Data Center Power Bills Drive US Voter Backlash Against Big Tech

AI on the Ballot with The University of Texas School of Law and Porter Group LLC — Ai4

Ai4

Voters are turning against artificial intelligence at the ballot box over rising electricity rates and grid strain from local data centers rather than online deepfakes or misinformation.

AI-assisted summary of AI on the Ballot with The University of Texas School of Law and Porter Group LLC — original source. Check the original for full context.

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Detailed notes

## Background Published on YouTube by Ai4 on August 21, 2026, this panel discussion features Kevin Frazier of The University of Texas School of Law alongside Bob Lucey and Jon Porter of Porter Group LLC. According to the description, the session examines how artificial intelligence is redefining democratic processes, exploring the tension between technological optimization and threats to election integrity, misinformation, and public trust.

## TL;DR The panel reveals that the true political backlash surrounding AI centers on tangible kitchen-table burdens—such as surging electricity bills, water depletion, and massive data center construction—rather than abstract worries about deepfakes. Drawing on local governance experiences in Nevada and broader utility law frameworks, the speakers illustrate how outdated regulations and poor tech messaging leave under-resourced local officials struggling against hyperscaler expansions. To remedy this, they urge local governments to leverage their bargaining power for direct community benefits and call for structural policy shifts to safeguard residential ratepayers and counteract extreme corporate wealth concentration.

## Atmosphere & style The conversation moves at a brisk, punchy pace guided by a strict 'no waffling' ground rule, enlivened by lighthearted jokes about Austin breakfast tacos and energy-drink-fueled utility law lectures. Grounded in the unglamorous realities of county commission meetings and arid Western water politics, the dialogue feels pragmatic, collegial, and sharply focused on bread-and-butter public administration rather than theoretical tech hype.

## Key takeaways - [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) Voters heading to the ballot box are far more concerned with kitchen-table economic issues—like surging electric utility bills, job displacement, and local infrastructure strain—than abstract worries about deepfakes or misinformation. - [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) Public backlash against the physical buildout of artificial intelligence is intense, with internal polling showing technology like internal combustion engines viewing more favorably than AI. - [02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) In arid regions like Nevada, which hosts approximately 76 major data centers, high resource consumption—particularly water—makes infrastructure development an explosive political issue for local residents. - [05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) The tech industry has suffered a messaging failure by aggressively hyping workforce displacement while failing to help the public connect the convenience of their everyday devices to the physical data centers powering them. - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) Centuries-old public utility frameworks were not designed for gigawatt-scale hyperscalers, risking the unfair transfer of grid upgrade costs onto captive residential ratepayers. - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) Current data centers represent the least energy-efficient iteration of the technology, with future generations expected to become substantially more sustainable and grid-friendly over time. - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) Local communities possess substantial negotiating leverage to demand tangible public benefits from tech giants who face intense global pressure to expand infrastructure rapidly. - [11:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=689s) Modestly compensated local officials often lack the technical playbooks and resources required to negotiate complex multibillion-dollar energy agreements against top corporate legal teams. - [15:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=946s) Rather than causing permanent net job losses, historical technological transitions typically evolve trades—such as turning standard commercial electricians into specialized server and data center electricians. - [18:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1128s) The extreme concentration of wealth and political influence among a handful of Silicon Valley tech executives is a primary driver of widespread public and electoral resentment.

## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) The Real "AI Vote": Utility Bills and Data Centers over Deepfakes

The panel opens by dispelling the popular media narrative that voters heading into the November elections are primarily losing sleep over deepfakes and algorithmic misinformation. The real "AI vote" is grounded in kitchen-table economic anxieties: escalating monthly electric bills, employment displacement, and the consolidation of corporate wealth. Introducing the panel, the moderator sets a ground rule of "no waffling" before handing the floor to Kevin Frazier, Director of the AI Innovation and Law Program at the University of Texas School of Law. Frazier jokes that anyone who visits him in Austin will be treated to breakfast tacos on the strict condition that they talk exclusively about AI and the justice system.

Frazier emphasizes that the average citizen across the country is not discussing Anthropic's Claude or writing software on OpenAI Codex. Instead, communities are reacting to the immediate physical footprint of artificial intelligence: a multi-megawatt data center breaking ground at the end of their street. Residents worry about how these sprawling campuses will impact local traffic, generate noise and pollution, and strain community resources. The public backlash against the physical buildout is so visceral that Frazier notes internal polling shows even internal combustion engines (ICE) are viewing more favorably than AI right now, reflecting the depth of public frustration.

- **Voter Priorities**: Bread-and-butter issues like electricity utility rates, job security, and local disruptions supersede abstract concerns about deepfakes or online misinformation. - **Community Realities**: Everyday voters rarely engage with bleeding-edge AI models directly, focusing instead on the tangible traffic, environmental, and infrastructure burdens imposed by nearby data center construction.

```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: The AI Ballot Disconnect subgraph Perception["Public & Political Debate"] A["National Narrative:<br/>Deepfakes & Misinformation"] -.->|Ignored by Voters| B["Everyday Reality"] B["Kitchen-Table Issues:<br/>Power Bills, Jobs, Wealth Concentration"] end subgraph Reality["The Physical Footprint"] C["Hyperscaler Buildout:<br/>Massive Data Centers"] --> D["Local Friction:<br/>Water, Grid Strain, Traffic, Taxes"] D --> E["Voter Backlash at the Ballot Box"] end B <--> E ```

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[02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) Nevada’s Data Center Boom and the Local Backlash

Bob Lucey, Senior Advisor at the Porter Group and a fifth-generation Nevadan, roots the national discussion in local governance. Having previously served as a county commissioner in Washoe County—home to Reno, Lake Tahoe, and the massive Tahoe-Reno Industrial Center—Lucey describes the immense concentration of infrastructure in the Silver State. Between the Las Vegas Valley and the Reno-Sparks metropolitan corridor, Nevada hosts roughly 76 major data centers run by hyperscalers like Google, Apple, Microsoft, and Switch.

Despite the economic capital these facilities represent, Lucey observes a deep disconnect when facing constituents at city council and county commission meetings. Rather than hearing industry experts discuss the revolutionary capabilities of advanced computing, local residents arrive at public hearings furious. Media coverage routinely tells them that data centers will drive up household energy rates and deplete limited regional water reserves. Lucey stresses that in an arid state like Nevada, "water is gold," meaning any threat to the water supply instantly becomes an explosive political flashpoint both inside and outside the voting booth.

- **Nevada Infrastructure Footprint**: Approximately 76 major hyperscale and colocation data centers operate between the Reno-Sparks corridor and Las Vegas. - **Key Hyperscale Operators**: Tech giants with substantial footprints in the region include Apple, Google, Microsoft, and Switch. - **Resource Sensitivity**: Water rights and municipal consumption dominate local resistance due to Nevada's desert climate.

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[05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) The Missing Mental Bridge: Fear, Uncertainty, and Flawed Messaging

Addressing why data centers have suddenly become a headline campaign issue—even dominating Senate races in battleground states like Michigan—Frazier points directly to a self-inflicted public relations failure by the tech sector. He dryly observes, "if you want folks to support your technology, don't tell them that it's going to take their jobs." When tech leaders aggressively hype human labor displacement while remaining silent on the tangible public benefits, the public fixates entirely on downside risks. Quoting a colleague, Frazier notes that citizens are not inherently anti-technology; rather, "they're opposed to uncertainty," and data centers provide a massive concrete target for their economic anxieties.

Lucey expands on this by referencing Frazier’s academic writing on "known unknowns" and "unknown unknowns," identifying a profound failure to build a "mental bridge" for the general public. Almost every voter owns an iPhone or relies on internet automation daily, yet virtually none connect the high-performance computing devices in their pockets to the physical infrastructure required to operate them. Because the technology sector has failed to explain this dependency, voters only absorb news warnings about pollution and depleted aquifers, completely divorcing the convenience of their digital lives from the concrete facilities down the highway.

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[07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) Utility Law, Grid Strain, and Tax Breaks: Who Pays for Hyperscalers?

When the conversation turns to who should foot the bill for soaring electricity costs, Frazier argues firmly that hyperscalers must shoulder the financial responsibility rather than captive residential ratepayers. Offering a counter-perspective to prevailing pessimism, he delivers one of his signature lines: "today's data centers are the worst data centers we will ever have," arguing that subsequent generations will be vastly more energy-efficient and sustainable. He highlights collaborative efforts like GigaWatt (backed by Al Gore and Gavin McCormick), which partner with states to expand grid transmission capacity and explore frameworks that could ultimately lower consumer energy costs over time.

The root of the cost-allocation crisis lies in statutory obsolescence. Frazier notes that American public utility law is deeply antiquated—joking that he could put an entire audience to sleep with a 90-minute lecture on utility regulation unless they had just consumed a Celsius energy drink. Existing regulatory frameworks were designed a century ago for traditional industrial consumers, not gigawatt-scale hyperscale facilities. Although ratepayer protection legislation is pending in Congress, existing tax breaks granted by local municipalities remain a point of fierce debate:

| Jurisdiction / Actor | Strategy or Concession | Realized / Expected Outcome | |:--- |:--- |:--- | | **Outdated Utility Frameworks** | Regulated utility cost-allocation models designed in the 20th century. | Shifts grid expansion and peak-demand costs onto retail residential ratepayers. | | **Progressive Louisiana Parishes** | Hard-nosed community benefit negotiations with hyperscalers. | Secured direct funding to award local public school teachers **$50,000 bonuses**. | | **Chinese AI Infrastructure** | Massive state-backed capital allocation. | On pace to deploy **$300 billion** into AI data center infrastructure over the coming year. | | **Proposed Federal Legislation** | Ratepayer protection bills currently sitting before the U.S. Congress. | Aims to ringfence retail consumer utility rates from hyperscaler energy consumption. |

Frazier advises that local governments possess immense negotiating leverage if they recognize it. Because hyperscalers face global pressure to keep pace with foreign rivals—especially China, which is projected to spend $300 billion on its AI data center buildout—communities can demand meaningful concessions rather than handing out unreciprocated corporate tax abatements.

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[11:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=689s) The NIMBY Dilemma and the Limits of Underpaid Local Officials

Drawing from his tenure as a county commissioner, Lucey compares the current AI panic to the onset of the COVID-19 pandemic. Recalling meetings inside Las Vegas convention halls with state leaders during the height of the shutdowns, he remembers the overwhelming fear caused by having "no playbook." AI is creating an identical panic among both the public and local officials who lack the technical expertise to separate realistic hazards from irrational fear.

This panic manifests as aggressive NIMBYism ("Not In My Backyard"). Lucey estimates that roughly 85% of general voters do not know the nuanced policy platforms of the candidates on their ballot, voting instead based on word of mouth or social media soundbites. When constituents discover that an incumbent approved a data center, they treat the facility as an alien intrusion that will ruin their property values and drink their water.

Defending local governing bodies against accusations of incompetence, Lucey highlights the institutional reality of local government: - **Low Compensation**: Most county and city officials earn modest salaries of roughly $60,000 to $70,000 a year, a level of compensation barely above the median wage for full-time work across many regions. - **Overwhelming Scope**: Part-time or lay officials are tasked with simultaneously overseeing public health, social services, and complex municipal budgets, leaving them ill-equipped to negotiate multi-billion-dollar energy agreements against top-tier corporate legal teams. - **Political Vulnerability**: Unprepared commissioners frequently become political casualties when communities mobilize against projects they do not understand.

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[15:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=946s) The Jobs Question: From Bowling Pinsetters to Data Center Electricians

The moderator presses the panel on the labor equation, questioning whether data centers merely bring a temporary burst of specialized HVAC and electrical construction jobs that evaporate once concrete cures, leaving college graduates and blue-collar workers with diminishing employment prospects. Frazier pushes back against the notion that construction employment should be dismissed simply because it is temporary. He points out that labor unions representing electricians strongly advocate for data center construction, knowing full well that all construction labor is inherently project-based and sequential: "Name one person who's worked on one construction site for the entirety of their career."

Addressing long-term white-collar and youth displacement, Frazier puts technological churn into historical perspective. He reminds the room that society once employed workers whose sole job was to manually reset bowling pins at alleys. While disruptive transitions cause genuine friction, Frazier argues that the United States must bet on its inherent capacity for reinvention rather than surrendering to fatalism.

Echoing Frazier, Lucey observes that the nation is marking its 250th anniversary, and throughout its history—from the dawn of the steam engine through the rise of personal computing—technological shifts have continuously transformed the labor force rather than eliminating the human need to work. Instead of disappearing, traditional trades will adapt; standard commercial electricians will simply evolve into specialized data and server electricians trained to maintain the physical backbone of the computing economy.

[18:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1128s) Concentration of Wealth, Power, and Conference Wrap-Up

With only forty seconds left on the clock, the panel pivots to a final rapid-fire issue: the staggering concentration of wealth generated by the artificial intelligence boom. The moderator raises the growing resentment among everyday citizens who watch trillion-dollar and two-trillion-dollar tech titans mint instant millionaires while erecting massive, resource-heavy data centers right in local neighborhoods—leaving residents feeling as though they shoulder the local burdens without seeing any of the upside. Asked whether this sentiment is fueling the wider societal and political backlash, Kevin Frazier answers without hesitation: "In one word, yes, we need to address the concentration of power concerns." He argues bluntly against allowing a tiny handful of Silicon Valley leaders to hold outsized sway over modern society, noting, "I don't think we should have four major companies run by four white dudes controlling so much of the economy and making so many political decisions. The answer is absolutely yes, 100%."

Beating the buzzer just in time, the session closes on an upbeat, humorous note. The moderator commends the speakers for their insights while playfully teasing the panelists for agreeing with each other on nearly every topic, joking that the audience might have hoped for a bit more onstage conflict—though that debate might simply have to wait for "after hours." The session concludes with well-wishes for the attendees to safely enjoy the casino floor and make the most of the remainder of the Ai4 conference.

## Notable quotes > [02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) water is gold — Bob Lucey

> [05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) if you want folks to support your technology, don't tell them that it's going to take their jobs. — Kevin Frazier

> [05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) they're opposed to uncertainty — Kevin Frazier

> [05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) known unknowns — Bob Lucey

> [05:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=315s) unknown unknowns — Bob Lucey

> [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) today's data centers are the worst data centers we will ever have — Kevin Frazier

> [11:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=689s) no playbook — Bob Lucey

> [15:46](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=946s) Name one person who's worked on one construction site for the entirety of their career. — Kevin Frazier

> [18:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1128s) In one word, yes, we need to address the concentration of power concerns. — Kevin Frazier

> [18:48](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1128s) I don't think we should have four major companies run by four white dudes controlling so much of the economy and making so many political decisions. The answer is absolutely yes, 100%. — Kevin Frazier

## Mentioned Kevin Frazier, The University of Texas School of Law, Jon Porter, Porter Group LLC, Bob Lucey, Ai4, Claude, Anthropic, OpenAI Codex, Washoe County, Reno, Sparks, Lake Tahoe, Tahoe-Reno Industrial Center, Google, Apple, Microsoft, Switch, iPhone, GigaWatt, Al Gore, Gavin McCormick, Celsius, U.S. Congress, Las Vegas, China, Louisiana

## Video description Kevin Frazier - Professor, The University of Texas School of Law Jon Porter - President & CEO, Porter Group LLC Bob Lucey - Senior Advisor, Porter Group

As the United States heads toward critical midterm elections, artificial intelligence is no longer a future tech issue—it is actively shaping the democratic process. From AI-generated political campaigns and deepfake disinhibition to micro-targeted voter outreach and automated election administration, technology is redefining how campaigns are run and how voters consume information. This session explores the dual nature of AI on the ballot: its power to optimize political engagement versus its potential to disrupt election integrity, spread algorithmic misinformation, and challenge public trust in democratic institutions.

[Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E)

中文简报

数据中心推高电费账单 引发美选民对科技巨头反弹 选民在投票时开始抵制人工智能,其主因是当地数据中心导致的电费上涨和电网压力加剧,而非网络深度伪造或虚假信息。 专家小组指出,围绕人工智能的真正政治反弹集中在切实的日常生活民生负担上——例如电费飙升、水资源枯竭以及大规模数据中心建设,而非对深度伪造的抽象担忧。发言者结合内华达州的地方治理经验和更广泛的公用事业法律框架,阐述了陈旧过时的法规与科技行业欠佳的信息传达,如何让资源不足的地方官员在应对超大规模企业扩张时陷入苦战。为改变这一局面,他们敦促地方政府利用自身的议价能力为社区争取直接利益,并呼吁推进结构性政策调整,以保护普通居民用电户的权益,并遏制企业极端的财富集中。 选民在投票时关心的核心并非深伪技术(deepfakes)或虚假信息,而是电费飙升、失业隐忧以及数据中心对社区基础设施带来的直接负担等切身民生经济问题。 (0:04) 在拥有约 76 座大型数据中心的内华达州等干旱地区,巨大的水资源和能源消耗让科技基础设施建设成为激烈的政治争议焦点。 (2:38) 科技行业在公关传播上遭遇严重失误,过度夸大 AI 取代人工的风险,却未能向公众解释日常便利设备与实体数据中心之间的紧密依存关系。 (5:15) 百年历史的传统公用事业法规尚未适应千兆瓦级超大规模数据中心,存在将电网升级成本转嫁给普通居民的风险,但地方政府同样拥有向科技巨头争取公共利益的有力谈判筹码。 (7:28)

Reading summary

Political backlash over artificial intelligence is driven primarily by the physical footprint of data centers—including utility costs, water use, and grid strain—rather than abstract worries about deepfakes, according to panelists Kevin Frazier and Bob Lucey. Kitchen-Table Costs Eclipse Misinformation Concerns (0:04) Kevin Frazier of the University of Texas School of Law asserts that average voters focus on pocketbook issues rather than cutting-edge software models or online misinformation. Communities react directly when multi-megawatt data centers disrupt local neighborhoods with noise, construction traffic, and potential spikes in household electric bills. Frazier notes that internal polling has even shown internal combustion engines scoring higher favorability than AI, reflecting widespread frustration over tangible community burdens. Resource Strain and NIMBYism in Nevada (2:38) Former Washoe County commissioner Bob Lucey reports that Nevada hosts roughly 76 major data centers run by operators such as Google, Apple, Microsoft, and Switch between Las Vegas and the Reno-Sparks corridor. Public meetings frequently draw angry constituents who fear these installations will inflate energy costs and deplete scarce water reserves, which Lucey calls an explosive issue in an arid state where "water is gold." Antiquated Utility Regulations and Negotiating Leverage (7:28) Frazier argues that century-old public utility regulations fail to handle gigawatt-scale computing, effectively shifting infrastructure expansion and peak-demand expenses onto captive residential consumers. While ratepayer protection bills are pending in Congress, Frazier maintains that municipalities hold substantial leverage against hyperscalers rushing to counter foreign investments, such as China's projected $300 billion AI data center buildout. As a positive precedent, he points to progressive Louisiana parishes that negotiated community concessions to secure $50,000 bonuses for local public school teachers. Institutional Strain on Underpaid Local Officials (11:29) Lucey highlights an institutional mismatch in local governance, where part-time or lay county officials earning modest salaries of $60,000 to $70,000 annually must negotiate complex, multi-billion-dollar energy agreements against sophisticated corporate legal teams. Lacking technical expertise, commissioners struggle to distinguish genuine hazards from public panic, leaving them politically vulnerable to grassroots NIMBY backlash from voters reacting to unvetted social media narratives. Labor Evolution and Wealth Concentration (15:46) Both speakers push back against claims that data centers generate only fleeting economic utility. Frazier notes that trade unions strongly support these developments because construction labor is inherently sequential, comparing anxiety over automated displacement to historical shifts such as the elimination of manual bowling pinsetters. Lucey forecasts that standard electricians will transition into specialized data and server technicians. However, Frazier strongly warns that the concentration of economic and political power among a tiny group of Silicon Valley executives remains a valid and urgent public grievance. While the panel anticipates that future data centers will become more energy-efficient and labor forces will adapt to technological shifts, resolving public resistance depends on reforming outdated utility frameworks and curbing the concentrated corporate influence driving community pushback.

精炼阅读摘要

德克萨斯大学法学院人工智能创新与法律项目主任凯文·弗雷泽(Kevin Frazier)与波特集团高级顾问鲍勃·卢西(Bob Lucey)指出,选民对人工智能的核心政治关切并非深度伪造或线上虚假信息,而是数据中心急剧扩张带来的家庭电费上涨、水资源争夺、基础设施承压及财富高度集中等切实的民生经济矛盾。 现实民生痛点压倒技术虚假叙事 (0:04) 讨论开篇纠正了主流媒体关于选民主要担忧深度伪造与虚假信息的普遍叙事,强调决定选票走向的是切实的经济焦虑。弗雷泽指出,普通大众极少直接接触或使用诸如Anthropic的Claude等前沿模型,他们面对的是矗立在社区街角的多兆瓦级数据中心。居民深切担忧庞大的数据中心园区将导致周边交通拥堵、产生噪音污染并过度挤占社区公共资源。公众对物理设施落地的抵触情绪十分直接,弗雷泽透露,内部民意调查甚至显示内燃机(ICE)目前的公众好感度均高于人工智能。 技术部门在公共沟通上的失误进一步激化了这种对立。弗雷泽认为,科技巨头大肆宣扬人工智能替代人类劳动力却对其公共效益三缄其口,让民众陷入对未知的强烈恐慌与不确定性之中。卢西补充分析,大众普遍拥有智能手机或日常依赖网络自动化,却几乎无法在随身设备与高速公路旁耗能巨大的混凝土服务器建筑之间建立起“心智认知桥梁”。沟通脱节使得选民仅能接收到关于污染和电网承载力的负面警告,进而将数据中心视作生活负担的具象载体。 水电资源制约与地方治理失衡 (2:38) 卢西结合自身曾任内华达州瓦肖县专员的从政经历说明,基础设施扩张与地方民意的冲突在水资源稀缺地区尤为尖锐。在拉斯维加斯谷地至雷诺-斯帕克斯走廊之间,内华达州容纳了由Google、Apple、Microsoft和Switch等超大规模企业运营的约76座大型数据中心。在干旱荒漠地带,“水即黄金”,媒体对数据中心大量消耗区域有限地下水和推高家庭电费的报道,迅速使公听会沦为愤怒选民抗议的政治风暴中心。 这种反弹在地方治理中演变为强烈的“邻避效应”(NIMBY)。卢西指出,该现状与早期新冠疫情暴发时缺乏现成应对方案的恐慌相似,约85%的选民并不了解候选人的细化执政方案,往往依据口耳相传或社交平台片段投票。基层官员年薪通常仅有6万至7万美元,本职为兼职或非专业人士,平日需要统筹公共卫生、社会服务及复杂市政预算,在缺乏专业技术知识的情况下,极难在涉及数十亿美元的基础设施能源协议谈判中抗衡科技巨头的顶尖法务团队,常常沦为政治牺牲品。 公用事业法滞后与地方谈判筹码 (7:28) 针对飙升的电力基础设施开销由谁埋单的问题,弗雷泽坚决主张应由超大规模技术企业全额承担,而非转嫁给无选择权的居民零售用电户。他指出,美国现行公共事业监管法律框架制定于一个世纪前,专为传统工业用电模式设立,严重滞后于当今吉瓦级超大规模数据中心的用电需求,客观上促成了电网改造成本向普通居民转嫁的局面。目前美国国会已提出旨在保护终端消费者的防范法案,以期划定住宅用电成本红线。 面对科技巨头在全球竞赛中的战略焦虑,弗雷泽主张地方政府握有显著的谈判主动权。考虑到中国预计在未来一年内将在AI数据中心基础设施领域投入3000亿美元,科技巨头面临保持国际竞争力的巨大紧迫感。地方行政机构不应盲目提供单方面的企业税收减免,而应参考路易斯安那州部分教区的强硬谈判策略——当地成功迫使数据中心厂商直接出资,为公立学校教师发放了每人50,000美元的专项奖金。此外,弗雷泽预测当前一代数据中心属于能效历史最低点,未来结合GigaWatt等扩容合作举措,电网传输效率有望逐步优化并降低长期能源成本。 就业结构迭代与财富过度集中 (15:46) 对于数据中心是否仅带来短暂施工岗位而无法提供长远生计的质疑,弗雷泽反驳了对建筑就业价值的贬低。他强调电气工人工会之所以坚定支持数据中心落地,是因为建筑施工本身就是具有项目性和连续性的工种;从历史长河来看,社会曾雇佣专人手动摆放保龄球瓶,技术更迭虽伴随摩擦,但必然催生结构性再造。卢西同样指出,从蒸汽机发明到个人计算机普及,劳动力市场始终在自我调整,普通商业电工将逐步转型为维护现代计算骨干网络的专业数据与服务器电工。 然而,技术红利分配的严重失衡引发了更广泛的社会怨愤。在万亿级科技巨头迅速积累财富的同时,承载实体基建负担的周边居民却感知不到实质收益。弗雷泽明确表示,财富与权力过度集中正是政治抵制的核心根源,不能任由少数几家硅谷核心科技企业及其掌控者对整体经济与政治议题握有过大的支配权,这一失衡机制亟待制度化约束。 本场研讨表明,人工智能在选票政治中的冲突焦点本质上是传统公用事业规制与新兴数字基建扩张的结构性错配。尽管专家主张通过技能转型与地方社区权益谈判化解阻力,但在基层专业治理能力有限、百年法律体系滞后的现实约束下,如何公平分摊电网与资源成本并遏制科技巨头权力集中,仍是留待立法规制的重大未决课题。

Detailed notes — zh

## Background 该内容由 YouTube 频道 Ai4 于 2026 年 8 月 21 日发布,德克萨斯大学法学院的 Kevin Frazier 与 Porter Group LLC 的 Bob Lucey 等嘉宾参与讨论。节目围绕美国关键选举背景,探讨了人工智能如何从抽象的技术议题演变为涉及数据中心建设、电费上涨、就业与财富集中等直接影响选民切身利益的现实政治议题。 ## TL;DR 本场对话深刻剖析了 AI 议题在选举中的政治化转向,指出选民真正关心的不是抽象的算法模型,而是数据中心激增带来的高昂电费、水资源消耗及对失业和财富垄断的恐惧。以内华达州等地为例,基层社区因信息不对称和“邻避效应”(NIMBY)对数据中心产生强烈抵触,而年薪微薄的地方官员在面对数万亿美元市值的科技巨头时往往处于谈判弱势。专家指出,虽然历史规律表明技术升级会带来新型专业岗位,但当前亟需改革过时的公用事业法并强化地方谈判筹码,以防止少数科技寡头过度掌控国家经济与社会决策。 ## Atmosphere & style 整场对谈务实接地气且节奏明快,法学院学者用幽默风趣的比喻化解枯燥的法规与技术概念,前地方官员则以一线执政经验道出了基层治理的无奈。两位嘉宾在观点上高度契合,既有对行业脱离大众认知的冷静调侃,也有对民生资源被挤占的切身体会,并在尾声对科技寡头垄断权力的现象作出了严肃而犀利的批判。整体氛围兼具学术洞察力与现实冲击力,让观众深刻感受到前沿科技扩张与地方民意诉求之间的激烈拉扯。 ## Key takeaways - [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) 大选年选民对 AI 的核心关切已从抽象的深度伪造与虚假信息,转向电费账单上涨、就业替代以及物理数据中心落地等极为现实的民生痛点。 - [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) 公众对 AI 扩张存在强烈的反弹情绪,甚至在民调中对移民和海关执法局(ICE)的支持度都高于 AI,反映出技术叙事与普通人日常诉求的脱节。 - [02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) 数据中心作为 AI 的物理实体具象,在干旱的内华达州等地因消耗宝贵水资源和激增的电力负荷,引发了强烈的社区抗议与选民焦虑。 - [04:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=294s) 公众反对 AI 的根源在于不确定性,科技行业过度宣传“工作被取代”的公关失误,导致大众无法将手头智能设备的便利与身边的基础设施正面联系起来。 - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) 当前高耗能的数据中心尚属早期能效最差的形态,未来其占地与碳足迹将随着清洁能源开发和技术迭代逐步改善。 - [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) 现行公用事业法严重滞后于高耗能数据中心的发展,急需国会通过费率保护法案,明确应由科技巨头而非普通用电居民承担电网扩容成本。 - [09:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=574s) 地方政府盲目给予科技巨头“甜蜜税收优惠”的时代正在终结,社区手握高议价筹码,应通过谈判将产业红利反哺给基层公共福利(如教师奖金)。 - [11:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=679s) 全美缺乏应对 AI 冲击的地方治理指南,绝大多数普通选民在信息匮乏下容易因恐惧产生强烈的“邻避效应”(NIMBY),惩罚批准建设数据中心的在任官员。 - [11:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=679s) 地方基层民选官员年薪普遍仅有 6 至 7 万美元且缺乏专业训练,在面对市值数万亿美元的科技巨头时处于极度不对等的博弈劣势。 - [15:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=936s) 与公众对 AI 抢走饭碗的悲观恐慌相反,建筑与电气工会积极支持数据中心落地,此类基础设施为一线劳动力带来了持续的高薪建造与安装岗位。 - [15:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=936s) 历史上保龄球摆瓶工等工种的消失证明技术淘汰必然伴随新岗位诞生,传统电工等工种正在演变为高门槛的数据中心专属电气工程师。 - [18:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1134s) 科技巨头在 AI 竞赛中催生的极端财富与权力集中,正加剧选民对极少数商业寡头操控经济命脉与政治决策的强烈抵触与不满。 ## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) 选票上的 AI:从虚假信息转向民生与数据中心争议 开场主持人指出,公众讨论 AI 时往往聚焦于深度伪造(Deepfakes)和虚假信息,但对于即将到来的 11 月选举选民而言,真正触动神经的并非这些抽象概念,而是极为现实的生活痛点——不断上涨的电费账单、就业机会以及日益加剧的财富集中现象。这些由底层技术变革引发的连锁反应构成了实质上的“AI 选票”,也是本次圆桌对话的核心命题。 德克萨斯大学法学院(The University of Texas School of Law)AI 创新与法律项目主任 Kevin Frazier 随后发言。他幽默地邀请听众若到访奥斯汀,他愿意请客吃早餐塔可(Breakfast Tacos),条件是“只能聊 AI 和司法系统”。Frazier 强调,全美各地的社区居民在日常生活中根本不关心开发者用 Codec 构建了什么,或者在 Claude 上做了什么;选民真正关切的是“这对我有什么好处”。当居民听说隔壁街区要新建数据中心时,他们最直接的恐慌是交通恶化、环境污染和社区破坏。他甚至分享了一个具有警示意味的数据:当前美国选民对移民和海关执法局(ICE)的民调支持率甚至高于 AI,直观反映出公众对技术扩张的愤怒与抵触。 ```mermaid flowchart LR accTitle: AI技术扩张与选民现实诉求的脱节 subgraph Industry["行业焦点与技术话语"] A["大语言模型与算法 (Claude/Codec)"] B["深度伪造与信息治理"] end subgraph Public["选民真正关切的核心议题"] C["电费与公用事业账单上涨"] D["就业不确定性与财富分配"] E["实体数据中心污染/交通影响"] end Industry -.->|"存在认知与利益脱节"| Public ``` ### [02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) 内华达州视角:76 座数据中心的物理冲击与公众焦虑 来自华盛顿特区联邦游说与商业策略机构 Porter Group LLC 的高级顾问 Bob Lucey 随后分享了地方一线视角。作为内华达州第五代原住民,且曾担任瓦肖县(Washoe County)县长,他亲历了包含里诺-太浩工业中心(Tahoe Reno Industrial Center)在内的数据中心建设热潮。Lucey 指出,内华达州在拉斯维加斯和里诺-斯帕克斯大都会区之间聚集了约 76 座高规格数据中心,涵盖 Google、Apple、Microsoft 等超大规模云厂商(Hyperscalers)以及 Switch 等专业数据中心企业。 然而,在市议会和县委员会的公开听证会上,涌现出大量被激怒的当地居民。大众通过媒体接收到的信息普遍将数据中心视作威胁:它们不仅会大幅推高家庭电费账单,还会消耗极其宝贵的水资源——而在内华达州,“水就像黄金一样珍贵”。这种物理资源消耗的焦虑直接转化为了强烈的选民情绪,成为跨越选区和党派的争议风暴中心。 - **内华达州数据中心聚集规模**:拉斯维加斯与里诺-斯帕克斯区域分布有约 76 座高等级数据中心。 - **本地敏感资源**:西部干旱地区水资源极度匮乏,高耗水冷却系统引发民间抗议。 - **地方治理摩擦**:县委员会与市议会面临公众针对电力分配与环境承载力的激烈问责。 ### [04:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=294s) 恐惧源于不确定性:技术认知断层与公关失误 针对密歇根州等关键摇摆州的参议员候选人纷纷将 AI 和数据中心列为主要竞选议题,主持人提问这种对抗情绪究竟源于行业公关策略的失误,还是多重社会矛盾的集中爆发。Kevin Frazier 调侃道:“我不是营销大师,但通常来说,如果你想让公众支持你的技术,最好别一开始就到处宣传它会抢走大家的工作。”公众目前只接收到关于 AI 负面影响的讯息,却看不到任何切实回馈到自身的红利;而数据中心作为无形算法唯一的“物理实体具象”,自然沦为民众宣泄愤怒的最明显靶子。正如他朋友所言:“人们反对的不是技术,而是不确定性。” Bob Lucey 赞同这一观点,并引用了 Frazier 论文中关于“已知的未知”与“未知的未知”带来的群体恐慌。他指出,大众认知中存在严重的“逻辑断桥”:公众享受着 iPhone 等智能设备带来的便利,却无法在脑海中将手中的设备与家门口的数据中心建立正面联系。当媒体不断放大水污染和电网承载力问题时,缺乏技术全貌认知的普通市民只会本能地产生排斥。 ### [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) 谁来为飙升的电费买单?过时的公用事业法与改革 在探讨不断上涨的电费应由普通纳税人(Ratepayers)还是科技巨头承担时,Kevin Frazier 提出了一个标志性论点:“今天的数据中心是我们未来能见到的最差的数据中心。”随着技术迭代,其能效比和可持续性将大幅提升,占地与生态足迹也会逐步缩减。他列举了由 Al Gore 和 Gavin McCormick 支持的 Gigawatt 等倡议,指出超大规模运营商正在与各州合作提升电网总容量,探索降低综合电价的路径。 但谈到费用分摊责任时,Frazier 明确指出应由超大规模厂商买单,目前最大的阻碍是法律制度的滞后。他坦言公用事业法极为枯燥(“就像我的学生如果没喝 Celsius 能量饮料听课准会睡着一样”),且现行法规是在完全没有考虑现代高耗能数据中心的前提下制定的。目前美国国会已收到关于纳税人保护的专门提案,亟待立法介入以建立合理的成本分担机制。 - **能效演进论断**:当前数据中心属于早期低效形态,未来能效与清洁能源利用率将持续优化。 - **电网协同改造**:部分超算中心与能源机构合作扩建区域电网,理论上有望平抑长期电力成本。 - **立法滞后现状**:现行公用事业法典无法匹配 Hyperscaler 的耗电体量,亟需国会通过专门的费率保护法案。 ### [09:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=574s) 地方税收优惠的博弈:从让利倒贴到议价红利 针对地方政府为何一边面临电力负荷紧张一边向巨头提供巨额税收减免的质疑,现场展开了风趣的讨论。Frazier 戏称自己连家庭沟通都依赖 AI 谈判辅助,但回到严谨的政策分析上,他指出全美的地方博弈态势正在发生逆转:盲目提供“甜蜜税收优惠”(Sweetheart Deals)的县郡已越来越少。由于超大规模厂商建立算力基础设施的需求极其迫切,地方社区如今掌握着极高的议价筹码。 Frazier 举例说明,路易斯安那州的一些教区(Parishes)在与数据中心开发商的谈判中取得了显著成果,成功为当地教师争取到了每人高达 50,000 美元的奖金。他强调,面对国际算力竞争——例如中国预计在接下来的年度内投入 3000 亿美元用于 AI 数据中心建设——美国必须加速推进基础设施部署,但关键在于借助强有力的谈判将产业红利反哺给基层社区,而非单向的财政补贴。 ### [11:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=679s) 地方治理的困境:从疫情无序到数据中心的邻避危机 (NIMBY) 曾担任地方县级官员的鲍勃·卢西(Bob Lucey)结合自身在疫情期间的执政经历,指出了当下地方政府应对人工智能浪潮时的被动与恐慌。他回忆道,在新冠疫情暴发时,全美各级政府都在仓促应对,无论是社交距离限制还是口罩佩戴要求,没有任何现成的“执政手册”(Playbook)可供参考,拉斯维加斯甚至一度沦为鬼城。今天的人工智能面临完全一样的困局——公众和基层官员普遍充满恐惧,正是因为至今仍没有人真正写出一本能让大众读懂并遵循的 AI 应对指南。回顾技术演进,卢西感慨在自己 47 年的人生历程中,早年史蒂夫·乔布斯还在车库里手工打造初代苹果电脑,那时的单台计算机体积堪比今天的工业机房,而如今这类工业级中心已经容纳了成千上万台服务器机架,支撑着多家科技巨头的数据中心业务。 随着技术基础设施下沉至地方社区,基层治理遭遇了严重的认知错配与“邻避效应”(NIMBY, Not In My Backyard)。卢西指出,大约 85% 的选民其实根本不清楚候选人的具体执政理念,他们走进投票站往往只是听信朋友推荐、刷到社交媒体或读到新闻报道。一旦选民发现某位在任官员批准了在当地建设数据中心,强烈的抵触情绪便会爆发:“主席台上的那些民选官员把怪兽建到了我的后院!我不知道它是干什么的,它对我毫无用处,还会破坏我的房价和水源!”选民往往忽视了这些冰冷的混凝土巨兽正是为他们日常家庭电力、智能自动化和全套电子设备供电的核心枢纽。 更为棘手的是谈判双方力量的极度悬殊。大多数地方基层民选官员只是普通的创业者、房地产从业人员或普通市民,并非精通法律的高级专家,他们的年薪通常仅有 6 万至 7 万美元,在全美范围内仅略高于基本生活工资水平。他们领着微薄的薪资,承受着社区居民的误解与怨恨,每天还要同时处理公共卫生、人类社会服务等错综复杂的地方事务;面对市值数万亿美元的科技巨头,这些缺乏商业谈判经验的基层官员根本无力辨别技术项目的利弊得失。 - **选民认知盲区**:约 85% 的选民在不深入了解候选人政策价值的情况下投票,极易被社交媒体和碎片化信息主导。 - **邻避主义(NIMBY)误解**:居民将数据中心视为破坏环境和房产价值的庞然大物,忽视其对日常数字化生活的支撑作用。 - **地方治理资源匮乏**:基层民选官员年薪普遍在 60,000 至 70,000 美元之间,缺乏与巨型科技企业进行复杂商业与技术博弈的专业训练。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 数据中心建设引发的地方邻避矛盾与谈判失衡 subgraph LocalGov["地方治理与选民现实"] A["普通民选官员\n(年薪$6-7万/缺乏技术博弈经验)"] B["普通选民\n(85%不了解政策细节)"] C["邻避情绪 (NIMBY)\n'别建在我家后院'"] end subgraph BigTech["科技资本扩张"] D["巨型科技企业\n(数万亿美元市值)"] E["数据中心落地需求\n(大量能耗/服务器机架)"] end subgraph Conflict["治理困境"] F["监管与利益博弈失衡"] G["基础设施落地受阻与选票惩罚"] end D --> E E --> LocalGov A <-->|信息不对称谈判| D B -->|恐惧与误解| C C -->|选票压力| A E --> Conflict ``` --- ### [15:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=936s) 就业市场的演进:从“保龄球摆瓶工”到数据中心电气师 围绕大选年选民最核心的“AI 抢夺饭碗”焦虑,小组展开了深入探讨。目前选民中弥漫着悲观情绪,许多家长甚至担忧刚大学毕业的孩子未来将无工可做。凯文·弗雷泽(Kevin Frazier)直言,选民在选票上面临的信息环境非常恶劣,很多人在 X(原 Twitter)或 TikTok 上刷到短视频,或者听了山姆·奥特曼(Sam Altman)的一句言论,便深信自己的工作即将彻底消失并奉为圭臬。然而,如果去和一线电气工会沟通,会发现截然相反的事实:工会普遍大力支持数据中心建设。建筑行业本质上就是“按项目分阶段进行”(stint by stint),历史上没有任何建筑工人会在同一个工地上干一辈子;数据中心项目为当下及未来提供了大量高薪、高质量的建造与安装岗位。 弗雷泽用生动的历史类比化解技术恐慌:过去保龄球馆曾有专门负责人工摆正球瓶的职业(Pinsetters),如今这个工种早已被自动化机械彻底取代,但社会并未因此陷入大失业,而是创造了更多元的高阶就业。“关键在于,我们必须对这个国家的创造力和智慧抱有信心,相信我们能够率先创造出全新的工作岗位,而不是举手投降抱怨‘AI 实在太强大了’。” 卢西完全赞同这一演进逻辑。他回顾了美国建国 250 年的历程,指出从 1776 年至今,就业市场从未处于停滞状态,而是经历了从蒸汽工业时代到现代信息技术时代的持续蜕变。认为单一的人工智能技术就能完全消灭人类劳动需求的观点是荒谬的;传统职业正在迎来专业化升级,普通电气技工正在演变为“数据中心电气师”或“高密度服务器电气专家”,劳动力结构将随着技术设施的升级持续自我迭代。 - **建筑岗位的项目属性**:工会积极支持数据中心落地,此类高技能施工虽非单一终身岗位,但提供了持续且高回报的建设周期。 - **职业替代的历史规律**:保龄球人工摆瓶工等机械性工种的消失证明,技术迭代虽然带来短期阵痛,但最终会催生更具创造性的新产业。 - **专业技术工种升级**:暖通空调(HVAC)与电气工程领域正向“数据中心专属电气师”等高门槛方向延伸。 --- ### [18:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1134s) 财富与权力集中:科技巨头垄断引发的选民焦虑 在对谈的尾声,主持人抛出了全场最具火药味的话题:数万亿美元市值的超级科技巨头不断制造新晋亿万富翁,而普通民众不仅分不到红利,还要承受后院被塞进高能耗数据中心的代价,这种极端的财富集中是否在加剧选民的不满与撕裂? 弗雷泽用斩钉截铁的态度给出了肯定答复:“答案毫无疑问是 100% 的‘是’,我们必须正视权力集中的严重隐患。”他直言不讳地批评道,绝不应该允许“四家主要由四位白人男性执掌的科技巨头”控制如此庞大的国家经济命脉,并在暗中替整个社会做出如此多的重大政治决策。 在热烈的掌声与倒计时声中,小组在规定时间内收官。主持人风趣地调侃两位嘉宾在观点上高度默契、缺乏激烈的现场交锋,并建议大家可以在会后的拉斯维加斯赌场休闲时光中继续展开非正式辩论,随后致谢并结束了本场关于 AI、选举与地方政治的对话。 > “在当下,我们绝对不应该由四位白人男性掌管的四家主要科技公司,来控制如此庞大的经济体并替公众做出如此多的政治决策。” —— 凯文·弗雷泽 (Kevin Frazier) ## Notable quotes > [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) 只能聊 AI 和司法系统 — Kevin Frazier > [00:04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=4s) 这对我有什么好处 — Kevin Frazier > [02:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=158s) 水就像黄金一样珍贵 — Bob Lucey > [04:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=294s) 我不是营销大师,但通常来说,如果你想让公众支持你的技术,最好别一开始就到处宣传它会抢走大家的工作。 — Kevin Frazier > [04:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=294s) 人们反对的不是技术,而是不确定性。 — Kevin Frazier > [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) 今天的数据中心是我们未来能见到的最差的数据中心。 — Kevin Frazier > [07:28](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=448s) 就像我的学生如果没喝 Celsius 能量饮料听课准会睡着一样 — Kevin Frazier > [11:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=679s) 主席台上的那些民选官员把怪兽建到了我的后院!我不知道它是干什么的,它对我毫无用处,还会破坏我的房价和水源! — Bob Lucey > [15:36](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=936s) 关键在于,我们必须对这个国家的创造力和智慧抱有信心,相信我们能够率先创造出全新的工作岗位,而不是举手投降抱怨‘AI 实在太强大了’。 — Kevin Frazier > [18:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1134s) 答案毫无疑问是 100% 的‘是’,我们必须正视权力集中的严重隐患。 — Kevin Frazier > [18:54](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E&t=1134s) 在当下,我们绝对不应该由四位白人男性掌管的四家主要科技公司,来控制如此庞大的经济体并替公众做出如此多的政治决策。 — Kevin Frazier ## Mentioned Kevin Frazier, Jon Porter, Bob Lucey, The University of Texas School of Law, Porter Group LLC, Claude, Codec, ICE(美国移民和海关执法局), Google, Apple, Microsoft, Switch, iPhone, Al Gore, Gavin McCormick, Gigawatt, Celsius, Steve Jobs, Sam Altman, X (Twitter), TikTok ## Video description Kevin Frazier - Professor, The University of Texas School of Law Jon Porter - President & CEO, Porter Group LLC Bob Lucey - Senior Advisor, Porter Group As the United States heads toward critical midterm elections, artificial intelligence is no longer a future tech issue—it is actively shaping the democratic process. From AI-generated political campaigns and deepfake disinhibition to micro-targeted voter outreach and automated election administration, technology is redefining how campaigns are run and how voters consume information. This session explores the dual nature of AI on the ballot: its power to optimize political engagement versus its potential to disrupt election integrity, spread algorithmic misinformation, and challenge public trust in democratic institutions. [Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YaENIzEe-E)

Source quotes

[0:04] Kevin Frazier: 只能聊 AI 和司法系统 [0:04] Kevin Frazier: 这对我有什么好处 [2:38] Bob Lucey: 水就像黄金一样珍贵 [4:54] Kevin Frazier: 我不是营销大师,但通常来说,如果你想让公众支持你的技术,最好别一开始就到处宣传它会抢走大家的工作。 [4:54] Kevin Frazier: 人们反对的不是技术,而是不确定性。 [7:28] Kevin Frazier: 今天的数据中心是我们未来能见到的最差的数据中心。 [7:28] Kevin Frazier: 就像我的学生如果没喝 Celsius 能量饮料听课准会睡着一样 [11:19] Bob Lucey: 主席台上的那些民选官员把怪兽建到了我的后院!我不知道它是干什么的,它对我毫无用处,还会破坏我的房价和水源! [15:36] Kevin Frazier: 关键在于,我们必须对这个国家的创造力和智慧抱有信心,相信我们能够率先创造出全新的工作岗位,而不是举手投降抱怨‘AI 实在太强大了’。 [18:54] Kevin Frazier: 答案毫无疑问是 100% 的‘是’,我们必须正视权力集中的严重隐患。 [18:54] Kevin Frazier: 在当下,我们绝对不应该由四位白人男性掌管的四家主要科技公司,来控制如此庞大的经济体并替公众做出如此多的政治决策。

Source quotes

[2:38] Bob Lucey: water is gold [5:15] Kevin Frazier: if you want folks to support your technology, don't tell them that it's going to take their jobs. [5:15] Kevin Frazier: they're opposed to uncertainty [5:15] Bob Lucey: known unknowns [5:15] Bob Lucey: unknown unknowns [7:28] Kevin Frazier: today's data centers are the worst data centers we will ever have [11:29] Bob Lucey: no playbook [15:46] Kevin Frazier: Name one person who's worked on one construction site for the entirety of their career. [18:48] Kevin Frazier: In one word, yes, we need to address the concentration of power concerns. [18:48] Kevin Frazier: I don't think we should have four major companies run by four white dudes controlling so much of the economy and making so many political decisions. The answer is absolutely yes, 100%.

Original transcript

[0:04] You know, people have been talking about deep  fakes and misinformation. And if you thought [0:08] that's what the voters care about, I don't  think that is the case. If you look at the [0:13] November elections that are coming up, it's what  their electricity bill is about, the jobs. And [0:19] those are the issues like concentration of wealth  that's happening. You might call it the AI vote, [0:26] but those are the issues that are happening here.  And that's what we're going to be talking about is [0:31] AI on the ballot. And we have two incredible  panelists who have promised taken a note. No [0:38] waffling here. So we're going to try putting  them to the test. Um when you you know look [0:46] at the issues that voters are uh talking about  whether it's AI or AI related issues, do you think [0:55] that's on the ballot in this election? I certainly  think so. And first off, I just want to say thank [1:01] you for the opportunity to talk about this because  right now a lot of the introduction to By the way, [1:06] I forgot. Sure thing. No worries. No worries. Uh  my name is Kevin Frasier. I'm the director of the [1:11] AI innovation and law program at the University of  Texas School of Law. If you ever find yourself in [1:16] Austin, Texas, I'll buy you some breakfast tacos,  but we can exclusively only talk about AI. Uh [1:21] so that's that's the deal there and the justice  system uh and the nexus there. But yeah, please [1:27] please come down to Austin. You know, I I think  what's really important to flag is that folks want [1:33] to know what is in it for them when we're talking  about AI. What are we going to see from this AI [1:39] buildout that's going to improve my quality of  life that's going to help my student that's going [1:43] to help uh my neighbor? What what is actually  going to come about from this data center buildout [1:50] in particular? And when you go and you talk to  community members across the country, as I get [1:55] to do, uh, you don't often hear about what folks  are building on codecs, folks won't tell you about [2:02] what they're doing with Claude, unless you're at  this conference. They'll tell you that they've [2:07] heard a data center is coming down the street, and  they're worried what that that's going to mean for [2:12] traffic, what that's going to mean for pollution,  what that's going to mean for the state of their [2:16] community. And so that's really the issue that I  see being on the ballot right now. Uh and it is a [2:22] hot one. Uh folks will say that uh ICE is actually  pulling higher than AI right now. So if you want [2:30] an indication of just how angry people are about  technology, uh just keep that stat in mind. Well, [2:38] you know, and good afternoon everybody. Welcome  to wonderfully hot Las Vegas. Hopefully you guys [2:44] are having a wonderful conference. My name is Bob  Lucy. I am the senior adviser for the Porter Group [2:48] LLC, a federal lobbying and business strategy  firm out of Washington DC. However, my credence [2:55] comes from here based in Nevada. I am born and  raised and fifth generation Neadan. Served as [3:03] an elected official at the local level as a county  commissioner up in Wo County which is the home for [3:08] Reno Tahoe and beautiful Lake Tahoe and the Tahoe  Reno Industrial Center where we've seen a massive [3:15] boom in data centers. Uh, and to Kevin's point,  you know, when we talk about voters presentation [3:21] on the ballot and what they expect, I mean, you  got to think about where they are getting their [3:28] information from primarily. Are they getting it  from, you know, individuals that are seasoned [3:35] within the industry speaking to the benefits of  AI and what, you know, um, advanced information [3:42] can be doing for them and and how that can be  growing or are they talking about the physical [3:47] impacts to Kevin's point about these data centers?  Now, here in Nevada, we have roughly about 76 data [3:53] centers between Las Vegas and the Reno Sparks  uh, metro area. 76 data centers most of those [3:59] being very high level data centers between from  um switch you know hyperscalers such as Google, [4:05] Apple, Microsoft you have switch you have a number  of different large scale data centers that are [4:12] taking up massive parts of things but when I  go to city council meetings, county commission [4:18] meetings where you see the the the activated  individuals that are coming out into the public, [4:23] they are complaining about the physical structure  of the data center because what they're hearing [4:29] in the media is these data centers are bad.  Everything about them is bad. They're going to [4:35] increase your energy rates. They're going to take  your water. And in Nevada, water is gold for us. [4:41] And so when you start talking about things of that  nature, it does have a tremendous impact on what [4:47] people decide in and outside of the ballot box. So  this is just one question that maybe either one of [4:54] you can tackle and we'll get more into it. How  did this issue suddenly become so huge that it's [5:02] become and especially when you look at states like  Michigan and others etc. the Senate candidates [5:07] have made this their primary issue. Has this been  brewing badly? Is this being messaged wrongly by [5:14] the hyperscalers or uh just it's a confluence of  factors? Yeah. Uh you know I am not a marketing [5:23] wiz but I'll say generally if you want folks to  support your technology don't tell them that it's [5:28] going to take their jobs. Uh [laughter] just a  just a recommendation. Uh and so for a lot of [5:37] folks uh as Bob was pointing out the information  they've heard about AI is all the negative things [5:42] and there are very real costs we know about AI use  for example as with any tool can lead to negative [5:48] outcomes but they're not hearing about the upside  and so data centers as that physical manifestation [5:55] of a technology is the easiest target and the  reason why I think that this really had a boom [6:01] of popular opposition uh as as one of My friends  put it to me. Folks aren't opposed to technology. [6:08] They're opposed to uncertainty. And right now,  folks just aren't sure where their jobs going to [6:14] be, what uh they're going to see for their kids  education. And data centers are the thing that [6:19] they can target and respond to. Bob, anything on  this? Just briefly. Just briefly, I wanted to say, [6:25] you know, what uh Dr. Fraser had pointed out in  one of his papers that he had written that I got [6:30] the pleasure to read on the way down here. Someone  other than my dad. Yeah, I know. and is is that [6:35] I think there is the uncertainty of the known  unknowns and the also the greater uncertainty [6:42] of the unknown unknowns for these individuals and  when you talk about general public and there there [6:48] is no bridge for individuals now you can ask any  individual in this conference in this city if they [6:54] have an Apple iPhone or they have some sort of  device that connects them to AI where is that [6:59] bridge and how are they getting that that that  resource to operate and they don't know where [7:04] the bridge is. They can't make the bridge from  the physical location of a data center to that. [7:09] And when media tells everybody that you're  going to it's going to pollute your water, [7:12] that's all they're hearing. But they are not  making the mental bridge from it's a good thing [7:17] that my phone still works or my computer still  works or I have these abilities to do such things, [7:22] but I am having to deal with these complications.  So, we've discussed electricity bills. You know, [7:28] data centers is the manifestation. Should these  companies be uh sharing in the cost? I mean the [7:37] cost of electricity is going up. There's just no  question everywhere. There all kinds of reports [7:42] etc. Should the rate payers be paying for this or  who should be paying for this ultimately? I mean [7:49] what is what is the solution here? Yeah. So first  off I'll say uh I'm a man of many tired lines. Uh [7:55] but one of them is today's data centers are  the worst data centers we will ever have. [8:00] they are only going to be more efficient.  They are only going to be more sustainable [8:05] and we're going to see a smaller and smaller  footprint of all of these data centers. So, [8:08] first it's important to point that out. Second,  it's important to point out that folks uh like [8:13] uh Gigawatt uh which is a company that is backed  by Al Gore and a guy named Gavin McCormack, these [8:20] data center hyperscalers, they're working with  states to improve grid capacity right now and to [8:26] identify better ways such that electricity prices  can actually go down. So when I say that we can [8:32] see advances such that consumers actually can  benefit from this data center buildout, that's [8:37] happening right now. But that's just information  as Bob pointed out that doesn't really get out [8:41] there. Uh but when it comes to who pays, I think  the question is obviously the hyperscalers and [8:47] here we know that uh we are sitting on mountains  of outdated antiquated law. I could sit up here, [8:56] I'm a law professor and I could talk for 90  minutes about how boring utility law is and [9:02] all of you like my students would fall asleep.  Uh unless you just had a Celsius as they commonly [9:07] do. But if we go through, we see that our laws  were not designed for hyperscalers. And so when [9:14] it comes to thinking through how to allocate these  uh rate increases, our laws weren't suited for it. [9:20] But we have rateayer protection legislation that's  sitting before Congress right now, and I know the [9:24] last panel was uh a little dower on the prospects  of Congress acting, but hopefully we do see them [9:30] act because it's sitting right there in front of  them. Bob, you have anything to add? Because I [9:34] have something to go back at him. Go ahead. Go  ahead and go back to that. So, let me ask you [9:40] this. Why are states and counties then giving  these massive tax breaks to these hyperscalers [9:48] when these folks are consuming so much  electricity? What is the logic? I mean, are they [9:52] not uh good negotiators? They need AI to negotiate  for them. What the heck is going on here? I mean, [9:58] I I certainly recommend AI for negotiation. It's  how I get through most of my marital negotiations. [10:03] Um I I'm just kidding partially. Uh but but in  uh you are in Vegas, you know, you're going to [10:10] get a education. That is fantastic. Are are you  sure you needed to spend that much time at the [10:14] crabs table? Uh yeah, that's another conversation.  So with respect to these counties and why we're [10:20] seeing these tax breaks. Number one, I would say  uh first, we are seeing fewer and fewer counties [10:25] lean into tax breaks as the approach. Right now,  the demand by hyperscalers to build is so high [10:31] that counties and communities are in a great spot  to negotiate with these hyperscalers. There are [10:37] parishes in Louisiana that have negotiated to such  an extent with data center developers that their [10:43] teachers are going to receive $50,000 in bonuses.  $50,000. And that is a product of supporting local [10:53] communities and helping them negotiate with these  hyperscalers. So the answer isn't to say let's [10:59] break do these uh uh sweetheart deals but instead  say hey hyperscalers if you want to compete with [11:04] China which is on par uh on pace to spend $300  billion on its AI data center buildout this [11:13] uh next year then we need to start building  and these hyperscalers in the US know that. So [11:19] counties are in a great position. We just need to  support them and make sure that they can negotiate [11:23] and get those full benefits out of these massive  tech companies. Well, he here is the county person [11:29] who was I was just I was just turning to have a  bite of the apple of this. So, you know, I served [11:36] in in office during CO and CO we all experienced  the trials and tribulations of CO. Nobody knew how [11:45] to deal with it. Counties and states and the  federal government were scrambling to try to [11:50] identify whether it was social distancing, whether  it was mask protect. We didn't know. There was no [11:55] playbook for anybody to to address COVID. This  town was a ghost town for years. The last time I [12:02] was in this ex this expo having a conversation was  with the former governor of the state of Nevada, [12:09] Sheldon add, and we were all social distance  trying to figure out how to reopen Vegas. It [12:13] was just trying to figure out. And now when I was  thinking about this on the plane ride down this [12:17] morning, AI is very similar to this. People are  just afraid because there is really no playbook, [12:25] nothing that has been truly written about  AI enough that people understand. At my ripe [12:31] age of 47 years old, when I was a young kid, you  know, uh Apple was just building their first model [12:38] with Steve Jobs in his in his garage. there was  computers the size of what we have in industrial [12:44] centers now. Now those industrial centers house  thousands and thousands of decks of servers and [12:49] our massive data centers for multiple different  companies. So the thing is is to to Kevin's point [12:55] things the the scale is going to change. We  are going to see this get better. However, [13:01] the counties don't understand that when every  individual here, whether you're a registered voter [13:06] or not, Republican, Democrat, doesn't matter.  The voters, I would always say to most of my [13:13] constituents, 85% of the voters out there, do not  know the candidate or the values of which that [13:19] candidate they're voting for has. They have been  told by their friend that this is a good person or [13:25] they've seen on social media. they've read it  in the paper or an article and they just feel [13:29] like that it's something innate inside of them  that drives them to the voting box. Now, if they [13:35] read a little bit about this individual and they  see that this individual maybe potentially voted [13:39] for a data center or an incumbent that voted for  a data center to support this type of development, [13:45] there is this fabulous term in politics that  we call nimi, not in my backyard. And those [13:51] individuals are saying, "Those guys on that dis  right over there, those elected officials chose to [13:57] put something in my backyard, and I don't like it,  and I don't know what it's for, and it doesn't do [14:02] me any good, and it's going to ruin my property  value. It's going to ruin my water. This is [14:07] horrible." Not knowing that realistically, they're  using it every day. That is powering their house. [14:13] It's powering all their electronics in their home,  their automation, everything is powered through [14:18] that data center. But they don't care because they  all they see is one big concrete building. And so [14:23] from a county perspective when you're negotiating  you have everyday people. Now I was I am not a [14:28] law professor by any means. I'm an entrepreneur. I  got into politics because I was in real estate and [14:34] involved and I wanted to do something different.  But most people that are involved in re in [14:40] politics these days or are just regular individual  people. They try to do the best with the [14:45] information that they have. doesn't mean that they  are, you know, gradea, you know, lawyers that are [14:51] they're you for the most part, most people who get  paid in the elected office make less than 60 to [14:57] $70,000 a year to be an elected official. And that  is almost just barely above minimum wage for the [15:04] entire country. So why would somebody go and be  in an elected office and then still have everybody [15:10] within their community hate them? And so this is  the challenge. You get people that are get elected [15:15] to office that don't know how to negotiate. They  don't know how what how big business works and [15:21] they're not just dealing with AI. They are dealing  with health services. They are dealing with human [15:25] services. They're dealing with everything across  the board and they don't know how to discern what [15:31] is good and what is bad. We have four minutes  uh before he gives us the hook and I have two [15:36] topics still to cover so we'll try to speed  it. No, that was passionate to let us know how [15:43] uh qualified our elected officials are right now.  I think you gave us a very good indication. Uh but [15:50] uh from your standpoint, the jobs issue is also  an important issue. You know, people say, "Hey, [15:58] it's taking my jobs." Now, you read that there  is a big shortage of HWAC electricians. You know, [16:04] these Google and others are training it. But is  that a one-time deal? build it and the jobs are [16:09] gone. And then the what is the other impact of  jobs that will go away? You know, my kids coming [16:16] out of college, is he or she going to have a job?  What is that kind of messaging on the ballot? Just [16:22] briefly, and we'll get Bob to answer that. Yeah,  the the messaging on the ballot is not great. To [16:26] Bob's point, people have read an expost or seen  something on TikTok that says your job's going to [16:31] disappear, end of story, so on and so forth. Maybe  they heard it from Sam Alman. Who knows? And they [16:36] take that as gospel. Uh in actuality, if you go  talk to any of the unions that have electricians, [16:43] for example, they'll tell you two things.  We are in favor of data centers, and there's [16:48] no such thing as a long-term construction  job. Construction is always stint by stint, [16:55] job by job. Name one person who's worked on  one construction site for the entirety of their [17:00] career. Uh maybe there was like the Empire State  Building, but I think that was actually built in [17:05] six months or something like that. But the the  point is that these are highquality construction [17:11] jobs for the foreseeable future. Uh with respect  to your kids, this is a much longer topic. Uh [17:18] the the short the shortest version possible uh is  that we used to have folks who got paid to stand [17:24] up bowling pins. Name any of your friends who  work at the bowling alley and stand up bowling [17:31] pins. Any hands? Somehow we've made it right.  It's going to require a lot of ingenuity. It's [17:38] going to require a lot of creativity. And I  don't want to dismiss the disruption that's [17:43] going to occur. But fundamentally, we have to bet  on our ingenuity as a country that we will be the [17:49] spot that creates jobs first rather than the one  that just surrenders and says, "Well, shoot. AI [17:54] is too good." And I guess my short answer would  be exactly on line with what Kevin is saying is [18:00] that evolution of the job market is consistent.  There is nothing that has ever stayed very status [18:09] quo. You know, we have evolved from the steam  industrial area to um more technology savvy [18:16] area. I mean realistically we just experienced  our 250th birthday as a country and if you look [18:23] back to where we were in 1776, 250 short very  short years ago, the things have changed and it [18:30] continues to evolve. So to say that one thing such  as AI is going to take the job market and just [18:37] dissolve human need for jobs is ridiculous. It's  going to evolve. Electricians are going to evolve [18:43] to data electricians or different type of server  electrician. There's all kinds of different things [18:48] that are going to be needed to continue to move  this forward. Uh 40 seconds. Uh we're going to [18:55] try to do this quickly. Concentration of wealth.  When people hear a trillion dollar company or $2 [19:02] trillion company, millionaires getting pumped out  and these folks are putting in a data center in my [19:08] backyard and I'm not getting anything out of it.  Is that also adding to the whole mix? In one word, [19:15] yes, we need to address the concentration of power  concerns. I don't think we should have four major [19:20] companies run by four white dudes controlling so  much of the economy and making so many political [19:25] decisions. The answer is absolutely yes, 100%.  Thank you so much. We made it in time. We covered [19:34] it. Uh we got some great opinions from both.  You were agreeing on everything. We would kind [19:39] of want it a little bit, but maybe after hours.  Well, you know, after hours, you know, we just [19:44] want to make sure that you guys get safely down to  the casino floors and have a great time here for [19:48] the remainder of your conference. But thank you so  much for having us today. Thank you. Thank you for