聊（small talk）。 在谈到人际关系时，史蒂文分享了自己紧密而固定的朋友圈：他身边最要好的依然是认识了12年的那5个老朋友。他们是真正的朋友（real friends），而非出于利益或交易建立的“交易型朋友”（deal friends）。史蒂文动情地提到，当年自己穷困潦倒、不得不“在超市顺手牵羊拿披萨来填饱肚子”时，正是这5个人陪在身边。亚瑟指出，外向者与内向者体验幸福的方式截然不同：外向者更容易获取短期的快乐与享乐（enjoyment），而内向者则往往能沉淀出更深沉、持久的长期幸福与人生意义（meaning）。 --- ### [01:21:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4865s) 元认知：对抗焦虑与情绪的理性解药 史蒂文提出，亚瑟之前提到的“元认知”（metacognition）听起来就像是不快乐的解药，并希望亚瑟能用“向10岁孩子解释”的方式深入浅出地拆解这一概念。亚瑟解释道，元认知本质上就是“反思自己的思考过程”（thinking about your thinking），并且在对情绪做出反应之前给自己争取更多时间。 人类的情绪由大脑深处古老的边缘系统（limbic system）生成，而真正对情绪进行理性评估与决策的，是位于前额正后方的前额叶皮层（prefrontal cortex）——也就是大脑的“高管指挥层”（C-suite）。情绪产生到理性分析不在同一个区域，转移需要时间。亚瑟举例说明：当10岁的小孩情绪崩溃大喊大叫时，父母不会对他说“别那么边缘系统”，而是会说“用语言表达出来（use your words）”。用语言表达感受的过程，正是调动前额叶皮层进行元认知思考，将情绪主导权从原始边缘系统夺回的过程。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 焦虑与恐惧在大脑中的神经回路机制 accDescr: 恐惧由视觉输入在74毫秒内激活杏仁核与HPA轴，而元认知通过前额叶皮层将无形焦虑化为有形逻辑。 subgraph FearCircuit["原始恐惧反射通路 (约74毫秒)"] A["威胁刺激 / 视觉皮层"] --> B["杏仁核 (Amygdala)"] B --> C["下丘脑 (Hypothalamus)"] C --> D["脑垂体 (Pituitary Gland)"] D --> E["肾上腺 (Adrenal Gland)"] E --> F["分泌应激激素 (如皮质醇)"] end subgraph Metacognition["元认知干预回路 (前额叶介入)"] G["无聚焦的模糊焦虑"] --> H["书写记录与逻辑拆解"] H --> I["前额叶皮层 (Prefrontal Cortex / C-Suite)"] I -- "理性驯化" --> J["转化为具体、受控的逻辑恐惧"] end ``` 亚瑟从演化生物学角度深入剖析了焦虑与恐惧的本质： - **恐惧的演化机制**：恐惧原本被设计为一种短暂、剧烈的突发反应。当眼枕叶的视觉皮层接收到外界威胁时，信号在短短 74 毫秒内直达杏仁核，经由下丘脑激活脑垂体，促使肾上腺迅速分泌应激激素。这种瞬时反射在历史上挽救了人类无数次生命（例如在伦敦街头看错来车方向时避免被撞）。 - **现代生活与焦虑的本质**：焦虑实质上就是“失去了聚焦的恐惧”（unfocused fear）。现代人极少遭遇猛兽袭击，但长期面对弥漫性、模糊不清的潜在威胁，导致杏仁核持续处于半激活状态，皮质醇像水滴一样不断滴入大脑，令人时刻感到惶惶不安。 - **书写化解焦虑的具体操作**：每天抽出10分钟拿出纸笔进行元认知书写： 1. 写下当前最让自己感到焦虑恐惧的核心事项； 2. 剖析为什么这件事会发生； 3. 预设最坏的结果到底会是什么； 4. 制定若最坏结果真的发生时的应对策略。 这一套动作能直接把体验从情绪中枢（杏仁核）强制拉入逻辑中枢（前额叶皮层），将模糊可怖的幻想撕开，把原本看似凶猛的“雄狮”还原为微不足道的“小老鼠”。 --- ### [01:24:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=5054s) 奋斗者的失败恐惧与成功成瘾 亚瑟坦诚自己本身也是一个极度焦虑的人，随身保持着记录各种恐惧的清单，甚至还有一份专门的“失败清单”。作为从一开始就拼命奔跑的“全能奋斗者”（strivers），他最深沉的恐惧就是面对失败。然而，当他真正把“失败具体会是什么样子”落实到纸面上时，那种无形的恐惧便烟消云散。 亚瑟与史蒂文剖析了奋斗者的心理困境： - **失败是奋斗者的幽灵**：不直视它时，它如影随形；一旦用理性凝视它，它便无所遁形。 - **成功成瘾与自我物化**：许多高成就者将自我价值完全建立在“成功人士”的标签之上，陷入了对成功的成瘾（success addiction）。 - **腹侧纹状体的多巴胺陷阱**：每当史蒂文被告知“播客又增加了700万次下载”时，大脑中的腹侧纹状体（ventral striatum）就会受到强烈奖赏刺激。然而这类纯数字指标并不具备内在意义；一旦增长停滞或数据下滑，大脑就会立刻拉响警报，误以为人生正在坠入深渊，从而滋生出巨大的幻影式恐慌。通过元认知将这些虚妄的指标剥离，才能看清事实本质。 --- ### [01:25:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=5130s) 著作赞誉与终极问题：面对无法掌控之事 史蒂文盛赞亚瑟与奥普拉·温弗瑞（Oprah Winfrey）合著的新书《Build the Life You Want: The Art and Science of Getting Happier》，称赞书中不仅涵盖了诸如“发短信更频繁的青少年抑郁和焦虑比例更高”、“幽默疗法能让人感到快乐度提升35%”以及感恩等扎实研究，更重要的是打破了市面上那些兜售“快乐三步法”或“快乐独家秘方”的快餐伪科学，以应有的复杂度和严谨科学给予了读者真正的幸福进阶路径。史蒂文感叹这本书读起来就像是专门为自己写的一样，亚瑟微笑着回应：“我写这本书正是为了你。” 在播客的传统保留环节中，上一位嘉宾留下了一个匿名的终极问题：**“对于生命中那些我们无法掌控的事情，我们究竟该如何应对？”** 亚瑟给出了清晰而坚定的回答： > 我们无法掌控的事物，几乎全部存在于我们自身之外。我们必须接纳一个客观现实——这个世界上充斥着大量非人力可控的外在因素。应对不可控之事的唯一方式，就是将全部注意力重新聚焦到我们生命中真正能够掌控的部分。只有这样，我们才能重获主观能动性（agency），并在面对那些真正无法掌控的外部风浪时，内心依然保有一份平静与超然。 对谈在双方诚挚的致谢与互敬中画上句点。随后，史蒂文作为健康品牌 Huel 的董事与投资人，分享了关于其明星产品 Daily Greens 正式登陆英国市场的消息，介绍了一勺包含 91 种维生素、矿物质及全食物提取营养素的肠道健康支持方案。 ### [01:28:31](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=5311s) 赞助产品上线预告与下期节目推荐 史蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）在节目的尾声向听众介绍了本期赞助产品的购买渠道，提醒大家获取该产品的链接已经放置在下方的视频简介中。该产品定于 1 月在英国正式发售，鉴于目前的市场需求异常火爆，他非常笃定地表示该产品一旦开售很可能会迅速售罄，建议感兴趣的观众尽快点击查看。 紧接着，史蒂芬为正在寻找下一期播客内容的听众给出了贴心推荐。团队在后台数据中发现，凡是喜欢本期内容的观众，往往也会“欲罢不能地爱上”他们近期推出的另一期深度访谈。为了方便大家无缝收听，他同样将该期节目的链接附在了下方简介里，并信心满满地向听众保证大家一定会从中获得极大的启发与享受。随后，节目在轻快的片尾音乐中圆满落幕。 ## Notable quotes > [15:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=938s) 感觉仅仅是幸福存在的证据，就像闻到饭菜的香味是饭菜存在的证据一样，香味本身并不是晚餐。 — Arthur Brooks > [19:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1185s) 如果一件事具有成瘾性，而你总是在独自一人时去做它，那么你很大概率做错了。 — Arthur Brooks > [24:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1461s) 满足感是历经挣扎与奋斗之后所获得的喜悦。 — Arthur Brooks > [27:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=1662s) 渴望你所拥有的，而不是拥有你所渴望的。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:04:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3852s) 和跟自己太像的人约会一点都不性感，差异才性感。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:04:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=3852s) 女人结婚时以为能改变丈夫，结果往往不能；男人结婚时以为妻子永远不会变，结果妻子变了。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:12:14](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4334s) 给予爱，就会得到爱。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:16:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4590s) 你不是他的哥们，你是他的父亲。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:21:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=4865s) 焦虑实质上就是失去了聚焦的恐惧。 — Arthur Brooks > [01:25:30](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw&t=5130s) 我们无法掌控的事物，几乎全部存在于我们自身之外。我们必须接纳一个客观现实——这个世界上充斥着大量非人力可控的外在因素。应对不可控之事的唯一方式，就是将全部注意力重新聚焦到我们生命中真正能够掌控的部分。 — Arthur Brooks ## Mentioned Arthur Brooks, Steven Bartlett, The Diary Of A CEO, Robert Waldinger, OECD, Harvard Kennedy School, Harvard Business School, Martin Seligman, Mo Gawdat, The Atlantic, Walter Mischel, Dalai Lama, Carl Jung, Ellen Langer, Oprah Winfrey, Rainn Wilson, Adam Waytz, Framingham Heart Study, LinkedIn Jobs, Huel, Huel Daily Greens, Build the Life You Want: The Art and Science of Getting Happier, From Strength to Strength, Mindfulness, Meditations, Nicomachean Ethics, The Bhagavad Gita, Super Soul ## Video description If you want to hear more about the key to happiness, I recommend you check out my conversation with Dr Robert Waldinger, which you can find here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Itg00I2q8lk 00:00 Intro 02:13 Are You a Professor of Happiness? 07:28 Is Hope Important to Be Happy? 10:21 Follow the Science to Be Happy 13:05 Personal Responsibility 18:05 Enjoyment, Satisfaction, and Meaning 20:01 Addiction and Temporary Rewards 23:10 How to Turn Pleasure into Happiness 28:32 Diets: How the Process Is More Important Than the End Goal 34:48 What's a Good End Goal for Fitness? 38:13 The Why of Your Life 43:48 Finding Purpose and Link to Unhappiness 50:58 The Power of Meditation 01:00:14 Personality Types 01:04:49 Finding the Right Partner That Compliments You 01:08:21 How Your Brain Works When You’re in Love 01:10:25 Does Being in Love Make Us Happier? 01:12:12 Focusing Less on Yourself Brings You Happiness 01:14:15 Is Happiness or Negativity Contagious? 01:19:31 Are Introverts or Extroverts Happier? 01:21:05 What Is Metacognition and Its Role in Happiness? 01:25:31 Last Guest Question You can purchase Arthur’s most recent book, ‘Build the Life You Want: The Art and Science of Getting Happier’, here: https://amzn.to/3SmH5B2 Follow Arthur: Twitter - https://bit.ly/3HnHLje Instagram - https://bit.ly/47CYaeq Get tickets to The Business & Life Speaking Tour: https://stevenbartlett.com/tour/ FOLLOW ► Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/steven/ Twitter: https://x.com/StevenBartlett?s=20 Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/steven-bartlett-56986834/ Sponsors: Linkedin Jobs: https://www.linkedin.com/doac Huel Greens: https://my.huel.com/DiaryofaCEOJan24 [Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRY-foz-ZAw)

[15:38] Arthur Brooks: 感觉仅仅是幸福存在的证据，就像闻到饭菜的香味是饭菜存在的证据一样，香味本身并不是晚餐。 [19:45] Arthur Brooks: 如果一件事具有成瘾性，而你总是在独自一人时去做它，那么你很大概率做错了。 [24:21] Arthur Brooks: 满足感是历经挣扎与奋斗之后所获得的喜悦。 [27:42] Arthur Brooks: 渴望你所拥有的，而不是拥有你所渴望的。 [64:12] Arthur Brooks: 和跟自己太像的人约会一点都不性感，差异才性感。 [64:12] Arthur Brooks: 女人结婚时以为能改变丈夫，结果往往不能；男人结婚时以为妻子永远不会变，结果妻子变了。 [72:14] Arthur Brooks: 给予爱，就会得到爱。 [76:30] Arthur Brooks: 你不是他的哥们，你是他的父亲。 [81:05] Arthur Brooks: 焦虑实质上就是失去了聚焦的恐惧。 [85:30] Arthur Brooks: 我们无法掌控的事物，几乎全部存在于我们自身之外。我们必须接纳一个客观现实——这个世界上充斥着大量非人力可控的外在因素。应对不可控之事的唯一方式，就是将全部注意力重新聚焦到我们生命中真正能够掌控的部分。

[32:37] Arthur Brooks: Losing your last five pounds of belly fat so you can see your lower abs... is not necessarily that healthy [and] is not going to materially improve your life and your relationships. [39:18] Arthur Brooks: If you're having fun more than you're serving other people, you're not going to find your sense of meaning. [64:49] Arthur Brooks: Wishing that your partner were more like you is just a form of egotism. [85:28] Previous Guest: What are we supposed to do about the things that we cannot control? [85:28] Arthur Brooks: The things that we can't control are virtually all outside ourselves.

[0:00] I take the same test year by year and I [0:02] am 60% happier than I was 5 years ago [0:04] because I finally cracked the code okay [0:06] so Arthur BR the world-renowned social [0:09] scientist har Professor best-selling [0:11] author who teaches people how to live a [0:13] better happier life I've studied the [0:16] science of happiness and I found that [0:18] most of what Society tells us is wrong [0:20] and we will go into all of this for [0:21] example they found that happiness is [0:23] about 50% genetic introverts tend to [0:25] have more long-term Happiness and [0:27] happiness is a mind virus it will [0:30] transmit from one person to another [0:31] person to another person really yeah [0:33] they were looking at the trajectory of [0:35] people's lives measuring everything for [0:36] many years and they found obesity is [0:38] contagious when your friends get [0:40] divorced you're more likely to get [0:41] divorced but also when your friends get [0:42] happy you're more likely to get happy [0:44] the problem is with happiness has been [0:46] in Decline since about 1990 one of the [0:48] reasons is that we need struggle and [0:50] suffering for us to actually get the joy [0:51] that we seek but we know that for [0:53] example 95% of D fail is the most [0:56] unsuccessful industry in the world [0:57] because the arrival fallacy that when I [0:59] actually get rid of the belly fat then [1:01] I'm actually going to have a more [1:02] wonderful life that's actually not true [1:05] you actually get more satisfaction from [1:07] the progress okay so if not a weight [1:10] number or a financial number what's a [1:12] better more realistic goal to set that [1:14] has more chance of success to being [1:15] happier there are goals that actually do [1:17] lead to the happiest life and the more [1:18] you have the better off you are the four [1:20] goals that really matter [1:26] are quick one this is really really [1:28] fascinating to me on the back end of our [1:30] YouTube channel it says that [1:33] 69.9% of you that watch this channel [1:35] frequently over the lifetime of this [1:36] channel haven't yet hit the Subscribe [1:38] button I just wanted to ask you a favor [1:40] it helps this channel so much if you [1:42] choose to just subscribe helps us scale [1:44] the guest helps us scale the production [1:46] and it makes this show bigger so if I [1:47] could ask you for one favor if you've [1:49] watched the show before and you've [1:50] enjoyed it and you like this episode [1:52] that you're currently watching could you [1:53] please hit the Subscribe button thank [1:55] you so much and I will repay that [1:57] gesture by making sure that everything [1:59] we do here here gets better and better [2:00] and better and better that is a promise [2:02] I'm willing to make you do we have a [2:05] [Music] [2:10] deal Arthur Steve what do you do I [2:15] am dedicated to lifting people up and [2:18] bringing them together using the science [2:21] and ideas around human happiness where [2:24] did you teach I teach at Harvard [2:26] University are you a professor of [2:28] Happiness yeah I'm a professor of [2:30] leadership technically at the Harvard [2:32] Kennedy School and the Harvard Business [2:33] School but my area is leadership and [2:36] happiness so I've studied the the [2:38] science of Happiness which is a huge [2:41] growing field multi-dimensional field [2:42] across Social Psychology and [2:44] Neuroscience behavioral economics [2:46] Philosophy for a long time and what I [2:49] try to do is I bring it to Future [2:51] Leaders in politics and policy and [2:54] especially business and help them [2:56] understand themselves as happiness [2:58] teachers so they can be happier and they [2:59] can be more successful and bring more [3:02] happiness to the people they lead what [3:04] is the state of Happiness can you qu can [3:06] we quantify that where we are in terms [3:08] of are we getting happier as a people or [3:10] more unhappy as a people we can we can't [3:12] so the United Nations and a lot of other [3:14] places try to see the happiest country [3:16] you've seen those data a lot the [3:18] happiest countri it's always Denmark [3:19] it's always the Nordic countries um you [3:22] can't do that and that's like the way [3:25] that that happens is they go to 100 [3:27] countries and they they survey a [3:28] thousand people in each of countries and [3:30] say how do you evaluate your life that's [3:33] like asking people in every country how [3:35] much you like the music in your country [3:38] and on the basis of the highest rankings [3:40] internally you say who has the best [3:41] music that doesn't really make sense [3:43] it's you know it's bad methodology you [3:45] can look at the average well-being [3:47] across a population where people are [3:49] having more or less the same experience [3:51] so I on inside countries inside [3:53] communities over time I'm I'm willing to [3:56] look at that and that shows that in most [3:58] of the oecd countries including the [4:00] United States and UK our countries um [4:03] happiness has been in Decline since [4:04] about [4:06] 1990 since about 1990 yeah is that when [4:10] you were born yeah [4:12] 92 it's not you it's [4:16] us what is um I always think when people [4:19] commit their lives largely to a topic [4:22] that that must have very personal roots [4:23] with that individual sure what are your [4:25] personal roots with the subject of [4:27] Happiness it's hard for me it's hard for [4:29] me I'm not a naturally happy person I'm [4:32] way below average in happiness and at [4:34] least 50% of that is genetic by the way [4:37] so there's a lot of research looking at [4:39] identical twins there's a whole database [4:41] of identical twins born between the mid [4:43] 1930s and 1960s that were adopted into [4:47] separate families at Birth then reunited [4:50] as adults this was not an experiment [4:51] that was cooked up by some you know [4:53] diabolical Harvard you know social [4:55] scientists like me it was it happened [4:58] naturally just over the of events and [5:01] when they were reunited they were given [5:03] personality tests you can see some of [5:05] these meetings where they were reunited [5:07] on on YouTube and they're they're [5:09] wonderful they're joyful and funny you [5:11] find that you have an identical twin you [5:12] didn't know about and say finding all [5:14] these commonalities but of course [5:16] there's always a bunch of social [5:18] scientists you know with with clipboards [5:20] you know Annoying them like me you know [5:22] taking data and so the personality tests [5:25] all show that between 40 and 80% of your [5:28] personality genetic [5:30] and the rest is [5:31] environmental and experiential and [5:33] circumstantial but 80% up to 80% that's [5:37] a lot and that means your openness to [5:39] experience your conscientiousness as a [5:41] person your extroversion agreeableness [5:43] neuroticism and and happiness is about [5:45] 50% genetic your mother literally made [5:48] you unhappy [5:49] Steve I'm or happy your results May Vary [5:52] was your household a happy [5:56] place it was a complicated place but it [5:58] wasn't terrible because my parents were [6:01] good parents and they loved each other [6:03] and they loved us but my relationship by [6:06] the time I was a young adult was [6:09] cordial because they were busy with [6:12] their issues and you know this is one of [6:14] the things that I talk about with a lot [6:15] of people nobody has a perfect childhood [6:17] and a lot of people are troubled by [6:19] their childhood and they feel doomed to [6:21] repeat the circumstances of their [6:22] childhoods but they're not you can [6:24] rewrite your own past history by looking [6:26] back at what happened and deciding to [6:28] change certain variables in the way that [6:30] you're going to live your adult life so [6:31] Steve you're going to get married and [6:33] you're going to have children and then [6:35] you need to look at your own childhood [6:37] and say what are the things that I want [6:39] to be the same and what are the things [6:41] that I want to be different I'm [6:42] designing my life right now on not just [6:45] on the basis of the things that went [6:47] right but on the basis of the things [6:49] that went wrong you know I wasn't close [6:50] to my parents they never lived close to [6:52] me my children who are now growing up [6:55] never had a an intense experience of a [6:57] relationship with any of their [6:58] grandparents they're one side lived in [7:00] Barcelona the other side lived in [7:01] Seattle we were you know in New York and [7:04] Washington DC and and and and so now no [7:07] you know I'm I'm going to live near my [7:08] kids and I'm a grandfather now um all [7:11] three of my adult kids are hearing from [7:14] me every day on FaceTime whether they [7:16] want to or not I see my grandson as much [7:19] as I can next week I turn down a whole [7:21] bunch of work because I I get to babysit [7:23] my my grandson is there any research [7:27] that proves people who have hope in [7:29] their lives have greater chances of [7:30] survival whether it's with when they're [7:32] suffering with you know illnesses or I [7:35] often think about this sort of [7:36] stereotype that when someone retires [7:38] yeah or when they stop working or when [7:41] their partner dies in old age so they [7:43] might be both of them might be 90 years [7:45] old when one of the partners dies it [7:46] seems that the the remaining the [7:48] surviving partner has months left [7:51] sometimes that's mostly true the when is [7:53] not true here's this is depressing how [7:57] you know that statistic which is that if [7:59] the husband dies the wife is going to be [8:01] fine really yeah widows are way happier [8:05] than widowers I told that to my wife and [8:06] she's like [8:08] huh um widowers do really poorly [8:12] generally men do very poorly part of the [8:15] reason is [8:16] because these data are disputed but more [8:19] or less they're they're directionally [8:20] correct 60% of 60-year old men say their [8:22] best friend is their wife 30% of their [8:24] wives say their best friend is their [8:26] husband women have more relationships [8:28] they have close or deeper love [8:30] relationships with non-related kin and [8:33] with the adult children typically than [8:35] than the than the husband does the [8:36] husband's most intense companion [8:39] relationship typically is with the wife [8:41] and that's why that's an asymmetric stat [8:44] and that's what the data say but yeah [8:45] for sure I mean back to the main point [8:47] hope is super critical on illness on [8:50] everything I mean hope actually affects [8:52] all sorts of physiological processes and [8:55] we know that when people lose hope they [8:58] give up and when they give up they don't [9:00] take care of themselves they don't do [9:02] what they need to do they don't exercise [9:05] like they should they don't they're not [9:06] as active they're not talking to other [9:08] people their minds are not stimulated [9:10] they don't eat right they might use [9:12] substances and ways that they shouldn't [9:14] and all of those things compound and so [9:15] just at the physiological level you'd [9:17] see that you'd be You' have degradation [9:18] when there is no hope and when you're 90 [9:20] you can't afford it actually I'm 59 I [9:23] can't afford it either and neither can [9:25] you at 31 we all need hope this is he [9:29] huge to the extent that you can actually [9:30] bring hope to People by showing them [9:34] they can do something as an agent in [9:36] their own future that's just giving them [9:40] a longer better more successful life [9:43] that that's that's what I want to do [9:44] with my work you know because I've seen [9:46] so much I mean since I've actually [9:48] dedicated myself to this I have very [9:50] good protocols for measuring my own [9:53] well-being and I don't game the numbers [9:56] I mean I have there there's [9:57] macronutrients to your happiness you [9:59] have to take the different elements it's [10:01] not a single measur thing and there are [10:03] micronutrients that you can aggregate up [10:05] to it and I follow this um very [10:08] carefully month by month by month [10:10] semester by semester year by year and I [10:12] take the same tests as my students do [10:14] every year and I am 60% happier than I [10:17] was five years ago because of my work [10:19] because of the work that you've done on [10:20] yourself or because of your work as a [10:22] both because here's the deal if you want [10:24] to be happier you need to understand the [10:25] science you need to apply it to your [10:26] life you need to share it with others [10:28] because you won't remember it and hold [10:30] yourself accountable unless you're [10:31] teaching it that's why I teach people to [10:34] be happiness teachers interesting yeah [10:37] yeah so so my guess is how long you been [10:40] doing the podcast two years we launched [10:42] on YouTube three years ago yeah it's uh [10:45] it's probably having a big effect on [10:46] your life huge because you're talking [10:49] about these ideas and my guess is that [10:51] you're in your private life you're [10:53] talking about the ideas that you learned [10:55] with other people and every time you [10:56] share these ideas you imprint them not [10:59] just sort of they're not just limic [11:00] fantasms they become you use them with [11:03] the executive centers of your brain the [11:05] more that you learn the more you talk [11:07] about what you learn the better off you [11:08] get you're only talking about things [11:10] that Empower people and lift them up and [11:11] make their lives better these are the [11:13] topics of what you do right because you [11:16] want people to be happier and more [11:17] successful that's the point of the show [11:19] right and that's how you're getting [11:21] happier and more [11:22] successful is there research that shows [11:24] this point of agency correlates to [11:27] happiness and survival yes like [11:29] longevity and so agency essentially [11:31] means that the belief that you have [11:33] control over your life and your future [11:35] in essence yeah and that you're there [11:37] are things that you can do so that [11:38] you're not helpless helplessness is the [11:40] problem this this gets back to the work [11:41] of Marty Seligman in the in the late 60s [11:44] and 19 early 1970s he's the father of [11:46] positive psychology he created the whole [11:47] field of positive psychology he's a [11:49] great mentor and hero to me he's done so [11:51] much for me and and intellectually and [11:53] in my career and as as a friend just as [11:55] a person and when he was doing his early [11:57] work he was doing animal stuff studies [11:59] and work on human beings to take away [12:01] their agency so he would do things like [12:03] people would be you know putting nickels [12:05] into a slot machine and they would [12:06] figure out along the way that it didn't [12:08] matter if they pulled the handle or not [12:09] that they were getting the same outcomes [12:11] that he took away just little tiny bits [12:12] of agency he had dogs in boxes where the [12:16] they would shock the floors of the boxes [12:18] this is hard to get through internal [12:19] review boards now but they would because [12:21] it seems cruel it wasn't big shocks but [12:23] the whole point was that the dogs would [12:25] you know step off the parts of the floor [12:27] that were shocking them but when they [12:29] couldn't do that anymore they would just [12:31] like lie down and whimper on the [12:33] shocking floor they would give up this [12:35] is called learned helplessness people [12:37] will learn their helplessness when they [12:39] realize that when they when or they [12:40] figure out or they conclude or they're [12:42] told by politicians and media and [12:45] activists and everybody else that [12:46] there's nothing that they can do and [12:47] they're a victim when you take on the [12:52] identity a victim you learn your [12:54] helplessness and that will degrade your [12:56] quality of life make you less successful [12:58] less happy and a lot of studies say that [13:00] you'll you won't even live as [13:03] long this point of agency is so [13:05] interesting I um I had someone on the [13:07] show at the very beginning of the show [13:08] and he said that he basically [13:10] crowdsources his book guy called Mo gat [13:13] you might know the guy says he [13:14] crowdsources his book and he gets 500 [13:16] people to reread to read his book before [13:17] it comes out and he goes when we got [13:19] down to the part in my book about [13:21] personal responsibility he goes 8% of [13:23] people drop off the Google Document [13:25] because they don't want to read it uhuh [13:26] yeah no that's a spinach this this and [13:29] and it's interesting because I have this [13:30] column that comes out every Thursday [13:31] morning in the Atlantic 12 or 1300 words [13:33] on the signs of happiness and about once [13:35] every two or three months I have a [13:37] spinach column which says you want to be [13:40] happy be humble you want to be happy [13:43] change your mind you want to be happy [13:47] don't tell somebody if they disagree [13:48] with you that they're stupid and evil [13:50] listen listen more than you talk you [13:52] know just what your grandmother told you [13:55] right about how to be a successful [13:56] person but it's all about Humanity about [13:59] humility but these are hard things in a [14:02] society where all of our biases are I'm [14:04] right you're wrong I don't want to [14:06] listen la la la la la if it goes against [14:09] my my whatever ideological biases that I [14:12] happen to have and I'll write a spinach [14:14] column and those are the ones that get [14:16] way less way fewer readers do you know [14:18] what's interesting I was as you were [14:19] speaking I was thinking that nobody [14:20] thinks they're a victim they can spot [14:23] victimhood in other people very [14:25] successfully but there's no one [14:26] listening to this right now that would [14:28] say [14:29] I am a victim so how does one know if [14:32] they are a victim well I mean a lot of [14:34] people will say I am a victim of these [14:38] institutional biases a lot of people [14:39] will a lot of people really will say [14:41] that I mean they will say that I'm a [14:43] victim of capitalism or I'm a victim of [14:46] powerful people I'm a victim of of [14:49] conspiracies that are happen the the [14:50] Deep State whatever happens to be a lot [14:52] of people really will talk about it in [14:53] that particular way and that's sort of [14:56] the problem now of course all victims of [14:59] something but we all have tons of power [15:01] and the really interesting thing in life [15:03] is to show people the levels of power [15:05] that they have the levers of power that [15:07] they have that don't start with trying [15:09] to change the outside world that start [15:11] with the inside of their heads that's [15:13] what I'm dedicated to doing is showing [15:15] people that the hope that they should [15:16] have comes from the The Leverage they [15:18] have over their circumstances which [15:20] starts with what they thought they had [15:21] the least control over their emotions [15:25] their happiness their well-being the [15:27] love that they experience because the [15:29] commitments that they make if you really [15:32] want to have power start with managing [15:35] yourself not trying to manage the [15:36] outside world is happiness a choice [15:39] happiness is unattainable because it's a [15:42] direction not a destination is being [15:44] happier a choice yes being happier is a [15:47] choice on the basis of the commitment [15:48] that you are going to make in your life [15:50] and in your relationships in the way [15:52] that you manage yourself absolutely do [15:54] you think there is a starting point to [15:55] being happier yeah it actually starts [15:58] with a [15:59] starts with U recognizing that most of [16:01] what Society tells us about happiness is [16:03] wrong what's wrong it's not a feeling [16:06] happiness is not a feeling on my first [16:07] day of class I have you know two [16:09] sections of 90 MBA students at the [16:11] Harvard Business School and they they're [16:12] taking this happiness science of [16:14] Happiness seminar I've got 400 in the [16:15] waiting list there's an illegal Zoom [16:17] link they think I don't know about right [16:19] it's the happiness class it's super fun [16:22] I love it I love my students they're [16:23] terrific and the I cold call them on the [16:25] first day by saying you know what's [16:26] happiness I pick one two 3 10 what's [16:31] happiness and they will say it's the [16:32] feeling I get when I'm with the people [16:34] that I love or it's how I feel when I'm [16:36] doing what I enjoy feelings feelings [16:38] feelings feelings I say wrong the [16:41] biggest barrier to actually getting [16:42] happier is believing that happiness is a [16:45] feeling it's not it's happiness is [16:47] evidence or feelings are evidence of [16:49] Happiness like the smell of dinner is [16:51] evidence of dinner that's how to [16:54] understand feelings now feelings are [16:55] really really important your affect your [16:57] mood is critically important but [16:59] happiness is something a lot more [17:01] tangible you start getting happier the [17:04] beginning of Happiness of be of getting [17:07] happier because true happiness is not [17:09] the goal because you have to have [17:10] negative emotions negative emotions keep [17:12] you alive negative experiences make you [17:14] learn and grow so you don't want pure [17:16] happiness the Side of Heaven H dangerous [17:18] you'd be dead quickly without a lot of [17:21] unhappiness but getting happier starts [17:23] with this understanding that really what [17:25] it is is the pursuit of three things [17:28] enjoyment satisfaction and meaning those [17:32] are the three macronutrients so you and [17:35] I are nutrition nerds right and what we [17:37] all know and I've heard people say on [17:39] your show is that most people get [17:42] insufficient protein and when you come [17:44] to America Everybody Eats way too many [17:46] highly glycemic carbohydrates right [17:48] happiness is the same thing we get the [17:50] macronutrient profile wrong we need more [17:54] enjoyment satisfaction and meaning we [17:56] know we have to know how to get them in [17:59] in efficient and healthy ways and we [18:02] need them in Balance can you define [18:04] enjoyment satisfaction and meaning for [18:06] me what yeah see this is the problem [18:08] because a lot of people think they know [18:09] what these things are but they aren't [18:10] but this is the adventure because once [18:12] you kind of get into the details of this [18:13] then you've got real strategies for [18:15] getting happier the definition provides [18:18] strategy so let's start with enjoyment [18:19] okay most people think it's the same as [18:21] pleasure but that's wrong pleasure is a [18:23] limic phenomenon now of course you know [18:25] this because you've had you've had [18:27] plenty of guests who talked about the [18:28] lmic system of the brain that's the [18:30] console of tissue deep inside the brain [18:32] that's been evolving over the past 40 [18:34] million years it takes signals from the [18:37] brain stem and other parts rudimentary [18:39] structures in the brain it takes those [18:40] signals about what's going on in the [18:42] outside in the lyic system it translates [18:45] them into information all your emotions [18:48] are is information there's no such thing [18:50] as good and bad feelings bad feelings [18:52] good feel no they're all good they might [18:55] be maladapted but but the point is [18:58] positive and negative emotions keep you [19:00] alive you need especially the negative [19:02] emotions I talk about negative emotions [19:04] all the time because they survival is [19:06] critical and so anger and sadness and [19:10] fear and disgust which are the big four [19:12] negative emotions these have kept you [19:13] alive thousands and thousands and [19:15] thousands of times really important that [19:17] information there then is relayed onto [19:20] the neocortex of the brain specifically [19:22] the prefrontal cortex the bumper of [19:23] tissue right behind your forehead where [19:25] you can figure out what are these [19:27] emotions what do they mean and how am I [19:28] going to react according to them now a [19:30] lot of times these signals are all [19:32] goofed up and and we're very reactive [19:36] which means that we're not letting our [19:37] prefrontal cortex catch up with our lyic [19:39] system and that's a lot of the work that [19:41] I do but back to enjoyment enjoyment is [19:45] not the same as pleasure because [19:46] pleasure is limic it's nothing more than [19:48] a signal where the ventral straight and [19:51] the reward center of your brain is [19:52] getting tapped in the lyic system saying [19:55] that thing is going to be good for [19:56] survival and passing on your genes [19:57] that's why feels good go do it sex and [20:00] sugar sex and sugar sex and sugar and a [20:02] lot and gambling Which social media has [20:05] a lot in common with slot machines and [20:06] all these little things that get back to [20:09] your primordial evolutionary past I know [20:11] you love The evolutionary biology and [20:12] psychology because this gives us so much [20:14] information about who we are today look [20:16] at the place to see and see yourself [20:18] kind of and and all of these things that [20:21] give us pleasure it's because they they [20:23] went back to survival and propagation of [20:25] the species so importantly all those [20:28] pleasure-filled things if you pursue [20:30] them you're just sitting in your lyic [20:32] system and modern technology and Society [20:34] will engorge these things into [20:36] incredibly unhealthy practices so you [20:38] get you know we have natural endorphins [20:40] that make us feel good and and help us [20:42] when we actually get hurt so that we can [20:44] get back to our cave and of course we've [20:46] chemically altered them into fentel [20:49] which feels great until you die fenel is [20:51] not a big thing in the UK but it's a [20:53] huge thing here it's huge I mean we have [20:54] a 100,000 drug overdose deaths every [20:57] year in the United States mostly because [20:59] of fentanyl it's unbelievable but that [21:01] that we have other versions of that you [21:02] know we can have stochastic experiences [21:05] you know things that that that happen [21:07] occasionally and give us a reward when [21:08] we when something happens um not in [21:12] predictably but [21:14] unpredictably um and so we make slot [21:16] machines and they give us all this that [21:18] you know tap into that that brain [21:21] chemistry or we want to propagate the [21:23] species and so we turn it into [21:24] pornography which is unbelievably [21:27] powerful and dangerous for the brain [21:28] because it captures the brain and [21:29] destroys relationships along the way [21:31] it's just feny in its way but all of [21:34] these things are just pleasure pleasure [21:36] anything that can be addictive which [21:39] pleasure-filled things typically can if [21:41] you if you do them compulsively over and [21:43] over and over again it will make you [21:45] less happy but here's know when people [21:47] ask me so does that mean I should never [21:48] drink alcohol I should never gamble no [21:51] no no no you need to add two things to [21:53] turn them into enjoyment you need to add [21:55] people in memory because if you add [21:57] people in memory to something then [21:59] you're moving the experience into your [22:00] prefrontal [22:02] cortex that's when it's fully human [22:04] that's when it's not an animal [22:06] experience it's a human experience and [22:08] that is a very important part of your [22:10] happiness and so the big question is if [22:12] something's addictive if you're doing it [22:14] alone you're probably doing it wrong [22:16] what about sex that's pornography and [22:19] masturbation is alone and that's not [22:21] good for you is the whole [22:23] point that's I mean again reasonable [22:26] people disagree and some people be like [22:27] what's this guy talking about but the [22:29] whole point is that that the data on [22:31] pornography or that it captures the [22:33] brain and ultimately it doesn't on [22:35] average lead to happier lives because it [22:38] truncates the reproductive experience at [22:41] the level of pleasure and doesn't take [22:42] it all the way to [22:44] enjoyment interesting yeah have you have [22:47] you studied porn much as a subject sort [22:50] of everybody in my field whes up there [22:52] it's not something that I focus that [22:53] much on cuz you know it's focusing on [22:56] the research on pornography makes you [22:58] look a little creepy at P [23:02] 59 it's not a good look it's like so so [23:04] so what do you study it's like [23:06] yeah interesting so people in memory [23:09] turn pleasure into enjoyment to [23:12] enjoyment that's right so alcohol add [23:14] people in memory you know the anheiser [23:16] bush Corporation doesn't put out [23:19] advertisements of you know a dude alone [23:21] in his apartment pounding a [23:23] 12-pack that's how a lot of people use [23:25] the product but that's everybody knows [23:28] that's an irresponsible dangerous thing [23:29] to do that can lead to alcoholism what [23:31] they show is the same guy with his [23:33] brothers and friends you know clink and [23:36] bottles together having a great time [23:37] that is pleasure alcohol plus people [23:40] plus memory equals enjoyment and that [23:42] leads to happiness because they want to [23:43] join their brand to happiness not just [23:46] to Pure Pleasure and certainly not to [23:48] addiction same with like Coca-Cola all [23:49] the Coca-Cola ads are like the world cup [23:51] with your friends and In Summer with [23:53] your friends and and that's actually [23:55] less addictive I mean there are certain [23:56] you know the sugar and and caffeine are [23:58] certainly adictive but they don't have [23:59] the same properties of of brain capture [24:02] in the same way for sure because they [24:03] don't they don't stimulate as much [24:05] dopamine as as you know something like [24:07] alcohol does and and so they're less [24:10] likely to make you really addicted but [24:11] the whole point is that they're it it [24:13] does give you a little bit of pleasure [24:14] but it makes you way happier if you get [24:16] to enjoyment and you only get that when [24:18] you're doing it with people satisfaction [24:21] satisfaction is the joy you get after [24:24] struggle you're an entrepreneur you [24:26] understand this one really well you're [24:27] at deferring your gratification all [24:29] entrepreneurs are good successful [24:31] entrepreneurs are good at deferring [24:32] gratification which means I'm going to [24:34] do this hard thing and it's going to get [24:36] big payoff and that payoff is going to [24:38] be [24:39] sweet that's satisfaction there a really [24:42] funny thing about humans is that we need [24:45] struggle and suffering for us to [24:47] actually get the joy that we seek and [24:48] that's a really important part of our [24:50] happiness so you find the people who are [24:52] better at deferring their gratification [24:54] get more satisfaction and they're [24:55] happier there's a lot of that remember [24:57] you've heard about the marshmallow [24:58] experiment yeah and you know people have [25:00] debunked it but they actually haven't so [25:02] the marshmallow experiment was taken [25:03] place it took place in the late' 60s [25:06] where Walter Michelle was a psychologist [25:07] at Stanford out in paloalto he had a you [25:10] know a little laboratory set up where he [25:13] would come in and sit down on one side [25:14] of a table and there was a kid on the [25:16] other side of the table between four and [25:17] eight years old and in front of the kid [25:19] was a marshmallow and so he says to the [25:21] kid you want the marshmallow the kid's [25:22] like yeah yeah he says I tell you what I [25:25] have to go take a phone call in the back [25:26] here but when I come back if the [25:28] marshmallow is still there I'll give you [25:30] another one can you wait every kid's [25:32] like yeah totally totally totally worth [25:34] it he comes back five minutes later or [25:37] so 80% of the kids had eaten the [25:39] marshmallow 20% of the kids hadn't now [25:41] that's a lot 80% of the kids could not [25:43] to further gratification so the real [25:45] question is who's the 20% it's Steve [25:49] Bartlett that these are the people that [25:51] went on to do distinguished things they [25:54] did better in school they got better [25:56] grades they went on to have more job [25:59] success they had better relationships [26:01] that's what they found that the most [26:03] successful kids now the that what people [26:06] fight about now is why whether it's [26:07] nature or nurture it's probably 50/50 [26:10] like everything else in life it's both [26:12] nature and nurture but the bigger point [26:15] is good things come to those who wait [26:17] and when you wait you suffer and you [26:19] need that suffering as part of the basic [26:21] satisfying experience now the bigger [26:23] problem with satisfaction is that Mother [26:25] Nature has a big lie at the end of it [26:28] Mother Nature says if you get it you're [26:30] going to love it forever and that's not [26:32] true see the the the brain the brain [26:36] works emotionally and physically in um [26:39] an environment of homeostasis [26:40] homeostasis means that you always return [26:42] to your Baseline physiologically and [26:44] emotionally because you can't stay in a [26:47] in a in in an unusual physiological [26:49] State unusual states are are reaction [26:53] you need to be ready to react and so you [26:56] know you step off the tread Mill your [26:58] heart is elevated your heart goes back [27:01] to where it was so you're not dead in a [27:02] week the same thing is true for you [27:03] emotionally something really good or bad [27:05] happens to you you think it's going to [27:07] last forever so that you have an [27:09] incentive to avoid or approach the thing [27:12] but it doesn't last forever does it [27:14] that's the problem we actually think [27:17] that if I get that billion dollars it's [27:19] going to be really great and the first [27:21] thing that somebody who has a billion [27:22] dollars says to her himself is I guess I [27:26] needed another billion [27:28] because of homeostasis and that puts you [27:30] on something called the hedonic [27:31] treadmill more more more more more more [27:34] more more so that's the great conundrum [27:36] of the striver is that there's never [27:39] enough Never Enough never enough I deal [27:41] with people all day long I really [27:42] specialize in people who are incredibly [27:44] successful but not happy and a lot of [27:48] what I do is explain one simple equation [27:51] that both explains that but also gives [27:53] you the solution which is that your [27:55] satisfaction doesn't come from all the [27:57] things that you have so have more is not [28:00] the right strategy satisfaction is all [28:03] the things you have divided by the [28:05] things that you want halves divided by [28:08] wants successful people need to manage [28:11] their wants even more than they need to [28:13] manage their halves they need to want [28:15] less and that's a whole kettle of fish [28:18] that's spirituality that's discipline [28:20] that's Fitness that's diet that's a [28:23] whole lot of things that go into that [28:26] and that will help you actually get [28:27] enduring [28:29] satisfaction sounds like a contradiction [28:31] though doesn't it sounds like a [28:32] contradiction to that the striving and [28:34] the struggle is going to make me happy [28:36] but I should want less yeah what people [28:38] actually who crack this code and and a [28:40] lot of you know Eastern Traditions [28:42] actually get into this is not that [28:45] striving is bad but that striving in [28:47] itself has an has a a reward to it that [28:52] you that the process and what you find [28:54] out along the way is that what you [28:56] wanted was not a right rival what you [28:58] wanted was progress and then you start [29:00] to get the reward from the progress [29:01] itself there's a funny thing in the the [29:03] in the research on dieting we all know [29:05] that is the most expensive unsuccessful [29:07] industry in the world right 95% of diets [29:09] fail which means within a year people [29:11] have gained back all the weight that [29:12] they've lost but they're successful in [29:15] so far as that almost everybody loses [29:16] weight when they go on a diet here's the [29:19] thing about diets every day you're [29:21] willing to foro the food you like in [29:24] exchange for the reward which is the [29:26] scale going down [29:28] when you hit your goal it's going to be [29:30] so great it's going to be so great you [29:31] know what the reward is Dave you never [29:33] again get to eat the things that you [29:34] like for the rest of your life [29:35] congratulations once you've got there [29:37] that's why you fail and the arrival [29:40] fallacy which is an identifiable [29:41] phenomenon in my field is that it's [29:43] going to be sweet when I get to the goal [29:45] it isn't what you're going to have is [29:47] homeostasis when you get to your goal [29:49] frustration and disappointment therefore [29:51] you need to want less you need to think [29:53] about the about less about wanting these [29:56] arrival experience experiences and get [29:58] more satisfaction from the progress from [30:00] the journey that's really what it comes [30:03] down to and people who crack that code [30:05] over the course of self-discipline self- [30:07] understanding self-management they can [30:09] actually experience remarkably higher [30:11] satisfaction the dolly Lama I've been [30:13] working with the dolly llama closely for [30:14] the past 11 years and I asked him this [30:17] question how can I get lasting [30:20] satisfaction and he said you need to [30:23] want what you have not to have what you [30:26] want and that's what it comes down to [30:28] it's the management of my wants not my [30:36] Hales on that point we're at the time of [30:39] year now where so many people are [30:40] thinking about diets you mentioned that [30:42] there so for those people that are [30:44] approaching that moment and that you [30:45] know they're going to be setting their [30:46] goals and stuff and all those kinds of [30:47] things what is a better goal to set if [30:49] not a weight number or a financial [30:52] number or whatever what's a better more [30:54] realistic um goal to set that has more [30:56] chance of success yeah has it it's it's [30:59] interesting because there are certain [31:00] things that we can accumulate that won't [31:03] homeostatically return us to the [31:05] Baseline that won't throw us onto this [31:07] honic treadmill over and over and over [31:08] again those goals are the goals that [31:11] actually do lead to the happiest life [31:13] and the more you have the better off you [31:14] are or more actually is better but they [31:17] don't fall into the categories of money [31:19] power pleasure and fame which are the [31:21] typical kind of goals that we get or [31:23] related goals like weight loss or you [31:25] know whatever it happens to be the four [31:27] goals that really matter are Faith [31:30] Family friendship and work that serves [31:33] others those are the four really great [31:35] and Transcendent goals that we can have [31:37] now there's nothing wrong with money or [31:39] power or pleasure or fame there's [31:40] nothing wrong with those things but only [31:42] as intermediate goals to make it easier [31:44] for us to pursue and [31:46] accumulate deeper Faith or philosophical [31:49] life I'm not talking about traditional [31:50] religious Faith necessarily better [31:52] family relationships which are very [31:54] mystical um poorly understood even in [31:57] Neuroscience in a lot of ways friendship [32:00] deep friendship it's hard for a lot of [32:02] people especially successful people and [32:04] work that where you earn your success [32:06] and serve other people that's what it [32:08] comes down to so those are the right New [32:10] Year's goals that we need you know this [32:12] year what am I going to do what how am I [32:15] how am I going to grow closer to the [32:16] Divine how am I going to do that this [32:18] year what am I going to do to draw [32:19] closer to my family and to have a a more [32:22] intimate relationship with my family how [32:23] am I going to have deeper friendships [32:25] this year and how am I going to take my [32:26] work [32:27] and find it more meaningful and [32:30] satisfying on the basis of serving other [32:32] people how am I going to do that what [32:34] is we haven't got to meaning yet yeah we [32:37] haven't got to meaning yet you said the [32:38] word there but but I want to make sure I [32:40] close off on this point about a better [32:41] goal because there's still going to be a [32:43] huge group of people that go listen I [32:44] get it love it I believe it but I hate [32:47] this belly fat yeah I get it and this [32:49] belly fat yo-yos every year so so those [32:51] are intermediate goals and there's [32:52] nothing wrong with those things the [32:54] problem is where they become satisfying [32:56] and self-destructive is when that's the [32:57] final goal Because by the time you get [32:59] there you think why why that wasn't as [33:03] meaningful as I thought that wasn't as [33:04] good as I thought that's the arrival [33:06] fallacy that when I actually get rid of [33:08] the belly fat then I'm actually going to [33:09] have somehow a more wonderful life [33:12] that's actually not true the reason that [33:14] you're doing that is because you want to [33:16] live longer with your spouse and see [33:17] your and and you dandel your 11 [33:19] grandchildren on your knee that's the [33:21] reason you want to do this because you [33:22] need to do it for some intrinsic reason [33:24] as opposed to an extrinsic reason having [33:26] to do with people will love me more I [33:28] mean it's amazing to me cuz I you know [33:30] I'm I do a lot of you know wellness and [33:32] fitness and stuff as it interacts with [33:34] happiness I I work with a lot of people [33:36] who are very big in the longevity [33:37] Community because I have sort of the [33:38] happiness console the science of the [33:40] happiness console that I put into those [33:41] things and and so I meet a lot of people [33:43] that are really into the fitness part [33:44] and and what what a lot of guys will [33:47] tell me is that they'll have these [33:49] fitness goals like I'm going to put on [33:52] 15 pounds of muscle this year and I'm [33:53] going to get rid of all my belly fat and [33:55] the whole thing and and buy if they [33:57] stick to it by September or October [34:00] where they're finding is that you know [34:03] they're not getting any more attention [34:04] or compliments from women but a lot of [34:06] dudes are going looking good dude and [34:09] they're like that's not what I [34:12] wanted and part of the reason is because [34:14] the arrival fallacy is you build up this [34:16] image of what will actually come from [34:19] the the satis the satisfaction that will [34:21] come from hitting these intermediate [34:22] goals these aren't the right final goals [34:25] you got to have the right final goals [34:27] then set some intermediate goals along [34:28] the way but not let's not kid ourselves [34:30] and when you think carefully about that [34:32] that losing your last five pounds of [34:34] belly fat so you can see your lower [34:36] abs which by the way is not necessarily [34:39] that [34:41] healthy is going to materially improve [34:44] your life and your relationships it's [34:45] not just isn't what's a better end goal [34:47] then as it relates to Fitness would it [34:49] be something more centered on health [34:51] yeah it is something that's actually [34:53] sustainable and having you do with [34:54] health also with happiness is the way [34:56] that this works so I work out 60 minutes [34:58] a day it's not because I'm vain look I'm [35:00] like I got a face for radio Steve I mean [35:02] it's good I don't know what you're [35:03] talking about I know but it's age [35:05] adjusted I look good you know this I [35:07] think you look good period and I'm not [35:08] you know I've got a girlfriend but [35:11] credit where credits to you the thank [35:13] you Steve I appreciate that [35:15] but you made my week see this was my [35:18] goal [35:20] yeah but the reason that I do this is [35:22] because I find that for me that working [35:25] out as much as I can is much harder than [35:26] working out every day working out every [35:29] day is much easier than working out as [35:32] often as I can right amen yeah and [35:34] practicing my religion every day is much [35:37] easier than practicing my religion when [35:39] it when it comes naturally to me or when [35:41] I find it convenient eating healthily is [35:44] much easier when I do it every day and [35:45] so the result of that is that I find [35:46] that with those particular routines I [35:48] program those things into my life and [35:50] I'm a much happier guy look at lowers my [35:52] cortisol levels which are naturally very [35:54] high I'm a very anxious person um and [35:57] and I understand anxiety I understand [35:58] the cortisol production I understand how [36:00] to manage it and and this is one of my [36:01] management techniques thing about [36:03] Fitness to understand is when I say it [36:06] makes you happier it actually doesn't it [36:07] lowers your unhappiness happiness and [36:09] unhappiness largely the experiences of [36:13] happiness and unhappiness which is to [36:14] say posi positive and negative affect [36:17] they're produced in different parts of [36:18] the lyic system so you can both be very [36:21] high happiness and very high unhappiness [36:24] I have tests for that that I put my [36:25] students through you're probably [36:28] somebody who experiences both very high [36:30] positive effect and very high negative [36:31] effect we've only met but my guess is [36:34] that you're a mad scientist that's the [36:36] profile and so that means is you got two [36:39] strategies you want to keep your [36:40] positive effect high and you want to [36:42] manage your negative effect effect and [36:44] one of the best ways to manage your [36:45] negative effect effect is physical [36:46] exercise vigorous physical exercise [36:49] today today for me was leg day I hate [36:51] leg day but I feel pretty good right [36:55] now okay that makes sense I've got an [36:57] answer there that I that I'm super clear [36:59] on um I should be aiming at the end goal [37:02] of Happiness ultimately even if it the [37:05] intermediary goals are things like belly [37:06] fat and these short-term things that are [37:08] measurements of my progress towards the [37:09] bigger goal and the real key here is [37:13] consistency yeah I this was the big [37:15] unlock for my whole Fitness thing [37:16] because I was that person which will be [37:18] 90% of people listening now that made [37:20] the goal every year that I was going to [37:21] go to you know change my life every year [37:23] never worked right because I was aiming [37:26] at getting a pack for summer so when I [37:28] arrived with the six pack and it worked [37:31] or summer it was great I look great I [37:32] got I actually got I think I got a [37:34] couple of compliments which was nice [37:37] however the minute summer finished or [37:39] the six-pack arrived I could not find [37:41] for the life of me the motivation no so [37:43] I'd go into winter and I'd become [37:44] there's no willpower that can that like [37:46] you cannot muscle these things out [37:48] unless they become a part of your life [37:50] consistency making my goal consistency [37:53] andits was the big unlock for me for [37:55] sure because then okay the goal [37:57] becomes if I go to the gym every day if [38:00] I make that part of my habits I'm going [38:01] to be healthier happier better at my job [38:04] [ __ ] is there anything more important [38:05] is that less important than a six-pack [38:08] and that mind set shift changed my life [38:11] for sure meaning then meaning was the [38:13] last of the three yeah meaning is the [38:16] why of your life this is the hardest for [38:18] most people especially young adults this [38:20] is really really hard so meaning is is [38:24] really a combination of three things [38:25] it's coherent purpose and significance [38:28] coherence is things happen for a reason [38:31] and so meaning in your life means you [38:32] got to have a theory about why things [38:34] happen like it's one damn thing after [38:36] another I mean you got to have some [38:37] concept of why things happen purpose is [38:39] my life has Direction and has goals [38:42] that's what purpose really is I'm going [38:44] in this direction toward these things [38:46] without getting stuck on the arrival [38:47] fallacy and the last but not least is [38:49] significance which is it would matter if [38:52] I weren't here I'm significant those are [38:55] the three parts of me meaning in [38:57] people's lives according to you know [38:59] philosophers and social psychologist so [39:00] there there's a test that I give my [39:02] students that kind of [39:03] encompasses these three ideas so you can [39:06] remember them into two questions and you [39:09] have a meaning crisis if you actually [39:11] don't have answers to these questions [39:13] that you believe and there's no right [39:15] answers you just got to have your [39:16] answers you want to play yeah here's the [39:19] quiz question number one why are you [39:24] alive you can answer that in terms of [39:27] who created you or what you're on Earth [39:28] to do both okay so why am I alive that's [39:32] something that I get to answer every [39:34] single day I get to Define that by what [39:36] I chose to do this morning when I woke [39:37] up what was it I went to the gym I was [39:40] on the running machine because I know [39:41] I've got a not going to be able to today [39:44] and then I came here and had this [39:45] conversation with you yeah but why are [39:47] you why are you doing this conversation [39:49] with me Steve the iag guy Theory comes [39:52] to mind when you ask that which is it's [39:54] incredibly selfish I learned a [39:56] tremendous amount already just from this [39:57] conversation and I know that it pays um [40:00] pays it forward to other people who are [40:02] going to going to learn from it as well [40:03] and that makes it feel worthwhile so you [40:05] said two things fun and service yeah [40:08] right which is more important to [40:10] you transcendentally which is more [40:12] important to you it's the service part [40:15] yeah okay good we're that gives me all [40:17] my that gives me all my Worth right but [40:19] the more you focus on that the better it [40:21] gets now we uncovered that so now [40:24] thinking about that you put the order of [40:26] operations into the podcast to say did [40:28] it does it serve is that guest going to [40:30] serve is this question going to serve is [40:32] this show going to serve is this [40:35] sponsor GNA serve the people who are [40:38] watching this podcast then suddenly [40:41] meaning starts to go starts to really [40:44] spread out of the soil because you we [40:45] got to that if it's like is it fun yeah [40:48] good so look my my whole have a company [40:51] and that that that rides alongside what [40:53] I do academically and everybody that [40:56] works with me we have an order of [40:58] operations and the order of operations [41:00] are these are the four goals but they [41:01] have to be in this order you just told [41:02] me that the order of operations is serve [41:04] other people and have fun for your work [41:06] that's what you basically said it's [41:08] probably more like lift people up and [41:10] have an adventure that's probably in [41:14] intellectual Adventure right but the [41:16] order of operations has to be right if [41:18] you're having fun more than you're [41:20] serving other people you're not going to [41:21] find your sense of meaning based on that [41:23] first question so you see you see where [41:25] we're going with that right [41:26] so the second question is harder for [41:29] what are you willing to die today [41:31] there's a couple of people in my life [41:32] that I die for I die for my romantic [41:34] partner i' die for my brothers and [41:37] sisters any of them [41:39] MH interestingly I don't know if I die [41:42] for my parents which is interesting did [41:44] you die for an [41:46] idea did you die for your [41:49] country I would die it when you say for [41:52] my country do you mean to save the [41:54] country I don't know I mean if you were [41:56] called to even if it were [41:59] ridiculous even if you thought it were [42:02] ridiculous would you die because you [42:04] love your [42:05] country it depends what you mean by that [42:07] what's the cost if I what's the cost if [42:09] I stay alive no I know and I and it's it [42:11] everything is context specific to a [42:13] certain extent but really what I'm I'm [42:15] trying to see is what's your what's your [42:19] kind of reaction is to this you know to [42:22] see what the there are good things in [42:24] there you are willing to die for your [42:25] girlfriend yeah Will to die for your [42:27] brothers and sisters Mom and Dad it's [42:29] like jur kind your mom listen to this [42:32] podcast they do but I'm just being [42:34] honest because I think I think I don't [42:37] know why I said that but I just I no for [42:39] sure this is good this is really [42:40] important right this is worth thinking [42:42] about right now the worst answer is I [42:46] don't know or nothing those are the [42:48] worst answers that doesn't mean it's a [42:49] problem on the contrary it's a huge [42:51] opportunity huge entrepreneurial [42:53] opportunity to realize you don't have [42:55] answers to these questions because you [42:57] don't have to go to you know get your [42:59] PhD in philosophy you don't have to sit [43:01] at the mouth of the cave with the guru [43:03] someplace in the himas you need to look [43:05] for your answers to these questions [43:07] that's it that's the quest that's the [43:09] Vision Quest so and when you see [43:12] somebody find these things like a lot of [43:14] young adults have they're nowhere near [43:16] you where you are on your journey you're [43:18] solid Steve I mean this is good stuff [43:20] but I meet a lot of people like why am I [43:23] alive cuz a egg met a sperm really [43:26] yeah and what are you willing to die for [43:29] nothing really or I don't know right A [43:31] lot of people and then they uncover that [43:33] they don't have a why is what it comes [43:35] down to repeat the questions again why [43:38] are you alive and for what are you [43:40] willing to die this very [43:42] day there's no wrong [43:45] answers I have so many young kids in [43:48] particular messaging me on Instagram [43:50] with the same question which is I think [43:52] Society Instagram quotes all of that [43:54] stuff has told them that they need to [43:55] find find their purpose and it seems [43:57] that they're in Hunt of their purpose [43:59] like it's some Easter egg um and you [44:01] think about that phrase itself find your [44:04] purpose it comes loaded with two [44:05] assumptions find which means you got to [44:07] go search for it and purpose which is a [44:09] singular word means there's one of them [44:11] somewhere and the unhappiness that I [44:14] sense because they were unable to find [44:17] this Easter egg somewhere that they've [44:19] been searching for causes them to feel [44:21] all kinds of inadequacy what do you say [44:24] to that yeah well part of it is because [44:26] that's the what we call in in business [44:29] the go find a rock theory of leadership [44:32] where the the CEO says to an employee go [44:35] give me a rock like what go give me a [44:37] rock okay so you go outside and you [44:39] bring a rock back in the boss says wrong [44:41] Rock that's not helpful right that's go [44:44] find your purpose that's the go find a [44:47] rock theory of leadership it's like what [44:49] rock how where do I look the world is [44:52] full of rocks that's so you need to be a [44:54] lot more specific and figuring out [44:57] deeply why you believe you're walking [44:59] the Earth why you actually are alive [45:01] besides just the mechanical you know [45:03] explanation for what we understand in in [45:05] 10th grade biology the real why the Deep [45:08] why you're alive and and think really I [45:11] mean if with push came to shove I would [45:13] die for this I actually would die for [45:15] this thing that's when you understand [45:17] what your deepest values are that's when [45:19] you can actually write your mission [45:21] statement that's what it comes down to [45:23] and that's how people actually find is [45:25] opposed to just platitudes on the [45:27] internet of go find your purpose as if I [45:30] mean I I spent a lot of time in darmala [45:32] in in the Himalayan Foothills this where [45:33] the Dal Lama lives in in um in Northern [45:36] India and uh when I'm me in darm Solo [45:39] was a little village until the Daly Lama [45:43] went there about 1960 when he was exiled [45:45] from China when was kicked out of Tibet [45:47] and now it's not a metropolis but [45:50] there's tons of people there and there's [45:52] I meet a lot of westerners there there's [45:54] Seekers I'm a seek Seeker man gosh yeah [45:57] yeah I'm a seeker and so I'm going to go [45:59] to a place where I feel like there's a [46:00] lot of positive spiritual energy and [46:03] don't get me wrong I mean I've you know [46:04] I've studied meditation with the Dal [46:07] Lamas Tibetan Buddhist monks I mean it's [46:11] I'm a much better Catholic on the basis [46:12] of this I feel like I'm I'm I'm a deeper [46:14] Christian on the basis of this but the [46:17] idea of just going someplace and and and [46:19] randomly looking hoping that your [46:23] purpose just hunts you down is misguided [46:27] you have to have a much better more [46:29] specific sense of what you're looking [46:31] for and these things coherence [46:34] significance and purpose as part of [46:36] meaning or the way to do it and those [46:37] two questions are a good way at least to [46:39] get started there's going to be a huge [46:40] you know group of people that are listen [46:42] to this and thinking you know what I [46:43] don't have anything that I would die for [46:46] and I don't really know why I'm alive [46:48] yeah and that's just made me hugely good [46:50] news it's incredibly good news because [46:52] that's the basis of your adventure is to [46:55] find those things cuz in point of fact [46:57] there are things out there you just [46:58] don't know them yet and you haven't been [47:00] looking for them you've been who knows [47:02] what you've been looking for like maybe [47:04] even looking for what I like right why [47:07] is that wrong there's nothing wrong but [47:09] it's just not going to find it's not [47:10] going to be the secret of finding your [47:11] meaning what I enjoy is a different [47:14] pillar of Happiness a lot of people will [47:15] say if I figure out what I enjoy then [47:17] I'll find my meaning no those are [47:19] different there different you're over on [47:20] that branch of the tree you're trying to [47:22] get over on this branch of the tree [47:23] different questions so I'm that person [47:25] say that person now and I don't have [47:27] answers to either you tell me it's [47:28] that's a great place to be because it [47:29] means the start of my adventure yeah [47:31] what do I do put my shoes on and leave [47:33] the house what what Jo so there's a a [47:36] lot of different protocols you can [47:37] actually start depending on where where [47:39] you on your life one of the things that [47:40] I actually recommend is reading more not [47:43] reading garbage and dumb stuff and not [47:45] even reading the news I put people on a [47:47] protocol of 15 minutes a day of of of [47:50] real reading actually there's a [47:51] three-part plan you want to hear the [47:53] three-part plan to actually start [47:54] figuring out the answers of these [47:55] questions M you don't have to answer the [47:57] questions directly but number one is [47:59] start thinking to yourself what do I [48:02] think is right and wrong what are my [48:04] moral principles what are my moral [48:07] non-negotiables that's the moral basis [48:09] of living it's the foundation of [48:11] actually figuring out the answers to [48:13] your questions so for me that might be I [48:15] think like free speech is important for [48:17] example um treating people with dignity [48:20] equality cool right and this is going to [48:22] change over the course of your life too [48:23] so you know you're 28 years younger than [48:26] me when you're my age is going to be [48:27] different and and saying to yourself [48:29] that's good I want to change I want to [48:31] change I want to change and that means [48:32] that one of your non-negotiables is [48:35] moral flexibility perhaps really [48:38] important that you're able to evolve [48:39] right the world doesn't want you to [48:41] evolve the world wants you to be rigid [48:42] because you're a better soldier in the [48:44] culture War when you're not able to say [48:46] huh what I thought actually probably [48:48] isn't right huh weird right okay so so [48:51] that's that's number one is the moral [48:52] foundations and thinking about that you [48:54] know I I asked my students to take out a [48:56] piece of paper and write start writing [48:58] things down that they think he the [49:00] things that I actually think are right [49:02] and wrong here the basis of the way that [49:04] I want to live now this is a very yian [49:06] idea Carl Jung said that the basis of [49:08] happiness is figuring out what you [49:10] believe and acting according to it [49:11] living according to it that the basis of [49:13] unhappiness is living not in accord with [49:17] your own [49:19] morals in other words I believe these [49:21] things are right and wrong and I'm [49:22] systematically violating them it's so [49:24] incredibly empowering when talk to a [49:26] young woman or man and I say for example [49:30] what do you think is a decent way to [49:32] treat a member of the opposite sex when [49:34] you're on a date and they'll tell me and [49:36] I say are you acting according to that [49:38] they're like no I said that's why you're [49:39] unhappy according to Carl Yung but also [49:41] according to Common Sense Once you know [49:44] what that is and say I'm going to start [49:45] acting and living according to my own [49:48] principles your life starts to change [49:50] why is that so say someone right now is [49:52] for example cheating on their partner [49:54] but they know and they're against [49:56] cheating they're against cheating they [49:57] know it's everybody's against cheating [49:58] by the way betraying somebody you love [50:00] everybody's against betraying somebody [50:02] you love right that's actually natural [50:04] law if you believe there's any natural [50:05] law why is why why is that making them [50:07] unhappy that's making them unhappy [50:09] because that's doing violence to their [50:11] own sense of propriety you're hurting [50:12] yourself you know the most ancient [50:16] wisdom traditions and religious [50:17] Traditions when they talk about Sin you [50:19] know Islam and Christianity and Judaism [50:21] and Hinduism and name the religion [50:24] there's a concept of sin right sin in [50:27] almost every religious tradition is not [50:28] offending God it's hurting yourself it's [50:32] self-destructive Behavior you're doing [50:35] something not in accord with the way [50:37] that you want to live and in so doing [50:39] you're weakening yourself you're making [50:41] it harder for you [50:43] to understand yourself as a good person [50:46] as a person of Integrity as an upright [50:48] person which we actually need and again [50:50] there's a lot of go back to the social [50:52] psychology research on this we need to [50:54] see ourselves as good people it goes [50:56] back to your point as well about [50:57] helplessness and agency because if I [50:59] know that that is bad but I can't seem [51:01] to stop myself doing it yeah I'm telling [51:03] myself that I'm low agency and I'm [51:05] helpless I'm a victim of my own sin yeah [51:07] I'm a victim of my own weakness I'm a [51:09] victim of my own impulses so this is one [51:11] of the reasons that people will be like [51:14] I hate how I eat what are they actually [51:17] saying they're not saying that I I hate [51:19] you know I mean like I I'm a sugar Fiend [51:21] I love I just can't get enough of it I [51:24] don't drink alcohol but I drink tons of [51:25] sugar lots of sugar I shouldn't do it [51:28] now it doesn't offend my sense of [51:30] propriety to be sure right but I could [51:32] get to the point where I'm so unhealthy [51:34] that I hate that about myself because [51:35] I'm actually hurting myself but I'm [51:37] being controlled by my impulses this [51:40] getting in line with your own views and [51:42] making a plan and this is where the New [51:44] Year's resolutions about taking off the [51:46] weight [51:48] actually make sense because it's not [51:50] about the ab veins it's about being [51:53] morally consistent with your own view of [51:55] the person person that you want to be is [51:56] what this comes down but you can't do it [51:58] till you lay it out until you actually [52:00] put it in black and white write down [52:01] your moral philosophy I don't care how [52:03] dumb it is write down your moral [52:05] philosophy and say make a plan to start [52:07] living according to it that's the base [52:08] of the pyramid there's two other parts [52:11] okay the second part is a contemplative [52:13] tradition is contemplation you need more [52:17] contemplation such that you can [52:19] experience Transcendence now there's a [52:21] bunch of different ways to do this right [52:24] um this is why everybody wants to do [52:26] mindfulness meditation that's all that [52:28] is is basically is sitting still without [52:32] your phone and and and and focusing on [52:35] being alive so there a lot of ways to do [52:37] it there's informal ways to do it my [52:39] colleague Ellen Langer if you had her on [52:41] the show no super interesting person she [52:43] actually was the one who brought the [52:44] concept of mindfulness to the West about [52:46] 30 years ago wow she wrote a book called [52:48] mindfulness she's a she was the first [52:50] woman tenured in the psychology [52:52] department at Harvard she's phenomenal [52:54] and she's just absolutely frustra and [52:56] and she says that mindfulness is best [52:58] practiced if you're sitting on the train [53:00] by putting away your phone putting your [53:01] hands in your lap and looking out the [53:02] window can they listen to this podcast [53:04] while they do that because no you should [53:07] listen to the podcast but not during [53:08] those periods okay and start with five [53:11] minutes of a of of just simple [53:13] contemplation of life now there are [53:14] other ways to do it prayer is a really [53:16] good way to do it too religious [53:17] Traditions are excellent at doing it but [53:19] people in a distracted world don't do [53:21] that at all you need to be in your head [53:24] you need to stop distracting yourself [53:26] and systematically stop distracting [53:28] yourself because in your default mode [53:31] Network you'll actually start to think [53:33] about things that actually matter [53:35] including the things that are in the [53:36] fundamental moral basis that you've that [53:38] you've started to formulate you need [53:40] contemplation I was thinking about this [53:42] last night I don't know why I was [53:43] thinking about this but this is how [53:44] weird I am I was thinking about why I [53:47] don't pray anymore because I grew up in [53:49] a Christian faith until the age of about [53:52] 18 are you still Christian no and every [53:55] time we had dinner for my whole [53:57] childhood the family sit around the [53:58] table one of us would have would pray [54:00] and we'd just basically give thanks for [54:02] things we're you know grateful for right [54:04] and I stopped praying because I no [54:06] longer have the Christian faith but but [54:08] I was thinking last night it doesn't [54:09] mean I need to give up the prayer which [54:11] is just an exercise in gratitude to be [54:12] thankful for the nature of my life and [54:15] that would serve if and I don't have to [54:16] pray to something I can just pray for [54:19] gratitude well you can contemplate you [54:21] can contemplate the source of your [54:22] gratitude so gratitude listing is really [54:24] important way for to focus uh on the the [54:28] we're resentful creatures because we [54:29] have a negativity bias we have a [54:31] tendency to pay attention to the [54:32] negative things in our lives [54:33] disproportionately because that tendency [54:36] serves us for survival you know you know [54:39] you pay attention to the worst thing [54:40] that happened at the dinner not the best [54:42] thing that happened to the dinner for a [54:43] reason I mean we've evolved to the snap [54:46] of The Twig behind you does not make you [54:48] think oh bet that's my friend right so [54:51] that that's just how we're Revol and the [54:53] way to not that let that become all [54:55] adapted is for you to contemplate the [54:56] sources of your gratitude which are [54:58] incredibly abundant now the reason you [55:00] stop praying is because you don't [55:01] believe there's anybody on the other end [55:02] of the line listening yeah yeah you [55:04] think that you're it's like the ghost [55:05] phone in Japan after the after the the [55:08] tsunami the earthquake and tsunami a guy [55:11] set up a telephone booth that's not [55:13] connected where the phone is not [55:15] connected and 30,000 people have gone [55:17] and picked up the phone and talk to [55:19] their dead [55:21] relatives that's the ghost phone and um [55:25] that's not satisfying for you with with [55:27] respect to prayer because your kid [55:28] version of religion was the reason [55:31] you're doing that is because you're [55:32] talking to God you've got a direct [55:33] transmission mechanism to God and now [55:35] you don't think that's actually the case [55:36] so you stop doing the contemplation [55:38] right now it's probably [55:40] worth think rethinking an adult version [55:43] of your faith as opposed to being put [55:46] off by the a lot of people are really [55:48] put off by the kid version of their [55:49] faith it's like really yeah like all [55:52] weird stuff and doesn't make doesn't [55:53] make sense but a a [55:55] most likely according to the data you're [55:57] going to start becoming interested in [55:59] your Christian faith again as you get [56:01] older it doesn't mean you're going to [56:02] have the same faith that you had on the [56:03] contrary you probably won't but you'll [56:05] start being like you know there's [56:06] certain things I miss about that and and [56:09] life actually is messy and there is [56:12] suffering that's hard to explain but [56:14] there's lots of things in life that are [56:15] hard to explain and maybe there's [56:17] something in there that I didn't [56:18] understand before so openness to that [56:20] I'm not saying for sure but I'm saying [56:22] just be open to it and then the top is [56:25] wisdom and that requires reading or or [56:28] you [56:30] know the accumulation of knowledge not [56:32] everybody's a big reader and there's so [56:33] many different ways to get good [56:35] information at this point pod podcast [56:37] for example but the whole point is is [56:39] reading or or acquiring information in [56:42] the wisdom tradition so uh you know read [56:46] the stoic philosophers read the nicomaki [56:49] and ethics of Aristotle read the babad [56:52] Gita read the Quran read the Bible read [56:56] read read and start with 15 minutes a [56:57] day of that kind of reading which you [56:59] can go years saying I wish I read it and [57:01] you don't right I mean it's it's crazy [57:03] we'll spend all this time scrolling [57:05] Instagram when we could spend just 15 [57:07] minutes a day reading the meditations of [57:09] Marcus [57:10] aelius and and the letters of Sena and [57:13] they incredibly enriching right it's [57:16] like whoa boom starting at 15 minutes a [57:19] day so do the work what do I believe [57:24] spend some time in contemplation and do [57:26] the reading your life's about to change [57:29] that's the protocol that's the Tibetan [57:31] Buddhist protocol for actually [57:33] finding F starting to find meaning in [57:35] your life but I've I've prescribed this [57:37] to others and I've done it myself and [57:39] this really works it helps you find on [57:41] the path to the answers to those [57:43] questions build the life you [57:45] want it's a book it's a book sat in [57:48] front of me here that that has your name [57:50] on it and who's this Oprah Winfrey I'd [57:54] like to give you young authors a leg [57:56] up how did you so you co-wrote this book [57:59] with Oprah yeah yeah how how did you [58:01] meet Oprah she called me turns out she's [58:04] a I know it's it's she this is Oprah [58:06] Winfrey I'm like yeah I'm Batman I mean [58:10] it was Oprah Winfrey The Voice she's [58:12] iconic all over the world for sure and [58:15] it turns out that she was a regular [58:17] reader of my column in the Atlantic on [58:19] Thursday mornings how to build a life [58:20] which is a different area of the signs [58:22] of happiness every week that I cover and [58:24] read my last book which is called from [58:26] strength to strength finding success [58:28] happiness and deep purpose in the second [58:29] half of life right so that was a book [58:32] she read on the first day it came out [58:33] and I went on her Super Soul podcast and [58:35] we were thick as thieves just [58:37] immediately because we have the same [58:39] goals as lift people up and bring him [58:41] together in the spirit of happiness and [58:42] love she does it differently because [58:44] she's not an academic she has incredible [58:48] platform I've never seen a platform like [58:51] she has where you know she says one [58:52] thing and people are like H that's it's [58:54] good thing to do but she's always [58:56] looking for it's interesting because she [58:58] has the money and power and fame and she [59:00] uses them she's cracked the code she [59:03] uses them in service of other people and [59:06] that's her whole goal from the very [59:08] beginning she's never said anything to [59:09] disabuse me of the idea that that's how [59:11] she lives and uh we started doing some [59:14] some things together and some podcast [59:16] together and she called up and she said [59:18] you know if I had my show still she for [59:21] 25 years she had this iconic show on [59:22] television in the United States called [59:24] the Oprah win show and millions and [59:26] millions of people watched it every day [59:28] and went off the air in about 2014 or [59:29] something she says if I had my show I'd [59:31] have you on 30 times and then you'd have [59:33] your show she said but I don't have the [59:35] show anymore so let's do kind of a [59:37] version of that and let me host a [59:39] book and and so we wrote the book [59:42] together all over the last winter in the [59:44] winter of 2022 2023 I went away to she [59:47] lives in mono California I live I went [59:50] and got a house in San CL California and [59:52] we we structured the thing and you know [59:55] at her place and we went back and forth [59:57] on the and it was just blast it was [60:01] about you know how to manage yourself [60:02] and once you're able to manage your own [60:04] feelings and emotions like a pro then [60:06] you'll no longer be distracted and you [60:08] can focus on the things that actually [60:09] matter for your life and that's how you [60:10] build your life and you you called me um [60:14] a mad scientist earlier I'd have to take [60:17] the test I think you nailed it I think [60:20] you nailed [60:21] it most likely yeah a which is that [60:24] which appears in your book in the the [60:26] section about the unique sort of unique [60:28] mix of um Happiness and happiness and [60:30] you talk about this panas schore system [60:33] what are these categories and why did [60:34] you call me a mad scientist so the panis [60:37] test is in the book and it's actually on [60:38] the website um at Arthur brooks.com [60:41] where anybody can take it for free it's [60:42] a it's a personality test based on the [60:45] intensity of your positive and negative [60:47] affect AKA [60:49] mood everybody's got more or less the [60:51] same emotions everybody feels joy and [60:54] interest and surprise and anger and [60:57] sadness and disgust and and and fear but [61:00] we have them in different intensities [61:01] depending on who we are and there's [61:03] really four kinds of people with these [61:05] different intensities there's some [61:07] people that have very high affect High [61:09] positive affect they have high highs and [61:13] high negative effect effect low lows [61:16] these are mad scientists that's a [61:17] quarter of the population Now by [61:19] construction it's the quar of the [61:20] population because it's above average on [61:21] both then there are people who are high [61:23] highs and [61:25] low lows I mean I should say that they [61:27] have intense positive emotion but but [61:30] weak negative emotion right these are [61:33] cheerleaders okay so they have they feel [61:37] their positive affect very intensely and [61:39] their negative effect effect very weakly [61:41] oh okay so they're like always happy [61:43] they're not always happy but they tend [61:45] to they tend to be in a better mood and [61:47] see the brighter side of things they [61:49] tend to downgrade threats and think [61:53] everything is going to be okay okay [61:54] that's a quarter of the population M and [61:56] everybody wants to be that by the way [61:58] but that's not necessarily the best way [62:00] to be and they don't make the best CEOs [62:01] because they're they have a hard time [62:03] paying attention to threats they don't [62:05] want bad news and they have a terrible [62:06] time giving bad news or giving people [62:08] bad valuations so working for a CEO [62:11] who's a cheerleader is great for a [62:12] minute but then it starts to become very [62:14] frustrating because you hear him telling [62:15] the the incompetent idiot in the cubicle [62:18] next to you that that she's doing an an [62:20] unbelievably good job ah okay so you I [62:22] mean you got to be realistic to be a [62:24] good I mean you're an entrepreneur you [62:25] know perfectly there's lotss of threats [62:26] out there you got to take them seriously [62:28] yeah yeah yeah so then there are people [62:29] who are high negative low positive these [62:32] are poets these are people who generally [62:35] speaking there's a place in the lyic [62:36] system called the ventrolateral [62:38] prefrontal cortex that's the part that [62:40] makes you a ruminator ruminators are [62:44] people who this part of the brain this [62:46] this part of the brain is dedicated to [62:50] making on problems and negative things [62:52] and regret and that I can't believe that [62:54] I said that thing I feel so stupid for [62:55] saying that thing and what does she [62:57] really think of me etc etc it's also the [62:58] part of the reing that you use when [62:59] you're highly creative comedians yeah [63:02] well for sure for sure you know I pal [63:04] around with a guy Nam rain Wilson who [63:06] was in the American version of the [63:07] office he played Dwight and Rain told me [63:09] that comedians tend to be depressed but [63:11] the reason is because they find out that [63:14] they're funny and they can substitute [63:16] humor for sadness it's a substitute [63:19] emotion it's called a metacognitive [63:20] Technique we talk a lot about that in [63:21] the book so then poets are they tend to [63:24] be high ruminators so high negative [63:27] affect they focus a lot of negative [63:29] things because of this hyperdeveloped [63:30] part of their brains they also tend to [63:33] be really creative because that's the [63:35] same part of your brain that when you're [63:36] working on a business plan or a symphony [63:39] and they also tend to be romantic [63:41] because infatuation is ruminating on [63:43] another person that's kind of the poet [63:46] profile right and then last but not [63:48] least there's low low people who are low [63:50] affect people these are Judges these are [63:52] people who they they're happy and [63:53] unhappy but they feel their moods less [63:56] intensely than other people and so they [63:58] they don't freak out you know these are [64:01] really good surgeons these are really [64:03] good judges they're very good Secret [64:06] Service agents you don't want somebody [64:08] to cut you open and say oh my God you [64:11] you don't want your surgeon to be like [64:12] that and so there's a a gift and a role [64:16] for all four of these quadrants most [64:18] great entrepreneurs are mad scientists [64:21] because they they the reason that [64:23] they're Entre is because they want to [64:25] feel things intensely because everything [64:27] is intense and they do everything [64:28] intensely right you don't have that many [64:30] people who are just like super chill [64:32] like [64:33] yeah interesting yeah it fits that's why [64:37] you just having a deep conversation with [64:39] you you I can see that you have a lot of [64:42] mad scientific characteristics to you [64:44] you feel things deeply is that fair it [64:47] is fair yeah I mean that's the one I I [64:49] resonate with the most and I do describe [64:50] myself as being a bit intense my team [64:52] know me I think I'm I think I come [64:53] across as a bit intense what's your [64:55] girlfriend I'm going to say that she is [64:57] a cheerleader a I'm married to a [65:00] cheerleader oh really yeah and what you [65:02] find is that cheerleaders they can they [65:04] can have the best of times but [65:07] cheerleaders tend to be struggle with [65:09] the mad scientist yeah right it's like [65:12] like why like everything's so great for [65:14] you why are you gloomy you know it's [65:16] like why can't you look in the bright [65:18] side of things like why are you grouchy [65:20] all the time what's wrong with you Steve [65:21] like there's a spelling mistake on our I [65:23] know it's like why why is that bothering [65:25] you yeah yeah so that's That's a classic [65:28] thing everybody can be with everybody [65:30] else but the compliments are really [65:31] important the biggest mistake that [65:33] people make in dating markets is they [65:34] look for their their op they look for [65:36] the their their doppelganger they look [65:39] for their clone you shouldn't look for [65:41] your clone you should look for your [65:42] compliment why because you'll be happier [65:44] when you complete each other that's when [65:46] people who complete each other you find [65:47] that very happy marriages often happen [65:49] between an introvert and an extrovert if [65:51] they learn to appreciate each other so [65:52] it's not you know hammer and T songs all [65:54] the time for the differences but when [65:56] people for example one of the reasons [65:57] that dating apps are so unsuccessful for [65:59] giving people you know satisfactory [66:01] dating experiences people have more and [66:03] more and more choice but they're more [66:04] likely to say they're not satisfied with [66:06] the people they're dating and not [66:07] attracted to the people that they're [66:08] dating it's because they'll set up a [66:10] dating profile saying I vote this way I [66:12] like this music I live here I like these [66:15] things I want somebody with these [66:16] preferences and they get somebody who's [66:18] their sibling which is as my adult [66:20] children will remind me is not [66:23] hot difference is hot it's so true [66:26] because I never would have said I want [66:28] someone that is spiritual um that is [66:31] really involved in spirituality and [66:32] believes in things that you just can't [66:34] see my girlfriend believes in all the [66:35] chakras and these energies and she'll [66:38] read and she just believes in it all and [66:39] it's funny because I never would have [66:41] said that's what I wanted but I [66:42] absolutely love it and that means that I [66:44] actually she's actually pulled me into [66:45] her world she's made me more spiritual [66:47] she's made me believe in things I never [66:49] would have believed before uhhuh and [66:51] she's completing me in that regard it's [66:52] really great it's really great you mean [66:54] you crack the code in that way and [66:55] finding all the ways that you're [66:56] different and celebrating those [66:57] particular differences is really key to [67:00] a to a good relationship and not wishing [67:02] the person were more like you this is [67:04] very important that this is a [67:05] relationship killer is that wishing that [67:08] your partner were more like you is is [67:10] just a form of egotism everyone tries to [67:12] change their partner though don't they [67:14] yeah well I mean it's interesting it's [67:15] like there's there's the old Axiom that [67:17] women are frustrated because they [67:18] thought they could change their husbands [67:21] and they can't and and um h husbands are [67:24] frustrated because they thought their [67:25] wives would never change and they do I [67:27] don't [67:28] know there is truth in that [67:31] relationships and love how important is [67:33] this as a subject for happiness it's the [67:35] number one area of interest of my [67:37] students really my average student is 28 [67:39] years old so they're MBA students [67:40] they're Master's students they've all [67:41] gone through college they've gone to [67:42] work and they've come back to the [67:44] Harvard Business School you have to have [67:45] some business experience to get the [67:46] business master's degree and this is the [67:49] number one thing they want to talk about [67:50] they want to learn about they want to [67:51] learn about it scientifically they want [67:53] toar learn about the neurochemical [67:55] Cascade of what's actually happening in [67:56] your brain and at what point you can't [67:58] control it anymore we have a lot of case [68:00] studies at the business school about you [68:01] know CEOs who were dismissed for [68:03] inappropriate relationships with [68:05] subordinates I mean it's a classic theme [68:08] you know it's I and the last line of the [68:10] case study is I was the the CEO looking [68:12] out the window of the train after being [68:13] dismissed going I don't know what [68:15] happened yeah and so we look at brain [68:17] scans and say this is what happened and [68:19] you can see it in the brain kind of I [68:21] mean that somebody who's really in love [68:23] uh has you brain activity it looks an [68:25] awful lot like a methamphetamine addict [68:26] brain scan I mean your brain is if [68:29] you're at a certain point in the falling [68:31] love process your brain is captured so I [68:33] mean at the beginning when people meet [68:34] there's a there's a a hormonal um [68:37] reaction with testosterone and estrogen [68:39] which are you know sex hormones [68:40] obviously and you know when people see [68:41] somebody who's really attractive that's [68:42] why they they want to look attractive [68:44] because that's the that's the ignition [68:46] mechanism that typically happens after [68:48] that you see a big uh increase in in [68:51] noradrenaline AKA nor um epinephrine and [68:54] dopamine level so you have anticipation [68:56] of reward and Euphoria that's sort of [68:59] the second line of things that tend to [69:01] happen in this chemical Cascade that's [69:03] going on when you're falling in love [69:05] after that you see a dip in serotonin [69:08] which is really interesting so serotonin [69:09] we think about as the as the neurom [69:11] modulator of of peace and happiness [69:14] which is what a lot of the psychiatric [69:15] drugs are trying to manipulate when when [69:18] they feel that it's an imbalance so [69:19] people who are clinically depressed will [69:20] often get selective serotonin reuptake [69:22] Inhibitors meaning you maintain a higher [69:24] level of Serotonin and that's all really [69:26] controversial still I mean because we [69:28] don't really understand that very well [69:30] but we do know that when people are [69:31] falling in love that they're more likely [69:34] to be ruminative and infatuated remember [69:37] that part of the brain the ventrolateral [69:38] prefrontal cortex that does rumination [69:40] it'll be more active when serotonin is [69:42] low and so serotonin will be low so you [69:45] start ruminating on the other person [69:47] that's when the infatuation part of the [69:48] relationship really kicks in and then [69:50] you get to the point of attachment which [69:52] is which is invol which involves [69:54] oxytocin which is a neuropeptide that [69:56] functions as a hormone that makes you [69:58] attached to the other person very [70:00] profoundly attached to the other person [70:02] that's intensely pleasurable so it's [70:04] like and the longer you let it go the [70:08] harder it is for your brain not to be [70:09] really really captured you wouldn't go [70:11] to a methamphetamine addict and say why [70:13] did you buy methamphetamine that's [70:16] illegal they' be like I'm an I'm an [70:18] addict I'm a junkie it's the same thing [70:20] as when somebody's sleeping with a [70:21] subordinate are people that are in love [70:24] in in relationships happier [70:26] statistically no on the contrary because [70:29] being in love especially in the early [70:30] stages of being in love is not [70:32] associated with what we would associate [70:33] with actual happiness because it has [70:36] jealousy tons of jealousy which is you [70:39] know the rumination part when your [70:40] serotonin levels are really low it's [70:42] hard for you to say ah I feel so great [70:44] you feel euphoric and you like it in its [70:47] own way but if you kept that if you [70:48] stayed in that stage you'd go out of [70:50] your mind and you'd be miserable because [70:52] there's jealousy there's surveillance [70:54] behaviors are really common and you know [70:57] this there's no nobody would say that [70:59] when I'm surveilling my intimate partner [71:01] that's when I'm [71:02] happiest nobody likes that but but [71:04] people tend to do that because you're [71:06] there's a lot of your brain is basically [71:08] saying I'm trying to figure out if this [71:09] is somebody who's going to betray me [71:11] back to evolution is this somebody who's [71:13] going to wander off and raise somebody [71:15] else's kids is this somebody who's going [71:16] to be when I don't know it carrying [71:19] somebody else's baby which is how men [71:21] and women actually they tend to express [71:23] sexual jealousy in those two interesting [71:26] there's a guy at um University of Texas [71:28] at Austin that studies jealousy the most [71:30] jealousy provoking thing for men is an [71:34] image of their intimate partner having [71:35] sex with somebody else for women it's an [71:38] image of their intimate partner saying I [71:39] love you to somebody else and the reason [71:42] is because traditionally or [71:44] evolutionarily women have to be worried [71:48] that their partner is going to take go [71:50] take care of somebody else's children [71:52] and men have to be worried that they're [71:53] not the actual father of the children [71:55] which According to some estimates is 15% [71:57] of paternity which is misattributed [72:00] worldwide makes sense that's a [72:03] lot no it makes sense well so [72:05] fortunately my kids look like me yeah I [72:07] one that's adopted she doesn't look like [72:09] me this idea in chapter four of your [72:11] book of focusing Less on yourself leads [72:14] to happiness how can you prove that's [72:15] the case so there's a there's a lot of [72:19] experimental tests that actually show [72:20] this using human subjects and so one of [72:21] the classic uh experiments there's these [72:23] guys at at Northwestern there's a [72:25] fabulous social psychologist named Adam [72:27] weights I don't know if you've had him [72:28] on your show before he's a really [72:29] impressive and Innovative social [72:31] psychologist he did a an experiment [72:33] where he took the undergraduate students [72:34] you always use the undergraduate pool at [72:36] your University because they'll do [72:37] literally anything for 20 bucks and and [72:39] and he put them into three groups one [72:41] had to do moral Deeds they had to do [72:43] random acts of kindness one had to do [72:46] moral thoughts they had to sit and think [72:48] beautiful thoughts about other people [72:49] and one had to do self focus sort of [72:51] self-care things go do something [72:53] something that really makes you feel [72:54] good and they looked at their happiness [72:56] over you know a series of weeks with [72:59] these interventions and we they found [73:00] that moral Deeds were happier than moral [73:02] thoughts and moral thoughts were happier [73:04] than self-care that's what they found in [73:06] other words you and again this this is [73:09] basically showing the same thing that [73:11] you know I did research for years and [73:13] years and years about happiness and [73:14] sharable giving if you're lonely the [73:16] most important thing you can do is [73:17] volunteer just is if you give money away [73:21] statistically you're more likely to make [73:22] more money next year incredible [73:25] investment strategy and the reason is [73:27] because you see yourself as an agent of [73:29] of positive change you're empowered when [73:32] you're helping other people you when you [73:34] give love you get love that's the bottom [73:37] line is what it comes down to and so all [73:38] of these experiments find kind of the [73:40] same thing if you put uh you know two [73:42] groups randomly selected of people um [73:44] one group is playing board games and the [73:46] other is helping you know sixth graders [73:48] with their math the ones helping sixth [73:49] graders with their math will have a mood [73:51] boost for days afterward I mean this is [73:54] just helping other people helps you not [73:57] focus on the Psycho Drama inside Steve's [73:59] head and it makes it so that life [74:02] actually has a Transcendent aspect to it [74:04] you get perspective you get peace and [74:06] furthermore you get empirical [74:09] confirmation that you are that person [74:11] that you want to be is happiness or [74:14] negativity contagious yes that's [74:16] emotional contagion there's a lot of [74:17] literature on emotional contagion it's a [74:18] virus it's a mind virus negativity is a [74:21] virus negativi is a virus but so is POS [74:23] positivity that you can actually so you [74:25] find that you know when I go into [74:26] companies which I do a lot these days I [74:27] do a lot of Happiness teaching inside [74:30] you know executive teams and [74:31] corporations and when I walk into a [74:33] company I can I can I can pretty quickly [74:35] ascertain which virus is going around [74:38] you know this is why the mood and [74:40] emotional well-being and emotional [74:41] self-management of CEOs is so critically [74:43] important because you know everybody's [74:45] like oh the bosses the boss is having a [74:47] hard time today though I think a boss [74:49] got yelled at this morning at breakfast [74:50] or whatever it happens to be because the [74:52] they can see it and the result is it [74:54] tends to the virus tends to pass around [74:56] a this sucks attitude is horrible inside [74:59] families and we see it and it will [75:01] transmit from one person to one person [75:03] to another person to another person [75:04] that's why it's hard to live with a high [75:06] negative affect person that's why [75:08] because High negative affect people will [75:10] spread a negativity virus even if you [75:13] live down the street well it depends on [75:15] how much contact you have with that [75:17] person and so you know that's why you [75:18] want your kids to hang out with positive [75:20] friends that's why would you you'll when [75:23] you have your kids and when my kids were [75:24] little they would have that one friend [75:25] who's like happy all the time you love [75:27] that kid you have the one kid who's just [75:28] bummed out all the time you're like I [75:30] don't want my kid to be around that [75:31] because that that infects the attitudes [75:34] of of the of your children in the book [75:36] you say living within a mile of a friend [75:38] or family member who becomes happier [75:39] makes you 25% likelier to become happier [75:43] too if you have contact with that person [75:45] obviously it it's not going to transmit [75:47] just through the air it's not you know [75:48] it's not the Corona virus but uh but you [75:51] have to have contact with the person but [75:52] you know and the way that they they [75:54] measured that that's called the [75:55] Framingham heart study which was out in [75:57] fra that's a suburb of Boston but for [75:59] many many many years they were looking [76:01] at the trajectory of people's lives to [76:03] look at heart you know issues but then [76:06] they started measuring everything else [76:07] and they found for example that obesity [76:09] is highly is is is very easy to catch [76:13] when your friends become obese you [76:15] become more obese that when your friends [76:16] get divorced you're more likely to get [76:18] divorced that when your friends get [76:19] happy you're more likely to get happy is [76:21] what we see and and and the more [76:23] proximity that they have to you measured [76:25] geographically or in terms of the [76:26] intimacy of the relationship the [76:28] stronger the transmission mechanism I [76:30] think a lot about that and how we take [76:31] on other people's problems when they're [76:33] friends and family um what you say to [76:36] that and does it matter that we take on [76:37] other people's problems sort of I mean [76:40] that's there's a big distinction between [76:41] empathy and compassion so the best way [76:43] to be a parent or a partner or a friend [76:45] is to be compassionate and that's not [76:46] the same thing as empathy our society [76:49] overvalues empathy empathy is feeling [76:51] somebody else's pain that's Tak taking [76:53] on their problems the worst parents of [76:55] teenagers are empathetic or highly [76:57] empathetic people it's like yeah I feel [76:58] your pain why because you're not [77:00] actually helping you got to do things [77:02] that that that you know I may feel your [77:04] pain but I can't be I can't be paralyzed [77:06] by that on the contrary I got to do hard [77:08] things you're not going to like son [77:10] that's what being it that's the reason [77:11] we always say you're not his friend [77:13] you're his dad you know and that's means [77:15] be compassionate don't be empathetic the [77:17] same thing is true with the big level I [77:19] mean I I would argue that our our [77:21] welfare systems in our countries are [77:23] need to be more compassionate um as [77:25] opposed to Simply empathetic and you [77:27] know that's and that we could actually [77:28] help people a lot more too being [77:30] compassionate means being hard as steel [77:32] and doing the things that people [77:34] actually need because you love them not [77:36] just because you're actually feeling [77:37] their pain so in our families we need to [77:40] say what does this person that I love [77:42] actually need notwithstanding the [77:44] feelings that they're transmitting to me [77:46] and sometimes that means you got to care [77:47] for your own happiness like they say in [77:49] the plane put on your own oxygen mask [77:51] first take care of your own happiness so [77:53] you're not you're not getting this [77:55] negativity virus all the time being [77:56] paralyzed by somebody else's pain you're [77:58] not going to help him enough no it's [78:00] almost never well I mean there there are [78:01] cases when somebody is just a Schism but [78:04] I I only recommend pican family Schism [78:06] when there's abuse and you know somebody [78:09] being unhappy is not abuse political [78:11] differences really not abuse those are [78:13] that's a it's like one in six Americans [78:16] in this country is not speaking to a [78:17] family member because of Pol political [78:19] differences that's insane that's simply [78:22] insane that doesn't not count as any [78:24] good reason to do that unless there's [78:25] actual abuse quick one if you guys have [78:29] heard me speak on this podcast before [78:30] about company culture and the secret to [78:31] building a world-class company you know [78:33] that everything starts with people which [78:35] brings me to our sponsor on this podcast [78:38] which I'm very excited to announce today [78:39] which is LinkedIn jobs the entrepreneurs [78:42] and business owners that listen to this [78:43] podcast you'll probably 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finding tons [79:34] of studies sign find that extroverts [79:36] have more positive affect they have [79:38] higher they tend to have higher mood but [79:40] introverts have special gifts they have [79:43] closer [79:44] relationships they have deeper emotional [79:47] connections to other people and the [79:48] result of that is that they have [79:50] long-term friendship and Marriage [79:53] Partners that sustain them in a way that [79:55] extroverts don't extroverts often get [79:58] can get really lonely because they are [80:00] you an extrovert it's such an [80:01] interesting question because you might [80:03] not be even though you're a mad [80:04] scientist I don't think I am do you get [80:05] when you're at a party do you find that [80:07] you get exhausted I looked at Jackie's [80:08] know me many many years five years I'm [80:10] an introvert I just want to be alone so [80:12] when you're at a party do you find that [80:13] it sucks energy out of you I don't go to [80:15] the party certainly your Baseline is [80:17] introversion but you have extroverted [80:19] characteristics because you're able to [80:20] do good entrepreneurs know how to be [80:22] extroverts when they need to be which is [80:25] important and you run a podcast if [80:26] you're a true introvert it's like I got [80:27] to meet Arthur Brooks what a pain no I [80:29] like deep conversations I don't like [80:30] small talk yeah yeah you do you have [80:32] close friends oh yeah the same five guys [80:34] i' I've known years that you've known [80:36] since College yeah basically no others [80:38] other than this slot here who I consider [80:39] friends but the same five that I've [80:41] known for 12 12 years they're real [80:43] friends not deal friends no they're real [80:44] friends they were there when I was [80:46] shoplifting pizzas to feed myself same [80:47] Five Guys so that's interesting and and [80:50] but so extroverts they tend to get more [80:53] shortterm happiness and introverts tend [80:55] to have more long-term happiness so what [80:57] you find is that extroverts they tend to [80:59] get more enjoyment and and introverts [81:01] tend to get more meaning metacognition [81:04] you used this word earlier on when we [81:05] were talking about happiness it sounds [81:06] like almost an antidote to unhappiness [81:08] in respects what is metacognition [81:10] explain this like I'm a 10-year-old yeah [81:11] okay so metacognition simply means [81:13] thinking about your thinking and taking [81:16] more time as you react to your emotions [81:19] that's what metacognition is all about [81:21] so theot are produced in the lyic system [81:24] of the brain an ancient part of the [81:26] brain you react to them and decide what [81:28] they mean in the prefrontal CeX the sea [81:31] Suite of your head that takes time those [81:34] are not the same place you need to [81:35] experience your emotions in your [81:38] conscious executive brain which is the [81:40] part the front the part of the front the [81:41] bumper of tissue right behind your [81:42] forehead so when your kids are little [81:44] when your kids are 10 and they're [81:46] freaking out about something you don't [81:48] say don't be so limic you say use your [81:52] word [81:53] what you're saying is be metacognitive [81:55] allow yourself to explain this thing [81:58] that you're feeling and in so doing [81:59] you're using your prefrontal cortex as [82:01] opposed to relying on the lyic tissue of [82:03] your brain so write it down would be an [82:04] example writing externally is phenomenal [82:07] classic case so you're anxious yeah [82:09] anxiety is unfocused fear that's what it [82:12] is fear was adapted in in the human [82:14] species so that to be episodic and [82:16] intense the way that fear is supposed to [82:18] work is that something happens it alarms [82:21] you it illuminates the igala of your [82:23] brain that sends a signal through the [82:24] hypothalamus to the pituitary gland [82:27] which then signals the adrenal gland [82:28] sitting above the kidneys to spit out [82:29] stress hormones this happens in 74 [82:32] milliseconds of the the perception of a [82:35] threat in you know the occipital lobe of [82:38] your brain where you're you know your [82:39] visual cortex exists boom this thing [82:42] happens really really quick this is and [82:43] saved your life many many times [82:45] thousands of times you know because you [82:47] live in London and you can get run over [82:49] at any given second it's crazy well [82:51] actually because I'm looking the wrong [82:52] direction for oncoming traffic that's my [82:53] problem there so so that's how that's [82:56] how that works is the whole point so [82:58] fear is supposed to work that way very [83:00] episodic very occasional the problem in [83:03] Modern Life is that we have all of these [83:04] vague threats that are happening that [83:06] are kind of half Illuminating our our [83:10] amydala which is giving us a little drip [83:12] of cortisol into our brain all the time [83:14] and that's unfocused and freaking us out [83:16] so the way to actually solve that [83:18] problem metacognitive is say okay okay I [83:21] got to focus it take out a piece of [83:23] paper number one number one thing that [83:26] I'm afraid of right now that's actually [83:27] giving me this anxiety that's giving me [83:29] this discomfort write it down why is it [83:33] happening what's the worst thing that [83:35] can happen and what would I do if that [83:37] happened and you literally moving the [83:39] thing experience from the amydala which [83:42] is the emotional Center to the [83:43] prefrontal cortex which is The Logical [83:46] which is that's for your SE suite and [83:47] that should kill the anxiety it will it [83:49] greatly attenuate the anxiety it will [83:51] turn it into a logical kind of fear [83:54] that's the right reaction to these [83:56] threats and it will change your life so [83:59] if you do that if you're experiencing a [84:01] lot of [84:02] anxiety you know unfocused fear focus it [84:06] every day for 10 minutes write it down I [84:08] have a I have a I'm a very anxious [84:10] person I have a running list of the [84:12] things that I'm afraid of a running list [84:14] I have lots and lots of lists I keep [84:15] lots of lists because journaling is so [84:16] critically important I also have a [84:17] failure list what are you afraid of I'm [84:19] afraid of failure I'm afraid of failing [84:22] I'm a total striver from the very [84:24] beginning failing what's what does what [84:25] would failure look like I know that's [84:27] the thing it's an unfocused fear and so [84:29] when I write it down and I focus it I go [84:30] oh yeah it's true you know that's that's [84:33] the point so it's failure is a spectre [84:35] for Strivers it's a kind of a when you [84:38] look at it it goes away yeah yeah but [84:40] when you're not looking at it it's there [84:42] and part of the reason is because your [84:44] self-image is one of somebody who's [84:46] successful so you're self- objectifying [84:49] as a successful person you're success [84:50] addicted meaning the vental item of your [84:52] brain gets tapped every time somebody [84:54] says Steve you got another 7 million [84:57] downloads or something that is not [85:00] inherently meaningful in that particular [85:01] way because the metric is actually what [85:03] Taps your ventral stum again and again [85:04] and again and so then if that's going in [85:07] the wrong direction and you're not [85:08] making progress then that sort of feels [85:10] somehow not successful which means that [85:13] things are going in the wrong direction [85:15] and that's just like this [85:17] fantasm right it's like and so okay [85:20] focus it focus it look at it poof [85:22] right disappears it doesn't entirely [85:24] disappear it turns into what it really [85:26] is which is a mouse not a [85:28] lion oh your book is fantastic I mean we [85:30] could talk for for so long because [85:32] there's so much more in it there's some [85:33] of the unb unbelievable stats that I was [85:35] reading about around social media and [85:38] this one St about um a study showing [85:39] that teens who texted more often than [85:41] their peers experienced more depression [85:42] anxiety and relationship and po [85:43] relationships the other things about [85:45] laughter and that you can feel 35% [85:47] happier um using some humor therapy all [85:50] of these things gratitude all of these [85:51] things that we haven't haven't covered [85:53] but they're all in this fantastic [85:54] fantastic book which is so unbelievably [85:56] accessible for someone that as smart as [85:58] you Oprah had okay oh okay right okay [86:02] yeah and I thank you for that because [86:05] happiness is a complex thing and I think [86:06] there's an industry out there that are [86:08] trying to simplify it and put it down to [86:11] three steps to happiness or one this one [86:13] secret to happiness one weird trick [86:15] don't gra you know whatever but your [86:17] approach provides the nuance and the [86:19] complexity that the subject matter [86:20] deserves and I think that offers us a [86:22] towards being happier as you talk about [86:25] in the book um that's why I wrote it I [86:28] wrote it for you oh it actually reads [86:31] like you wrote it for me that's the kind [86:33] of but I imagine everyone that reads [86:34] it's is going to feel that way um I [86:36] highly recommend everybody goes and gets [86:37] this book ASAP it's a really really [86:39] beautiful book as well it's so beautiful [86:42] um we have a closing tradition on this [86:43] podcast where the last guest leaves a [86:44] question for the next guest not knowing [86:45] who they're leaving it [86:46] for what are we supposed to do about the [86:49] things that we cannot control what is [86:51] your opinion on this [86:53] the things that we can't control are [86:55] virtually all outside [86:58] ourselves we have to accommodate [87:00] ourselves to the fact that we live in a [87:02] world where there are many things that [87:04] we can't control and focus on the things [87:07] that we can how do we deal with things [87:09] that we can't control by refocusing our [87:11] attention on the parts of our life that [87:13] we actually can thus giving us agency [87:15] and giving us a sense of peace and [87:17] perspective about the truly [87:20] uncontrollable ala thank you so much so [87:22] wonderful to meet you you've energized [87:24] me this morning and we started pretty [87:26] early for me this is super early know [87:28] it's apprciate it I appreciate it so [87:30] much thank you Steve it's wonderful to [87:31] be with you I've admired you for such a [87:32] long time I get to meet you in person [87:33] it's been a joy that means the well to [87:35] me someone is uh profound and as smart [87:37] as you to say that to me means a ton so [87:39] thank you so much Arthur from the bottom [87:40] of my heart really really appreciate it [87:41] thank you you too thank [87:43] [Music] [87:49] you as you'll know if you've listened to [87:51] this podcast before I'm an investor in a [87:52] company called hu I'm on their board and [87:54] they sponsor this podcast and I have a [87:56] very exciting announcement to make this [87:58] product called Daily Greens is one of [88:00] the most highly requested products at hu [88:02] but it's never been sold in the UK [88:04] before [88:05] until now it's often difficult to get [88:08] all of the greens into our diet that we [88:10] need to have a healthy gut microbiome [88:12] and a healthy body and with hu's Daily [88:15] Greens product with one scoop every [88:17] morning a very very delicious scoop you [88:19] can get 91 vitamins minerals and whole [88:22] food source nutrients into your diet the [88:25] most important Point here is I genuinely [88:26] believe it tastes delicious it's May my [88:29] favorite heal product ever for all the [88:31] reasons I've described so if you want [88:33] access to this product the link is in [88:34] the description below it launches in the [88:36] UK in January because of the demand I'm [88:39] pretty sure it's going to sell [88:41] out do you need a podcast to listen to [88:44] next we've discovered that people who [88:46] liked this episode also tend to [88:48] absolutely love another recent episode [88:50] we've done so I've linked to that [88:52] episode in the description below I know [88:54] you'll enjoy [89:01] [Music] [89:03] it