Horowitz, Biyani Launch For-Profit College Rival for Tech Builders

霍洛维茨与比扬尼创办面向技术构建者的营利性替代大学 传统大学服务于机构利益相关者而非学生，导致年轻构建者缺乏实战准备，亟需建立与初创企业网络直接对接的学徒驱动模式。 在本次探讨中，Ben Horowitz、Erik Torenberg 与 Gagan Biyani 阐述了创办 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 的初衷。该学院是一所专为有雄心的年轻技术构建者打造的独立、营利性传统大学替代机构。他们认为，传统大学仍沿用过时的工业时代模式，无法让学生应对 AI 驱动的飞速技术变革。通过让学生直接融入旧金山科技生态圈并与顶尖公司并肩协作，该学院打破被动的讲座教学与文凭崇拜，优先培养动手执行力、同伴潜移默化的影响以及关键的人际领导力。最终，创始人旨在打造一份以真实好奇心以及通过试错换取的真知为核心的教育蓝图，使机构激励机制完全服务于学生的成功。 Ben Horowitz 和 Erik Torenberg 联手 Udemy 及 Maven 联合创始人 Gagan Biyani，创办了坐落于旧金山的寄宿式、项目制替代教育机构 Horowitz Andreessen Academy。 (0:55) 该学院作为独立的营利性实体运营，而非 a16z 内部项目，这在确保学生是其唯一客户的同时，还能借助 a16z 旗下 1,600 多家投资组合公司提供实习与就业对接。 (26:44) 其教学模式从基于讲座的被动“推式”学习转向好奇心驱动的“拉式”学习，鼓励学生利用 AI 解决极高难度的问题，并积累真实的学徒实战经验。 (31:00) 其长远愿景超越了单纯的软件工程，随着生成式 AI 降低各类媒介的制作门槛，该机构计划逐步拓展至音乐、媒体和医学等学科领域。 (40:33)

Venture capital firm Andreessen Horowitz and educational entrepreneur Gagan Biyani have launched the Horowitz Andreessen Academy, an applied residential program designed to replace traditional collegiate instruction with project-driven training, direct industry immersion, and AI tooling. The Disconnect Between Legacy Academia and Work (0:55) Traditional higher education originated as religious and agrarian institutions before evolving into industrial-era training grounds for corporate management. Ben Horowitz argues that while modern universities remain suitable for aspiring academics, they have become an inefficient economic and practical choice for 18-year-olds seeking direct workforce entry or startup founding. Academic curricula struggle to adapt to the speed of technological shifts, forcing students into passive lectures and abstract theory while saddling them with substantial financial burdens. Past educational alternatives frequently failed because they treated education solely as curriculum delivery, ignoring the comprehensive 'bundle' that makes universities resilient: elite peer signaling, socialization, brand credibility, and hiring pipelines. To build an enduring alternative, Biyani notes that an institution must deliver a complete bundle tied directly to employer networks and high-conviction young builders. Pedagogy Grounded in Execution and Advanced Tooling (5:37) The Academy replaces standard lecture schedules with brief, concentrated instruction paired with individualized, AI-paced learning and continuous execution. Rather than penalizing students for leveraging AI, the school adopts a framework inspired by Stanford professor Dan Boneh: presenting challenges difficult enough that students cannot complete them without AI tools, thereby transforming students from passive observers into active problem solvers. This execution-focused philosophy extends beyond software development into fields such as calligraphy, music, and horticulture by replacing written examinations with tangible creative projects. Horowitz contends that essential leadership instincts cannot be absorbed from management books; like an NFL quarterback facing defensive pressure, young founders must navigate real-world team conflict, cold outreach, and operational friction to develop true judgment. San Francisco Immersion and Cross-Generational Osmosis (20:08) Rather than isolating students within age-stratified collegiate cohorts, the Academy operates a residential model in San Francisco that embeds cohorts directly alongside working professionals. Biyani notes that when an 18-year-old student building hardware needs a specific chip, real-world constraints force them to learn outreach and negotiation on the spot with guidance from surrounding domain experts. Horowitz identifies Northern California as an essential base because it concentrates more than 80% of Andreessen Horowitz's portfolio companies alongside a high density of transformative tech enterprises. Furthermore, the local culture fosters a positive-sum environment that treats productive failure as an opportunity to gain hard-won insights—or 'earned secrets'—that theoretical coursework cannot provide. For-Profit Alignment and Long-Term Institutional Scope (26:44) The Academy is structured as an independent for-profit company rather than an internal arm of Andreessen Horowitz or a non-profit foundation. Horowitz argues this model avoids the institutional dilution seen in legacy universities, which must balance competing demands from alumni, tenured faculty, donors, and athletic departments. As a business, the school's commercial viability depends strictly on graduate outcomes, while a16z leverages its network of over 1,600 portfolio companies—including firms like Databricks, NVIDIA, and Stripe—for hiring pipelines. Five years out, the founders envision expanding the Academy's codified model beyond traditional computer science to encompass creative disciplines like filmmaking, music, and visual arts, which are also experiencing profound disruption from generative AI tools. The long-term validation of the Horowitz Andreessen Academy rests on whether its graduates can reliably build durable companies or secure top-tier roles over a multi-year horizon, and whether its non-degree, for-profit framework can be successfully replicated across legacy higher education institutions.

Ben Horowitz与Gagan Biyani宣布创立Horowitz Andreessen Academy，主张传统大学体系已无法适应人工智能时代的需求，必须从第一性原理出发，为立志投身科技创业与产业前沿的青年打造以实战构建为核心的全新教育模式。 工业时代高等教育模式与AI时代的脱节 (0:00) Ben Horowitz指出，现代大学体系成形于工业革命时期，其最初目标是将农耕社会的人口训练为适应现代企业层级架构所需的读写、数学及行政人才。然而在生成式AI与自动化普及的今天，以被动听课、通识理论和死记硬背为主的传统教学模式已无法跟上技术迭代的速度。绝大多数青年进入大学的明确目标是寻找理想工作，大学却收取高额学费并耗费数年时间在脱离职场实际的理论上。Horowitz与Marc Andreessen委托的一项研究显示，Z世代呈现出前所未有的分化度，其中涌现出一批迫切希望尽早进入技术前沿的青年构建者，而传统象牙塔正在延误这部分人才的发展。 重构大学捆绑包与以营利实体对齐学生利益 (3:31) 主持人Erik Torenberg与Udemy及Maven联合创始人Gagan Biyani分析认为，以往教育科技（EdTech）尝试多以失败告终，原因在于它们将大学仅视作课程交付渠道，忽视了大学作为学术文凭、社交圈层、精英筛选标识与成人礼的综合“捆绑包”（Bundle）。Horowitz Andreessen Academy计划借助a16z生态内超过1600家投资组合公司（包括Databricks、NVIDIA、Stripe等）的招聘需求与网络效应，为学生建立直接对接顶级雇主的品牌背书与职业通道。 该学院选择作为一家独立的营利性公司运作，而非a16z内部孵化项目或传统非营利高校。Horowitz解释，传统高校因试图兼顾校友捐赠人、终身教职教授、政府机构和体育部门等多元利益诉求，导致产品体验严重稀释。学院采取营利性模式，旨在确立学生为唯一的真正客户，倒逼机构必须依靠毕业生在真实世界的卓越产出与职业成功来维持品牌声誉与商业飞轮。 基于旧金山生态的学徒制浸润与人际能力培养 (20:08) 该学院采用常驻旧金山的非学位全日制模式，将首期招募的50名青年构建者直接置于科技生态的核心。Biyani与Horowitz认为，旧金山拥有容忍失败与推崇正向博弈（Positive-sum）的文化，也是全美孕育突破性技术企业的重镇。与传统大学将同龄人隔离在校园象牙塔的做法不同，学院推行“渗透式学习”（Learning by Osmosis），要求学生与成年专业人员、创业团队共同工作，在真实的工程合作与实习中面对实际利益博弈。 针对AI时代的人际能力，Horowitz以美式橄榄球四分卫作比喻，强调管理心理压力与团队领导力无法通过阅读商业书籍获得，必须在实战中面对“300磅防守队员扑面而来”的临场压力与冲突。他认为，随着AI代劳繁琐的机器操作，人类价值将高度集中于团队激励、愿景凝聚与真实的人际好奇心，青年必须在低风险的实战项目中通过多次尝试建立抗压能力。 从被动灌输到以AI攻克极难课题的“拉动式”探索 (31:00) 教学机制上，学院主张将“灌输式”（Push）学习彻底转变为以强烈好奇心驱动的“拉动式”（Pull）构建。Horowitz援引斯坦福大学Dan Boneh教授的观点指出，面对AI工具，唯一的教育出路不是禁用它，而是将课题难度提高到“没有AI就无法解决”的程度，进而促使学生攻克以往学术界未能攻克的难题。这种机制鼓励学生成为主动探索的“主角”（Main Character），以交付端到端的真实系统取代试卷答题。 Biyani强调，这种构建者思维同样适用于软件以外的书法、艺术、园艺等多元领域，核心在于以具象输出检验掌握程度。Horowitz建议18岁的青年不要过早被普通的“百万美元想法”所局限，而应将自身热情对准恶性疾病攻克、环境危机或制度信任等宏大挑战。硅谷推崇的不是盲目失败，而是在攻克硬核难题的挫折中获得稀缺且深刻的“经由实战赢得的秘密”（Earned Secrets）。 在未来五年的设想中，Horowitz Andreessen Academy期望验证并固化这套基于实战与AI工具的新型教学范式，使毕业生不仅能在科技行业立足，还能利用跨界生成式工具拓展至电影、音乐与现代艺术等更广阔的创造领域。Horowitz公开呼吁包括哈佛大学在内的传统高校模仿这一学生中心制模式，但其实际效果与能否成功替代传统学位背书，仍有待首批学员步入产业界的长期结果检验。

## Background 该内容由知名风险投资机构 a16z 于 2026 年 9 月 22 日发布在 YouTube 平台。视频简介介绍，Ben Horowitz、Erik Torenberg 与 Gagan Biyani 齐聚一堂，正式宣布创立 Horowitz Andreessen Academy，并深入探讨在 AI 飞速颠覆劳动与创造技能的背景下，未来教育应如何转向以动手实践、人际能力培养及真实项目攻坚为核心的新模式。 ## TL;DR 对话围绕新型学院 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 的创立展开，指出沿袭工业革命逻辑的传统大学教育已无法适应当下 AI 时代的爆发式变革。学院打破传统大学的冗长讲座与服务捆绑，采取营利性架构将学生确立为唯一客户，并依托旧金山与 a16z 的产业网络推行由好奇心驱动的“做中学”学徒制实战。讨论强调，尽管 AI 极大降低了产品制造的技术门槛，但身处现场的人际沟通、心理抗压以及在挑战世界级难题中碰壁后“赢取的独家秘密”变得空前珍贵。嘉宾鼓励当今 18 岁的年轻人拒绝陷入百万美元级的平庸生意，利用顶尖工具和同侪生态直接切入现实世界难题，成为引领时代的主角。 ## Atmosphere & style 全片充盈着雄心勃勃的开拓激情与直面现实的犀利透彻，既有对传统象牙塔官僚脱节的坦率批评，更满溢着对年轻人站在技术变革浪头上的无限乐观。Ben Horowitz 的叙事兼具历史纵深感与管理智者的沉稳，从家族逃亡史到生动的四分卫隐喻信手拈来，与 Gagan Biyani 充满执行锐气的教育创业视角相得益彰。三人对谈节奏紧凑、思想碰撞激烈，听感宛如置身一场直击未来教育内核的硅谷高层战略研讨，令人深受鼓舞。 ## Bulletin - [01:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=65s) Ben Horowitz 与 Gagan Biyani 正式宣布创立 Horowitz Andreessen Academy，旨在通过营利性独立实体打破传统大学教育的“服务捆绑”，为年轻一代建造者提供以项目为核心的实战成长场域。 - [21:57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1317s) 学院针对 Z 世代极高方差与碎片化的特质，首期招募 50 位年轻建造者，通过将整个旧金山作为全城校区，并深度接入 a16z 投资网络中的顶尖科技生态开展浸润式学徒制培养。 - [31:01](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1861s) 教育模式从传统的被动推式（Push）转向好奇心驱动的拉式（Pull），主张借助 AI 攻克极难现实难题，而非单纯考核在 AI 面前已贬值的标准答案记忆能力。 - [28:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1725s) 学院将营利性架构确立为保障利益对齐的核心机制，使学生成为唯一的真正客户，避免因多方利益相关者博弈导致教育产品价值稀释。 ## Key takeaways - [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=0s) 传统高等教育体系是为了工业革命后的企业职员需求而设计的，无法匹配 AI 时代指数级迭代的技术栈与现实工作形态。 - [04:37](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=277s) 以往 EdTech 项目失败的关键在于大学本质上是一套集声誉背书、社交生活与顶级雇主通道于一体的复杂“服务捆绑”，单纯的网课无法替代这一综合体验。 - [11:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=692s) 在 AI 工具大幅抹平执行门槛的当下，年轻人无需在企业阶梯上熬炼数十年，可凭借对前沿工具的天然理解单刀直入解决复杂的现实世界难题。 - [15:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=926s) 缺乏十亿美元级绝佳创意的年轻人，加入领军企业或顶尖创新团队（如早期 SGI、Databricks 等）历练，是快速拓宽认知边界与建立商业体感最高效的路径。 - [17:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1063s) AI 将人类从屏幕前解放出来，促使面对面的人际交往能力与心理管理能力成为最核心的不可替代资产。 - [20:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1208s) 软技能与领导力如同赛场上的四分卫直面扑防，无法通过教科书讲座习得，必须在解决实际项目瓶颈与团队冲突的实战重压中浸润磨砺。 - [21:57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1317s) Z 世代群体呈现极高的方差与分化，学院首期通过汇聚 50 名硬核年轻建造者，打造能够相互激发的同辈高质量协同网络。 - [23:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1398s) 以旧金山为超级校区，借力硅谷独特的包容失败、正和博弈（Pay-it-forward）及高信任文化，使学生能在超过 80% 的本地核心科技产业网络中就地开启职业生涯。 - [26:44](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1604s) 学院保持独立公司建制而非作为 a16z 附属部门，既能借助其科技企业网络，又为未来将实战学徒制模式扩展至音乐、医疗等广泛领域保留了制度空间。 - [28:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1725s) 坚持商业化营利性定位的根本目的在于将学生确立为唯一客户，把机构自身的商业存续与学生的长期成就深度绑定，消除非营利大学讨好捐赠者与家长的错位诉求。 - [32:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1953s) AI 时代教育应从填鸭式“推”转向兴趣“拉”，教学设计应将问题难度提升至“离开 AI 就无法解决”的极限边界，培养打破框架的破局者而非流水线 NPC。 - [37:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2249s) 鼓励 18 岁年轻人拒绝百万美元级平庸生意的诱惑，在攻坚世界级硬核难题的过程中承受有价值的挫折，从而“赢取独家秘密”（earned a secret）。 - [40:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2434s) 长远来看，学院未来五年将不仅局限于传统软硬件极客，还将赋能利用生成式 AI 跨越媒介壁垒、自由显化思想的全能创意者与现实难题解决者。 ## Detailed walkthrough ### [00:00](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=0s) 时代的转折：旧培养体系与新世界的断层 当前正处于人类历史上作为年轻人最伟大的时代，其变革与机遇堪比托马斯·爱迪生（Thomas Edison）或亨利·福特（Henry Ford）所处的技术爆发期。然而，当今年轻人面临的根本困境在于：现行用来培训、教育他们的一切体系，全都是为了一个即将不复存在的世界而构建的。 在对 Z 世代（Gen Z）的最新研究中，一个显著特征是这一代人在各方面都表现出了极高的方差（variance）与碎片化（fragmentation）。对于缺乏百亿美元级灵感的年轻人，绝不能妥协于百万美元级平庸的想法，而是需要更多地向外探索、开阔视野。在 AI 时代，建设一所新型学校意味着必须从头重新设计教育的一切。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 工业时代教育体系与AI时代的断层 accDescr: 对比传统教育模型在工业革命后的定位，与当前AI时代所需全新模式的差异。 subgraph Industrial["工业革命时代构建的旧体系"] A["传统高等院校体系"] --> B["标准化听讲与大课堂灌输"] B --> C["目标：进入工业/企业社会担任白领"] end subgraph AI_Era["AI时代的新需求"] D["AI革命驱动的生产力变革"] --> E["亲自动手构建真实系统"] E --> F["Horowitz Andreessen Academy: 探索与实践"] end Industrial -.->|旧工具与旧流程失效| AI_Era ``` --- ### [01:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=65s) 正式官宣：创立 Horowitz Andreessen Academy Ben Horowitz、Erik Torenberg 与 Gagan Biyani 正式宣布创立 Horowitz Andreessen Academy。在过去一年半的筹备过程中，团队在寻觅负责执行的联合创始人兼 CEO 时找到了 Gagan Biyani。 Ben 指出，Andreessen Horowitz（a16z）思考教育变革已经很多年，其核心洞察主要来自两个方向的碰撞： 1. **学生端的现实错位**：传统大学如果用来培养学者或大学教授，效果极为出色；但对于只想找一份工作、或者想要自己创办公司的年轻人而言，上大学的投入产出比显得极为怪异。不仅需要耗费巨额的学费与四年的大好时光，而且大学里绝大多数课程内容根本不围绕求职和创业展开。虽然高校强调培养所谓“综合素质全面的人”（well-rounded person），但现实中绝大多数 18 岁年轻人上大学的最直接目的就是为了就业，而高校的传授内容与现实职场严重脱节。 2. **企业端的招聘困境**：在过去四到五年里，大学在招收什么样的生源以及培养何种技能上发生了很大变化；然而科技产业所需的技术栈和核心能力正在以指数级迭代，庞大笨重的大学官僚体系根本跟不上技术进化的节奏。 大学固然依然适合绝大部分普通孩子，但对于那一批明确想动手做东西、且目标直奔科技领域的年轻人，a16z 掌握着整个行业最为密集的就业机会与岗位网络，清楚知道行业需要什么能力。因此，创办这样一所新型学院，直接切入核心能力的传授，便水到渠成。 - a16z 投资了超过 1,600 家科技企业，自身亦是大型用人平台，具有极其深厚的招聘与行业落地网络。 - 联合创始人兼 CEO Gagan Biyani 在教育与社群创业领域深耕十余年，此前先后联合创办了在线教育平台 Udemy 以及群组化在线学习平台 Maven。 --- ### [04:37](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=277s) 传统教育解绑：为何以往的 EdTech 替代方案未能突围 过去十年间，风险投资机构和创业者曾尝试过众多颠覆高等教育的替代方案，但大多未能形成真正持久的突破。Erik Torenberg 认为，很多项目失败的根源在于眼界过于狭隘，未能意识到大学本质上是一个复杂的“全套捆绑包”（bundle）。 大学不仅承担着传授知识的功能，还深度绑定了以下核心要素： - **地位标识与声誉背书**：向雇主或合作伙伴证明“你来自这里，所以我信任你并渴望与你共事”的社会认证机制。 - **社交与生活乐趣**：必须具备趣味性和吸引力，提供让人真正享受其中的年轻生活方式。 - **全方位体验**：大学涵盖了从校园社交、运动联赛到校友捐赠基金等多重属性。许多替代者要么仅仅做成了冷冰冰的技能培训网课，要么做了缺乏吸引力的半吊子混合体，未能构建出真正具备市场竞争力的综合价值主张。 --- ### [05:37](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=337s) “动手做”而非“纸上谈兵”：从工业时代转型走向 AI 时代重塑 Ben 强调，新学院的核心立足点必须是“做”，而非停留在“谈论做”。在大学里，学生选修艺术或音乐鉴赏课程，只是坐在教室里分析作品；而如果想要真正掌握音乐，就应当亲自去写歌、去制作、去理解创作的全流程。技术领域同理：想要成为科技领袖，核心是亲自动手构建真实运转的系统，而不是在黑板上研究抽象理论。 从历史演进的角度来看，高等教育系统经历了数次范式重构： - **宗教起源阶段**：最早由耶稣会（Jesuits）等宗教组织主导，旨在进行神职培训与教义研习。 - **工业革命扩张阶段**：18 世纪之前，人类社会几乎全为农耕结构，不存在现代意义上的公司与企业生态。随着工业革命爆发，社会急需大量具备高水平阅读、书写和基础算术技能的劳动力以支撑企业运转，美国的高校体系在此期间迅速扩张，为现代商业社会的繁荣奠定了基石。 - **AI 革命降临阶段**：当前正在发生的 AI 革命，其对岗位形态、工作方式与生产力模式的重构烈度，绝不亚于工业革命替代传统农耕文明的幅度。沿用工业革命时期培训普通公司职员的框架来迎接 AI 革命，从根本上就是错位的。 新学院的核心打法不仅体现在教学内容上，还体现在时间结构的重新分配： - 摆脱每天被迫听讲 5 到 8 小时大课的传统模式，大幅压缩被动讲授时长。 - 把时间倾斜到使用前沿工具、利用 AI 展开个性化自主节奏的学习。 - 引入高密度的结构化社交场景（structured social dynamics），并非单纯的酗酒派对，而是让志同道合的年轻人在旧金山线下共同生活、共同协作。 Gagan Biyani 与 Ben 一致认为，这虽然不是授予学位的传统大学，但必须提供一种在体验上可完全比拟大学、甚至超越大学的线下全日制成长场域。构建一所面向 AI 时代的新型学校，绝非在旧模式上小修小补，而是从工具、节奏到人际网络的全面颠覆与重塑。 ### [10:05](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=605s) 打破传统教育的“服务捆绑”与锁定精英建设者群体 Gagan Biyani 指出，高等教育之所以难以被轻易颠覆，是因为它提供了一整套复杂的“服务捆绑”（bundle），其中最关键的一环就是与能雇佣最优秀人才的顶级雇主建立深度连接。在过去五十年里，几乎只有两三家机构尝试过重新打包并交付这套捆绑体系。然而，以往许多类似尝试都忽略了初创企业最底层的成功法则：创业必须找到一个极其明确、特定，且对该产品抱有“极度迫切渴望”的核心客户群体。 在过去六个月里，Gagan 将全部精力都投入到了年轻一代的“建设者”（builders）身上。他发现，现实中确实存在这样一群对创造事物充满狂热激情的年轻人。这正是 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 能够成立并有别于以往尝试的核心基石——学院并不是在凭空创造需求，而是为这群已经存在的精英群体量身打造。这种需求既明确又高度精英化，面向的绝非意识形态层面的偏激群体，而是未来注定会募集数亿美元资金、创办雇佣成千上万名员工的企业领袖。 - **传统教育捆绑的核心**：将高质量同侪圈子、前沿技能训练与顶级雇主的招聘通道绑定。 - **初创教育的靶向人群**：具备极高自主行动力与创造野心、未来能够主导科技产业发展的年轻建设者。 ### [11:32](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=692s) 身处 18 岁的黄金时代：跳过晋升阶梯直接解决现实问题 Erik Torenberg 回顾自身经历时提到，传统的大学生活与现实世界严重脱节，学生往往只能在象牙塔里阅读科技资讯；而在这所学院中，学生将直接进入包括 Databricks、Nvidia、Stripe 等几十家顶尖互联网企业在内的“a16z 电影级宇宙”（a16z cinematic universe），通过高强度的实际工作与环境熏陶，以“渗透吸收”（osmosis）的方式汲取硅谷精神。基于此，Erik 询问 Ben Horowitz：如果今天重新回到 18 岁，面对当前的世界应当感到兴奋还是焦虑？ Ben Horowitz 斩钉截铁地表示，如果自己现在 18 岁，他会感到无比狂喜。尽管现行的就业选拔体制让许多年轻人对前途焦虑不安，但从技术演进的维度看，当下是历史上身处 18 岁最美妙的节点，堪比托马斯·爱迪生（Thomas Edison）或亨利·福特（Henry Ford）所开创的工业大变革时期。老一代人很难真正理解即将到来的新世界及其无限潜力，而年轻一代从一开始就掌握着最新工具，甚至比拥有三四十年工作经验的老手更具解题能力。过去年轻人必须在企业阶梯上苦熬二十年积累地位与信誉，如今他们一踏入社会就能利用新工具“单刀直入”（right off the rip）去解决现实世界中随处可见的复杂难题。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 传统职业路径与 AI 时代建设者路径对比 accDescr: 展示从传统的等级爬升模式向基于工具与解决问题的新模式的转变 subgraph Traditional["传统职业演进路径"] T1["象牙塔理论学习"] --> T2["初级岗位入职"] T2 --> T3["攀爬企业晋升阶梯（耗时 20 年）"] T3 --> T4["获取声誉并解决复杂问题"] end subgraph Modern["AI 时代新型实践路径"] M1["深度融入工业一线生态<br>(Databricks / Stripe / Nvidia)"] --> M2["掌握最前沿 AI 工具与协作技能"] M2 --> M3["直接切入现实难题<br>(领导项目或核心团队攻坚)"] end ``` 为了具象化代际变革带来的巨大飞跃，Ben 分享了自己的家族历史：他的曾祖父为了躲避沙俄时期针对犹太人的残酷迫杀（pogroms）举家逃亡至美国，沦落到血汗工厂充当日夜苦工，甚至因为工时过长只能直接睡在缝纫机底下，仅在周末偶尔回家；到了祖父这一代，通过在纽约市立学院（CCNY）接受教育成为一名教师，生活有了实质改善；而父亲这一代的生活质量又更上一层楼。Ben 感叹道，面向未来回望今天，年轻一代看待现在的父母，或许就如同现代人看待当年睡在缝纫机下的劳工一样辛酸与落后。面对飞速消逝的旧时代，唯有彻底向前看，才能站上历史正确的一边。 - **时代红利对比**：当前青年面对的技术代际差，使他们在理解新工具的生产力潜力上天然压制从业数十年的资深人士。 - **家族代际变迁**：沙俄大屠杀难民（缝纫机底下的劳工） $\to$ 纽约市立学院教育（教师） $\to$ 现代知识精英 $\to$ AI 驱动的超级创造者。 ### [15:26](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=926s) 绝佳点子与名企历练：从扎克伯格式天才到硅图的根基搭建 Erik 提出一个核心痛点：虽然当今制造产品的门槛空前降低，年轻人随手就能用工具写出一个约会软件或披萨订购应用，但为什么高质量的行业阅历、人脉关系以及在标志性企业的工作经验依然不可替代？ Ben 剖析认为，年轻时如果能洞察到全世界只有自己真正理解的超级机会，并受其驱动创立公司，那自然是如同马克·扎克伯格（Mark Zuckerberg）创办 Facebook 一般罕见且绝妙的天才时刻。然而，绝大多数年轻人并不具备这种开局洞见。一个发人深省的事实是，当年扎克伯格在哈佛大学的舍友们，几乎都曾收到加入 Facebook 的邀请，而那些拒绝邀请选择留在学校的人，后来无一不懊悔莫及，痛失了与最前沿创新同行的机会。 对绝大多数尚未产生惊世创意的年轻人而言，加入由领军者带领的顶尖团队是最高效的成长路径。Ben 坦言自己 18 岁时也并没有成熟的好点子，他的职业起跳点是早期加入了极具技术突破性的硅图公司（Silicon Graphics, SGI）。在 SGI 的经历让他亲眼见证了颠覆性创新的诞生过程与商业运作机制，正是这段在标志性企业摸爬滚打的经验，为他日后整个职业生涯筑牢了地基。 - **扎克伯格的哈佛室友教训**：面对划时代的早期火车，哪怕只是作为普通成员上车，其成长杠杆也远大于自我封闭的摸索。 - **标志性企业的沉浸价值**：在顶级科技创新公司（如早期 SGI 或当下的 Databricks）工作，能够快速矫正认知的狭隘，建立对宏大架构与商业落地尺度的真实体感。 ### [17:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1063s) AI 时代的终极杠杆：从屏幕解脱与人际交往能力的重构 在谈到年轻人才的核心素养时，Erik 指出 Ben 撰写过多本企业管理书籍并在内部反复强调人际交往能力（people skills）。他询问 Ben，这种能力是他在 18 岁时就已具备的，还是后天习得的？在高等教育中应当如何传授这项技能？ Ben 认为，掌握人际交往能力的根本前提在于“置身于人群之中”。千禧一代及年轻一代之所以深陷前所未有的“孤独流行病”（loneliness epidemic），核心原因在于他们被长期锁死在发光的屏幕前。而 AI 技术带来的最大潜在解放，恰恰是让人类脱离屏幕束缚——未来人们只需通过自然语言向 AI 下达指令，让机器去应付繁琐的计算机交互，人类自身则能被彻底解放出来，去面对面打交道。在这种背景下，了解同伴、激发团队潜能、凝聚人心追求超越个体的宏大愿景，将变得空前值钱。 传统大学过去唯一不可替代的长处，就是提供了一个多元人群碰撞的物理场域，让一个来自沿海大都市的学生有机会遇见来自内布拉斯加州（Nebraska）的同学，好奇地探寻对方家乡是否真的只有玉米地。然而在商业世界中，许多人却丧失了这种最朴素的人际探知欲。Ben 强调，他在公司内部极力推行的一项底层交往技巧，就是从“探寻眼前这个人究竟是谁”开始，而非直奔冰冷的业务主题： > “不要只停留在客套的寒暄。问问对方在哪里长大？来自何方？父母有着怎样的文化背景？他们当年相处得如何？当你开始理解一个人的生命底色时，真实的连接才会建立。年轻人在同龄群体中天然会这么做，但到了商业语境里，这项本能却往往被遗忘了。” ### [20:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1208s) 技能的“潜移默化”培养与打破同温层的项目式学习 传统的大学教育往往将学生局限在同龄人构成的单一社交泡泡中——你接触的大多是同届学生，最多偶尔认识一两个高年级或低年级的学长学姐。但 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 期望打破这种隔离。通过让学生在同一办公空间中与真实的公司、从业人员、实际项目、协同实习（co-op）以及“成年人的真实世界”共同生活与工作，使学生置身于浓厚的行业生态之中。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 传统大学与学院式技能学习路径对比 accDescr: 对比传统课堂通过理论讲座学习，与学院通过真实项目、行业环境渗透及同行支持快速培养人际技能的模式。 subgraph Traditional["传统大学学习模式"] A["同龄人社交气泡\n（同届学生同温层）"] B["理论讲座与脱节授课\n（例如在教室听谈判课）"] A --> B B --> C["缺乏实战场景与应对能力"] end subgraph Academy["Horowitz Andreessen Academy 模式"] D["多元社交生态\n（行业先锋 + 成人世界）"] E["真实项目需求倒逼\n（如制造机器狗需采购芯片）"] F["潜移默化与导师指点\n（行业专家即时建议）"] D --> E E --> F F --> G["极速掌握沟通谈判与人际技能"] end ``` 这种浸润式环境（osmosis）能够强迫学生面对现实问题并快速成长。例如，假设一名学生想制造一种新型机器狗（robot dog），核心瓶颈是必须拿到某款特定芯片，但他甚至不知道该怎么写一封商务冷邮件（cold email）。在传统环境里他可能寸步难行，但在真实行业网络环绕下，身边的从业专家会主动给出针对性建议：“你应该这样切入、那样表达”。这种将硅谷的熏陶、互助支持的同行网络以及项目制驱动结合在一起的体系，远胜过坐在阶梯教室里听一堂虚无缥缈的谈判理论课。正如他们所指出的：“你不是通过听讲座来培养人际技能的，你是因为真正在做一件自己极其在乎的事情，且必须争取到所有人的支持，才被迫且快速地磨砺出这种能力。” --- ### [21:57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1317s) Z 世代的高方差特征与聚集 50 名年轻建造者 Mark 和 Ben 委托开展的一份针对 Z 世代（Gen Z）的专门研究报告显示，这一代人在各个层面都表现出前所未有的“最高方差与高度碎片化”（highest variance and fragmentation）。他们内部的分化极为剧烈：在过去他们读大学的年代，18 岁就已经全身心投入创办初创公司、沉迷于构建产品的情况极度罕见；但如今在 Z 世代中，已经涌现出一批极度硬核的创业者与建造者。正因群体方差如此之大，找到志同道合的人（find your people）变得前所未有地困难且重要。 学院的创办核心正是要将这些具备高韧性、高度创业精神的人汇聚到一处。在学院的首期奖学金项目（Founding Class Fellowship）中，他们计划挑选并聚集 50 名真正的年轻建造者（builders）。Gagan 回忆自己 13 岁就开始第一次创业冒险，但在成长过程中身边几乎没有任何具备创业倾向的人；而在这里，50 位对“建造”有着广泛定义（涵盖软硬件、艺术或技术各个维度）的年轻人将被汇集在同一个物理空间内相互碰撞、激发灵感，共同创造出极其强大的同辈协同效应。 --- ### [23:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1398s) 旧金山作为全城校区：宽容失败、正和博弈与高信任文化 Ben 提到自己在伯克利长大（他调侃其为“伯克利共和国”），当时那里距离硅谷物理上只有半小时车程，文化和心理距离却仿佛有一万英里之遥。然而加利福尼亚与湾区不仅是全球技术的桥头堡，更是深厚的文化与思想堡垒。美国是全球唯二能够大规模批量诞生伟大公司的核心区域之一，而全美绝大多数伟大公司以及亲手创立并运营它们的人才，全都高度集中在加州和旧金山湾区。Ben 回忆自己当年在纽约读大学时，校园主要的招聘渠道基本全被金融服务业（financial services）占据；而本学院连接着庞大的科技产业网络，其中超过 80% 的合作资源与公司就扎根在湾区本地，学生在这里学习、积累人脉，毕业即可就地开启职业生涯。 旧金山本座城市就是学生的超级校区（"San Francisco is your campus"）。更重要的是，它拥有许多外界鲜少深究的独特文化内核： - **包容并拥抱失败**：即使一家公司创业失败，社区和资本依然愿意支持创始人的下一家公司； - **正和博弈与互助文化（Pay-it-forward）**：每个人都笃信“帮助他人无需立刻索取回报，它终将以更美好的方式回流”； - **极度高信任与高雄心并存**：兼具安全包容的心理环境与极度高昂的改变世界雄心，这是全球罕见且难以复制的独特土壤。 无论是人工智能、新型货币体系、还是生物技术的未来，不仅核心技术在这里诞生，关于这些技术未来走向的关键辩论与现实博弈（"both metaphorically and literally"）也正在旧金山发生并向全球辐射。 --- ### [26:44](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1604s) 独立建制与突破科技局限的宏大野心 关于为什么 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 必须成立为一家独立公司，而非仅仅作为 Andreessen Horowitz（a16z）内部的一个附属业务部门，Ben 剖析了其背后的战略权衡： 1. **连接优势与明确出口**：a16z 拥有全面触达整个科技界机遇的稀缺网络，能够为学院优秀毕业生提供极为扎实的合作通路与机会矩阵； 2. **定位差异与本质不同**：a16z 本质上是一家投资机构，而学院是一所教育机构，是一项针对国家未来的长远投资；将其保持独立，才能建立自有的制度和文化，不被投资公司的运作逻辑所异化； 3. **跨越科技行业的广泛蓝图**：这种基于项目实战与学徒制的教育变革绝不局限于科技领域。当今各行各业都面临剧烈重构，未来该模式完全可以扩展至音乐、医疗等广泛领域。如果它仅仅是 a16z 旗下的一个分支，将会极大限制学院未来的发展规模与雄心，而他们“从不做自我设限的事情”。 --- ### [28:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1725s) 营利性定位的根本逻辑：让学生成为唯一的“真正客户” 学院必须采取商业化/营利性（for-profit）架构的根本原因，在于必须确保学生成为核心且唯一的客户（customer）。在现有的许多传统教育机构中，由于资金和体制来源复杂，机构往往试图同时讨好政府、捐赠人、赞助企业等过多利益相关方，最终导致交付给学生的产品支离破碎且效率低下。 对于今天的年轻人而言，这本应是人类历史上成长与发展的黄金时代；然而，现行所有用来培养年轻人的传统教育体系，都是针对一个“行将消逝的旧世界”而设计的。必须有一家机构全心全意为年轻人这一真实用户提供极致服务。他们并不寻求建立市场垄断，而是公开呼吁竞争：“请抄袭我们吧，请哈佛大学也来抄袭我们，请所有人都能借鉴这一模式。”正如 Ben 所言，当有人率先完成从 0 到 1 的创新突破后，这种成功的新型教育范式才能真正扩散并改变全美乃至全球所有年轻人的命运。 ### [30:11](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1811s) 营利模式与利益对齐：把学生当作真正的客户 传统高等教育的结构往往充满了错位的利益诉求：大学不仅要讨好捐赠者、迎合校友会，还要安抚家长的焦虑，而处于核心位置的学生反而被边缘化。Horowitz Andreessen Academy 选择以营利性实体运作，核心逻辑在于彻底简化这一利益方程——将年轻人确立为唯一的终端客户，所有资源与目标全部聚焦于“他们真正需要什么”以及“什么能为他们创造最好的生活”。 通过营利模式建立起的商业飞轮非常直接：学院必须全力确保入读的年轻人未来能够取得非凡成就，唯有学生在现实世界中做出一番事业，学院才能树立无可替代的品牌信誉，从而让组织长久存续。这种将教育机构的生存与学生的长期成就深度绑定的机制，在传统教育领域极其罕见，也是学院成立的核心支柱之一。 ### [31:01](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1861s) 激发好奇心：从填鸭式“推”到由兴趣驱动的“拉” 教育界常引用一句话：“教育不是注满一桶水，而是点燃一把火”（Education is not the filling of a bucket, but the lighting of a fire）。学院希望彻底摒弃那种被动应试、死记硬背的“推式”（push）模型，转向由学生内在好奇心驱动的“拉式”（pull）模型——发掘个体真正痴迷的领域，并鼓励他们去该领域中创造与探索。很多时候，某种兴趣在初期看似毫无实用价值，但日后往往会产生深远影响： - 史蒂夫·乔布斯（Steve Jobs）早年出于兴趣旁听了字体排印学与书法课（calligraphy），当时看似与计算机工程毫无关联，但多年后直接造就了 Mac 电脑革命性的优美字形体系。 - 本·霍洛维茨（Ben Horowitz）自年轻时起就狂热喜爱说唱音乐（Rap Music），至今仍乐此不疲。这种独特的跨界爱好不仅让他在商业世界中成为更具辨识度与真实感（authentic）的人物，更深刻磨砺了他的叙事能力（storytelling），成为他日后管理、投资与写作不可或缺的超级技能。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: Push vs Pull Learning Model accDescr: A comparison between traditional passive push education and academy project-based pull learning. subgraph Traditional["传统教育模式：推式（Push）"] T1["标准考试与学分压力"] --> T2["死记硬背已知答案"] T2 --> T3["流水线上的齿轮（NPC）"] end subgraph Academy["学院教育模式：拉式（Pull）"] A1["内在好奇心与热情"] --> A2["利用 AI 攻克极难问题"] A2 --> A3["产出实体项目与突破"] A3 --> A4["现实世界的主角（Main Character）"] end ``` ### [32:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1953s) AI 时代的创造者：拒绝当 NPC，去做主角 在当代，单纯考察学生能否背诵标准答案已经毫无意义，因为 AI 工具在回答既定知识方面早已超越绝大多数人类。本·霍洛维茨提到了斯坦福大学著名密码学教授丹·博内（Dan Boneh）对 AI 教学的洞见：面对 AI，教育者只有两条路——要么试图禁止它（这注定行不通），要么“把问题设置得极其艰深，深到离开 AI 就根本无法解决”（make the problem so hard that you can't solve them without AI）。博内教授发现，当采用后一种方式时，学生们竟攻克了以往计算机科学教学历史上从未有学生能够解决的难题，甚至连教授自己当年也无法解开。 这种转变赋予了每个年轻人创造跨越式突破的可能。学院正是为那些渴望成为“主角”（Main Character）而非系统里的“NPC”（非玩家角色）或大型组织中的螺丝钉而设计的： - **拒绝当测试机器**：单纯做题只是机械重复，AI 时代呼唤的是带着顶级工具挑战极限边界的开拓者。 - **万物皆可创造（Builder Mentality）**：即使是看似与 AI 毫不相干的传统领域（如书法、园艺或风筝冲浪），也必须重构为行动导向的任务。例如学书法不再是考卷上回答“如何画出漂亮的字母”，而是“掌握足够的技巧，在学院里亲手绘制并展示一幅优美的伊斯兰诗歌挂轴”。 ### [35:15](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2115s) 软技能的残酷内功：无法从教科书里学来的心理战 在创业与创造的过程中，软技能（People Skills）与心理管理至关重要。有人把创始人比作电影导演，必须打磨剧本、组织演员阵容并掌控全场；也有人把创始人比作夜店推广人，必须懂得兜售愿景、聚拢人气与谈判斡旋。更关键的是面对压力时的内在心理管理（the inner game of managing your psychology），许多极具魅力的人也会因心理失衡而彻底崩溃（crash out）。 本·霍洛维茨直言，这些东西在传统课堂或教科书里根本学不会： - **四分卫隐喻**：一个人可以读遍全世界所有关于橄榄球战术的书籍，但当你真正踏上 NFL 的赛场担任四分卫时，面对一名 300 磅重如野兽般扑面而来的防守球员，没有任何一本书能教会你如何在极度恐慌中看清局势并精准把球传出去。你必须亲自置身险境，才能学会应对这种重压。 - **低成本实战**：学院的作用类似于高强度的“球队实战对抗赛”（practice），而非让学生在毫无训练的情况下直接送命于真实商业战场。学生必须在团队协作中切身体会：“决策犹豫不决会付出什么代价？”、“逃避团队冲突会酿成怎样的恶果？”那种在面临艰难抉择时胃部翻江倒海的“可怕感觉”（that horrible feeling），唯有亲身经历过，才能转化为真正的领导力判断。 ### [37:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2249s) 18 岁该做什么：拒绝平庸，在攻坚中“赢取秘密” 当强大的 AI 工具和开发资源大幅降低了执行门槛，“做什么”与“什么才真正值得投入时间”就成了最大的瓶颈。如果一个年轻人今天只有 18 岁，他该如何选择方向？ 本·霍洛维茨与加甘·比亚尼（Gagan Biyani）认为，选题的核心应当结合个人兴趣、自身技能匹配度，以及现实世界中亟待解决的重大系统性挑战——无论是致命疾病的攻克、环境问题的改善，还是大选系统与民主机制完整性的技术解法。更重要的是，伟大的创业洞见与科学发现往往源于意外（accidental）： - **科学探索路径**：你最初的目标可能是去攻克某种致命绝症（例如胰腺癌），但在这个极具野心的攻坚过程中，你被挡在路上的某个次生硬核难题所拦截；当你回过头去解决这个阻碍时，反而孕育出了一项颠覆性的发明或企业。 - **拒绝百万级平庸**：很多 18 岁的年轻人视野往往被局限在高中与青少年的狭窄生活经验中。学院的核心使命之一，就是让年轻人接触更广阔的现实世界，告诫他们：“如果你还没有构思出十亿美元级的伟大愿景，切莫过早妥协于一个平庸的百万美元级小生意，而是应该继续深入探索未知。” - **硅谷所真正包容的失败**：硅谷并非盲目崇拜一切失败，粗心或愚蠢导致的失败毫无意义；被尊重的失败，是在挑战世界级难题的过程中所经历的挫折。通过全力以赴去挑战难题并承受失败，你能够“赢取独家秘密”（earned a secret）——唯有你深切体会到了这堵墙究竟有多硬、它背后的子问题（subproblems）到底分布在哪里，这种认知是任何走捷径的人都无法企及的真正财富。 ### [40:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2419s) 在失败中获取真知：“做中学”的核心价值 真正的认知与技能往往不是从书本理论中得来的，而是在实操中经历挫折、撞上具体问题后沉淀下来的宝贵洞察。在评估一位年轻创业者或建设者时，最核心的衡量标准并不是他们是否一帆风顺，而是面对连锁出现的复杂难题时能否迎难而上、解决其中关键的一环。通过失败所赢取的那份真实洞察，正是硅谷乃至 Horowitz Andreessen Academy（哈罗维茨-安德森学院）最为看重的品质。 学院的核心教育哲学就是追问一个根本性问题：“你在动手实践中到底学到了什么？”（"What did you learn by doing?"）这种重实践、重反馈的模式，彻底颠覆了传统象牙塔只看论文和考试分数的评估体系，将重心放回到在真实世界的碰壁中磨砺出的直觉与判断力。 ### [40:34](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2434s) 展望五年之后的学院：成就多元创作者与思想实体化 谈及对 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 五年后的愿景与成功定义，本·哈罗维茨勾勒出了一幅更加宏大且充满可能性的图景。评判学院是否成功，首先取决于毕业生的成长轨迹：他们是否找到了自己发自内心热爱且引以为傲的事业，或者是否创立了极具潜力的创新企业——哪怕在短短五年之内，这些初创公司尚未达到世俗意义上的商业巅峰，但探索本身就已经意义非凡。 更深层次的成功在于学院自身的演进。学院将在教学实践中摸清究竟怎样的模式才真正有效，并将这种机制不断拓展与复制，从而吸纳更多样化背景的学生。未来的学院绝不会仅仅局限于对狭义科技感兴趣的极客，而是要敞开大门迎接致力于解决各类现实世界复杂难题的实干家，以及在新时代蓬勃涌现的卓越创作者。 当前的创意产业正在经历一场前所未有的范式转移。得益于生成式 AI 等前沿工具的赋能，创作者的表达不再受限于单一的技术门槛或专业媒介。很多创意领域的朋友感叹，如今只要心中有一个想要传达的情感或概念，就能自由跨越所有媒介形式将其完全实现：一个人不仅可以制作一部完整的长篇电影，还能亲自为电影配乐、谱写歌曲。这是一个让灵感与想法在各种媒介中自由显化（manifest）的黄金时代。Horowitz Andreessen Academy 的长期使命，正是打破传统技术路径的单一壁垒，全力支持并加速这种跨领域的全方位创造，携手未来一代的学生共同将这一构想变为现实。 ```mermaid flowchart TD accTitle: 五年后的学院愿景与生态扩展 accDescr: 展示 Horowitz Andreessen Academy 从科技构建者扩展到全能创意者与现实问题解决者的五年愿景路径。 subgraph Graduates["核心成果与衡量"] A["热爱的事业与发展"] B["启动前沿创新项目/初创公司"] C["总结验证有效的教育范式"] end subgraph Expansion["辐射群体扩展"] D["多元化生源"] E["全球现实难题解决者"] F["跨界卓越创意人"] end subgraph CreativeEra["新工具赋能创作"] G["情感与核心概念"] --> H["全媒介自由实现"] H --> I["长篇电影制作"] H --> J["音乐创作与电影配乐"] end Graduates --> Expansion Expansion --> CreativeEra ``` - **毕业生成就**：衡量学院的标准在于毕业生是否从事自己热爱的卓越事业，或者启动了激动人心的新创公司。 - **生源多样性**：从最初偏向计算机与硬核技术的早期探索者，逐步扩展至关注全球性现实议题的行动派，以及运用全新技术打破媒介边界的艺术家与创意大师。 - **全媒介表达**：现代 AI 工具打破了创作分工的物理壁垒，无论是编剧、长片制作还是影视配乐，个体的想法都能以极低门槛无缝呈现为现实作品。 ## Notable quotes > [17:43](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1063s) 不要只停留在客套的寒暄。问问对方在哪里长大？来自何方？父母有着怎样的文化背景？他们当年相处得如何？当你开始理解一个人的生命底色时，真实的连接才会建立。年轻人在同龄群体中天然会这么做，但到了商业语境里，这项本能却往往被遗忘了。 — Ben Horowitz > [20:08](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1208s) 你不是通过听讲座来培养人际技能的，你是因为真正在做一件自己极其在乎的事情，且必须争取到所有人的支持，才被迫且快速地磨砺出这种能力。 — Ben Horowitz > [23:18](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1398s) San Francisco is your campus — Ben Horowitz > [28:45](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1725s) 请抄袭我们吧，请哈佛大学也来抄袭我们，请所有人都能借鉴这一模式。 — Ben Horowitz > [31:01](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1861s) Education is not the filling of a bucket, but the lighting of a fire > [32:33](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=1953s) make the problem so hard that you can't solve them without AI — Dan Boneh > [37:29](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2249s) 如果你还没有构思出十亿美元级的伟大愿景，切莫过早妥协于一个平庸的百万美元级小生意，而是应该继续深入探索未知。 — Ben Horowitz > [40:19](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q&t=2419s) What did you learn by doing? ## Mentioned Ben Horowitz, Erik Torenberg, Gagan Biyani, Mark Zuckerberg, Dan Boneh, Steve Jobs, Thomas Edison, Henry Ford, Horowitz Andreessen Academy, Andreessen Horowitz (a16z), Udemy, Maven, Facebook, Silicon Graphics (SGI), Databricks, Nvidia, Stripe, Harvard University, Stanford University, City College of New York (CCNY) ## Video description Ben Horowitz and Erik Torenberg sit down with Gagan Biyani to introduce the Horowitz Andreessen Academy and discuss a bigger question: what should education look like when AI is rapidly changing the skills people need to build, work, and create? Ben and Gagan explain why they believe learning should be more focused on doing rather than studying about doing, with students building real projects, developing people skills, and working alongside companies and builders in San Francisco. The goal isn’t to replace college for everyone, but to create a different path for young people who already know they want to build. They also discuss why AI could make this an unusually powerful time to be young, how project-based learning changes when everyone has access to powerful tools, why failure can be valuable when it produces real learning, and what it takes to develop the judgment and people skills that can't simply be learned from a textbook. Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 01:05 - Introducing Horowitz Andreessen Academy 15:26 - Why Experience Still Matters When It's So Easy to Build 23:18 - Why California: The Cultural & Intellectual Bastion 26:44 - Why Make Academy a Separate Company 28:45 - Why It Had to Be For-Profit: Making the Student the Customer 31:01 - Curiosity as the Core: From Push to Pull Learning 35:15 - People Skills: The Underrated Advantage in the AI Era 37:29 - What's Actually Worth Working On When You're 18 Today 40:34 - Five Years From Now: What Success Looks Like for Academy Resources: Follow Gagan Biyani on X: https://x.com/gaganbiyani Follow Ben Horowitz on X: https://x.com/bhorowitz Learn more about the Horowitz and Andreessen Academy: https://www.a16z.news/p/introducing-the-horowitz-andreessen Stay Updated: If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to like, subscribe, and share with your friends! Find a16z on X: https://twitter.com/a16z Find a16z on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/a16z Listen to the a16z Show on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5bC65RDvs3oxnLyqqvkUYX Listen to the a16z Show on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/a16z-podcast/id842818711 Follow our host: https://x.com/eriktorenberg Please note that the content here is for informational purposes only; should NOT be taken as legal, business, tax, or investment advice or be used to evaluate any investment or security; and is not directed at any investors or potential investors in any a16z fund. a16z and its affiliates may maintain investments in the companies discussed. For more details please see http://a16z.com/disclosures. [Source](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4x71naDx1Q)

[17:43] Ben Horowitz: 不要只停留在客套的寒暄。问问对方在哪里长大？来自何方？父母有着怎样的文化背景？他们当年相处得如何？当你开始理解一个人的生命底色时，真实的连接才会建立。年轻人在同龄群体中天然会这么做，但到了商业语境里，这项本能却往往被遗忘了。 [20:08] Ben Horowitz: 你不是通过听讲座来培养人际技能的，你是因为真正在做一件自己极其在乎的事情，且必须争取到所有人的支持，才被迫且快速地磨砺出这种能力。 [23:18] Ben Horowitz: San Francisco is your campus [28:45] Ben Horowitz: 请抄袭我们吧，请哈佛大学也来抄袭我们，请所有人都能借鉴这一模式。 [31:01] Education is not the filling of a bucket, but the lighting of a fire [32:33] Dan Boneh: make the problem so hard that you can't solve them without AI [37:29] Ben Horowitz: 如果你还没有构思出十亿美元级的伟大愿景，切莫过早妥协于一个平庸的百万美元级小生意，而是应该继续深入探索未知。 [40:19] What did you learn by doing?

[5:37] Ben Horowitz: learning how to do it as opposed to just studying about it. [12:24] Ben Horowitz: it is like one of the best times in history to be 18. [12:24] Ben Horowitz: slept under his sewing machine [12:24] Ben Horowitz: I think the young people today will look at us and their parents as though you guys were sleeping under sewing machines... compared to like what's going to be possible. [15:26] Ben Horowitz: Dag nab it. That would have been so exciting. [26:44] Ben Horowitz: Please copy us. Please Harvard, copy us. Please everybody copy us [31:00] Erik Torenberg: Education is not the filling of a bucket, but the lighting of a fire [31:00] Ben Horowitz: Did you build something interesting? [31:00] Ben Horowitz: Then you're a main character, not an NPC. [35:15] Ben Horowitz: that horrible feeling [37:29] Ben Horowitz: earned a secret [40:19] Ben Horowitz: that knowledge that you earn by failing is what we value here.

[0:00] This should be the greatest time in the [0:03] history of humanity to be young. This is [0:06] like Thomas Edison's time or Henry [0:08] Ford's time or so forth. But the [0:10] challenge that we have is everything [0:12] that we've built to train you was built [0:14] for a world that is soon to no longer [0:17] exist. [0:18] >> Mark and I just commissioned this [0:20] research report on Gen Z and one of the [0:22] findings was that it's the generation [0:24] that has the highest variance and [0:26] fragmentation across the board. It's [0:28] critical for young people who don't have [0:31] that billion-dollar idea to not settle [0:33] for the million-dollar idea and instead [0:36] go and explore more. We're building a [0:39] new school for the AI era and that means [0:41] redesigning everything. [0:42] >> Let's go pursue it all and let's get an [0:45] output on that. [0:46] >> Picture HA 5 years from now. What do you [0:49] hope that we've achieved? How would you [0:50] determine if we're being successful? My [0:52] hope is [0:55] >> well Ben Gagan we have a big [0:57] announcement today. [0:59] >> Yes. [1:00] >> We are announcing Harowitz and Jason [1:01] Academy. [1:02] >> Yes we are and we're very excited about [1:04] that. Super pumped. [1:06] >> So let's get into the story of how how [1:08] this came to be and and let's talk about [1:10] what it is. Ben, ever since I joined, [1:12] you know, a year and a half ago, we've [1:14] been, you know, working on bringing this [1:17] to life. We found the perfect coe and [1:19] co, you know, founder in Gagen. But [1:21] you've been thinking about this uh at [1:23] at&Z for years before. So talk about [1:26] what was the impetus for why we wanted [1:28] to to make make this happen. [1:29] >> Yeah, we kind of came out at it from a [1:31] couple different directions. So the the [1:33] kind of first thing was you know for [1:37] well one of the things we noticed is [1:38] like for young people um kind of college [1:43] works really really well if you uh want [1:46] to be a scholar or uh kind of um you [1:51] know a professor or that kind of thing. [1:54] But it's a little bit of a weird [1:55] proposition if you just want to get a [1:58] job or you have an idea to start a [2:01] company. It's a very large financial [2:04] investment and a very big time [2:06] investment. And most of the stuff uh [2:09] that happens in college isn't around [2:10] that. It's around other kinds of things. [2:12] And there's, you know, being a [2:13] well-rounded person, this and that and [2:15] the other. But if you ask an 18-year-old [2:18] why do they go to college? It's to get a [2:20] job usually. and that kind of doesn't [2:22] always translate. So that was kind of [2:24] one thing where like you know I wonder [2:26] if you know we got a lot of jobs maybe [2:28] we can help with that. And then on our [2:31] side from a hiring standpoint, I think [2:33] that um you know college really evolved [2:38] a lot uh in the last I would say four or [2:41] five years in terms of uh kind of the [2:45] kind of students they're looking for and [2:47] then what uh skills they have. And you [2:51] know in our world the skill sets needed [2:53] are evolving so fast uh that it it was [2:57] just very hard for a kind of big system [3:00] like that to keep up. So you know we [3:03] still think college is great for you [3:06] know probably most kids. Uh but there is [3:09] a certain kind of kid that wants to [3:11] build something that already knows they [3:13] want to go in you know specifically [3:15] currently into technology and we have [3:18] access to all the jobs. we know exactly [3:21] what you need to learn. We know exactly [3:23] the skills that you have to have. And so [3:25] we thought, gee, you know, like that [3:27] would be a great thing for us to add to [3:29] the mix and provide. [3:31] >> Yeah. And you know, we've been [3:33] individually been thinking about this [3:34] for, you know, over a decade. You and [3:36] your many businesses, you know, having [3:37] co-ounded Udemy, uh, you know, Maven [3:40] most recently. Um that was you know we [3:43] did a search for who who was the right [3:44] CEO and it just through the process [3:46] became obvious that Gagen has one been [3:48] thinking about this for forever but then [3:50] two uh is one of the most just [3:52] impressive entrepreneurs in in the [3:54] entire space o over the past you know [3:55] decade plus. Is there anything else you [3:57] want to say about the the the [3:58] >> Yeah, like he was it was kind of one of [4:01] those things where you go like we have [4:04] this idea and then we meet a guy he's [4:06] like you know I've had that idea for [4:08] much longer than you've had that idea [4:10] and not only that I've like spent a lot [4:12] of time trying to work and make it [4:14] happen. um but without necessarily [4:18] the gigantic resource that you guys have [4:20] which is you're invested in 1,600 [4:23] companies um and you have a fairly large [4:27] uh place of employment yourself and so [4:29] forth. So you know if you put those [4:31] things together um then you have the [4:34] potential for like something really [4:36] really special. [4:37] >> Yeah. And I I think also you know we as [4:40] a firm have also backed many you know [4:42] things in the space. There's a lot of [4:43] people who tried to do something in the [4:44] space and it hasn't really cut through. [4:46] There's some interesting experiments. [4:47] There's some interesting outcomes, but [4:48] nothing has really, you know, taken um [4:51] sort of a crack at it. And I'm I'm [4:53] curious why you guys think that that is. [4:55] I'll I'll take a stab by saying I think [4:57] they they focus a little bit too narrow. [5:00] You know, college is of course a bundle. [5:02] It's a bundle of dozens of things [5:03] including like sports leagues and hedge [5:05] fun. You don't have to do the whole [5:06] bundle, but you have to do uh not just [5:09] sort of um training people for the job [5:11] world, but also um or not just [5:13] education, but also uh status and [5:16] credential and brand. It has to be an [5:17] indication that oh, you know, you went [5:19] here, thus I want to hire you or I want [5:21] to work with you. Um and it also has to [5:23] be fun. Um it has to be something that [5:24] people actually want to do. And I think [5:27] too too many players just focus either [5:29] just on the learning thing or or just on [5:31] some other hybrid and don't create the [5:33] the the bundle that is the the value [5:35] prop that is truly truly competitive. [5:37] >> Yeah. So I think that you know we're [5:39] kind of starting out um a little more [5:43] specific and then we'll you know and [5:46] really ace that. Um but you know the [5:49] idea the core idea of it is like it's [5:52] for people who want to build something [5:54] and do something and make an impact um [5:57] kind of in the world outside of you know [5:59] like I said being a scholar and to do [6:03] that uh you know be it in technology or [6:07] in music or in any field you kind of [6:09] want to learn how to do it uh as opposed [6:12] to just study about it. And so if you [6:15] think of something like you know uh like [6:18] music uh appreciation or art [6:21] appreciation or so for that that's great [6:23] but like we would do that kind of thing. [6:25] We would do the kind of thing where it's [6:27] like oh you want to major in music like [6:31] you know let's write some songs let's [6:33] let's do some things you know let's [6:35] let's understand that process and and do [6:37] that and it's same thing with technology [6:39] which is oh you want to be a [6:41] technologist like let's learn how to [6:43] build a system. Yeah. [6:44] >> Uh and you know I think that's just ends [6:47] up being [6:49] very different. The other thing that you [6:52] know [6:54] the other reason that now is actually [6:56] the correct time to do it is if you look [6:58] at the university system you know it [7:01] started out as this religious [7:04] institution with the Jesuits and so [7:06] forth. Um and then the industrial [7:08] revolution came and then all of a sudden [7:11] everybody needed kind of a higher level [7:14] of the ability to learn things, the [7:17] ability to you know being literate etc [7:20] etc and so the university system just [7:23] exploded in the US and and the [7:25] universities got much bigger and there [7:26] became many more of them and so forth [7:28] and that was really necessary to train [7:30] the population to kind of enter the [7:33] corporate world. there was like it's [7:36] hard for people to understand now but [7:38] like oh in 1700 there was no corporate [7:40] world like that there was like a farm [7:42] world that you know and then all of a [7:44] sudden we got these companies and all [7:45] this kind of thing and um to exist in [7:48] that environment you've got to be able [7:49] to you know read and write and do math [7:51] and this and that and the third and so [7:54] like things really changed from an [7:55] educational standpoint in this country [7:57] which became a huge advantage and you [7:59] know to a large extent the America that [8:01] we have was built on the backs of our [8:03] great universities, [8:05] but we're hitting the AI revolution now, [8:09] which is going to be, you know, in our [8:11] estimation, as transformational [8:13] uh in terms of jobs, the way jobs are [8:16] done, the kinds of jobs that are [8:17] available and so forth as the industrial [8:19] revolution was to the agricultural uh [8:22] kind of society that that came before [8:24] it. And the idea that the training for [8:28] the industrial revolution is going to [8:31] map into the AI revolution probably not [8:35] perfectly. So there kind of needs to be [8:36] a pioneer that shows the way like how do [8:39] you train somebody into the new world. [8:41] Uh and you know there's many things that [8:44] are different. So and we've got all this [8:46] technology as well. So, you know, rather [8:48] than being in lectures for 5 hours a day [8:50] or eight hours a day depending on your [8:52] curriculum, you know, maybe it's better [8:54] to have uh kind of more contained [8:57] instruction and you know, more time with [8:59] the tools, more time learning on an [9:01] individual pace with AI and those kinds [9:03] of things. And then also more structured [9:05] social things. So, not like the social [9:08] things, not necessarily let's get rip [9:10] roaring drunk uh and go out. Although [9:12] maybe some of that will occur too, but [9:15] you know, kind of more structured social [9:16] things because we'll have the time [9:17] because we won't have so much time, you [9:20] know, sitting in the classroom listening [9:22] to somebody talk. Uh and so, you know, [9:24] all these new ideas can come into play [9:27] now. Uh and the timing is, you know, I [9:30] say, you know, for for a young person [9:31] now, that's the world they're going to [9:32] live in. [9:34] >> Yeah, I I completely agree. We're [9:36] building a new school for the AI era and [9:39] that means redesigning everything. And I [9:41] think that actually the other efforts I [9:44] agree with you some of them don't go big [9:46] enough in order to truly deliver a you [9:50] know college comparable experience. [9:53] Obviously this is not college. It's not [9:54] degree granting but a college comparable [9:57] experience that's good for a high school [9:58] student. You have to have interpersonal [10:01] social dynamics. You need to have it [10:03] residential in San Francisco. you need [10:05] to make sure that it's connected to the [10:07] employers who employ the best people. [10:10] Um, and so there's a bundle that's [10:12] required that you have to deliver. And [10:14] there's probably only two or three [10:15] people who have ever even tried to [10:16] deliver that bundle in the last, you [10:18] know, let's say 50 years. Um, and the [10:22] other thing though that those companies [10:24] or or or efforts I think missed is, you [10:27] know, it's a classic startup thing like [10:29] what do you do when you start a startup? [10:31] You need a very very unique specific [10:33] customer who has a burning desire for [10:36] your product. And like Ben, when we [10:39] first met, I hadn't met that many of [10:41] these, but over the last six months, as [10:43] you know, I've spent all my time with [10:44] these young builders. And there is a [10:47] generation of young builders who are [10:50] just fired up about creating things. And [10:55] that is one of the core ingredients of [10:58] this academy is that they exist. and [11:00] we're building it for them. And I think [11:02] that makes it different from other [11:04] efforts because we have the we have a [11:06] very clear demand. Um and also that that [11:09] demand is elite. So it's not like it's [11:12] demand from you know the far right or [11:14] the far left or something where it's not [11:17] perceived positively like these are the [11:19] people who are going to employ you know [11:21] thousands or hundreds of thousands of [11:23] people in the future. They're going to [11:24] raise a billion dollars for their [11:26] company eventually. like those are the [11:28] people who need our product right now [11:30] and that's what I think is really [11:31] exciting. [11:32] >> Yeah. and and students will have the [11:33] opportunity to uh like when I when I was [11:36] in college it was so divorced from from [11:37] the real world uh and I was interested [11:39] in technology and I was reading about it [11:41] but here you're going to have access to [11:43] work at companies internet companies [11:45] like data bricks Nvidia uh stripe dozens [11:49] of others and you'll be immersed in the [11:51] A16Z sort of cinematic universe uh that [11:54] is both economic you know practically [11:56] from a career oriented like very [11:58] embedded in in the actual work but then [12:00] also just um you know exposure to people [12:03] doing real things, interesting things, [12:05] getting the the osmosis of the Silicon [12:07] Valley sort of spirit. Ben, let's talk [12:10] about if you were 18 today, how would [12:12] you be thinking about your own uh sort [12:15] of growth or education, learning like [12:18] how what's it like to be 18 today in [12:20] terms of like what do you think people [12:21] should be excited about, you nervous [12:23] about? [12:24] >> Yeah. So I I would be thrilled to be 18. [12:27] I think um it is like one of the best [12:31] times in history to be 18 and and it's [12:35] unfortunate because I think because of [12:36] the systems for getting people into work [12:40] currently people are really nervous [12:42] about their future. Um but if you look [12:45] at it this is um you know this is like [12:48] Thomas Edison's time or uh you know [12:50] Henry Ford's time or so forth. It's kind [12:53] of you're going into a world that only [12:55] you will understand. Um that like people [12:58] like me will have much more difficult [13:00] time understanding the world than you [13:02] will and what's possible and what you [13:04] can do and so forth. So you're going to [13:05] go in at a very young age being more [13:08] capable than people with 30 40 years of [13:11] experience. And that's that's just [13:13] amazing because normally, you know, [13:14] you've got to work your way up the the [13:18] corporate ladder, you know, spend, you [13:19] know, 20 years kind of developing your [13:22] status and credibility, whereas now you [13:24] can come out right off the rip using the [13:27] new tools to basically solve almost any [13:31] problem out there. And I'm, you know, [13:34] the funny thing is like, well, what are [13:35] people going to do? It's like, well, are [13:36] we out of problems? It seems like we [13:38] have all I read about is problems. [13:40] There's problems everywhere. So now you [13:42] can go out, you can attack them [13:43] directly. Um either you know either [13:45] yourself as the leader or as part of a [13:47] team. Um but you know that to me is the [13:51] thing that's really really exciting. And [13:53] I think it's, [13:56] you know, it's it's funny. I I you know, [13:59] I heard a lot about the industrial [14:00] revolution trans uh transition because [14:03] so my grandfather's uh father kind of [14:07] immigrated the uh the family out of [14:10] Russia um because uh they were going to [14:13] kill all the Jews. So they had to leave [14:15] um you know was the the pilgrim period. [14:18] And he he basically was a slave here um [14:21] in in that he was in a sweat shop. He [14:24] slept under his sewing machine um [14:25] because he they work he worked so many [14:27] hours. He like slept at the office under [14:29] his sewing machine. He'd come back you [14:31] know on the weekends and so forth. Uh [14:33] and he made like very little money and [14:35] he he was just it was a very very hard [14:36] life for him. But you know my [14:38] grandfather was able to get an education [14:41] at CCNY and he kind of became a teacher [14:44] and had a kind of much better life. [14:47] Although it was also not nearly as good [14:49] as my father's who was the next [14:51] generation coming out of it. And I think [14:53] you know for this when we look back I [14:56] think the young people today will be um [14:59] look at us and you know their parents as [15:02] though you guys were sleeping under [15:04] sewing machines you know and and and [15:06] pretty bitter uh compared to like what's [15:09] going to be possible and so forth. So I [15:12] think it's it's a very very exciting [15:13] time but you know you want to be on the [15:17] kind of right side of history and you [15:18] want to be future forward. You don't [15:20] want to I I think the past is going to [15:23] fade very fast you know much faster than [15:25] we're used to. [15:26] >> Talk about how even though it's so easy [15:29] to build um you still want to have [15:32] experience, relationships, connections, [15:34] spend some time at some of these iconic [15:36] companies, right? because when you're [15:38] just a a kid you might think oh I want [15:39] to start a dating app idea or pizza idea [15:41] but if you work at data bricks for a bit [15:43] say example talk a little bit about that [15:45] >> yeah so I I think that um [15:49] you know the if if you're young and you [15:54] see something that you go oh my god I [15:57] think I'm the only one who really [15:58] understands this and it's compelling me [16:01] to build a company then that's you know [16:04] that's phenomenal that's Mark Zuckerberg [16:06] that's you That's a kind of a [16:09] unbelievable opportunity but also a rare [16:12] one. And then I think you know most [16:15] people who are young or kind of the [16:17] majority would love to kind of [16:20] understand that thing. Um, and by the [16:23] way, all Zuck's roommates um, from [16:27] Harvard who didn't go to Facebook with [16:29] him really regretted that because he [16:31] kind of invited them all to be employees [16:33] or, you know, many of them and and some [16:35] of them didn't do it and they're like, [16:37] "Dag nab it. That would have been so [16:39] exciting." Uh and so I think that you [16:42] know there's just a great opportunity to [16:45] kind of join up with people who have [16:47] done that kind of thing either you know [16:49] it's something that's further along [16:51] depending on you know if you really want [16:53] to kind of learn and develop your skills [16:54] and so forth or uh you know maybe you [16:57] know one of your classmates is doing [16:59] something really exciting like you know [17:01] in the case of uh Facebook at the time. [17:03] So, you know, I think there are many, [17:08] you know, there's plenty of [17:08] opportunities depending on um how how [17:12] powerful your new ideas are at that [17:14] time. And, you know, sometimes they're [17:16] not that powerful. I didn't have a great [17:17] idea when I was 18. So, it's it's not uh [17:20] it's not that common. Um it took me a [17:22] while to learn. You know, I'm not as [17:24] quick as others on that, I guess. Uh but [17:28] if you get in, you know, the great thing [17:29] for me is I got in at a company Silicon [17:33] Graphics which had all kinds of [17:34] innovation and I saw what that was and [17:36] how you can really change things and so [17:38] forth and that kind of built a [17:40] foundation for the rest of my career. [17:42] >> Yeah. We always talk about builder [17:44] skills but also people skills. You've [17:46] written a couple books on it. You you [17:48] you um talk about all the time [17:50] internally. [17:51] >> Is that something you knew uh when you [17:52] were 18 or in college or how do you how [17:54] do you learn people skills? how should [17:56] we um you know teach it to our students [17:58] etc. [17:59] >> Well look I think the main thing and is [18:01] to be around people and and it it's [18:04] you know people of often talk about you [18:07] know particularly the millennial [18:08] generation has this kind of loneliness [18:10] epidemic uh because they're so locked [18:13] into their screens and so forth. I think [18:15] one of the things that AI has the [18:17] potential is just like get us off of the [18:18] screen, right? Like we're not that far [18:22] away from [18:25] I'm going to talk to my AI and have him [18:27] do the work and deal with the dang [18:29] computer, you know, like and so that's [18:31] going to free me up to really deal with [18:33] people where there's going to be just [18:35] tremendous value. um being able to kind [18:38] of know my peers, motivate them, kind of [18:41] uh get the best out of each other, do [18:43] something larger than ourselves and try [18:45] and kind of move the future forward and [18:47] make the world a better place. And so [18:50] kind of getting experience in that [18:52] environment where you're kind of working [18:55] with others and and learning, hey, you [18:58] know, yeah, I mean, I and you know, [19:00] college, by the way, has has been great [19:02] for this over the years where you're [19:04] like, oh, you come from Nebraska. I I [19:07] never knew anybody from Nebraska. Like [19:08] what is it like that? What's it just [19:10] corn fields and Like what's going [19:11] on? And and you know, you kind of get to [19:13] know people. And you know, probably one [19:17] of the skills that I see missing the [19:20] most, uh, which I try and kind of impart [19:22] in people on the firm is like, let's [19:24] just start with who the person you're [19:25] talking to is, like rather than just [19:28] talking to somebody. Hey, Eric, how you [19:30] doing? D, like, [19:33] where'd you grow up? Where are you from? [19:35] Like, oh, that's interesting. you've [19:38] got, you know, this uh parent from this [19:42] place, this other parent from the other [19:43] place, you know, that that's really [19:46] good. What was that like? You know, how [19:48] did they get along? So forth. And then [19:50] you start to kind of understand people [19:52] and and that opportunity in a business [19:55] context isn't as obvious, you know, if [19:58] you haven't, but you always do that when [20:00] you get with a group of kids your age. [20:02] Like that's the first thing you ask [20:03] them. You want to know um you know, do [20:06] you get along with your parents? you [20:07] hate your parents, you know, that that [20:08] kind of thing. [20:10] >> Yeah. I think one of the I mean, [20:12] absolutely one of the most important [20:13] things we want is to develop people's [20:15] skills. [20:16] >> And uh one of the core tenants of [20:19] developing a skill like that is osmosis. [20:22] >> You need to immerse the student in the [20:26] envi social environment in which these [20:29] which the humans are. And specifically, [20:32] I think it's a challenge if you go off [20:34] to college, you only interact with [20:36] people your same year. You know, you [20:38] finally maybe have a friend who's like [20:40] one or two years above you or below you. [20:43] One of the things I think the academy [20:44] will do is we obviously want there to be [20:46] deep social networks amongst your peers. [20:50] We also are going to try and cohabitate [20:53] you like especially in the office with [20:55] other companies and individuals and [20:58] projects and co-ops and internships that [21:01] are with the quote unquote adult world [21:04] so that you can force yourself to you're [21:07] sort of you can't have no choice. Like [21:09] if you're trying to accomplish let's say [21:10] you're trying to build a new type of [21:12] robot dog and the only way to do it is [21:14] to get a specific type of chip and you [21:16] don't know how to write a cold email. [21:18] you're going to have to learn, right? [21:20] And you're going to have all these [21:21] people around you who are experts at [21:23] this. So, they're going to be like, "Oh, [21:24] you should do that and you should do [21:25] that, etc." And so, I think that the [21:28] combination of the osmosis of Silicon [21:31] Valley, a peer network that's [21:33] supportive, and a the project-based [21:36] curriculum combined will dramatically [21:40] accelerate people's skill development [21:43] over something like, "Let me sit in a [21:46] lecture talking about negotiations. Like [21:49] that's not how you develop people's [21:50] skills. You develop people's skills [21:52] because you're doing something you [21:54] really care about and you need to get [21:55] everyone on board. [21:57] >> Yeah. 100%. Related. Mark and I just [22:00] commissioned this research report on Gen [22:02] Z. And and one of the findings was that [22:04] it's the generation that has the highest [22:06] variance and fragmentation across the [22:08] board. And so any sort of subculture um [22:11] or they're the most extreme at it. And [22:14] so, for example, there's so many like [22:17] back when we were in college, it was [22:18] rare to have an 18-year-old who was [22:20] already building startups, immersed in [22:22] the startup world, um, you know, [22:24] obsessed with sort of, you know, uh, [22:25] this kind of thing. And now there there [22:28] a bunch of them and we're going to [22:29] harness them. But to your point, Ben, [22:31] it's important about the people you [22:32] surround yourself with. And so now it's [22:34] higher variance than ever to to find [22:36] your people, people who are builder, [22:37] people who are resilient, people who are [22:38] entrepreneurial. Um, to being able to [22:40] aggregate them the same place is is just [22:41] huge. Yeah, we're really excited. I I've [22:44] been so impressed by the talent that [22:46] we've had a chance to meet. I mean, I [22:49] didn't know a single person who was [22:51] doing anything entrepreneurial when I [22:53] was a child and I started my first [22:55] venture at 13. So the idea that we're [22:58] going to collect, you know, 50 uh in at [23:01] least in the founding class fellowship, [23:02] 50 students who are all like actually [23:06] builders and they're going to be [23:07] different kinds of builders like like I [23:08] want to be clear that this be quite a [23:10] broad definition of the word building, [23:12] but all in one place and for them to [23:14] meet each other and spend a bunch of [23:15] time riffing off each other. I'm very [23:16] excited about it. [23:17] >> Yeah. The Let's talk about the [23:19] importance of this being in California [23:22] in the extended Bay Area. You know, Ben, [23:23] you grew up in in in in Berkeley. Um, [23:26] >> Republic. Absolutely. [23:28] >> Yes. Exactly. [23:29] >> Which at the time was like [23:33] 10,000 miles from Silicon Valley, even [23:35] though it was only [23:36] >> like a half hour drive. [23:38] >> Yeah. And I I think it's so interest [23:40] because you grew up in in California, so [23:41] you know that it's not just sort of a a [23:43] technical, you know, bastion, but also, [23:46] you know, a cultural bastion, [23:47] intellectual bastion. It's so [23:48] interesting because and we're focused, [23:49] you know, uh largely on the on the [23:51] builder um element first, but people [23:53] say, you know, college is for building a [23:54] career, but also becoming an, you know, [23:56] pursuing knowledge and be becoming a [23:58] better person. And talk about why [23:59] California is just in San Francisco is [24:02] just such an important place for uh for [24:04] this to be what is the opportunity here? [24:06] >> Well, I think the big thing is it's [24:08] where most companies, great companies in [24:12] America get started and then America is [24:15] one of kind of [24:17] two places in the world where like a [24:20] giant number of companies get started. [24:23] And so everybody who has done that and [24:25] knows how to do that and all the people [24:27] have worked at places like that um just [24:30] a huge majority are here in California. [24:34] So, [24:35] you know, if you want to learn how to do [24:37] that or if you want to um go work with [24:40] people who do that, then it's just like [24:43] the most obvious place to put it. Uh and [24:46] and look, you know, I I went to college [24:48] in New York and most of the people who [24:50] came out of academia went into financial [24:52] services like that was kind of the main [24:55] employer that was the main recruiter [24:56] there and so forth. And I think uh for a [24:59] program like this, you know, we're [25:01] connected to so many companies, but [25:04] probably, you know, well over 80% of [25:06] them are like right in this area. And so [25:10] it just makes it very very convenient to [25:12] you come here, you learn the area and [25:15] guess what? You can start your career [25:17] right in that place. [25:19] >> Yeah. Yeah. San Francisco is your [25:21] campus, right? The campus is not just [25:23] the walls within the school, but it's [25:25] the entire city. And and I think that's [25:27] very important. And the other thing I'll [25:29] add is that uh if if San Francisco is [25:32] the campus, the cultural values of San [25:34] Francisco um that many people don't talk [25:37] about. You know, San Francisco is one of [25:40] the places that embraces failure. If [25:42] things don't work out, we'll still fund [25:44] your next company. You know, it's [25:46] Silicon Valley is one of the places [25:47] that's positive sum. Everyone believes [25:49] that if I help someone, I don't need to [25:51] get anything in return. I'm going to pay [25:53] it forward and I know it's going to come [25:55] back to me because that's the culture we [25:57] live in. It's a super high trust [25:58] culture. So, I think that it's going to [26:01] create a really, really calm, safe, and [26:05] positive environment for students that [26:08] is also super ambitious. It's a rare [26:10] combination. It's very hard to get [26:12] right. And I think Silicon Valley and [26:14] San Francisco in particular really has [26:16] figured that out. And I I think another [26:18] way of also phrasing it is like if you [26:21] want a stake in the future in this or [26:23] help help determine it, help argue it, [26:25] help build it, a lot of it happens in [26:27] San Francisco. Whether it's the future [26:28] of art AI, whether it's the future of [26:30] money, whether it's the the future of uh [26:32] biotech, uh so many of these [26:35] technologies, but also the conversations [26:37] surrounding those technologies um are [26:39] litigated here or started here and then [26:41] expanded out that way [26:42] >> and litigated here. [26:45] >> Yes. both metaphorically and literally. [26:48] >> Ben, talk about the decision to make [26:51] this a separate company. We went back [26:52] and forth on this for for a while of why [26:55] Harwoods and Jason Academy, we wanted it [26:56] to both be separate but also connected [26:59] and that's why we kept the brand the [27:00] same and also it has to be a strong [27:01] brand that signals to students. But talk [27:03] about that decision a little bit and how [27:04] you see it interfacing with with the [27:06] firm and you know at large. [27:09] >> Yeah. So I think the thing that the firm [27:11] brings that's extremely unique is we are [27:16] comprehensively [27:18] connected to basically every opportunity [27:22] in tech. Um there's and and you know by [27:26] the way you know we're working to make [27:28] those partnerships kind of explicit [27:31] around the graduates of the academy. if [27:34] you go through this program, if you do [27:36] well, [27:38] there are opportun like you know many [27:41] opportunities for you and so that that [27:43] was the real strength that we brought I [27:45] thought um but you know this is its own [27:48] idea like we're an investment firm this [27:51] is not an investment idea this I mean [27:53] it's an investment in the future of the [27:54] country but it's uh you know it's it's [27:58] an academy uh which we're not and so it [28:01] really needed to be separate and have [28:03] its own [28:04] In addition, I don't think that this [28:08] idea is limited to technology. Like as I [28:13] said, I think it's very interesting for [28:16] music. It may be interesting for [28:18] medicine. It could be interesting for a [28:20] variety of things because every [28:22] profession is undergoing a massive [28:24] change. And so we wanted it to be able [28:26] to grow and expand um you know, as we [28:30] got it working and so forth. So it [28:31] didn't make sense to be kind of a kind [28:34] of piece of the firm uh or that would [28:38] have limited its ambition uh quite a bit [28:41] and you know we're we're not about [28:43] limiting ambition around here. [28:45] >> Totally. And and talk about why it had [28:47] to be a for-profit or put differently. [28:49] Another thing we said in previous [28:50] conversations is the customer has got to [28:52] be the student and right now sometimes [28:54] in in certain institutions there's kind [28:56] of they try to serve too many customers [28:58] and and it kind of be ends up being this [29:00] disjointed product. [29:02] >> Yeah. So look I mean the the whole thing [29:05] is if you're young it kind of goes back [29:07] to our earlier conversation. If you're [29:09] young this should be the greatest time [29:14] in the history of humanity to be young. [29:17] Yeah. Uh but the challenge that we have [29:20] is [29:22] everything that we've built to train you [29:24] was built for a world that is soon to no [29:28] longer exist. And so [29:31] you you know we have to somebody's got [29:34] to super serve that client. And um and [29:38] look, I think my hope is that as we kind [29:42] of show this model, as we build this [29:44] model, as we create it, we're not the [29:45] only ones that will have it. Like this [29:47] isn't an idea where we're going, okay, [29:49] we're going to create a monopoly on this [29:52] thing. It's like, no, please copy us. [29:54] Please Harvard, copy us. Please [29:56] everybody copy us because, you know, [29:58] somebody's got to do the innovative work [30:00] to get the breakthrough. Um but then [30:03] that's going to change the world for, [30:04] you know, every young person. uh in this [30:07] country and you know maybe maybe beyond. [30:09] So [30:11] that's the idea that we don't you know [30:13] we don't care about um serving the [30:16] alumni or serving the donors or serving [30:19] the you know the parent like this is [30:23] about the young people [30:24] >> uh and you know what do they need and [30:26] what's going to create the best life for [30:28] them and so that simplifies the equation [30:31] quite a bit. [30:32] >> Yeah. Yeah. the the profit motive forces [30:34] us to deliver to the customer and our [30:37] job at the end of the day is to make [30:40] sure that young people who attend the [30:42] institution go off and do great things [30:45] because that creates the brand that [30:46] creates the flywheel that allows us to [30:49] continue to stay in business and I think [30:50] that's very unique in education um that [30:54] we have such incentive alignment uh and [30:57] I think it's it's a core tenant actually [30:59] of the academy [31:00] >> yeah similarly One of the core tenants [31:03] of the academy is is uh curiosity and [31:05] and you know there's this quote uh [31:07] education is not the filling of a bucket [31:09] but the lighting of a fire [31:10] >> and um you know we're moving from this [31:12] like kind of like push model to you know [31:14] these grades and all this stuff you have [31:16] to cram to this pull which is like what [31:18] are you naturally curious about and what [31:20] can you go build or pursue in that space [31:21] and it may not be obvious that all the [31:24] time of what it will lead to like we [31:25] were talking about how Steve Jobs had [31:26] this interest in calligraphy [31:28] >> and that didn't seem like that would you [31:29] know obvious what it would lead to but [31:31] in fact it It of course led led to quite [31:33] a lot. And similarly, Ben, you've always [31:34] been interested in rap music. [31:36] >> Yes. [31:36] >> And you you were pursuing your interest [31:38] at a very young age. I [31:39] >> still am. Yeah. [31:40] >> Yeah. Exactly. And um it it maybe wasn't [31:43] obvious at the time how that might lead [31:44] to uh something, but it's it's made you [31:46] much more authentic and interesting as [31:48] as a business person and made your life, [31:50] you know, [31:50] >> and a better storyteller, which is a key [31:52] part of what I do. Um and so, [31:56] >> yeah. know I I and that's definitely [31:58] kind of important in the context of the [32:00] academy and what we're trying to do in [32:02] in terms of yeah like let's go pursue it [32:07] all. Um but then let's uh you know and [32:12] but let let's get an output on that. [32:14] Yeah. So not you know it's much more [32:17] oriented [32:19] around oh did you build something [32:21] interesting um than oh could you like [32:25] memorize these questions because look we [32:28] do have tools that can answer those [32:30] questions very well now it's funny funny [32:33] I was talking to Dan Bonet um who is a [32:37] great professor of uh computer science [32:39] at Stanford cryptography [32:42] and his take on AI I uh was you kind of [32:46] have two choices, right? You can ban it [32:49] and by the way that won't work. Uh or [32:52] you can make the problem so hard that [32:55] you can't solve them without AI. And I [32:58] think that's um you know his orientation [33:00] is amazing there. And what he's seeing [33:02] is oh I've got students solving things [33:05] that no student in history could have [33:07] ever solved like that I can't even like [33:09] I could never solve myself. uh and but [33:13] that's what's possible, right? And so [33:14] you want to kind of have that [33:16] orientation where it's like, well, what [33:17] can you solve with the tools and what [33:19] can you do um you know, what can you do [33:23] that's like breakthrough because now [33:25] everybody's got an opportunity to create [33:28] a breakthrough and that's um that's [33:31] super exciting because you know then [33:32] you're then you're a main character, not [33:34] an NPC, right? like that that that's [33:36] kind of what the academy is about is [33:38] like hey do you want to be a main [33:40] character? If you want to be a main [33:42] character like we help you do that. Um [33:44] if you want to be a cog in a machine [33:46] then this is not going to be the best [33:48] place for you but uh you know there are [33:51] many places that can serve that. [33:53] >> Yeah. [33:53] >> Yeah. And I think it's important that [33:55] the builder mentality apply to uh [33:59] interests that are not obviously about [34:00] AI or building. So take calligraphy for [34:03] example. You know, it's one thing to [34:06] say, "Hey, why don't you go study [34:07] calligraphy and respond like and and and [34:10] sort of answer questions on a test about [34:12] how to, you know, I know nothing about [34:13] calligraphy, but like how how how to [34:15] draw, you know, beautiful letters." And [34:17] it's another thing to say like, "Hey, [34:19] why don't you learn enough calligraphy [34:21] to write a Islamic poem, you know, [34:25] beautifully displayed in the academy?" [34:28] And so for every pursuit that we, you [34:32] know, Ben, you earlier talked about [34:34] music. For every pursuit of knowledge [34:37] that our students have, we are going to [34:39] reframe that into how do you do [34:42] something with it? Create a challenge, a [34:44] project, anything that's fun and [34:46] interesting that allows you to go pursue [34:48] it. And I think that is that ethos will [34:52] allow them to learn skills that are not [34:56] relevant to jobs obviously like even you [34:59] know horiculture or you know learning [35:02] how to kite surf whatever it is but it [35:05] allows them to do it in a way that [35:08] ensures that they actually learn the [35:09] skill. It's a very very hard to learn [35:11] most skills if all you're doing is [35:13] cramming for a test. On the people [35:15] skills, there's a few different [35:16] dimensions, right? Like some people make [35:17] the analogy, you know, founder is like, [35:19] uh, you know, being a movie director, [35:20] like you've got to, you know, sort of, [35:22] you know, create script, bring all, you [35:23] know, get get all the actors involved [35:25] and then and then make it happen. Other [35:26] people, you know, compared to like a [35:27] nightclub promoter, like you have to get [35:29] people excited about thing, you have to [35:30] bring them in, you have to sell, you [35:31] have to sort of negotiate, etc. At the [35:33] same time, there are people who are [35:35] charismatic, but also uh crash out. Um, [35:38] you know, um, and man, you talk a lot [35:40] about the inner game of managing your [35:42] own psychology of, you know, uh, you [35:44] know, you you've worked with a lot of, [35:45] uh, you know, you still work with a lot [35:47] of like very idiosyncratic, uh, people. [35:49] And so, how do you as a kid learn, uh, [35:53] this um, what might you say there? [35:56] >> Well, I think look, I think that's um, [35:59] again, difficult to teach in a [36:02] classroom, right? Uh, and here's the [36:04] thing that I always tell [36:07] CEOs, um, is, you know, and look, a lot [36:10] of them read my book, so I don't want [36:12] to, you know, but that book doesn't [36:15] teach you how to be a CEO in the sense [36:16] that, you know, you can read every book [36:20] ever written on how to play football. [36:22] But like if you get into an NFL game and [36:25] you're playing quarterback, like nothing [36:27] in a book is going to teach you to deal [36:29] with like somebody some 300 lb monster [36:32] rushing at you while you're trying to [36:34] like figure out who to throw the ball [36:35] to. Like you actually have to do that in [36:38] order to learn it. And I think that um [36:41] you know, you kind of have to do it to [36:44] learn it. And so a lot of what we're [36:47] going to orient the academy about is [36:48] like okay, can you put a team together? [36:50] Can you do it? Um, and that's, [36:54] you know, there'll be less on the line. [36:56] It'll be more like practice than the [36:58] game. Uh, but you know, that's that's [37:01] the way you learn that you you kind of [37:02] learn those decision- making. You know, [37:04] what does it cost you if you hesitate on [37:07] the decision? Like what is it what does [37:09] it mean to not resolve a conflict? Like [37:12] what are the consequences? Um, and you [37:14] can't you can read about that. [37:16] >> Yeah. Um, and I can tell you about that, [37:18] but until you know that feeling, you [37:21] know, that that that horrible feeling, [37:24] um, you're not really going to learn it [37:26] to the level that you need to do it to [37:28] like run a company or that kind of [37:29] thing. [37:29] >> To that end, because of the tools are so [37:31] good, our resources are so good, it's [37:33] easier than ever to do something um, [37:35] once you know what you want to do. And [37:37] so, the constraint often comes on what's [37:39] worth working on, how do you spend your [37:40] time? If if you were uh, 18 today, [37:44] >> because there's, you know, there's so [37:45] many different trade-offs. How would you [37:46] think about? [37:48] >> Well, I think you know a lot of it comes [37:50] down to um you know what you're [37:55] interested in, what your kind of skill [37:57] set matches and you know what what's [38:00] some problem that you know about uh that [38:03] you can solve. And there are [38:07] you know there there's there's so many [38:09] diseases that are so destructive. [38:11] There's um you know all kinds of uh [38:15] challenges with the environment. There's [38:17] real challenges in the integrity of our [38:20] election system and so forth like is [38:22] there a technological answer to that? Um [38:26] you know and and so on and so forth or [38:28] is there just a systems answer? Uh and [38:32] you know depending on what problem [38:33] you're like dang we need to fix that. [38:37] And then by the way, what always happens [38:39] with entrepreneurs is it's kind of like [38:41] scientific discovery. You go to fix, [38:43] you're like, we're going to go get to [38:46] like a cure for uh you know, pancreatic [38:51] cancer, but along the way you find, oh [38:54] no, like we can solve this other thing [38:56] uh that's also important because we [38:58] discovered something there or or [38:59] whatever. you know, most kind of [39:01] scientific discoveries and [39:03] entrepreneurial ideas end up being [39:05] accidental in some way and that you're [39:07] going to solve a hard problem and you [39:09] find some other hard problem that's in [39:11] the way of you solving that hard problem [39:13] that ends up, you know, being the thing [39:16] that that becomes the the idea. And that [39:19] that's why I believe it's critical for [39:22] young people who don't have that [39:24] billion-dollar idea to not settle for [39:27] the million-dollar idea and instead go [39:29] and explore more. [39:30] >> Yeah. [39:31] >> You know, a lot of young people are not [39:32] yet exposed to anything beyond what a [39:35] teenage life in includes. And one of the [39:38] real core values of the academy is we're [39:40] going to expose you to a a much wider [39:43] range of what happens in the real world. [39:45] >> Yeah. And look to try and [39:49] fail at a really hard problem the value [39:52] is in the learning. So you people say oh [39:55] Silicon Valley uh embraces failure. Well [39:57] not all kinds of failure [40:00] right the failure where you learn a [40:02] tremendous amount and then you know you [40:06] you've earned a secret. [40:08] >> Yeah. [40:08] >> By going out there trying to solve a [40:10] hard problem and not being able now you [40:12] know why that problem's so hard to [40:13] solve. Okay. So then what are the [40:17] subpros and you know what are the [40:19] related problems and can you solve one [40:20] of those and that knowledge that you [40:22] earn by failing is what we value here [40:26] and that's the same kind of thing that [40:28] we would value at the academy is like [40:31] what did you learn by doing? [40:33] >> Yeah. Picture HA 5 years from now. What [40:37] do you hope that we've achieved? How [40:38] would you determine if we're being [40:40] successful? Talk about what you [40:41] envision. [40:43] Well, I think that you know in five [40:46] years there there's many things that [40:48] would made it success. One is that you [40:50] know we have graduates um who have great [40:55] careers that they love um and have built [40:59] like or has started really interesting [41:02] companies. You know maybe they probably [41:03] wouldn't be successful in that time [41:05] frame or you know whatever you consider [41:07] a success. Uh and that you know we've [41:11] learned um as the academy to uh like [41:15] what really works and can we kind of [41:18] extend that and expand that so we can [41:20] get more different kinds of students in. [41:22] you know, maybe not just okay, [41:25] technology is interesting to you, but [41:26] you're really interested in these other [41:28] things and get people who can solve all [41:30] the problems of the world or, you know, [41:33] become uh incredible creatives and, you [41:36] know, the creative world is changing, [41:38] too. Now, you know, when I talk to my [41:39] creative friends, they're like, it's [41:41] amazing because I have an idea about [41:45] like a feeling that I want to convey and [41:47] I can absolutely do it in every medium [41:50] now. I don't I'm not just restricted to [41:52] my thing. I can make a full-length [41:54] feature film. I can make a movie. I can [41:56] I can make a song. I can make a song. I [41:59] can score a movie. Uh and so now like [42:03] everything is possible. And so I think, [42:05] you know, it's a just a wonderful time [42:07] to be able to manifest um your ideas and [42:10] get your ideas out in in every kind of [42:13] medium. And we want to facilitate that [42:14] across the board, not just, you know, [42:16] kind of in our traditional uh lanes. [42:19] Well, it's going to be incredible to to [42:21] build that future out with both of you [42:22] and all the students who join us. [42:24] >> All right. [42:24] >> So excited. Yeah, very excited. [42:26] >> Thank you.