Former Navy Specialist Triggers Mindset Shift to Multiply Executive Sales

前美海军专家推动思维转变，助力高管销售业绩倍增 通过环境激发与身份承诺克服行为障碍，在打破认知默认惯例的同时驱动职业成长。 行为学专家 Chase Hughes 深入剖析了驱动人际互动、权威感与影响力的核心机制。他分享了关于解读肢体语言（例如眨眼频率和微表情）的见解，并详细介绍了用于沟通与销售的实用框架，如 ACSS、PCP 和 FATE 模型。此外，Hughes 还阐述了重塑内在自信、克服童年局限性信念，以及通过为未来的自己服务来掌握自律的心理学技巧。 任何追求的成败都取决于三大核心支柱：自我掌控、观察力与沟通力。 (0:00) 历史上每一个重大事件、组织或人际结果，根本上都可以追溯到人类行为以及领导力、自我管理与说服力等因素。 (2:00) 在 ACSS 模型中，权威感与舒适感对影响力的决定作用远胜于具体的技术技巧或现成话术。 (6:42) 将身体动作放慢至“水下速度”可以平复神经系统，并展现出沉稳扎实的个人权威感。 (6:42) 个人权威由五个内在要素（自信、自律、领导力、感恩与乐趣）构成，并在五大核心生活领域中得以体现。 (12:04)

Behavioral expert and military veteran Chase Hughes argues that human success across leadership, negotiation, and personal transformation is determined by underlying psychological mechanics—specifically self-mastery, observation, and communication—rather than technical checklists or superficial scripts. The Hierarchy of Authority and Composure (6:42) Hughes asserts that most people fail to influence others because they focus on surface-level tactics rather than foundational traits. Under his ACSS framework, true interpersonal impact requires ascending from Authority through Comfort and Social Skills before specific technical skills or scripts can function effectively. Without internal comfort and personal authority—built across controllable domains such as personal environment, time management, appearance, and finances—superficial posturing or nervous collapse invariably telegraphs internal insecurity. To project genuine authority, Hughes highlights composed physical markers, notably deliberate slowness of movement, rather than exaggerated dominance. True authority relies on an internal foundation of confidence, discipline, leadership, gratitude, and enjoyment. When these elements are absent, cognitive dissonance leaks through micro-behaviors, triggering negative intuitive reactions in others regardless of how well an outward script is executed. Observation and Detecting Behavioral Baselines (29:23) Hughes outlines behavioral profiling as a multi-step evaluation rather than the reliance on isolated gestures. Valid behavior analysis requires observing changes against an established baseline, evaluating situational context, identifying clusters of simultaneous reactions, filtering for cultural norms, and cross-referencing behavioral checklists. Isolated actions, such as scratching an itch or touching the face, carry little diagnostic weight on their own. A primary unconscious indicator of mental state is blink rate, regulated automatically by the nervous system. While slow, steady blinking signals deep concentration and predatory manipulation exhibits almost zero blinking, acute anxiety or deceptive stress can cause an individual's blink rate to surge to 70 to 80 blinks per minute. Hughes monitors individual and aggregate room blink rates in high-stakes environments—such as keynote speeches, investor pitches, and jury trials—to identify when an audience's focus or comfort deteriorates. Persuasive Communication and Psychological Drivers (39:46) Effective communication relies on identifying a subject's core social driver rather than reciting canned talking points. Hughes categorizes these primary motivators into six categories: significance, acceptance, approval, intelligence, pity, and strength or power. Persuasive framing aligns directly with these drivers; for example, appealing to an intellect-driven individual requires highlighting exclusivity and unconventional thinking, whereas pitching a significance-driven counterpart demands focusing on status and measurable scale. To bypass defensive cognitive filters, Hughes advises gathering intelligence through indirect elicitation instead of asking intrusive questions. Techniques include intentionally stating incorrect facts to trigger an innate reflex to correct the record, using bracketing to narrow down hidden figures, or expressing disbelief. Hughes links this to his PCP model (Perception to Context to Permission), demonstrating that altering a subject's contextual perception grants them subconscious permission to agree to requests or behaviors they would normally resist. The FATE Framework and Habitual Discipline (68:40) Hughes models human and mammalian compliance through the FATE framework: Focus, Authority, Tribe, and Emotion. Re-evaluating the 1962 Milgram obedience experiment, where 67% of participants delivered lethal 450-volt shocks, Hughes argues that obedience was catalyzed not just by perceived authority, but by the intense novelty of the setting capturing focus, paired with incremental identity micro-agreements that locked subjects into their roles. Applying these mechanics to self-mastery, Hughes redefines discipline as prioritizing the needs of one's future self over immediate gratification. Because approximately 91% of New Year's resolutions fail from over-relying on brute willpower, long-term change requires establishing automated micro-habits and re-engineering the living environment. Techniques such as visual stimulus for the primitive mammalian brain, altering visual home cues to disrupt automatic neural scripts, and actively mapping dopamine sources away from low-effort consumption reinforce lasting behavioral habits. Modern Vulnerabilities and Algorithmic Capture (110:49) Modern digital platforms actively exploit evolutionary vulnerabilities to capture mammalian focus. Hughes points to short-form video algorithms utilizing hypnotic fractionation—a concept originating from Dr. Milton Erickson that alternates rapidly between extreme emotional highs and stressful lows. By cycling users through divergent affective states within seconds, these platforms induce suggestibility and increase advertising conversion rates. Hughes observes that separating individuals from natural settings and placing them into high-density urban or digital crowds degrades empathy and social accountability. Drawing parallels to the bystander effect documented in cases like Kitty Genovese (1964) and modern transit studies where crowds ignore individuals in distress, Hughes contends that exceeding natural human community limits (historically 150 to 200 people) overloads sensory processing and social responsibility, driving urban apathy, depression, and lifestyle diseases. Hughes concludes that mastering human behavior hinges on self-regulation, composed observation, and contextual framing rather than mechanical persuasion techniques. However, an unresolved question remains regarding how effectively individuals can defend against industrial-scale algorithmic manipulation and urban overstimulation, given that these systems exploit the exact same primitive neurological mechanisms that govern personal discipline and influence.

行为专家 Chase Hughes 指出，人际互动与个人成败的底层机制不在于机械化技巧，而取决于习惯与神经反应规律。他主张真正的说服力源自内在从容与个人权威，而可持续的自律则依赖与原始哺乳动物脑建立情感连接、培育自动化微习惯，而非依靠短期意志力硬撑。 权威与从容：影响力层级与内部掌控 (6:42) Hughes 提出了影响力的 ACSS 模型，层级自下而上为权威（Authority）、舒适感（Comfort）、社交技巧（Social Skills）与技术技能（Skills）。他指出约 90% 的人过度聚焦顶层的话术与脚本，但若缺乏底层的权威与内部舒适感，话术便如同交给外行人的飞行操作清单般无效。面对社交压力，人们容易陷入“萎缩”（自我矮化回避冲突）或“虚张声势”（攻击性代偿）两极，而真正的影响力则位于二者之间的中点——由沉静构成的“从容”（Composure）。真实的权威由自信、纪律、领导力、感恩和享受五大特质构成，并在环境、时间、外表、社交与财务五大生活领域的管理中展现；任何领域的失序都会转化为微表情与肢体语言泄露，引发他人的直觉性怀疑。 Stanley Milgram 在 1962 年的权威服从实验印证了权威信号的支配力：在实验人员与权威符号指示下，100% 的普通受试者施加了危险的 250 伏电击，67% 的人甚至执行了最高档的 450 伏电击。这表明当权威符号与全新陌生环境结合时，足以压制个体的道德常识与自主意志。 重塑自律：服务未来自我与神经重构 (93:10) 针对约 91% 的新年决心失败率，Hughes 强调长期改变取决于习惯机制而非抽象目标。他将自律重新定义为“优先满足未来自我需求、而非当下自我即时享乐的能力”。意志力如同“茶匙”，仅在触发初始微习惯时需要少量介入，一旦形成自动化通路便不再损耗心力。为了实现可持续自律，个体应建立“未来自我的管家思维”，通过提前整理生活环境或为日后留存惊喜，将即时放纵的多巴胺机制重构为对“过去自我”的感恩正反馈。 在神经机制上，原始哺乳动物脑无法理解抽象口号，必须借助直观的视觉与情绪刺激建立连接。Hughes 建议使用软件生成自身 95 岁时的肖像并高频注视，唤醒对远期自我的共情，从而主动约束当下的多巴胺消费。同时，打破旧习必须依赖“环境搅动”（Agitation），通过移动家具、重塑居所或改变外观切断大脑退回旧习惯的自动路径。Bartlett 的自律模型亦表明，行动由动机、强化与感知成本权衡决定，对“不作为成本”的敏锐认知往往是打破拖延的核心关键。 行为观察机制：眨眼率与五重基线评估 (29:23) 有效互动始于精准观察。Hughes 指出动作迟缓是从容与权威的外显表征，而由自主神经系统调控的眨眼率则是探测心理负荷的可靠窗口。专注常态下眨眼缓慢平稳；在操纵或病态锁定状态下，眨眼率会降至近乎零；而在承受极度欺骗、压力或焦虑时，眨眼频率可飙升至每分钟 70 至 80 次。在演讲或路演中，监控全场平均眨眼率的突然飙升，能够即时预警听众注意力的流失或情绪抵触。 然而，肢体语言解读绝不能依赖孤立的单一动作。行为分析必须依托五重框架（5C）：首先观察偏离常态基线的“变化”（Change），结合具体语境的“情境”（Context），寻找多个动作同步出现的“行为簇”（Clusters，如护住躯干要害并伴随舔唇），剔除地域或族群的“文化”（Culture）特异性，最后再对照指标“清单”（Checklist）。抓挠鼻子等单一动作常因生理过敏引起，唯有多维度的基线偏移才具备推断价值。 隐蔽说服与引出：六大需求与FATE模型 (39:46) 沟通的核心在于直接对接个体的深层心理驱动。Hughes 将人的核心社交需求归纳为六类：重要感、接纳、认可、聪明、同情与力量。高效说服需将信息包装成契合目标需求的框架；若向渴求重要感的人强调方案的智识细节，沟通将无法引发共鸣。 在实操层面，Hughes 介绍了源自情报领域的“引出”（Elicitation）策略——避免直接提问触发心理防线，转而利用人类纠错本能抛出蓄意的错误陈述、设定区间界限或表达夸张怀疑，引导对方主动纠偏并吐露事实。在系统层面，影响机制遵循 PCP 链条（认知 Perception → 情境 Context → 许可 Permission）与 FATE 模型（焦点 Focus、权威 Authority、部族 Tribe、情绪 Emotion）。销售实践表明，在电话开场引入打翻咖啡等真实且脆弱的新奇场景，能有效锁定专注力，将客户通话留存时间提升 70%。 数字异化与从众冷漠：过度刺激的代价 (108:06) 现代技术与过度拥挤的人造环境正在扰乱人类的演化适应机制。Hughes 警示防范缺乏明确功能效用的数字化工具；短视频平台常借用催眠学中的“分相技术”（Fractionation），在数秒内高频轮转悲情与暴力等极端对比的情绪片段，快速耗尽心理防御，使大脑在随后的广告投放中极易接受暗示并冲动消费。这种算法刺激不仅滋生盲目攀比与匮乏心态，更将受众禁锢在虚假回音室中。 同时，高密度都市生活正在诱发显著的旁观者效应。伦敦利物浦街数百名行人跨过求助者的实验与 1964 年 Kitty Genovese 遇害案均表明，当环境人口密度突破人类演化适应的 150 至 200 人自然部落规模时，群体的社会责任感与共情回路便会钝化乃至关闭。城市环境与数字网络的超载，已成为现代社会抑郁与心理疾病蔓延的重要温床。 面对过往挫折与自我消耗，Hughes 建议践行“近乎妄想般的彻底自我宽恕”（Delusional Self-Forgiveness），将过往失误转化为幽默与释怀，以迅速切断悔恨反刍，将精力锚定于当下的从容掌控与面向未来的长期自律。

## Background 本期内容由 YouTube 知名播客频道《The Diary Of A CEO》（主持人 Steven Bartlett）于 2024 年 12 月 26 日发布。节目邀请了前美国海军资深特工、知名行为学与肢体语言专家、《行为作战手册》作者 Chase Hughes，深度拆解如何在任何场合瞬间洞察他人心理以及如何彻底重构个人的自律系统。 ## TL;DR 访谈围绕决定人生胜负的三大核心支柱——自我掌控、观察洞察力与沟通说服力展开。Chase Hughes 结合军事情报审讯与商业实战经验，深度剖析了肢体语言的“5C法则”、眨眼频率所揭示的心理状态，以及人类底层的六大社交需求与 FATE 操控模型。此外，他还重新定义了自律的本质，提出将自律视为“替未来的自己担任管家”，并揭示了短视频“分段催眠”与现代科技产品收割注意力的心理学阴暗面。 ## Atmosphere & style 整场对话兼具特工谍战般的冷峻敏锐与深度心理咨询的理性温和，节奏沉稳而充满智力交锋的张力。Steven 带着极强的好奇心与自身的商业经验频频抛出尖锐问题，而 Chase 则展现出惊人的洞察气场，通过即兴模拟推销和现场心理侧写让抽象理论具象化。录音室内的氛围既严谨烧脑又极具警示感，听众仿佛置身于一场拆解人性脆弱与心智控制底层代码的特工级大师课。 ## Bulletin - [03:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=208s) 前美国海军行为分析专家 Chase Hughes 提出，决定个人成败的核心并非话术技巧，而是自我掌控、观察力与沟通力三大底层支柱构成的严密系统。 - [06:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=402s) 人际交锋与说服中最该竞争的维度是“从容感”（Comfort），通过刻意将肢体动作放慢至“水下移动”般从容，可显著重构身体语言并建立个人内在权威。 - [29:23](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1763s) 观察对方心理状态的最隐蔽生理指标是眨眼速率，眨眼率骤降揭示了极高专注与兴趣（如投资人动心），而突然飙升则预示压力剧增或注意力分散。 - [01:33:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5590s) 自律的本质是成为“未来自我”的忠实管家，目标仅是习惯的副产品；建立新习惯只需投入“一茶匙自律”，后续完全由潜意识的惯性自动接管。 - [01:50:49](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6649s) 短视频算法正在滥用催眠学中的“分段催眠”（Fractionation）机制，通过剧烈拉扯情绪高低循环使大脑暗示感受性暴增十倍，从而大幅提高广告冲动消费转化。 ## Key takeaways - [03:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=208s) 成败三大核心支柱：自我掌控（自信与权威感）、观察洞察力（识别基线与微反应）、沟通说服力（调动核心动机激发行动）。 - [04:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=257s) 审讯犯罪招供与情报策反在本质上相通，底层逻辑均是“说服他人做出明显违背其切身利益的行为”。 - [06:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=402s) ACSS 模型指出 90% 的人误以为自己欠缺销售或谈判技巧（Skills），但最底层的基石是内在权威感（Authority）与从容感（Comfort）。 - [09:55](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=595s) 面对压力的人常陷入两极陷阱：一端是主动缩小的“自我崩溃”（Collapse），另一端是虚张声势的“假装强势”（Posturing），真正解法是中轴的沉着冷静（Composure）。 - [12:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=724s) 内在权威感无法单靠表面西装和坐姿伪装，若真实生活环境杂乱不堪，潜意识的自惭形秽就会在微表情与呼吸中渗漏出来，破坏直觉信任。 - [20:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1213s) 真正自信的人与自卑者的唯一区别在于：自卑者把脑海中的自我怀疑当成了事实（Truth），而自信者将其听作一段虚构的故事（Fiction）。 - [33:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1986s) 行为侧写遵循“5C法则”（变化、情境、行为集群、文化、特征清单），单一孤立动作从不具备诊断价值，清单也是最不重要的参考项。 - [39:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2388s) 人类社交互动受六大深层需求驱动：重要感、接纳感、认可、智力展示、博取同情与力量控制；说服的本质是诊断对方的核心需求并精准投喂神经递质。 - [52:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3135s) 情报诱导技术（Elicitation）的核心在于绝不直接提问，而是使用陈述句并故意触发对方纠错的本能，让其自愿吐露真实机密数据。 - [59:27](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3567s) PCP 心理模型（感知-语境-许可）揭示了邪教与高额推销的机制：篡改感知便能重构语境，在新的语境下，个体对反常行为的心理防御将被彻底瓦解。 - [01:01:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3716s) 说服的高境界是“捕捉身份”而非“捕捉观念”，利用武器化认知失调，让人在公开做出微小认同后，为顺应自我身份而主动改变重大行为。 - [01:06:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4016s) 操纵哺乳动物大脑的 FATE 维度为专注（Focus/新奇感）、权威（Authority）、群体（Tribe）与情绪（Emotion）。 - [01:13:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4400s) 化解争论必须避免在细节事实纠错，识别对方使用的 FOG 操控武器（恐惧、责任、内疚），并为对方铺设体面后退的“金桥”（Golden Bridge）。 - [01:25:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5112s) 电话销售最致命的缺陷是“剧本感”，必须打破神经习惯制造新奇感（如打翻咖啡策略），并将自主权交还给受众以破除习惯化过滤。 - [01:44:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6294s) 习惯重塑与自我洗脑的 FEAR 模型包含：专注（Focus）、情绪（Emotion）、打乱固有环境的扰动（Agitation）以及全天候暴露的重复（Repetition）。 - [01:48:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6486s) 当一款科技硬件或应用无法明确解释自身解决了现实世界中的什么实际痛点时，它往往在瞄准孤独、无聊与逃避现实的病态渴求。 - [01:58:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7126s) 摆脱悔恨泥潭并活在当下的最快途径是做到“近乎妄想程度的自我原谅”（Delusionally self-forgiving），将全盘感恩投向过往，将规划与关切投射给未来。 ## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=0s) 精彩看点与访谈开场 访谈以新年愿望切入：统计显示只有约 9% 的新年计划能真正坚持下来。行为学专家 Chase Hughes 指出，改变的核心在于意识到“我们的人生由习惯决定，而非目标”，并掌握一套重新为大脑“洗脑”以建立新习惯的高效策略。 作为前美国海军退伍军人、享誉全球的行为分析与人类影响力专家，Chase Hughes 曾为美国特勤局特工、海豹突击队指挥官、跨国企业 CEO 及政府高层提供行为侦测、人际沟通与说服力的实战培训。在谈及成败根源时，他总结出贯穿始终的三大决定性维度： 1. **自我掌控（Self-mastery）**：涵盖自信、肢体语言、纪律与个人权威感。人类天生对“权威”极其敏感，而建立权威感由五大核心要素构成。 2. **观察洞察力（Observation）**：包括行为画像中的“5C法则”。最快读懂一个人心理状态的窗口之一是眨眼频率——如果对方在交流中眨眼频率突然攀升，往往意味着必须立刻转换话题。 3. **沟通说服力（Communication）**：不论是开启还是推进对话，关键都在于识别受众类型。Chase 将人群划分为六大类别，以此定制最有效的沟通策略，并揭示了人们在争论中常犯的最大误区。 节目主持人 Steven Bartlett 随后向听众真诚呼吁：数据表明，常态收听该节目的听众中仍有 53% 尚未点击订阅；若喜欢节目内容，只需点击订阅即可给予团队最大支持，团队也将全力根据听众反馈邀请顶尖嘉宾，持续输出高水准内容。 --- ### [02:03](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=123s) Chase Hughes 的使命：撬动人性的“隐形杠杆” 谈及自身定位与终极使命，Chase Hughes 自称为“行为专家（Behavior Expert）”。他的目标是向大众揭示一个绝大多数人“看不见、无法触及”的隐藏世界： 纵观人类有记录以来的上万年历史，无论是任何历史事件的演变，还是各国领袖的起落，最终决定局势走向的永远是**人因（Human Factors）**。哪怕面对经济震荡、大众对现状的不满，亦或是 AI 与技术的爆发式变革，底层的关键依然是人与人之间的互动——能否管理好自我、是否是优秀的领导者、能否通过说服引导他人的情绪与行动。 Chase 强调，他的工作主要是为了那些在生活中察觉到某种“隐形优势”存在的人。许多人看着身边的成功者，隐约觉得对方掌握着某种不可见的特权与秘诀，却无法具象化捕捉。将“人类行为学”这根人生中最强大的杠杆交到他们手中，见证他们借此看清规律并彻底转变人生走向，是 Chase 心中最为着迷且极具回报感的事情。 --- ### [03:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=208s) 决定成败的三大核心支柱 Chase 明确指出，“人类行为”绝非零散的心理战术碎片，而是一个严密的底层框架。衡量任何人在任何场景下的成与败，都可以归结为以下三个核心维度的水准： ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 成败的三大行为支柱 accDescr: 展示决定个人成败的三个核心维度：自我掌控、观察力、沟通力。 subgraph Pillars["决定成败的三大支柱"] A["自我掌控<br/>Self-Mastery"] B["观察洞察力<br/>Observation"] C["沟通说服力<br/>Communication"] end A --> D["自信 / 肢体语言 / 纪律 / 个人权威"] B --> E["洞察全局 / 读懂对方的真实状态 (如眨眼率)"] C --> F["具影响力的表达 / 激发动力 / 说服行动"] ``` - **自我掌控（Self-Mastery）**：能否管理自我状态、掌控肢体语言、建立稳固的自信与个人权威。 - **观察洞察力（Observation）**：是否具备“读懂房间”的能力，能否在当下精准解读眼前对话者的微表情、微反应与心理底牌。 - **沟通说服力（Communication）**：能否进行极具影响力的表达，以能够激励、鼓舞他人的方式描绘结果，并以极具说服力的方式促使对方采取行动。 --- ### [04:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=257s) 军情背景与“反直觉说服”的实战经验 谈到职业履历，Chase Hughes 拥有 20 年的海军服役背景，长期为政府机构提供高级别培训。其合作对象涵盖情报机构、美国陆军特别行动司令部旗下的心理作战部（PSYOP），以及大批美国海军指挥官，如今其主要客户群体也延伸至企业与平民领域。 在为情报官员和审讯人员授课时，Chase 指出情报招募与司法审讯在本质上是相通的： - **审讯的本质**：说服嫌疑人做出招供犯罪等违背其切身利益的行为； - **情报策反的本质**：说服外国目标背叛自己的国家充当间谍。 二者的底层逻辑完全相同——**“说服他人去做一件明显不符合其自身最大利益的事情”**。这也是行为学在现实世界中“硬碰硬（where the rubber meets the road）”的最严酷检验：要么是商业销售中促使对方做出原本不会做的购买决策，要么是审讯室里促使对方做出原本绝不会承认的供罪招供。 --- ### [05:41](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=341s) 巨著《行为作战手册》的诞生背景 演播室桌上摆放着 Chase 撰写的巨作《行为作战手册》（*The Behavior Operations Manual: Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence*），主持人感叹这是自己见过最厚重的一本书。Chase 回忆道，这本书凝聚了他毕生的心血，融合了 30,000 至 40,000 小时的实战研究与沉淀，涵盖了他开发和教授过的所有审讯、行为分析、说服与影响力技术。 谈及成书的催化剂，Chase 动情地透露，当时自己曾被诊断出严重的脑部病变，一度面临即将失去大脑认知功能的绝境。在极度恐慌与绝望中，他首要担忧的是未来家人的生计。为了将自己为军情部门研发的全部知识毫无保留地留存下来，他拼尽全力将所有技术、模型与理论全盘倾注于纸上，这本集大成的巨作由此诞生。 --- ### [06:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=402s) 破解求助误区：ACSS 模型与“舒适度”竞争 当被问及大众在生活中寻求行为学帮助的最普遍动因时，Chase 总结道：**人们通常在生活的某一维度上失去了控制感**。然而，绝大多数人对自身困境存在巨大的认知偏差： 大部分求助者坚信自己欠缺的是“技巧”——他们迫切渴望话术脚本、谈判秘籍、销售套路或破冰台词。针对这一现象，Chase 提出了用于团队训练的 **ACSS 模型**： | 层级 | 要素 | 现状与误区剖析 | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **A** | **Authority（权威感）** | 并非职位或层级上的权力，而是强大的个人内在权威感。这是达成影响力的先决条件之一。 | | **C** | **Comfort（舒适度/从容感）** | **最根本的基础**。缺乏从容感，任何高阶技巧都会失效；与人交锋的核心是比对方更自在从容。 | | **S** | **Social Skills（社交技能）** | 许多人误以为自己欠缺的是闲聊破冰、寒暄应对等社交技巧。 | | **S** | **Skills（专项技术/话术）** | **90% 的人误以为自己最缺这一项**（如销售脚本、谈判套路），但实际上它是最末梢的工具。 | Chase 打了一个生动的比方：即便投入 1000 万美元，请顶尖专家写出完美无瑕的说服脚本，将其用银盘端给一个内心充满社交焦虑的人，让他照本宣科读出来，也绝不可能奏效——“这又不是《哈利·波特》，念咒语改变不了现实”。同样地，将一架塞斯纳 172（Cessna 172）轻型飞机的飞行操作检查清单直接塞给你，也绝不会让你立刻变成飞行员。 人脑天生具备无法关闭的“竞争机制”，但多数人都在错误的维度上与人竞争——盲目比拼身高、外貌、社会地位、财富、职级或外显的自信。Chase 强调，**在人际交流中，唯一真正需要去“竞争”的维度是舒适度（Comfort）**： - 能否在对话中比对方表现得更加从容、放松、坦然自若？ - 一旦将竞争重心从地位或气势转移到“舒适度”上，就能在无形中赢下绝大多数沟通。 在实战落地层面，想要在短时间内建立身体层面的从容感，Chase 为学员开出的首周核心训练极其简单，无需反复翻看手机里繁琐的守则备忘录，只需要执行一条铁律： > **放慢身体的移动速度（Move Slower）**。想象自己整个人浸没在游泳池的水底，感受肢体在水下的阻力与节奏；在整整一周内，将这种“水下慢速”设定为你身体行动的最高限速，确保在房间里动得比任何人都更慢、更从容。仅仅这一微小的物理调控，便能引发连锁反应，瞬间重塑整体气场与控制感。 ### [09:55](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=595s) 镇定与两极陷阱：崩溃与假装强势 恐惧和压力在人体上最直接的生物学反应就是“加速”——它让心率加快、呼吸急促，并诱发快速且生硬的抽搐式动作。当一个人在社交或商务互动中感到焦虑时，无论是在线下面对面还是在电话另一头，这种生理紧张都会暴露无遗。要在沟通中建立真正的舒适感，关键在于第二步：维持沉着冷静（Composure），例如在电话中保持平稳从容的讲话语速。然而，绝大多数人在失去镇定时，都会跌入左右两端的极端陷阱：一端是“自我崩溃”（Collapse），另一端则是“假装强势”（Posturing）。 处于“崩溃”状态的人，倾向于主动缩小自己的存在感，委曲求全去迎合他人，让别人感到舒服；而“假装强势”的人，则通过虚张声势把自己撑大，用攻击性把别人逼退。Chase Hughes 分享了自己刚从军方退役、初涉商海时的亲身尴尬经历：当时有人打电话邀请他做主题演讲，询问他的时薪。Chase 报价 6,000 美元（包含差旅费）。电话那头的人什么话都没说，仅仅叹了口气：“呃……” Chase 瞬间陷入了极度崩溃心理，慌不择言地主动倒贴折扣：“啊没事，我们可以打折，5,000 美元也行，甚至打个五折、两五折都行！只要您让我去，我怎么都配合……”他几乎到了想自掏腰包求对方让自己上台的地步。这就是典型的崩溃心态。 更为普遍的误区在于，那些习惯处于崩溃状态的人（例如试图学习把妹技巧 PU 话术的年轻男性），误以为摆脱懦弱的解药是走向对立面的“假装强势”。他们学着昂首挺胸、大声说话、摆架子，以为这就是强大。然而，两极摇摆只是从一种防御机制跳入另一种防御机制，真正的核心解法永远位于正中央——那是一种结合了内在权威感的“镇定”（Composure）。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 行为状态光谱 accDescr: 从左至右展示人类在社交与压力情境下的三种行为状态：左侧自我崩溃，中间沉着冷静，右侧假装强势。 subgraph Spectrum ["行为表现光谱"] A["自我崩溃 Collapse<br/>(自我缩小 / 讨好他人)"] --- B["沉着冷静 Composure<br/>(内在权威 / 心理中轴)"] B --- C["假装强势 Posturing<br/>(虚张声势 / 逼退他人)"] end A -. 错误纠偏.-> C C -. 崩溃反弹.-> A A ==>|真正正道| B C ==>|真正正道| B ``` --- ### [12:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=724s) 权威金字塔与潜意识的“拆台效应” 真正的沉着并非无源之水，它来自内在权威感（Authority）。Chase 在工作中无论是面对情报部门特工，还是辅导大型汽车经销商老板，第一天都会拿出他的核心工具——“权威评估量表”（Authority Inventory）。这一模型将个人权威拆解为五个核心特质：自信（Confidence）、自律（Discipline）、领导力（Leadership）、感恩（Gratitude）以及享受当下（Enjoyment）。量表能迅速锁定一个人得分最低的弱项，而正是这个短板，往往在关键说服场景中彻底毁掉一个人的影响力。 这种内在权威无法仅凭外在技巧去伪装。社交网络上充斥着类似“教你展现自信的 19 个技巧”的快餐文章，教人昂首挺胸、用力握手、死盯对方眼睛。然而，一个人的日常现实生活无时无刻不在身体语言、呼吸节奏与微表情中“渗漏”（Bleed out）出来。如果一个人表面西装革履、坐姿挺拔，但其真实生活中卧室堆着八英尺高的脏衣服、床单肮脏恶心、水槽塞满发霉的碗碟，其大脑深处就有一块区域在疯狂叫嚣：“我是在弄虚作假！”这种自惭形秽的潜意识信号会转化为极其细微的破绽，在对方心中制造出糟糕的“直觉感知”（Gut feeling）。许多人在交流后会隐隐觉得“这人表面看着不错，但我总觉得哪里不对劲”，这种直觉警报正是对方潜意识识破了这种不一致性。 要彻底消除这种内耗与渗漏，就必须从基石做起。内在权威的模型是由三维支撑的系统： - **底层生活基石（五个可控领域）：** 环境打理（Environment）、时间规划（Time）、个人形象（Appearance）、社交圈层（Social life）以及财务状况（Financial life）。这是潜意识的锚点，唯有打理好这些最基本的现实琐事，内心才不会产生虚浮感。 - **左侧内在心智特质（权威五要素）：** 自信（Confidence）、自律（Discipline）、领导力（Leadership）、感恩（Gratitude）、享受当下（Enjoyment）。 - **右侧外在信号呈现（MACCI 模型）：** 动作幅度与节奏（Movement）、外表修养（Appearance）、从容自信（Confidence）、情感联结（Connection）以及意图清晰度（Intent）。 --- ### [14:58](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=898s) 米尔格拉姆实验：权威的致命破坏力与核心病因 为了阐明“权威感”对人类心智有多么强大的统治力，Chase 回顾了心理学史上著名的米尔格拉姆服从实验（Milgram Experiment）。1962 年的耶鲁大学校园里，研究人员通过报纸招募普通市民参与所谓的“记忆与学习研究”，许诺微薄报酬。实验设计了一场被操纵的抽签，让不知情的受试者抽中“教师”，而同伙扮演“学生”。“学生”被绑在隔壁房间的电击椅上，受试者则坐在操作台前。每当学生答错题目，受试者就必须按下面前递增电压的电击按钮，电压标签一路延伸到最右侧骇人的“XXX 危险：严重电击”。 随着实验推进，隔壁不断传来尖叫与拍墙哀求，甚至喊着“我有心脏病，我不做了！”绝大多数受试者会慌张地回头看向现场穿白大褂、手持写字夹板的主试。而主试仅仅用冷酷平稳的声音反复下达指令：“实验需要你继续，请继续。”当电压升到最后阶段，隔壁彻底陷入死一般的沉寂，主试则规定“无应答等同于答错，请施加电击”。实验前精神科专家曾预测只有不到 1% 的变态才会电到最顶端，然而现实数据极其残酷： - **100% 的受试者** 都将电击施加到了足以致人死亡的 250 伏特。 - **整整 67% 的普通人** 在权威指令下，一路按到了最高档的 450 伏极限。 这证明了身处陌生环境（Novelty）与面对合法权威（Authority）时，人会彻底卸下道德抵抗甚至犯下谋杀，这种对人类行为的支配力远超普通的商务推销。 现代人往往将权威的“症状”当成了“原因”。穿白大褂、放慢动作节奏（Slowness of movement）、挺拔坐姿等，只是权威自然流露出的生理症状。权威人士之所以坐姿端正，是因为他们看待世界的方式截然不同，而非因为看了一篇技巧贴。如果只学坐姿与眼神，不过是东施颦效；只有重构底层世界观，才能散发真正的场能。Chase 举了一个辅导洛杉矶知名大公司 CEO 的案例：该高管威信彻底荡然无存，甚至在董事会会议上被下属公然出言嘲弄，公司经营一落千丈。高管急功近利地向 Chase 索取“飞行检查清单”（即速成话术和技巧），但 Chase 选择追本溯源，利用权威评估量表找出他的关键短板（极度匮乏的自信），并动用催眠与深度认知行为重构（本质等同于良性的神经认知重编程），从底层重建他对自我与环境的掌控力，仅用数月便彻底扭转了局势。 ### [20:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1213s) 快速蜕变的“借口”与自信心重塑：识别脑中的虚构之声 蔡斯·休斯（Chase Hughes）继续讲述那名通过厌恶疗法调整行为的客户案例。在短短几个月内，该客户公司的月收入就从约 60 万至 80 万美元直接飙升到了近 400 万美元，全体员工也都全力配合，整个人生轨迹发生了翻天覆地的转变。但休斯指出，作为教练，当你帮助一个人以如此惊人的速度改变生活时，往往会面临一个棘手的现实问题——他们必须为自己的突变找到一个“借口”。一个人不可能毫无缘由地回到办公室后就彻底变了副模样，他们必须有一套合理的对小说辞，比如“我身上发生了某件事”或“我经历了一次重大顿悟”。因此，休斯在指导客户时，第一步总是提前帮他们设计好合理的解释，让他们有体面的理由去展现脱胎换骨的自己。 要实现这种深层蜕变，最先需要重塑的永远是“自信心”。休斯解释说，这本质上是改变一个人脑子里的内在对话。休斯随即询问史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett），即便史蒂文已经登上过面对一两千人的演讲舞台、长期录制电视节目且事业极具成就，脑海中是否仍然出现过那个微小却刺耳的声音：“我为什么会在这里？我配坐在这里吗？或者大家迟早会发现我是在假装懂？”史蒂文立刻心领神会，坦言自己做播客时特别有这种“冒名顶替综合征”的感觉，因为播客并没有官方资质认证，听众涌入后却认定你无所不知，那种“自己是在装模作样”的怀疑挥之不去。 休斯强调，这种怀疑的声音永远不会彻底消失，真正自信的人与缺乏自信的人之间唯一的区别在于： - **缺乏自信的人**：把脑海里的自我贬低和怀疑当成了“事实（Truth）”。 - **真正自信的人**：把同样的声音听作一段“虚构的故事（Fiction）”。 为了生动阐述这一点，休斯打了个比方：想象他开车去接史蒂文一起去吃午餐，史蒂文拉开车门坐进副驾驶，车内的音响正在播放一本有声书。有声书中插播了一段模拟 BBC 紧急新闻的虚构广播，播报某地刚刚引爆了一枚核弹。休斯心平气和，一边听一边放松地握着方向盘专注路况；而不知情的史蒂文则瞬间心跳狂飙、杏仁核剧烈激活，陷入极度恐慌与痛苦之中，心里满是“天哪，我的家人会怎样”。两人坐在同一辆车里，听到的是完全相同的声波与内容，唯一的差异在于休斯知道那只是虚构的小说，而史蒂文却误以为那是正在发生的现实。 --- ### [23:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1385s) 童年“后台程序”与跟哺乳动物大脑对话：连接95岁的未来自己 休斯指出，每个人脑海中那个自我质疑的声音，十有八九是在八九岁童年时期固化下来的。当时的孩子为了适应环境，必须摸索出三套生存法则： 1. **如何结交并维系朋友？** 2. **如何获得安全感？** 3. **通过什么手段换取奖励？**（对于普通孩子可能是一句表扬与认可，而对于童年悲惨的孩子，奖励甚至可能是一口水或一顿饭）。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 童年生存策略转化为成年行为模式的机制 accDescr: 展示8至9岁时形成的结友、安全与奖励机制如何演变成成年人在无意识中运行的心理后台程序 subgraph Childhood ["童年期（8-9岁）的环境适应模式"] A["为了安全或避免伤害<br/>对他人表现敌意/讨好权威"] B["为了获得关注与认可<br/>不惜代价取悦自恋型父母"] end subgraph Transition ["无意识固化为底层应用程序"] C["演化为大脑后台常驻应用<br/>（未经自主同意且无意识运行）"] end subgraph Adulthood ["成年期的投射与职业表现"] D["在职场变成人尽皆知的讨好者<br/>每天竭力巴结老板以求安全"] E["产生深层冒名顶替感<br/>'我不配拥有财富/成功'"] end A --> C B --> C C --> D C --> E ``` 这些早期的适应策略就像一道道微小的“应用程序（Apps）”，在成年后未经本人同意和察觉的情况下，依然常驻在大脑后台默默运行。当年为了在自恋型母亲身边生存而养成的极力奉迎习惯，长大后便原封不动地转化为每天在办公室对老板卑躬屈膝、充当众人眼中的“马屁精”。 为了让客户彻底认清这种潜意识限制的荒谬，休斯会采用极其激进的手段来激怒他们的理性意识。例如，他会强迫客户将电脑桌面壁纸甚至办公室海报换成一句话：“我不配赚钱，金钱是属于其他人的（I don't deserve money, money is for other people）。”当大脑每天被迫直视这句话时，其荒诞性会被无限放大，从而打破原有的认知循环。此外，休斯指出自信者共同的认知底色在于拥有一种“针对积极结果的泛化预期（Generalized expectation of positive outcomes）”——他们并不执着于具体的细节如何展开，但从心底确信“事情最终都会没问题的”。 这一切进一步延伸到自律的核心机制——建立与“未来自己”的深层情感联结。休斯强调，掌管我们大部分日常习惯与情绪反应的是底层“哺乳动物大脑（Mammalian brain）”，它根本听不懂英语，任何空洞的鸡汤名言、PPT 标语或积极心理暗示都无法穿透这层生理屏障。 - **与狗对话的思维实验**：休斯要求所有学员在设定年度目标时自问：“如果我要把这个目标教给一条狗，我会怎么做？”因为改变习惯必须诉诸动物本能。 - **95岁的衰老照片**：休斯让客户通过手机应用生成一张自己 95 岁时的照片——满脸深纹、毛发稀疏。客户必须打印出来贴在生活中的各个显眼位置，持续放置数周。这种视觉冲击直接向哺乳动物大脑植入了对未来自我的具象化认知，立刻倒逼人们改变日常饮食、消费习惯、作息时间与饮酒量。 - **多巴胺地图（Dopamine Map）**：盘点生活中的快感来源。休斯指出，如果一个人的多巴胺图谱中有超过 50% 来源于酒精、色情内容等廉价且具破坏性的渠道，就必须对自己极其诚实；他接触过的每一位真正成功的人士，都拥有一张健康的“多巴胺地图”，能从良性且有建设性的事物中汲取动力。 --- ### [27:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1658s) 自律与自信的纽带：“享受当下”的磁场吸引力 当被问及“自律”与“自信”之间是否存在直接关联时，休斯给出了非常肯定的回答。他举例道，如果两人一同坐在亚特兰大机场的候机大厅，休斯即使不对史蒂文做任何行为分析培训，仅让他转头寻找一个“极其自律的人”，史蒂文在 5 秒钟内就能凭借直觉精准指认出来。人类的大脑天生具备无意识捕捉这种信号的能力： - 自律所呈现的外在状态，会直接拉高个体的内在自信，因为你心知肚明周围的人能感知到你的笃定与控制力。 - 当你意识到自己对自我的掌控度远超交谈对象或日常接触的群体时，底气会自然而然升腾。 - “镜头之外的生活方式”会毫无保留地投射到自信之中：在私下独处时的环境掌控、时间管理与仪表维持，若能与希望外界感知的形象完全一致，自信便会自然生根。 史蒂文随后追问休斯此前列出的权威五大支柱中为何包含“享受（Enjoyment）”。休斯坦言，这一项是他后来特意补充进去的。在回顾了自己指导过的所有学员后，休斯发现，那些拥有天生领导力与强大权威感的人，并非是指在聚会上彻夜狂欢，而是一种在当下时刻泰然自若、从容沉浸的姿态。这种对现实生活的平静享受甚至可以被称为某种“正念（Mindfulness）”，而能够自然流露享受状态的人格特质，是人际交往中最具磁力、最令人神往的品质。 --- ### [29:23](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1763s) 现场观察力：从移动速度与眨眼频率中看透人心 随后，对话切入休斯“成功或失败三角模型”中的第二大核心支柱——**观察力（Observation）**，即如何精准“阅读整个房间”。 面对史蒂文关于如何在公共场合（例如机场）解读环境的提问，休斯分享了两个关键的行为破解维度： 1. **肢体移动速度**：在任何公共空间中，休斯首先会寻找“全场动作移动最慢的人”。在群体动态中，移动从容、放慢节奏往往意味着更高的心理安全感与自信度，能够瞬间将气场强大者与焦虑匆忙者区分开来。 2. **眨眼频率（Blink Rate）**：眼神交流是快速读懂他人的终极窗口，而其中最可靠的生理指标是眨眼速率。由于眨眼主要受下意识神经控制，人类极难通过主观意志对其进行精细伪装，因此具有极高的诊断价值。 | 眨眼表现特征 | 神经生理状态 | 典型现实场景 | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **超高速眨眼**<br/>（甚至达到每分钟 75~80 次） | 高度压力、焦虑、隐瞒或欺骗 | 处于谎言暴露边缘、承受巨大心理压迫的被询问者 | | **极低眨眼频率**<br/>（近乎降至 0 次） | 极致聚焦、锁定猎物<br/>（即所谓的“捕食者专注” Prey Focus） | 审讯室或高风险商业谈判中的病态人格者（Psychopath），正全力企图操控对手 | 休斯进一步指出，观察眨眼频率并不需要刻意在心里掐秒表计算每分钟具体跳动了多少次，普通人只需捕捉对话开始时的基线，并留意对方何时发生骤变即可看破对方的内心波澜。 ### [31:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1868s) 眨眼频率与注意力的秘密 在评估人类行为时，最关键的维度并非某个固定的动作，而是寻找“变化”（Changes）。当 Chase Hughes 在舞台上做主题演讲时，他会在全场环视观众并进行眼神接触。如果他察觉到台下观众整体的眨眼频率开始上升，他就会立刻意识到当前的受众正在走神或失去兴趣，必须立即更换话题或调整节奏。面对成百上千名听众时，观察者无需盯住某一个人，而是将整个人群的视线当成“一双普通人的眼睛”，去感知整个房间的平均眨眼节奏。 眨眼频率的骤降代表着极高的专注与投入。Chase 经常在华盛顿旁听创业者向天使投资人的路演汇报，通过观察投资人的眨眼率，就能准确预测谁会最终掏钱投资——只要看到某位投资人的眨眼频率明显降低，那个人绝对是全场对项目最感兴趣的买家。这一原理在法庭陪审团甄选（Jury Selection）中同样极其灵验。相比之下，网络上常讨论的“胸式呼吸与腹式呼吸”在现实中很难通过余光轻松掌握；很多人在尝试观察呼吸时会直勾勾盯着对方的胸部，尤其当交流对象是女性时，这种举动会显得极为冒犯和尴尬。相比之下，眨眼率更易捕捉、更加隐蔽且高度可靠。 - 观察标准流：开启对话时先校准基准线（属于正常、偏快还是偏慢），随后全程监控其偏离基线发生的变化。 - 极高眨眼频率（如每分钟70次）通常代表高压力反应，并不一定代表撒谎欺骗；而极低眨眼频率（接近零）在没有外部专注刺激时则可能暗示反社会人格（Psychopath）特征。 --- ### [33:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1986s) 行为侧写的“5C法则”与科研局限 为了防止大众把身体语言粗暴地套入非黑即白的公式，Chase 提出了行为侧写的“5C法则”（5 C's of Behavior Profiling）。人们常在网上看到诸如“双臂交叉抱胸就代表防备、保留与封闭”的言论，但如果当时室内温度极低，受访者仅仅是在保暖。Steven Bartlett 对此深有体会，他回忆起录制《The Diary Of A CEO》上一期节目时，由于演播室夜间未开暖气，他的手臂甚至冻出了大块鸡皮疙瘩，为了保暖自然地交叉双臂，但内心却一直惶恐被嘉宾误认为是傲慢与防御。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 行为侧写的5C法则判定流程 accDescr: 展示从基线变化到最终对照清单的五个阶段筛选逻辑 subgraph Evaluation ["核心判定阶段"] A["1. Change (变化)"] --> B["2. Context (情境)"] B --> C["3. Clusters (行为集群)"] end subgraph Filtering ["背景与校准阶段"] C --> D["4. Culture (文化背景)"] D --> E["5. Checklist (特征清单)"] end ``` 这种多重变量的存在，正是身体语言极难通过同行评审（Peer-reviewed）实验完全复现的原因。这好比要求罗杰·费德勒（Roger Federer）必须拿出同行评议论文来证明他为何能赢下网球赛一样荒谬。学术界在研究审讯与测谎时，往往让大学生拿一张午餐券进实验室，假装对一只“鸭子”撒谎；而真实的特工或战犯审讯对象可能经历了连日睡眠剥夺、头戴黑头套被拖入密室，这两者的心理与身体状态根本不可同日而语。人类行为无法像服用泰诺（Tylenol）监测药效那样被塞进一张标准化电子表格中。 5C法则的完整评估链路包括： - **Change（变化）**：行为偏离个体初始基线的瞬间。 - **Context（情境）**：行为发生的具体环境与刺激源（例如是否处于寒冷环境，或是在被问及敏感问题时出现）。 - **Clusters（行为集群）**：孤立的单一动作（如摸鼻子）几乎从不具备诊断价值；必须寻找成群出现的线索。例如，在被问到“周三晚上去了哪里”时突然紧张，双手下意识护住生殖器区域，同时频繁舔舐嘴唇（一种灵长类动物的抚慰/卫生手势）。 - **Culture（文化背景）**：排查文化习惯差异。例如南亚（如巴基斯坦）部分地区的人在表达认同与同意时，会自然地伴随特殊的晃头动作，不知情者极易误判为言行不一。 - **Checklist（特征清单）**：这是整个评估模型中**最不重要**的参考项。清单上列出的“可疑谎言特征”只代表概率；若某人平时就习惯性频繁舔唇或摸鼻，缺乏基线变化，清单便毫无参考意义。 --- ### [37:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2228s) 伪专家陷阱与《龙穴之创业投资》 业余的肢体语言爱好者很容易陷入“抓凶手”的偏执中：一旦看到对方摸了三次鼻子，就断定对方在撒谎并拒绝合作。然而实际情况可能只是春季花粉过敏，对方的公文包里甚至备着抗过敏药，进门前鼻子就已发红发痒了半小时。如果忽略了这种长期重复性，就会将生理习惯错当成心理应激变化。 在商业竞标与投资节目（如 Steven Bartlett 参与的《Dragons' Den》或美版《Shark Tank》）中，这一机制尤为清晰。只要盯着全场投资者中谁的眨眼频率最低，有99%的概率正是这名投资者会率先举手报价。因为其眨眼率骤降直接揭示出深度沉浸与个人兴趣的投入。主持人 Steven 也观察到，每当访谈触及嘉宾童年或极端敏感话题时，嘉宾往往会下意识蜷缩身体，做出抚慰自我的微动作（Self-soothing behavior）。掌握看穿真实压力与专注度的本领，堪称职场与社交中的超级能力。 --- ### [39:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2388s) 深度沟通：人类的六大社交需求模型 沟通是通向成败三角架构中的第三大支柱。除了保持低沉放慢语速来建立权威之外，真正的顶级沟通大师并不单靠讲好故事，而是具备洞察对话对象底层需求并“见人说人话”的适配能力。Chase 将人类在社交互动中最渴望从他人身上获取的情感回馈细分为六类需求标签： 1. **重要感（Significance）**：渴望被视作至关重要、举足轻重的人物。 2. **接纳感（Acceptance）**：渴望融入群体，不被排斥与孤立。 3. **认可与赞赏（Approval）**：渴望获得外界的夸奖与表扬。 4. **智力展示（Intelligence）**：渴望被他人认为极其聪明、富有远见。 5. **博取同情（Pity）**：通过示弱、受害者心态来获取他人的关注与照顾。 6. **力量/控制欲（Strength / Power）**：渴望展示强悍、主导全局与不可撼动的影响力。 在任何日常对话中，只要给对方抛出一个关于他们自身的问题，对方在展开回答的瞬间就会无意识地暴露出自己所驱动的底层核心需求。如果对方骨子里是一个极度追求“重要感”（Significance）的人，而销售者却一味奉承该决策多么彰显“聪明才智”（Intelligence），这种沟通策略从根本上便南辕北辙，无法引发任何情感共鸣。精准沟通的起点，永远在于捕捉到对方发出核心需求信号的那一刻。 ### [41:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2478s) 六大深层心理需求与语言线索识别 在任何日常寒暄中，人们谈论自我经历、近期成就、生活喜好乃至上周见闻时，其潜意识中的心理需求都会在言辞间无所遁形。蔡斯·休斯（Chase Hughes）指出，只要仔细聆听，就能迅速捕捉到对方究竟属于哪一种心理需求驱动型： * **重要性（Significance）**：渴望证明自己有影响力、独一无二。例如对方在开场不久便看似不经意地透露：“我是那家公司的首席执行官，手下管着 490 号人，明年大概率就要套现退出了。”即使聊起假期，重要性驱动者也会强调个体的体验：“我去了迈阿密，太爽了，我玩得非常开心，昨晚刚飞回来。” * **认可（Approval）**：极度渴望他人的夸奖与肯定，往往通过自我贬低来“钓”取赞美。他们会主动示弱：“我明天得登台演讲，但我演讲烂透了，明天绝对会砸锅，我现在紧张得要命。”其潜台词其实是在诱导你回应：“怎么会！你讲得棒极了，上次表现那么出色，这次绝对没问题！” * **接纳与归属（Acceptance）**：言必称集体，高频使用“我们”、“大家”、“我们团队”。当被问及同一个迈阿密假期时，他们的叙述方式截然不同：“我们一起去了那边，大家一块儿参加了这个活动，我们玩得很尽兴。”他们的核心诉求是确认自己属于某个群体。 * **聪慧与智识（Intelligence）**：渴望被视作博学、有智慧的高认知人群。他们习惯在对话中夹带学术与智力背书：“其实我的 MBA 学位师从某某名师”、“我当年的硕士毕业论文写的就是这个方向”。 * **怜悯与苦难认同（Pity）**：这是最难建立有效沟通的人群。他们最渴望获得的是外界对其受苦经历的承认。要打动怜悯型人格，最理想的切入点是：“真不敢相信你承受了那么多常人无法想象的磨难，居然还能走到今天这一步，换作绝大多数人早就崩溃了。” * **力量与控制（Strength and Power）**：这一类型并不局限于电影《回到未来》中粗暴蛮横的反派比夫（Biff），也普遍存在于追求绝对权力的企业高管，甚至体现在那些开着底盘高高架起、车尾挂着塑料恶搞装饰的皮卡车司机身上。重要性追求的是“我是否对世界产生影响”，而力量型追求的则是“我对他人是否拥有绝对控制权”。 --- ### [44:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2640s) 神经递质操纵术：如何针对需求精准说服 一旦识破对方所属的需求分类，就能在说服或谈判中有的放矢。蔡斯·休斯解释道，在行为情报训练中，学员不仅要学会识别六种决策方式与六种终极价值观，更要在沟通中向对方传递两个关键信号：第一，明确肯定并赞美对方的核心需求；第二，向对方证明，只要做出你所建议的决定（无论是签单还是买车），就能进一步放大他们从外界获取该需求的能力。 以主持人史蒂芬·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）为例，蔡斯指出史蒂芬显然属于“重要性”驱动型。若想向他提出合作请求，最佳策略是在提要求前先击中其心理痛点：“史蒂芬，这档播客办得极其出色，你拥有数百万订阅者，切实改变了无数人的生活轨迹。”紧接着顺水推舟：“如果我们携手合作，最直接的效果就是让你的影响力翻倍，在全球范围内留下更深远的痕迹与遗产。” 这种说服逻辑的底层密码在于神经生物学。蔡斯直言不讳地指出，人类不仅内心充满不安全感与创伤，从生理层面看本质上都是“神经递质的成瘾者”。针对核心需求的精准夸奖，会在对方大脑中瞬间引发数以亿计的神经递质爆发式释放。沟通者的任务，就是精准诊断出坐在对面的人究竟对哪一种“神经化学药物”上了瘾，并成为这种药物的稳定供给源。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 需求识别与神经递质说服闭环 accDescr: 展示从语言线索识别需求、投喂神经递质到达成身份认同与说服的完整转化流程。 subgraph Listen ["第一步：倾听语言线索"] L1["语言线索捕捉<br/>（言辞、代词习惯、叙事焦点）"] L2{"定位核心成瘾源<br/>（6大深层心理需求）"} L1 --> L2 end subgraph Feed ["第二步：神经递质投喂"] F1["先行动作：精准赞美其核心需求<br/>（引发数亿神经递质释放）"] F2["利益挂钩：承诺合作将倍增其需求获取力<br/>（放大影响力 / 强化智力标签）"] L2 --> F1 F1 --> F2 end subgraph Close ["第三步：身份固化与说服闭环"] C1["塑造身份认同<br/>（从修改观点跃迁为锁定身份）"] C2["顺畅达成说服协议"] F2 --> C1 C1 --> C2 end ``` --- ### [46:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2765s) 卖笔演示与空间手势：利用否定预设重塑身份认同 为了将理论落到实处，史蒂芬现场向蔡斯发起经典测试：如果面对一个“聪慧型（Intelligence）”客户，你会如何把一支普通的笔卖给他？蔡斯当即演示了极具杀伤力的负面预设技巧。他并不急于推销笔的功能，而是先否定低阶平庸的人群：“这世上有太多人只知道随波逐流，你也肯定赞同，外面有一大堆蠢人只满足于最基础、最不起眼的东西，思想僵化保守。但偶尔，你会遇见真正懂得高品质事物的人，他们看待事物的维度与众不同。”在潜移默化中，蔡斯将对方对智识优越感的追求，完全锚定在眼前这支“非比寻常”的书写工具上。 随后，蔡斯拆解了高阶说服中手势与语言的精妙配合。当谈及负面特质或令人反感的人群时，手势绝对不能落在自己与对话者之间的互动空间，而必须明显偏向外侧，用肢体语言明确界定“那是外界其他人”： - **负面排除**：向外侧指点：“世上有很多人从不回馈社会，对帮助他人毫无兴趣……每次跟这种人坐下，他们都有个共同毛病——” - **瞬间拉近**：紧接着，蔡斯重重吐出极具心理制动效果的词汇“停下（STOP）”，同时双手瞬间收回，在自己与史蒂芬之间来回比划：“——他们根本无法**停下来**，全心全意地与坐在对面的人建立深度连接。” 这一套组合拳利用了史蒂芬对“重要性”的需求，在贬低“无法深度连接的平庸之辈”的同时，迫使史蒂芬在潜意识中点头赞同。反过来，用正面框架也能达到同样的效果：先赞扬卓越企业家往往具备摒除一切杂念、全然投入连接的罕见品质，对方为了符合这种崇高的心理预期，便会主动代入这一人设。正如谈判专家克里斯·沃斯（Chris Voss）所强调的“That's right（说得没错）”，此时对方认同的不再是一个单纯的观点，而是确认了自己的人格身份——“我改变的不是你的想法，而是你的身份认同”。 --- ### [49:57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2997s) 预设陷阱与倾听盲区 为了进一步锁定这种身份认同，蔡斯展示了一种几乎无法拒绝的“预设性提问（Presupposition Question）”。他通常会先自我暴露弱点，随后抛出诱饵： > “坦白讲，我从小到大一直深受社交焦虑的折磨，直到 25 岁才慢慢学会对他人敞开心扉。我非常好奇，你是一直以来天生就能和遇到的每个人迅速建立深度连接，还是后天刻意训练出来的？” 表面上看这是一个二选一的选择题，但实际上无论对方回答“天生的”还是“后天练的”，都已经默认并锁定了“我是一个极擅长与人深度连接的人”这一前设。现实中绝不可能有人反驳说：“其实我心胸狭隘、非常封闭。”通过这一连串精巧的小共识，对方亲口在自己的潜意识里筑牢了新的人格设定。 对话最后转向沟通的残酷现实。史蒂芬感慨，公众对沟通技巧的热衷程度远超倾听本身，人人都渴望拿到一套能在台上侃侃而谈的“飞行检查清单”。史蒂芬回忆起声学与沟通专家朱利安·特雷杰（Julian Treasure）的亲身经历：朱利安曾做过一场关于“如何成为卓越演说家”的 TED 演讲，播放量极高、风靡全球；然而当他同样精心准备了一场关于“如何成为卓越倾听者”的演讲时，现实中却几乎没有多少人愿意静下心去倾听。 ### [51:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3088s) 倾听的隐形力量与沟通核心 大众往往对演讲和口才趋之若鹜，相关的视频动辄数千万播放量，而关于“倾听”的内容却常常无人问津。然而，倾听才是成为顶尖沟通者的基石。真正的倾听不是被动等待发言机会，而是一种高维度的观察：通过专注地听，能够敏锐地捕捉到对方究竟是谁、内心深处被何种驱动力支配、拥有怎样的社交需求，以及他们究竟是如何做决定的。掌握了倾听，沟通者才能掌握精准的词汇和触动对方的杠杆。无论是心理咨询师、危机人质谈判专家，还是自杀干预热线的话务员，倾听都是他们最致命的工具——因为他们的最终目标，是说服一个人做出其在正常状态下绝不会做的事情。 ### [52:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3135s) 诱导技术（Elicitation）：用陈述代替提问的特工艺术 在情报学中，获取信息的最高境界被称为“诱导技术”（Elicitation）。这项源自美国中央情报局（CIA）的技巧最早由约翰·诺兰（John Nolan）在其著作《机密》（*Confidential*）中系统阐述。该技术的核心原则非常颠覆：**绝不直接提问，而是使用陈述句**。提问会像警报器一样立刻触发人类大脑的防御机制，让对方进入戒备状态；而巧妙的陈述句却能营造出一种对方在“自愿分享”的错觉。 诱导技术最致命的一招是“触发纠错欲”（Correcting the record）。人有一种难以抑制的本能——纠正他人的错误信息。例如在纽约的 Whole Foods 超市里，如果你想在 60 秒内套出一位正在整理农产品的女员工赚多少钱，直接询问不仅冒昧而且大概率会被拒绝。但如果你走过去一边找胡萝卜一边感叹：“我刚在网上读到一篇报道，说 Whole Foods 员工的时薪全涨到 26 美元了，太棒了！”她几乎会立刻本能地纠正：“什么？没有，我才赚 17 美元。”她丝毫不会感到被盘问，反而觉得自己在澄清事实。同样的方法放在 Uber 司机身上也屡试不爽，只要轻描淡写地抛出一句“我刚读到 Uber 司机现在是全美满意度最高的员工之一”，必定会换来司机激烈的反驳与倒苦水。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 诱导技术的三层推进流程 accDescr: 展示从抛出错误陈述触发纠错，到设定区间收窄范围，再到通过假意怀疑迫使对方吐露更多细节的流程。 subgraph S1["第一步：触发纠错"] A["抛出错误或夸张陈述"] --> B["唤起本能反驳欲"] end subgraph S2["第二步：区间夹逼"] B --> C["给出模糊区间 Bracketing"] end subgraph S3["第三步：假意怀疑"] C --> D["表达难以置信 Disbelief"] --> E["彻底瓦解心防获取深层信息"] end ``` 诱导技术的三个主要层级与技巧： - **触发纠错（Correcting the record）**：抛出一个明显有偏差或夸大事实的陈述，诱导对方主动纠正，从而吐露真实数据。 - **区间夹逼（Bracketing）**：给出一个估算范围（例如“听说你们公司搬迁定在三月到五月之间”或“金额在 39 到 59 之间”），迫使对方说出精准事实（如“不，其实是二月”）。 - **假意怀疑（Disbelief）**：当对方讲出一件事时，故意表达质疑（“不可能吧，那次旅行怎么可能毫无波折，完美无瑕？”），对方为了证明自己所言非虚，会倾囊倒出所有细节与内幕。 ### [55:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3346s) 冷战谍影与日常破冰话术 这项技术不仅适用于日常商业情报的刺探，在冷战时期更是苏联克格勃（KGB）间谍套取机密的标配手段。当年美国海军潜艇停靠在泰国或新加坡港口时，身穿夏威夷衬衫的苏联特工会坐到酒吧里，陪年轻微醺的 19 岁美国水兵喝酒。间谍绝不会问“你们潜艇螺旋桨多大”，而是故意说：“德国潜艇速度绝对能甩开你们，毕竟他们螺旋桨直径有 22 英尺，而你们的才 18 英尺。”年轻水兵为了维护国家与部队的自尊心，立刻激动地反驳“才不是，我们的其实是……”，轻而易举地把绝密军事情报吐露殆尽。 在日常人际交往或谈判中，应用诱导技术最顺手的两个口头抓手是 **“所以……”（So...）** 和 **“我打赌……”（I bet...）**： - 使用“所以……”后接总结复述：“所以你做这份工作已经三年了，虽然不是最体面的，但至少能把生活打理得井井有条。” - 使用“我打赌……”：“我打赌你当时克服了超乎常人的阻碍才走到这一步。” 这与此前许多特工（如安德鲁·布斯塔曼特 Andrew Bustamante、迈克·贝克 Mike Baker）的实战哲学完全一致：情报游戏的真谛永远是让对方不停地说、不断地倾诉，绝不显露出咄咄逼人的态势。情报越是敏感机密，你越应该少提问题，甚至完全不提问题。 ### [59:27](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3567s) 操控人心的骨牌法则：PCP 心理模型 PCP 模型（Perception 感知 - Context 语境 - Permission 许可）是一套解释“如何促使他人做出违背常规行为”的深层心理操控机制，无论是诱导他人加入邪教，还是促成一桩商业购买，其底层逻辑完全相通。PCP 模型并非割裂的三步，而是一组连锁多米诺骨牌：改变一个人对事物的**感知**（Perception），就会彻底重塑该事物所处的**语境**（Context），而在新的语境之下，个体内心的阻抗被瓦解，从而获得了采取行动的**心理许可**（Permission）。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: PCP 心理操控多米诺模型 accDescr: 展示感知改变带动语境转换，最终重塑心理许可的行为驱动链条。 P["感知 Perception<br/>（重构大脑对当下现实的定义）"] --> C["语境 Context<br/>（从不可接受的场合转入合乎逻辑的场景）"] C --> Perm["许可 Permission<br/>（心理防御瓦解，自愿执行反常行为）"] ``` 为了阐释这套模型的极端威力，可以参考美国华盛顿州发生的一桩耸人听闻的案件：一名甚至算不上催眠高手的律师，通过催眠手段对一名女性进行侵害，使其在律所办公室里脱下衣服。在正常语境下，没有任何人会无缘无故在办公室或播客录制现场裸露身体，但几乎所有人都会在晚上回家洗澡时自然脱衣。这名律师正是重构了当事人的感知——他引导对方想象自己“忙碌一天后疲惫地下班回家，把钥匙扔进门厅的碗里，走向浴室拧开热水，正准备踏进热气腾腾的淋浴间”。通过篡改其脑海中的时空感知，现实语境被悄然替换为“准备洗澡”，脱衣的行为便获得了完全合乎逻辑的“心理许可”。这种通过重塑语境来打破社会禁忌并赋予许可的机制，正是邪教招募者与顶尖上门推销员长年精研并赖以生存的核心手法。 ### [01:01:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3716s) 操纵的起点：重塑认知与武器化认知失调 Chase Hughes 详细拆解了极端操纵、邪教招募乃至高额推销是如何诱导人们做出反常行为的——无论是让屋主签下高达 95,000 美元的屋顶太阳能系统、购买昂贵的吸尘器，还是加入有害的邪教。这些套路的核心并不在于乞求式的推销，而是从一开始就悄悄改变对话的“认知框架”（Perception）。例如，邪教在接触目标时往往伪装成“匿名调查”，这一举措瞬间降低了对方的防备心，赋予了对话合理性；接着，他们抛出一连串微小的认知重塑问题：“你更愿意生活在一群感觉像家人一样的人身边，还是仅仅有血缘关系的人身边？”、“你希望被喜欢你陪伴的人环绕吗？” ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 认知失调与行为锁定漏斗 accDescr: 展示从微小认同逐步升级到公开承诺并最终锁定身份与行为的递进过程。 subgraph Step1 ["第一阶段：轻量切入"] A["匿名调查 / 微小共识<br/>（如：支持安全驾驶）"] --> B["微小行动 / 改变情境<br/>（如：在窗户贴小贴纸）"] end subgraph Step2 ["第二阶段：公开化与失调"] B --> C["公开表达与社会承诺<br/>（社交发帖 / 庭院立牌）"] C --> D["武器化认知失调<br/>（行为与自我设定必须一致）"] end subgraph Step3 ["第三阶段：身份锁定"] D --> E["身份深度绑定<br/>（接受重大极端行为要求）"] end ``` 当被测试者做出大约 25 次关于“我是谁”的微小认同时，其内在的语境（Context）与自我准许（Permission）便彻底偏移。他们会产生一种心理：“我允许自己这么做，因为我刚刚承认了自己就是这种人。”Chase 指出，无论是在国家层面发动心理战（PsyOp）、操纵单个个体，还是进行心理治疗，说服者的核心武器就是**武器化认知失调（Weaponized Cognitive Dissonance）**。当说服者让一个人眼中的世界与其实际行为产生冲突时，人会感到极度不适；为了消除这种不适，最快、最轻松的办法就是改变行为，而不是推翻自己的信念或承认自己愚蠢。 - **认知失调的核心机制**：人类极难承认自己犯蠢或直接推翻既定观念，因此只要通过心理牵引让其行为偏离，大脑就会反过来调整行动来顺应新的自我设定。 - **极端意识形态的抓手**：无论是极左还是极右政治阵营，只要让人就其个人身份公开发表两到三次声明，未来的行为模式就会被彻底扭曲并锁定。 --- ### [01:04:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=3861s) 锁定身份而非观念：影响力法则与渐进漂移 为了证明这种心理机制，Chase 援引了影响力大师罗伯特·西奥迪尼（Robert Cialdini）在其经典著作《影响力》（*Influence*）中记录的一项实验：研究人员若直接敲门请求居民在自家前院插一块巨大且丑陋的“安全驾驶”告示牌，只有极少数人同意；但在另一组社区中，研究人员提前两周上门做微小民调，询问“你支持安全驾驶吗？”，约 91% 的人给出肯定回答，随后被请求在窗户上贴一张几乎不引人注意的小贴纸。两周后，研究人员再次上门要求立大牌子时，原本仅有 6% 接受率的要求在预先贴贴纸的社区飙升至 89%。 Steven 顺势指出，这完美解释了现代政治生态与历史悲剧的演进：选民一开始只是宣布“我属于这个政党”，随后在群体认同的推波助澜下经历微小的信念漂移（Creep of beliefs），十年后回过头看，整个群体已经接受了原本看起来极其荒唐、疯狂的极端立场。这种逐步妥协的心理演进，同样能够解释纳粹德国等极权社会如何从文明理性的常态滑向骇人听闻的野蛮行径。 - **西奥迪尼安全驾驶实验数据**： - 未作预先铺垫组：仅约 6% 的住户同意在庭院中设立巨型丑陋告示牌。 - 经历微小认同组：91% 先口头赞同安全驾驶，随后贴上小贴纸；两周后有高达 89% 的住户同意立大告示牌。 - **观念与身份的本质区别**：世面上绝大多数沟通与说服技巧都在试图“捕捉观念”（Capturing ideas），但真正能颠覆长期行为的是“捕捉身份”（Capturing identity）。一旦让人在社交网络公开表明立场或采取行动，社会评价机制便会倒逼其捍卫该身份。 --- ### [01:06:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4016s) 破解米尔格拉姆实验：新奇感（Novelty）与 FATE 操纵模型 重新审视著名的米尔格拉姆服从实验（Milgram Experiment），Chase 提出了不同于传统教科书的独到见解。传统观点将受试者施加致命电击归咎于对“权威”（Authority）的绝对服从，但 Chase 认为“新奇感”（Novelty）起到了被严重忽视的决定性作用。受试者踏入陌生的大学校园、进入从未去过的建筑、面对穿白大褂的陌生人、面对未知的仪器和未见过的问卷——每一个环节都是前所未有的刺激。 哺乳动物大脑（从人类到犬类）捕获专注力的第一驱动力正是新奇感。在进化史上，祖先每天走过灌木丛，某天黄昏树枝突然折断发出异响，这种打破日常预测框架的意外输入就是新奇感。Chase 将影响和操纵哺乳动物大脑的核心维度凝练为首字母缩写词 **FATE**： | 维度代码 | 核心要素 | 机制说明与场景应用 | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **F** | **专注（Focus）** | 借助反常、打破既定预测的“新奇感”彻底抓住神经系统的注意力。 | | **A** | **权威（Authority）** | 展现领域统治力、专业身份或公众信任背书，唤醒服从本能。 | | **T** | **群体（Tribe）** | 展现同类归属感与社会证明（Social Proof），如百万好评、大众跟风。 | | **E** | **情绪（Emotion）** | 激发强烈的感受与情感共鸣，完成价值注入与最终行动促成。 | 在电视购物广告中，操纵者迅速抓住观众视线（Focus），出示上百万人购买且好评如潮的数据（Tribe），展现产品背后的专业认可（Authority），并用生动的画面展示使用后的喜悦与被朋友羡慕的场景（Emotion）。Steven 联想到夏日碳酸饮料广告中拉开拉环的清脆声响与欢聚人群，Chase 补充指出，广告中的巨幅品牌标识或明星代言正是部落领袖般的权威象征，因为在远古时期，不顺从部落领袖指示的个体很难生存繁衍。 --- ### [01:10:35](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4235s) 争论的艺术：如何消解冲突与锁定共同目标 讨论转入亲密关系与日常沟通场景，Steven 提问：当自己与伴侣产生分歧、希望寻求良好解决方案时，有哪些绝对不能踩的雷区？Chase 给出的首要告诫是：**切忌当场揪住细枝末节的错误信息去反驳纠正**。 如果在争论过程中对方指责了一件你显然没有做过的事情，明智的做法是先保持克制、将纠错留到最后。原因在于必须让对方先把胸中的负面情绪完全宣泄出来，攻击性才会被自然化解（Diffused）。与此同时，在对话初期应当迅速建立双方的共同底线与诉求，甚至可以直接发问：“先暂停一下，我们在这场讨论中是否追求的是同一个结果？” Chase 强调，永远不要在对话中使用“争论”（Argument）这个词。人在争吵时极易陷入一种智力上的征服欲，满脑子想的都是“我必须在逻辑上碾压这场谈话，我必须证明我是对的”。但事实上，即使在口角中争赢了，也丝毫不能证明你在过去或未来是真正正确的一方；一旦将焦点从“我要赢下争论”转移到“我们共同追求的成果是什么”，对抗的情绪场便会立刻发生逆转。 ### [01:11:57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4317s) 争吵背后的潜台词与情绪识别 在商务谈判或人际关系中，当局面开始失控时，首要任务是寻找对双方都理想的平衡点（Middle Ground），并学会“倾听没有说出口的话”。Chase Hughes 以夫妻相处为例：如果妻子抱怨“出差时你根本不需要给我打电话，你反正也不打，我从来接不到你的电话”，男性的第一直觉往往是掏出手机摆事实——“看看未接来电记录”。但这根本不是电话次数的问题，真正隐藏在字面背后的是她感到“自己未被重视、感受不到被爱”。 像行为画像分析师（Behavior Profiler）一样倾听言外之意至关重要。争吵表面上的话语只是外壳，底层驱动的往往是愤怒、孤独或不被欣赏等情绪。想要化解争端，必须针对情绪本身进行回应，切忌就事论事地在字面细节上争个输赢。 ### [01:13:20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4400s) 拆解 FOG 操控与“金桥”退路 针对人际操控与争辩，Chase Hughes 提到他在 YouTube 发布的视频《自恋者关闭开关》（The Narcissist Off Switch）。在任何争论中，操纵者通常会利用三样武器获取控制权，其首字母缩写为 **FOG**： ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 识别与化解 FOG 操控流程 accDescr: 展示自恋者使用的三类武器以及非对抗性化解与提供退路的方法。 subgraph FOG["操控武器 (FOG)"] F["Fear (恐惧)"] O["Obligation (责任/义务)"] G["Guilt (内疚)"] end FOG --> Recog["非对抗性指明: 听起来像是你想让我感到..."] Recog --> Bridge["构筑金桥 (Golden Bridge): 给对方体面后退的台阶"] ``` 识别出对方在使用恐惧、责任或内疚时，必须用“非对抗性”（Non-confrontational）的方式直接点破。例如，若对方说“如果你不接这个活，我下周就得加班 19 个小时”，其实质是用内疚施压。此时合适的回应是：“Steven，也许你并不是这个意思，但听起来你刚才像是在让我为你下周工作感到内疚；我知道你是个很好的人，应该不是故意这么想的。” 这种技巧借鉴了《孙子兵法》中给敌人留后路的理念，在审讯训练中被称为“金桥”（Golden Bridge）： - 永远给对方一个体面的退路，避免将他们逼入死角。 - 透视争论背后隐藏的恐惧（Concealed Fear）：害怕丢掉订单、害怕亏钱、害怕在众人面前丢脸等。通常只需花 30 到 40 秒，就能察觉对方到底在害怕什么。 - 采用“有意义的沉默停顿”（Meaningful Pause）：在对方抛出施压言论后，停下来注视对方几秒或移开视线沉思。这并非刻意的战术表演，而是真实地消化对方的话，能瞬间瓦解对方话语的压制力。 ### [01:16:37](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4597s) 现场侧写 Steven Bartlett：动机与潜意识解码 当 Steven 询问 Chase 还有什么重要话题尚未探讨时，Chase 反问了两个没人问过 Steven 的核心问题：“你是谁？你的使命是什么？”借此进行现场性格与心理侧写。 Steven 的回答呈现出极有深度的内心特征： - **寻找答案时的眼球转动（Transderivational Search）**：Steven 回答前先看向右上方，再看左上方，接着看向正中央。这种多维度的眼球转动表明大脑正在内部“不同的档案柜”中检索深层记忆与自我认知。 - **身份认同标签**：Steven 给出的标签依次是“播客主、创业者、投资人、男友”。他完全没有提及公众熟悉的“电视明星”身份，说明外在虚名对他并不重要；将“男友”置于重要位置，透露出私密亲密关系在其价值体系中的分量。 - **使命的内在驱动（Significance vs. Approval）**：Steven 将使命定义为“追求自身潜能、追随好奇心，看看究竟会发生什么”。这并非空洞的“改变世界”口号，而是源自纯粹的热情与探索欲。 Chase 对此剖析道：Steven 追求的是个人的“意义感与重要性”（Significance），而非大众群体的“认可与接纳”（Approval）。因此，若对 Steven 说“你生来就是为了改变他人、丰富他人生命，正在做你生来就该做的事”，会深深触动他；相反，若赞美他“你在社交圈里好受欢迎、走到哪里都是全场焦点”，Steven 会下意识地皱眉苦笑（Grimace）。如果在销售或沟通中错判了对方的核心心理动机，使用错误的夸赞与说辞，只会让谈话显得极度尴尬和脱节。 ### [01:21:51](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4911s) 洞察人类核心需求与潜藏恐惧 很多销售人员常将业务视作一场机械的“数字游戏”（numbers game），死板地套用既定话术，哪怕只是松散地照本宣科，也能维持大约 41% 左右的基础成单率。然而，Chase Hughes 指出，这种粗放的做法完全忽视了人性的深层机制。每个人的内在心理虽然属于私密思想，却无时无刻不在公开场合表露无遗。只要你真正懂得如何倾听、理解对方表达背后的含义，就能精准捕捉到这些信号。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 需求与恐惧推导模型 accDescr: 展示如何从个体核心需求直接反推出其最大心理恐惧，进而引导行为。 subgraph Analysis["心理侧写过程"] A["识别核心需求\n(如: 追求重要感)"] --> B["推导核心恐惧\n(如: 边缘化/无所作为)"] end subgraph Action["行为影响"] B --> C["重塑沟通策略"] C --> D["引导目标行为\n与销售促成"] end ``` 一旦能够对一个人进行深层心理侧写，沟通方式、成交手段以及引导行为的逻辑就会发生根本性的蜕变。以人类的“重要感需求”（need for significance）为例，一旦确定对方渴望证明自身价值，其内心最深处的恐惧便呼之欲出——他们害怕感到无足轻重、害怕本有机会做出改变却一事无成、害怕无法在世界上留下属于自己的印记。任何一种被锁定的核心需求，都会自然倒推出对应的恐惧，而洞悉并利用这些恐惧，同样是引导与改变他人行为的关键抓手。 ### [01:23:03](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=4983s) 电话销售中的“泼咖啡策略”与新奇感 Steven Bartlett 结合自身的团队管理经历与早年丰富的电话销售（telesales）背景引发了深入探讨。Steven 回忆起自己 16 岁时在普利茅斯（Plymouth）的 Everest 公司推销门窗、阳光房与人造草坪；后来在曼彻斯特读大学直至退学期间，他又先后在 Swinton 汽车保险公司、Fusion 摄影工作室推销写真券，甚至从事过早期的 Facebook 电话广告销售。在这类冷不防拨打过去的 Cold Call 中，销售员只有几秒钟的极短窗口，根本没有充足时间去系统剖析客户类型。 面对这种场景，Chase 提出了回归 FATE 模型的实战方案。他分享了自己最近为某销售团队提供培训时的真实案例：当陌生客户接起电话的瞬间，销售员会假装家里的新小狗刚刚把热咖啡撞翻在笔记本电脑上，惊慌失措地喊道：“天呐，真抱歉！请稍等我一秒钟！”接着一边慌乱擦拭，一边向对方解释刚养的小狗打翻了咖啡，连连致歉说这太尴尬了。电话那头的客户甚至还不知道来电者是谁，但这种突如其来的戏剧性事件打破了常规，凭借高度的“新奇感”（novelty）瞬间抓住了哺乳动物大脑的注意力： - 实验数据显示，仅凭打翻咖啡并在电话中坦承“我很尴尬”的举动，客户留在通话中的时长直接提升了 70%。 - 听到对方如此窘迫与抱歉，多数接听者的本能反应都是柔和地安慰：“没事没事，不要紧”，从而极大地消解了对陌生来电的防备。 - 通话时间的延长为销售员争取到了探寻对方性格特质、调整后续策略的关键缓冲期。 ### [01:25:12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5112s) 销售中最常见的致命缺陷：剧本感的抹杀 谈及销售演练中最常见的短板，Chase 总结了几个核心痛点：语速不当导致的拖沓迟缓、缺乏从容掌控局面的权威感（authority）、对自身兜售的产品缺乏信心，而其中最致命的一点是——“照本宣科的剧本感”（going off of a script）。 人类大脑极其擅长识别规律与模式匹配。当人们接到骚扰推销电话，听到那句熟悉的“您好，Hughes 先生，我是某某公司的某某”时，大脑会瞬间识别出标准的销售套路，并在极短时间内启动心理防御机制将对方屏蔽。因为这种声音与过往听过成百上千次的劣质推销如出一辙，听众的注意力会瞬间蒸发，只想尽快挂断电话。因此，卓越沟通的核心不在于每次都打翻一杯星巴克，而在于打破神经习惯，让对话听起来与所有平庸的话术截然不同。 ### [01:26:47](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5207s) 赋予自主权与破除“习惯化过滤” Steven 随后分享了自己亲身遭遇过的一次高明推销。某位销售员拨通电话后直言不讳地坦白：“你好，这是一通销售电话。如果你不感兴趣，现在就可以直接挂断；但如果你愿意听我说几句，我只需要占用你 30 秒。”当时 Steven 正急于赶往录音棚录制播客，但这番开场白瞬间击中了他。Chase 点出，销售员在这里巧妙地给予了对方“自主权”（autonomy），把掌控权交还给受众，反而让人心甘情愿地停下脚步去听他讲完。 这种反直觉的沟通逻辑在商业邮件与招聘筛选中同样适用： | 沟通场景 | 常见错误（易触发习惯化过滤） | 高成效打破策略（制造新奇感） | 心理机制 | |:--- |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **求职引荐信** | 冗长客套的自我介绍与格式化开场 | 开篇直奔主题：“直接进入正题，无习惯化过滤” | 引用受众书中概念，直截了当，取悦认知与自尊 | | **邮件标题设计** | 首字母规范大写的促销长句：“2013年营销失败的13个教训” | 纯小写或极简短语：“这事搞砸了”（this sucked） | 伪装成朋友或亲属的私人随手来信，消除营销戒备 | | **营销 Newsletter** | 排版精美、充满设计感的图文模板 | 类似纯文本的无修饰格式 | 数据显示精美模板反遭冷落，未设计的文本更显真实重要 | ### [01:30:17](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5417s) 词汇疲劳与内容抓手：MrBeast 的破局法则 两人进一步探讨了认知神经学中的“习惯化”（habituation）现象。不仅视觉上人们会对格式化模板视而不见，听觉上也存在同样的机制。研究表明，如果反复机械地对一个人重复“父亲、父亲、父亲（father）”，随着认知资源的撤回，大脑便不再加工该词的语义，它最终会退化为脑海中毫无意义的一段杂音。然而，像“危险（warning）”这类带有极高情绪张力的词汇，由于自带警报属性，在大脑中产生习惯化衰减的速度要缓慢得多。 这种注意力竞争在内容创作领域表现得尤为极致。Steven 赞叹道，YouTube 顶级博主 MrBeast 堪称击穿“习惯化过滤器”的终极大师——他的视频开场从不给观众任何适应和走神的机会，往往在第一秒就用极具冲击力的方式对着镜头嘶吼出爆炸性的挑战设定（如“价值 50 万美元的……”），以最原始、最具穿透力的感官刺激瞬间锁死观众的注意力。 ### [01:31:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5470s) 受众差异与习惯化过滤机制 Steven Bartlett 和 Chase Hughes 进一步探讨了内容创作中的“习惯化过滤器”（habituation filter）。Steven 指出，对某些观众来说，一旦视频充斥着千篇一律的套路镜头，他们会在一秒内立刻划走，因为同质化严重的内容已经触发了审美疲劳。Chase 补充说，受众的群体特征至关重要：收听《The Diary Of A CEO》这种深度对话节目的受众，与观看 MrBeast 把法拉利扔到床垫上炸毁的观众截然不同。本节目的观众不需要每隔十秒穿插一段在机场慢速行走的 B-roll 空镜，也不需要过度设计的特效。 每个人根据自己的消费偏好与品味，会建立完全不同的习惯化过滤机制。人类大脑天生会通过快速预判和建立认知捷径（shortcuts）来减少认知负荷并节省脑力。 - **MrBeast 风格 vs. 深度对谈**：高频轰炸式视觉冲击与沉浸式深度长对话吸引完全不同心理机制的观众。 - **认知节能**：大脑建立先入为主的偏见和过滤捷径，核心目的是节约认知资源。 --- ### [01:33:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5590s) 自律的重新定义：为“未来的自己”做管家 在谈及咨询中最常被问到的话题时，Chase 表示最核心的问题往往是：“我该如何改变自己的自律（discipline）？”在建立个人权威的要素中，自律是通往自信和从容沉着（composure）的“入门诱导剂”（gateway drug）。一旦自律发生改变，其他一切都会随之改变。 Chase 对自律给出了独到的定义：**自律就是优先考虑“未来的自己”的需求，胜过满足“现在的自己”的需求。** 当 Steven 提到自己今晚在“早点回家睡觉”和“去健身房”之间权衡时，Chase 指出两者其实都属于自律，因为二者都是在造福未来的自己。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 自律与多巴胺反馈闭环 accDescr: 展示自律如何将对过去自我的感激转化为对未来自我的关怀，并产生多巴胺激励。 subgraph Mindset["时间视角转换"] A["过去的我<br/>(Past Me)"] -->|"以感激取代懊悔"| B["现在的我<br/>(Present Me)"] B -->|"像管家般服务"| C["未来的我<br/>(Future Me)"] end subgraph Feedback["心理机制"] B -->|"产生内源多巴胺"| D["强化自律行为"] D -->|"形成正向循环"| B end ``` 绝大多数人回顾过去时充满懊悔——后悔喝了太多酒、后悔在家庭聚会上口无遮拦、后悔睡懒觉；但如果能把“过去的自己”转变为“现在的自己”的多巴胺来源，自律就会变得充满动力： - **微小的预备行为**：Chase 睡前会把 Keurig 咖啡机的胶囊装好、杯子放好，第二天醒来只需一按即可；把第二天的衣物提前搭配好，把出行的行李放在后门。如同为“未来的自己”担任贴身管家（butler）。 - **时间胶囊惊喜**：在春夏换季时，在冬季夹克口袋里塞入 100 美元钞票或一张便签纸。数月后穿上衣服偶然发现时，会打心底感谢过去的自己。 - **情感矢量的重塑**：当你习惯性地向后投射感激（gratitude）时，向前投射的必然是关怀与关切（concern and care），而当下那些短视的焦虑与放纵冲动便会自然消退。 --- ### [01:38:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5912s) 目标是副产品：从“一茶匙自律”到自动化习惯 Steven 提及网络上体重 400 磅、立志减肥却在两年内一路增重至 500 磅的博主，指出了大众普遍存在的认知失调：人人都在元旦设立新年目标（New Year's resolutions），但成功坚持下来的仅有 7% 到 9%。针对这种执行力脱节，Chase 直言**人生的基石是习惯而非目标，目标只是正确习惯带来的副产品**。 普通人常常产生误解，看到 Steven 经常去健身房、吃健康餐且不饮酒，就会感叹“他太有自律了”。但 Chase 强调，外人看到的根本不是持续紧绷的自律，而是已经固化的**习惯**： - **习惯替代意志力消耗**：日常去健身房或健康饮食不需要每天痛苦地强迫自己，它就像每天早晨刷牙一样自然，没有人会觉得每天刷牙需要克服天大的意志力阻碍。 - **自律的真实剂量**：建立一个新习惯其实只需要在最开始投入“一茶匙”（a teaspoon）的自律，一旦微习惯（micro habits）生根发芽，后续的维持就会交由潜意识的惯性自动接管。 ### [01:40:40](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6040s) 自律方程式：延伸至未来的“为什么” Steven Bartlett 与 Chase Hughes 深入探讨了习惯与自律的底层逻辑。Steven 分享了他在上一本书中梳理出的“自律方程式”（Discipline Equation）：一个人要展现出自律，其核心在于理解做这件事的理由（Why），加上追求过程中的心理强化（Reinforcement），再减去行动的感知成本（Cost）。例如在刷牙这件事上，行动的“强化”（乐趣）几乎为零，且需要付出两分钟的成本，但背后的“为什么”（防止牙齿脱落、避免看牙医、保持形象）在净值上远大于成本，因此该行为得以维持。 Chase 对这个公式表示高度认同，但他着重强调了“为什么”（Why）的体量与时间维度。他指出，如果一个人的“为什么”仅局限于当下的即时享乐（例如“我当下需要快乐”），那么任何有自律倾向的长远理由都无法战胜它，其行为必然会滑向“我为什么现在要吃奇多（Cheetos）”或“为什么我每晚要喝 20 瓶啤酒”的即时满足中。摆脱自律下行螺旋的关键节点，在于将“为什么”延伸到尚未发生的未来时间里；唯有让未来的意义超越当下的诱惑，长久的自律才会发生。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: 自律方程式结构 accDescr: 展示自律行为的产生机制，由动机、强化与行动成本共同决定 subgraph Equation ["自律驱动机制"] direction TB Y["核心理由 (Why)<br/>面向未来的意义"] R["心理强化 (Reinforcement)<br/>追求过程的正向反馈"] C["感知成本 (Perceived Cost)<br/>阻力与付出"] Calc["(Why + Reinforcement) - Cost"] Y --> Calc R --> Calc C --> Calc end Calc -->|净值为正| Action["自律行为落地"] Calc -->|即时享乐主导| Spiral["陷入自律螺旋 / 逃避"] ``` ### [01:43:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6180s) 不作为的代价与动物性大脑的驾驭 Steven 进一步举出他与 Simon Sinek 讨论该公式时的例子：早上 7 点爬起来倒垃圾（走去倒垃圾桶）没有任何乐趣强化，起床本身的身体成本也很高，但为了避免垃圾溢出和被罚款，这个“为什么”足以促使行动落地。对此，Chase 补充了方程式中不可或缺的隐性分母——“不作为的代价”（Cost of Inaction）。他认为，所有这些公式最终都归结为个体的主观认知：对“为什么”的认知、对付出成本的认知，以及对无所作为所产生后果的感知。 要驾驭这一切，本质上是人类如何利用高级认知去驯服我们体内的“哺乳动物大脑”（Mammalian Brain，即本能与动物性部分）： - **注意力（Focus）**：引导哺乳动物大脑聚焦在目标上。 - **自我权威（Authority）**：建立对自身本能的掌控力，强迫自己起床并启动新习惯。 - **群体归属（Tribe）**：引入社交监督、朋友参与或公开承诺，借助群体压力推动自己。 - **情感驱动（Emotion）**：也就是那份强大的“为什么”。因为动物性大脑无法理解抽象概念，它只能理解直观图像与情绪体验。 Chase 强调，这正是愿景板（Vision Board）具有实际威力的科学原因。制作愿景板并不是为了向宇宙“显化”（manifesting）什么玄学愿望，而是给大脑中那个像“狗”一样的本能区域展示它能看懂的视觉画面（例如拥有六块腹肌的照片），用高频直观的视觉刺激对本能脑进行有效沟通。 ### [01:44:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6294s) 洗脑模型 FEAR：如何重塑习惯与环境 Chase 揭示了一套常用于情报审讯与行为重塑的“自我洗脑”模型——**FEAR**，其由四个核心要素构成： 1. **专注（Focus）**：让注意力持续、高强度地聚焦在目标上。 2. **情绪（Emotion）**：赋予行动持续的充沛情感，甚至把“不作为的代价”情绪化（例如使用能把脸变胖的软件，直观感受放纵的后果）。 3. **扰动（Agitation）**：打破“习惯化”（Habituation）。当一个人每天在同一间屋子里醒来，面对相同的走廊、地毯与沙发时，大脑为了省时会自动调用固有的旧行为脚本（Default Script）。要戒断不良习惯，就必须剧烈打乱环境节奏。Chase 会要求客户重新粉刷房屋、移动家具布局、彻底更换衣柜风格，甚至换一个完全不同的发型，让镜子里的自己变得陌生，从而剥夺大脑依赖旧模式的机会。 4. **重复（Repetition）**：通过不间断的暴露来固化新刺激。 为了说明“重复”的极致运用，Chase 提到他曾要求一位客户前往百思买（Best Buy）购买一台 70 英寸的电视，并在背后用胶带粘上一台两三百美元的平价平板电脑，让电视全天 24 小时在办公室内无休轮播多达 900 张愿景幻灯片。即便客户不在办公室，屏幕也永不关闭，这样不仅消除了每天还要自律决定“要不要开电视”的心理消耗，更创造了全天候、无法逃避的高频环境浸泡。 ### [01:48:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6486s) 警惕那些“说不清自己解决了什么问题”的产品 当 Steven 问及还有什么至关重要、必须让大众知晓的底层洞察时，Chase 给出了他传授给子女的一条最严肃的忠告：“如果你接触到一款产品，而它根本无法清楚告诉你它到底解决了什么问题，你必须感到极度恐惧（Terrified）。” Chase 拿成熟的实用工具与前沿科技硬件进行了尖锐对比： - **明确解决问题的工具**：像 DoorDash 或 Uber Eats，它们直截了当地解决“如何更快送达食物”、“免于出门、安心工作”的痛点；亚马逊（Amazon）清晰地展示了其高效的物流与商品获取方案；MacBook 甚至相机，都能明确告知能帮你更快完成哪些具体工作。 - **掩盖真实目的的产品**：反观苹果的 Vision Pro 以及 Meta（Facebook）的各类 AR 眼镜，其营销从来无法明确说出自身究竟解决了现实世界中的什么实际痛点。 Chase 犀利地指出，这些产品不敢言明的底层功能，实际上是瞄准了当下的**孤独感（Loneliness）**、**无聊（Boredom）**，以及人们想要**自我麻醉（Anesthetize）**、逃避当下现实生活的病态渴望。人类正处于一场史无前例的“孤独流行病”（Loneliness Epidemic）之中——表面上前所未有地互联互通，内心却经历了前所未有的孤绝。类似 TikTok 这样的大众娱乐应用同样如此，它们绝口不提解决现实问题，而是像赌场一样通过持续吞噬年轻人的注意力和逃避心理来运转。一旦产品隐瞒了其真实的消耗属性，用户就成为了被收割的对象。 ### [01:50:49](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6649s) 短视频与催眠术：分段催眠与算法操纵的暗示性 Chase Hughes 深入剖析了短视频平台（如 TikTok、Instagram Reels）背后令人不寒而栗的心理学操控机制。平台并不仅仅是在无脑刺激多巴胺分泌，更在使用一种源自催眠领域的高级技巧——“分段催眠”（Fractionation）。这种技术的运作方式是先引发强烈的情感低落或共鸣，紧接着又通过剧烈的反差将情绪骤然拉高。例如，用户上一秒还在看着一位祖父怀抱新生孙辈的温情画面，感动得几乎落泪——Chase 坦承自己也曾孤身一人看着一段 60 秒的短视频流下眼泪并深感懊恼；但短短两个视频之后，信息流会瞬间切入激烈的骚乱、抢劫商铺、街头斗殴、汽车高速失控翻滚，或是飞机险些坠毁的惊险画面。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 分段催眠与广告转化循环图 accDescr: 描述短视频算法如何通过极度情感反差循环提升用户暗示感受性并最终推送广告促成购买转化。 subgraph EmotionCycle ["情绪过山车循环 (分段催眠)"] A["极度情绪低点<br/>(感人落泪/温情故事)"] --> B["极度情绪高点<br/>(暴力冲突/危险惊险)"] B --> A end EmotionCycle --> C["心理受暗示性 (Suggestibility)<br/>飙升近十倍 (米尔顿·艾瑞克森理论)"] C --> D["精准推送广告<br/>(极高转化率与冲动消费)"] ``` 这种反复的情绪过山车绝非偶然。根据著名催眠学先驱米尔顿·艾瑞克森（Dr. Milton Erickson）在 20 世纪 60 年代的研究，一个人经历的情绪起伏震荡越多，其心理“受暗示性”（Suggestibility）就会呈十倍级暴增。短视频算法精准利用了这一点：在连续经历四到五个情绪高低往复的循环后，系统会极其可靠地插播一条广告。此时用户的理智防线已降至最低。Chase 坦言，哪怕自己作为全球顶级的人类行为学和洗脑机制专家，也曾深陷其中，直到妻子质问他为何每周都在 Instagram 上网购垃圾产品，他才猛然警醒。为了自保，他让妻子掌握 iPhone 的“屏幕使用时间”（Screen Time）密码，严格锁死应用权限。他严肃警告公众：如果连他这样的专业洗脑专家都无法对短视频免疫，普通大众更应看清其巨大危害。 - **分段催眠（Fractionation）**：利用剧烈的情感起伏切换，彻底瓦解个体的批判性思维，使心理暗示的接受度成倍提升。 - **理论溯源**：心理学家米尔顿·艾瑞克森在 20 世纪 60 年代即通过严谨研究证实了情绪震荡与受暗示性的直接正比关系。 - **专家防线崩溃**：即便专攻行为操控数十年的 Chase Hughes，也曾沦为 Instagram 算法广告的受害者，最终必须依靠妻子设置设备密码来实行物理隔离。 --- ### [01:53:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6785s) 社交媒介的真实代价：旁观者效应与超负荷社群的冷漠 探讨这种持续侵蚀多巴胺受体生活方式的代价时，Chase Hughes 直言其核心恶果是“极度加剧的孤独感”。所有依靠广告变现的平台都遵循两个共同的深层目标：第一，诱导用户以极不健康的方式与他人盲目攀比；第二，让用户潜移默化地形成“我自身不够好”的自卑认知。这种机制制造了割裂的“我们与他们”的对立阵营，并将个体禁锢在严重的确认偏误（Confirmation Bias）之中——无论你的想法多么荒唐偏激，算法总能聚拢并展示 150 个随声附和的人，让你误以为整个世界皆是如此。 从纽约密集的水泥森林出发，Chase 探讨了现代高密度聚集如何彻底击垮人类的同理心。他援引了菲利普·津巴多（Philip Zimbardo）等人在伦敦利物浦街车站（Liverpool Street Station）进行的著名社会心理学实验：一名衣着普通的女性倒在进站台阶旁，短短时间内竟有高达 395 名行人视若无睹地绕行或直接从她身上跨过。同样令人触目惊心的是 20 世纪 60 年代纽约发生的“基蒂·吉诺维斯案”（Kitty Genovese），她在数十名目击者注视下被残忍刺死，却因旁观者效应（Bystander Effect）中“别人会去报警”的责任分散心理，导致无人及时施救。 面对这种常人视若“心理变态”（Psychopathy）的集体冷漠，Chase 解释道：人类大脑在漫长进化中只能承载一两百人的小型部落（邓巴数）。当群体规模暴增到大脑无法处理的天文数字时，个体便丧失了对人际声誉的关切，大脑随之切断了关怀周围所有人的情感带宽，同理心彻底归零。他在纽约街头感受到的冷漠与人口仅 2,200 人的乡村老家形成了鲜明对比——在乡村，只要有人摔倒或手臂划破，会有四辆车瞬间停下施救。此外，置身于祖先无法理解的钢筋水泥与化学添加剂环境中，抑郁症、自杀率与生理病变激增便成为必然结果。 - **社交媒体广告的双重核心**：挑起病态比较心理，持续灌输“我不够好”的匮乏感以促成消费。 - **利物浦街车站实验**：实验中约 395 名行人无情走过或直接跨过倒地求救的受试者，验证了极端都市环境对人性的麻木化效应。 - **邓巴数与同理心耗竭**：大脑无力负荷超出生物进化设定的人际规模，致使群体声誉约束失效、都市同理心丧失。 --- ### [01:58:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7126s) 上位嘉宾的提问：“妄想级自我原谅”与当下觉察的超能力 按照节目惯例，上一位神秘嘉宾留下了给 Chase 的专属问题：“我们如何才能持续感知并由衷感恩生命中的一切恩赐？”Chase 对此展开了独到的剖析。尽管“正念”（Mindfulness）在互联网上已被泛化为毫无新意的陈词滥调，但他坚信专注于当下的感知能力依然是一种人类超能力。而想要迅速掌握活在当下的技巧，最凌厉有效的途径就是做到“近乎妄想程度的自我原谅”（Delusionally self-forgiving）。 大部分人终其一生都在与回溯式的悔恨和羞耻感纠缠不休——反复苛责自己“当年不该做那件事”、“我竟然当着众人的面出丑”。Chase 建议，必须把对过往自我的宽恕推向一种常人看似疯狂的极端边界，哪怕理智在呼喊“这件事绝对无法原谅”，也要在心里一笑置之、全盘接纳。一旦达到这种能够自嘲、对过去一切愚行释然的“妄想级原谅”，一个人将自己从历史泥潭中拔出、专注于当下的能力瞬间会暴增十倍。在探讨如何平衡对未来的思考时，Chase 强调前瞻思考本身十分有益，只要践行此前探讨的自律准则——将“关切与规划投射向未来，将全盘的感恩投掷给过往”。 谈话最后触及了 Chase 的虚构小说作品《Phase Six》（访谈中主持人称《Phrase Seven/Phase Seven》）。该书正在被改编为影视剧集，Chase 本人还将客串一位露脸 25 秒的调酒师。这部作品通过扣人心弦的虚构叙事，系统揭示了精神控制、催眠与思想洗脑在大众社会中的隐秘运作，旨在警示读者识破现代社会心理操控的重重迷网，并掌握反制与自保的行为学武器。 - **妄想级自我原谅（Delusional Self-forgiveness）**：打破“悔恨-羞耻”心理死循环的核心心法，是彻底卸除心智重担、回归当下正念的催化剂。 - **时空能量配置哲学**：秉承“关切与规划置于未来，感恩与释怀交予过往”的心理认知框架。 - **著作《Phase Six》影视化**：以虚构悬疑形式拆解洗脑、催眠与集体心智工程，兼具反洗脑防卫手册与大众警示录的深层意义。 ### [02:01:25](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7285s) 获取行为科学资源与深入学习的途径 史蒂文·巴特利特（Steven Bartlett）打趣地形容切斯·休斯（Chase Hughes）的工作与行为学体系就像是谍战剧《24小时》（24）与律政剧《金装律师》（Suits）的奇妙结合，既有高压特工般的情报洞察，又有商业律政中的犀利谈判。对于渴望进一步深究这套行为分析系统的人，切斯指出了最佳的获取渠道：他的神经认知智能中心官方主页——NCI（Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence），网址为 `nci.university`。 为了回馈本期节目的听众，切斯特别说明会在该主页的最底部专门添加一个名为“CEO”的专属链接，里面汇总并提供了他在本次对话中提及的所有工具、模型和相关资料，供大家免费下载。针对现场展示的《行为操作手册》（The Behavior Operations Manual），切斯也确认其实体平装版书籍同样可以在官方网站上直接购买，里面的核心知识体系与他日常培训所用的完全一致。 ### [02:02:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7328s) 行为学是一切人际互动与商业成败的核心解码器 史蒂文由衷地向切斯致谢，感叹这场长达两小时的对话极其震撼，却仅仅只是“触及了冰山一角”，他甚至觉得两人可以一口气深入探讨 20 个小时。在史蒂文看来，人生中的每一个目标、梦想、挫折与障碍，归根结底都能提炼为某种关于“人”的挑战——无论是与伴侣的亲密关系、掌管公司的商业决策、团队领导力，还是作为播客主持人的控场沟通，其本质全都围绕着人类行为展开。洞察与解读人类行为，正是解开所有关键问题的“唯一底层技能”。 史蒂文回忆起学生时代对心理学实验的痴迷，尤其是著名的“米尔格拉姆服从实验”（Milgram experiment），那是彻底颠覆并塑造他思维方式的转折点。从早期在呼叫中心做基层工作，到后来创办并管理庞大的商业帝国，再到主持顶级播客，米尔格拉姆实验所揭示的权威与服从逻辑无处不在。史蒂文代表广大热心粉丝感谢切斯的公开分享，并大力推荐切斯的 YouTube 频道。切斯在频道中通过行为微表情、身体语言和心理杠杆等多维透镜，对现实社会中的知名事件与名流互动进行细致拆解，不仅极具启蒙性与深度，同时兼具绝佳的观赏娱乐性。 ### [02:03:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7434s) 肠道健康科学与个性化营养：赞助商 ZOE 节目的尾声，史蒂文分享了关于饮食与身体健康的反思。他坦言自己不仅倾听直觉，也非常信赖自己投资并作为本期节目赞助商的健康品牌 ZOE。与众多营养学专家的交流让他意识到，食品包装上的宣传往往极具误导性——所谓的“健康光环”（healthy halos），例如醒目标注的“低糖”或“无人工添加”，往往是超加工或应尽量避免的食品特征（正如新鲜水果从来不需要在表面印上健康声明）。面对混乱且缺乏透明度的营养信息，消费者极易陷入信任危机。 ZOE 依托全球最大规模的肠道微生物数据库之一，结合先进的居家肠道与代谢检测工具，为用户提供有硬核科学支撑的个性化饮食方案。注册成为 ZOE 会员后，用户将获得一套居家测试套件，并解锁专属的定制化营养指南，从而做出更聪明、更利于肠道微生态的选择。 - 访问官网 `zoe.com` 并使用优惠代码 `STEVEN10`，即可在订阅会员时享受 10% 的专属折扣优惠。 - 史蒂文在结语中呼吁：“相信你的直觉，相信 ZOE（Trust your gut, trust Zoe）。” ## Notable quotes > [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=0s) 我们的人生由习惯决定，而非目标。 — Chase Hughes > [06:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=402s) 在人际交流中，唯一真正需要去“竞争”的维度是舒适度（Comfort）。 — Chase Hughes > [06:42](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=402s) 放慢身体的移动速度。想象自己整个人浸没在游泳池的水底，感受肢体在水下的阻力与节奏；在整整一周内，将这种“水下慢速”设定为你身体行动的最高限速，确保在房间里动得比任何人都更慢、更从容。 — Chase Hughes > [20:13](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1213s) 缺乏自信的人把脑海里的自我贬低和怀疑当成了“事实”；真正自信的人把同样的声音听作一段“虚构的故事”。 — Chase Hughes > [23:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=1385s) 如果我要把这个目标教给一条狗，我会怎么做？ — Chase Hughes > [46:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=2765s) 我改变的不是你的想法，而是你的身份认同。 — Chase Hughes > [01:33:10](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5590s) 自律就是优先考虑“未来的自己”的需求，胜过满足“现在的自己”的需求。 — Chase Hughes > [01:38:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=5912s) 人生的基石是习惯而非目标，目标只是正确习惯带来的副产品。 — Chase Hughes > [01:48:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=6486s) 如果你接触到一款产品，而它根本无法清楚告诉你它到底解决了什么问题，你必须感到极度恐惧。 — Chase Hughes > [01:58:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8&t=7126s) 关切与规划置于未来，感恩与释怀交予过往。 — Chase Hughes ## Mentioned Chase Hughes, Steven Bartlett, The Diary Of A CEO, The Behavior Operations Manual: Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence, The Ellipsis Manual: Analysis And Engineering of Human Behaviour, Phase Six, 米尔格拉姆服从实验 (Milgram Experiment), Robert Cialdini, Chris Voss, Julian Treasure, John Nolan, Confidential, Simon Sinek, Milton Erickson, Philip Zimbardo, Kitty Genovese, MrBeast, Roger Federer, Apple Vision Pro, TikTok, Instagram Reels, Meta, Amazon, ZOE, NCI (Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence) ## Video description Chase Hughes is a former US Navy Chief and leading behaviour expert and body language master. He is the bestselling author of books such as, ‘The Behavior Operations Manual: Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence’ and ‘The Ellipsis Manual: Analysis And Engineering of Human Behaviour’. 00:00 Intro 02:00 Who Is Chase Hughes and What Is His Mission? 03:28 The Factors for Success 04:17 Who Has Chase Worked With? 05:41 What Is the Behaviour Ops Manual? 06:42 The Most Common Reason People Come to Chase 14:45 The Elements That Give Someone Authority 17:18 Is There a Physical Appearance of Authority? 21:03 Building Confidence Within Your Own Mind 27:38 Is There a Relationship Between Discipline and Confidence? 29:23 Is It Possible to Read a Room? 39:46 What You Should Know About Communication 46:07 How Chase Would Sell a Pen 51:09 Listening: A Key Part of Communication 52:15 What Is Illicitation? 59:27 What Is the PCP Model? 1:10:33 How To and Should You Win an Argument? 1:16:34 How To Read Someone's Motivations in Life 1:25:11 What Is the Most Common Deficiency in Sales Pitches? 1:33:10 How Do I Change My Discipline? 1:38:32 Are There Any Tricks To Improve Discipline? 1:40:40 How To Form New Habits 1:48:06 If You See This With a Product, Be Terrified 1:53:05 What’s the Cost of This Social Media Rabbit Hole? 1:58:46 Guest's Last Question Follow Chase: Instagram - https://g2ul0.app.link/WyJ70f6xqPb YouTube - https://g2ul0.app.link/DUk91t8xqPb NCI Training Page - https://g2ul0.app.link/dJtkPQUQqPb Website - https://nci.university/20030 You can purchase Chase’s book, ‘The Behavior Operations Manual: Neuro-Cognitive Intelligence’, here: https://amzn.to/3VJmYy6 You can purchase the The Diary Of A CEO Conversation Cards: Second Edition, here: https://g2ul0.app.link/f31dsUttKKb Follow me: https://g2ul0.app.link/gnGqL4IsKKb Get access to exclusive Diary of a CEO content: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGq-a57w-aPwyi3pW7XLiHw/join Sponsors: Shopify - https://shopify.com/bartlett ZOE - http://joinzoe.com with code STEVEN10 for 10% off [Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvjR9GM2kX8)

[0:00] Chase Hughes: 我们的人生由习惯决定，而非目标。 [6:42] Chase Hughes: 在人际交流中，唯一真正需要去“竞争”的维度是舒适度（Comfort）。 [6:42] Chase Hughes: 放慢身体的移动速度。想象自己整个人浸没在游泳池的水底，感受肢体在水下的阻力与节奏；在整整一周内，将这种“水下慢速”设定为你身体行动的最高限速，确保在房间里动得比任何人都更慢、更从容。 [20:13] Chase Hughes: 缺乏自信的人把脑海里的自我贬低和怀疑当成了“事实”；真正自信的人把同样的声音听作一段“虚构的故事”。 [23:05] Chase Hughes: 如果我要把这个目标教给一条狗，我会怎么做？ [46:05] Chase Hughes: 我改变的不是你的想法，而是你的身份认同。 [93:10] Chase Hughes: 自律就是优先考虑“未来的自己”的需求，胜过满足“现在的自己”的需求。 [98:32] Chase Hughes: 人生的基石是习惯而非目标，目标只是正确习惯带来的副产品。 [108:06] Chase Hughes: 如果你接触到一款产品，而它根本无法清楚告诉你它到底解决了什么问题，你必须感到极度恐惧。 [118:46] Chase Hughes: 关切与规划置于未来，感恩与释怀交予过往。

[2:00] Chase Hughes: Everything that dictates the outcomes of situations comes down to human factors every time... whether or not you can manage yourself, you're a good leader, who the good leaders are, and who can persuade the people to feel a certain way. [18:44] Chase Hughes: I literally used brainwashing techniques to help him... within just a few months he went from around I think 6 to 800k per month to like 4 million a month. [103:03] Chase Hughes: It's always going to be your perception of the why, your perception of the cost, and your perception of the cost of inaction. All of that is about whether I can leverage my focus, exert authority over that mammalian part of my brain, and involve the tribe. [105:22] Chase Hughes: Agitation means I'm going to disrupt my environment so much and so often that my brain has no chance to default to an older script. I have clients that repaint their house, rearrange their furniture, change their wardrobe, or get a completely new haircut so they're not even looking at the same person in the mirror. [198:06] Steven Bartlett: everything is about humans.

[0:00] so New Year's resolutions around the [0:01] corner I think 9% of resolutions stick [0:03] what advice have you got for me okay so [0:05] let's say I wanted to lose weight the [0:06] first thing is realizing that all of our [0:08] lives are about habits not goals the [0:10] second aspect of this is one of the most [0:12] effective strategies to brainwash [0:14] yourself to form these new habits and [0:16] that is Chase Hughes is a former [0:17] military veteran turned world-renowned [0:19] expert in behavioral analysis and human [0:22] influence he has trained Secret Service [0:24] agents Navy SEAL leaders CEOs and [0:26] government officials to master [0:28] communication behavioral detection and [0:30] persuasion you can look at three factors [0:32] every single time to determine why [0:34] someone was successful or why they [0:35] failed the first is self-mastery where [0:37] we look at confidence body language [0:39] discipline and authority and we know [0:41] that people are hyper responsive to [0:42] Authority but how do we establish [0:44] Authority ourselves Authority is made up [0:46] of five things and that's number two is [0:49] their level of observation and there's [0:51] five C's that we talk about in Behavior [0:53] profiling should we get into but my [0:55] favorite example and one of the fastest [0:56] ways to get a read on another human [0:58] being is how often they're BL bling if I [1:00] start seeing an increase in someone's [1:02] blink rate I know I need to change the [1:03] subject right away interesting and the [1:05] third their level of communication and [1:07] if you want to learn how to start a [1:08] conversation or continue one this is for [1:10] you it comes down to understanding the [1:13] type of person that you are in front of [1:15] now segregate people into six groups and [1:17] that'll influence the best way to talk [1:18] to those people so we can get into if [1:20] you want please okay number one what [1:22] about how to win an argument what are [1:24] the things I should definitely not do so [1:26] the big mistake most people make is [1:28] don't do that [1:32] this has always blown my mind a little [1:33] bit 53% of you that listen to the show [1:36] regularly haven't yet subscribe to the [1:38] show so could I ask you for a favor [1:40] before we start if you like the show and [1:41] you like what we do here and you want to [1:43] support us the free simple way that you [1:44] can do just that is by hitting the [1:46] Subscribe button and my commitment to [1:48] you is if you do that then I'll do [1:49] everything in my power me and my team to [1:51] make sure that this show is better for [1:53] you every single week we'll listen to [1:54] your feedback we'll find the guest that [1:56] you want me to speak to and we'll [1:58] continue to do what we do thank you so [2:03] much Chase Hughes who are you and what [2:06] is your mission I'm a behavior guy [2:09] Behavior expert and [2:13] I think I've just set out to teach [2:16] people that there is an entire world [2:20] that other people can't really see don't [2:22] have access to and I think for the last [2:25] 10,000 years of recorded history you can [2:27] look at any event or any leader of any [2:29] country and everything that dictates the [2:32] outcomes of situations comes down to [2:34] human factors every time no matter if [2:36] there's economic turmoil there's people [2:38] getting pissed off about an economy [2:40] there's AI or technology innovations [2:42] that are happening it everything comes [2:44] down to human interactions and whether [2:47] or not you can manage yourself you're a [2:49] good leader who the good leaders are and [2:51] who can persuade the people to feel a [2:53] certain way and who'd you do it for I [2:56] think I'd do it for people that have [2:59] gone through a period in their life [3:00] realizing that there's an invisible [3:02] advantage that some other people have [3:04] the people that got [3:05] successful maybe have some kind of [3:08] advantage that they're not able to to [3:12] tangibly see and I think showing them [3:15] that this is one of the biggest lovers [3:17] that you could ever pull in your life is [3:19] the most rewarding and fascinating thing [3:22] to see someone go through this [3:23] transition to realize that this human [3:26] behavior stuff dictates outcomes in life [3:29] when you say this you're referring to [3:31] human behavior and is human behavior is [3:34] it like a set of tactics is it like a [3:37] form of psychology what is what is this [3:40] when you say the word this when I say [3:42] human behavior I mean that when a person [3:46] becomes successful or they become a [3:49] failure you can look at three factors [3:52] every single time to determine why [3:54] someone was successful or why they [3:55] failed that is their level of [3:57] self-mastery their level of observation [4:01] like can they read the room can they [4:02] read the person that they're actually [4:03] talking to and their level of [4:06] communication can they speak [4:07] influentially can they talk [4:09] about outcomes in a way that inspire [4:12] people and motivate people and can they [4:14] communicate in a persuasive way that [4:17] moves people and who exactly have you [4:21] worked with lots of government agencies [4:24] uh notably I've worked with intelligence [4:27] agencies I've worked with the [4:28] psychological operations Department the [4:30] US Army which is the Special Operations [4:32] Command I've trained a lot of the US [4:34] Navy leaders nowadays [4:38] and a lot of civilians are my main base [4:42] of clients right now what do [4:43] intelligence what do you do for [4:44] intelligence agents so when we talk to [4:48] intelligence agents the number one thing [4:50] that we train them in is recognizing [4:53] human behavior and we also teach [4:55] interrogation and we tend to teach like [4:57] if I'm doing an interrogation it's kind [4:59] of the same as if I'm uh an intelligence [5:02] officer somewhere trying to talk [5:03] somebody into spying on their own [5:05] country for us both of those things are [5:08] about talking someone into doing [5:09] something that's not really in their [5:11] best interest so when it comes down to [5:13] that that's really where [5:16] we get to the point the rubber meets the [5:18] road can you talk someone into doing [5:20] something that they a normally wouldn't [5:22] do which is maybe sales because they [5:24] normally they wouldn't have otherwise [5:25] done that or B in the interrogation [5:28] world can I talk you into something that [5:30] you wouldn't want to do because it's not [5:33] your best interest like confessing to a [5:34] crime or providing intelligence or [5:36] something like that and that's where we [5:38] really do a lot of the training for [5:41] police and government next to me there's [5:44] this massive book called The behavior [5:46] Ops manual it's probably the biggest [5:47] book I've ever seen um what is the [5:50] wealth of experience that have fed into [5:52] this body of work that book right there [5:55] is my entire life so probably 30 to [5:58] 40,000 hours of of research on this [6:01] stuff every technique that I've ever [6:03] learned or taught every method that [6:05] we've ever used for interrogations or [6:08] persuasion or influence all that stuff [6:10] is inside of the behavior Ops manual and [6:13] I wrote that book and we can get into [6:14] that if you want to right now I received [6:17] a brain diagnosis where I thought I was [6:20] going to lose my brain and I was [6:23] desperate I'm just wondering how's my [6:26] family going to feed itself so I wanted [6:30] to put every single piece of knowledge [6:31] that I've ever created or I've ever come [6:33] up with for any government agent [6:35] everything all on the table and that's [6:38] what this book was it's just the [6:39] culmination of everything and you served [6:41] in the military yourself I did for 20 [6:43] years what is the [6:45] most common thing that people come to [6:48] your work for like if you were to [6:49] encapsulate it into like a sentence what [6:51] they're searching for in their own [6:52] personal lives it would be a person [6:56] that is lacking some degree of control [6:59] in some aspect of their [7:01] life and it's typically they think they [7:04] need skills most of my clients come to [7:07] me saying I want the technique I want [7:08] the skill teach me the the recipe to do [7:11] X Y and Z what do I say on the phone [7:13] give me a new sales script so I have [7:16] this model called the acss model that I [7:18] trained to my entire staff and that acss [7:21] model stands for Authority [7:24] Comfort social skills and then [7:27] skills 90% of people say they need more [7:30] skills but what they need is Authority [7:31] or comfort and they can't be comfortable [7:34] in a [7:35] conversation so I could give you like I [7:38] would talk to these clients and I would [7:39] say I could spend $10 million write the [7:43] best persuasion script for whatever your [7:45] ideal outcome is hand you this thing on [7:48] a silver platter and if you're not [7:50] comfortable in that conversation you're [7:52] not going to be successful so I could [7:54] give it to somebody with social anxiety [7:56] and have them go read this out loud it's [7:57] not Harry Potter we're not reading [7:59] spells it's not a spell so a lot of [8:03] people's problems come from Comfort a [8:05] lack of being able to be comfortable in [8:07] in a conversation and the level of [8:10] authority that they might have and I [8:11] don't mean hierarchical Authority I just [8:13] mean personal Authority but they don't [8:16] know it they think it's I need more [8:18] social skills I need to learn small talk [8:20] or I need this little technique so every [8:22] time the one thing I tell every client [8:25] is if I give you a flight checklist [8:28] right now for a a small plane Cessna [8:32] 172 are you a pilot no having this [8:35] little checklist of what to do does not [8:38] give you the skill so a lot of that so [8:40] much of that comes from comfort and the [8:43] problem that a lot of people have is [8:44] they're competing with other people on [8:46] height on looks on social status money [8:50] hierarchy confidence all this other [8:51] stuff the number one thing you need to [8:53] compare yourself with other people on is [8:56] Comfort that's it is can I be more [8:59] comfortable than the other person in in [9:01] this conversation because our brains are [9:03] naturally wired to compete we can't turn [9:06] competition off but we can change what [9:07] they're focused on and if they're [9:09] focused on Comfort we win a lot more [9:11] conversations Comfort yeah how does that [9:14] manifest is that just like being like [9:16] physically comfortable what is that yeah [9:20] it would be physical comfort so one of [9:23] the challenges I give to people is for [9:25] your first week all the only thing I [9:27] want you to focus on I'm not going to [9:29] give you the this long list to go look [9:30] into your phone and have to read it [9:31] before every meeting the one thing I [9:33] want you to focus on this week is can [9:36] you move [9:37] slower than the other people in the room [9:40] that's it just adjusting the speed limit [9:42] on your body so if you were standing in [9:44] a swimming pool how fast would your arms [9:47] and legs move if you were underwater and [9:49] make that the speed limit for this [9:50] entire week that's all I want you to [9:52] focus on and that makes so many changes [9:55] in people's mind because we change our [9:57] bodies and we change how our emotions [10:00] are feeling and there's one thing that [10:02] fear does it speeds our body up so if [10:05] you see someone doing these rapid jerky [10:07] movements you're you're seeing mostly [10:10] fear or stress in their [10:12] body so get more comfortable in an [10:15] interaction conversation even if it's on [10:17] the phone or in [10:19] person yeah so on the phone it would be [10:21] speaking at a normal composed Pace okay [10:26] and then so step two is composure can I [10:29] get you into a place where you have some [10:31] composure and the left and right side of [10:33] composure we have collapse and we have [10:37] posturing so we I have a person that [10:39] makes themselves small so other people [10:41] can be comfortable or I make myself big [10:45] so other people can get away from me and [10:49] we have we see that with every aspect of [10:51] our lives like when I first started my [10:53] business or when I first got out of the [10:55] military these people called me for a [10:56] keynote so this guy calls me and he's [10:59] like what's your hourly rate and I said [11:02] 6K uh and I said that's including travel [11:04] and all that and the only thing he did [11:05] he didn't say anything on the phone he [11:07] just [11:08] goes that's it he just made that noise [11:11] and right away I said oh yeah but we [11:13] could do a discount I could probably do [11:14] like 5K we could even take some off 50% [11:17] I could even take 75% since you're here [11:19] here and I have to do this it just made [11:21] up excuses and I almost got to the point [11:23] where I was like let me pay you I'll [11:26] give you some money if you come let me [11:28] speak on stage for you [11:29] and that's collapse so that's I'm in [11:32] collapse in some areas of my life I [11:34] might posture in some areas of my life [11:36] and our goal is to get out of that swing [11:39] but the problem most people have if I'm [11:41] living in collapse the solution looks [11:45] like [11:46] posturing and we see this in like guys [11:48] that learn pickup like I'm going to [11:50] learn how to posture because it's the [11:52] opposite of what I'm doing it's not the [11:53] center where I need to be and what is [11:56] the center that's that's composure that [11:58] would be composure and I would say [11:59] composure is a combination of the things [12:02] that make up authority and authority is [12:04] made up of five things and that's [12:07] confidence discipline leadership [12:09] gratitude and enjoyment so I have an [12:13] Authority inventory this is day one the [12:15] first thing that I give to intelligence [12:17] people or I've got a guy that owns a car [12:20] dealership whoever the client is and [12:23] it's the authority assessment it [12:24] assesses you on those things and [12:27] wherever your lowest point is that's [12:29] what's keeping you from being successful [12:31] in most conversations when you need to [12:33] persuade somebody and it pinpoints it [12:36] very quickly and if I could go into this [12:39] a little further um the way that we live [12:42] our lives off camera I'm sure you would [12:44] agree you just had Vanessa van Edwards [12:46] on uh it it bleeds out in our body [12:49] language it bleeds out in not just body [12:51] language but how we breathe how we talk [12:53] how we come across so even if I read [12:57] that article on LinkedIn of 19 ways to [12:59] look more confident and it says well [13:01] have better posture sit up straighter [13:03] shake hands make better eye contact I [13:06] did all of that and I look really [13:08] presentable but back home I've got a 8ot [13:11] pile of laundry sitting in the bedroom [13:14] my bed's nasty I've got dishes all piled [13:16] up in the sink there's a part of our [13:18] brain that's somehow dedicated to [13:21] reminding us I'm faking it right now and [13:24] that comes across so whether we're doing [13:27] it consciously or uncons consciously [13:29] we're manufacturing gut feelings in [13:31] other [13:32] people so our job is to manufacture [13:35] better gut feelings and the five most [13:38] common ways that those bleed out in our [13:40] everyday life is how we manage five [13:43] areas of our life and that is our [13:44] environment like do I take care of my [13:47] environment my uh time [13:53] appearance my social life and my [13:57] financial life because those are the [13:59] those are the five things we worry about [14:01] in the back of our head that start [14:03] bleeding out these gut feelings because [14:04] we've all had a conversation where [14:06] everything on the surface looked great [14:09] but afterwards we were like something [14:11] was off I don't know what it was but [14:13] something just didn't feel right about [14:15] that guy and we've all had that little [14:17] experience [14:19] and getting a hold of your those five [14:23] qualities that make up Authority are the [14:24] fastest way to get success in your life [14:27] and just drastically start changing your [14:29] life so it's really that the [14:31] controllable element it's our [14:33] environment our time our appearance our [14:34] social life and our finances that's the [14:36] like controllable Foundation to all [14:37] these other things um that we talked [14:40] about yeah so that would be the the [14:41] bottom Foundation of that little pyramid [14:44] and the far left side of that triangle [14:47] would be confidence discipline [14:49] leadership gratitude and enjoyment yeah [14:51] and those elements alone produce [14:54] feelings in other people that make them [14:56] see an authority figure and you've heard [14:58] of the milgrim [14:59] experiment oh gosh it reminds me of [15:01] something I read when I was 16 in [15:03] Psychology class in a textbook probably [15:05] did that was the one where they got [15:07] people to shock each other yeah please [15:09] explain all right let me give you a [15:10] quick recap it's Yale University I think [15:13] it's [15:14] 1962 and Yale runs an ad in the paper [15:17] says come help us with this study on [15:19] learning and we'll give you 20 bucks or [15:21] lunch voucher or something like that so [15:23] all these volunteers come out and [15:26] there's a tall guy in a lab coat and a [15:29] official clipboard there and there's one [15:31] other volunteer and you draw straws one [15:33] of you is the teacher one of you is the [15:34] learner so you're led into this room you [15:37] watch this learner guy get strapped up [15:39] he's on this table getting strapped up [15:41] to this electric shock machine and every [15:44] time he gets a question on this quiz [15:46] wrong you've got to shock him you have [15:48] to hit the button and every Progressive [15:51] question you increase the voltage on [15:53] this machine that goes all the way up on [15:55] the far right to xXx danger severe shock [15:59] is what it says on [16:00] there but the whole time you're shocking [16:02] him the you can hear the guy screaming [16:05] on the other side of the wall he's [16:06] screaming and Midway through the process [16:08] the guy's banging on the wall he's like [16:10] I have a heart condition I don't want to [16:11] do this anymore I'm out I quit I don't [16:13] want to do the experiment and 90% of [16:16] these people will turn around to the guy [16:17] in the lab coat and the guy in the lab [16:18] coat is like please continue it's [16:20] important that you continue the [16:22] experiment so they keep going and going [16:24] and almost to the end no more [16:27] response it's just silence the guy [16:29] doesn't even respond to questions and [16:31] the guy in the lab coat says any [16:33] non-answer has to be [16:35] treated as if it were an incorrect [16:37] answer please continue and they keep [16:40] going and going and going and you you [16:42] can watch some some of these are on [16:44] video and you just watch this their [16:47] faces toward the [16:49] end these psychiatrists at the beginning [16:51] of this predicted less than 1% would go [16:55] all the [16:56] way 67% of people will go all the way [17:00] and 250 volts is enough to kill you 100% [17:04] went up to 250 the presence of novelty [17:08] and Authority did [17:10] everything it made a person commit [17:12] murder and that's I would say I would [17:14] argue that's more difficult than selling [17:17] someone a [17:18] car and that Authority comes in that [17:21] particular example came from going to [17:23] the university the lab coat Etc but how [17:25] do we establish Authority ourselves is [17:27] it going back to the things you said [17:29] there about environment appearance Etc [17:31] finances yeah is there like are are [17:33] there physical expressions of that [17:34] Authority in a day-to-day basis there [17:37] are slowness of movement is one of the [17:40] most common so we have slowness of [17:42] movement so the right side of that [17:43] Authority triangle has five letters on [17:46] it and that stands for movement [17:49] appearance confidence connection and [17:51] intent is our intent visible that [17:54] outward sign of authority is what a lot [17:56] of people tend to look for [17:59] what does Authority look like but what [18:01] we're really doing is I want to look up [18:04] the symptoms of authority not the cause [18:09] because we all these LinkedIn articles [18:11] YouTube videos that are saying how to [18:13] have more confidence how to do x y and z [18:16] are how to have the symptoms instead of [18:18] the cause of authority so people with [18:21] authority tend to sit up straight but [18:24] they don't sit up straight because they [18:25] read an article they sit up straight [18:27] because they see the world a certain way [18:29] and that's so much of a difference [18:32] between changing my world view versus [18:35] changing my posture that's very [18:37] different outcomes and we're still [18:38] generating those gut feelings in people [18:41] interesting have you worked with many [18:44] people that come to you and they've got [18:45] a clear Authority problem is there a [18:47] particular example you can think of [18:48] where you were able to help someone turn [18:49] their life around many hundreds give me [18:52] your favorite example my favorite [18:53] example was a big CEO he's in Los [18:57] Angeles [18:58] and he ask me for skills he starts off I [19:01] need I need the flight checklist I don't [19:03] need to learn to fly I just need the [19:04] checklist uh but it takes me a while to [19:07] kind of walk people back and say like [19:09] let's get to the root of this because [19:10] you can't just openly say you have an [19:12] authority and and comfort [19:14] problem [19:16] and his employees [19:19] would like openly make fun of him in [19:21] board meetings and stuff like that and [19:23] he didn't like it and it it his company [19:28] was going downhill so fast and I took [19:31] him through this process of gaining [19:33] let's let's build up your confidence [19:35] discipline leadership gratitude and [19:37] enjoyment all of those things and let's [19:40] find where your lowest point is of those [19:42] five if I could just find your lowest [19:44] point on that five list then I know the [19:48] highest leverage thing that I can do so [19:50] if the highest leverage that he can do [19:52] would be confidence that's the number [19:54] one thing I'm going to start working on [19:56] and the moment we took him through that [19:58] process say it was only a couple of [19:59] months and we used a lot of hypnosis we [20:01] used a lot of um I literally used [20:04] brainwashing techniques to help him so [20:06] it's the same techniques and you know [20:08] what uh cognitive behavioral therapy was [20:11] also a a form of brainwashing back in [20:13] the day and aversion therapy um but [20:17] within just a few months he went from [20:20] around I think 6 to 800k per month to [20:24] like 4 million a month all of his [20:26] employees were on board he he did he had [20:29] this huge shift the problem comes when [20:33] you're when you're a coach and you make [20:35] someone's life change that fast they [20:37] have to have an [20:39] excuse they can't go back to the office [20:41] and like they're different right so they [20:44] have to say some this thing happened to [20:45] me I had this thing so that's the first [20:47] thing I work out with every client is [20:48] like you need you're going to have to go [20:50] back and tell them something happened [20:51] that changed your life because you have [20:53] to have a reason that you're going back [20:54] different so watching that [20:57] transformation is so so so rewarding and [21:00] incredible but the confidence is usually [21:03] what you have to change first with [21:05] people how'd you do that you change how [21:09] what's going on inside their head so [21:11] you've gone on stage before probably a [21:13] thousand or 2,000 people you were on TV [21:15] for a [21:18] while even after you've been [21:20] successful have you ever even heard a [21:23] tiny voice that said why am I here or [21:26] like do I deserve to be here yeah I mean [21:28] this is a prime example of that yeah [21:30] yeah or I'm faking it people are going [21:33] to find out I'm I'm faking it well you [21:35] feel like that when you're a podcaster [21:36] because you you didn't get any official [21:38] qualifications and then people started [21:39] listening and then there's they think [21:41] that you know what you're doing or you [21:43] so I think I can tell that as a [21:45] podcaster yeah so and they never go away [21:48] so the difference between a person who's [21:50] confident and a person who doesn't have [21:53] confidence is that they hear those [21:55] voices as truth [21:59] and I hear them or somebody with [22:02] confidence hears them as [22:03] fiction they're both listening to the [22:05] same thing so imagine like as a quick [22:07] story if I if you and I were going to [22:09] lunch I said Stephen I'm going to come [22:11] pick you up I pull up in front of your [22:13] house you jump in the passenger side [22:16] we're heading off and I'm listening to [22:19] an audio book about a nuclear bomb going [22:24] off but it's inside the audiobook [22:26] there's a fake news report [22:29] about a nuclear bomb going off let's say [22:30] it's a pretend BBC broadcast or [22:32] something that's going off that it's in [22:34] the audiobook we start [22:36] driving I'm relaxed I'm focused on the [22:39] road I'm enjoying what I'm doing your [22:41] heart rate's increased you're fearful [22:43] you're a migdala is firing off you're in [22:45] this horrible state of like oh my God [22:47] what H what's going to happen to my [22:48] family we're both hearing the exact same [22:52] broadcast we're listening to the same [22:54] speakers at the same time but I know [22:57] that I'm hearing fiction [22:59] and you are worried that it's truth I [23:02] don't mean to use you as as that example [23:04] but [23:05] it's that's the easiest way to to [23:08] describe it and then just fundamentally [23:11] changing how you hear that voice and [23:15] nine times I think 10 times out of 10 [23:18] that voice was developed when you were [23:20] eight or nine what did that kid do and [23:23] this is what I would ask any of the [23:24] clients what did that kid do to make [23:27] friends or keep them so friends to feel [23:31] safe now we're in the safety like how [23:34] did I get to feel safe and what did I do [23:36] to earn rewards and for some people that [23:39] might be recognition for other kids who [23:42] had a bad start in life that might be [23:45] water or food might have been a reward [23:47] for those kids so the way that we keep [23:51] or earn friends the way that we get [23:53] rewards as a child and the way that we [23:55] feel what we have to do to feel safe [23:59] those develop as little apps in our [24:01] brain that run in the background of our [24:03] adult lives all the time and we [24:07] typically as a kid they're great they [24:09] might have kept us safe they might have [24:11] kept us alive they might have held us [24:12] inside of these Social Circles but I'm [24:14] going to be a dick to people so that [24:16] they don't get close to me or I'm going [24:18] to kiss up to authority figures like Mom [24:20] and Dad so I'll get some recognition and [24:23] praise and that becomes an app that we [24:27] carry into adulthood without knowing it [24:29] without our consent without our [24:30] awareness that little kid brings these [24:33] things into adulthood and they just [24:35] modify so I go from having to kiss up to [24:38] a narcissistic mother to I'm going to [24:42] I'm going to kiss the boss's ass every [24:44] single day and everybody knows me as the [24:46] office kiss ass so they just translate [24:51] from child to adult behavior and if I [24:54] can start understanding that then I can [24:56] start getting that person to understand [24:59] the fundamental way to change their life [25:01] and I make them put those phrases out in [25:04] the open to where it's so I want them to [25:07] be pissed off so I will make them get a [25:10] desktop wallpaper that says I don't [25:12] deserve money money is for other people [25:17] just just to make their brains see how [25:19] stupid it is on a regular basis and put [25:21] it on a motivational [25:22] poster and the second part of that [25:26] is I any anybody who's confident has a [25:30] generalized expectation of positive [25:32] outcomes not specific but things are [25:35] going to be fine things are going to be [25:36] fine so if I can do that you can [25:41] fundamentally change someone's life so [25:43] the final point of that which leads into [25:45] discipline is I need to get you to form [25:48] a relationship with your future [25:51] self because everything that goes into [25:54] on in our life has to do with our [25:55] mamalian brain this lower part of our [25:57] brain [25:58] here and it doesn't speak English [26:01] there's no affirmation that's going to [26:03] penetrate that barrier there's no like [26:06] I'm going to read a quote on a wall or a [26:09] PowerPoint slide that's going to [26:10] fundamentally change Behavior you have [26:12] to change the animal the Mamon part of [26:15] the brain so the question I ask [26:17] everybody that I'm training is how would [26:19] I teach it to a [26:21] dog how would I how would I show my [26:24] goals if I'm setting goals for next year [26:27] how would I show that to a dog cuz I [26:29] have to get it down to a mammal so the [26:32] fastest way to do that is through Visual [26:34] means so I have all of my clients [26:37] download this app I can't remember the [26:39] name of it there's probably a hundred [26:41] but it makes you look like [26:43] 95 yeah and you're just covered in [26:46] wrinkles it makes a lot of your hair [26:48] kind of go away and I make them print it [26:51] out and put it everywhere just for a [26:53] couple of weeks and now we start [26:55] developing a mental mamalian in [26:58] relationship with our future self which [27:00] changes how I eat changes how I spend [27:02] money it changes maybe what time I go to [27:05] bed how much alcohol I drink and mostly [27:09] uh where I'm getting my dopamine from if [27:11] I draw a map of everywhere I'm getting [27:13] my dopamine from and more than 50% of it [27:17] is on alcohol or porn or you know all of [27:21] these things that I don't want that's [27:23] you have to be very very honest with [27:25] yourself at that point of where do I [27:27] need to get dopamine front of in my life [27:30] and successful people every single [27:32] successful person that I've ever met has [27:35] a good dopamine map so they they get [27:37] dopamine from good sources instead of [27:39] bad ones and is there a relationship [27:41] between discipline and confidence I [27:44] think so very much it's like if if you [27:46] and I were sitting in an airport [27:48] together let's say we're sitting in [27:49] Atlanta airport and I just asked you [27:52] with and you're not a behavior profiler [27:54] as far as I know but I said Stephen look [27:57] around and find somebody that's [27:59] disciplined it would take you 5 seconds [28:02] because we don't need to to profile [28:04] people that's a natural thing that you [28:07] picked up on it on purpose but we pick [28:08] up on it unconsciously all the time so [28:11] having that level of discipline elevates [28:13] our level of confidence automatically [28:15] because we know that other people are [28:17] going to pick up on it but we also know [28:20] I'm moving up and I'm probably more in [28:22] control of myself than the person that [28:24] I'm talking to or the people that I'm [28:25] I'm dealing with regularly so so how we [28:28] live off camera is coming through in our [28:31] confidence that's the exact thing that [28:33] we were talking about that environment [28:35] time appearance and if I can live off [28:39] camera the same [28:40] way that I want to be perceived by [28:44] everybody in my life my confidence [28:45] already starts to [28:47] grow and you said enjoyment as well was [28:49] one of the five yeah why is enjoyment [28:52] important I added it on there it it took [28:55] a while but I walked through every body [28:58] I've ever trained and if you look at [29:00] everyone who is a natural leader and has [29:03] that level of authority they are not [29:06] just partying in the moment but just in [29:10] calmly enjoying what is happening now so [29:13] maybe you could call it mindfulness but [29:16] I think in just the trait of enjoyment [29:19] and being in enjoyment is the most [29:22] magnetic human trait that there [29:24] is what do I need to know about [29:26] observation which is the second part of [29:30] your triangle to success or [29:32] failure observation being able to read a [29:35] room is it possible to be able to read a [29:37] room yeah how would I go about reading a [29:39] room okay so if if you're reading like a [29:42] public area yeah let's go back to the [29:44] airport maybe yeah if I'm in a public [29:47] area I really want to pay attention to [29:49] the slowest moving person in the room I [29:52] want to pay attention to who is more [29:54] confident than the other person and [29:56] that's typically going back to speed and [30:00] if I'm if I'm reading other people well [30:03] I'm also making a lot of eye contact [30:05] with them so that's also one of the [30:08] fastest ways to get a read on another [30:10] human being is how often they're [30:12] blinking and if a person is blinking [30:16] fast it's a sign of high stress if [30:19] they're blinking really slow it's a sign [30:21] of focus so it's not always relaxation [30:25] so if I talk to a psychopath and a [30:28] interrogation room or in a business [30:30] negotiation and they're very focused on [30:32] prey so we call that a prey [30:35] Focus because they're going to [30:36] manipulate somebody their blink rate [30:38] will almost be at zero if I talk to [30:41] somebody who's being deceptive their [30:43] blink rate can go up to like a 75 80 [30:46] without us even knowing it so one of the [30:48] reasons that blink rate is so reliable [30:51] is that it's unconscious we don't [30:53] realize the shifts in blink rate and we [30:55] don't manually control it very well [30:58] and if all that I would ever need to [31:00] teach somebody you don't have to count [31:02] or know how many times per minute it's [31:03] going on is if I'm in a conversation I'm [31:07] going to start the conversation and say [31:08] is the blink rate normal does it look [31:11] fast does it look slow so what I'm [31:13] really looking for in human behavior are [31:16] changes changes so if I'm on stage and [31:19] if I'm let's say I'm doing a keynote and [31:22] across the room I'm making eye contact [31:24] with all these people and I start seeing [31:25] an increase in audience blink rate I I [31:27] know I need to change the subject or [31:29] change the topic right away so would you [31:32] be looking at one particular person no [31:35] so generally yeah so I would look at all [31:38] of these eyes and pretend like I'm [31:39] looking at one [31:41] human okay does that make sense getting [31:43] an average of the yeah so as I'm looking [31:46] around how many blinks do I see and I'm [31:47] going to pretend as if that was one [31:49] human eye okay so when you get a lower [31:53] blink rate people are paying more [31:55] attention yeah you're doing a great job [31:57] and you can I go to these pitch meetings [32:00] where these uh entrepreneurs will go up [32:01] and Pitch these Angel Investors and [32:03] stuff like that up in Washington and you [32:06] can measure who will pitch based on [32:08] blink rate you see a blink rate drop [32:11] that is the most interested person in [32:13] the room we do the same thing with jury [32:15] selection it's so reliable and you you [32:19] read these articles about like someone [32:21] breathing into their chest it takes a [32:23] while to get good at that with your [32:24] peripheral vision because I've taught it [32:27] to people and they would have spend a [32:28] conversation with someone staring at [32:30] their chest and especially if you're [32:32] talking to a woman it's a bad idea so [32:35] blink rate is incredibly reliable so to [32:39] recap that skill yeah I start a [32:41] conversation does it look pretty normal [32:43] is it pretty fast or kind of slow then [32:46] I'm going to look for changes and that's [32:47] all I'm looking for in a room of people [32:50] is what's [32:51] changing so 70 is deceptive and zero is [32:56] psychopath 70 is stress not always decep [33:00] okay and zero is psychopath basically [33:03] zero might be psychopath context is the [33:06] second letter C there's five C's that we [33:08] talk about in Behavior profiling so [33:11] change then context MH so now it like [33:14] somebody just crossed their arms and you [33:16] read the internet it says it's being [33:18] defensive withholding closed off see all [33:20] that stuff well what if it's freezing [33:22] cold yeah so now we have Contex so [33:24] interesting that actually happened in my [33:25] last conversation I um I try not to [33:27] close off my body when I'm doing this [33:29] cuz some sometimes my natural reaction [33:31] is to go like this and then sometimes [33:33] especially in here when it gets later [33:35] and we didn't have the fan in the heater [33:37] I would go like this yeah and what I'm [33:39] if like the I was thinking but this is [33:41] rude the rude to the guest but I looked [33:43] at my arms and I had these like massive [33:44] Goosebumps and I was like that's the [33:46] context yeah the context is I'm [33:48] freezing yeah but to the guest it would [33:50] look like I'm going like this yeah you [33:53] know so this is why body language is so [33:56] delicate I think is delicate and it's so [33:59] hard to for people to do peer-reviewed [34:01] research on it because there's a million [34:05] variables it's like saying well why [34:07] should Roger Federer win a tennis match [34:10] when he doesn't have any peer-reviewed [34:12] studies to back up what he's doing yeah [34:15] it's the same thing with body language [34:17] because like they're doing interrogation [34:21] research so they're saying that a [34:23] college kid who gets a lunch voucher and [34:26] walks in and pretends to to lie about a [34:29] duck is exactly the same as someone [34:31] who's been captured in combat sleep [34:34] deprived for a few days has a black hood [34:36] over their head and they're drugg into [34:37] an interrogation room and they're saying [34:39] those behaviors are identical then [34:41] there's the peer-reviewed research on [34:43] lying and not lying it's so you cannot [34:47] replicate human behavior that well so [34:49] and people treat it like it's a [34:51] pharmaceutical like I can put a Tylenol [34:53] in somebody and I can measure all these [34:55] responses and it doesn't really go into [34:57] aad spr sheet like that and there's a [34:59] lot of great research out there but I'd [35:01] say it's just so incredibly hard to [35:03] replicate everything in with perfection [35:06] like that so what was the first C first [35:09] C is change I want to look for a change [35:11] and then you want to look at context is [35:12] there a third C that would be clusters [35:15] clusters so then you read articles that [35:17] say [35:18] someone looks a certain way or does a [35:21] certain thing that might be deceptive [35:22] like the most common one I hear is [35:24] someone touches their nose so someone [35:26] touching their nose might be being de [35:27] cve if you're just seeing one [35:30] thing I would say that never almost [35:33] never means anything you want to look [35:35] for a cluster of behavior so they [35:37] started getting nervous which is a [35:38] change they're it's because I'm asking [35:41] about where they were on Wednesday night [35:42] there's the context and while they were [35:44] getting nervous they also started [35:46] protecting their genitals with their [35:47] hands and licking their lips which is a [35:50] hygienic gesture that we do so now I [35:53] have a change within the context that's [35:55] appropriate and there's a cluster of [35:59] Behavior after that I screen through [36:01] culture is there some part of this [36:02] person's culture or background uh that [36:05] makes them do that like I was with a [36:07] young person we were watching a [36:11] Pakistani person get inter interrogated [36:14] and you know how you you commonly see [36:16] that kind of headshake oh yeah in that [36:18] region of the world they said I was [36:20] shaking his head while he's saying yes [36:22] like now we get down to that sea this is [36:25] culture which rules out uh that Behavior [36:28] or gets rid of it and finally the most [36:30] the least important thing on that list [36:32] is the [36:33] checklist and by checklist I mean there [36:36] is a list of known behaviors that are [36:39] likely to be deception and if you're in [36:41] body language you deal in likelihood [36:43] that's all we deal in some people say [36:45] they're 100% sure on stuff and I'm [36:49] skeptical but we deal in likelihood so [36:52] we should always process in that so [36:54] someone licking their lips or moving a [36:57] certain way if it's in on a checklist [37:00] does not mean that it's deceptive MH cuz [37:03] what if they do it all the time then we [37:05] don't have a change does that make sense [37:07] yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I was thinking [37:08] about things I used to do when I was [37:09] younger and there was just a period of [37:11] my life where for some bizarre reason I [37:12] used to go like this and I used to do it [37:15] all the time a tick it was almost like a [37:17] tick yeah you know what's really weird I [37:18] think this sounds like a really crazy [37:19] thing to say [37:22] but one of my best friends had like [37:26] curtains [37:28] like the haircut curtains okay and he [37:30] used to flick it and I almost like [37:32] vicariously picked up the like flicking [37:33] from him I'd go like that all the time [37:36] but I was just thinking if someone saw [37:38] me doing that they would perceive that [37:39] as some some form of behavior whereas it [37:43] was just this weird thing that lasted [37:44] for like two years when I was younger [37:46] and then went away yeah but did you do [37:48] it all the time I just did it I oh I [37:50] don't know I felt like I just did it [37:51] randomly but that that wouldn't be a [37:53] change okay yeah if I if I was meting [37:56] you yeah and [37:58] you were on the Dragon's Den for a while [38:00] still yeah and people pitch you yeah all [38:03] kinds of [38:04] ideas that just having somebody on the [38:08] show or just having those skills with [38:10] you you could see through a lot of those [38:12] people and whether or not they're being [38:15] honest about what they're pitching [38:16] they're confident about what they're [38:18] pitching and you could look at a show [38:20] like Shark Tank and I can look at I can [38:23] watch any episode of Shark Tank and look [38:25] who's blinking the least MH they're [38:27] they're going to be the first to make an [38:28] offer 99% of the time because they're [38:31] the most focused on what's going on [38:33] they're they're personally [38:35] invested so that's fascinating is that [38:39] just you could just look at one or two [38:40] things and predict stress or focus and [38:46] just being able to do that if you just [38:48] took that one thing away from this that [38:50] would be a [38:51] superpower because I sit here with [38:53] guests right and they talk about their [38:54] life stories and stuff and I often see [38:56] some patterns of Behavior yeah [38:58] specifically like closing up when you [39:00] ask someone something about their [39:01] childhood or a specific sensitive [39:04] subject in their life you tend to see [39:06] like self I call it like self- soothing [39:08] Behavior to some degree so it's [39:10] difficult and it's funny because we [39:12] we're all like amateur body language [39:14] experts now yeah because there's been a [39:16] lot of stuff online saying spot this did [39:18] they touch their nose Etc so it can also [39:19] be dangerous it can and it can give us [39:22] these like oh I saw this one thing I'm [39:23] never doing business with that guy yeah [39:25] and like he scratched his nose three [39:27] times while he was talking about that [39:28] well he's look in his briefcase he's got [39:31] allergy medication in there he's [39:33] scratching his nose the season just [39:34] changed it Springtime his nose is red [39:37] when he came in so he's been scratching [39:38] it for 30 minutes before he walked in [39:41] the door so now we we start to realize [39:43] I'm not seeing a change I'm seeing [39:45] something that was repetitive and [39:48] communication is the third one in the [39:49] Triangle to success or failure [39:52] communication so what I've got so far is [39:54] talking slow is higher authority yeah is [39:57] there anything else that if I want to be [39:58] a master Communicator I should be [40:00] thinking about [40:02] absolutely [40:03] oh when it comes to communication a [40:06] being a good Storyteller is great and [40:08] there's a million podcasts out there [40:10] that can teach somebody that but it [40:13] comes down to whether or not you can [40:16] speak to the person that you are in [40:18] front of MH and understanding what kind [40:21] of person that is and there's a few ways [40:25] that I identify I I segregate people [40:27] into six groups and that's through what [40:31] do they need from other people so what [40:33] kind of things do I need [40:36] socially and these are [40:39] significance [40:41] acceptance [40:43] approval intelligence pity and strength [40:48] or SL [40:50] power and in every conversation if you [40:54] ask somebody about themselves they're [40:56] going to come across [40:58] and reveal one of those things to you so [41:01] if I know that you are a significance [41:04] driven person and I'm selling you on how [41:07] smart of an idea this is and how [41:10] intelligent you are for making this [41:11] Choice I'm [41:13] communicating way opposite in what you [41:15] need to hear so the moment that I hear [41:18] you talk about yourself your [41:19] accomplishments what you like in life [41:21] what happened for you this week what's a [41:23] great memory that you have every [41:26] conversation you're going to hear this [41:27] stuff starting to get revealed so you [41:29] hear somebody Within These are [41:31] conversation or things that you could [41:33] hear in a conversation pretty quickly [41:36] you start talking to somebody and they [41:37] said yeah I'm actually the CEO of that [41:40] company I've got 490 people that work [41:43] for me and I'm probably going to be [41:45] making an exit sometime next year so you [41:48] hear that there's significance right uh [41:51] then you then you listen for approval is [41:54] this is when you hear people say well I [41:55] got to go up on stage tomorrow Tom but I [41:57] suck at public speaking I'm going to I'm [41:59] going to really bomb at it I'm just [42:00] really nervous trying to get you to say [42:03] no no you don't suck you're great you [42:06] did great last time you're going to rock [42:08] this you got this then you have the [42:10] acceptance people they'll always use the [42:11] terms like we us our and just team so [42:17] acceptance people are all about like I'm [42:19] a member of some kind of group and [42:21] that'll come across in their [42:22] communication so you ask a significance [42:25] person about a vacation and they say I [42:27] went down to Miami it was fantastic I [42:29] had a great time and I just got back [42:31] last night you ask an acceptance person [42:32] they'll say we went down there all of us [42:35] went to this thing and we did this so [42:38] you hear a lot of this language that [42:39] talks about groups and membership you [42:41] get into the intelligence side how often [42:44] do you hear people go yeah I actually [42:45] got my MBA from this person oh I did my [42:48] Master's thesis on that do you hear this [42:51] intelligence stuff come out of people [42:53] and the pity is you can identify a Pity [42:56] person pretty well and those are the [42:58] hardest people to communicate to and the [43:01] pity person always like if I want to [43:03] give you the ideal thing to say to each [43:05] one of these people the pity person [43:07] wants to hear I can't believe all the [43:11] stuff that you've been through and [43:13] you've got to this point because I don't [43:16] think many people would have pity wants [43:18] recognition of [43:20] suffering and finally we have the [43:22] strength and power person and this isn't [43:25] always Biff from Back to the Future [43:28] so it's can be somebody who's a leader [43:30] in a company they want but they want [43:32] control so significance is do I make a [43:35] difference strength and power is do I [43:37] have control over other people these are [43:40] the everybody from like the leader who [43:43] kind of forces his way into the top to [43:45] the guy with the ridiculous jacked up [43:48] pickup truck that has like the plastic [43:50] testicles hanging off of the back of it [43:52] and once you understand what [43:54] categorization someone fits into how [43:57] would you show up in a way that's [43:59] effective in communicating with them say [44:01] for example if I'm talking to a [44:02] significance person yeah do I [44:05] just and and I'm trying to close a deal [44:07] with them or something do I Pander to [44:09] their significance is that yeah so [44:12] there's a few other types that we teach [44:14] intelligence people to identify there's [44:17] the six ways we make decisions and then [44:19] six ways that we have values which is [44:21] our end goal that we want but I want to [44:23] speak in a way that says this decision [44:26] is going to increase your level of [44:28] significance and I want to compliment [44:30] them on their level of significance [44:32] right before I ask them for something so [44:34] I could say You Stephen um this is a [44:37] great podcast you've got millions of [44:39] subscribers and it's obvious you make a [44:40] difference in so many people's lives and [44:44] you are a significance person so that [44:46] would be effective uh for you because I [44:48] know that you want to make the biggest [44:50] difference that you can and I want to [44:53] speak in a way that a speaks to their [44:55] needs and lets them know that I'm I am a [44:57] source for that but B that making this [45:01] decision whatever the whatever we're [45:03] talking about selling a car whatever is [45:05] going to increase your ability to get [45:08] that same need from other people so I [45:11] think if we did this together I think [45:12] the number one thing that's going to [45:14] happen right away is you're going to be [45:16] able to impact twice as many people [45:18] you're going to leave a much deeper [45:20] footprint on the world so I'm giving you [45:23] we're going to double your subscribers [45:25] or your listeners but not just that [45:27] you're going to make a bigger impact and [45:29] Legacy on the [45:30] world so every time I'm thinking about [45:33] needs always think in terms of [45:36] neurotransmitters so if I can compliment [45:39] someone on their need that's what we [45:40] need from other people so I'm giving [45:42] them like 500 million neurotransmitters [45:45] being released when they hear this so [45:48] it's not just that we [45:50] are kind of suffering and insecure and [45:53] all these things that we talked about a [45:54] minute ago we're also drug addicts [45:57] everybody we just need to identify the [45:59] drug that that person's addicted [46:03] to I was thinking about the pen I was [46:05] like I was going to ask you to if I'm [46:08] a if I'm an INT intelligence person and [46:11] you had to sell me the pen yeah how [46:14] would you go about that you know I think [46:17] there's a lot of people in the world out [46:19] there and I think most people just do [46:21] what other people do and I'm sure you [46:24] would agree there's so many idiots out [46:26] there that just get with the basic thing [46:27] I'm going to do this basic thing and [46:29] they don't really go outside the box [46:30] very often and every once in a while [46:34] there's you meet somebody who knows [46:37] higher quality things you and you meet [46:39] somebody who is able to see things at a [46:42] level different than other people and I [46:45] would talk about that intelligence while [46:48] subconsciously I'm associating all of [46:50] that with this this is different it's [46:51] Unique it's a pencil um but it's it's [46:55] not like other pencil it's not the basic [46:58] run-of-the-mill thing so I want to [46:59] present that in a way and I want to [47:01] start with a negative comment and this [47:03] is one of the most effective persuasion [47:05] strategies is to I'm going to negatively [47:08] associate something I don't want you to [47:10] have so let's say uh we're starting our [47:14] podcast and I'm I'm afraid Stephen's not [47:15] going to connect with me and I know that [47:17] you're significance [47:19] driven as we started out imagine if I [47:22] said something at the very beginning of [47:24] this podcast and I said Stephen [47:26] thanks for having me man and there's so [47:28] many people out there and when anytime I [47:30] say something negative in a conversation [47:32] I never want to gesture in between you [47:34] and me I always want to gesture away so [47:36] this is we're talking about other people [47:38] you know there's so many people out [47:39] there who [47:41] just don't really give back to the world [47:45] and they don't really have an interest [47:46] in helping other people and it's like [47:48] every time you meet one of those people [47:50] you sit down with them it's like all of [47:52] them have the same thing in common they [47:54] can't just stop and connect [47:57] when they sit down with [47:59] somebody so I'm demonizing a trait using [48:03] your [48:04] needs that I don't want you to have like [48:07] the inability to connect ah okay [48:10] interesting and you're consciously [48:12] pointing off to adjust it to it's others [48:15] not right until I said the word connect [48:17] and then I gestured between you and me [48:19] back and forth between both of us and [48:22] that word stop is a very powerful word [48:24] in the English language so when I that [48:27] it's like all of them have the same [48:28] quality to them they can't just [48:30] stop and fully connect with somebody [48:34] else that's a very subtle thing but I've [48:36] used your neurotransmitters I've used [48:38] your needs and I've I've got you to [48:40] agree you nodded your head [48:42] if agree that those people don't really [48:45] connect well with other people so that's [48:48] how powerful that stuff can be and you [48:50] can use the same thing in the in [48:52] reverse and I could I could say a [48:55] positive thing I could say you know [48:56] Stephen what's fascinating to me is I've [48:59] gone around the world I've met several [49:01] entrepreneurs I've met people who are on [49:03] TV and it's like you think that they are [49:06] just dismissive offand before you meet [49:09] them and it's incredible when you meet [49:11] these people it's like all of them have [49:13] this ability to just tune everything out [49:15] and just completely connect with [49:18] somebody and that would have the same [49:21] effect and what what's going on there [49:24] people we want [49:25] to be that person because it's positive [49:28] we want to live up to that expectation [49:31] set right so what I've done is I've [49:34] gotten you to say um as Chris Voss would [49:37] put it that's right okay but I've got [49:40] you to say that about who you are as a [49:42] person okay so now I'm not changing your [49:45] ideas I'm changing your [49:47] identity changing my Identity or yeah [49:50] because you've made an agreement about [49:51] who you are you've nodded your head okay [49:54] and if I wanted to take that further [49:57] I would I would make an admission first [49:59] and I'd say you know what I've had [50:00] social anxiety growing up and I'm [50:03] curious what is it that have you always [50:05] been able to just connect with everybody [50:07] you talked to or is this something that [50:08] you had to work [50:11] on oh was that a question yeah okay but [50:14] I know it's not a question Yeah Yeah [50:16] question the moment that you ask that [50:19] that you start to answer that question [50:21] you stepped you've made an agreement [50:22] about who you are as a person so if I [50:25] wanted somebody to be less close [50:27] off I might say you know I've spent my [50:29] whole life just worried about what other [50:31] people think and it it to I was 25 [50:33] before I got to a point where I was able [50:35] to open up have you always been this [50:37] open with people or did you have to work [50:40] on that so just any answer and no one's [50:44] going to give you an answer like [50:45] actually I'm just closed off I'm very [50:46] close-minded and that's maybe a 0.1% of [50:50] people so small agreements and none of [50:53] these are designed for people to take [50:56] word for word word I guess they can but [50:58] it's about the idea of getting someone [51:00] to comment on their own identity who [51:02] they are as a person is there anything [51:05] else as it relates to communication [51:06] that's especially important it's funny [51:09] that so many people are interested in [51:12] the communication part more so than the [51:15] listening part they want the flight [51:17] checklist yeah I was think of Julian [51:18] treasure who did the Ted Talk on how to [51:20] be a great speaker he told me he also [51:22] did a Ted Talk on how to be a great [51:24] listener no no one listened he said [51:26] everyone wanted to his one on speaking [51:28] has got like 35 million views but the [51:30] one on listening just no one's [51:32] interested in that but I'm I'm guessing [51:34] listening plays a pretty critical role [51:36] to being a great speaker yeah and [51:38] listening means I can identify who you [51:41] are and what the needs that are driving [51:43] you and the social needs and the the way [51:45] that you make decisions is that part of [51:47] the observation part yes [51:50] absolutely just listening to that means [51:52] that now I have the right words to use [51:54] for the communication and the right the [51:56] right understanding of what motivates [51:57] you as a person so if I'm a therapist [51:59] that makes me a better therapist if I'm [52:01] a hostage negotiator that makes me a [52:03] better hostage negotiator and if I'm a [52:06] suicide hotline operator that makes me [52:09] way better at my job because I'm [52:10] understanding exactly who I'm talking to [52:12] and my goal is to talk someone into [52:14] doing something that they normally would [52:16] not do you talk about this [52:18] elicitation yeah what is elicitation [52:21] it's a CIA technique right it is it was [52:23] originally came up with by this guy [52:25] named John Nolan and his book is no [52:27] longer for sale you have to get it on [52:29] eBay like it's hard to find but the book [52:33] is called confidential why isn't it no [52:35] longer for sale I think that he just [52:37] kind of pulled it off the shelf I'm not [52:39] sure okay so elicitation is about using [52:42] statements instead of questions and I'll [52:45] give you an example let's say you and I [52:48] walk into Whole Foods which is we're in [52:51] New York so it's probably a block away [52:53] somewhere we walk in there and there's [52:57] uh let's say there's a young lady [52:58] stocking [53:00] produce and you get in there and I say [53:04] all right Stephen your goal is to go [53:07] figure out how much she makes in 60 [53:09] seconds and you're not allowed to ask [53:10] any questions or be [53:14] awkward and that's tough right it's it [53:17] sounds really tough so if you went over [53:20] to her and and this is a a [53:23] generalization just to get you to [53:25] understand what elicitation is [53:27] and said heyy I'm trying to find the [53:29] baby carrots and she walks you over [53:31] there but while you're walking you say I [53:33] just read this article online it says [53:34] all Whole Foods employees just got [53:36] bumped up to $26 an hour that's [53:39] fantastic and she turns around goes [53:42] what no I I make [53:45] 17 so now she doesn't feel like she's [53:48] been pressed or questioned about how [53:51] much she makes she's correcting you mhm [53:53] or if you let's say you got into an Uber [53:56] tonight and you said I just read this [53:58] article that Uber drivers were one of [54:01] the top most highly [54:04] satisfied employees in the country [54:07] you're going to get a [54:08] correction and you're going to be like [54:10] what where did you read that so [54:13] triggering A need to correct the record [54:15] is one of the easiest ways to use [54:17] elicitation but it's only one another [54:20] one is just making a statement [54:23] afterwards and saying I bet you had some [54:25] interesting exper experiences doing that [54:27] or I can imagine that was challenging [54:30] statements are always going to be better [54:31] than asking pointed questions because a [54:34] person feels like they're volunteering [54:36] information the third layer of that is [54:40] disbelief so let's say I wanted to ask [54:43] if you just got back from vacation and I [54:46] didn't want to use any questions we [54:49] let's say we meet up for dinner or [54:50] something and I said see you look like [54:53] you just got back from a vacation [54:56] that's a statement and you're like no [54:58] actually I've been doing this this this [54:59] and this so now you've you've given me [55:02] more than if I just asked if you were on [55:04] vacation MH and I said wow that had to [55:07] be interesting I I can't imagine that [55:10] there's got to be a lot of stuff going [55:11] on there and you start talking more and [55:13] more and more and then like that sounds [55:17] great there was no challenges to that [55:19] entire trip I love when everything is [55:22] 100% Flawless and you're like no [55:24] actually and then you start going into [55:26] that and I'm like no way then now we [55:28] have disbelief that comes in and I [55:30] haven't asked a single question yet so [55:33] that's one thing that I challenge [55:34] everybody that I train to get really [55:36] good at is that elicitation piece how [55:38] many layers can I get into a person or a [55:43] conversation just using these statements [55:46] and that's why I wrote a there's a whole [55:48] chapter about it in in this book here [55:51] but that elicitation is powerful [55:54] because we're not being asked questions [55:56] so our brain doesn't set off little [55:58] security alarms and this is how Soviet [56:01] spies would get information from a [56:04] 19-year-old US Navy [56:06] sailor uh in the early days of the Cold [56:09] War they s ship would pull into Thailand [56:12] or submarine would pull into Thailand or [56:14] Singapore and a Russian would go up and [56:16] these Sailors would be drinking at the [56:18] bar Russian would sit there he's got a a [56:21] loha shirt on or [56:22] something and strike up a conversation [56:25] they say [56:27] I know that the the German submarines [56:29] could outrun you because their [56:30] propellers are 22 and all of your [56:32] submarine propellers are 18 fet in [56:34] diameter and the Sailor slightly drunk [56:36] turns around and say no they're not and [56:39] starts giving up all this information [56:41] just to correct the record and that's [56:43] all they did back then was just [56:45] correcting the record I'm triggering [56:47] this need to offer some kind of [56:48] Correction to information that's [56:50] inaccurate and even with business [56:54] intelligence let's say the a company's [56:56] moving and they have to get business [56:57] intelligence somebody at that company [56:59] will get approached at a bar and [57:01] somebody will say yeah I heard you guys [57:03] are moving between March and [57:05] April and they'll get corrected in they [57:07] say no it's actually February but we're [57:09] not really supposed to talk about it [57:10] it's like there's no way you're going to [57:11] move in February it's too cold and the [57:14] interest rates are up too high there's [57:15] no possible way that the CEO would ever [57:17] do that it's like yeah and then you're [57:19] going you're going to get more [57:20] information out because of the disbelief [57:23] so that was correcting the record a [57:25] second technique called bracketing where [57:27] I'm giving you a series like between [57:29] March and may or between 39 and 59 and [57:33] the third is the disbelief that starts [57:36] getting this information out of people [57:38] so if you want to think about like how [57:40] do I start a conversation or continue [57:42] one using elicitation think of the words [57:45] so and then do a recap so you've been [57:48] doing this for three years or so this is [57:51] not the best job but it's getting things [57:52] done for you or I bet so I bet that was [57:56] I bet there were still some challenges [57:58] there I bet you overcame a whole lot to [58:00] get to this point so or I bet is the [58:02] best way to do that and when okay so if [58:04] I say I bet you hate that coffee yeah [58:08] that that's a statement but you're gonna [58:10] Endeavor to correct the record either [58:12] way yeah and if you do hate the coffee [58:16] you'll say yeah like even you saying yes [58:20] I do kind of hate it is offering up [58:21] information yeah okay interesting and [58:25] you could even go go on with that like I [58:28] bet you hate that coffee and somebody [58:29] says yeah well I do kind of hate it like [58:31] I can imagine you're the kind of person [58:32] who likes coffee a very specific way [58:35] well yeah here's how I like it a lot and [58:37] say that's extremely [58:41] interesting no creamer no sugar and I'm [58:44] just recapping so why is that better [58:47] than me just [58:48] going how' you prefer your coffee well [58:52] if we're just talking about coffee it's [58:53] not sensitive information so I wouldn't [58:55] I wouldn't say that was better it's for [58:57] sensitive information when you're trying [58:58] to not get their guard up yeah so the [59:00] rule of thumb is the more sensitive the [59:02] information is that you need the less [59:04] questions you need to be asking and is [59:06] that what I mean that's does correlate [59:08] to kind of like how I've uh the [59:11] information that the spies I've [59:12] interviewed have given me like Andrew [59:14] Bustamante and Mike Baker they've both [59:16] said that much of the game was like [59:19] hearing someone out and just letting [59:20] them talk and talk and talk and talk [59:23] yeah but not being too pushy yeah and [59:25] that's that's the best way to not be [59:27] pushy is to use the elicitation stuff [59:30] perception context permission the PCP [59:33] model is a way of understanding how to [59:35] get someone to do something from joining [59:37] a cult to buying an item yeah so the PCP [59:42] model looks like it's three steps but [59:45] it's I I want you to view it as kind of [59:47] dominoes so one step starts the progress [59:51] of coming down the other and once that [59:52] comes down the next Domino starts going [59:54] down m so if I change your perception [59:57] about [59:59] something then I change the context that [60:01] you're viewing that in which changes the [60:04] way that you feel permission to do it so [60:06] I'll give you an example would you want [60:07] a weird example or a boring one we we'll [60:11] go with let's go with weird Okay so [60:13] let's go with uh an [60:16] attorney in Washington state [60:20] was charged with assault of a woman [60:26] using [60:27] hypnosis and he would have her get naked [60:31] in his [60:32] office which is something she would not [60:34] normally do [60:36] and the attorney was studying this [60:39] hypnosis and stuff like that he wasn't I [60:41] don't as as far as I know he was not [60:42] even [60:43] good but he would hypnotize her and then [60:46] tell [60:47] her at the end of the day you come home [60:50] from work and this is just like that [60:52] time I want you to picture yourself it's [60:54] the end of the day you're coming home [60:56] from work you drop your keys in the bowl [60:59] you make your way to the bathroom you [61:00] turn on a hot shower and now you're here [61:03] getting ready to get into that shower so [61:06] he's changed her perception of where she [61:08] is he changed the context of neither one [61:11] of you or me right now would like get [61:13] naked on a podcast but both of us are [61:15] going to later tonight when we go to [61:17] shower so but because that's a different [61:19] context so he modified the context which [61:23] gave her permission to remove clothing [61:26] or do something that we otherwise [61:28] wouldn't do in a social [61:30] setting one of the ways I studied this [61:34] and it was fascinating is cult [61:37] recruiters I spent a a long time well [61:40] six weeks working with these cult [61:42] recruiters and I was back and forth [61:44] between cult recruiters and door-to-door [61:46] salespeople and these are hard-hit [61:48] people man that it's a hard job door [61:50] to-door [61:51] sales but they talk people into doing [61:55] things they probably [61:56] wouldn't otherwise have done M uh [61:59] installing a [62:01] $95,000 solar system on their roof or [62:05] buying a vacuum cleaner or joining a [62:07] cult that's probably [62:09] harmful but all of them started off the [62:12] conversation by changing the perception [62:14] of what's going on so instead of me [62:17] saying hey let me talk to you about this [62:19] thing that's from a like a needy [62:21] perspective they come out with a [62:24] survey and they say it's it's an [62:26] anonymous survey which automatically [62:28] makes the people more open so it's an [62:32] anonymous survey I've changed permission [62:34] so now the context has shifted slightly [62:38] and if I could change your perception [62:39] again would you rather be in a group of [62:42] people who feel like family or people [62:44] who are related to you so I start asking [62:47] all these little questions about how [62:49] would you rather lived your life in a [62:51] way that's like just kind of nudging you [62:53] down into this cult mindset of like do [62:56] you want to be around people that enjoy [62:58] your company like those kind of [63:00] questions so more perception changes now [63:03] the context shifts to where I've just [63:05] made 25 agreements about who I am as a [63:09] human [63:10] being so now my my context is way off [63:14] which shifts my permission it's like I [63:16] have permission to do this because [63:18] that's the kind of person I've just [63:19] agreed to be and that's who I've said [63:21] that I am I have to do this because [63:23] that's cognitive dissonance like crazy [63:25] and one thing I teach you about any [63:27] persuasion whether you're doing a scop [63:28] on an entire country or you're just [63:31] manipulating one person or doing therapy [63:34] on one person your main weapon as a [63:38] person who is persuasive or influential [63:41] is cognitive dissonance which is I'm [63:44] getting you to be uncomfortable because [63:47] I'm get the way that I've got you to see [63:48] the world doesn't match up with what [63:50] you're doing so the fast easiest thing [63:53] for you to change is what you're doing [63:54] instead of changing your mind about [63:56] something or calling yourself dumb I [63:58] just get you to do something different [64:00] and that's weaponized cognitive [64:02] dissonance we're seeing a lot of that [64:04] with the extreme left extreme right [64:06] Politics on both both of those extremes [64:09] once I get a person to [64:11] make even one or two or three statements [64:14] about their identity I have drastically [64:17] altered how they're going to behave in [64:18] the future uh Robert [64:21] chalini who wrote influence and [64:24] persuasion wonderful human being wrote [64:28] about this where a few [64:31] weeks before they go ask somebody to put [64:34] a giant ugly sign in their yard that [64:36] says drive safe huge ugly sign two weeks [64:40] before that they go back door to door [64:42] and say do you support safe driving yes [64:44] or [64:44] no who's going to say no it's like 91% [64:48] said yeah yeah I support safe driving [64:50] they said good will you put this tiny [64:52] sticker in your front window tiny little [64:55] sticker and just to let us know that [64:57] you're supporting safe driving that's [64:59] all we all we ask you to do two weeks [65:02] later they come back to the neighborhood [65:05] like 89% of people are sticking these [65:08] signs in their yard the other [65:09] neighborhood they did the test on didn't [65:11] have this little survey do you support [65:13] safe driving first and it was like 6% [65:17] stuck the sign in their yard so making [65:20] one agreement about who I am and then [65:22] taking action on it so if I can get you [65:25] to take AC ction on something not in [65:26] just between you and me now I got you to [65:29] put a sticker on your window I got you [65:32] to do something that alters the way [65:33] other people see you so if I can get you [65:36] to make something that I've got you to [65:39] believe public I get you to make a [65:41] Twitter post I get you to make a [65:43] Facebook post now I've captured identity [65:46] so most persuasion and influence [65:48] training in the world is about capturing [65:50] ideas identity is where you truly get to [65:53] change Behavior because I'm getting you [65:55] to agree that you are a certain type of [65:57] person before I want you to do [65:59] anything [66:01] interesting it explains a lot about [66:03] politics in fact you know what we what [66:06] we see go on in the election cycles and [66:07] also just how a a political party [66:10] political group can slowly [66:13] drift together to a position that [66:18] objectively go blood L that's crazy yeah [66:21] you know because they kind of slowly [66:22] they say I'm this party I signed up to [66:24] this this particular political party and [66:27] then slowly just with like creep of [66:29] beliefs you end up over 10 years all of [66:32] you believing in thinking something is [66:34] okay yeah it's interesting just because [66:37] you made an agreement I guess in part [66:39] that explains some of the wars as well [66:41] like there's an element here which can [66:44] be can explain things like Nazi Germany [66:47] yeah and how a civilization can go from [66:50] being relatively normal to doing really [66:54] horrific barbaric things to people yeah [66:56] if you just going back to the milgrim [66:58] experiment right away I got you to say [67:01] do you fully volunteer to participate in [67:03] this would you accept the role of [67:05] teacher would you sit down in this chair [67:08] would you shock him with this low [67:10] voltage I've got you to agree that I'm [67:13] the kind of person that's willing to [67:15] shock someone for an experiment within [67:16] the first two minutes MH and they don't [67:19] talk about that they they kind of tend [67:20] to say the whole experiment is about [67:22] Authority but I don't think it's all [67:25] authority I think a lot of it is novelty [67:27] and they don't talk about that ever in [67:29] the these Recaps of the study but if you [67:32] volunteer for that experiment you're [67:34] driving on a campus youve probably not [67:36] been on going into a building you've [67:38] never been to meeting a guy in a lab [67:40] coat that you've never met and another [67:42] guy you've never met in a room that [67:43] you've never met sat in front of a [67:44] machine you've never seen reading a quiz [67:46] that you've never read in your entire [67:48] life all of these things brand new the [67:52] number one thing that generates focus in [67:55] the Alan brain this is dog you name it [67:59] is [68:01] novelty so our ancestors they're walking [68:04] past a bush every day of their life and [68:07] one day Sun's about to set and a stick [68:09] snaps behind that bush that's novelty [68:13] that's an unexpected piece of [68:14] information new information or is it [68:17] unexpected yeah what's your definition [68:18] of novelty here novelty is my brain is [68:22] expecting certain things to happen I'm [68:24] going to walk past this bush just like [68:26] I've done before I have kind of a script [68:27] for running things and something happens [68:30] that breaks that script of what I am [68:32] predicting about the world does that [68:35] make sense yeah any kind of novelty [68:37] generates Focus so the four things that [68:40] we can manipulate inside of a human [68:42] brain uh spells out the word fate so the [68:46] four ways to manipulate or influence a [68:50] mammal and this is human dog you name it [68:55] is through Focus [68:58] Authority [69:00] tribe and [69:02] emotion those are the four things that a [69:05] dog could feel if you're looking at a [69:06] dog training video you're [69:09] watching let's say you're binge watching [69:11] three seasons of dog whisperer with [69:13] Caesar Milan you're seeing him redirect [69:15] Focus establish Authority show contact [69:18] with the tribe and praise the dog when [69:21] the dog's doing well Focus Authority [69:23] tribe and emotion that's how we train [69:26] animals it's also how an infomercial [69:28] gets you to buy something they grab your [69:31] focus they show you here's [69:33] a a million people who've already bought [69:36] it so far they all have these five-star [69:38] reviews everybody in your neighborhood's [69:40] doing it or all these people across the [69:41] United States are doing it they're [69:42] getting success and all of their friends [69:45] love them because of that success now we [69:46] get emotion and they show it visually [69:49] they don't just say it they're showing [69:51] this visual images to show the mammal [69:54] brain the f Focus Authority tribe and [69:56] emotion that spells fate I was thinking [69:58] about a lot of like um fizzy drink ads [70:02] in the Su in the sunshine in the summer [70:04] and you see you know like the you hear [70:06] the sound like as they like break it [70:08] open there's people there I guess that's [70:10] the tribe having a great time and I was [70:13] just struggling with the authority part [70:15] in that context of those ads you see for [70:17] like a fizzy drink brand I think the [70:19] authority would be the on screen [70:21] presence or brand recognition okay or [70:24] could be a celebrity or something yeah [70:27] and this is coming from a tribal leader [70:30] as if our ancestors didn't listen to a [70:31] tribal leader you don't live very long [70:35] in your work you talk about how to win [70:36] an argument and when I say win an [70:38] argument I don't really mean an argument [70:39] I mean more like you know me and my [70:41] girlfriend are having a conversation [70:43] yeah and I want to get to a good [70:46] resolution what are the things I should [70:48] definitely not [70:49] do calling out little [70:52] points that any kind of in correct [70:55] information we wait until the end we [70:57] save it okay so if I hear if I'm in an [71:00] argument with someone and they're [71:01] calling me out for doing something I [71:03] clearly didn't do I'll wait I want to [71:05] wait why because they get diffused now [71:08] we want them to get that out [71:11] first but right away as soon as possible [71:13] in any argument like this I want to [71:15] establish [71:17] like do we have a similar Common Ground [71:20] do we have what common ground do we [71:23] share and do we want a similar outcome [71:25] and I might even ask that question be [71:26] like really quick do we both want the [71:29] same thing from from this discussion I [71:31] would never call it an [71:33] argument so one the moment that we [71:36] redirect [71:37] on I this is the outcome I want instead [71:39] of I need to win an argument because [71:41] when we're in a fight we tend to think I [71:44] intellectually need to conquer this [71:46] conversation and I need to be right and [71:49] if I can be right that means I was right [71:53] not winning an argument doesn't mean you [71:54] were right before before or right after [71:57] but it's like what is the ideal outcome [71:59] for both of us and I would stop in a [72:00] business negotiation or whatever what's [72:02] ideal for both of us we both want this [72:05] same thing and the ideal outcome for you [72:08] is this the ideal outcome for me is this [72:10] and I think there's some Middle Ground [72:12] here and it would be the same thing in a [72:14] relationship if anything started [72:16] spinning out of control the first thing [72:18] I'm going to think is I'm going to [72:21] hear what's not being said so if my wife [72:26] was [72:27] saying you don't even need to call me [72:29] you don't call me anyway when you're on [72:31] these business trips I never get phone [72:32] calls do you think she is worried that [72:36] her phone isn't ringing or she's worried [72:37] that she's not being appreciated and and [72:40] not feeling loved [72:43] so men especially will will tend to say [72:47] well let's let's open these facts really [72:48] quick pull your phone out I'm going to [72:50] show you some Miss calls right now it's [72:52] not about the calls I need to hear [72:54] what's underneath the statements that [72:56] someone is saying you need to hear [72:58] between the lines just like a behavior [73:00] profiler so what is the what's the [73:03] emotion that's starting here is it anger [73:06] is it loneliness is it feeling [73:08] unappreciated I need to understand what [73:10] the emotion is behind what someone's [73:12] saying and address that and never [73:15] address exactly what people are saying [73:17] to try to win an argument I just posted [73:20] a video on YouTube U three days ago of [73:24] it was called the n narcissist off [73:26] switch and it was how to disarm any [73:30] narcissist and there were these very [73:32] specific methods but the the biggest [73:35] method of all was to always think about [73:38] what they're are using to get out of you [73:41] so if I'm in an argument is someone [73:43] using fear obligation or guilt and that [73:47] acronym spells [73:49] fog so am I going to get in trouble or [73:52] can I recognize when somebody is using [73:55] fear obligation and guilt and if someone [73:58] is doing any of those things I want to [74:00] call it out in a non-confrontational way [74:03] so let's say [74:04] um you give me some line about like if [74:07] you don't do this I'm going to have to [74:08] work 19 hours next week so it's never [74:12] about the hours and it's now it's guilt [74:14] right M I could say Stephen [74:17] it maybe you didn't mean to but it [74:20] sounded like you wanted me to feel [74:22] guilty about me working next week and I [74:24] know know that you're a good person I [74:26] don't think you meant it that way so I [74:28] will absolutely call out any fear [74:30] obligation or guilt always but I'll call [74:33] it out in a way that says maybe you [74:35] didn't mean this but it sounded like [74:38] this is what you were saying right here [74:40] and I always want to use that word where [74:42] it's non-confrontational and I want to [74:44] give them an out so in interrogation [74:47] training we always call this the golden [74:49] bridge in The Art of War they say give [74:51] your opponent a golden bridge on which [74:54] they can can Retreat mhm so they can [74:57] Retreat across this golden bridge and [74:59] trap them in a corner yeah so we give [75:01] them an out that's beautiful so maybe [75:03] you didn't mean this and I always want [75:05] to think about going back to that what [75:07] is the hidden feeling or fear that's [75:10] behind what they're saying they're [75:12] scared of something they're scared of [75:14] losing a deal they're scared of losing [75:15] money they're scared of looking a [75:18] certain way they're scared of what the [75:20] people in the room are going to think so [75:22] where is the hidden fear in someone's [75:24] argument any anytime you're in an [75:25] argument there is a level of concealed [75:28] fear and just 30 40 seconds you can find [75:32] that and a lot of people teach this as a [75:35] tactic but just stopping and looking at [75:38] a person after they do that in an [75:40] argument is so incredibly powerful just [75:43] stopping and looking at them yeah so [75:46] like say you made that statement to me [75:48] about I'm G to have to work 19 hours [75:49] next [75:51] week the moment that I stop it lessens [75:54] the power [75:55] of that statement because I'm not [75:57] stopping as a tactic I'm choosing to [76:00] stop because I want to process what you [76:01] are saying and that helps people to do [76:04] that because it feels less awkward as if [76:06] I'm doing a tactic I'm doing that thing [76:09] but I'm just pausing because I'm going [76:11] to actually reflect on what you just [76:13] said and I'm going to use that time for [76:14] just a minute I might look away I might [76:17] as soon as you're done talking I might [76:21] say and I might just take a moment and [76:25] say Stephen it's maybe I heard this [76:28] wrong and go right into that so that [76:30] long pause is so effective in [76:32] conversation especially when it's [76:33] meaningful and it's not a tactic what is [76:37] the most important thing we haven't [76:38] talked about that we should have as it [76:40] especially as it relates to what most [76:41] people ask you about and they're most [76:42] interested in well what is one thing [76:45] that no one's ever asked you on a [76:47] podcast what is one thing no one's ever [76:48] ask me [76:50] yeah people don't really ask me stuff [76:52] well who are you and what is your [76:54] mission [76:55] oh you're doing something on me I'm not [76:57] doing something unless you were doing [76:59] something to me I would love to [77:02] know and why don't you answer that and [77:04] I'll break down the hidden statements [77:07] that you're going to reveal about your [77:09] personality okay uh who am I [77:13] uh uh I'm a podcaster I'm an [77:17] entrepreneur I'm an investor I'm a [77:20] boyfriend and what's my mission [77:25] H it's to pursue my potential and to [77:27] follow my curiosity and to see what [77:30] happens all right yeah [77:34] so that's a great answer but you went [77:37] deeply into who you are as a person so [77:39] the first thing you did is look up and [77:41] to your right yeah then you looked up to [77:43] your left then up into the center so [77:45] that when your eyes are moving in [77:46] multiple directions is called a trans [77:48] derivational search so I'm looking in [77:50] different file cabinets that are inside [77:52] my head yeah and then then you talked [77:55] about some of the labels that you wore [77:57] yeah and podcaster was first but you [78:00] mentioned boyfriend so I know what's [78:02] important to you so like the podcast you [78:04] don't say I'm a TV star but most people [78:07] would identify you as as a TV star but [78:09] it wasn't important to you yeah it's not [78:11] important to me right yeah so you could [78:13] hear what's important to people [78:15] interesting and then the mission was not [78:17] about other people it was about like how [78:20] can I make myself better you may be [78:23] doing that to enrich other people's Liv [78:25] but you didn't say I have a podcast so I [78:28] can [78:29] benefit 10 million are you about to hit [78:31] 10 million yeah it's interesting because [78:33] I actually my brain like it was right [78:37] there to say that and then I thought [78:39] it's just not the nature of the truth [78:42] like the truth is I started this in my [78:44] bedroom and I always think about the [78:46] fact that when I did it for three years [78:47] no one was listening so my mission when [78:49] I was doing it was genuinely because I [78:52] really loved it yeah it wasn't like I'm [78:53] going to change the world and it's so [78:55] tempting sometimes to like add that on [78:57] like I want to change the world and I [78:59] just don't I don't believe that's why [79:01] most people start things and continue [79:03] when no one's listening yeah I think [79:05] it's it's usually something more selfish [79:07] does that make sense yeah you started [79:09] something and you were passionate about [79:11] the thing itself enjoyed the thing yeah [79:14] yeah yeah I love that that was a [79:19] licitation oh okay what you just did [79:21] then well three I think I did three [79:23] layers okay [79:25] but it's very very genuine and a lot of [79:28] people get to the subscriber thing I'm I [79:31] think I'll hit a million in a week or [79:33] two which is a huge milestone for me I [79:35] never thought I would have a million [79:38] but that was never important on your [79:41] main channel on uh the behavior panel [79:44] it's me and three other Behavior [79:46] profilers ah yes that's incredible yeah [79:49] it's amazing licitation that was a [79:52] elicitation good job [79:56] so we just record zooms don't edit them [80:00] at all I've seen it I know I'm I was [80:02] just trying to meiss it so [80:05] sloppy so you sorry you were doing like [80:07] a read of me you said I said podcaster I [80:09] said entrepreneur I said invester and [80:11] then I said I do it to like I think I [80:13] said um so your gos curiosity and then I [80:18] was the other one it was like it was [80:19] about my potential that's what I think [80:21] about a lot like pursue my potential and [80:23] follow my curiosity yeah [80:25] see what happens so potential curiosity [80:28] what would I see there so I'm a [80:29] podcaster I did this for passion I want [80:31] my I want to fulfill my potential am I [80:34] seeing I'm not seeing [80:36] acceptance I'm not seeing that you need [80:38] approval from me to do anything so it's [80:41] about your personal level of [80:43] significance like do I make a difference [80:46] but not to other people but you still [80:48] want people to acknowledge that you are [80:49] Reaching Your Potential you are doing [80:52] what you say you're going to do you're [80:53] relying on your girlfriend so we're [80:55] talking about a little bit of a group [80:57] but all of what you're saying is about [80:59] significance so when I say like you make [81:01] a tremendous difference in people's [81:03] lives and you're really enriching other [81:04] people you're doing exactly what you're [81:06] born to [81:09] do it hits harder than if I said lots of [81:13] people appreciate you and you're in so [81:15] many great Social Circles and you're [81:17] like the center of attention in room [81:20] yeah see that little Grimace yeah but [81:25] other people who are like the more [81:26] approval group focused people when I say [81:29] like I can tell like you're the center [81:30] of all your groups of friends and [81:31] everybody comes to you for advice you [81:33] seem like one of those people which is [81:35] an elicitation statement by itself as [81:37] well so you can tell that if I used [81:42] anything that didn't fit your psychology [81:44] it feels weird yeah and if a [81:46] salesperson's doing that they do it by [81:49] accident and they say oh this is a [81:51] numbers game because I don't I I use [81:54] this script that I have I kind of follow [81:57] this script pretty Loosely and I close [81:59] of 41% or whatever it [82:01] is in reality if you changed how you [82:05] communicate based on the sub parts of [82:08] that person's psychology which are on [82:10] public display and they're private [82:12] thoughts but they're very public if you [82:14] know how to listen to what people are [82:15] saying and understand what people are [82:17] saying you can put that out and it [82:19] changes how you speak it changes how you [82:21] communicate how you close a sale how you [82:24] get somebody to do something Everything [82:26] Changes the moment you're able to [82:28] profile a human being and understand who [82:30] they are a little bit deeper and if you [82:32] know the needs if I know that [82:35] your need is significance I [82:37] automatically know what one of your [82:39] fears and some of your biggest fears are [82:41] feeling insignificant feeling like you [82:44] could have made a difference but you [82:45] didn't make any difference like you [82:46] didn't leave any footprint in the world [82:48] like you didn't fulfill what you meant [82:50] what you wanted [82:51] to and any any need that I can identify [82:55] automatically reveals some fears and if [82:58] I understand fears I can also lead [83:01] behavior that way as [83:03] well I was thinking through the context [83:05] of being like a CEO or manager of [83:09] teams um this is I guess this is why [83:12] it's so important to know the different [83:14] types of people you have in your teams [83:16] and also I used to work on phones doing [83:18] Telly sales and you did yes for many [83:22] years I when I was 16 worked at Everest [83:25] in Plymouth which was uh windows and [83:27] doors and conservatories and artificial [83:29] grass and then when I went to Manchester [83:31] when I was a little bit older for [83:32] University before dropping out I um [83:35] worked at Swinton car insurance I worked [83:38] at a bunch of places I worked at Fusion [83:39] studi selling like uh photography [83:42] vouchers I did uh Facebook ad sales on [83:45] the phone back in the day wow lots of [83:48] lots of uh Telly sales experience and I [83:51] was just wondering because in those [83:52] moments you call someone out the blue or [83:54] they call you you asking for car [83:55] insurance and you don't have a big [83:57] window of time necessarily to figure out [84:00] what kind of person they are not at all [84:01] so how do you go about then you go back [84:04] to the Fate model so one of the sales [84:07] teams I recently [84:09] trained and I'm not on a confidentiality [84:11] agreement but one of the things when [84:13] they call people up out of the blue is [84:16] they pretend like their dog just knocked [84:18] a drink over on their computer right as [84:21] that person answers the phone and [84:22] they're like oh my God I'm so sorry hold [84:23] on one second and they're cleaning this [84:26] up and they're explaining like we just [84:28] got this new dog she knocked this coffee [84:29] over I'm really sorry person doesn't [84:31] even know who they are yet but they so [84:34] novel and interesting that they stay on [84:36] the phone 70% longer just because of the [84:40] spilled coffee and the person saying I'm [84:42] so sorry this is embarrassing making [84:44] this admission of I'm a little bit [84:45] embarrassed on the phone they stay on [84:47] the phone longer because novelty [84:49] captured that mamalian [84:51] Focus interesting and then if they're on [84:54] the phone a little bit longer you can [84:55] get to know them a little bit better and [84:57] understand what kind of person they are [84:58] and better adjust to yeah make sense and [85:02] then when you're saying I'm so sorry [85:03] this is really embarrassing the other [85:05] person most people are going to be like [85:06] no it's fine it's fine I don't even know [85:08] who you are yeah we haven't even got to [85:10] know each other [85:12] yet is there something that you see most [85:14] frequent that's deficient in sales [85:16] pitches when you're training sales [85:18] people is there like one particular [85:19] thing that's typically most [85:21] deficient that they're not doing there's [85:23] a few okay but slowness is a big one [85:28] Authority is lacking and confidence in [85:31] in what that person is [85:33] selling and going off of a script and [85:37] this is the biggest one any kind of [85:40] script automatically tells our brain so [85:43] like when's the last time you got you [85:45] get telemarketer calls to your phone [85:47] every once in a while once in a while [85:48] yeah yeah I do too and I'll answer it [85:52] and the moment that it sounds like [85:53] somebody going oh hi Mr Hughes this is [85:57] blank from blank company my brain knows [86:01] what a sales call sounds like and [86:03] instantly checks out of the conversation [86:05] instantaneously even if I didn't want to [86:08] do it my brain's already starting to [86:10] shut this guy out of my life because it [86:13] sounds like everything else I've ever [86:14] heard so since our brain is so good at [86:17] making apps I know because of just [86:21] knowing Neuroscience if I'm calling and [86:24] I sound like a salesperson or I sound [86:26] like something you've heard before [86:28] you're done you're going to get off the [86:30] phone as fast as possible if something [86:32] happens that makes you think whoa this [86:34] is different your brain is going to pay [86:36] more attention and I don't mean knocking [86:38] a Starbucks over across your laptop I [86:40] mean how can I make my sales calls not [86:43] sound like every other call that exists [86:47] I was victim of a phone call that was [86:50] clearly listening to your work because [86:52] the guy called me and said [86:55] hi this is a sales call and you can hang [86:57] up now if you're not interested but if [86:59] you are willing to hear me out I just [87:01] want 30 seconds and the fact that they [87:04] offered me the opportunity to hang up I [87:06] for some reason appreciated it and I [87:09] gave them the time and I remember I was [87:11] like really busy I was on my way to a [87:12] podcast recording and just the fact that [87:13] he' gone you can hang up now this just [87:14] gonna be honest this is a sales call [87:16] yeah he gave you [87:17] autonomy so I was like okay what are you [87:21] selling then he told me about some [87:23] social media soft or whatever but I just [87:25] thought it was really smart cuz you're [87:26] right within seconds I'm trying to [87:28] figure out if this is like all the [87:29] others yeah and we I guess we can do the [87:32] same in our emails in fact the co CEO [87:35] and COO of my media company that I hired [87:38] sent me an email in the first line of [87:40] the email they didn't even she's [87:42] listening now Cristiana and Georgie they [87:44] didn't even like introduce themselves [87:46] they [87:47] said um like straight to the point no [87:51] habituation filter [87:54] and it's interesting it's an interesting [87:55] open align because the word habituation [87:57] filter is something I talk about in my [87:58] book so they' kind of like tickled my [88:01] ego a little bit as well I think because [88:03] it says I've read your book yeah and [88:05] they went straight to the point and it [88:06] took cut me off guard and and got more [88:09] focused of course yeah they have the job [88:11] now they work here so and even the [88:13] subject line was like oh that was their [88:15] introduction email to you yeah that was [88:17] the first ever email yeah that's [88:19] brilliant cuz it's I don't think people [88:21] realize this unless you've been in a [88:22] situation where you're like like working [88:24] in recruitment looking at thousands of [88:26] emails but we when I used to really run [88:29] the recruitment inbox because I'm just [88:30] obsessed with the recruitment we have we [88:32] have 35,000 email emails in there and [88:35] I'm going through there at speed and I'm [88:37] looking [88:39] for what I would call exclusionary [88:42] factors and inclusionary factors what I [88:44] mean by that is factors to immediately [88:46] exclude this email yeah and factors to [88:49] immediately include this email within [88:52] three seconds to read later to read [88:53] later [88:55] read later or just it another and the [88:57] exclusionary is they're all just surface [88:59] things that you typically get from [89:01] people who typically do a certain thing [89:04] and that's I mean that's also why I [89:05] think about marketing newsletters if the [89:08] newsletter looks designed the studies [89:10] show the open rate the retention rate [89:12] the click-through rate is significantly [89:14] worse if it's a beautifully designed [89:16] email because people see it as a sales [89:18] email yeah the emails you get every day [89:20] that are important are not designed yeah [89:23] and so we we newsletter we [89:25] again the email newsletter provider was [89:28] saying oh you can use all these [89:29] templates but then we're like no no if [89:31] we use a template no one reads the thing [89:34] which is again counterintuitive but it's [89:35] the same psychology right it is like [89:37] I've increased our our open rate with [89:39] emails by not capitalizing the first [89:43] word of the subject line because it [89:45] looks like it's overly edited and we've [89:50] switched from here's a list of 13 [89:54] uh ways that we might have failed in [89:57] 2013 with this ad campaign or whatever [89:59] or this uh marketing campaign and I just [90:02] Chang the subject line to this [90:05] sucked and it just it did so much better [90:08] because it looks like something a friend [90:10] would send you it looks like something [90:13] you'd get from a relative or [90:15] something and that's that habituation [90:17] filter at play just trying [90:19] to phase out things that [90:22] are I like that not novel I think I read [90:25] it I read I was reading studies about [90:27] habituation and how we just habituate to [90:28] things and I was looking into um how [90:32] that happens in both what we see but [90:33] also in what we hear so the studies were [90:36] talking about if you say a word like [90:38] Father father father father father [90:39] father father father eventually it's [90:41] just becomes a sound in your head yeah [90:42] because your brain is taking away [90:44] cognitive resource it's no longer [90:45] thinking about the meaning and it's just [90:47] hearing the sound but then there's other [90:49] words that habituate slower like warning [90:51] warning warning warning warning warning [90:54] warning warning because those words are [90:55] like emotional and anyway um I think a [90:58] lot about it in the context of content [90:59] creation Mr Beast is the Great Master [91:02] of beating your habituation filter like [91:06] with how he starts his videos yeah [91:08] screaming in your face like yeah 500 [91:10] people in that Circle million pounds but [91:12] I think he he defeats the habituation [91:14] filter for a certain type of [91:17] viewer because I I see any video that [91:20] looks like that I'm off within the first [91:22] second I'm done done because they all [91:25] look the same now yeah that's an [91:27] interesting observation so I think the [91:29] type of viewer is very important because [91:32] like during this video when people are [91:34] watching this conversation you're not [91:36] going to have 10 seconds of b-roll of [91:38] people walking in slow motion through an [91:40] airport there's not going to be you're [91:42] not overdesigning stuff and the people [91:45] who listen to this show are way [91:47] different than the people who are [91:49] watching Mr Beast drop a Ferrari onto a [91:52] a mattress m and blow it up they're very [91:56] very different so I think the [91:57] habituation filters change based on what [92:00] we consume and what we appreciate [92:03] interesting because we're all making [92:05] we're all doing sort of quick prejudices [92:07] about everything so shortcuts yeah yeah [92:11] I'm going to develop as many shortcuts [92:12] as I can to [92:14] save cognitive load brain [92:17] power at my company flight Studio which [92:19] is part of my bigger company flight [92:21] group we're constantly looking for ways [92:22] to build deeper connection with our [92:24] audiences whether that's a new show a [92:26] product or a project it's why I launched [92:29] the conversation cards I've relied on [92:30] Shopify before who's a sponsor of [92:32] today's podcast and I'll be using them [92:34] again for the next big launch which [92:36] we'll hear about soon and I use them [92:37] because of how easy it is to set up an [92:39] online store that reaches all of you no [92:41] matter where you are in the world with [92:43] Shopify the usual pain points of [92:45] launching products online Disappear [92:46] Completely no matter the size of your [92:49] business Shopify has everything you need [92:51] to make your business go to the next [92:53] level and better connect with your [92:54] customers all over the world to say [92:56] thank you to all of you for listening to [92:57] my show we're giving you a trial which [93:00] is just $1 a month you can sign up by [93:03] going to shopify.com [93:05] Bartlet that's shopify.com Bartlet or [93:09] find the link in the description [93:12] below what is the the most popular thing [93:15] people come to you and talk to you about [93:17] and ask you that we haven't talked about [93:19] today I think one of the most common in [93:22] there is [93:24] how can I change my discipline that's [93:28] the number one thing that I get from [93:29] people how do I level up discipline on [93:31] this Authority checklist [93:33] and getting to a point where they're [93:36] modifying their discipline changes their [93:38] confidence because I always talk about [93:40] discipline is kind of the gateway drug [93:42] to everything else in authority and it's [93:45] the gateway to composure for sure but [93:49] getting your discipline modified is one [93:51] of the the fastest ways to make [93:53] everything else change and how do I fix [93:57] my discipline if I'm an ill disciplined [94:00] person understanding what discipline is [94:02] is the most critical element and I [94:05] Define this differently than most people [94:07] so I Define discipline [94:09] as your ability to prioritize the needs [94:13] of your future [94:15] self ahead of your own present self and [94:19] that's it that's all the discipline is [94:21] I'm prioritizing the needs of future me [94:25] you're trying to think of [94:26] a I was think no I was thinking of two [94:29] scenarios the scenario one is I go home [94:32] tonight right because I go to sleep I [94:34] get to bed early and there's this other [94:36] thing I'm thinking about doing after [94:37] this which is going to the gym yeah and [94:38] I'm like I was just as you're saying [94:40] that I was thinking both help future me [94:43] yeah I was PR I was like which one is [94:45] disciplined I think they would both be [94:47] discipline okay [94:49] so the moment that we start [94:53] understanding that if I could just make [94:54] decisions that are prioritizing future [94:56] me then we go back to where am I getting [94:58] my dopamine from and I want past tense [95:02] me to be a source of dopamine for [95:05] present tense me because most of us look [95:09] back with regret I shouldn't have drank [95:11] that much I shouldn't have mouthed off [95:13] at the family reunion you know whatever [95:15] it is I shouldn't have [95:17] overslept if I can start looking [95:20] backwards with gratitude that's the [95:22] fastest way to make discipline dopamine [95:25] generating so the tricks are to start [95:28] small so like when I go to bed at night [95:31] I will pop open the little [95:34] curig uh coffee thing and stick the [95:36] thing in there put a cup under there [95:38] everything's like ready to go so when I [95:39] wake up in the morning I just go bam and [95:41] everything's ready I'll get my clothes [95:43] out everything kind of lined up ready to [95:45] put on for the next day so I'm I'm [95:47] lowering the threshold of how much [95:49] attention I'm spending so I'm going to [95:51] set my life up in everying single way [95:54] that I possibly can is if I were a [95:55] butler for future me so when I wake up [95:59] in the morning all this stuff set out my [96:01] laundries laid out my checklist for what [96:03] I need to do to the uh for the day all [96:06] the stuff I'm got to get on a plane is [96:08] all laid out by the back door I can grab [96:10] it and jump in the car everything that I [96:12] could possibly do to make my future self [96:14] go oh man that's awesome and Look [96:17] Backwards with gratitude I'm going to do [96:19] it I'll take a $100 biller maybe a few [96:23] hundred s every spring or summer and [96:26] I'll stick them in the a jacket pocket [96:29] that I'm not going to use until the [96:30] winter and I'll forget about it and in [96:32] the winter I'm I'm looking and now I [96:34] become a source of dopamine past tense [96:36] me is becoming a source of dopamine for [96:39] present me that forces me to look in the [96:42] future along with like printing that old [96:45] me photo and putting it all over the [96:47] house but everything that I can possibly [96:50] do to make myself look backwards with [96:53] gratitude is what I'm going to start [96:55] doing but you have to start small it's [96:58] like just going overboard is going to be [97:00] crazy and even writing a little Post-It [97:04] note to yourself and sticking it in a [97:06] jacket or a maybe a dress shoe that [97:09] you're not going to wear for a few [97:10] months it means so much to find that and [97:14] it's it's from you it's not from a loved [97:16] one you did it so you're looking [97:19] backwards with like wow that's amazing [97:21] so you're now getting in love and [97:23] sending gratitude backwards which [97:25] automatically means that what's going [97:27] forwards is concern and Care the moment [97:31] I'm always looking back with gratitude [97:34] the concern is always going forward in [97:35] the future and the concern for present [97:39] goes away and I'm gonna I'm going to [97:41] push that concern to the right out in [97:44] the future people struggle even with the [97:46] small things right like getting because [97:49] yeah it's funny because I watched a [97:50] video last night about a lady that went [97:52] to YouTube and started her like journey [97:55] of weight loss and whatever and she was [97:57] very I think she was 400 pounds or [97:59] something and she was trying to get down [98:01] and in the video you what some people [98:03] will know who I'm referring to over the [98:05] space of a year or two years she [98:07] actually just gains weight so she gets [98:09] to I think five 500 pound or something [98:11] and as I was watching it you're watching [98:15] someone who's saying I want to change my [98:17] life but then is coming on every day and [98:20] saying I've just gained three pounds [98:21] I've just gained another three pounds [98:22] and there's almost this this like [98:24] visible dissonance that you're observing [98:26] between this person saying they want to [98:27] change their life but clearly the [98:29] actions that they're then taking are [98:31] like are different to that and many [98:34] people can relate to that feeling of I [98:36] want to be this person I mean we're [98:37] coming up to like we for anyone that [98:38] doesn't know we're recording this in [98:40] December so New Year's resolutions [98:41] around the corner everyone's going to [98:43] say to themselves who they want to [98:44] become but it's easier said than done I [98:46] think what seven8 8% 9% of New Year's [98:49] resolutions will stick yeah so is is it [98:52] just a case of stuff starting small or [98:54] is there any other tricks to discipline [98:56] that you can offer it's starting small [98:59] and realizing that all of our lives are [99:01] about habits not goals but what are the [99:04] habits that make my goal a byproduct [99:06] everything is about byproducts in your [99:08] whole life whether you know it or not so [99:10] instead of setting goals set like the [99:12] byproduct what are the byproducts I want [99:14] to have for this year and then what are [99:16] the habits that make that up so what the [99:19] big mistake most people make is they see [99:23] somebody like you you go to the gym very [99:25] often you probably eat really clean um I [99:29] know you don't drink alcohol cuz I [99:30] brought you a flask and gave it to your [99:32] team but uh Bost they took it they did [99:37] yeah [99:38] so somebody who doesn't live a very [99:41] disciplined life would look at you and [99:42] say God I want to be like Stephen he's [99:44] got all this discipline going to the gym [99:46] but they don't understand that you going [99:48] to the gym isn't discipline it's a [99:50] habit so you're not like forcing [99:53] yourself to go do something you're doing [99:55] something that's a habit for you the [99:57] discipline only is necessary you only [100:00] need like a teaspoon of it at the very [100:02] beginning to get this habit started so [100:04] start micro habits first and then bigger [100:06] habits so the discipline is not [100:09] something that you should be seeing if [100:11] you're seeing someone eat healthy and go [100:12] to the gym do all the stuff you want to [100:14] do those are habits and that person [100:17] you're you're not seeing a discipline at [100:20] work right there you're seeing a habit [100:22] the discipline was just at the beginning [100:24] and I think if more people knew that [100:26] that you're just exercising a little [100:28] discipline at the very beginning and [100:30] then it's just that's just what you do [100:32] it's like somebody who sees someone [100:35] brushing their teeth every day like wow [100:37] that's so much discipline it's just what [100:40] we do it's a habit there's a interesting [100:42] part of this [100:44] um like habit equation you could say or [100:47] like discipline equation which [100:48] is the why [100:51] part which is like why does this matter [100:53] to you and is it important to get really [100:57] clear on why this thing matters to you [100:58] whether it's the gym or like because [101:01] when I I was playing around with this [101:02] discipline equation idea from my last [101:04] book and the kind of conclusion I landed [101:06] at was that to be disciplined you have [101:09] to understand the reason why something [101:11] matters to you you can say that in other [101:12] words yeah um plus [101:16] the psychological reinforcement you get [101:19] from the pursuit of the thing minus the [101:22] you could say [101:23] the psychological or perceived cost of [101:25] the pursuit of the thing so in the [101:27] context of brushing your teeth I think I [101:29] know why it matters right because if I [101:32] don't then I have to go to the dentist [101:33] my teeth fall out I look ugly whatever [101:34] it might be yeah the is it rewarding and [101:37] fun to do no not [101:39] really and minus the cost of the pursuit [101:42] it takes two minutes it's not that bad [101:44] but when that Nets out the Y is stronger [101:48] thankfully on net than the cost so the [101:50] behavior happens yeah but the key part [101:52] of this equation here is the Y part like [101:55] it's not the key part but it's the [101:56] central part is the Y part why does this [101:58] thing matter to you yeah and in how much [102:03] why like how big is the why yeah because [102:07] if if the why is I need enjoyment in the [102:10] present moment then no other why will be [102:13] bigger no disciplined why will ever be [102:16] larger the only why will be why am I [102:18] eating these Cheetos right now or why am [102:21] I drinking [102:23] 20 beers every night because that's the [102:26] only why so I think once the why starts [102:30] edging its way into the future that's [102:33] that's the moment where you break the [102:37] discipline spiral and you get out of [102:39] that because your y's are extending into [102:42] time that hasn't happened yet does that [102:44] equation stack up for you saying this I [102:47] like it a lot because I I've been try [102:49] I've been saying it I wrote about this [102:50] in my book The whole idea is why plus [102:52] like we could say [102:54] reinforcement minus you could say cost [102:56] just to simplify it yeah but is there [102:58] anything missing from this [103:00] equation do you think is there anything [103:03] I said it to Simon cynic and he went [103:04] let's try it out and he talked to me [103:05] about taking his bin out in the morning [103:08] like taking the bin out for like the bin [103:10] men and it kind of holds up because he's [103:12] so the why is if I don't take the bin [103:14] out then I'm going to get fined and my [103:16] bin is going to overflow pretty strong [103:18] motivator the reinforcement there's no [103:20] reinforcement getting out of bed at 7: [103:21] a.m. to take your bin out it's not nice [103:22] yeah the cost is also significant [103:25] getting out of bed but the Y still so [103:28] it's y plus you could say like y plus [103:31] the psychological reinforcement from the [103:33] pursuit of doing it so DJing really fun [103:37] for me I would say there's you it would [103:39] be divided by the cost of inaction the [103:42] cost of inaction would would [103:44] either add to it but it's always going [103:47] to be your perception of the why mhm [103:49] your perception of the cost and your [103:51] perception of the cost of an action and [103:54] all of that is going to be about can I [103:55] use can I leverage my focus the mamalian [103:59] brain's Focus can I leverage authority [104:02] over myself in some way over that [104:04] mamalian part of my brain force myself [104:06] out of bed Force these habits to start [104:09] developing and then tribe are my friends [104:11] involved have I made a public agreement [104:13] about something and then the emotion [104:16] which I think would be the why yeah and [104:18] and like that's the emotional driver [104:20] that animal can understand [104:23] you visualizing yourself better like [104:26] looking with a six-pack or whatever it [104:28] is but printing it on a vision board [104:31] this is why I think vision boards are so [104:33] important not because we're manifesting [104:36] something out of the universe maybe it [104:38] is but we are definitely showing [104:42] something that a dog can understand it's [104:44] imagery and dog dog can understand [104:47] images so we're routinely exposing [104:51] ourselves to these vision boards on a [104:52] very very regular basis and if you [104:54] follow the brainwashing formula which is [104:58] focus emotion agitation and repetition [105:00] it spells [105:02] fear and that is the best way to [105:04] brainwash yourself to form these new [105:06] habits and goals so how can I get myself [105:08] to [105:09] focus how can I build the emotion which [105:12] is the why recurring emotion not just [105:15] one at the very beginning how can I [105:16] continue to make it emotional or maybe I [105:19] can make the cost of an action emotional [105:22] maybe I can buy the app that makes me [105:23] look fat or one of those things and then [105:27] agitation is if I'm waking up uh [105:30] habituation which you just talked about [105:32] if I'm waking up in the same house every [105:34] day that I've been fat in let's say I [105:36] wanted to lose weight or whatever the [105:38] same house every day that I've lived [105:39] xway in I'm seeing the same hallway same [105:42] rug same couch everything looks the same [105:45] my brain says oh I'm here I'm going to [105:47] follow that script because our brain [105:49] writes scripts for us to save us time so [105:52] a itation means I'm going to disrupt my [105:55] environment so much and so often that my [105:59] brain has no chance to default to an [106:01] older script so I have clients that [106:04] repaint their house they rearrange their [106:05] furniture they change up their wardrobe [106:07] a whole lot they get a completely new [106:09] haircut so they're not even looking at [106:10] the same person in the mirror anymore [106:12] they do everything you can to disrupt [106:14] that Rhythm it's exactly what we would [106:16] do with a a detainee if we were trying [106:20] to brainwash someone who is in an [106:23] intelligence uh interrogation so I'm [106:26] disrupting environment like crazy and [106:29] what will we do with a dog are we going [106:31] to let it do everything it's always done [106:33] we're going to change that environment [106:34] we're going to change the behavior [106:35] change the lease change the collar so [106:37] it's not not everything exactly the same [106:41] and then repetition repetition which is [106:43] just repeating the same thing over and [106:45] over so like if even just coming to the [106:47] vision [106:48] board uh the last client I had I had him [106:50] go to Best Buy and get a 70in TV [106:53] and then get one of those cheap tablets [106:55] those $300 $200 tablets and just duct [106:58] tape it to the back of the TV and put [107:01] his vision point vision board on that [107:03] thing it's like 900 slides of just [107:06] non-stop photos but it runs 24 hours a [107:09] day in his office even if he's not there [107:11] he walks in the morning it's on nonstop [107:14] repetition because him having to turn it [107:17] off at night means he's got another [107:18] point of discipline I've got to turn [107:19] that TV on start that little PowerPoint [107:21] thing um but that's nonstop and it's [107:24] just non-stop exposure so can I generate [107:28] Focus that's a lot of focus on on the [107:31] goals then there's emotion you're you're [107:33] seeing all of that agitation which is [107:35] disrupting my life patterns and [107:37] repetition which is just over and over [107:40] and over how can I reexpose you to the [107:42] same stimuli reexpose myself to the same [107:45] stimuli [107:47] interesting so I should keep a vision [107:50] board I I think always think with your [107:53] goals like how would I show these goals [107:55] to my [107:58] dog how would I show these goals to my [108:01] dog and how would I let my dog know [108:04] shit's going to change around here I'm [108:06] GNA move stuff around I'm G to make [108:08] everything different move his [108:11] bedh is there anything else that we [108:13] haven't covered yet in terms of your [108:15] work here that is important for us to [108:18] know I will give anybody listening one [108:21] big piece of advice that I've pass down [108:23] to my kids and maybe just make this a [108:24] final piece of advice is if you are [108:28] exposed to a product that can't tell you [108:32] the problem that they're solving you [108:34] need to be terrified absolutely [108:37] terrified so like if I look at door Dash [108:41] or Uber Eats they get food to me faster [108:45] I don't have to leave my house I don't [108:46] have to do anything I can continue [108:48] writing my book or doing something on my [108:51] computer and the food just shows up [108:54] they tell you the problem that they're [108:55] solving right look at Amazon they can [108:57] tell you all the problems they're [108:59] solving but you look at something like [109:02] apple Vision [109:04] Pro they can't tell [109:07] you you will never see it you see all [109:10] the problems that a Macbook solves this [109:12] this camera does all this does all these [109:14] things it helps you get this F done [109:16] faster and you look at Facebook [109:18] meta these AR goggles none of them will [109:22] ever ever tell you the problems that [109:24] they're trying to solve because it's [109:26] loneliness and people needing to [109:28] anesthetize themselves from being in [109:31] their own life and we are in a [109:34] loneliness epidemic right now in the [109:37] midst [109:38] of all this we've never been more [109:41] connected but we've never had more [109:42] loneliness than is in the world right [109:44] now so there's so many [109:47] products uh that are out there that are [109:50] that seem great but they can't [109:53] articulate what they're really solving [109:56] and it's usually loneliness boredom or a [109:59] need to anesthetize myself so I don't [110:02] have to think about my life I don't have [110:03] to be in my life [110:06] and that should be one thing if I could [110:09] just program into everyone's head be so [110:12] I did this to my kids just be so so [110:15] scared and so cautious when I see a [110:18] product or an app or anything that's not [110:21] openly advertised ing the problem that [110:23] they're solving I mean there's a lot of [110:25] entertainment apps right at the moment [110:27] for young kids and social networks fine [110:30] for boredom is boredom a problem it [110:33] might be but because I'm trying to [110:35] distinguish between like is Tik Tok [110:36] solving a problem for a young kid right [110:39] so that might be solving loneliness [110:41] instead of [110:42] boredom and I think Tik Tok does not [110:44] talk about solving any [110:47] problem it's like a casino isn't it for [110:49] the dopamine yeah it's so bad and they [110:52] use some they use a hypnosis technique [110:55] not just Tik Tok this is everybody uh [110:57] called [110:58] fractionation which is where you bring [111:00] somebody up and like so like you'll see [111:03] one of those videos of a grandpa holding [111:05] his grandbaby you know like that that [111:08] makes you almost cry have you ever cried [111:10] just watching like a 60-second Instagram [111:12] reel yeah I have too man and I feel [111:14] stupid I'm by myself yeah watching a [111:17] 60-second video uh but like they'll pull [111:20] you down into that then they'll they'll [111:22] punch you back up like two videos later [111:24] and and you'll start to notice this two [111:28] videos later it'll be a riot someone [111:31] robbing a store fist fight a car going [111:34] way too fast flipping off the road an [111:36] airplane almost crouching so they get [111:39] you up and down and up and down and the [111:41] more I can do that this is proven that [111:44] that ramps up [111:46] suggestibility Dr Milton Erikson uh did [111:49] studies on this in the [111:50] 1960s and that increases your level of [111:55] suggestibility like tenfold the more I [111:58] can get you up and down up and down and [112:01] what happens after you get like four [112:02] five cycles of up and down you get an [112:08] ad and it's so [112:12] reliable and I didn't realize it was [112:15] happening until my wife said why are you [112:19] buying off Instagram as like once a [112:21] week now [112:23] and it I was working on me so I was [112:25] buying stupid that was on Instagram [112:28] ads and then I finally set time limits [112:30] on those apps you set time limits on [112:33] those apps yes yes my wife has the [112:36] passcode to unlock the uh whatever it's [112:39] called screen time the iPhone screen [112:41] time but I'm a I'm a brainwashing [112:46] expert and I am personally [112:49] terrified of short form social media [112:52] like that and I'm not [112:55] immune and I'm one of the best in the [112:59] world and I am not immune to it and I [113:02] think that should be a stark warning for [113:05] a lot of [113:07] people what what's the cost though [113:09] what's the cost of the life in your view [113:12] of the living this kind of life where [113:14] you know we go home and we just like [113:16] burn our brains out with these social [113:19] media apps and Fry our dopamine [113:21] receptors is there like a [113:23] cost yeah I think the cost is increased [113:26] loneliness and the these apps any app [113:29] that sells ads has two main goals number [113:33] one uh and all advertising shares these [113:36] two main goals number one make you [113:37] compare yourself to other people in [113:39] unhealthy ways number two make you think [113:42] I am not enough and we see that [113:45] everywhere I'm not enough I'm comparing [113:48] myself to other people and it gets us [113:50] into an US versus them then it traps you [113:52] into into a corner of confirmation bias [113:55] whatever you think I'm going to show you [113:57] this group of 150 people that agree with [113:59] you no matter how stupid how radical how [114:04] absolutely bizarre your ideas are let me [114:06] show you all of these people and then [114:08] you start thinking the whole world's [114:10] like that so really [114:13] quickly what happens when we [114:15] conglomerate people together like I'm [114:19] I've only been in New York once in my [114:20] life but we're in New York right now [114:22] looking at my hotel I like struggling to [114:25] find a piece of nature like I think I [114:28] have more trees on my property than [114:29] they're in the whole uh City here so on [114:34] the whole when you squeeze people [114:35] together have you heard of the bystander [114:37] effect uh I have heard of it but please [114:40] so they there is a very good experiment [114:42] that was led by Dr Phillips and Bardo [114:44] that they did at uh Liverpool Street [114:46] Station in London in London yeah okay so [114:49] right at Liverpool Street there's this [114:51] there's a video on YouTube [114:52] um and it's fair use if you want to [114:55] Overlay like an image of what this looks [114:57] like but at Liverpool Street station [114:59] there's three or four steps to get up to [115:01] the main so from the street there's a [115:03] curb and then there's three or four [115:04] steps they had this woman laid out on [115:07] the ground wearing like a normal skirt [115:10] and top and I think 395 people either [115:14] walked by her or stepped over [115:17] her and then they did it with a guy then [115:19] they did it with a guy he's holding a [115:21] beer and he's asking for help and they [115:23] they made changed all these variables [115:25] but it's happened in New York City [115:27] before there's a woman named Kitty [115:28] genovas in the 60s I think just two [115:30] blocks from here who was stabbed to [115:32] death in front of like 55 Witnesses [115:35] don't quote me on that number and no one [115:37] called the police until much much later [115:41] mostly because everyone thought somebody [115:42] else would act but if I describe to [115:46] you saying I watched a person get [115:50] stabbed and three people just watched [115:54] and they watched it happen would you say [115:56] that that's psychopathy that's a [115:59] psychopath so these large cities and [116:02] stuff and the apps that are messing with [116:04] the social part of our brain that makes [116:06] us think the tribe is way bigger than [116:08] our brains are made to handle causes [116:10] this almost Psychopathic [116:13] Behavior which the bystander effect has [116:15] been [116:16] proven hundreds of times as as an [116:19] experiment is that because if I'm [116:20] logging on to social media I'm becoming [116:23] desensitized to this kind of thing but [116:24] also if if you live in London you get [116:27] quite accustomed to seeing someone that [116:29] is homeless and so in that case of [116:32] seeing someone rolling on the Floy [116:33] Liverpool Street Station you might have [116:35] seen it before and it might have just [116:37] been someone who was homeless or [116:39] struggling with something yeah some kind [116:40] of addiction or something yeah so you [116:43] you you've become somewhat desensitized [116:45] to it is that so it you you are getting [116:48] desensitized to it but your brain is [116:51] made to hold small tribes of a couple [116:54] hundred people and the moment that tribe [116:57] expands into something your brain can't [116:59] imagine you are no longer relying on [117:03] reputation from anyone you don't care [117:05] what other people are thinking about [117:07] you and the moment that stops your brain [117:10] says I don't have the capacity to worry [117:12] about everyone that I see so empathy [117:16] disappears like you walk down these [117:18] streets here in New York their empathy [117:20] is zero for you no matter what's [117:22] happening you walk through a country [117:24] town it's like 1,500 people I the [117:27] population of the town I live in is [117:30] 2,200 and if you get cut on the arm or [117:32] like you stumbled four cars will stop [117:35] people get out of their cars to figure [117:37] out what's going on because our brains [117:39] can handle smaller tribes the moment we [117:42] get flooded with all of these things all [117:44] of these people that we can't possibly [117:46] care about everybody empathy [117:49] disappears the second aspect of this is [117:52] if we're surrounded by environments that [117:54] our ancestors would be absolutely scared [117:57] of and confused by we we start [118:00] developing problems in our brain [118:02] depression loneliness suicide through [118:04] the roof in large cities every time [118:07] there's no exception and I think the [118:10] same thing happens when we put stuff our [118:11] cells our ancestors cells don't [118:13] recognize uh you had the glucose Queen [118:16] on here recently talking about some of [118:18] this we're putting unnatural stuff into [118:21] our bodies you had a toxicologist on [118:23] here I think talking about this too that [118:26] goes into our bodies Our Ancestors don't [118:28] know what that is and our bodies can't [118:29] process it it turns into disease it [118:32] turns into mental disease when our [118:35] bodies can't process everything that's [118:36] going on around us so I in my theory and [118:40] this is just my theory the further we're [118:43] separated from nature we find disease [118:46] mental and physical [118:50] amen we have a closing tredition on this [118:52] podcast where the last guest leaves a [118:54] question for the next guest not knowing [118:56] who they're going to be leaving it for [118:58] the question left for you is how can we [118:59] consistently feel and appreciate the [119:03] blessings in our lives and this is [119:05] interesting because you talked about [119:06] gratitude earlier on yeah I think [119:10] if mindfulness has become a Trope now [119:15] it's just kind of become overused on on [119:17] the internet and it's one of the I think [119:21] it's a super power just learning present [119:25] tense mindfulness of just being in this [119:28] moment and I think if you one of the [119:32] fastest ways to get good at just [119:34] enjoying the moment is to be so self [119:37] forgiving that it's almost delusional [119:41] that's the best advice that I could give [119:42] somebody be delusionally self-forgiving [119:45] about [119:47] everything what does that mean in [119:48] reality give me an example um most [119:51] people look back with regret and shame I [119:54] shouldn't have done that or I should [119:56] have done that I can't believe I [119:57] embarrassed myself I can't believe I you [120:00] know did that thing in front of those [120:03] people get so forgiving of everything [120:06] that you've ever done of yourself that [120:08] it is like delusional to the point where [120:11] it's just crazy and you're thinking I [120:14] shouldn't forgive myself for that you [120:16] get to a point where everything is fine [120:18] and it's just [120:19] hilarious if you get to that point your [120:22] ability to stay in the present and not [120:24] stuck in the past will tin X overnight [120:28] just the ability to be delusionally self [120:31] forgiving how does that keep you out of [120:33] thinking about the future though because [120:36] thinking about the future is [120:37] great especially once we follow that [120:39] discipline practice and we're putting [120:42] concern forward and gratitude [120:45] backwards you wrote a book called phrase [120:47] seven which which is I hear is being [120:50] turned into a TV series yeah which [120:52] you're going to feature in as a [120:54] bartender as a bartender and this is [120:56] being released next year for 25 seconds [120:58] all right okay better than nothing and [121:01] this is being released next year we're [121:03] hopeful yeah what's your what is the [121:05] book about phas s it is a fictional book [121:11] about mind control hypnosis [121:15] brainwashing and how those things are [121:17] being used on our population but also [121:20] about how you can recognize it and even [121:23] how you can use some of those techniques [121:25] in your everyday life but it's kind of [121:26] like a mix [121:28] between [121:30] 24 and Suits okay yeah people know suits [121:34] and if I if I want to learn more about [121:36] your work and I want to get I want to go [121:38] further into everything that you do [121:40] where's the best place for me to go just [121:42] our homepage which is NCI which is our [121:45] neurocognitive intelligence NCI do [121:48] University NCI do University yeah and [121:51] right at the very bottom of that page [121:53] I'll put a link that says CEO that has [121:55] anything that I talked about here as [121:57] well that people can download and this [121:59] book here is that available on the [122:00] website the paperback version of that is [122:03] yes okay the paperback version the same [122:06] but it's the same stuff right yes [122:08] exactly cool Chase thank you it's so [122:11] unbelievably fascinating I I get the [122:13] impression that I could talk to you [122:14] probably [122:15] for 20 hours maybe I feel like this [122:18] conversation could have been 20 hours [122:19] long because I feel like we're just [122:20] scratching the surface but because I [122:22] guess at the end of the day everything [122:23] is about humans it is you know every [122:26] every goal dream problem I have in my [122:28] life it could actually be just distilled [122:31] down to some kind of human challenge [122:33] with my girlfriend with you know the [122:35] businesses I run Etc even with like [122:37] being a host of a podcast it's all human [122:38] beings so that's why I'm so hungry to [122:40] learn more because it's clearly like the [122:42] singular skill that's going to unlock [122:44] all of the things that I care about and [122:46] that's why as well like when you talk [122:47] about some of these studies the milgrim [122:49] study and a bunch of them in school I [122:52] was obsessed with these things I still [122:54] remember the studies that like the mgrm [122:57] study that they just changed my life and [122:58] my thinking in so many ways and as I [123:00] grew up and I became you know I did like [123:02] uh call center stuff and then like [123:04] business leadership in our podcast it's [123:07] all there it's all been human it's all [123:09] there every step of the way it's been [123:10] about the same things even you know [123:12] running businesses now the mgrm study or [123:15] the when I was in the call center the [123:16] milgrim study was still pertinent or as [123:18] a podcast host the milgrim study is [123:20] still pertinent because it's once again [123:22] just dealing with humans and that's what [123:23] you're helping people to unlock so thank [123:24] you for doing what you do absolutely um [123:26] and for the many you know you've got a [123:27] lot of Raving fans online I thank you on [123:29] behalf of all of them as well and if [123:30] anyone wants to go check out the YouTube [123:32] channel which is really fascinating [123:33] because I've watched you many many many [123:35] many times breaking down moments in [123:37] society and culture and looking at those [123:39] moments through the lens of Behavioral [123:42] um factors and body language and things [123:45] like that to help you interpret what was [123:46] going on in that moment it's incredibly [123:48] Illuminating and it's incredibly it's [123:50] entertainment at the end of the day it's [123:51] fantastic thank you so much Chase thanks [123:54] Sten when it comes to food I trust my [123:56] gut and I trust Zoe a business I'm an [123:59] investor in and today's sponsor of this [124:01] podcast all the nutritionists I've [124:02] spoken to have highlighted just how [124:03] misleading information is out there when [124:05] it comes to food take healthy Halos the [124:07] claims you see on packaging that say [124:09] things like low sugar and nothing [124:11] artificial are often a sign of foods to [124:14] avoid have you ever noticed a health [124:15] claim on fresh fruit you probably get my [124:17] point understandably there's loads of [124:19] distrust out there who should you turn [124:21] to for accurate information I use Zoe [124:24] which is backed by one of the world's [124:26] largest microbiome databases and most [124:28] scientifically Advanced atome gut health [124:30] tests Zoe gives you proven science [124:33] whenever you need it as a Zoe member [124:35] you'll 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