Pahlavi Outlines $1 Trillion Iranian Reconstruction Plan After Regime Collapse

巴列维概述政权垮台后1万亿美元伊朗重建计划 流亡王子Reza Pahlavi与投资人Shervin Pishevar断言，通过世俗民主转型推翻伊斯兰共和国，将为国际投资者释放1万亿美元的经济红利。 在本期节目中，王储Reza Pahlavi勾勒了后政权时代伊朗的系统性过渡方案，并将当前的军事行动定性为拯救民众的人道主义干预。他详细阐述了世俗民主、领土完整、法律平等保护和自由选举等核心过渡原则，并辅以名为“伊朗繁荣项目”的详尽百日经济稳定蓝图。随后，投资人Shervin Pishevar加入讨论，探讨了现政权下惨重的国内平民伤亡、自由伊朗蕴藏的巨大经济潜力以及其家族的流亡经历。主持人和嘉宾共同展望了一个以地区稳定、民主治理及美伊深化合作为特征的未来。 巴列维王子与舍尔温·皮舍瓦（Shervin Pishevar）指出当前的军事行动属于必要的人道主义救援干预，旨在协助伊朗人民对抗使用重型武器屠杀逾4.3万名抗议者的残暴政权。 (0:00) 政治过渡以四大核心原则为底线：领土完整、政教分离、法律面前人人平等以及通过自由公正的民主选举确立新宪法与政府。 (7:00) 巴列维王子明确表示自己仅作为走向民主的中立协调人与桥梁，不会谋求特定公职；目前已有逾5万名伊朗军职人员通过保密渠道响应过渡合作。 (11:00) 专家团队已制定175页的“伊朗繁荣计划”（Iran Prosperity Project），预计世俗民主化后的伊朗经济重建将在前10年内为美国市场创造1万亿美元的经贸与投资机遇。 (29:39)

Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi and investor Shervin Pishevar outline a post-regime roadmap for Iran, framing current military actions as a humanitarian intervention to dismantle the clerical autocracy and establish a secular democracy. Their proposal pairs an phased constitutional roadmap with economic reconstruction, relying on military defections and diaspora technical expertise. Transition Roadmap and Institutional Continuity Pahlavi outlines four non-negotiable principles for any transitional authority: preserving Iran's territorial integrity, enforcing a strict separation of religion and state, guaranteeing equal protection under the law, and conducting democratic elections. Contrasting the proposed transition with post-war Iraq, Pahlavi argues against widespread administrative purges, maintaining that Iran's established bureaucratic and institutional foundations should be preserved to prevent state collapse. These governance steps are formalized in the Iran Prosperity Project, a 175-page technical blueprint authored by an advisory team. The roadmap schedules an initial 100-day stabilization period, followed by a national referendum on the system of government within the first four months. The subsequent phases allocate six months for a constitutional assembly to draft a legal framework and 14 months to finalize the draft and hold a nationwide popular vote. Neutral Arbiter Role and Foreign Relations Pahlavi describes his intended role as a neutral facilitator and temporary bridge rather than an aspiring head of state, leaving the constitutional structure to the electorate. He notes that viable democratic systems exist as both republics and constitutional monarchies, emphasizing that transparent civic debate must precede any vote to avoid repeating the political opacity that followed the 1979 revolution. Addressing foreign relations, Pahlavi confirms active communication with the Trump administration through special envoy Steve Witkoff and members of the U.S. Congress. However, both Pahlavi and Pishevar insist that foreign partners must not select Iran's leadership, maintaining that full sovereignty rests with the 93 million Iranian citizens. They further reject external support for separatist movements, asserting that territorial integrity is essential to maintaining broad public consensus. Economic Reconstruction and Modernization Plans (29:39) Comparing Iran's trajectory to Gulf Cooperation Council states and South Korea, Pahlavi and Pishevar argue that domestic economic distress is caused by state corruption and ideological resource diversion rather than insufficient domestic talent. Pahlavi forecasts that post-transition reconstruction and access to global commerce could generate a $1 trillion economic opportunity for the U.S. market within the first 10 years alone. The recovery strategy seeks to leverage the global Iranian diaspora, highlighting tech executives such as Databricks CEO Ali Ghodsi, Uber CEO Dara Khosrowshahi, and eBay founder Pierre Omidyar. The Iran Prosperity Project blueprint proposes modernizing the economy by deploying advanced technologies, citing early integration work with Artificial General Intelligence and quantum computing firm D-Wave. Defection Strategies and Civilian Protection (34:29) Addressing recent civilian crackdowns, Pishevar asserts that regime forces killed more than 43,000 peaceful protesters using heavy, military-grade anti-materiel ammunition. Transition organizers anticipate a four-week campaign to neutralize the regime's military command, depending heavily on encouraging internal armed forces to break ranks. Pishevar claims that over 50,000 security and military personnel have already contacted Pahlavi's channels securely. The transition framework proposes that soldiers and officials not implicated in atrocities will be offered continued compensation or early retirement. While Pahlavi states that his physical presence in Iran will be necessary to guide the transition, he clarifies that his return depends on securing basic safety measures on the ground. The presented transition model assumes that deep-seated regime institutions can be systematically defanged within weeks while administrative functions remain intact. However, the blueprint relies on untested assumptions regarding large-scale military defections, frictionless collaboration among disparate political factions, and the ability to maintain internal stability without sparking regional factionalism.

流亡伊朗王储Reza Pahlavi与硅谷投资人Shervin Pishevar在《All-In Podcast》中主张，当前的外部军事行动应被视为解救伊朗民众的“人道主义干预”，并提出了推翻现政权后建立世俗民主国家与推动经济重建的系统性过渡框架。他们认为依托国家官僚结构的延续性与侨民资本，伊朗能避免陷入类似伊拉克的混乱，但这一蓝图的实现仍取决于军事行动进展、内部军队倒戈及复杂的政治公投程序。 四项核心原则与民主立宪路线图 Pahlavi强调，任何参与未来过渡进程的力量都必须遵守四项不可动摇的基石原则：维护国家领土完整、实现政教分离、保障法律面前人人平等的法治体系，以及通过自由公正的选举产生制宪议会和新政府。Pahlavi明确表示，自己在此过程中的角色是促进权力平稳过渡的中立桥梁与协调者，而非角逐执政职位的候选人。他指出，无论是共和制还是君主立宪制，只要符合民主规范均属可行选项，具体的国体结构必须由伊朗选民在充分知情的前提下通过选票自主裁定。 针对政权更迭初期的治理真空风险，过渡团队设立了“伊朗繁荣计划”（Iran Prosperity Project），该计划包含一份长达175页的详细技术方案，重点指导过渡期前100天的经济稳定与行政职能整合。根据该蓝图设定的时间表，在国家解放后的前4个月内将举行关于政体形式的全民公投，随后由制宪议会耗时6个月起草宪法草案，并在其后14个月内敲定法案并举行全民公决，最终将权力移交给民选议会和政府。 军事干预预期、机构保留与军队倒戈 (34:29) Pahlavi与Pishevar将针对该政权的军事打击定性为遏制国内屠杀的救援手段。Pishevar指出，此前该政权曾动用比可乐罐还大的重型反器材弹药镇压集会，导致逾4.3万名和平示威者丧生。Pishevar声称外部军事行动预计将在四周左右解除该政权的军事威胁，并宣称最高领袖哈梅内伊及伊斯兰革命卫队（IRGC）高层在早期打击中已被瓦解，同时提及媒体关于美军第82空降师动向的报道显示了支持信号。 为了避免重蹈伊拉克战争后全面“去复兴党化”导致国家机器崩溃的覆辙，Pahlavi主张保留伊朗具有数百年历史的常规民政官僚机构。在安全防务领域，Pishevar表示已有超过5万名军政人员通过保密渠道与Pahlavi的团队取得联系。过渡计划明确规定，只要未直接参与针对平民的杀戮与罪行，原体制内的军事和行政人员将获得提前退休或留任并领取薪酬的保障，以此分化执政集团并推动体制内力量和平倒戈。 释放经济潜能与“伊朗繁荣计划” (29:39) Pahlavi指出，若非1979年宗教政权通过黑手党式的治理掠夺资源并向外输出意识形态，拥有丰富油气储备与年轻人口（平均年龄约31至32岁）的伊朗本应成为该地区的“韩国”而非“朝鲜”。他预测，向世俗民主体制转型后，仅国内重建在最初10年内就将为美国市场带来高达1万亿美元的经贸机遇，同时还将吸纳庞大的国际资本投资。 Pishevar以海湾合作委员会（GCC）国家的现代化进程以及硅谷伊朗裔精英的商业成就作为对比，列举了包括Uber首席执行官Dara Khosrowshahi、Databricks联合创始人Ali Ghodsi及eBay创始人Pierre Omidyar在内的企业领袖，指出侨民群体已在全球创造了数万亿美元价值。他认为，一旦国内9300万人口摆脱压迫，将释放巨大的创新与生产红利。此外，其团队的重建计划还提出引入通用人工智能（AGI）和量子计算等新兴技术，以加速伊朗在基础设施、医疗与法律体系上的跳跃式现代化。 主权自决、领土完整红线与对外关系 针对外部势力干预政局的担忧，Pahlavi证实其团队与特朗普政府特使Steve Witkoff及美国国会参众两院关键议员保持着透明沟通，但他坚决否认外国领导人有权指定伊朗领导层。Pahlavi强调，包括美国在内的外部伙伴仅应提供道义与战术支持，决定国家未来的最高权力完全属于全体伊朗公民。他重申伊朗民众具有长期的亲西方与反极端主义倾向，例如“9·11”事件发生后民众曾自发举行烛光守夜悼念美国遇难者，示威者也持续高呼反对将外国视作敌人的口号。 关于地缘政治风险，Pishevar明确指出维护伊朗完整的领土主权是不容妥协的底线，反对任何外部势力资助地区民兵或助长分裂主义运动。他援引伊朗5000年的文明延续性，认为神权统治仅是漫长历史中的短暂占领者。Pahlavi和Pishevar均认为，一个重拾法治与包容传统的世俗伊朗，不仅将彻底解除核武器扩散与区域袭击的威胁，还将成为中东地区最大的民主实体与全球安全的重要合作者。 该访谈描绘了反对派在推翻现政权后平稳建立世俗民主国家的乐观预期，但内容多基于受访者的单方判断与政治主张。文中关于军事打击进程、人员伤亡统计、高层被定点清除以及数万军队倒戈等关键断言，均带有战时信息不确定性与受访者的立场投射。在真实的权力真空与外部军事介入下，如何有效管控地方分离势力、在缺乏成熟政党体制的环境中落实长达两年的制宪路线图，依然是未有明确答案的现实难题。

## Background 本期节目由知名商业与科技频道《All-In Podcast》于 2026 年 3 月 7 日发布在 YouTube 平台。节目由主持人杰森·卡拉卡尼斯（Jason Calacanis）主持，专访了流亡海外近半个世纪的伊朗末代王储礼萨·巴列维（Reza Pahlavi）及著名硅谷投资人舍尔文·皮谢瓦（Shervin Pishevar）。根据官方简介，对话重点聚焦于巴列维对当前战局的研判、伊朗平稳过渡与民主化重建蓝图、特朗普的投降通牒，以及对伊朗民众精神与中东未来地缘格局的深度探讨。 ## TL;DR 在伊朗神权政权面临历史性瓦解的节点，巴列维王储将当前的外部军事干预定性为打破力量失衡的人道主义营救行动，并阐述了涵盖政教分离、领土完整及“伊朗繁荣项目”前 100 天稳定方案的民主过渡路线图。他强调自己定位为不谋求个人官职的中立调停者，国家最终采纳共和制或君主立宪制完全交由人民通过自由选举与公投决定。随后加入对话的舍尔文·皮谢瓦揭露了德黑兰当局屠杀示威者的残暴罪行，梳理了硅谷伊朗裔精英创造的数万亿美元商业价值与和平红利，并动情回顾了家族在伊斯兰革命后的惊险逃亡往事。整场对谈勾勒出一个拥有九千三百万人口的世俗民主伊朗将给全球与中东带来的繁荣前景，并呼吁各方尊重伊朗人民自主决定未来的神圣权利。 ## Atmosphere & style 整场对话兼具历史转折关头的厚重紧迫感与极为浓烈的人性温度，充满了对摆脱 47 年黑暗专制、重获自由的昂扬希冀。杰森的主持充满同理心与敏锐洞察，巴列维王储的发言克制沉稳、展现出超脱个人权力的高度政治责任感，而舍尔文的加入则带来了极具戏剧张力的家族生死逃亡记忆与赤诚的波斯情怀。从严肃剖析军事倒戈与制宪治理方案，到回忆 9/11 烛光守夜与波登的美食探索，再到相约一年后在自由的德黑兰喝茶录播客，谈话在宏大地缘叙事与温暖个体记忆之间自然穿梭，呈现出极具感染力的情感共鸣。 ## Bulletin - [10:07](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=607s) 流亡王储礼萨·巴列维联合海内外精英提出《伊朗繁荣计划》（IPP），制定包含“前100天”应急方案及为期24个月的立宪与政权过渡路线图。 - [21:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1293s) 舍尔文·皮谢瓦透露近期德黑兰当局在48小时内动用反器材重武器屠杀了逾4.3万名和平示威者，并强调该政权对周边12国发起袭击凸显其核武化带来的毁灭性风险。 - [36:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2189s) 巴列维团队已建立安全加密通道，已有超过5万名伊朗军方和安全人员建立联络并倒戈，过渡政府将对未参与大屠杀的体制内人员实行宽肃政策与和平安置。 - [01:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=81s) 巴列维与舍尔文均明确强调国家领土完整是不可动摇的绝对底线，未来民主世俗政体将释放未被充分挖掘的巨大市场红利，预计前十年将为美伊带来上万亿美元商业价值。 ## Key takeaways - [01:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=81s) 巴列维王储将当前针对德黑兰神权政权的外部军事打击定性为打破力量失衡的人道主义“营救行动”，为受压迫的伊朗人民反抗创造了必要条件。 - [01:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=81s) 世俗民主化将释放伊朗作为21世纪最大未开发市场的潜力，彻底扭转其沦为地区“朝鲜”的困境，向类似“韩国”的经济腾飞转型。 - [03:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=230s) 巴列维倡导建立涵盖君主立宪派与共和派的跨派系“大帐篷”同盟，并明确将伊朗的平稳过渡与当年伊拉克失序的“去复兴党化”乱局划清界限。 - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=448s) 过渡方案的核心前提是获得伊朗人民的合法性认可，民众绝不接受神权残余换汤不换药地苟延残喘，要求实现彻底决裂。 - [10:07](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=607s) 通过“伊朗繁荣项目”（IPP）制定的“前100天”计划将维持物资秩序，后续经由全民公投、制宪会议及首届民选政府选举实现权力完全移交。 - [11:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=696s) 巴列维强调自身定位为实现民主的“中立调停人和过渡桥梁”，明确表示不竞选未来公职，最终国家制度由人民在透明辩论后自主决定。 - [15:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=926s) 巴列维团队虽与特朗普政府保持沟通，但直言决定伊朗领导人的权力完全属于伊朗人民，外部大国角色仅在于协助进程而非强加结果。 - [17:16](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1036s) 伊朗民间社会长期对西方文化保有深厚好感，在“9·11”事件当天伊朗民众曾自发走上街头举行烛光守夜默哀。 - [20:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1204s) 拥有9300万人口的自由民主伊朗若成功建立，将一跃成为中东地区幅员与人口最为庞大的民主政体，重塑区域安全格局。 - [24:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1488s) 舍尔文·皮谢瓦联合多位顶尖投资人成立“以伊联盟”，指出反击流氓神权政权是消除中东面临核勒索风险的根本道德与物理安全防线。 - [27:16](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1636s) 波斯文明与犹太民族有着长达2500年的历史纽带，居鲁士大帝开创的人权哲学亦深刻影响了托马斯·杰斐逊及美国建国原则。 - [30:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1846s) 硅谷伊朗裔精英已创造数万亿美元企业价值，民主伊朗若将本土智力资本与海湾级别的基建雄心相结合，将释放巨大的和平与经济红利。 - [33:41](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2021s) 过去47年的神权统治被视为一场彻底失败的社会“A/B测试”，实现彻底的“政教分离”已成为伊朗社会最强烈的全民共识。 - [36:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2189s) 针对体制内人员实施区别对待政策，宽肃未染指大屠杀罪行的官兵，同时强调国家必须重点疗愈长达数代人的严重心理创伤。 - [38:52](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2332s) 伊朗拥有长达五千年的文明韧性，任何借外部势力肢解或分裂国家的行径都触犯了王储与全体国民的绝对红线。 - [41:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2516s) 舍尔文回顾全家在伊斯兰革命后的惊险逃亡与赴美奋斗史，生动体现了移民精神以及海外伊朗人倾力反哺祖国自由的决心。 ## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=0s) 专访流亡王储礼萨·巴列维：历史转折点的重磅对谈 主持人 Jason Calacanis 在 All-In 播客第 263 期特别加推的第二部分开场，隆重介绍了本期的重磅嘉宾——流亡海外近半个世纪的伊朗末代王储礼萨·巴列维（Reza Pahlavi）。Jason 透露，这次极具历史意义的独家对话由好利友投资人舍尔文·皮谢瓦（Shervin Pishevar）牵线搭桥得以促成。Jason 提到巴列维王子在 17 岁时以飞行员身份离开祖国，而如今整整过去了 47 年，将近半个世纪的等待似乎迎来了曙光——随着针对伊朗政权的军事行动展开，伊朗人民正站在重获自由的历史节点上。Jason 随即切入核心问题：在这场军事行动彻底结束之后，巴列维对伊朗的未来有着怎样的蓝图构想？ ### [01:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=81s) 人道主义救援：将伊朗从黑手党式神权政权中解放 巴列维首先正面回应了当前的军事打击。他强调，这次军事介入的本质是一场“营救行动（rescue mission）”和人道主义干预，旨在挽救更多生命。过去一段时间以来，这个极度残暴且高压的德黑兰政权屠杀了数以万计手无寸铁的无辜平民，外部的军事打击抹平了双方悬殊的力量差距，为民众创造了反抗的条件，“这是许多伊朗人民一直在呼吁的必要干预”。 谈及未来发展，巴列维指出政权崩溃后的过渡期治理至关重要。他已挺身而出，联合国内各行业同胞领导过渡进程，确保在满足民生紧急需求的同时，推动国家走向重建与再发展。他痛心疾首地打了个鲜明比方：如果不是当年的伊斯兰革命，今天的伊朗本该是该地区的“韩国”，坐拥丰富资源与卓越人才；然而它却沦为了该地区的“朝鲜”。导致这一悲剧的绝非伊朗人民能力不足或资源匮乏，纯粹是因为腐败无能的黑手党式政权绑架了国家，将其作为向外输出极端意识形态的跳板。 走向民主与世俗化的伊朗将迎来爆发式的商业机会： - 伊朗拥有21世纪全球最未被充分挖掘的庞大经济潜力与市场红利。 - 重建与经贸往来将带来双赢局面，预计头十年内将为美国市场带来约 1 万亿美元（1 Trillion USD）的商业价值与回报。 - 数十亿美元的外资将注入伊朗的基础设施重建与产业升级，彻底扭转过去近五十年自绝于全球经济的衰退泥潭。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 伊朗历史轨迹与转型对比 accDescr: 对比伊朗在革命前后的发展轨迹及未来世俗民主化路线 subgraph Past["历史歧路"] A["1979年前潜力"] --> B["伊斯兰革命爆发"] B --> C["黑手党式神权政权<br/>成为地区‘朝鲜’"] end subgraph Present["当下转折"] C --> D["外部人道主义军事打击<br/>打破力量失衡"] D --> E["政权崩溃与瓦解"] end subgraph Future["过渡与未来"] E --> F["领导平稳过渡委员会"] F --> G["建立世俗民主政体<br/>成为地区‘韩国’"] G --> H["释放1万亿美元商业价值与科技潜力"] end ``` ### [03:50](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=230s) 跨越派系的大帐篷联盟与平稳过渡路径 Jason 指出，巴列维的父亲执政时是君主制，后来演变成了独裁体制，而如今人们期盼的是一个通过自由选举产生、人民自主当家的民主体制。考虑到当前伊朗人口非常年轻，平均年龄仅在 31、32 岁左右，社会转型面临全新格局。Jason 询问巴列维与伊朗国内各方沟通的实际情况，以及过渡期建立的时间线。 巴列维阐述称，现在的竞争格局已经扭转，待轰炸行动告一段落，民众将更有底气重返街头夺回属于自己的家园。他强调，伊朗局势的关键变量在于政权内部的“内爆”与倒戈程度——军队、安全部队以及文官行政体系能否弃暗投明，不再充当镇压机器，转而协助人民过渡。巴列维明确区分了伊朗与当年萨达姆倒台后伊拉克的“去复兴党化”乱局：伊朗拥有数千年的民族国家历史，底蕴深厚，拥有强大的国家凝聚力，决不会重蹈伊拉克的覆辙。 他勾勒出了一个包容各方的“大帐篷（big tent）”政治同盟： - 涵盖政治光谱的各个阵营：右派、中间派、左派，君主制拥护者与共和派人士兼收并蓄。 - 广泛团结全伊朗各民族与各宗教团体，调动知识分子、高校师生、工薪阶层与海外侨民的力量。 - 确立世俗民主制度的基调，但具体的最终政体形式（无论是君主立宪还是民主共和）必须交由全体伊朗人民通过制宪程序与自由公正的选举来共同决定。 - 破除体制性歧视与压迫，给极具天赋和创造力的年轻一代伊朗人平等的创业与发展空间。 ### [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=448s) 王储回国条件与特朗普“无条件投降”通牒的解读 谈到何时亲自踏上祖国土地，巴列维坦言目前很难给出一个严苛的时间表。回国的进度取决于体制内官员与军人倒戈的速度、国内组织结构的健全程度以及安全局势的成熟度。他幽默而务实地表示：“如果我死了，我对任何人都没有用处”，因此必须保障基本的安全条件；但他迫切渴望尽早回国，因为身在现场直接领导能发挥远大于海外遥控的作用，一旦条件允许，他会立刻动身。 针对唐纳德·特朗普当天早晨提出的“政权残余力量必须无条件投降，否则绝无协议可能”的严厉通牒，Jason 询问巴列维如何看待这一强硬表态。巴列维从伊朗国内民意的视角剖析道：过渡方案要想成功，核心在于必须在伊朗人民眼中具备“合法性”。数以万计的伊朗同胞付出了鲜血和生命的代价，绝不可能妥协接受让神权政权的残余势力换汤不换药地苟延残喘，人民要求的是彻底决裂（a clean break）。 巴列维强调，任何有意愿从旧政权剥离并加入世俗民主过渡进程的势力，都必须遵从四项核心共识原则，其中第一项且最不可动摇的底线，就是“维护伊朗的国家领土完整（Iran's territorial integrity）”——这是跨越所有族裔与宗教分歧、深植于数千万伊朗人心中最核心的情感共识与政治基石。 ### [10:07](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=607s) 民主转型的核心基石与“前100天”行动方案 礼萨·巴列维（Reza Pahlavi）阐明了未来伊朗走向民主的先决条件。首先，全体国民必须在一面国旗下团结为统一的国家；其次，实现民主至关重要的前提是“政教分离”（separation of religion from state）；第三是法律面前人人平等以及确立真正的法治，以此作为保障所有公民权利的基石。在具体路径上，伊朗人民需要自主选出代表进入制宪会议（Constitutional Assembly），辩论并起草未来国家的制度构想与法律条文，交由全民公投批准，进而选出新民主制度下的第一届议会与第一届民选政府。一旦完成这一阶段，临时过渡政府便会将权力完全移交给民选代表。 为了确保过渡期平稳落地，巴列维成立了一个名为“伊朗繁荣项目”（IPP，Iran Prosperity Project）的组织，其首要任务就是制定极为详尽的“前100天”（the first 100 days）应急与稳定计划。该方案重点解答如何在政权更迭发生后第一时间稳住伊朗国内局势，并尽可能吸纳现体制内愿意与人民站在一起的残留力量，让他们得以平稳度过政权瓦解期，并在未来的国家建设中找到一席之地。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 伊朗民主转型路径图 accDescr: 展示从稳定前100天到最终民选政府交接的过渡流程架构。 subgraph Phase1 ["第一阶段：危机稳定"] A["启动 IPP 前100天计划"] --> B["维持社会基本秩序与物资稳定"] B --> C["吸纳体制内转向力量以促平稳过渡"] end subgraph Phase2 ["第二阶段：立宪与民意决断"] C --> D["举行全国选举产生制宪会议"] D --> E["充分辩论政体形式与起草新宪法"] E --> F["全民公投表决新宪法"] end subgraph Phase3 ["第三阶段：权力移交"] F --> G["选举首届新国会与民选政府"] G --> H["过渡团队正式移交国家政权"] end ``` ### [11:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=696s) 制度之争与中立调停人：君主立宪还是共和制？ 主持人提出外界最为关注的核心疑问：作为一个正在争取民主国家的流亡王子，未来的伊朗是否绝不考虑君主制？巴列维本人是否会出任总统并领导国家走出长达47年的梦魇？对此，巴列维明确回应自己的关注点是“过程而非结果”（focus is on the process, not the outcome）。作为过渡阶段的中立调停者，他绝不会提前偏向某一种特定的政治形态，最终选择必须交由伊朗人民决定。他指出，放眼全球，无论是共和制（如印度、以色列、法国、美国），还是议会君主立宪制（如日本、瑞典、西班牙、加拿大），都存在非常成功的民主样本，民主绝不等同于单一政体。 巴列维强调，过渡领袖的天职是充当“通向结果的桥梁”（a bridge towards that outcome），而非谋求个人的官职、权力或威权。他的使命是将全国力量团结在共同目标之下，保障所有人能在阳光下自由辩论与选择。他格外提醒，绝不能重蹈半个世纪前的覆辙：1979年革命时，几乎没有人真正清楚霍梅尼口中的“法基赫的监护”（Velayat-e Faqih，最高领袖神权统治）究竟意味着什么，等掌权已成既成事实，全体伊朗人便沦为体制的囚徒。这一次必须做到绝对透明，向国民完整展示不同政治架构的利弊，让选票箱成为衡量民意的唯一尺度。 - **不谋求个人权力**：巴列维明确表示自己不作为候选人竞选公职，只承担引导转型、弥合分歧的阶段性职责。 - **划清民主君主制与海湾传统君主制的界限**：未来的任何讨论都以现代议会民主、分权制衡为底线，绝非回归中东传统君主专制。 - **全民公决与知情选择**：通过充分的公共辩论，确保全体选民在完全知情的状态下决定未来的国家形态。 ### [15:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=926s) 与特朗普政府的沟通及西方干涉的边界 针对唐纳德·特朗普（Donald Trump）此前在公开言论中流露出“可能挑选伊朗下一任领导人”并质疑巴列维国内号召力的说法，巴列维给出了坦诚的回应。他证实，自己团队与特朗普政府一直保持着沟通，其中主要渠道是通过公开宣布此事的史蒂夫·威特科夫（Steve Witkoff），同时也与美国参众两院的国会议员维持着密切对话，向美国政界清晰阐述该过渡方案的设计构想。 巴列维直言，特朗普或任何世界领导人都不应僭越去替伊朗人决定谁来掌舵国家。真正的西方民主原则应当不言自明——决定伊朗未来领袖的权利只属于伊朗人民自己。国际社会与大国的积极角色在于“协助这一进程”（assist that process）并支持伊朗人民的民主愿望，提供外部支持而非强加政治结果。他相信在这一原则上，无论是与特朗普还是其他国家领导人沟通，都不存在根本分歧。 ### [17:16](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1036s) 伊朗人民的真实面貌：从硅谷精英到9/11烛光守夜 在谈及美国大众应当如何看待伊朗的真实文化与人民精神时，巴列维打破了外界因德黑兰政权产生的刻板印象。他指出，庞大的在美伊朗裔群体早已通过婚姻、商业纽带深度融入美国社会，尤其在硅谷等高科技创新中心，大量伊朗人担任顶尖工程师、科研人员与创业先锋，展现出深厚的现代文明潜能与文化创造力。伊朗人民长期被神权体制窒息，但社会底色对西方文明抱有深厚的好感。 巴列维还分享了一段震撼人心的历史记忆：2001年“9/11”恐怖袭击发生当天，中东多国甚至部分所谓的“盟友”街头出现庆祝狂欢，而整个中东地区唯一自发走上街头、为美国遇难者点燃烛光守夜默哀的国家，恰恰是伊朗的人民。多年来，伊朗街头抗议者早已向世界发出明确信号，高喊“他们对我们撒谎说敌人是美国，我们的敌人就在这里”（They lie to us that it's America; our enemy is right here）。正是基于这种民间深处的共鸣，美伊人民之间建立民主伙伴关系以重建国家，具有无可替代的现实与历史意义。 ### [20:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1204s) 走向自由与稳定的历史拐点：九千三百万伊朗人的愿景 礼萨·巴列维王储强调，一个重获新生的伊朗不仅将为整个中东乃至全球带来至关重要的稳定基石，而且完全符合美国自身的国家利益。他指出，美伊之间迫切需要建立这种具有生命力的伙伴关系，而各方如今正展现出前所未有的决心与承诺，共同推进这一历史进程。主持人杰森·卡拉卡尼斯（Jason Calacanis）对巴列维王储的愿景深表赞同，并表示所有人都在为伊朗人民实现民主而祈祷。 杰森感慨道，如果九千三百万饱受苦难的伊朗人能够生活在一个自由的民主体制之下，那将是何等震撼的历史时刻。届时，伊朗将一跃成为中东地区幅员与人口最为庞大的民主国家，对整个人类文明进程产生不可估量的深远影响与繁荣红利。杰森深情回忆起自己在洛杉矶生活期间接触到的波斯人社群，盛赞他们是他所见过的最乐观、最勤勉、最美丽的人群之一，这种特质令他强烈联想到自己身上的希腊与爱尔兰血统。在感谢王储拨冗出席《All-In》播客并向其表达敬意后，杰森期待王储在未来重返故土、与获得自由的伊朗人民站在一起时，能再次做客节目。 - 自由民主的伊朗将涵盖 9,300 万人口，直接成为中东地区规模最大的民主政体。 - 杰森高度评价海外波斯裔群体的勤勉与生命力，并强调向全球科技与商业受众传递王储过渡愿景的重要性。 --- ### [21:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1293s) 舍文·皮谢瓦加入对谈：四万余示威者遭屠杀与政权的残暴现实 硅谷著名投资人舍文·皮谢瓦（Shervin Pishevar）随后接入访谈。杰森对舍文促成王储做客节目表达了由衷感谢。舍文首先感谢杰森向伊朗人民与王储开放《All-In》这一极具影响力的平台，并毫不吝啬地盛赞王储是他所见过“最勇敢、最具正直品格的人”。他指出，王储一生行事清白，在国家历史的转折关头挺身而出，赌上了个人的一切与历史遗产，旨在作为过渡期的核心凝聚者，带领整个国家走出长达 47 年的黑暗梦魇。 舍文随后将焦点转向德黑兰当局令人发指的暴行。他透露，就在上个月，该政权在短短 48 小时内残暴屠杀了超过 43,000 名和平示威的普通民众。安全部队甚至使用了重型反器材弹药直接扫射人群，舍文在社交媒体上发布过一张子弹与可口可乐易拉罐的对比照片，弹体尺寸甚至比可乐罐还要巨大。杰森对此感到极其震惊并呼吁公众深思：调转枪口向四万多名手无寸铁的抗议者疯狂扫射，是绝大多数文明世界所无法想象的野蛮行径，而国际媒体对这场血腥大屠杀的报道严重不足。谈及美国历任政府，舍文虽然过去长期支持奥巴马等民主党人，但他直言布什、奥巴马和拜登都未能在伊朗问题上取得突破，唯有特朗普展现出了直面这一恐怖政权的政治勇气。 - 德黑兰现政权在近期抗议中动用反器材大口径武器扫射平民，48 小时内造成逾 4.3 万名和平示威者丧生。 - 舍文强调，伊朗民众历经了 47 年的专制统治，如今正迎来摆脱噩梦的决定性窗口。 --- ### [24:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1488s) 核威胁、流氓政权与“以伊联盟”的建立 舍文提出了一个核心安全法则：“我们的道德安全预示着我们的物理安全”（"our moral security presages our physical security"）。他认为瓦解伊朗现政权不仅关乎伊朗人民的生死，更直接决定了美国的国家安全。面对外界的解放军事行动，该政权的本能反应是同时向周边 12 个国家发动攻击。舍文断言，如果这个政权拥有核武器，他们绝对会毫不犹豫地按动核按钮，其底层意识形态与发动“9·11”事件的恐怖分子如出一辙。现代地缘政治最危险的特征，正是犯罪与恐怖组织直接绑架了主权国家并掌握或谋求核武装（如俄罗斯、伊朗、朝鲜等）。 在舍文看来，该伊斯兰政权既不合法，也不能被视作一个正统的民族国家，而王储巴列维是引领向民主过渡的唯一具备合法性的领袖。他感叹当前世界正处于“圣经时代”般的历史汇聚点，特朗普总统、以色列总理内塔尼亚胡与巴列维王储三位领袖罕见地同处一个时代。在“10·7”事件爆发后，舍文联合顶级风险投资家迈克尔·艾森伯格（Michael Eisenberg）、迈克尔·布鲁希姆（Michael Broukhim）、杰西·梅曼（Jesse Maiman）与 Tinder 创始人肖恩·拉德（Shawn Rad）等人创立了“以伊联盟”（Israeli-Iranian Alliance），并在纽约等地为王储举办沙龙，吸引了对冲基金巨头丹·勒布（Dan Loeb）等众多政商领袖参与，致力于打破数十年的敌对僵局。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 应对中东危机的战略联盟与历史推手 accDescr: 展现特朗普、内塔尼亚胡与巴列维王储的历史协同，以及以伊民间政商沙龙联盟的形成与目标。 subgraph Leaders["时代领袖的历史协同"] T["唐纳德·特朗普"] N["本雅明·内塔尼亚胡"] P["礼萨·巴列维王储"] end subgraph Alliance["以伊联盟民间推手"] S["舍文·皮谢瓦 (Shervin Pishevar)"] ME["迈克尔·艾森伯格 (Michael Eisenberg)"] DL["丹·勒布 (Dan Loeb) 等领袖沙龙"] end subgraph Objective["终极安全诉求"] Eliminate["消除中东核勒索风险"] Liberation["终结 47 年专制统治"] Democracy["建立 9300 万人口的民主国家"] end Leaders --> Alliance Alliance --> Objective ``` - 该政权在面临军事施压的第一反应是针对中东 12 个国家实施报复打击，凸显了若其掌握核弹将带来的毁灭性后果。 - “以伊联盟”搭建了犹太群体与波斯侨民精英的高层对话通道，旨在复兴两大古老民族的互信与合作。 --- ### [27:16](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1636s) 跨越两千五百年的纽带：从居鲁士大帝到美国立国精神 舍文追溯了犹太人与波斯人之间长达 2,500 年的历史渊源。他提到在《圣经》中备受推崇的居鲁士大帝（Cyrus the Great）：居鲁士在征服巴比伦后解救了沦为奴隶的犹太人，护送他们重返耶路撒冷故土，并资助重建了第二圣殿。这一壮举千百年来被犹太民族传颂。而如今的历史仿佛形成了一种圣经式的对称闭环——曾被波斯人解放的犹太民族，正在协助伊朗人民摆脱自身遭受的精神与肉体奴役。 更鲜为人知的是波斯文明与美国建国先贤的渊源。美国《独立宣言》的主要起草人托马斯·杰斐逊曾深入研读居鲁士大帝的治理哲学与宽容思想，后者颁布的《居鲁士圆柱》被普遍视为人类历史上第一份人权宣言。美国宪法、权利法案中所蕴含的核心自由理念，很大程度上借鉴了居鲁士的人权思想。杰森在赞叹这一历史深度的同时，也对当前局势保持了理性警惕。他指出特朗普的行动虽然极具魄力，但也是一场风险极高的地缘政治豪赌，一旦失控局势将迅速恶化，因此必须保持谦逊审慎，在祈祷最佳结局的同时做好面对复杂动荡的准备。 - 居鲁士大帝于公元前 6 世纪解放巴比伦之囚并重建耶路撒冷圣殿，奠定了两民族 2,500 年的深厚友谊。 - 托马斯·杰斐逊受《居鲁士圆柱》启发，将古典波斯的人权与宽容原则融入美国立国文献与制度设计中。 --- ### [29:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1748s) 海湾国家的繁荣蓝图与伊朗未来的经济潜能 杰森谈到过去三年自己对中东地缘商业的观察，尤其是阿联酋、沙特阿拉伯、卡塔尔、阿曼、科威特等海湾阿拉伯国家合作委员会（GCC）君主国展现出的惊人现代化步伐，并询问舍文：如果伊朗直接跨入民主制度，将给中东格局带来何种冲击？ 舍文指出，海湾阿拉伯国家的现代化轨迹是展现中东无限潜力的绝佳范例。这些国家与伊朗同样受到天然资源的眷顾，拥有丰富的石油与天然气储备，具备独立自主发展经济的坚实资本。舍文回忆自己在 2001 至 2002 年间造访阿联酋时，迪拜的荒漠中仅有零星的几栋建筑，而如今已成为世界级的现代化大都会。他将 GCC 国家的崛起比作 20 世纪 50 年代二战归来后的美国——艾森豪威尔总统主导修建州际高速公路系统，激发了“一切皆有可能”的国家雄心。舍文坚信，如果将海湾国家这种追求卓越的建设心态赋予拥有九千三百万高素质人口、深厚历史底蕴与丰富资源的伊朗，该国所能迸发出的经济与文化能量将彻底重塑整个中东的文明版图。 - 迪拜等海湾城市从 2000 年代初的荒芜发展到今日全球枢纽，成为中东资源型国家现代化转型的成熟参照。 - 舍文将海湾国家的基建与进取精神与美国 1950 年代艾森豪威尔时期的建设狂潮相媲美，认为民主伊朗的潜力将远超海湾诸国。 ### [30:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1846s) 伊朗侨民的万亿级价值与新伊朗的经济红利 谈及伊朗人的潜力时，舍尔文·皮谢瓦（Shervin Pishevar）满怀激情地列举了身处美国及硅谷的伊朗裔科技领袖：Uber 首席执行官达拉·科斯罗萨西（Dara Khosrowshahi）、曾在 Google 早期立下汗马功劳的欧米德·科尔德斯塔尼（Omid Kordestani）、Databricks 创始人兼首席执行官阿里·戈德西（Ali Ghodsi），以及 eBay 创始人皮埃尔·奥米迪亚（Pierre Omidyar）。舍尔文感慨道，仅仅是硅谷这一小群流亡的伊朗人，所创造的企业价值总和就高达数万亿美元。他由衷感谢美国为他们提供了施展才华的安全庇护所，但他同时强调，伊朗本土滞留着数量更为庞大、智力同样超群的人才，他们被现行政权压制了整整四十七年。 在舍尔文看来，一个自由、民主的伊朗将成为“赠予世界及中东地区最伟大的和平红利与经济红利”。当前人类正处于通用人工智能（AGI）、超级智能与量子计算（正如舍尔文、埃米尔·迈克尔与 D-Wave 合作推进的项目）爆发的前夜，若能将中东及伊朗丰厚的人力资本与庞大的油气财富深度结合，整个中东将加速转型为全球顶尖的创新与投资枢纽，从而极大加快人类文明的前进步伐。 - **硅谷伊朗裔精英商业版图**：涵盖 Uber、Google、Databricks、eBay 等科技巨头，累计创造数万亿美元市值。 - **和平与经济红利**：解除制裁并释放伊朗 8500 多万人口的智力资本与油气资源，将彻底重塑中东地缘经济格局。 --- ### [32:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1948s) “伊朗繁荣计划”：重塑国家的过渡路线图 舍尔文向镜头展示了一份长达 175 页的重磅规划文件——《伊朗繁荣计划》（Iran Prosperity Project）。作为该项目的顾问之一，他与多位杰出的伊朗各界精英共同为王储礼萨·巴列维制定了一份详尽的逐月过渡方案。这份路线图旨在确保政权更迭后社会平稳过渡，通过严格的法治程序确立新宪法，并立即启动全方位的经济重建。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 伊朗政权平稳过渡路线图 accDescr: 展示从全民公决到制定宪法再到最终公投的完整过渡时间线 subgraph Phase1 ["第一阶段：公投确立国体"] A["启动过渡治理"] --> B["4个月内组织全民公决"] end subgraph Phase2 ["第二阶段：起草与确立宪法"] B --> C["历时6个月组建制宪会议"] C --> D["历时14个月起草并敲定宪法草案"] D --> E["举行全民宪法公投"] end subgraph Phase3 ["第三阶段：全面经济重建"] E --> F["确立法治框架与新政府"] F --> G["落地《伊朗繁荣计划》全面复兴各产业"] end ``` 根据该计划的设计，当伊朗实现解放后，首先将展开为期 4 个月的过渡程序并举行全民公投；随后将耗时 6 个月召集各阶层代表组建制宪会议；接着在随后的 14 个月内彻底完成宪法的起草、定稿并交付全民投票表决。这套环环相扣的法律流程将为新伊朗奠定稳固的宪政框架，进而全面激活国内各行各业的重建工作。 --- ### [33:41](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2021s) 47年的“AB测试”与政教分离的全民共识 主持人杰森·卡拉卡尼斯提出质疑：巴列维国王当年的统治并非完人，目前伊朗国内也有反对声音，且推翻神权体制并实现彻底的“政教分离”极具风险，正如沙特王储 MBS 改革时面临的巨大反弹一样。舍尔文对此明确回应：绝大多数伊朗民众坚决支持政教分离（“Separation of mosque and state”）。他打了个生动的硅谷比喻：过去 47 年伊斯兰教士阶层的统治，本质上就是一场惨烈残酷的“A/B 测试”，其结果毫无疑问是一场人道灾难、混乱与纯粹的罪恶。 舍尔文指出，伊朗街头涌动的民意早已说明了一切。在当年一月的抗议活动中，抗议民众高呼“国王万岁”（Javid Shah）以及礼萨·巴列维的名字。当王储呼吁民众在 8 日和 9 日晚上 8 点走上街头时，数以百万计的人群响应号召涌向城市各处。“事实胜于雄辩”，巴列维是目前唯一被伊朗人民指名道姓呼唤回国领导过渡进程的领袖。民众甚至公开恳求特朗普与内塔尼亚胡协助摧毁该恐怖政权。随着美军第 82 空降师进入戒备状态的报道见诸《华盛顿邮报》，舍尔文认为针对该政权军事与恐怖能力的精准瓦解已经进入不可逆的轨道，正如官方所言，这大概需要四周左右的定点行动。 - **民意呼声**：抗议者走上街头公开呼喊“Javid Shah”，响应巴列维的集会号召。 - **神权恶果**：47年的神权政治被证明彻底失败，政教分离成为全社会最强烈的普遍共识。 - **外部行动**：美军与盟友针对政权机器的定点清除与去武装化正在加速执行。 --- ### [36:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2189s) 军队倒戈、去激进化与多代际心理创伤疗愈 针对杰森关于军方是否已经开始倒戈的提问，舍尔文透露了关键的内幕渠道：巴列维王储团队建立了一套安全加密的通讯系统，已有超过 50,000 名伊朗军方与安全人员通过该系统与王储取得了直接联系，网络上也出现了大量军人公开发布的倒戈视频。舍尔文特别强调，在军事打击初期，伊斯兰革命卫队（IRGC）的最高层领导在最初 24 小时内就被定点清除；而统治并恐吓世界长达 47 年的最高领袖哈梅内伊，“仅仅坚持了 60 秒便灰飞烟灭”。 舍尔文指出，对于剩下的体制内人员而言，最理性的选择是彻底放弃抵抗并投降： - **区别对待与宽肃政策**：只要没有亲手对伊朗人民执行种族屠杀和恐怖命令的军人，过渡政府不会展开无差别的报复性追捕。 - **安置方案**：一部分人员可选择提前退休；而具备专业技能且愿意服务国家的军政人员，可以继续到岗工作、领取薪水，参与国家的和平重建。 - **心理创伤疗愈**：舍尔文与杰森一致认为，伊朗人民承受了整整 47 年“多代际的严重心理创伤”（multi-generational trauma），新政权建立后亟需大量专业心理医疗专家介入，帮助整个民族走出恐惧阴影。 --- ### [38:52](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2332s) 领土完整是绝对红线：舍尔文·皮谢瓦的家族记忆 杰森提及西方情报机构与叙利亚阿萨德政权背景下关于库尔德民兵等分裂势力的报道。舍尔文对此极其严肃地划定了底线：“伊朗作为一个国家、一个民族已经延续了 5000 年。历史上无数侵略者来来去去，但我们最终熬死了所有的入侵者。”他痛斥过去 47 年掌权的教士集团根本不是真正的伊朗人，而是这片土地的非法占领者，其下场必将与当年的成吉思汗等外敌一样被彻底扫地出门。任何企图肢解伊朗的分裂行径都会彻底丧失数千万民众的支持，“领土完整是巴列维王储与全体伊朗人民不可动摇的绝对红线”。 在谈到回归故土的情感时，舍尔文深情回忆了自己的家族往事。他出生于 1976 年，当时巴列维国王正出资选拔全国最拔尖的人才前往全球深造，70 年代伊朗学生曾是全美研究生院规模最大的留学生群体。舍尔文的父亲在 1976 年美国建国二百周年之际来到华盛顿特区，居住在第 16 街，并在美国天主教大学攻读硕士学位。 1978 年全家返回伊朗，舍尔文的父亲被国王任命为伊朗国家广播电视局的主管。然而回国不久伊斯兰革命便轰然爆发，霍梅尼强势夺权。面对险境，舍尔文的父亲做出了极具勇气的抉择：秘密为美国大使馆提供无线电通讯设备，并通过外语广播向身处德黑兰的外国人播报逃生指引，协助他们撤离这个即将陷入黑暗的国家。 - **历史韧性**：伊朗拥有 5000 年文明史，具有强大的国家凝聚力与抵御占领者的历史惯性。 - **国家统一**：坚决反对任何外部势力支持的碎片化或分裂势力，主张统一进军德黑兰。 - **家庭抉择**：舍尔文父亲在 1978 年伊斯兰革命前夕临危受命，在政权崩塌关头利用国家广电资源秘密协助美使馆及外籍人士安全撤离。 ### [41:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2516s) 逃亡经历与出租车往事：从 35 美元难民到 Uber 投资人 舍尔文·皮谢瓦（Shervin Pishevar）深情回忆了他们全家在伊朗革命后的惊险逃亡历程。霍梅尼与哈梅内伊掌权后，将舍尔文的父亲亚伯拉罕（Abraham）列入了处决名单。为了保命，父亲被迫东躲西藏整整十个月，舍尔文在那段时间完全见不到父亲。转折发生在一个极具宿命感的时刻：一名曾受过他父亲恩惠、借此进入广播电视台工作的人找上门来，主动向舍尔文的母亲提出协助逃跑的意愿。起初母亲充满戒备，谎称不知丈夫下落，直到暗中向丈夫核实后，父亲确认此人绝对信得过。令人意想不到的是，这名故人当时已成为德黑兰梅赫拉巴德国际机场（Mehrabad Airport）的新任安保负责人。舍尔文至今依然清晰记得，离别那天他被弟弟的哭声惊醒，躲藏十个月的父亲站在门前与他们道别，因为谁也不知道这一别是否还能生还。在机场负责人的亲自护送下，父亲顺利登上了法国航空（Air France）的航班飞往美国，并在曾经帮助过的友人协助下办妥了合法身份与文件。 父辈离开后，舍尔文与母亲及兄弟姐妹仍被困在伊朗长达两年。当时正值萨达姆·侯赛因发动两伊战争，德黑兰每晚警报长鸣、炸弹倾泻而下。最终，母亲带着舍尔文与弟弟妹妹设法出逃，抵达美国时全家身上仅剩 35 美元。为了维持生计并攻读博士学位，舍尔文的父亲在华盛顿特区开起了出租车，母亲则做帮佣清洁工。舍尔文笑着谈及这一巨大的人生悖论——正是幼年时在华盛顿特区那些橙黑相间的出租车后座上长大的经历，让他在日后与杰森·卡拉卡尼斯（Jason Calacanis）及特拉维斯·卡兰尼克（Travis Kalanick）初次碰面时产生了深厚共鸣，更帮助他在与全美顶尖风投机构的激烈竞争中脱颖而出，成功拿下了对 Uber 的早期关键投资。 舍尔文感慨只有在美国，一个出租车司机与女佣的儿子才能在两手空空开局的情况下逆袭改变命运。他强调自己永远不会忘记自己的根，过去致力于回馈与报效美国，如今则倾尽全力协助流亡王储礼萨·巴列维推进政权过渡进程，帮助伊朗重获自由并重建辉煌。 - **生死逃亡**：父亲亚伯拉罕因名列处决名单躲藏 10 个月，凭借曾帮助过的梅赫拉巴德机场新任安保主管协助，搭乘法航航班流亡海外。 - **两伊战火**：母子四人在空袭炸弹与警报声中苦撑两年后成功出逃，入境美国时全副身家仅有 35 美元。 - **全生态闭环（Full Circle）**：从父辈以开出租车养家并攻读博士，到儿子凭借出租车成长背景打动创始人、赢得 Uber 投资大单。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 舍尔文一家的逃亡与成长轨迹 accDescr: 展现从德黑兰被迫逃亡到美国逆袭成为顶尖科技投资人的核心历程。 subgraph IranEscape["伊朗危机与逃亡"] A["父亲面临处决威胁<br/>隐匿潜伏 10 个月"] --> B["机场安保故人相助<br/>乘法航飞机流亡"] C["母子在空袭警报下苦撑 2 年<br/>携 35 美元逃抵美国"] end subgraph USARebuild["美国奋斗与反哺"] B & C --> D["父母开出租与做帮佣<br/>半工半读攻读博士"] D --> E["出租车背景助攻<br/>赢得 Uber 早期投资"] E --> F["助力伊朗过渡进程<br/>支持王储重建国家"] end ``` ### [44:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2651s) 伊朗人民的韧性、安东尼·波登与重聚德黑兰的约定 杰森·卡拉卡尼斯由衷赞叹伊朗人民在长达 47 年的残暴压迫下依然保持的精神面貌。他提及已故名厨安东尼·波登（Anthony Bourdain）大约十年前拍摄的伊朗特辑，那一幕深深震撼了他：波登走在德黑兰街头，惊讶地发现伊朗老百姓骨子里就像美国人一样热爱生活——他们吃着必胜客、听流行音乐、在自家后院喝啤酒、跳舞，即便在重重网络审查下，也通过 VPN 翻墙紧随全球流行文化。无论是女性、性少数群体还是普通大众，尽管承受着系统性的残酷迫害，他们依旧洋溢着鲜活的生命力。杰森将伊朗人热烈好客的性格与希腊人和爱尔兰人相提并论：“他们会陪你聊到餐馆打烊，当店家关上大门，大家搬着椅子坐在门外还能继续聊上一个小时。” 舍尔文对此深表赞同，表示这正是伊朗民族真正的灵魂所在：热衷于在沙发上热情款待宾朋好友。他坚称伊朗人民骨子里向往自由，苦难深重已久，因此格外感激特朗普总统有魄力正面硬抗这个邪恶政权。他与杰森相约，希望能在不久的将来于德黑兰现场录制一期《All-In》播客。杰森兴奋地表示这将是他毕生的心愿清单之一，并当场提议：“让我们把时间定在一年后的今天，坐在德黑兰喝茶录播客。” 谈到伊朗的美食文化，舍尔文如数家珍。虽然外人大多只知道波斯烤肉（Kababs），但真正的伊朗本土烤肉风味截然不同。他特别隆重推荐了伊朗的国菜——炖羊肉香草汤（Ghormeh Sabzi）。舍尔文充满怀念地提到，自己的母亲是世界上最顶级的波斯大厨，做这道炖菜往往要慢火熬煮整整三天。杰森则笑称希腊人和伊朗人有着完全相同的味蕾基因——对羊肉毫无抵抗力。在节目的尾声，杰森向舍尔文致谢，祝愿他在接下来的三到五周关键行动中好运，并与观众道别；随后节目切入经典片尾鬼畜曲与四位主持人的标志性搞怪金句合辑。 - **波登的文化观察**：伊朗民众在严酷极权下依然借助 VPN 拥抱世界文化，保持着听歌、跳舞、聚会的日常生活与乐观天性。 - **德黑兰录制约定**：杰森与舍尔文约定在一年后政权平稳过渡之时，赴自由的德黑兰喝茶并举办《All-In》实地播客。 - **波斯国菜 Ghormeh Sabzi**：经典的羊肉香草香料炖菜，讲究耗时两至三天精心慢炖，承载着深厚的家族与故土记忆。 ## Notable quotes > [01:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=81s) 如果不是当年的伊斯兰革命，今天的伊朗本该是该地区的‘韩国’，坐拥丰富资源与卓越人才；然而它却沦为了该地区的‘朝鲜’。 — 礼萨·巴列维 > [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=448s) 如果我死了，我对任何人都没有用处。 — 礼萨·巴列维 > [17:16](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1036s) 他们对我们撒谎说敌人是美国，我们的敌人就在这里。 — 礼萨·巴列维 > [24:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1488s) 我们的道德安全预示着我们的物理安全。 — 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 > [30:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=1846s) 仅仅是硅谷这一小群流亡的伊朗人，所创造的企业价值总和就高达数万亿美元。 — 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 > [36:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2189s) 统治并恐吓世界长达 47 年的最高领袖哈梅内伊，仅仅坚持了 60 秒便灰飞烟灭。 — 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 > [38:52](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2332s) 伊朗作为一个国家、一个民族已经延续了 5000 年。历史上无数侵略者来来去去，但我们最终熬死了所有的入侵者。 — 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 > [41:56](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2516s) 只有在美国，一个出租车司机与女佣的儿子才能在两手空空开局的情况下逆袭改变命运。 — 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 > [44:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw&t=2651s) 让我们把时间定在一年后的今天，坐在德黑兰喝茶录播客。 — 杰森·卡拉卡尼斯 ## Mentioned 礼萨·巴列维 (Reza Pahlavi), 杰森·卡拉卡尼斯 (Jason Calacanis), 舍尔文·皮谢瓦 (Shervin Pishevar), 唐纳德·特朗普 (Donald Trump), 史蒂夫·威特科夫 (Steve Witkoff), 本雅明·内塔尼亚胡 (Benjamin Netanyahu), 迈克尔·艾森伯格 (Michael Eisenberg), 迈克尔·布鲁希姆 (Michael Broukhim), 杰西·梅曼 (Jesse Maiman), 肖恩·拉德 (Shawn Rad), 丹·勒布 (Dan Loeb), 达拉·科斯罗萨西 (Dara Khosrowshahi), 欧米德·科尔德斯塔尼 (Omid Kordestani), 阿里·戈德西 (Ali Ghodsi), 皮埃尔·奥米迪亚 (Pierre Omidyar), 特拉维斯·卡兰尼克 (Travis Kalanick), 安东尼·波登 (Anthony Bourdain), 居鲁士大帝 (Cyrus the Great), 托马斯·杰斐逊 (Thomas Jefferson), 霍梅尼 (Ruhollah Khomeini), 哈梅内伊 (Ali Khamenei), 伊朗繁荣项目 (Iran Prosperity Project), 以伊联盟 (Israeli-Iranian Alliance), 居鲁士圆柱 (Cyrus Cylinder), All-In 播客, Uber, Google, Databricks, eBay, D-Wave, 法国航空 (Air France), 伊斯兰革命卫队 (IRGC), 梅赫拉巴德国际机场 (Mehrabad Airport), Ghormeh Sabzi ## Video description (0:00) Jason intros Prince Reza Pahlavi (1:09) Pahlavi's take on the war and vision for Iran's future, Democracy, and return (8:53) Trump's surrender conditions, core principles, role in transition and potential leadership (17:14) Thoughts on the people and the spirit of Iran (21:33) Shervin Pishevar joins: thoughts on the current regime killing 40k+ protestors, future of the Middle East (33:59) Future leader and government of Iran, plan for transition Follow Reza Pahlavi: https://x.com/PahlaviReza Follow Shervin: https://x.com/shervin Follow the besties: https://x.com/chamath https://x.com/Jason https://x.com/DavidSacks https://x.com/friedberg Follow on X: https://x.com/theallinpod Follow on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/theallinpod Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@theallinpod Follow on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/allinpod Intro Music Credit: https://rb.gy/tppkzl https://x.com/yung_spielburg Intro Video Credit: https://x.com/TheZachEffect #allin #tech #news [Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elhGYEiZ7fw)

[1:21] 礼萨·巴列维: 如果不是当年的伊斯兰革命，今天的伊朗本该是该地区的‘韩国’，坐拥丰富资源与卓越人才；然而它却沦为了该地区的‘朝鲜’。 [7:28] 礼萨·巴列维: 如果我死了，我对任何人都没有用处。 [17:16] 礼萨·巴列维: 他们对我们撒谎说敌人是美国，我们的敌人就在这里。 [24:48] 舍尔文·皮谢瓦: 我们的道德安全预示着我们的物理安全。 [30:46] 舍尔文·皮谢瓦: 仅仅是硅谷这一小群流亡的伊朗人，所创造的企业价值总和就高达数万亿美元。 [36:29] 舍尔文·皮谢瓦: 统治并恐吓世界长达 47 年的最高领袖哈梅内伊，仅仅坚持了 60 秒便灰飞烟灭。 [38:52] 舍尔文·皮谢瓦: 伊朗作为一个国家、一个民族已经延续了 5000 年。历史上无数侵略者来来去去，但我们最终熬死了所有的入侵者。 [41:56] 舍尔文·皮谢瓦: 只有在美国，一个出租车司机与女佣的儿子才能在两手空空开局的情况下逆袭改变命运。 [44:11] 杰森·卡拉卡尼斯: 让我们把时间定在一年后的今天，坐在德黑兰喝茶录播客。

[7:00] Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi: I'm no use to anyone if I'm dead. [16:47] They lie to us! Our enemy is right here, not America! [34:29] Shervin Pishevar: mosque and state [34:29] Javid Shah [44:11] Shervin Pishevar: Ghormeh Sabzi

[0:00] All right, everybody. Welcome back to [0:01] part two of the All-In podcast episode [0:05] 263. We promised you a part two because [0:08] we are very lucky that my dear friend [0:10] Shervin Pishevar was able to set up a [0:13] very important historic interview for us [0:16] today. [0:17] None other than Prince Reza [0:20] Pahlavi is here. [0:21] And we have a limited amount of time [0:24] with you, Reza. And may I call you Reza [0:27] or should I call you Prince Reza? [0:29] >> Thank you. [0:30] >> [laughter] [0:30] >> Uh [0:31] >> I can probably meet you on your program. [0:32] It It's great to have you. [0:35] And this is a moment I think you've been [0:37] waiting 47, close to 50 years for it, [0:40] which is we are at this moment in time [0:44] looking at [0:45] potentially the people of Iran being [0:47] free. You left the country and [0:50] when you were 17 years old to become a [0:51] pilot. And now [0:54] you are looking to help your people with [0:57] a transition post this military [1:00] activity, this operation, [1:03] essentially a war that's going on right [1:05] now that we all hope [1:07] gets resolved quickly. [1:09] I think people would love to know what [1:11] is your vision for Iran [1:16] post [1:17] this military action. [1:21] Well, thank you again for the [1:22] opportunity. Before I get into that, I [1:24] wanted to simply [1:26] stress the importance of this [1:28] intervention that it was like a rescue [1:30] mission. It was literally an a [1:33] humanitarian intervention to protect [1:36] more lives that it would otherwise be [1:38] lost under this extremely brutal and [1:40] repressive regime that as you know has [1:42] massacred as of late [1:44] tens of thousands of innocent and [1:46] unarmed citizens. In order to equalize [1:49] the playing field, this was a [1:50] much-needed [1:52] intervention that a lot of Iranians [1:53] asked for and fortunately it did happen. [1:57] But what's the next step? Where are we [1:59] headed to? [2:00] The most obvious question would be once [2:02] the regime collapses, how do we manage [2:04] the transition? I've stepped in to lead [2:06] this transition with the help of many of [2:08] my compatriots from various sectors. We [2:11] believe that a a stable transition will [2:13] lead to a address the immediate needs of [2:15] the country, but then set the country on [2:18] a path of redevelopment and [2:19] reconstruction, which is of course [2:21] something that we were always hoping for [2:24] that could not have a happened under [2:26] this uh corrupt mafia-like regime. Iran [2:29] should have been, had it not been for [2:31] the revolution, today's South Korea of [2:33] the region. Instead, it has become the [2:35] North Korea of the region. Why? Not [2:38] because our people are not gifted or [2:40] talented or capable, not because we lack [2:43] uh natural resources, it's simply [2:45] because of a corrupt bad management and [2:47] a regime that basically took our country [2:49] hostage, used it as a launching pad to [2:52] export an ideology, and that's why we [2:54] are here today. [2:55] A different Iran, a democratic secular [2:57] Iran would first and foremost bring [2:59] about the opportunities to our nation, [3:02] but it will open Iran for business [3:04] again. [3:05] Iran is one of the most untapped uh [3:07] uh economic um opportunities of the 21st [3:10] century, and it could tremendously uh [3:13] change the shape of our world in terms [3:15] of what would be beneficial to the [3:16] Iranian people, of course, but also uh [3:19] from the advantage point of a country [3:21] like the United States and billions of [3:23] dollars that will be generated as a [3:25] result of doing business in Iran. We [3:28] figure about 1 trillion in the first 10 [3:30] years to the US market, but also [3:33] billions of dollars that will be [3:34] invested into Iran and everything that [3:36] we need to have done in order to rebuild [3:39] our country. These are crazy [3:40] opportunities that uh we can look [3:42] forward to, and it all starts with [3:45] uh moving towards this recovery and [3:48] transition. [3:49] And [3:50] when your father was in charge, it was a [3:52] monarchy. Turned into a dictatorship. [3:55] And to be clear, the hope now is to [3:57] evolve into a democracy with free [4:00] elections for the people. Average age of [4:02] people in Iran now, [4:04] early 30s, 31, 32 years old. [4:07] What would that look like? What is a [4:08] possible timeline? And you are have said [4:11] on other programs and on your YouTube [4:13] channel, which I suggest everybody go [4:14] search for and follow right now because [4:16] you're speaking directly to the people [4:17] on X and on your YouTube channel. [4:21] What is What is the [4:23] condition on the ground from the people [4:25] you're talking to? You said you've been [4:27] talking to people in the military, [4:30] civilians, and other leadership. They're [4:32] ready to move on. What's the timeline? [4:35] And what are they telling you is [4:36] happening on the ground today as we sit [4:39] here? Well, I think that now the playing [4:41] field has been equalized, meaning that [4:42] the people could finally, of course, [4:45] awaiting the end of this campaign, have [4:47] a better opportunity to reengage the [4:49] streets and take over [4:51] their homeland. [4:52] Of course, part of the equation is how [4:54] much implosion from within the regime [4:56] and how much defection from the regime [4:58] in the sense of joining with the people [5:00] this time and not be an instrument that [5:03] will halt the people's progress, but [5:04] instead help the people in that [5:06] transition. Meaning whether people are [5:09] in the military or security forces, as [5:11] well as a civilian bureaucracy. Unlike [5:14] what happened after the fall of Saddam [5:16] Hussein and the Ba'athification, the [5:18] scenario of change in Iran is totally [5:19] different. [5:21] And let's not forget, Iran is a multiple [5:24] century old nation-state. It's a country [5:26] that is extremely unified and united for [5:29] this common purpose. [5:31] Under this tent, we have diverse groups [5:33] that are joining in this national [5:35] campaign. People who are on the right, [5:37] the center, the left, monarchists, [5:39] republicans, ethnic groups, religious [5:41] groups. Every sector of society is [5:44] engaged. I have had a tremendous amount [5:46] of uh coming from inside Iran. We have [5:48] the support of the uh intelligentsia. We [5:52] have the support of universities. We [5:54] have the support of the working class. [5:56] We have the support of uh the diaspora [5:58] that can bring a lot to this equation. I [6:01] think this is a good recipe uh that will [6:03] allow us to manage this uh transition, [6:06] but set the country [6:08] to clean up, be ready for business, and [6:11] create the opportunities that will [6:13] finally impact [6:15] first and foremost Iranians who have [6:17] been starving as a result of this [6:18] regime's corruption, but have a true [6:20] opportunity to get back on track and [6:22] improve their livelihood. And I think [6:24] it's also good for those who partner [6:25] with us in this process cuz there's a [6:27] lot to be uh done that will be win-win [6:29] as opposed to be lose-lose to the [6:31] benefit of this corrupt regime. That has [6:33] been the story of the past almost five [6:35] decades. [6:36] So, the difference lies in but this [6:38] change and how crucial it is. And of [6:39] course, the reason we want to have a [6:41] secular democracy, the final form to be [6:44] determined by the people of Iran through [6:46] free elections and a constitutional [6:48] process, but most important is that [6:50] under equality and the rule of law, all [6:53] the opportunities that has been denied [6:55] our nation as a result of its [6:56] discrimination, as a result of uh [6:59] pretty much disenfranchising the [7:00] majority of Iranians, now it creates a [7:03] true opportunity. And as I said earlier, [7:05] I think Iranians are quite gifted. As [7:07] much as it is attractive to uh um [7:09] entrepreneurs in the outside world [7:11] looking in, there's so many gifted and [7:13] talented young Iranians who will have a [7:15] fair chance this time, a true chance for [7:18] being uh using all their creativity and [7:20] genius uh to bring our country back [7:22] online. This will be an excellent, [7:24] fantastic partnership that we're looking [7:26] forward to. So, you've spoken about [7:29] wanting to be on the ground there. What [7:31] conditions and what timeline do you have [7:33] for yourself? And this seems like a a [7:35] pretty high-risk thing to do. It'd be [7:37] pretty brave of you to uh go to the [7:40] country now. What conditions have to be [7:42] met for you to [7:45] go to Iran, to go home [7:47] for the first time in 47 years? And how [7:50] close do you think we are to the people [7:52] taking the streets now and for starting [7:54] this transition? [7:56] Well, to be honest with you, it's very [7:58] difficult to put an exact timeline. [8:00] Factors that will expedite it is the [8:02] level of separation from the regime, the [8:05] level of defections, [8:07] the strengthening of domestic [8:09] organizations and structure. How can we [8:11] partner with elements from within that [8:13] are not joining this campaign? All of [8:15] these are factors that will contribute [8:17] to the rapidity of the of the [8:19] transition. As far as myself being [8:21] there, obviously there are security [8:23] concerns to make sure that it's safe [8:25] enough for me to go there. I'm no use to [8:27] anyone if I'm dead. So, obviously we [8:29] have to keep that in mind, but I would [8:31] like to be able to be there as soon as [8:32] possible to be able to help as much as I [8:35] can in this process. Obviously, being in [8:37] a country is an advantage. It's hard to [8:39] do things from far away. I had no choice [8:42] to be living in exile because of the [8:43] circumstances, but I think that the [8:45] opportunity is presenting itself and the [8:48] first opportunity that is created for me [8:50] to safely return to Iran, I will [8:52] obviously be there. Just this morning, [8:54] Trump said there will be no deal [8:56] in Iran until unconditional surrender [9:00] is given by whatever is left of the [9:04] government there. [9:06] What do you think of that condition? Is [9:08] that the right move? Do you agree with [9:09] Trump's ultimatum? [9:11] Well, let me look at it from the [9:13] domestic prism. In order for a [9:15] successful transition to occur, it has [9:18] ultimately to be something that is [9:20] legitimate in the eyes of the Iranian [9:22] people. [9:23] We have lost so many tens of thousands [9:25] of lives just to settle for a continuity [9:29] of the remnants of this regime. That [9:31] will not fly. People will want to have a [9:33] clean break. The alternative will be for [9:36] all those who align with the secular [9:37] democratic alternative and are some four [9:40] core principles that who whoever adheres [9:43] to to that including people who may [9:45] today peel away from the regime [9:47] would be able to agree to work together [9:49] on that platform. The first and foremost [9:51] issue is of course Iran's [9:54] territorial integrity. That's an issue [9:56] that is very close to the hearts of [9:57] millions of Iranians representing every [10:00] aspect of our [10:01] diversified country in terms of [10:04] ethnicities, religions and what have [10:06] you, but we find ourselves in this [10:07] united [10:09] cause under one flag and under one [10:11] nation. The second element that is a [10:13] prerequisite to democracy is a clear [10:16] separation of religion from state. [10:19] That's a critical element for a [10:20] democracy to occur. [10:22] Equality of all citizens under the law [10:25] and the rule of law obviously is a [10:26] critical aspect that guarantees all of [10:28] the rights we're talking about and the [10:30] democratic process itself meaning the [10:33] fact that people can elect the [10:34] representatives to go to this [10:36] constitutional assembly to debate the [10:38] issues of what the next system could [10:40] look like and what its laws should be [10:41] ratified by the people which would bring [10:44] us to the election of the first [10:46] parliament of this new democracy and of [10:48] course the election of the first [10:49] government of such democracy at which [10:52] point the transitional government hands [10:54] over power to the elected [10:57] representative of the people in the [10:58] future government. That's pretty much [11:00] the the the direction that we hope to [11:02] manage this transition and I'm playing a [11:05] role in bringing about this transition [11:07] with a very well crafted plan that is in [11:11] detail explaining [11:12] particularly focusing on the first 100 [11:14] days. [11:15] I created an organization called IPP [11:17] which is Iran prosperity project but its [11:20] first focus is the first 100 days. How [11:22] we immediately stabilize the situation [11:23] in Iran, how can we maximize the [11:26] remaining elements that will join with [11:28] us to be able to survive regime change [11:30] and have a place in the future. These [11:32] are the first components and then we [11:34] move forward with the plan. [11:36] Two quick questions. Under no [11:37] circumstances would that be a monarchy? [11:40] Uh I think uh is a question everybody [11:42] has for you because you're the prince. [11:45] This is a democracy. We don't have [11:47] princes in democracies. [11:48] And then number two, what do you ideally [11:50] see as your role in the transition? [11:53] And then would you like to have the [11:56] opportunity to run for president and to [11:59] lead the country out of this [12:01] horrific nightmare of 47 years? [12:04] My focus is on the process, not the [12:06] outcome. And in as a neutral arbiter, [12:08] I'm not taking sides with one form [12:11] versus the other. That's for the people [12:12] of Iran to choose. And I think the world [12:15] has seen successful models in both the [12:17] Republican system and a monarchic [12:19] system. Examples uh [12:22] a republic that you have like in India [12:24] or like in Israel or in France or the [12:27] United States, they're not exactly the [12:28] same. But that's on the of the [12:30] Republican structure. In terms of [12:33] parliamentary monarchies, we have the [12:34] example of Japan, Sweden, Spain, other [12:37] countries. So, I don't think that [12:39] necessarily you can equate democracy [12:41] with one outcome in particular. It could [12:43] be both models that people can emulate. [12:46] So, at the end of the day, you know, [12:48] again, uh it's not for me to choose the [12:50] outcome. I'm here to be a bridge towards [12:52] that outcome. That's the function of a [12:54] transitional leader, not to run for [12:56] office [12:57] or not to have an aim for personal uh [12:59] position or power or authority, but to [13:02] be the element that unites the country [13:04] towards a common purpose and allow the [13:06] nation to decide what is their preferred [13:09] system. That's what elections and free [13:11] elections should be all about. And the [13:13] ballot box is the only means to measure [13:15] uh people's uh opinion and the majority [13:18] uh will decide on that and that's the [13:20] process that I envisage to bring about. [13:22] What do you believe the people of Iran [13:24] want? And in that monarchy subset, there [13:29] are the Gulf monarchies, the kingdom, [13:31] UAE, [13:33] Qatar. [13:34] They are obviously distinctly different [13:36] than a parliamentary [13:39] you know, system. So, [13:41] I assume you wouldn't want to see that. [13:44] What do you think the people of Iran [13:46] will vote for? [13:47] But, just what you said. I mean, we [13:50] a democratic system clearly outlines how [13:53] it should be and and how it should not. [13:57] I mean, if you want to look at the [13:58] closest monarchy to the United States, [14:00] technically speaking, it's Canada. And [14:03] you know, if you want to look at that [14:04] way. And I think Canadians are quite [14:05] happy with a democracy that they enjoy. [14:08] And again, we have very good models of [14:10] republic. Case in point, the United [14:12] States. At the end of the day, as I [14:14] said, it's for the Iranian people to [14:16] determine what would be in their best [14:18] interest, having looked this time, [14:21] unlike what happened, by the way, 50 [14:23] years ago. Nobody had a clear idea what [14:26] Khomeini was suggesting [14:28] in terms of this Velayat-e Faqih, as [14:31] they call it, or the tutelage of the [14:33] supreme leader. By the time he took over [14:36] and power was established, it was too [14:38] late. And since then, we've been [14:39] hostages to this regime. This time, in [14:42] full transparency, the Iranian people [14:44] ought to have a clear idea of different [14:47] models presented to them. And on that [14:49] basis, having understood every aspect of [14:52] what it could be, then they make their [14:53] choice. This is a process that should be [14:55] totally transparent, with enough time [14:57] for debating different ideas. And again, [15:00] as I said, let the democratic process [15:02] unfold and let the people vote in [15:04] majority what is their final [15:06] choice. I'm not here to determine an [15:08] outcome. Again, I stress, my role here [15:10] is to manage this transition and create [15:13] an opportunity that people have been [15:15] deprived of for half a century to [15:17] finally have a say as to what they they [15:20] like to have for themselves in terms of [15:22] sovereignty and determining their own [15:24] future democratically. Final question [15:26] and I'll get into a bunch of details [15:28] with you Shervin as to the plan which I [15:30] know you're helping construct and I'm [15:33] assuming you'll help execute on. [15:35] Trump [15:36] says he's going to pick the next leader. [15:38] Trump says a lot of things. He says them [15:40] sometimes in a [15:42] provocative way. [15:44] But he said he's not sure how you would [15:46] play within your own country. There's [15:47] obviously people holding up your [15:49] picture. There are people who are maybe [15:52] vying to take control of this from the [15:53] previous administration. [15:56] Are you in touch with President Trump [15:58] and what's your relationship with him [15:59] today? What's your best [16:03] plea to him or your argument to him [16:07] to work with you? Look, there's nothing [16:10] hidden in the agenda. Everything is [16:11] transparent and I've been communicating [16:13] with the administration by Steve Witkoff [16:16] who announced it publicly. That's what [16:18] was our channel to President Trump. And [16:20] of course on the other side in the [16:22] legislation with members of Congress, [16:24] senators and congress people to [16:27] understand a little bit from the [16:28] American prism what it is that we are [16:30] proposing here. I don't think that [16:32] President Trump or any other leader in [16:34] the this world would presume that it's [16:36] his up to them to determine who should [16:38] be the next leader in Iran. I'm sure as [16:40] democracies they respect the right for [16:42] people to make that choice. And as [16:45] Western democracies it should be going [16:47] without saying that they would believe [16:49] that the the right to choose the future [16:52] leaders is only up to the Iranian [16:54] people. If the intention is to assist [16:56] that process [16:58] if the intent is to support the Iranian [17:01] people in their democratic aspiration [17:03] you provide them with the help but the [17:05] choice should be theirs. That has been [17:06] my position and I don't think there's a [17:08] disagreement on that whether it is with [17:10] President Trump or other world leaders [17:12] that I've also talked to about this [17:14] matter. As So you go, what should the [17:16] American people know about the spirit, [17:19] the culture, and the people of Iran, [17:22] including the people who fled in 1979 [17:25] like you and your family? [17:28] Well, I I know many Americans who have [17:29] many Iranian friends. As a matter of [17:31] fact, if you just look at the Iranian [17:33] diaspora in the United States alone, [17:36] you will see how much interaction there [17:38] is between Iranians who are now Iranian [17:41] Americans, if you will, many of them, [17:43] and the kind of relationship that I've [17:45] built with [17:46] their American counterpart. And many [17:48] people have [17:50] connections via marriages. Many people [17:52] have connections through business [17:54] affiliations. Many people have worked [17:56] with Iranians. Many of the high-tech [17:58] companies, including Silicon Valley, [18:01] employ so many Iranians or they are [18:03] themselves entrepreneurs. This is the [18:05] kind of potential, and I'm sure Shervin [18:07] will talk to you more about that, but [18:08] this is the kind of connections there [18:10] is. And for Americans that have traveled [18:12] to Iran or have known Iranians all these [18:14] years, they know what what what country [18:17] it represents, what amount of culture, [18:19] arts, [18:21] I mean, civilization in the true sense [18:23] Iranians represent. And they've been [18:25] completely suffocated under this regime. [18:28] But once Iran is is you know, free from [18:31] its shackles, [18:33] I'm sure a lot of Americans know [18:36] what difference there is between an Iran [18:38] that wants to be friends with America, [18:41] that is not the regime that has from its [18:43] inception called death to America or [18:45] death to Israel, for instance. But there [18:47] are Iranians who actually love to [18:50] America. Let me just give you a last [18:52] parting thought, because I think every [18:54] now and then I need to remind your [18:56] audience and other audiences, [18:58] we talked about other countries in the [19:00] region. Remember 9/11? [19:03] Yes. [19:03] >> And how many people on the streets of [19:05] many of the so-called allies of the [19:07] United States were celebrating that [19:09] attack on that sinister day? [19:11] The only country in the entire world and [19:13] the entire region [19:15] that actually stood in candlelight [19:17] vigils in sympathy to the victims of the [19:19] 9/11 terrorist attacks were no other [19:21] than the Iranian people themselves [19:23] holding candlelight vigils in Iran. [19:27] And they've been messaging America for [19:29] years now. We are not your enemies. In [19:31] fact, they would been chanting slogans [19:33] in Iran [19:34] saying, "They lie to us. It's America. [19:36] Our enemy is right here." This is the [19:39] Iran I'm talking about. This is the [19:40] people I'm talking about. And I know [19:42] many Americans, both in the civilian [19:44] sector, including military forces in [19:46] America, know that. And I think that's [19:49] something that [19:50] I'm sure I'm not the only one, [19:52] you know, talking about this. You will [19:54] hear from other Iranians who will pretty [19:56] much confirm what I just said. That's [19:58] why this partnership is so vital for us [20:01] because together we'll be able to [20:03] rebuild, [20:04] you know, a different world. Iran will [20:06] bring an element of stability to the [20:08] region and beyond. And that can only [20:10] play to the interest of [20:12] America itself. We need to have this [20:14] vital partnership. And I think we'll be [20:17] able to succeed because I see everybody [20:18] now is very much committed to work [20:21] together towards [20:22] bringing this agenda forward. Well, [20:24] we're we're all praying for the people [20:26] of Iran to have a democracy. And what an [20:28] amazing moment will be when you get to [20:31] return [20:33] in whatever capacity and help this [20:34] transition. And 93 million people who [20:37] have been suffering will be living free [20:40] in a democracy. And the impact that [20:42] could have on the world and obviously [20:44] that region would be by far the largest [20:46] democracy in in [20:48] the Middle East. And this could have [20:51] ramifications in terms of humanity that [20:53] would be absolutely stunning and [20:55] beautiful. And the prosperity would be [20:57] amazing. [20:59] The Iranian people I met in my life, [21:01] Prince, [21:02] when I was living in Los Angeles, all [21:04] these great Persians I would meet [21:06] were some of the most joyful [21:10] and industrious, beautiful individuals [21:12] I've met. They remind me of my Greek and [21:14] Irish heritage, including you, Shervin. [21:15] So, Prince Reza, thank you so much for [21:17] your time. I know you're extremely busy. [21:19] It's very important for the All-In [21:21] audience to hear from you [21:22] and to understand what's going on and [21:24] your vision, and we would love to have [21:25] you back when you're on the ground with [21:28] your people and that your people are [21:30] free. Thank you again. Looking forward [21:32] to it. [21:33] All right, Shervin. Thank you so much [21:34] for setting this up. [21:36] I ask for very few favors from my [21:37] friends, but as a good friend, you made [21:40] this happen for the All-In community, so [21:42] we I thank you for that. Of course. And [21:44] as I as I said to to the prince, the [21:46] people [21:48] and then the Persians here in the United [21:49] States, maybe you can tell us a little [21:50] bit about your story and and what this [21:52] means to you and then we can get into [21:54] your involvement here and what you hope [21:56] to see in those first 100 days. Of [21:58] course. First of all, Jason, thank you [22:00] for opening up this tremendous platform [22:03] to the Iranian people and to the prince. [22:06] As you can see, [22:08] the Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi is a is a [22:10] great man, the most courageous man that [22:12] I've ever met [22:14] and he's a the highest integrity human [22:16] I've I've met as well. We're very [22:18] blessed as a people to have a leader [22:20] like him [22:22] who has lived a very clean life and has [22:26] stepped up in a very courageous way. [22:28] He's put it all on the line for his [22:30] people and his legacy to play this [22:33] tremendous transitional role to evolve [22:37] the Iranian [22:38] nation to a democracy [22:41] and this long nightmare of 47 years that [22:44] all of my Iranian brothers and sisters [22:46] have suffered through [22:48] is almost over and also tremendous [22:51] gratitude to President Trump for his [22:55] courageous leadership on this matter. I [22:58] don't think any other president uh, have [23:00] the courage and the principle and the [23:02] values to take on this Islamic regime of [23:05] terror. As you saw last month, uh, they [23:08] massacred uh, over 43,000 Iranians who [23:13] were just peacefully protesting. They [23:15] gunned them down with anti-material [23:17] bullets. I I put a post of a Coca-Cola [23:20] can next to these bullets. It was bigger [23:22] than the can. Uh, that's what they [23:24] >> And this is super important to to [23:26] meditate on for a second here. This [23:28] regime is a murderous and evil regime to [23:31] turn those guns and mow down 40,000 [23:35] and over 40,000 individuals peacefully [23:37] protesting is just an act of savagery [23:39] and brutality that I think most people [23:42] don't appreciate and [23:44] uh, or don't fully appreciate. Um, and [23:46] we there hasn't been enough coverage of [23:47] that fact. [23:48] >> No. And you [23:50] are a bipartisan type person. I've known [23:52] you for many years. You you were a [23:54] super, uh, funder of Obama. He wasn't [23:58] able to get this done. Biden wasn't able [24:00] to get this done. Bush wasn't able to [24:01] get this done. This has been something [24:02] that presidents have struggled with. [24:05] And you got to give Trump credit here. [24:07] There's a lot of debate over why this is [24:09] happening. Is it Israel driving it? Is [24:11] it the relationship with China? We [24:12] talked about on that in part one. [24:14] At the end of the day [24:16] as uh, a son of Iran what's matters is [24:20] that the people are free. All these [24:21] other conspiracy theories theories and [24:25] motivations do not matter to you or the [24:27] people, yeah? Absolutely not. I uh, But [24:30] but one of my key principles is our our [24:35] our secure our moral security presages [24:37] our physical security. So, this has as [24:40] much to do with Americans uh, security [24:44] as it does Iranians security and [24:47] livelihood. As you saw, this regime is [24:49] not only uh, evil enough to mow down [24:52] 43,000 innocent people in 48 hours. [24:55] Their reaction to this liberation [24:59] operation is to attack over 12 countries [25:02] in the region. Imagine if they had a [25:05] nuclear bomb, they would use it. They [25:07] would use it. There's not even a doubt [25:09] in my mind that they would have used it [25:10] by now if they had it. [25:13] So, this is incredibly important for [25:15] America's national security. [25:18] As the prince mentioned, 9/11 happened. [25:22] That's the same kind of ideology except [25:25] the problem we have in our modern time [25:27] is that basically criminal and terrorist [25:29] organizations have taken over sovereign [25:31] nations with nuclear bombs or seeking [25:34] nuclear bombs. We have Russia, China, [25:38] you know, we have North Korea, and you [25:40] have Iran. And then you have Venezuela. [25:42] So, the president has not only [25:44] gotten rid of the Maduro in in [25:46] Venezuela, he has now begun this process [25:49] of dismantling this this Islamic regime [25:52] who is absolutely [25:54] not a legitimate government and not a [25:57] legitimate [25:59] nation-state. And the only leader that [26:03] is legitimate to lead us to a transition [26:06] process to become a democracy is the [26:09] Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi. We are very [26:11] lucky I think in our modern times to [26:14] have three leaders who are living at the [26:16] same time and leading at the same time [26:18] as President Trump, President Netanyahu, [26:21] and Prime Minister Netanyahu, and and [26:23] the Crown Prince Reza Pahlavi all in in [26:26] this one moment in time. I think we're [26:28] living in biblical times. When 10/7 [26:31] happened, [26:33] I started the Israeli-Iranian Alliance [26:35] with Michael Eisenberg, Michael [26:36] Broukhim, [26:38] Jesse Maiman, Shawn Rad, [26:40] and we started to host these salons with [26:43] the Crown Prince. One was in New York, [26:45] Michael Eisenberg flew in, Dan Loeb, and [26:47] lots of leaders came. [26:50] And that was the beginning of the [26:52] process uh that was seated with a [26:54] breakfast with Michael Eisenberg as a VC [26:56] and that number one VC in Israel [26:59] 15 years ago where we said we have to do [27:02] more between Israeli and Jewish [27:04] community and the Persian Iranian [27:06] community and someday we're going to [27:08] have uh tea in Tehran. And we wrote an [27:10] op-ed last year about this and we began [27:13] to build these bridges uh and this [27:15] connection [27:16] between the Jewish people and the [27:18] Iranian people goes back 2500 years. [27:21] Cyrus the Great who's in the Bible uh [27:24] freed the Jews from uh slavery in [27:26] Babylon, returned them to their homeland [27:29] in Jerusalem, and rebuilt their temple. [27:32] Uh and that he is celebrated for that [27:35] courageous act uh in the Bible and in in [27:38] uh Jewish religious uh you know, [27:40] holidays and and it is a tremendous [27:43] connection that goes back now 2500 years [27:46] later in kind of biblical symmetry. You [27:49] have the Jewish people helping free [27:51] Iranian people from their slavery. And [27:53] at the same time there is a connection [27:55] between America's beginning that many [27:57] people don't know is that Thomas [27:59] Jefferson was uh a student of Cyrus the [28:03] Great who declared the first declaration [28:05] of human rights. And a lot of the [28:07] principles that went into the [28:08] declaration of [28:10] uh independence of America and the [28:12] founding of America and the Bill of [28:14] Rights and the Constitution have had its [28:16] roots in Cyrus the Great and Persian [28:18] history. And so this connection between [28:21] America's founding and the principles [28:24] that Iranians uh espouse for 2500 years [28:28] uh is this beautiful connection between [28:30] the Jewish people, the American people, [28:32] and the Iranian people. And and this [28:35] could have such a tremendous impact on [28:36] the region. You have essentially a lone [28:39] democracy in Israel uh and now to have [28:42] 93 million Iranians in a democracy. If [28:45] that can be achieved, and listen, [28:46] there's a long way to go, this could [28:48] spiral out of control. This was a very [28:50] high risk [28:52] move uh by Trump, President Trump. So, [28:54] you give him a lot of credit for that. [28:56] Uh but, he has to own this. So, let's be [28:58] humble and and we got to pray for the [29:00] best here. Things can spiral out of [29:01] control in these kind of situations. [29:04] But, let's hope that we do get to [29:06] democracy there. I'm curious. Shervin, [29:08] you spent a lot of time in the Middle [29:09] East. I have over the last 3 years [29:11] gotten myself educated and caught up, I [29:12] hope, [29:13] and have started doing business there [29:15] and and really meeting a a larger swath [29:17] of people. The Gulf monarchies have [29:19] modernized incredibly, starting with the [29:22] UAE, Saudi uh now the kingdom, and of [29:25] course Qatar uh as well modernizing, [29:28] Oman, Kuwait. [29:30] What would Iran [29:33] going straight to a democracy, if that [29:35] is even possible, what would that do to [29:37] the region in your mind? [29:39] I think that uh everything it what what [29:42] the Gulf countries have done uh is a [29:44] tremendous case study of what the [29:46] potential for the Middle East really is. [29:49] Uh being blessed uh by God to have oil, [29:53] gas the way the most GCC countries have, [29:56] and Iran [29:58] uh so has, uh gives them an advantage to [30:01] be able to have the resources [30:02] independently to develop themselves. And [30:05] when you look at what happened in UAE [30:06] over the last 25 years, I went to UAE in [30:09] 2001, 2002, and there was a smattering [30:12] of buildings there. Yeah, I've seen the [30:14] pictures of Dubai then and now. [30:16] >> it's it's incredible. [30:18] It's incredible. And it it reminds me of [30:21] what America was like in the 1950s, when [30:23] they came from back from World War II, [30:26] Eisenhower built built the Interstate [30:27] Highway System, and America developed [30:29] into this superpower. [30:31] Uh and and in many ways the GCC [30:34] countries espoused that American [30:36] mentality of everything is possible, [30:38] anything is possible. And they've [30:41] manifested their greatness. And you look [30:43] at Iran, you have 93 million [30:46] unbelievably brilliant people who have [30:47] been held back. You look at the Iranian [30:50] diaspora in America, just our fellow [30:53] friends who you may you know Dara [30:56] Khosrowshahi at Uber, [30:58] uh my myself at Uber, [30:59] of course um Omid Kordestani at Google, [31:03] and Ali at [31:04] Databricks. Um you know, uh Pierre [31:07] Omidyar at eBay. When you add up the [31:09] numbers, it gets to trillions of dollars [31:11] of value have been created by this small [31:13] population of Iranians in America, and [31:15] especially in Silicon Valley. And I've [31:17] been blessed to be part of that circle. [31:19] And you know, one thank God for America [31:22] that we had a a safe sanctuary to come [31:24] and develop our brilliance. But there [31:27] are as many as there [31:29] as many brilliant Iranians, way more [31:31] brilliant Iranians [31:32] >> Yeah, on a numbers basis it's it's a [31:33] magnitude more. And so this will be a [31:36] free democratic Iran will be the [31:38] greatest peace dividend and economic [31:41] dividend to be gifted to the world and [31:43] to the region. So I think what will [31:44] happen is [31:46] we will have an acceleration of the [31:48] Middle East becoming this unbelievable a [31:51] place where innovation and investment in [31:54] the future is happening. We're at the [31:55] dawn of AGI and advanced [31:58] superintelligence. We have quantum [31:59] computing which you and I, you know, and [32:01] Emil Michael and others have done with [32:04] our you know, our [32:05] SPAC. Um and D-Wave. [32:08] These these technologies are are going [32:11] to fast-forward humanity and being able [32:15] to tap into the resources of the Middle [32:18] East and Iran in in human capital and in [32:21] the oil and gas wealth to be able to [32:23] unleash an accelerated future is [32:26] something that we all look forward to. [32:28] And one of the things the team uh the [32:30] Crown Prince's vision, [32:32] uh this is a 175-page report right here, [32:36] the Iran Prosperity Project. And I'm [32:38] blessed to be an advisor there with many [32:40] other very talented Iranians. [32:43] And this [32:45] piece by piece, month by month, [32:48] has a sequence of of plans to rebuild [32:51] Iran as the Crown Prince was talking [32:53] about, so that when there is a free [32:55] Iran, there will be a 4-month process to [32:58] get to a referendum, [33:01] and then a 6-month process to [33:04] assemble Iranians to to write a [33:07] constitution, [33:08] and then a 14-month process to actually [33:11] finalize the the the constitution, and [33:14] then have a vote on the constitution. [33:16] So, you'll have a sequence of events [33:19] that will then lead to [33:21] a legal framework where the the the new [33:25] Iran will be able to actually execute on [33:28] this on this tremendous plan, [33:30] and rebuild all aspects and all sectors [33:33] of the economy. [33:34] And that'll lead to, [33:36] you know, this new Iran that we're all [33:39] have been dreaming and praying for. [33:41] And and so, this plan's been worked on [33:43] for some time. He seems like he's got, [33:45] you know, a third or so of the [33:47] constituents there who are in favor of [33:49] him. There are some people who strongly [33:50] opposed. [33:52] Last time, his father was not perfect. [33:54] He's answered many of the hard questions [33:56] about his father's tenure. What are the [33:59] chances that the existing regime, what's [34:01] left of it, there are people in that who [34:04] would collaborate on moving to a [34:06] democracy where specifically religion [34:10] and the government were separated. This [34:12] was something MBS was able to do in [34:14] Saudi, but not without strong resistance [34:18] and great risk to himself. [34:20] This is a high-risk thing, you know, [34:22] with some of these radicalized [34:25] individuals who want religion to rule [34:27] over democracy. So, maybe you can unpack [34:29] that a bit. Absolutely. The vast [34:31] majority of Iranians want a a separation [34:35] of [34:37] church and state [34:39] mosque and state [34:41] and we've seen what 47 we've had an AB [34:43] test [34:45] in Silicon Valley speak of what happens [34:47] when you have a system that is [34:49] controlled by mullahs. [34:51] It has led to absolute disaster and [34:53] mayhem and evil [34:56] and [34:57] so the vast majority are out there and [34:59] they're saying Reza Pahlavi's name. If [35:01] you look at the videos from January, [35:04] they're saying Javid Shah, they're [35:05] saying his name to return. He called on [35:08] them to come in the streets at 8:00 p.m. [35:10] on the on the 8th and 9th and they came [35:13] out in droves and by the millions in [35:15] response to him. So the idea that we [35:18] don't know who the Iranian people want [35:21] to help lead this transition process. [35:23] The proof is in the pudding. You just [35:24] have to look at the videos and look at [35:26] the the actual facts. [35:28] That's the he's the only leader that [35:31] Iranians are by name calling out for him [35:34] to to come back and they're also calling [35:36] for for Trump and Netanyahu to please [35:39] help save them from this you know terror [35:42] regime and as we've seen in the last [35:45] week their prayers have been answered in [35:48] a tremendous way and what is going to [35:50] happen is basically a dismantling and a [35:53] defanging of this regime's capabilities [35:55] to use terror, to use their military [35:58] capabilities and we have to let the that [36:01] run its course. As the president said, [36:04] this is probably about four weeks of [36:07] work. [36:08] There was a leak [36:10] I think in the Washington Post today [36:12] that the 82nd Airborne was activated and [36:15] that's a signal [36:17] that this is going to potentially [36:21] lead to even more support in this [36:24] liberation operation to completely [36:27] dismantle this regime. [36:29] Defections are a big part of the [36:31] strategy. They [36:32] >> Have the defection started yet or is [36:33] that too risky for the individuals on [36:35] the ground? What what what are you [36:36] hearing through your back channels? [36:38] Well, I I the the Crown Prince had a [36:41] a [36:42] system for people to communicate [36:44] securely with him and his team and over [36:46] 50,000 people in the military [36:49] have actually responded to that. You saw [36:51] some defections that were went viral [36:55] during the protests and before the [36:56] protests of of different military [36:58] members. We expect that that as the [37:01] dismantling process continues and many [37:04] of the as you saw the [37:06] top leadership of the IRGC was [37:09] eradicated in the first 24 hours. The [37:13] the supreme leader Khamenei was a just [37:15] an absolutely evil man [37:17] was gone in the first 60 seconds. He [37:20] spent 47 years threatening the world. He [37:22] lasted 60 seconds. Yeah. And that's [37:25] going to continue. [37:26] And so [37:28] I think it's going to be a very rational [37:30] thing for the rest of [37:33] who remains to realize that if they [37:35] don't actually have a complete surrender [37:39] and you know, capitulate. And for the [37:42] ones that haven't actually executed the [37:44] orders of genocide against Iranian [37:46] people, there'll be an opportunity for [37:48] people to actually [37:50] be a part of the reformation and the [37:53] reconstruction of Iran. The plan [37:56] actually says even people in the [37:58] military will be able to one either have [38:01] early retirement for the ones that [38:02] didn't actually [38:04] execute those you know, [38:07] acts of terror against the Iranian [38:09] people. [38:10] And then others who are talented and [38:12] have the the ability to to serve and [38:14] want to serve, they'll also be able to [38:17] show up at work and continue to get paid [38:19] and have some role uh in the military [38:22] and in the government. So, there's This [38:23] isn't going to be a hunting down of [38:26] people. The hunting down is happening [38:27] right now. There'll be a process of [38:30] peace and reconstruction, [38:32] um and rehabilitation [38:35] uh that'll happen. And we're going to [38:36] also need to have a lot of like, um you [38:39] know, specialists to come in and help [38:41] people with the trauma that they've been [38:43] through for 47 years. Uh this is going [38:46] to be a multiple multi-threaded [38:48] Multi-generational trauma, yeah. [38:50] multi-generational. Yes. Uh tell me [38:52] about uh the Kurd the Kurds being backed [38:55] by Assad and um the CIA are uh backing, [39:00] reportedly, militias in the West. And [39:03] that's going to play a role, yeah? [39:06] I think, you know, we we have to be [39:07] very, very careful because uh a red line [39:10] for the Iranian people is we have [39:13] existed at a as a country for for 5,000 [39:16] years, as a people for 5,000 years. [39:18] Wherever invaders came in or out, we [39:20] always outlasted our invaders. These [39:23] These people uh who have ta- had taken [39:25] over for 47 years, were occupiers. They [39:27] weren't really truly Iranians. They were [39:30] occupiers of this country. [39:32] Uh and they'll be booted just like [39:33] Genghis Khan and everyone else who came [39:36] into Iran were booted. Um and so, uh [39:40] it's very important we if if if there's [39:43] any kind of separatist movement, we will [39:46] lose the goodwill and the support of [39:47] millions and millions of Iranians. Um [39:50] and so, [39:51] >> to be one country, you know? It has to [39:52] be one country. The territorial [39:54] integrity of Iran must be protected. [39:57] That's a red line for the Crown Prince. [39:58] It's a red line for the Iranian people. [40:02] Um and so, that's that's incredibly [40:04] important uh to to uh project that. [40:07] Wherever there's collaborations that can [40:09] happen [40:10] uh to to be able to work together [40:13] uh to fight uh for uh the the [40:17] to be completed and for a march on to [40:19] Tehran and the Crown Prince being able [40:22] to come back to lead this transition and [40:24] physically come back to his homeland. [40:26] You imagine that after 47 years of being [40:29] away from his nation Yeah. we uh being [40:32] away from my [40:33] >> You've never been able to go back or [40:34] have you snuck in and [40:35] >> I I haven't been back for, you know, I [40:37] left Basically, I was born in 1976. [40:41] My dad, the the last Shah, was sending a [40:44] lot of the top brilliant people on [40:46] scholarships around the world. Iranian [40:48] community and uh graduate school and [40:50] universities was the largest population [40:52] in 1970s. He was educating this whole [40:55] um class of people and we were going [40:57] back to to rebuild and build Iran into [41:00] this great nation. We're at the cusp of [41:02] greatness. So, my father came to [41:04] Washington D.C. uh where I am right now [41:06] and uh I grew up here uh on 16th Street [41:10] in in in Washington [41:12] uh and he got his master's degree at [41:14] Catholic University. Uh 1976 to 1978. [41:19] Uh and I remember when we first came it [41:21] was a bicentennial of America. Now, [41:24] it was our 200th anniversary. And so, he [41:26] returned We returned to Iran 1978. [41:30] Um right before the revolution, really [41:32] bad timing. And my dad had been promoted [41:35] to head of radio and television for the [41:36] Shah and uh this all happened. The [41:39] revolution happened. Khomeini was coming [41:41] back and my dad made the courageous [41:44] decision to help uh the US Embassy get [41:47] the radio communications devices to [41:50] them, do foreign language broadcasts to [41:52] tell um uh foreigners in Iran how to get [41:55] out of the country. This was from the [41:56] different embassies. And Khomeini and [41:58] Khamenei put my father, Abraham, on the [42:01] execution list. So, he went into hiding [42:03] for 10 months. I didn't see my dad for [42:06] 10 months and uh and kind of a kismet [42:09] moment, a someone he helped get a job in [42:11] radio and television came to my our home [42:14] and said to my mom, I want to help. And [42:16] she didn't trust him and said, I don't [42:18] know where he is, but she checked with [42:19] my dad and and they came back and my dad [42:22] said, no, you can trust him. And that [42:23] guy was the new head of security for the [42:27] Mehrabad Airport in Tehran. And he [42:29] personally met my father. And I remember [42:32] this moment I woke up to my brother [42:34] crying and my dad was at the door after [42:36] 10 months to say goodbye cuz he didn't [42:38] know if he was going to survive. Uh and [42:41] he went to the airport [42:43] met his friend and he walked him onto [42:45] the Air France flight and you know, [42:48] crying he he flew out [42:51] and came to America and the people he [42:52] had helped helped him [42:54] get his papers and everything in order. [42:57] And then we were stuck in Iran for two [42:59] years. Saddam invaded, bombs were [43:01] falling on us every night and the sirens [43:04] were going off. So then we escaped with [43:06] my mom and my brother and sister came to [43:08] America with $35. [43:10] My dad was driving a taxi while getting [43:12] his PhD. My dad A great paradox. My mom [43:15] >> [laughter] [43:15] >> was like, yeah, I did Uber. Actually [43:17] helped Great irony. He loves irony. [43:20] That was one of the things in my first [43:21] meeting with Jason and with with Travis, [43:24] I told him that story and I and I I know [43:26] that like growing up in an orange and [43:29] black taxi cab in in in Washington D.C. [43:31] helped me win the Uber deal against all [43:33] the greatest in venture. Yeah. You know, [43:36] it's all full circle. Only in America [43:38] would that be possible. You know, the [43:40] the son of a taxi driver and a maid [43:43] Yeah. you know, coming to America with [43:45] nothing be able to have the blessing of [43:47] the life that we've had and Fantastic. [43:50] I've never forgotten those roots. I've [43:52] tried to to serve America. Um and um [43:57] I'm you know, [43:59] now now helping in any way that I can to [44:03] help the Crown Prince in this transition [44:05] process for a free Iran and and rebuild [44:08] Iran into [44:09] something great. So, make Iran What's [44:11] extraordinary to me about the Iranian [44:13] people is they have maintained even [44:16] under this oppression [44:17] that spirit. [44:19] 47 years later, I don't know if you've [44:21] ever seen the Anthony Bourdain Yeah. uh [44:24] you know, episode when he goes there. [44:26] And it was always touched me. I don't [44:28] know if this is like a decade ago when [44:29] he did it. [44:30] And he said, "I can't believe it. This [44:31] These people are Americans. They're [44:33] They're eating Pizza Hut. They're [44:34] listening to music. They're having some [44:35] beers on their back porch. They're [44:36] dancing. They are on VPNs, you know, [44:40] understanding culture and what's going [44:42] on around the world even under the [44:45] oppression. Women, gays, uh everybody in [44:49] between, uh [44:51] they're suffering and they still have [44:53] that joy of life that every person I've [44:56] ever met [44:58] will stay with you like the Greeks or [44:59] the Irish and they will close the [45:01] restaurant. They will talk and the [45:03] restaurant closes the door. They go on [45:05] to the restaurant, sit down, and you [45:06] just talk for another hour. Some of the [45:08] most beautiful people I've ever met and [45:10] uh it's just I'm so glad that you are [45:11] engaged in this. Uh very much appreciate [45:14] you bringing the prince [45:14] >> Thank you, Jason. I didn't here today. [45:16] understand the soul of the Iranian and [45:18] that is exactly where they we love to [45:20] host our friends on the sofa [45:22] and uh and uh you know, uh uh [45:25] there truly are as American as you can [45:28] be. Uh we love our freedom. Uh we've [45:30] suffered for so long uh and we're so [45:33] thankful for uh President Trump uh [45:36] having the having the courage to take on [45:38] this evil regime and we look forward to [45:40] uh hosting All In Pod in Tehran Um that [45:44] would be sooner than later. one of the [45:46] great bucket lists of my life to be able [45:48] to go to Tehran and and host the podcast [45:51] there and have tea with [clears throat] [45:52] you in Tehran. We'll have Let's put it [45:54] on the schedule a year from today. food [45:56] in in the world. I can't wait to take [45:58] you to Tehran. [45:58] >> What's the signature for you? What's the [46:00] signature dish? What's the Well, I mean [46:02] What's your favorite? Everyone loves the [46:04] the Persian kebabs, right? But the [46:06] kebabs in Iran [46:09] are something else. There's like it's a [46:11] it's a tremendous uh you know, food [46:14] culture. Uh and the national dish is [46:17] called ghormeh sabzi, [46:19] um which is a stew of lamb and and my [46:22] mom was like the greatest Persian cook [46:25] in the world and she would cook it for 3 [46:27] days. [46:28] Uh and these foods I can't wait to to [46:31] break bread with you in a free Iran. [46:33] >> Incredible. It'll be a Yeah, I mean [46:34] [clears throat] that's one of the things [46:35] the Greeks [46:36] and uh the Iranians share is that love [46:38] of lamb. Cannot wait. Us. All right, my [46:41] brother. Um Uh thank you. I'm so glad [46:43] you're engaged in this. Gives me hope um [46:45] and [46:47] good luck in the next uh three, four, [46:50] five weeks. Let's hope and pray for the [46:52] best. Thank you. [46:53] >> the All-In audience, we'll see you next [46:55] time. Bye-bye. [46:57] Let [music] your winners ride. [47:00] Rain Man David Sacks. [47:04] And I said [music] We open sourced it to [47:06] the fans and they've just gone crazy [47:08] with it. Love you, Sacks. My queen of [47:10] quinoa. [47:12] Chamath. [music] [47:13] Let your freak flag Let your [47:17] >> [music] [47:17] >> Besties are ballers. [47:20] That is my uh dog taking a dump in his [47:21] neighbor's driveway. [47:25] Oh man. I have a guy sure will meet me [47:27] at the Olympics. We should all just [47:28] [music] get a room and just have a one [47:29] big huge orgy because they're all just [47:31] useless. It's like this like sexual [47:33] tension that they just need to release [47:34] somehow. [47:36] What? Let your freak flag [47:37] Let your Let your freak flag [47:40] Let [47:41] >> [laughter] [47:41] >> We need to get merch. Besties are [47:42] ballers. [47:45] >> [music]