We Audited Hunter Biden: $15 Million Owed, $0 Stocks, & Going Broke

审计亨特·拜登：负债1500万美元、零股票持仓且濒临破产 在这场深入探讨中，Hunter Biden 透露，其背负的1500万美元债务完全源于四年来同时应对多家联邦机构和国会委员会调查而产生的辩护费用，而非个人挥霍所致。在几乎没有任何流动资产、且加利福尼亚州住所遭山火焚毁后，他说明了自己如何通过在 Substack 写作和出售原创画作来维持在开普敦的日常开支。Biden 还探讨了人工智能带来的宏观经济与生存威胁，将潜在的未来形态比作《星际迷航》（Star Trek）式的物质充裕或《星球大战》（Star Wars）式的冲突对抗。此外，他还谈及 Laptop Coin 发行时的混乱状况，在维护其代币经济学及慈善初衷的同时，将图表上飙升至3160亿美元的异常异动归咎于做市商失误和自动化交易机器人的操盘。 Hunter Biden 透露其负债约1500万美元，并称这100%是连续四年应对并发的联邦调查和国会调查进行辩护所致。 (49:20) 在几乎没有任何流动资产的情况下，Hunter Biden 正在积极与多家律师事务所协商还款方案，同时依靠 Substack 订阅、艺术品销售和两份工作来维持基本生活开销。 (54:12) “Laptop Coin”上线时理论市值曾短暂暴涨至3160亿美元，原因是做市商仅注入了5000美元的流动性，致使交易机器人主导了最初的挂单撮合。 (64:24) 法务审计显示，Laptop Coin 发行期间未发生内部人员抛售或开发者提现行为，且30%的内部股权处于多年锁定期内。 (73:42)

In an interview on The Iced Coffee Hour, Hunter Biden assesses his personal finances at zero, attributing roughly $15 million in debt entirely to multi-year legal defense costs while detailing the ethical rules, systemic pressures, and ill-fated ventures that shaped his financial reality. Legal Defense Liabilities and Financial Insolvency (49:20) Hunter Biden rates his current personal finances as a zero out of ten, disclosing approximately $15 million in accumulated liabilities. He states that this debt does not stem from past personal spending or substance abuse, but entirely from legal defense bills accrued over four years of parallel investigations led by multiple United States Attorney offices, Department of Justice divisions, the IRS, and several congressional committees. Because he did not qualify for a public defender and faced an expansive federal apparatus, sustaining representation required millions of dollars without any formal court-ordered repayment schedule yet finalized. Family Ethics and Congressional Stock Ownership (8:39) Addressing why he owns zero stocks, Hunter explains his upbringing under Joe Biden’s lifelong refusal to hold equities or corporate bonds. Originating during the 1972 Senate campaign following the corruption scandal of Vice President Spiro Agnew, the policy was intended to avoid conflicts of interest while overseeing corporate legislation. Hunter acknowledges mixed feelings about this stance, conceding that his family lacked basic financial literacy and could have utilized broad-market index funds or blind trusts, especially given that a Senate salary—averaging roughly $175,000 annually over 36 years—left little surplus capital. The Ill-Fated Launch of Laptop Coin (64:24) Hunter addresses the public fallout from his cryptocurrency project, Laptop Coin, which experienced a catastrophic rollout. Targeted for an initial $50 million market capitalization, the project was destabilized when its third-party market maker deployed only $5,000 of a planned $1 million liquidity reserve. The resulting illiquidity allowed automated trading bots to trigger rapid slippage, briefly inflating the paper valuation to an anomalous peak of $316 billion before it collapsed. Pushing back against allegations of an insider pump-and-dump, Hunter asserts that core insiders remain subject to a six-month lockup and a two-year vesting schedule, and notes that an independent audit of Aerodrome transaction records showed no insider liquidity extraction. Institutional Power, Soft Diplomacy, and Fiscal Policy (51:46) Reflecting on his interactions with the federal government, Hunter compares the enforcement reach of executive and regulatory bodies to an overwhelming power that can bankrupt individuals through protracted process alone. On broader governance, he argues that resolving the $40 trillion national debt cannot be achieved simply by popular slogans like 'tax the billionaires,' as the ultra-wealthy avoid standard income tax brackets. He also criticizes spending cut proposals like the Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE), arguing that eliminating foreign aid organizations such as USAID dismantles critical soft diplomacy and international crisis relief that accounts for less than 3% of the federal budget. While Hunter Biden maintains that total public exposure of his past failures provided personal relief, he remains constrained by eight-figure legal liabilities, navigating daily expenses through writing and creative projects while attempting to renegotiate terms with creditors.

[51:46] Hunter Biden: The federal government's power is beyond anything that you can remotely imagine. [51:46] Hunter Biden: It's like the eye of Sauron. [51:46] Hunter Biden: The process is the thing that, regardless of whether you get indicted or convicted, it can bankrupt you. [60:05] Hunter Biden: Why am I crying about some Argentinian chef talking about, you know, the farm-to-table process that he goes through? [62:19] Hunter Biden: I'm not the first meme coin... I'm like the 10 millionth meme coin. [75:12] Hunter Biden: Do not buy my coin. [75:12] Hunter Biden: Meme coins are a tool, just like a hammer: you can use it to build something, or you can use it to tear down something. [82:50] Hunter Biden: Does anybody sit here and ask Don and Eric of why they would ever get involved in this?

[0:00] Hey everybody. So, it's not usual that I [0:02] have to do an intro like this, but let's [0:03] just say this episode was a little spicy [0:06] and as a result of that, we had to [0:08] repost it separately. We know that he's [0:10] a bit of a polarizing figure and not [0:11] everyone's going to agree with his [0:13] views. But we also believe there's value [0:15] in having conversations with people [0:16] across a wide range of perspectives and [0:19] having the ability to hear somebody else [0:21] out even if you don't agree with them, [0:23] we think is just overall a good thing. [0:24] So, with that said, here is the uh spicy [0:27] episode. And if you want to see this, by [0:29] the way, uncensored, which is probably [0:31] how it should be viewed, feel free to [0:33] join as a channel member. You can see [0:35] the full episode there. Uh, this is the [0:37] episode though that, uh, should be [0:39] interesting. Enjoy. How would you rate [0:40] your finances? One out of 10 [0:42] >> right now. [0:42] >> Yeah. [0:43] >> A zero. [0:44] >> Hunter Biden. [0:45] >> Hunter Biden. [0:46] >> Hunter Biden is now out with a new [0:48] slaptop crypto coin and it crashed and [0:51] burnt, losing almost all of its value. [0:54] What was going through your mind when [0:56] you saw it go from 50 to [1:00] [laughter] [1:00] >> So the FBI has had physical possession [1:02] of Hunter Biden's laptop for more than 3 [1:04] years. Now on that laptop is [1:06] indisputable evidence of crime [1:08] regardless of whether you get indicted [1:10] [music] [1:10] or convicted. It can you how much is [1:13] that debt for fighting those legal [1:15] battles [1:15] >> like about $15 million. The real power [1:19] in Washington [music] DC is money. The [1:21] federal government's power is beyond [1:24] anything that you can remotely imagine. [1:26] >> With federal prosecutors in Delaware [1:28] investigating Hunter Biden and whether [1:30] he broke federal tax [music] law, [1:32] >> by the way, this is We can edit this [1:34] part out. It's off the record. Are [1:35] aliens real or are they? [1:37] >> We should probably stop the cameras. [1:39] Okay, [1:40] [music] [1:43] >> Hunter Biden, thank you so much for [1:45] coming on the ice coffee hour. [1:46] >> Thanks for having me. So, I'm very [1:48] curious why agreed to do the podcast. [1:51] >> Oh, I think you're fascinating. I love [1:52] the guests that you have on. I watch you [1:54] all the time and I think you ask really [1:57] insightful questions and the truth of [1:59] the matter is is that I usually learn [2:01] something when I'm listening to you. [2:03] >> I really appreciate that, man. What do [2:04] you have to gain from coming on, though? [2:07] Well, for me it's a opportunity to talk [2:10] to people who I think have an enormous [2:12] amount of influence in a uh in a [2:15] category of listeners that most of the [2:18] people that are my age and and uh you [2:21] know political persuasion don't [2:23] necessarily have a chance to talk to and [2:26] um I know that you guys are equal [2:27] opportunity in terms of [2:29] >> you know and apolitical and most [2:31] everything [2:32] >> but um I just think that you uh do a [2:35] really incredible job of like asking [2:38] really insightful questions. So, you [2:40] know, maybe I get to learn something [2:41] myself. More than anything, that's what [2:43] it's about. Yeah. [2:44] >> What's the message that you hope viewers [2:46] could take away from this? [2:47] >> I think that we're fed, particularly at [2:50] this moment in time, this u algorithm [2:52] that we're so divided that things are so [2:56] desperate that we are um on the verge of [2:58] a civil war, so to speak, uh literally [3:01] or figuratively. And while all of that [3:03] may seem true and um I I I truly believe [3:07] that uh that our algorithms are not our [3:10] reality. I think that if people just [3:12] think about themselves and their own uh [3:14] personal lives and think about their [3:16] neighbors and think about the [3:18] aspirations of their their neighbors and [3:20] their community, the truth is that we [3:22] all share far more in common than we do [3:24] um have uh differences with each other. [3:27] One of the things that I've noticed, [3:29] you've done a lot of podcasts recently. [3:31] You've talked about a lot as well, and [3:32] when we were doing research for our [3:35] episode, we didn't want to cover the [3:37] same things that you've talked about [3:38] every single time. And I am curious, [3:41] what is something you wish other people [3:42] had asked you? [3:44] >> We kind of always touch this uh topic of [3:48] universal pain that everyone [3:50] experiences, but I don't really ever get [3:52] to go in depth about it. And I remember [3:54] on I I did Bill Maher's show and I like [3:57] Bill and but it's a it's a 10-minute [3:59] format and it's not a two-hour format [4:02] which doesn't lend itself to kind of [4:03] really kind of in-depth discussions. But [4:05] I said to him, I said, "I don't think we [4:07] get to talk about issues like grief and [4:10] and nearly enough." And he goes, "I [4:12] think we talk about it all the time." [4:14] And in one respect, it's true is that [4:16] it's something that gets mentioned, but [4:19] never really in depth. And I think [4:21] that's one of the ways that I have uh [4:24] been able to connect with people more [4:26] than anything is not they they don't [4:29] associate out with me. Um uh instead [4:33] they identify with me because of my [4:36] experiences. And so not everybody was a [4:39] a [4:41] and not everybody had my experience in [4:43] terms of that becoming a widely widely [4:46] talked about public person. But [4:48] everybody has a brother that has uh you [4:51] know, so to speak, uh that has uh dealt [4:55] with um everybody has a um a loved one, [4:59] I I've never met anyone that hasn't been [5:01] impacted by it in some way. And with me, [5:04] there's this piece that uh because of [5:07] who my father was and because of the [5:10] notoriety that I've received because of [5:12] negative kind of conspiratorial press [5:14] about that involves politics. You would [5:18] think that that people wouldn't find a [5:20] connection, but it's the exact opposite. [5:22] they have found a connection in uh in [5:26] the way in which I've been I think [5:27] particularly for someone in my position [5:29] radically honest about not just my past [5:32] but my present. So what do you think is [5:34] then left out of the conversation about [5:37] grief and and that should be included [5:41] that pain is the um uh the universal [5:44] connector is I always I I I say this a [5:48] lot is that uh the one thing that a [5:50] human being is guaranteed to experience [5:53] um uh in a lifetime regardless of its [5:57] length is pain. It's not love. It's not [6:00] any other emotion. It is the experience [6:02] of of pain and that pain can take many [6:05] forms. Some of it self-inflicted, some [6:07] of it is not. And uh and I think that [6:11] what we don't uh necessarily talk about [6:14] is the the role of that pain in the way [6:17] in which people treat each other. You're [6:19] saying then that this pain that everyone [6:22] is guaranteed to experience is mostly [6:24] seen as a personal experience. But what [6:26] you're saying is that it's more [6:27] interpersonal that it's more of like a [6:30] language like a communication thing that [6:31] everyone experiences and that's the [6:33] thing that we should observe as opposed [6:35] to pain solely being a person. [6:36] >> Exactly. Again, it it it's this whole [6:39] idea what the back to what I originally [6:41] said. It it is a way in which we can [6:44] identify with each other, not a way in [6:46] which we identify out um from each [6:48] other. [6:49] >> And uh and you are just articulated much [6:52] better than I have over the course of [6:53] the last few months, but that's exactly [6:55] right. Yeah. So what do you feel like [6:56] people get wrong about you? [6:57] >> Oh, I think that they get a lot of [6:59] things wrong based upon a narrative that [7:00] has been spun for close to seven years [7:03] be before I started to speak for myself. [7:06] You know, when my name uh kind of became [7:10] ubiquitous, it was by no um uh intention [7:15] on my part. I had led a uh relatively [7:19] private life um in a very public family. [7:22] I I'm I camera shy um in some ways. Not [7:26] that I didn't have a lot of opinions and [7:28] and a lot to say and a lot of experience [7:30] to talk about things that I cared about, [7:32] but the truth of the matter is is that I [7:34] I usually shied away from them. Uh when [7:37] that happened, um you know, I didn't [7:39] really have an opportunity over the [7:41] course of the last 7 years uh to speak [7:44] for myself for a couple reasons. one, if [7:47] you're under investigation from the [7:48] Department of Justice, as a as a former [7:51] lawyer myself, I can tell you is keep [7:53] your mouth shut and um follow the [7:55] direction of your attorneys. Um and [7:58] don't make matters worse. That was part [8:00] of the reason. And the second part of [8:01] the reason is is that I have a very very [8:04] close relationship with my dad, but I [8:06] never ever involved my dad in myself in [8:10] in my father's politics and policy in [8:13] office. meaning that I I I [8:16] and didn't have [8:19] any intention of further complicating a [8:22] very very difficult uh job of uh of the [8:25] administration in uh in executing on [8:30] their plan and and their agenda which is [8:32] very different than mine. Now, speaking [8:34] of your dad, uh, he had previously said, [8:36] because we're mostly a finance podcast [8:39] at the end of the day, we talk about [8:40] economics and personal finances. [8:42] >> Your dad previously said that he vowed [8:45] to never own a stock. [8:47] >> I was curious if those financial beliefs [8:51] >> transferred over to you as well, if you [8:52] grew up with that. [8:53] >> Let me explain why he said that. [8:56] >> Yeah. [8:56] >> He got elected to the United States [8:58] Senate at the age of 29 in 1972. Mhm. [9:02] >> And the story of the day at that time [9:05] during that election uh it was [9:07] pre-Watergate but it was post Spiro Agnu [9:10] who had resigned um as vice president [9:14] and the reason that he had resigned had [9:16] to do with whether I forget whether it [9:19] was stock manipulation or um you know he [9:22] took stock from a a donor and then uh [9:25] basically he was getting paid off um and [9:28] and so during that campaign he made a [9:30] commitment that he would never want a [9:32] stock or a bond for this reason is that [9:34] it is um a a United States senator has a [9:39] um an almost uh unlimited uh uh ability [9:44] to impact policy that that affects every [9:49] company in the world and um excuse me at [9:51] least every company in the United States [9:53] every and particularly every publicly [9:55] traded company. And so he had made a [9:58] commitment uh not to own a stock or bond [10:01] to never have that conflict of interest [10:03] and he kept that commitment. Now of [10:05] course you know he has a retirement [10:07] account and he has his you know Senate [10:09] pension and his vice presidential and [10:11] presidential pension and I'm sure those [10:12] pensions are you know uh disassociated [10:15] from him invested into the market and [10:18] whatever way that uh retirement funds [10:20] are. But he never has personally um he [10:23] kept that commitment the entire time. [10:26] Sometimes I I get a little uh uh uh [10:30] angry that he did that. [10:32] >> And that's what we're trying to promote [10:34] to the viewer is that it's not a bad [10:36] thing. [10:37] >> No, by the way, not not at all. And [10:39] that's and 100% not even remotely a bad [10:42] thing, [10:43] >> but it is an inherent conflict of [10:45] interest for somebody that is serving in [10:48] Congress, serving in the executive [10:50] branch, serving as a United States [10:52] senator in the House of Representatives. [10:54] And if people that have that kind of [10:56] authority cannot set aside and put in [10:59] like blind trust, truly truly blind [11:01] trust while they serve, then I don't [11:03] think that they should be serving. [11:05] >> I agree with you. I think that it was [11:06] actually an incredibly noble position to [11:08] take to not own any stock. However, he [11:11] could have got, in my opinion, the exact [11:13] same effect, maybe 95% of that effect, [11:16] saying, "I'm never going to buy an [11:18] individual company. I'm only ever going [11:19] to buy index funds." [11:21] >> Yeah. [11:21] >> Well, here's another thing about that. [11:22] Okay, you're absolutely right. Is that [11:25] the Biden family could have used some [11:27] financial literacy for we we for for a [11:30] very long time. Um and and the other [11:34] side of it is this is my dad never had [11:35] any money to buy any um equity. Uh [11:38] >> you don't get paid well as like a [11:39] senator. [11:40] >> Well, I mean 1972 I think that the [11:42] salary of a United States senator was [11:44] like $46,000 and it went up when in I [11:47] think in the in the 80s maybe early 90s. [11:50] Um, and I don't don't hold me to the [11:52] exact numbers, but you know, I think [11:53] over the course of the 36 years that he [11:55] served, I think that his probably [11:57] average salary was about $175,000 a [12:00] year, [12:01] >> maybe not even um uh actually if you [12:04] include the the those earlier years in [12:06] the 70s and early 80s. And I and I know [12:09] and people are not going to believe me [12:11] about this um because you think United [12:13] States senator, oh, they're all rich. [12:15] Well, 90% of them that come into the [12:18] United States Senate come in already [12:20] rich because of the fact that it is not [12:23] a place to go to make money. um if [12:26] you're not making money on the side and [12:29] he was not making money on the side and [12:32] there's very very few ways to do that [12:34] today in in Congress other than by [12:39] buying individual stocks and trading in [12:42] in the way that uh we see many of the [12:45] members of Congress both Democrats and [12:47] Republicans have done and u it's been [12:49] made public over the course of the last [12:51] uh several years and remember this is a [12:54] recurring ing thing that comes up and [12:56] then they don't do anything it but comes [12:58] up and people get pissed off. [12:59] >> Why don't they do anything? [13:00] >> Because [13:01] >> take a guess who's benefiting from it, [13:03] right? And who's actually going to do [13:05] anything to who has the power to change [13:06] it. [13:06] >> So the people who have the power to [13:07] change it don't want to change it [13:08] basically [13:09] >> cuz they're the only people that benefit [13:10] and they benefit enormously from it. [13:12] >> Yeah. And by the way, not just remember [13:14] who else benefits from it is the [13:17] companies. [clears throat] Yeah. [13:18] Exactly. the people look the real power [13:21] in Washington DC is um is uh is money [13:27] and it's and it's not the way most [13:29] people think. It's not by making a uh [13:32] individual congressperson [13:34] um you know a millionaire or you know uh [13:37] it's not a personal financial benefit [13:40] the vast majority of people who go serve [13:42] in the Senate or the or the House of [13:44] Representatives. what the real power is [13:47] is the way in which uh money interest [13:51] are able to impact policy that is [13:56] important to them. And so if you're the [13:58] pharmaceutical industry, you spend [14:00] hundreds of millions of dollars and what [14:03] you do is you have uh you know targeted [14:06] ad campaigns in certain districts and [14:08] you are able to give money to packs that [14:10] that support Congress people you know uh [14:13] that support whatever position that you [14:15] want them to take. The the amount of [14:17] money is staggering and after the [14:19] Supreme Court decision basically there's [14:21] unlimited money um in in politics now. [14:24] So given what you've seen, what is your [14:26] relationship to money? Now, we've been [14:28] talking about insane amounts of money in [14:31] politics, but for most of us, every [14:33] dollar matters. And when you do spend [14:35] your money, it is so important that [14:37] you're able to make the most of it. And [14:38] that's where our partner Cash App comes [14:40] in. With the Cash App card, your [14:41] everyday spending can unlock actual [14:43] benefits, including personalized [14:45] cashback offers at places you already [14:47] like to shop. And those benefits could [14:48] go even further with the new Cash App [14:50] green status. Cash App does more than [14:52] you think when it comes to having your [14:54] back and making sure your money stays [14:56] your money. Cash App just released a new [14:58] status program for the way people [14:59] actually spend called Cash App Green. [15:02] And now when you spend at least $500 a [15:04] month with the Cash App card, you earn [15:05] Green status which unlocks benefits like [15:07] up to $200 of free overdraft coverage. [15:10] If you overdraft unexpectedly, there are [15:12] no hidden fees. You also unlock higher [15:14] borrow limits and custom personalized [15:16] cashback offers every Friday at places [15:18] you love to shop. Turn every day into [15:20] status with Cash App Green. Download [15:22] Cash App today or visit cash.app to [15:25] learn more about this and other [15:27] financial benefits. New Cash App [15:29] customers can earn $10 if they use code [15:31] cash app 10 in their profile at signup [15:33] and send $5 to a friend within 14 days. [15:36] Terms apply. Download Cash App today and [15:38] make your money work for you. Link in [15:40] bio. Cash App is a financial services [15:42] platform, not a bank. Banking services [15:43] provided by Cash Apps bank partners. [15:45] Prepaid debit cards issued by Sutton [15:46] Bank. Member FDIC. Cash App Visa debit [15:48] flex cards issued by Sutton Bank member [15:50] FDIC and the Bank NA pursuant to a [15:53] license from Visa USA Inc. See terms and [15:55] conditions for the Sutton Prepaid card, [15:57] Sutton Debit Flex Card and Bank Corp [15:59] Debit Flex Card, Cash App Green [16:00] features, savings, direct deposit [16:02] roundups, overdraft coverage and [16:03] discounts provided by Cash App, a Block [16:05] Inc. brand. Visit [16:06] cash.app/legal/mpodcast [16:08] for full disclosures. So, given what [16:10] you've seen, what is your relationship [16:12] to money? I want to have a better [16:14] relationship with money. [16:16] And I really mean that is that I got [16:18] married very young and I didn't have any [16:20] family money. And I'd never had anyone [16:22] in in in my life in which money was the [16:26] um [clears throat] uh money was a [16:28] central part of like a a dinner table [16:30] conversation. You know, I always [16:33] remember my first semester um tuition at [16:36] Georgetown University was I think [16:39] $7,500. and we had to deliver it on the [16:42] day that I came to campus unlike most [16:45] people had already sent their checks in. [16:47] And because he had to um mortgage a [16:51] piece of, you know, uh refinance a piece [16:53] of the our house, the property to be [16:56] able to come up with that. And that's [16:58] kind of the way that that my brother and [17:00] I were raised. And the the other side of [17:03] it too is that money for money's sake [17:06] was never something that was um [17:09] celebrated in my family. Um it it wasn't [17:12] looked down upon. Um I didn't have kind [17:15] of like a negative view of people that [17:17] were business people and uh but the the [17:20] higher calling was always something what [17:22] is you know what what's your purpose? Um [17:25] and and it revolved around the idea of [17:27] service more than anything. Do you wish [17:29] that you would have been better with [17:31] money in terms of your education and [17:34] buying stocks and saving a certain [17:37] percentage? [17:38] >> Oh, 100%. After Georgetown, I had about [17:41] $60,000 in student loan debt. And I went [17:44] to do a thing called the Jesuit [17:46] Volunteer Corp, which was like the [17:47] domestic Peace Corp, where you make $80 [17:49] a month, literally, and you pull your [17:51] money and you live with other [17:52] volunteers. and I ran an emergency [17:54] service center in this neighborhood in [17:56] Portland where I help families that [17:58] couldn't get their lights turned on or [18:00] their utilities uh were off in the [18:02] winter and I would uh advocate for them [18:05] and and help them get those things back [18:07] up so that they could have you know that [18:10] heat in you know in the middle of [18:12] winter. And then I got married and had [18:14] it and and had Naomi, my first child. [18:16] And then I got uh in in law school and I [18:19] took out I think at the time it was all [18:23] in for law school when I graduated from [18:25] Yale about [18:28] uh another 130,000 $120,000 for that. [18:32] Immediately out I was a young father, a [18:35] Yale law graduate uh with no savings and [18:39] about you know $165,000 [18:42] in debt. And the only reason I bring [18:44] that up is because you you asked and u [18:46] but also is is that I look today and um [18:51] and even with that I was able within uh [18:55] a year of graduating law school able to [18:57] go buy a house [18:59] >> and fix it up myself. And that's what we [19:01] did. And I then flipped that house and I [19:05] was able to um do that um two more [19:08] times. And that's the way that I had put [19:11] a little money away in terms of uh and [19:14] having savings and giving myself a [19:16] little bit of a cushion to be able to [19:17] send three daughters to, you know, uh to [19:20] to school and and you know and have a [19:23] house and ultimately in Washington DC [19:25] for 20 years. [19:26] >> Yeah. What's been your best investment? [19:29] >> Real estate. Yeah. And so, [19:32] um, one of the things that my brother [19:35] and I did with my dad is that we would [19:37] literally his, um, we just used to love [19:40] doing this. And Delaware has these [19:42] beautiful, beautiful old, uh, homes, [19:44] just incredible like classic [19:46] architecture and the Brandy River Valley [19:48] and, uh, really, really neat. And old [19:50] uh, all of the DuPont family had these [19:53] amazing estates and and really cool [19:55] homes, but, you know, a lot of them were [19:57] fixer uppers. So he did that when um [20:00] when we were young after my mom we [20:02] bought this old Dupon estate that they [20:04] were going to tear down and then we [20:06] spent the next 20 years um you know [20:08] working on it. And so I had and I love [20:12] to do that with my dad um and my brother [20:15] and uh you know the the joke was that if [20:18] you came over to our house all all of [20:20] our friends um is that you expect to be [20:24] put to work for at least at least half [20:26] the time that you were there. There was [20:27] always a project that was going on. [20:29] >> How would you rate your finances? One [20:31] out of 10. [20:32] >> A zero. [laughter] [20:34] >> What makes it a zero? [20:35] >> When I when I got out of law school, I [20:37] went to work at a uh at at a bank uh as [20:41] as an attorney and then in their uh in [20:43] their executive program uh to become a a [20:47] banker also. And um and I left there as [20:52] a senior executive vice president and [20:54] had done very well. And I went to work [20:58] um in DC and I went to work for a guy [21:01] named Bill Daly at the Department of [21:02] Commerce where I wanted specifically to [21:05] understand this new thing called the [21:08] internet and a lot of my friends were um [21:12] uh were building online companies and [21:15] and so I became the executive director [21:18] of e we used to call it e-commerce. [21:21] >> This is like 1999. [21:23] >> Yeah. [21:23] >> 2000. And I got a really incredible view [21:26] into what was coming next in terms of [21:29] new technology and particularly as it [21:31] related to at the time being called [21:32] e-commerce and the internet. And then [21:34] you know the crash came then in 2000 and [21:38] what I uh had intended to do was go up [21:41] open up a law firm to uh [21:44] [sighs and gasps] [21:44] to uh focus on e-commerce e-commerce [21:48] policy and also the the uh the new uh [21:54] issue which I thought was going to be [21:56] the most important issue going into the [21:58] early 2000s was privacy. the way in [22:01] which people's personally identifiable [22:02] information was being shared and [22:05] collected as data without their [22:07] knowledge um or with opt-in processes in [22:11] so many different um ways in which the [22:13] internet was collecting our information [22:16] and then the the the bubble happened. [22:18] And so all of those friends of mine that [22:20] were worth not all but a lot of my [22:23] friends who were worth millions and [22:24] millions of dollars who needed that type [22:26] of advice from uh from somebody who was [22:29] uh kind of on the cutting edge of [22:30] understanding it um no longer had had [22:33] companies to pay any legal bills. And um [22:37] I had a friend who was a Jesuit priest [22:39] that I when I was at Georgetown was a [22:41] mentor of mine. He suggested that um I I [22:44] talked to the president at the time of [22:45] St. Joe's University, which is one of [22:47] many uh incredible institutions, Jesuit [22:50] universities, and they needed help with [22:53] um potentially securing federal dollars [22:55] to do uh a program of sending their PhD [23:01] um education students into the the the [23:04] toughest neighborhoods in Philadelphia [23:06] to provide for support and um help. And [23:09] so I helped him do that. And then he [23:11] recommended me to a friend who at [23:13] Scranton University. And then he [23:14] recommended me to the that another [23:17] priest, Jesuit priest who was president [23:19] of university and I worked at Regis and [23:21] I ended up that became my business. The [23:23] whole point being is I built a really [23:25] incredible business around that. And [23:27] then when Barack Obama uh and uh chose [23:30] my father to be uh vice president, what [23:32] I did because I thought that there was [23:35] potentially a um a conflict of interest [23:38] of me um uh looking towards uh securing [23:43] dollars within the federal budget for [23:46] even though it was for like a mobile [23:47] dental clinic in in in Detroit for [23:50] Detroit Mercy where there was no dentist [23:52] office or even if it was all of these [23:54] kind of like uh great programs. [23:56] >> Yeah, [23:57] >> it's still uh I I [24:01] >> uh unilaterally and volunteered to give [24:04] up that business which was really hard [24:06] for me to do. [24:06] >> Was it making money? [24:07] >> Oh yeah. From at that time for me I [24:11] represented probably over 17 um Jesuit [24:14] universities. [24:14] >> Could you have sold that business if it [24:16] was doing well and just like sell I get [24:18] a lump sum for that index? No, because [24:20] it was all based upon my personal [24:22] relationship with this network of Jesuit [24:24] um uh presidents and and what I was able [24:26] to do for them in particular. And [24:29] >> were you making like six figures, a [24:31] million dollars? Like it was [24:32] >> I forget what the exact number was, but [24:34] it was enough for me to be able to pay [24:35] for my girls to go to to private school [24:37] in Washington DC and own a home and and [24:40] uh and have two cars and and not have [24:43] any debt at that. [24:44] >> Were you investing it? [24:45] >> Not in not in the way that I should have [24:47] been. No, absolutely not. What were you [24:50] investing in? [24:50] >> Um, no, no, I mean like not because I [24:52] was investing in other things. I wasn't [24:54] investing in a I I had a a friend who [24:57] became my partner and he did a really [25:00] great job of making certain that I was [25:03] being uh responsible, frugal with with [25:07] my money. Yeah. [25:08] >> So, he was monitoring your budget and [25:10] investing extra funds or just kind of [25:13] making sure that you don't fall behind. [25:16] >> Not but again, not into the market. I [25:18] didn't have any understanding uh of uh [25:20] or I didn't felt feel like I had any [25:22] understanding but you know in terms of a [25:24] 401k retirement fund all you know um [25:28] 529s all of the things that you would [25:31] would do responsibly without being um uh [25:35] being a risk taker in any way. [25:37] >> Yeah. [25:37] >> When in your life were you working your [25:39] hardest? [25:40] >> Right now. [25:41] >> Right now is harder than when you were [25:43] representing these different colleges. [25:46] >> Yeah. Because right now I basically have [25:48] four different jobs. You know the the [25:49] the common refrain from people the [25:53] trolls um online is get a real job. like [25:56] [laughter] [25:58] so right now I am a um a principal at a [26:01] recovery center here in Los Angeles [26:03] called Peak Path Health and the my [26:06] responsibility is to uh stand up a [26:09] foundation the Peak Path Health [26:11] Foundation for the purposes of creating [26:13] a free afterare and uh availability for [26:16] free afterare and advice for people that [26:18] don't have the money to go anywhere [26:20] after they've done 30 days if they were [26:22] lucky enough to get those 30 days. I [26:24] think it's the most significant I mean [26:26] most important gap in the health care [26:28] system as it relates to recovery. People [26:31] do their 30 days they have nowhere to [26:32] go. They have uh often times where they [26:35] do have to go is not only dangerous it [26:37] almost um ensures and that's why I [26:40] believe that you have the level of [26:41] recidivism or in people coming out of [26:44] recovery and so it's something that is [26:46] near and dear to my heart but that's one [26:47] of the jobs I have. I also work with an [26:49] organization called Basta Universal and [26:52] they are 501c3 and they uh uh are a [26:56] tenants rights and homeless prevention [26:58] organization here in uh in Los Angeles. [27:01] >> That's Graham's favorite. [27:02] >> Oh man. [27:03] >> Oh yeah. [27:04] >> Well, no, he he's had some problems with [27:06] rental properties here in Los Angeles. [27:08] >> Oh gosh. I So I had a house in Santa [27:11] Monica and the homeless was a huge huge [27:15] issue. [27:15] >> Yeah. Well, okay. I mean that was [27:17] massive and it and it got so bad ended [27:20] up selling the house. Not because of the [27:23] homeless people specifically, but I mean [27:25] that didn't help. [27:27] >> Oh, kind of doesn't even remotely help. [27:28] I mean the 10 cities that came up in in [27:31] Venice when I lived there and and the [27:32] way in which I mean anyway those are two [27:35] that are like full-time jobs in in and [27:38] of themselves. And then I'm an artist [27:41] >> as we can see. [27:42] >> Yes, guys. These are two pieces of art [27:44] that you can see behind Hunter and [27:46] behind us. This is [27:47] >> He brought these to show them off. And [27:49] let me tell you, they are impressive. [27:50] >> I am a huge fan of your art. [27:52] >> Thank you. [27:53] >> I really, really like it. And I'm [27:55] curious to take a quick side tangent [27:57] here. [27:58] >> What is it like selling your art? And [28:00] how have your art prices fluctuated over [28:03] the last few years? But before we go [28:05] into hunter's art business, it's funny [28:07] because when the topic of money comes [28:08] up, we always want to know the [28:10] interesting stuff like how much it [28:12] costs, how much they made, how much [28:14] profit there is, but we rarely talk [28:16] about all the details behind the scenes [28:18] because as a business begins to grow, so [28:20] does the amount that you need to keep [28:22] track of. Bingo, Graham. And eventually [28:24] you realize that making money is only [28:26] one aspect of running a business. [28:28] There's this whole other side that no [28:29] one even thinks about until they have to [28:31] deal with it, which is exactly where our [28:32] partner Gusto comes in. For those [28:34] unaware, Gusto is an online payroll and [28:36] benefit software built for small [28:37] businesses. It is all-in-one, remote [28:40] friendly, and incredibly easy to use. [28:42] So, you could pay, hire, onboard, and [28:44] support your team from anywhere. It [28:46] handles literally everything from [28:48] payroll, tax filing, direct deposits, [28:50] health benefits, 401k, workers comp, all [28:52] of the stuff that I do not want to think [28:53] about. On top of that, if you ever hit a [28:55] tough HR situation, you get direct [28:58] access to certified HR experts. Plus, [29:01] switching is super easy, too. All you [29:02] have to do is transfer over your [29:03] existing data and you are up and running [29:05] fast. No joke, you won't pay a single [29:07] scent until you run your first payroll. [29:09] After that, it's one flat monthly price [29:12] for unlimited payroll runs. No hidden [29:14] fees. This year, we actually hired our [29:16] first ever full-time editor, and we used [29:18] Gusto to set up everything. It was [29:21] genuinely easy, and I did not crash out. [29:23] It's no wonder that Gusto is ranked [29:25] number one on G2's highest satisfaction [29:27] products list for 2026, and over 500,000 [29:30] small businesses trust it. So try Custoa [29:32] today at gustto.comiced [29:36] and get three months free when you run [29:38] your first payroll. It's three months of [29:39] free payroll at gustto.com/iced. [29:44] One more time, that is gustto.com/iced [29:48] or just click the link down below in the [29:50] description. So now that you've got the [29:51] back end of your business handled, [29:52] finding the people to actually help your [29:54] business grow is what comes next. So [29:57] whether you need an editor, a designer, [29:59] a developer, or someone to help with a [30:01] very specific skill set, that's where [30:02] our partner Upwork comes in. Upwork is [30:04] where businesses find highly skilled [30:06] freelance professionals for specialized [30:07] work from software development and AI [30:09] implementation to marketing, design, and [30:11] business operations. You can browse [30:13] profiles, review past work, and get help [30:15] scoping the role so you know exactly [30:17] what you're getting before you commit to [30:19] anyone. With Business Plus, you can [30:21] access the top 1% of talent on Upwork. [30:23] AI powered shortlisting delivers a [30:25] curated short list of top freelancers [30:27] matched to your goals in under 6 hours. [30:29] No endless searching required. Plus, [30:31] contracts and payments all live in one [30:33] place so you're not chasing down [30:34] invoices while simultaneously trying to [30:37] run the company. [30:38] >> I've personally used Upwork a ton and it [30:40] genuinely makes the entire process [30:41] easier. Signing up is free and posting a [30:43] job takes minutes. If you're looking for [30:45] talent and you're not posting on Upwork, [30:47] what are you doing? On top of that, over [30:49] 170,000 freelancers on the platform hold [30:52] a five-star rating, so you're hiring [30:54] someone with a verified track record. [30:56] Visit upwork.com right now and post your [30:58] job for free. That is upwork.com to [31:01] connect with top talent ready to help [31:02] your business grow. Once again, upw.com, [31:06] upwork.com, or just click the link down [31:08] below in the description. What is it [31:09] like selling your art, and how have your [31:12] art prices fluctuated over the last few [31:15] years? [31:15] >> My prices have never fluctuated. my [31:17] prices are are a reflection of the of [31:21] the market. And so I've never set a [31:24] price for a painting myself. I've always [31:26] let like a third party independent uh [31:29] player do that. [31:30] >> See, when I was going on your website, [31:31] hunterbiden.com, if you want to look at [31:33] the art, [31:34] >> I not a paid promotion. I saw each piece [31:37] of art and then I clicked on it. It said [31:39] like inquire about the price and I'm [31:41] like this is exactly how very very very [31:45] expensive and luxury things kind of [31:47] market things like they don't tell you [31:48] the price. [31:49] >> I always thought because I've inquired [31:51] on a few pieces [31:52] >> and not not your pieces specifically [31:54] just in general and I always wondered [31:56] it's like do they just Google you and [31:57] they're like what's his net worth and [31:59] >> let's just say it's like oh it's Jeff [32:00] Bezos. Yeah. the price is like a million [32:02] dollars. But if you know Jack over here [32:04] inquires [32:05] >> 50ents. No. So, so here's how it [32:08] originally worked with my art. Okay. So, [32:10] what happened was is that uh I've been [32:13] an artist my whole life. I've never I [32:15] hadn't sold my art. Um uh I hadn't shown [32:18] in a gallery. But before my dad was even [32:21] won the nomination, I met a gallerist in [32:24] New York just by chance who came to my [32:27] house in California with a mutual friend [32:29] and he looked at my art and he goes, [32:32] "Hey, have you ever thought about [32:34] showing your art?" And I said, "Yeah, I [32:36] mean, it's like a dream of mine, but [32:37] no." He said, "Well, let's keep [32:39] talking." And we and we talked and [32:41] talked and uh he said, "Let's plan a um [32:45] a gallery show." remember this before he [32:48] lost Iowa, lost New Hampshire, lost [32:50] Nevada. This was not anything remotely [32:53] political. And um when I joined when I [32:57] when I agreed to be represented by this [33:00] gallery in New York. So when I had the [33:03] show, however, what ended up happening [33:05] was is that the New York Post kind of [33:07] set me up. And I really mean this. They [33:09] went to somebody, an anonymous gallerist [33:11] in Midtown Manhattan. They said, "How [33:13] much is Hunter Biden's art worth?" And [33:14] he said, "Anywhere from $100,000 a piece [33:17] to $500,000 a piece." And I mean I was [33:20] like, "All right." Like that's great, [33:22] dude. like that. And I called George and [33:25] he kind of laughed and he go and the the [33:27] gallerist at the time and he laughed and [33:30] he said well you know it's nice for [33:32] people to believe that but you know like [33:34] it's not um you know as as a u first [33:37] time exhibiting artist I mean the prices [33:40] in anybody's estimation of what I've [33:42] been able to sell my art for is are [33:44] really great and I've been able to [33:46] maintain a serious price that does not [33:49] make it just an inexpensive commodity. [33:52] No. However, no piece of art that I've [33:54] ever sold has been close to what the New [33:57] York Post said. And so what they did [33:59] then, however, is George then, this my [34:03] gallerist was asked by uh people uh in [34:06] the press, well, how much is Hunter's [34:08] art for? And he pointed to to that [34:10] article. And so then it was Hunter Biden [34:12] was selling his art while his dad was [34:14] president of the United States for [34:15] $500,000 a piece. Now, I can tell you [34:18] that's not true. And the reason I can [34:20] tell you that's not true is because they [34:21] had an entire impeachment hearing over [34:23] it. They subpoenaed every person that [34:25] ever bought a piece of art from me and [34:27] including the gallerist and people that [34:29] just attended the show. All of whom had [34:31] to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars [34:33] in legal fees to testify under oath that [34:36] it had nothing to do with anything and [34:39] how much they bought each painting for. [34:41] And then they made all of that public. [34:43] So you can go read it all online in the, [34:45] you know, House Oversight Committee like [34:47] which is mixed in with Yeah. [34:48] >> Let me ask you this. Hypothetically, if [34:50] you were selling for 500,000 a piece. [34:52] Yeah. [34:53] >> What's wrong with that? [34:55] >> Nothing. And that's exactly the point is [34:57] this is that number one, certainly [35:00] nothing wrong with it. Now, number two, [35:02] as long as you're transparent about it [35:04] and uh and that I can show that I'm not [35:07] selling to a Russian oligarch. Like take [35:08] the story today that's out as it relates [35:10] to Don Jr. is that a Russian oligarch [35:12] came in that he's known for maybe a [35:14] couple years. He gets remarried and this [35:18] Russian oligarch who's close to to Putin [35:20] paid hundreds of thousands of dollars in [35:22] costs for his wedding. Okay. Now, I [35:26] think that it's kind of a legitimate [35:27] question to say, what is this person [35:30] that's in 62 pictures with Putin and is [35:33] sanctioned by the Ukrainian government [35:36] and uh doing paying for the president's [35:39] son's second wedding on a island and [35:42] like what what's that all about? And so [35:44] with me, I made it clear is that anybody [35:47] that bought my art is that I would not [35:49] sell to anyone outside of the United [35:51] States. I would make it all transparent [35:53] and I would make it all available to um [35:57] to to anybody and they even made a rule [35:59] while my dad was president that it would [36:01] be anonymous to me which made it almost [36:03] impossible in many ways. Like who wants [36:05] to buy a piece of art and never be known [36:07] to the artist that they're buying the [36:09] piece of art? [36:10] >> But that was the the the case and and [36:12] there's nothing wrong with it. Now my [36:15] dad's no longer president. Nobody in my [36:17] family has any power over anything as it [36:19] relates to elected office in any way. [36:21] I'm an artist. I sell my art. I sell it [36:23] for the price that the market will [36:24] support. [36:25] >> What's the most you've sold a piece of [36:27] art for? [36:27] >> I think the highest price was 85,000. [36:30] >> Yeah. Well, by the way, which in through [36:32] the gallery, which I got 50% of a little [36:34] under 50% of. So, when you sell through [36:36] a gallery, they take 50%. [36:38] >> I was curious, are you allowed to say [36:41] who the coolest person is who bought [36:43] your art? [36:44] >> I can tell you the coolest person who [36:45] has a piece of my art [36:47] >> is um Trump. [36:49] >> No. [36:50] >> [laughter] [36:52] >> That would be [36:53] >> that would be pretty cool. Yeah. [36:55] >> Well, there's the coolest person and the [36:56] most important person. The most [36:58] important person that has a number of [36:59] pieces of art are my mom. I gifted her [37:02] for Christmas these uh these beautiful [37:04] flowers on with alcohol ink on aluminum [37:07] sheet that I knew she would love. And so [37:10] she put them up in the White House in [37:11] the residence which is really really [37:13] cool. And now they're at home with her. [37:15] >> But I have um I have some I I just gave [37:18] I I just did an interview with uh [37:21] somebody who who not just because of his [37:25] work in film but because of the person [37:27] that he has been in public life is been [37:32] uh some someone that I truly truly [37:34] admire. It was Martin Sheen and he came [37:37] to do a uh to interview me. [37:39] >> Wow. [37:40] And I really really just love him and [37:42] his wife Janet and um and we have a lot [37:46] of shared kind of understanding in terms [37:48] of in families and things like that. And [37:51] um I I gave him a painting that meant a [37:54] a lot to me that I had painted which was [37:57] um based upon the book of Kels which is [37:59] a ancient Irish text of the Bible that [38:02] was created by Irish monks a long long [38:05] long time ago that's at Trinity College [38:06] right now. A couple others but mainly [38:09] the I gift it to my friends. Yeah. [38:11] >> So, what's the fourth job then? [38:13] >> The fourth job is writing. You know, I [38:16] wrote one book and I it was released in [38:18] 2021 and I have been writing on Substack [38:21] now and it's a full-time job. I have two [38:24] books that I've written that I'm [38:25] releasing on Substack right now that are [38:27] uh one is kind of the continuation of [38:29] the of the original memoir, Beautiful [38:32] Things, and then another one is a uh is [38:35] an accounting of what happened in the [38:36] rooms that I wasn't in. kind of the [38:38] conspiracy to dehumanize uh me and uh [38:42] impact our politics. And I'd done an [38:44] enormous amount of research and uh [38:47] investigation into that over the course [38:49] of the seven years. One of the things [38:50] about it that was so incredible though [38:52] is this [38:53] >> is that I was able to write the other [38:56] book which is an incredibly cathartic [38:58] experience because just from it linearly [39:01] I could tell the story of what happened [39:03] to me when you know how I felt about it [39:05] the internal emotions and um and [39:08] reactions to events that were occurring [39:10] to me as they occurred to me. The other [39:13] one was like a like hundreds of [39:17] thousands of pages of documents and [39:20] investigative work and Senate um you [39:22] know intelligence committee uh [39:23] declassified information and loads and [39:26] loads of of uh press of reporting on it. [39:30] >> It was just like trying to get it all in [39:33] one place and which I've been fascinated [39:35] watching some of the people that are [39:37] experts with you guys is AI. I was able [39:40] to use AI to feed in um literally [39:43] thousands of pages of documents to [39:45] number one literally give me a glossery [39:47] of names of the people and um and [39:50] concurrent timelines and uh like mind [39:53] maps of you know who was connected to [39:56] who which allowed me then to write that [39:58] second book with a you know with all the [40:00] footnotes and everything that I would [40:02] do. [40:02] >> So here's a really good way to digest a [40:04] ton of research. If you open up Claude, [40:07] you create a project. This is one of the [40:09] ways that I researched you for this [40:11] podcast. I listened to quite a few of [40:13] your podcasts you've been on. I didn't [40:14] listen to all of them because there's [40:15] probably 25 plus in the past 6 months or [40:17] so or maybe year. [40:19] >> And so I downloaded the transcript for [40:21] every single one of the podcasts. [40:23] >> And then I saved it as a PDF and then [40:26] uploaded it to the context of the Claude [40:28] project. And then I asked how many times [40:31] were these things covered in the [40:32] podcast? And there were certain things [40:33] like the laptop which was covered in you [40:35] know it said 20 of the 20 podcast [40:37] samples I provided. There were other [40:39] things that were you know berisma that [40:41] were covered you know 18 out of 20 [40:43] times. And then it also gave me a list [40:44] of things that weren't covered in any of [40:46] the podcasts that you did. And this was [40:48] all done in like 15 minutes of just [40:50] downloading transcripts and then [40:52] uploading his context. And then it's [40:54] able to look through [40:54] >> insane [40:55] >> 20 plus probably 30 plus hours of [40:58] content and and and know perfect answers [41:00] immediately. It's incredible. It's truly [41:03] truly incredible. And I love people that [41:06] are transparent about how they are using [41:08] it [41:09] >> because the the beauty of the ability [41:12] for like for instance, I came in here, [41:16] it's just you two. [41:17] >> Mhm. And so everybody knows there's not [41:19] a team of people setting up a production [41:22] and lighting and and uh like has like [41:25] notebooks and by the way where by the [41:27] way I've been to podcasts where that's [41:29] the case [41:30] >> there where there's at least 10 or 15 [41:32] people that are in the background doing [41:35] things [41:36] >> the cap the ability for you to do all [41:39] your own research to be able to you know [41:40] get yourselves over here to set up to be [41:43] able to do it to um to to agree with [41:45] each other what the and do it as often. [41:48] I'm I'm I'm assuming that I'm not the [41:51] only person that you use that technique [41:54] >> to to research, right? It's just it's [41:57] truly incredible the productivity that [41:59] speeds us up if you're transparent about [42:01] it in a way that which by the way so [42:03] there's this whole debate on Substack [42:05] right now is they put in one of those AI [42:07] detection tools for everybody and number [42:09] one a lot of the authors are saying this [42:11] is to bull like I'll put in a piece that [42:15] I wrote in 1996 [42:18] and and this AI detection tool will come [42:21] up and say this is a you know this is [42:24] 75% % AI and the reason is is because AI [42:28] trained itself off the piece that that [42:29] person wrote. [42:30] >> Yeah. And so the whole thing is is a [42:33] little wonky still. Anyway, but here's [42:35] what I feel like [sighs] [42:37] is I know some of the the books that I I [42:40] think that are one of some of the [42:42] greatest um for instance works of of [42:45] long form journalism like Bob Woodward's [42:47] books and I Bob Woodward is obviously an [42:49] amazing one of the the Hall of Fame [42:51] investigative reporters that we've ever [42:53] had. Right. Well, I know Bob Woodward [42:55] works with a team of researchers, and he [42:59] always has. He works with a team of [43:01] other writers that um uh that collect [43:03] that information and that go through the [43:07] uh uh 600page [43:10] um House Oversight Committee report [43:13] >> and um so forth. Man, you can take that [43:16] House Oversight Committee report and [43:17] beat it into uh Claude and well with 16 [43:22] other uh equally dense reports and and [43:25] if you are if you have the capacity to [43:27] know what you want and what you're [43:29] looking for and how to um and how to [43:33] organize it um you can do incredible [43:36] things. Really truly incredible things. [43:38] >> What do you think about some of the [43:39] safety issues about AI? I vacasillate [43:42] between it's all a hoax um and I mean [43:45] and and I'm exaggerating like it's all [43:48] like a it's all just to uh you know [43:51] drive uh you know [43:53] >> regulation. [43:53] >> No, I mean it's all just to drive value [43:56] like that you know this the end of the [43:58] world and AI is you know because they're [44:00] trying to juice their IPOs um which they [44:03] have to do in order to be able to [44:04] sustain the burn rate that they're going [44:07] through. I mean, you know that there's a [44:08] whole strain of thought Oh, yeah. [44:10] >> from legitimate people that that's what [44:12] it is. I find that just by my own um uh [44:18] um and which is which is nothing. I mean [44:22] as compared to what I know others have [44:24] been able to do using AI is that there's [44:27] a staggering difference in the way in [44:30] which human beings are just by the AI [44:34] that is available today on a retail [44:37] level can live their lives if they [44:40] engaged with it. Well, I have a feeling [44:42] that what we see is just the tip of the [44:44] iceberg. Like what really is going on [44:46] behind like if they make something [44:48] public? [44:48] >> Yeah. [44:49] >> It's a dumb down version of like what's [44:51] really going on. Oh, look man, I don't [44:54] know many many people I mean what did [44:56] did uh Elon and [44:58] >> Sam Elman [44:59] >> Sam came out and they said that you know [45:01] like yeah we got a real problem slow [45:04] down a little [45:05] >> slow down and Daario is saying you know [45:08] like yeah this could be the end of the [45:10] world and and that viral tweet that went [45:12] out from that former anthropic and said [45:14] it's you know [45:15] >> a 10% chance and then you look at some [45:17] like incredible thinkers here's what I [45:19] think I think that we are on the verge [45:21] of the probably the most significant not [45:24] probably the most significant [45:26] evolutionary leap in human kind [45:30] throughout all of history. If you think [45:33] about it is that if you listen to people [45:35] like Kerszswhile and you read about uh [45:39] some of the most important thinkers in [45:41] this space is this if you read super [45:44] intelligence [45:46] it literally [45:48] no one no one can tell you what happens [45:52] next. There's not a it's it would [45:54] literally be as the equivalent of a [45:59] alien um you know spaceship you know [46:02] landing in you know the middle of of of [46:05] LA that was so superior in every um uh [46:09] almost every respect to us in terms of [46:12] our capacity to reason and and [46:15] effectuate decisions and everything [46:17] changes then and nobody can tell you [46:20] what that means. Now I always say is it [46:23] do we have a Star Trek future or do we [46:25] have a Star Wars future and I think that [46:28] along the way think of all the amazing [46:31] amazing things that we are uh on the [46:34] verge of solving right now u according [46:38] to very smart and I think responsible [46:42] people whether it's related to our [46:44] health related to longevity related to [46:47] um cancer research uh related to climate [46:50] change related to the way in which we [46:53] produce and distribute energy around the [46:55] world. Um just a a an incredibly um you [47:01] utopian potential in our future. And the [47:05] other side of it is that you know it may [47:08] just kill us all. I guess I'm somewhere [47:10] in the middle. I would love to know what [47:12] your thoughts are on the potential age [47:14] of abundance and if AI ends up being [47:18] this amazing thing and the economy is [47:21] doing great and people's ailments are [47:23] all cured and and we have this age of [47:26] abundance. How you're planning on [47:28] capturing that in the stock market? Are [47:31] you going to be investing in AI and like [47:33] buying different you know are you are [47:35] you looking [47:36] >> I'm calling you guys for advice is what [47:38] I'm going to be doing. Well, technically [47:39] it's not financial advice because [47:42] for entertainment purposes only, [47:44] >> you can make a lot of money. You know, [47:46] >> Chris Camillo really likes Amazon and [47:48] Robin Hood [47:49] >> and Bloom, [47:50] >> which I have done well in [47:52] >> all three. [47:52] >> All three, actually. All three. Yeah. [47:54] Thanks, Chris. [47:54] >> Chris Camilillo is a guy that we bring [47:56] on the podcast. He's like a very smart [47:57] >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Like five times now. [48:01] Yeah. He's a part of Dumb Money and he [48:02] put me on to a few stocks that have [48:04] they've done well. So, I appreciate [48:05] that, Chris. Yeah. He has a thesis that [48:07] we're going to have robot workers and [48:09] they're going to take over just about [48:11] everything and we could create just [48:12] about anything we want that's going to [48:14] bring the price down [48:16] >> and effectively make [48:18] >> big purchases meaningless because you [48:20] could just create anything that you want [48:21] though. [48:22] >> Yeah. No, I I [48:25] >> bring it on. [48:26] >> Bring it on. [48:26] >> Yeah. Yeah. [48:27] >> Because I I I really do mean that is [48:29] that um there's what's his name? Mo. uh [48:32] he was at Google the but he he makes [48:35] that point is that I think in order to [48:37] get there it is going to be the the [48:39] dislocation the um uh the uh the feeling [48:45] of uh of [48:48] uh [48:49] not not not having control over our [48:53] future is going to be it it's going to [48:55] be really difficult. It's it's going to [48:57] be a difficult transition process for us [48:59] to go through. And if they are right [49:03] that 95% of employment will be not only [49:07] unnecessary but irrelevant in a world in [49:10] which there is AGI. Um then like that's [49:15] going to be a tough time for people to [49:17] figure out where where they fit in the [49:19] world. [49:20] >> I'm curious to know you've gone on the [49:22] record and mentioned that you're like 15 [49:24] or so million dollars in debt. [49:25] >> Yeah. How does that affect daily life [49:28] being $15 million in debt? [49:30] >> It's staggeringly difficult in in this [49:33] way is that the idea that I'm 56 years [49:35] old and a I'm uh uh [49:40] going to have to be able to figure out [49:42] my way out of that. Now, to be fair is [49:44] that I hope that I can come to terms [49:46] with some of the people that I um owe [49:49] owe money to. I'm I'm trying in earnest [49:51] to be able to uh to do what I can do to [49:56] um do that. Now, for everybody who's [49:58] listening, that debt was directly and [50:03] solely related to my legal bills that I [50:06] had over that were acred over the course [50:09] of four years. None of that debt has [50:11] anything to do with my use or anything. [50:16] I did not it none of it. How much is [50:18] that debt? [50:19] >> Like about $15 million. [50:21] >> How every single penny of that is to [50:23] defend yourself. [snorts] How do they [50:24] keep going like more and more and more? [50:27] I would just think that for most people [50:29] they would stop at like, hey, listen, [50:30] you owe us like 500 grand. We're not [50:32] we're going to stop find someone to [50:34] represent you for free. I feel like the [50:35] public you guys have not had um uh No, [50:38] you know what? They wouldn't. And one [50:39] one of the reasons that they uh that I [50:42] did have some people that did and they [50:43] they were great to me, really wonderful [50:46] to me. But if I had owed that, then I [50:48] would it would be even more. It's it [50:50] it's insanely just think about this, [50:52] okay? I had a um uh the the Department [50:57] of Justice, Maine Justice, the US [50:59] Attorney's Office in Delaware, the US [51:01] Attorney's Office in Los Angeles, the US [51:03] Attorney's Office in Washington DC, the [51:05] US Attorney's Office in Pittsburgh, [51:07] Crimax at uh uh which is a different [51:11] division within the DOJ, the IRS [51:14] investig Criminal Investigation Unit, [51:17] and um uh and House Oversight Committee, [51:21] House Intelligence Committee, [51:23] uh Senate over uh uh Senate Judiciary, [51:26] House Judiciary, [51:28] all of those are separate and um uh uh [51:31] work product, you know, uh workflows in [51:34] in a law firm as well as uh responding [51:38] to uh and understanding how to be able [51:41] to communicate whatever we needed to be [51:42] able to communicate through the press [51:44] through courts and court filings. [51:46] >> Could you have gotten a free public [51:47] defender? [51:48] >> No, I could not have. So if this happens [51:51] to the average person, [51:53] >> yeah, [51:54] >> what are they expected to do? [51:55] >> Well, this is why I always say, and I [51:57] said this before it became my reality, [52:00] is this. [52:03] The federal government's power is [52:07] beyond anything that you can remotely [52:10] imagine. It's like the eye of Sauron. [52:12] >> When you say the federal government, [52:14] who? I mean, the Department of Justice [52:16] and all of the agencies that uh uh that [52:19] are either directly connected to it or [52:21] um that are part of the executive [52:23] branch, it's incredible. [52:24] >> Is it a specific individual or cohort of [52:26] people that like give out those [52:28] instructions and directions or is it [52:30] just like this, you know, [52:32] >> it's not supposed to be. and not just by [52:34] Norm, but in the the last president of [52:37] the United States that was instructing [52:39] his Department of Justice what to do was [52:41] Richard Nixon and he had to resign [52:43] because he he even attempted it and what [52:46] was called the Friday night which led to [52:49] him leaving office. We are in a in in a [52:52] whole new world. And we were in a whole [52:53] new world as it relates to the way in [52:55] which the executive, the actual [52:58] president of the United States and the [52:59] people that surround him in the White [53:01] House are directing the um uh the the [53:06] internal matters of the Department of [53:08] Justice. So when I say the the the [53:11] federal government, I mean the [53:12] Department of Justice, the FBI, the IRS, [53:14] that whole paniply of enforcement [53:16] organizations, including the SEC, the [53:18] CFTC, and all of those different [53:20] organizations. They need to be separated [53:22] from politics in the political arm of [53:24] the executive for the exact reason of [53:28] it's not intended to be a uh it uh [53:32] depended upon the [53:36] the whim of a single person. That's [53:39] called a that's called a monarchy. it [53:42] truly if their gaze falls upon you [53:46] [sighs] [53:48] the process is the thing that regardless [53:52] of whether you get indicted or convicted [53:54] it can you I mean it can bankrupt you it [53:58] if you want to mount a defense it cost [54:01] can cost depending upon the the length [54:03] and complication of what you're being [54:05] investigated for can cost hundreds of [54:07] thousands if not millions of dollars to [54:10] be able to defend. So why not just [54:12] declare for bankruptcy? [54:13] >> Well, uh I might and truth of the matter [54:16] is is that that may be the only option [54:18] and I'm trying to come to terms with u [54:20] with the my creditors which are mainly [54:23] law firms and and also a few others in [54:26] which I have been able to reset some of [54:28] the a a more reasonable and realistic [54:31] payment plan with them. But you know I I [54:34] plan on making good on what I'm [54:36] responsible to make good for. Do you [54:37] have like any assets now or how is it [54:40] trying to acquire wealth when you're $15 [54:42] million in debt? [54:43] >> Uh about and that's about and and that's [54:45] a rough number is that No, I don't. Um [54:48] the only assets I have I mean I have [54:50] this as Nico would be happy with this. I [54:52] have my Timexy. [54:54] >> Yeah, by the way, which I love. But uh [54:56] my only assets are my paintings that [54:58] that I have and you know like the stuff [55:01] that you accumulate over the course of [55:03] but no I don't have any liquid assets um [55:06] in anyway. [55:07] >> How much money are you allowed to make? [55:09] >> Well, I can make as much money as I [55:10] possibly can and that's and and so you [55:12] can still build wealth. [55:13] >> Yeah. Oh, absolutely. So, you know, I [55:15] mean I I I hopefully am have a a uh what [55:20] I want is a long and sustainable career [55:22] in art. Um and I have uh you you [55:27] building some wealth is that anyone that [55:30] wants to go look at my art that's a [55:32] legitimate collector and and uh really [55:34] does uh love art can go to [55:36] honorbiden.com and look at art. I'm [55:38] building a a subscription platform on [55:40] Substack and I have two jobs. [55:43] >> What's your monthly payment towards this [55:44] debt? Like is there a certain amount you [55:46] have to put away? Hey, before we go into [55:48] that, while Hunter's Dream is building [55:49] up his art business, I'm sure most of [55:51] you watching have an idea of your own. [55:54] Something you would like to turn into [55:55] your own business, but you just haven't [55:57] gotten around to doing it yet. And [55:59] unfortunately, that's where most ideas [56:00] stay in your head, in your notes app, or [56:03] you just telling yourself that you'll [56:04] get to it eventually. But now, getting [56:06] started is a lot easier than it used to [56:07] be. You don't need a huge team, know how [56:09] to code, or spend months building a [56:10] website. Because with our partner [56:12] Shopify, you could take your idea and [56:14] start turning it into a real business. [56:16] Everything that you need to start [56:18] selling is included and ready to go from [56:19] day one. You can launch a store in a few [56:21] simple steps, and their AI site builder [56:23] and design templates mean it actually [56:25] looks good without hiring anyone. And [56:26] when your first customer is ready to [56:28] pay, Shop Pay is the easiest checkout on [56:30] the market, so more of them actually [56:32] complete the purchase. Plus, when they [56:33] come back, all their details are saved. [56:35] One tap and they are done. I've [56:37] personally used Shopify a ton because [56:39] before I worked with Graham, I set up [56:40] probably five different Shopify stores [56:42] because I tried literally everything. [56:44] Drop shipping, you name it. I kept going [56:46] back to Shopify because I kid you not, [56:48] there is not even a competitor. If you [56:49] want to sell stuff online, Shopify is [56:51] the best way to do it. Not to mention, [56:53] Shopify powers millions of businesses [56:55] worldwide. From leading names like [56:57] Mattel and Gym Shark to everyday [56:59] entrepreneurs just getting started. So, [57:01] if you're ready to hear the of your [57:03] first sale today, head over to [57:04] shopify.com/ic [57:06] to start your free trial today at [57:08] shopify.com/ic. [57:10] One more time, that is shopify.com/ic [57:13] or just click the link down below in the [57:14] description to get started today. What's [57:16] your monthly payment towards this debt? [57:18] Like, is there a certain amount you have [57:20] to put away? [57:20] >> Yeah. No, not right now. um is that I so [57:23] I have not there there has been no [57:25] judgment against me so I don't have to [57:27] now with with others that that are part [57:31] of that uh they have given me the space [57:34] to be able to renegotiate the terms of [57:36] of of paying that back. But with um one [57:38] of them I'm in litigation right now and [57:40] we'll see where that goes. [57:41] >> By the way, this is we can edit this [57:43] part out off the record. Are aliens real [57:46] or are they [57:46] >> I I we should probably stop the cameras. [57:50] >> Okay, cool. We're getting into some [57:53] >> tricky territory. So, a little more [57:55] clarity around building wealth while [57:57] you're in this debt. Are you able to [57:59] like save money and buy stocks? Are you [58:01] buying stocks or how are you investing? [58:03] >> No, I'm not there yet. And so, the truth [58:05] of the matter is is that o over the past [58:09] uh what has it been about four months [58:11] since I initially went back on social [58:13] media, I've gone on shows. I haven't uh [58:16] kind of created my own platform yet [58:18] other than my Substack and and that bill [58:21] is slow, but it definitely isn't enough [58:22] money to invest in anything. It pays it [58:25] pays the bills right now. And you know, [58:28] we lost the ability to go back to our [58:30] rental home uh because of the fires out [58:32] here. And my wife is South African and [58:35] so we decided to go over to Cape Town [58:38] and uh spend some time with her family [58:41] which gave us the ability to have [58:42] somewhere to stay for a period of time [58:44] with friends and family there. And the [58:46] truth is I fell in love with Cape Town. [58:48] It's one of the most magnificent places [58:49] in the world. An incredible community of [58:52] people. But more than anything is it's [58:54] affordable. It's very very affordable. [58:57] And so what we're what I am in right now [59:00] is a a complete rebuilding process, like [59:04] just complete rebuilding process. And [59:06] there isn't um there's not enough wiggle [59:08] room for uh for saving yet. But I'm I'm [59:12] trying to build something. You know, [59:14] I've talked with Andrew Callahan um to [59:17] do maybe a a show with them. I've talked [59:20] to a couple other people about um [59:22] building a platform. I mean, I don't [59:24] know whether I have an enemy to do what [59:27] um what you guys do 52 weeks out of the [59:30] year. I mean, it's it's an enormous [59:32] amount of of uh commitment. Uh and and [59:35] and I'm and I am incredibly impressed [59:39] with it. And it's not that I don't want [59:41] to make the commitment, but I have to [59:42] figure out [gasps] [59:44] uh how to number one maintain a thing [59:48] that is part of what helped save my [59:50] life, which is my art. is the uh the [59:53] practice of art is not just important to [59:55] me in the sense of the for the idea that [59:58] I could sell paintings. That's the least [60:00] on the list of why I call myself an [60:03] artist first before anything else. [60:05] >> You could have a social media page and [60:07] monetize it and use it to actually [60:09] market your art about your art. Like if [60:12] you had a time of you making a piece and [60:15] you posted it on social media, I think [60:17] that that it do really well and then you [60:19] listed it for sale and it that was like [60:21] immediate perfect marketing for that [60:23] exact piece. [60:23] >> I follow so many artists on Instagram [60:25] and my favorites are when they have the [60:27] canvas turned around and it's like a [60:29] sound and then they slowly [60:32] see what it is. [60:33] >> You have to be like a really pretty girl [60:34] in a [laughter] for it to do. [60:37] >> I always get [60:39] I always get a little annoyed with them. [60:41] I'm like, just turn it around because [60:42] she was [laughter] a big guy. But you're [60:44] right. You know what? You know what I [60:46] always thought is that one of the [60:47] reasons why you you remember that show [60:49] Chef's Table, which I think is still on. [60:51] You ever seen It's an amazing amazing [60:53] show about cooking. I I'm not a cook and [60:55] I'm not a chef and I and I'm not a [60:57] foodie. I enjoy food. But the thing [61:00] about that show that was so um uh that [61:02] that just made I I mean you literally [61:05] end up crying in every episode and I'm [61:07] like why am I crying about some [61:08] Argentinian chef talking about you know [61:11] the farmtot process that he goes [61:13] through. But part of it is is the way in [61:16] which they film people in the process of [61:19] of their artisanship [61:21] >> uh you know like literally washing their [61:22] hands as they slice or pick or things [61:25] like that. And um and I've always [61:27] thought that about art. The content that [61:29] I most appreciate about art is watching [61:32] um it's like Bob Ross. Yeah. [61:34] >> Like you you people love [61:36] >> you could have your own Bob Ross show [61:38] that that would be very easy to produce. [61:39] >> Yeah. You know who does that? That is uh [61:42] the genius is Oh my god, I can't believe [61:46] I have to uh up my creatine dose. Get my [61:48] memory back. [laughter] [61:49] >> What do you the artist um Choy uh Cho um [61:53] David? Is it David Cho? the the the [61:55] artist. He did really really well for [61:58] himself because he painted that mural [61:59] for for Facebook at the at the outset of [62:03] equity, [62:03] >> but but but he's much more than that. He [62:05] was one of Anthony Bourdain's closest [62:07] friends, but he's an incredible [62:09] incredible artist and he does a show [62:11] like that now. He's he's also a [62:13] performance artist in and of himself, [62:15] but yeah, [62:16] >> I love that. [62:17] >> So, I'm curious. We had to ask you. [62:19] >> Yeah. [62:19] >> What was behind laptop? What happened? [62:24] Okay, so here's exactly what happened. I [62:26] set out to build and the whole purpose [62:29] of doing this was to build a coin a [62:32] token that was different in every [62:35] respect than what every other um uh [62:38] celebrity token including Trump token [62:40] was built in which every one of them was [62:43] built for max extraction 80% insiders um [62:48] you know no lock up or you know very [62:50] limited lock up and just pure extraction [62:53] from the market [snorts] and which [62:55] everyone has proven to be. And so I [62:57] built a coin that number one reversed [63:00] the tokconomics in which 30% of the coin [63:03] was to the uh on the inside and 70% of [63:07] the coin basically was to develop and [63:11] create community. 20% airdrop [63:13] immediately give away or over the course [63:16] of two airdrops give away a total of 20% [63:19] of the value of the coin. And then this [63:22] first ever unique element of a token [63:26] ever done before and was a prediction [63:28] market was basically embedded into the [63:30] coin. So for instance like yesterday [63:33] it's kind of trivial and fun as the [63:35] Eagles win their season opener. So they [63:38] won their season opener. That means we [63:40] burn I think in this instance 5% of the [63:42] coin which raises the value for the rest [63:44] of the community. And if the Eagles had [63:46] lost you would dedicate that amount to [63:49] charity. So we have a minimum of 5% [63:51] charity and up could be up to a maximum [63:54] obviously about 35% charity but more [63:56] will probably end up in like the 15% [63:58] range and so all of these things and [64:01] also it was to troll it was to troll [64:04] which is important to me um politically [64:07] and particularly with this audience [64:08] which I think is uh uh not exclusively [64:12] but a majority of 18 to kind of 35 year [64:15] old uh that are engaged in [64:18] cryptocurrency are engaged in memecoins. [64:20] Like I'm not the first memecoin, you [64:22] know, I'm like the 10 millionth [64:23] memecoin. [64:24] >> But what happened was this is that on [64:27] launch day within the first minutes the [64:31] a global leading market maker who had [64:36] over 1.5% of the coin for liquidity [64:41] only deployed $5,000 [64:45] into the into the market for liquidity [64:47] purposes. And so it went from we [64:51] launched at $50 million. That was our uh [64:54] that was our our our launch price. It [64:56] was significantly I mean low 50 million [64:59] and and within 3 minutes it went to $316 [65:04] billion because we only had 5 they only [65:06] put $5,000 [65:08] 30,000 coins into the liquidity pool [65:11] which made it impossible for anybody to [65:14] uh execute their trades. And then all [65:16] the which we knew is all the bots came [65:18] in. I think something like uh 85% of all [65:22] of the trades in that first moment were [65:23] were bots. But it drove the price up to [65:26] 200 billion and then up to $316 billion [65:30] market cap which is larger than the [65:31] market cap of Black Rockck. And then [65:34] within minutes it came down to to [65:36] >> but that's because they had a couple of [65:38] people put a few thousand in at these [65:41] high prices because there wasn't enough [65:42] liquidity to satisfy like more [65:44] reasonable [65:45] >> price and so what is the explanation of [65:48] which we are trying to get an answer to [65:50] of only putting they had one they had a [65:53] million dollars in cash [65:54] >> but available. Why would you create the [65:56] coin in the first place? Because in my [65:58] mind I'm like that a sounds like a [66:00] recipe for disaster and b like good luck [66:03] explaining that to to any audience aside [66:05] from our audience like our audience even [66:08] I understand like 5% of what you said I [66:12] don't get it [66:13] >> I I get it and defensible but people [66:15] won't get it. [66:16] >> Yeah. No, let me tell you why is this is [66:18] that I I read the internet of money and [66:21] from my own experience when I worked at [66:23] the UN uh US world food program and [66:27] believing in digital money micro uh uh [66:31] transactions and the idea that of the [66:34] democratization of finance. I truly [66:36] believe in the crypto community. I [66:38] believe in that. Okay. And what I [66:41] thought happened in the last election [66:42] was just a bastardization of and and a [66:46] taking advantage of an entire community [66:48] that is largely apolitical that is [66:50] almost in every respect libertarian in [66:52] the best sense of of the word. And I [66:55] just found that it was an incredibly [66:56] dynamic way to talk to a new audience. I [66:59] thought and I still do think and I think [67:01] that that's what we will achieve when uh [67:03] you know when this evens out which it's [67:05] not gone in in any in any way. there's [67:08] still value in the coin and there's [67:10] still value in the message. So, one of [67:12] the things I like that that like look of [67:15] like, oh, like why would you do this [67:16] anyway? Well, because like the millions [67:20] of people that are invested into this [67:22] economy is that I believed in it too and [67:24] I think that I can do it a different way [67:25] and I think that I can show that I can [67:27] do it. [67:27] >> From my perspective, it's like I've [67:29] never seen a memecoin launch successful [67:33] ever. [67:34] >> Well, number one, that's not necessarily [67:35] true. But what's been successful? [67:38] >> Well, I mean, Dogecoin's been [67:39] successful, [67:40] >> but that was never that was never [67:41] launched. That was launched as a bit of [67:43] a joke before memecoins became a thing. [67:45] And it that happened organically. Yeah. [67:47] But no, it didn't happen organically. [67:49] There was a launch. Every coin goes [67:51] through a launch. Okay. Is that what [67:53] didn't happen uh uh organically with us [67:56] is that we were on the centralized [67:58] exchanges or had commitments from [68:00] centralized exchanges 48 hours before. [68:03] That will alleviated all of this. And [68:05] after we announced that the coin would [68:08] be coming out in 48 hours, we got just [68:11] ravaged on uh crypto Twitter by uh [68:14] whether it was trolls or bots or you [68:16] know actual people. And we lost our um [68:19] uh we lost our listings on the [68:21] centralized exchanges at that time. And [68:23] so there was 1.5 million um uh tokens [68:27] available 1.5% uh 15.5 million tokens in [68:32] the um in the liquidity pool for this [68:34] market maker and instead of deploying [68:37] even if they had deployed uh 20% of it [68:40] or 10% of it instead they deployed less [68:43] than 1% of it and it completely ruined [68:46] the launch. Now we have a shot to [68:48] relaunch and make it meaningful and do [68:51] exactly what I said. But I here here's [68:53] the other side of it is this. Ultimately [68:56] the value of this coin I get to give [68:58] away to charity maybe anywhere from five [69:02] to let's say 20% depending upon the [69:05] prediction market aspect of it away [69:08] which even today under this scenario [69:11] over the course of of at least two years [69:13] I will get to give away millions of [69:16] dollars to charity all dedicated to uh [69:19] the uh recovery in it space. What other [69:22] project could I do that would remotely [69:26] um uh I'll I'll tell you that I think [69:29] you create your own podcast. [69:31] >> Yeah. Social media. [69:32] >> And because from my perspective, you [69:35] have just been on this like massive [69:37] comeback [69:38] >> where I've been seeing you everywhere, [69:41] clipped everywhere. You've come off [69:44] really likable, really just charismatic. [69:47] >> The humility is the thing that sticks [69:48] out to me. the fact that you went on [69:50] Matan Evan [69:51] >> and talk about anything [69:52] >> and just rolled with the punches [69:54] >> oh my gosh like I listened to I loved [69:57] the episode [69:58] >> and I feel like man if you just continue [70:01] in that trajectory it's so good [70:04] >> and that to me is like that seems [70:05] organic [70:06] >> that seems like you're having fun like [70:08] you don't have to be here like even when [70:10] you agree to do that I'm like really [70:12] >> that that's I I was like [70:14] >> we we're telling people yo we got we got [70:16] hunter coming and everyone's like no way [70:18] that's so Cool. So, to me, I'm like, [70:20] "Oh, yeah. Just continue doing that." [70:22] >> Yeah. Well, by the way, that's what I'm [70:23] going to continue to do [70:25] >> is this was one look, I'm taking a swing [70:27] in ways that I think are are from [70:30] anybody's perspective are risky. So, [70:33] from your perspective, it's like I like [70:35] you guys think it's cool. I went on [70:37] Matan. There's a whole audience out [70:39] there who is saying, "What the did you [70:41] go on Matan for?" Excuse my language. Or [70:44] by I mean, they are, right? And so there [70:46] is a [70:47] >> that's everyone who goes on Matan is [70:48] like [70:49] >> by the way why did you go so much to [70:51] lose nothing to gain nothing to gain and [70:53] in the same respect I have a whole [70:55] audience of people out there that say [70:56] why are you going to talk to Tucker [70:58] Carlson traitor you know you're a [71:00] traitor why did you talk to Candace [71:01] Owens and then there's a whole group of [71:04] people that say channel 5ahan [71:07] you know isn't that the guy that like [71:09] was filming backyard brawls in you know [71:12] out of his uh camper van you know what I [71:14] mean whereas I know it to very different [71:16] maybe because I'm a consumer of it in in [71:19] a um in a in a in a in a way that I [71:22] think is interesting to me but also this [71:25] is who else goes to go talk to those [71:27] people and that was the idea of the the [71:30] the crypto community and the reason to [71:32] immerse myself [71:33] >> the hard part is that now there is this [71:35] narrative out there that's like oh you [71:38] were doing all this like promotion to [71:41] lead up to this like crypto meme coin [71:44] >> cash out [71:46] of it. It's not here and I'm going to [71:48] stay here. And so that's not to it it [71:50] the reality and the truth. And by the [71:52] way, and sometimes perception becomes [71:55] reality, but not in the instance [71:56] [clears throat] of me. What I have found [71:57] is this is that I've been kicked in the [71:59] teeth about 500 times. I shouldn't be [72:02] here by all accounts by and by anybody's [72:05] um estimation before I went out on [72:07] Twitter in May of of this year. Didn't [72:10] have anything to do with cryptocurrency [72:12] or any any of that. I didn't go on [72:14] Candace Owens show with the intent and [72:17] idea that that's what, you know, this is [72:19] all about. This was something that I [72:22] thought was an opportunity and I still [72:24] do to talk to an entirely different [72:26] audience. When I talk to somebody that's [72:28] 40 years old about cryptocurrency or [72:31] about memecoins, I mean, their eyes [72:33] glaze over and they say it's all a [72:36] grift. When I talk to somebody who's [72:38] between the age of 18 and 30, it's a [72:40] very, very, very different thing. meme [72:43] culture in and of itself is not [72:44] something most people and that [72:46] understand, but it is a incredibly [72:49] powerful culture with in its in its own [72:52] silo that has I think ripple effects [72:55] across the board. And so I'm going to [72:58] try everything that I can and as long as [73:00] I do it in an ethical way, as long as I [73:02] do it in a way that I'm comfortable [73:04] with, because one of the other things is [73:06] this is that I know me for the first [73:09] time and uh you know I' I've gotten to [73:11] know me in a way and be comfortable and [73:13] confident in in in uh in my truth in a [73:17] way that most people don't ever have to [73:19] go through and being completely and [73:22] utterly shamed in the in on a global [73:25] scale. And so I agree with you is that [73:28] it was a risk. I took the risk. I I'm [73:31] absolutely certain that this is [73:34] ultimately at the end of the day going [73:35] to do exactly what I intended it for it [73:38] to do. And I get to tell that story, but [73:40] it's going to take a little bit of time. [73:42] >> So who made money and who lost money so [73:46] far with Laptop Coin? [73:48] >> Nobody made money. Nobody on the inside [73:50] has made any money. Um the the way that [73:53] it works is that the uh the 30% that is [73:57] dedicated to what you know quote unquote [73:59] insiders which is the uh people who hold [74:02] equity in the coin [74:04] cannot touch or uh their money for at [74:08] least 6 months and then invest over a [74:10] 2-year period of time. There's a [74:12] foundation, there's a liquidity pool, [74:14] and then there is the pull related to [74:16] the airdrop and the pull related to the [74:19] event burn, the prediction market side [74:21] of it. So, nobody on the inside has uh [74:24] has extracted any money from this. [74:26] >> But what about losing money? Like, did [74:28] you have any wallets that lost a lot of [74:30] money on the coin? Mostly like a couple [74:33] hundred, few thousand. [74:34] >> Yeah, exactly. And um right now what [74:36] we're doing, we're only 5 days in. So [74:38] right now what we're doing we have two [74:40] independent reports that are being done [74:41] and I'm going to figure out exactly um [74:44] uh who I think that and last I looked [74:47] one of the reports came back and 85% of [74:49] the of the trading that occurred in that [74:51] first hour in which any um uh [74:54] significant uh change of of capital and [74:57] hands happened was uh was through bots [75:01] um and so and mainly in Asia but we'll [75:04] be able to identify every every single [75:06] wallet and every single and hopefully um [75:09] do what we can to to yeah correct it. [75:12] >> This may be a very harsh opinion, but I [75:15] would just like to say that meme coins [75:17] are exactly like the emphasis on meme. [75:20] Like for the most part, you know what [75:22] you're getting [75:22] >> for every part. They're not an [75:24] investment like it's not even Oh, well, [75:27] by the way, [clears throat] [75:28] >> do not buy my coin is the line that I [75:30] used when I started out this thing. And [75:33] it is not an investment in any way. It's [75:36] like a trading card literally. [75:38] >> But if someone doesn't understand that a [75:42] >> who doesn't understand that the 90% of [75:44] the market is a bunch of deans that are [75:46] are uh literally and you know at to [75:51] trading [75:52] >> and that's [clears throat] what it is [75:52] and it's all about attention. It's who [75:54] can attain, sustain and maintain. I'm [75:57] thinking like is that the market you [75:58] want to go after is like dgens who are [76:00] just trying to like flip a [76:03] talk to an educated audience or [76:04] uneducated and and hopefully [76:06] >> I don't disagree. I don't disagree. What [76:08] I am saying is this is that I took a [76:10] shot and I think that I can still prove [76:12] my point as it relates to the coin. I [76:14] think that I can show that it can be [76:16] done differently. I think that I can [76:17] show that it can be a tool. I think that [76:19] it's a tool just like any hammer. You [76:22] can use it to build something or you can [76:23] use it to tear down something. And also [76:25] I can say this to you is this and I also [76:28] think it is a way in which you can build [76:31] community and do well and do good at the [76:33] same time if you do it the right way. [76:35] >> I agree. That's what I believe and and [76:36] the same rule applies to NFTTS. NFTs [76:39] were a tool but the way that the [76:41] community used NFTTS was somewhat [76:44] predatory. However, NFTs as an as a a [76:48] fundamental idea are actually really [76:51] interesting. they're really interesting [76:53] and there's a lot of value in that. It's [76:55] just the way that the community adopted [76:57] it and expressed that fundamental idea [76:59] and it's the exact same [77:00] >> parts of the community and that is the [77:01] exactly the growth phase that all of [77:04] cryptocurrency is in right now. So I [77:06] hear all of these people say, "Oh, this [77:08] is all a sham. This is all a scam." It's [77:10] like as if as if the dollar bill [77:13] [laughter] is anything but mean. [77:15] >> Okay, that's all right. And so and and [77:17] also, you know, like this idea, well, [77:19] what's it's a it's a way for people to [77:21] operate um anonymously in a black market [77:24] and in a criminal way. Well, as far as I [77:26] can remember is that no cryptocurrency [77:29] um uh or or anyone involved in [77:31] cryptocurrency was involved in the the [77:33] crash of 2008. I don't know of any [77:36] Lehman Brothers in cryptocurrency right [77:37] now. I also don't know of any city bank [77:39] that has been laundering the money for [77:42] organizations for, you know, however [77:44] long. And I by the way allegedly as it [77:47] [laughter] relate to that. Okay. I'm [77:48] >> really careful about not getting sued. [77:50] >> Yeah. No, exactly. But I really do mean [77:52] this in terms of like this idea of the [77:54] arrogance of fiat currency and the [77:56] establishment and banking. [77:59] Cryptocurrency has a future. I am not [78:01] the evangelist for it. But I am a [78:04] believer in it. I am a believer in the [78:06] idea that there's an entire generation [78:07] of people engaged in an economy that [78:10] most people my age don't even take a a [78:13] second glance at or understand. So you [78:15] asked me how do you in the future build [78:19] wealth in this environment in which you [78:21] are under that you have debt. Memecoin [78:23] is not the answer to that for me [78:25] understanding it understanding um it to [78:29] the degree and its relationship to uh to [78:32] the to the current economy in which I've [78:34] been talking to [78:36] >> whether it's you guys or whether it's [78:38] through a show like Matan or whether [78:41] it's through you know whatever audience [78:43] is out there. And so look is that also, [78:48] you know, kind of live and learn is one [78:50] of the things too is this is that uh [78:52] that we had no um uh optics into and [78:56] which you're not supposed to because [78:57] there's supposed to be a Chinese wall [78:58] with the with the market maker and you [79:01] know one up, you know, can ruin a [79:03] day, you know what I mean? And not only [79:05] ruin a day, but I now it's my [79:07] responsibility to make it good. And as [79:09] long as I'm just radically transparent [79:12] about it, which I plan to be and I am [79:15] being right now as much as I can be in [79:17] terms of getting the actual information [79:18] of what happened exactly and you know [79:21] make good where I can make good then you [79:23] know what I all the other stuff is not [79:26] even remotely off the table. [79:28] >> From what I see it does appear like the [79:31] best way out is through and with radical [79:34] transparency which it does appear that [79:36] you're providing. So, that's really good [79:38] because, you know, I I didn't nec I [79:40] didn't think that this was a cash grab [79:42] from the beginning. I thought, you know, [79:43] obviously there's there's a chance that [79:44] it is. [79:45] >> Um, but I tend to believe the people [79:48] that are willing to sit down in front of [79:50] us and answer all of the questions with [79:53] potentially millions of people watching. [79:55] >> Exactly. [79:56] >> And and before the podcast when we ask [79:58] you, hey, is there anything off limits? [79:59] You say, [80:00] >> nah, [80:00] >> nothing. Nothing. [80:02] >> Nothing. And I answer every single [80:03] question that I possibly can. And um and [80:07] I just know this too, the coin is [80:10] stabilized. There is a an assurance that [80:13] it is stabilized and that we can [80:15] actually pro uh do what we intended to [80:17] do with the coin and uh and make good if [80:20] there was anything to make good about. [80:22] But to uh but it all came down to that [80:25] one market maker, one decision and it [80:28] was hard not to see how it was almost [80:30] not intentional. And I'm not saying that [80:31] it was it was gross negative. [80:32] >> But could you see before launching that [80:34] they only had Oh, because you can't see [80:36] into that. So that when you're sitting [80:38] on the other side, the market makers [80:40] like a black box [80:41] >> and um and there are several market [80:44] makers that you use, they had all of the [80:46] liquidity and we're providing that [80:48] liquidity to other market makers. And [80:50] there was the whole thing. And so when [80:52] we were sitting there just looking at [80:53] our screens and you see this, just think [80:55] about this. There there's never been a [80:58] coin ever that hit $316 billion market [81:01] cap anywhere. We launched at 50 million. [81:04] We're at a I don't know 200 million FTV [81:07] right now. So if that had been our [81:10] trajectory, it would this would have [81:12] been a great success, right? But it in [81:16] 10 minute it didn't just do a Christmas [81:18] tree. It did a Mount Everest and then it [81:22] came all the way back down. But it was [81:24] literally [81:26] that um spike happened in like a minutes [81:31] minutes of the of the coin launch. how [81:33] much volume then was actually transacted [81:36] during that time period. [81:37] >> Hey, by the way, really quick, if you [81:39] want extra content just like this, as [81:41] well as early access and a bonus post [81:43] show posted every single week, feel free [81:45] to join as a channel member to get [81:47] immediate access to all of that as well [81:49] as early access to everything else that [81:51] we post along with priority responses to [81:54] all of your comments. So, if that sounds [81:55] cool, feel free to join. Would love to [81:57] have you on board. Thanks so much. We'll [81:59] get back to the podcast now. How much [82:01] volume then was actually transacted [82:03] during that time? [82:04] >> Very little period. [82:05] >> Very little. Like you could have made a [82:06] $10, you know, purchase of the coin and [82:08] it sent it up $30 billion. I mean, [82:11] literally. [laughter] [82:12] >> See, that's I I it makes sense [82:15] mathematically. It's just I don't envy [82:16] you because you now need to explain [82:18] yourself out of that. [82:19] >> Exactly. And by the way, and like you [82:21] said, nobody's nobody has an interest in [82:23] understanding liquidity and how a [82:25] liquidity pool too complicated. Barely, [82:28] right? Nobody. You have people that are [82:30] bidding and you have people that are [82:32] asking. Those are the people that are [82:33] willing to pay a certain price and [82:35] willing to sell at a certain price and [82:37] then you have this money that makes the [82:38] transaction actually occur. Now, if [82:41] there's not enough money to make the [82:42] transaction occur, then like if someone [82:45] Yeah. If someone puts a market order at [82:48] a buy, but there's no money that [82:49] fulfills it and there's no one that's [82:51] necessarily selling it, then like the [82:53] price can spike. It can go down. And so, [82:56] basically, it's it's like the the lube [82:57] of an engine. If that's absent, Why do [82:59] you why do you coin and it went to $75 [83:02] billion? Just remember this. Trumpcoin [83:05] has lost 95% of its value. Does anybody [83:08] sit here and ask Don and Eric of why [83:10] they would ever get involved in this? [83:12] And they took out 80% max extraction 3.9 [83:16] but they don't give a and what I was [83:18] trying to do was show that you could do [83:19] it the exact opposite. I wanted it to be [83:22] the specific troll of how they have [83:25] taken over industries and and and ideas [83:28] and and made them theirs and then Max [83:31] extracted from them and done the exact [83:33] opposite of of uh of what they said that [83:36] they were going to do, you know. And so [83:38] I may have had all these high fallutin [83:40] reasons of doing it of doing it. Bottom [83:42] line is this. In 3 minutes, the coin [83:45] went from $50 million where we intended [83:48] to launch it. And because of literally [83:50] singular trades that could have been [83:52] anywhere from a dollar to to $100, send [83:55] it billions of dollars, higher than any [83:58] any any other coin, I think, by a factor [84:00] of of of several has ever traded, ever [84:04] had a market. [84:05] >> I would be excited to hear your third [84:06] party investigations into the matter. If [84:08] you publish that, I think I will also [84:10] what I will do is I'll give them to you [84:11] guys. I'll come back. I'm also very [84:12] curious through them. Yeah. [84:14] >> What was going through your mind when [84:15] you saw it go? [84:17] [laughter] [84:18] >> That's what was going through my mind. [84:20] >> You should have done like a live stream [84:21] launch. [84:22] >> Literally the smile turned [84:23] >> by the way. No, literally it was that [84:25] >> because for the first like what the B [84:28] the first two minutes you must have just [84:29] thought like like you know the truly [84:31] truly truly experienced people that are [84:33] part of this. They were sitting there [84:34] going like and I'm like [84:36] >> what like how is what [84:39] >> you know? And it was just the most [84:43] infuriating because by the way the whole [84:44] thing was that when I started this I [84:46] said the only way that I'm doing this is [84:48] that if no one ever could accuse me of [84:50] doing a rugpool and so we built [84:52] everything into the tokconomics of it so [84:55] that you could never [84:56] >> but I feel like that's what everyone [84:57] says and then it's somehow it's just [84:59] like [84:59] >> by the way name me one other person [85:01] [clears throat] that has gone through [85:02] this that you know a celebrity that is [85:04] >> probably the hawk tuo was like the last [85:05] one and it seemed like she was like she [85:08] disappeared and the only reason to get [85:10] back is Like she's funny, but my my [85:12] point is is that there were people that [85:14] extracted from her coin. She was not [85:16] involved in her coin. She got duped and [85:18] conned by a bunch of people. I did not [85:20] look man, I didn't get duped and conned [85:21] by anybody. I went into this with full [85:24] eyes wide open exactly what I was trying [85:26] to tend to do. And by the way, and still [85:28] have the coin still sits at the value [85:31] that I wanted it to launch at. It holds [85:33] that value. We have a two years of of [85:37] prediction market um of predictions to [85:39] to burn coins. We still have over 10% of [85:42] the coin to be able to airdrop to to [85:44] community. I still have an enormous [85:46] amount of the of the value of the coin [85:48] to be able to give away to charity. [85:50] Look, that's it. The proof is in the [85:52] pudding. the the the and the and the [85:55] pudding is it the ingredients have to be [85:58] an afteraction report an independent um [86:00] study what happened in that 316 [86:03] >> to see how many wallets were affected by [86:05] it you know was it [86:06] >> I promise you I guarantee you I will I [86:08] will come back or I'll you guys will be [86:10] some of the first I will send the [86:11] reports to and I'm and by the way that's [86:13] not like like four months from now I [86:16] mean that's like the end of this week. [86:18] >> Oh wow. [86:18] >> Yeah. [86:18] >> Yeah. Text it over. Actually, we could [86:20] just put it in the description. We could [86:22] link to the report in the description of [86:23] the video if you guys would like to see [86:25] it. [86:25] >> Absolutely. Radical [86:26] >> transparency. I could upload it to [86:27] Claude so I understand what it means. [86:29] >> Exactly. By the and that, by the way, [86:32] one of the reasons that we were able to [86:33] figure that out is exactly that is [86:35] because Aerodome gave us their initial [86:38] report of exactly what happened and we [86:40] were able to feed it into Claude and [86:42] give it into a granular level of exactly [86:44] what happened and that's the and that's [86:46] what was fed out of it. I'm surprised by [86:48] your seemingly like understanding. [86:50] >> Oh yeah. I don't even understand crypto [86:52] and stuff like that and even like [86:53] knowledge on the Hawkua coin. [laughter] [86:55] You know, [86:56] >> I knew all the coins because I looked [86:57] into every one of them and I wanted to [86:59] know exactly what happened. You know, [87:01] one of the things that had happened was [87:03] the Eric Adams coin and what you [87:04] figuring out Eric Adams launched a coin [87:06] and he did this that and the other thing [87:08] and then it it went to zero within 72 [87:10] hours. And I said like okay like what [87:13] are the mechanics of that? Why did that [87:16] happen? Did somebody fully extract? And [87:18] it turns out I believe allegedly someone [87:20] extracted within the within the first in [87:23] from the inside. It became clear that [87:25] the coin went to zero. So how do you [87:27] build a coin that does what coins were [87:30] intended to do? Tokens were intended to [87:32] do in terms of building something and [87:33] not max extracting. And that's what we [87:35] did. [87:36] >> Well, it seems like the best meme coins [87:38] though are not associated with a person. [87:40] Like I'm thinking recently it was like [87:41] pawns [87:43] >> was one of those meme coins shot up. But [87:46] when it's like there's not a person, [87:48] it's not a thing. It just somehow [87:50] >> appears one day and then some groups get [87:53] a hold of it and they're like [87:54] >> maybe I got a little bit um ahead of [87:56] myself as being an idea and not just a [87:58] person. And the idea is this is the idea [88:02] of of u resilience, recovery, [88:04] redemption. The idea that we all get to [88:07] tell our own stories that we don't have [88:09] to live in the narratives that have been [88:11] written for us. That's the idea. You [88:13] guys ask me why I'm doing this is not [88:15] just a coin in any way. The larger [88:18] picture of this is that I would like to [88:22] build something. I think it's important. [88:24] I know that it's important in terms of [88:26] my my future to have a financial future [88:28] that goes along with it for my family, [88:30] for my uh for for my children. Um but [88:35] for me too in order to be able to make [88:37] independent decisions to do the things [88:39] that matter to me that's important but [88:42] really what is the why I spend this much [88:44] time talking about this is because I [88:48] know I have one thing that I am uh uh [88:52] eminently qualified to talk to other [88:54] people about and that's how about [88:56] surviving that's how to make it through [89:00] how to walk through the fire about the [89:04] idea that you know what, you may get [89:06] knocked down, but it truly in life is [89:09] all about how you get back up. And so I [89:12] look at this thing as that I look at, [89:14] look, I took a swing. I had the exact [89:17] right intentions. I promise you I'll be [89:19] able to show that in every single way. [89:21] And now I got to get back up. I took a [89:23] punch in the face on this one, but it's [89:25] not the first time. And and it's not [89:27] like I'm I'm happy that it happened, [89:29] >> but I know that that is something that [89:32] is uh uh that I just can't walk away [89:36] from things anymore and act as if they [89:38] did not happen or that I was duped or [89:41] that you know somebody un you know [89:43] nefarious like you know it there is no [89:46] excuse. There's an explanation out there [89:49] but ultimately at the end of the day [89:51] everything that happens is my [89:53] responsibility. What sort of financial [89:55] goals do you have for your own life? [89:58] >> My immediate financial goal would be to [90:01] uh to make good on um the debts that I [90:05] owe. That's number one. Is um is to uh [90:10] is to have the capacity to um to come to [90:14] terms with the people that I [90:16] legitimately owe money to um for my [90:19] defense over that period of time. How [90:20] how does that relationship look today [90:23] with those people? [90:24] >> Oh, with most of them it's great. It [90:26] it's they've been very understanding and [90:28] and and been willing to work with me um [90:31] on that and believe in me and believe in [90:33] the idea that uh that that I that I will [90:36] do exactly that. But number two is not I [90:40] have no interest in in um in things. Not [90:45] that I don't like things like I was [90:47] talking about Nico um Leonard in [90:49] watches. I love watches, you know. I [90:51] mean, I don't wear this a Timex as like [90:53] a statement because I only wear a Timex, [90:55] you know. I mean, I love a Rolex. I I'm [90:57] not saying that I don't like nice [90:58] things, but that's not my goal. And [91:01] maybe it's because of what I've gone [91:03] through and where I've been to. My goal [91:06] is to be able to have and live in an [91:08] environment in which I can nurture the [91:11] the the the most important relationships [91:14] that I have and that's with my family [91:16] beginning with Melissa and Bo and my [91:18] daughters and to have an adequate space [91:21] that you're not spending all of your [91:24] time like wondering what you're going to [91:26] do at the end of the month. Um that's [91:29] it. That's really it. [91:30] >> Does investing play a role in that? Do [91:32] you ask? [91:33] >> Well, I I hope that it would. I I really [91:35] hope that it would, but um I have to get [91:38] there first. I have to get to the space [91:41] where there's any opportunity of any [91:44] dollar that I make uh going to anything [91:49] other than um uh my immediate um uh uh [91:53] obligations right now. [91:55] >> So, what is your current like monthly [91:57] expenses? I imagine that you could sell [91:59] your art and like cover that and then [92:01] some, [92:02] >> you know. [92:03] >> Yeah. Like Yeah. I mean, I'm I'm I'm I'm [92:06] working on it, you know what I mean? and [92:07] and um and just remember is that [92:10] literally truly it's just like this is [92:12] the the only opportunity for me to be [92:15] able to do this in a in any um [92:18] meaningful way just started like 16 [92:20] months ago, [92:21] >> you know, and I'm working on it and I [92:23] and uh and right now um I'm I am a able [92:28] to do the things that I need to be able [92:30] to do to cover my obligations to people [92:32] that I need to cover my obligations to [92:34] to take care of the family, put food on [92:36] the table, [92:37] and um and pay the rent. [92:39] >> Do you have a financial adviser or any [92:41] sort of money manager? [92:42] >> No, not not technically, but but I but I [92:45] do have uh people that I trust very much [92:48] that have been very helpful in in in [92:50] advising me. [92:52] >> Do you have any concerns about the [92:53] future of the US economy? [92:55] >> I have Oh, yeah. [92:58] >> What do you think is the biggest issue [92:59] right now? [92:59] >> $40 trillion in in in debt. [93:02] >> What do you think that comes from? I [93:04] think 35% of the more than that comes [93:08] from uh one presidency and that's this [93:10] one and over the the two presidencies. [93:13] But you can't blame all of the debt on [93:15] any single president. I think that it is [93:18] unwillingness for us to really look at [93:20] the at at uh very uncomfortable and [93:23] unpopular um things that would [93:26] potentially need to be done in order for [93:28] us to live in our means. Now remember, I [93:30] mean, [sighs] [93:32] you know, part of it is about revenue, [93:35] but um uh but the other part of it is [93:38] about uh the way in which we um uh [93:42] address entitlements and and at some [93:45] point we're going to have to be able to [93:47] uh reconcile uh the two or or not and [93:51] and face the consequences of that. [93:53] >> What do you think are the top three [93:54] things that would need to change in [93:56] order to stabilize the US debt? Number [93:59] one is to uh is to uh come to terms with [94:05] uh how we are going to continue to [94:08] organize and and run our entitlement [94:10] programs. Number two, you know, there's [94:13] this whole push from progressives about, [94:17] you know, a a very easy catchphrase, tax [94:20] the billionaires. Tax the billionaires. [94:22] Well, the fact of the matter is is that [94:26] when most people associate taxes, they [94:28] associate it with the income tax, which [94:29] is the largest driver of revenue in with [94:32] the federal government. Billionaires [94:33] don't pay income tax. And not because [94:35] they're cheats on their taxes, but [94:37] because they take advantage of the [94:39] system as it exists. And you know, I [94:41] mean, Elon Musk pays him famously pays [94:44] himself no salary. You know, Jeff Bezos [94:46] pays himself $100,000. Why would you uh [94:50] pay yourself a salary to be taxed in [94:53] normal income? So taxing the income of [94:56] billionaires, it is um is meaningless. [94:58] Now, that being said, too, is that, you [95:01] know, I think people don't truly [95:03] understand that out of 350 million [95:06] Americans, there's only 984 families [95:08] that are truly billionaires and they pay [95:10] no income taxes. Have you guys read [95:12] which is an incredible book and I and I [95:14] suggest that you read it? It's called [95:16] the second estate and it's by this uh [95:18] professor who is a tax expert and she [95:21] talks about how we're dangerously coming [95:24] close to a to a a society that very much [95:28] resembles France in the uh late 1700s [95:32] early 1800s in which you had what they [95:35] called the second estate is that you had [95:37] the king but then you had the feudal [95:38] that it basically they had created a [95:41] system by which they were not taxed by [95:43] the by the king and they passed all of [95:46] those taxes down to working people and [95:49] um and right now the vast majority of [95:52] taxes fall on the 99%. [95:55] So think about it. [95:56] >> Well, I thought the bottom 50% pays [95:59] pretty much nothing in tax. [96:01] >> Well, here's the thing though. Between [96:03] 99% What do you think that the the uh uh [96:07] that would put you in the top 1% of [96:10] income earners in the United States? [96:12] >> 700,000. [96:13] >> That's exactly right. $750,000. [96:16] >> $750,000. [96:19] And I don't uh believe that most people [96:21] think what we we all know is that the [96:25] the chasm between $750,000 [96:28] as your income and uh and a billion is [96:32] from not, you know, here not to the [96:36] moon, it's here to Pluto. [96:38] >> Yeah. [96:38] >> And so it's not about income tax. And [96:42] many people have these aspirations and [96:44] they think look you know I don't tax the [96:46] rich I want to be rich one day you know [96:49] I want to make a million dollars I want [96:50] to make $5 million I want to make $10 [96:52] million the difference between doing [96:54] that in income and having a you know a [96:58] billion dollars in wealth is you know [97:01] two very very different worlds. So how [97:02] do you tax wealth and it's a really [97:05] tricky thing because you need to tax [97:07] wealth. Wouldn't wouldn't someone then [97:10] say, "Well, why don't we get our [97:12] spending under control first and then [97:13] figure out how much we need?" [97:15] >> Because here's the thing about that. [97:16] Think about the politics of that. [97:17] Getting our spending under control. All [97:19] right. What what in every situation, of [97:23] course, you should get your spending [97:24] under control. You know, a bunch of [97:26] Democrats did it. My dad reduced the [97:28] deficit for for the first time in uh I [97:31] don't know how how many uh presidencies. [97:33] Bill Clinton bal famously balanced the [97:36] budget with the Democratic Congress. Do [97:38] you know what I mean? So getting our [97:40] spending under control is obviously [97:43] something that's really important. But [97:45] the way in which they went about it in [97:46] this past uh you know two years is is [97:50] asinine. I mean like take for instance [97:52] like the the whole uh Doge push. You [97:55] know Doge you know ended USAD. You know [97:58] how much money we spent on USAD and as a [98:01] percentage of the budget? Less than 3%. [98:03] >> So I thought and again I could be [98:05] misinformed here, but I thought in terms [98:07] of ending it, it wasn't ending it. It [98:09] was just annotating exactly what the [98:12] funds were using. [98:13] >> No, they ended it. It's over. USAD [98:16] basically all of the uh uh all of the [98:18] organizations that were uh funded by [98:21] USAD that promulgated anything from the [98:24] PEPAR program that saved 20 million [98:26] lives around the world to enormous [98:28] amount of good that we've done over in [98:30] the world since its inception in uh you [98:33] know 50 years ago is gone is effectively [98:36] gone [98:36] >> and I'll put it up if I'm incorrect here [98:38] I'll I'll note that I'm incorrect I [98:39] thought Elon said that he wasn't ending [98:41] it he just wanted to annotate what the [98:43] funds were used for and if they agreed [98:46] to publicly disclose exactly where the [98:48] funds went, he was all for it. [98:50] >> He said that and that's not true. 100% [98:53] he 100% say say that and I can show you [98:55] where it is absolutely not the truth is [98:58] that we had I don't know how many [99:00] thousands of workers that were in [99:01] subsaharan Africa um that work for US ID [99:04] distributing these programs that were [99:06] critical to the you know to so many [99:09] people and saving so many lives. And [99:11] then there's this whole argument that he [99:13] says, "Oh, well, you know, it was all, [99:14] you know," Joe Rogan says, "Oh, what, [99:16] you know, it was all CIA fronts and, you [99:18] know, intelligence operations and they [99:20] were, you know, funneling money into [99:22] you, you know, uh, my my point about [99:25] that is, yeah, [99:27] >> well, what if some of it was? What do [99:29] you how do you think we got information [99:32] and intelligence in places in the world [99:34] where no other plbody could have ever [99:36] gone?" I work for the US UN war food [99:39] program as chairman of the board of [99:40] that. We were responsible for the $2.6 [99:42] billion, 60% of the UN World Food [99:45] Programs budget, the largest [99:47] humanitarian organization in the world. [99:48] We fed 70 million pe uh 75 million [99:52] people in 80 different countries around [99:53] the world on a daily basis where every [99:56] single major hot spot in uh in in the [99:59] world at at day one from whether it's [100:02] refugee crisis created by or a tsunami [100:06] in um in the Philippines. And you know [100:09] who is there first? Who is there first? [100:13] USA ID with boxes and boxes of material [100:16] and and and food for these people in [100:19] which it says a gift from the American [100:20] people on every one of them. It was the [100:22] most important soft diplomacy that we [100:25] had as a nation. [100:26] >> Why would they want to end the programs? [100:29] >> Because I think that he had an enormous [100:32] distrust and and uh dislike for for [100:34] programs like USAD. I don't think that [100:37] he uh um believes in them. I don't think [100:40] that he believes that as he said [100:42] famously said is that the thing that is [100:44] the most um you know corrosive thing in [100:47] American culture is the idea of empathy. [100:50] Remember when he said that and I think [100:52] that that's because what he believes and [100:54] I also think that he believes that [100:56] that's because he could at that time is [100:58] that they were almost on power. And [101:00] what's the lowest hanging fruit? [101:02] Everybody always says, "Well, you're [101:04] spending money over there and why aren't [101:06] you spending it on the homeless people [101:07] over here?" Well, I think we're a great [101:09] nation. I think that we can do both. And [101:12] I think that we need to do both because [101:15] it's our responsibility as a great [101:16] nation to be able to do both. I think [101:19] that it is in our interest to be the [101:22] benefactors of people that no other [101:25] people stand up for in in the world. I [101:28] think it's the greatest power of the [101:30] United States of America is the idea of [101:32] who we are. [101:35] And right now, who are we? All it seems [101:38] to me is we're dropping and we're not [101:41] dropping uh uh you know uh food and [101:44] medicine in any way. [101:45] >> That sounded like a campaign speech to [101:47] me. [101:49] >> I saw the hands with the thumbs kind of [101:51] right here. I know that's kind of the [101:52] way [101:52] >> I started to do my bullet point. [101:54] >> Oh my gosh. [101:55] >> You gave me away. [laughter] No, it's [101:57] something I care deeply about. [101:59] >> Yeah, I care deeply about. [102:01] >> All right. Unfortunately, we are in a [102:03] strong time constraint, so we would love [102:06] to do a part two at some time. Love to, [102:09] but we're going to do rapid fire [102:11] questions to kick this uh to an end. Do [102:14] you own a single stock? [102:16] >> No. [102:18] >> I know. [102:19] >> That was like being dropped right there. [102:22] That's crazy. Can I let us like send you [102:24] a stock? [102:25] >> Oh my gosh. I can send you a stock. [102:26] >> Of course. Yeah. [102:27] >> They can't send a stock. Open up. I will [102:30] give you the money to buy a stock. [102:31] >> Yeah. [102:32] >> You tell me the stock and I'll and I'll [102:35] and I'll find the money to put into [102:36] >> buy like one share of Apple. [102:37] >> Okay. [102:38] >> You know, not advice. That's crazy. I'll [102:41] I'll give you the money, [102:42] >> right? [102:43] >> Okay. What was the biggest surprise that [102:45] you've seen at the White House? how uh [102:49] dedicated [102:51] the uh the the staff that remains with [102:55] the White House are most wonderful [102:56] people in the world. It was maybe not a [102:59] surprise, but they [103:01] they made it a beautiful experience to [103:03] be there and they they stay through [103:05] administration to administration [103:07] >> and they show no sort of [103:09] >> No, they're wonderful wonderful people [103:12] and just incredibly dedicated to the [103:13] idea of the of the honor of every anyone [103:16] to ever walk through those doors. They [103:19] they're just really really really cool, [103:21] beautiful people. [103:22] >> I want a specific answer for this. What [103:24] is your one least favorite thing about [103:26] Trump? his his cruelty [103:29] his cruelty. [103:30] >> One specific example of that [103:32] >> the way in which he particularly talks [103:35] to uh female reporters really really [103:39] really really bothers me. [103:41] >> Yeah. [103:42] >> What is the one thing that you admire [103:44] most about Trump? [103:46] >> His tenacity. [103:47] >> Anything specific? He has taken um [103:52] uh [103:55] delusional thinking [103:58] [laughter] [103:58] to a to an art form that is um that is [104:04] almost hard not to admire. I give you an [104:07] example. I really do think that he [104:09] thinks that he's 6'3, weighs 225 lbs. [104:12] >> What do you think he actually is? [104:13] >> I think he's probably more like 6 feet [104:15] and probably weighs 280. I mean uh and [104:18] maybe 275 if you know but but it's [104:23] amazing how much that he is um [104:27] self-diluted in in things to the degree [104:29] that he makes into a reality. [104:31] >> Can you do a Trump impression? [104:33] >> No, I can't. [laughter] [104:37] I'm not going to try. [104:39] >> What's the cheapest thing about you? [104:42] >> Probably um clothes. [104:44] >> What brand is that shirt? [104:46] >> Levis's. I don't even know. I think [104:47] Melissa bought me this. I love that. [104:49] >> Yeah. Yeah. [104:50] >> What's your biggest insecurity? [104:51] >> Uh, almost every one of the true [104:54] insecurities [104:55] I got to lay down [104:58] um over the course of the last seven [105:00] years in rebuilding my life. And uh I [105:03] would have said before that you were [105:05] going to find out about my secrets. My [105:07] biggest insecurity would be that that [105:09] you would have found out I was not just [105:12] an my biggest insecurity would have been [105:14] that you found out that I was in motel [105:16] rooms with people that you don't want to [105:18] be in motel rooms with. But every single [105:22] one of my secrets has been exposed. [105:26] >> So it's almost a blessing. [105:27] >> It was one of the greatest blessings of [105:29] my life. [105:30] >> Saved my life. [105:31] >> When's the last time you cried? Last [105:33] night I was watching Lioness and they [105:37] found Joe. Do you guys watch Lioness? [105:39] >> No, I don't know what the I don't know [105:41] what you're talking about. That's [105:42] amazing. I don't know what it is, but [105:44] >> Well, everybody will know Lioness is a [105:45] show on Paramount. It's one of the um [105:48] Zoe's and she was and they found her. [105:52] >> I was good. [105:53] >> Was overwhelmed. [105:54] >> And lastly, [105:55] >> I cry all the time. [105:57] >> If you had this amount of money, you [105:59] would feel financially free. So, I [106:02] watched you with John umgan. [106:04] [clears throat] [106:04] John Morgan. Yeah. I' I' I'd say half [106:07] that. I need half that. What he said, [106:09] remember$ 30 million in a paid off [106:11] house. [106:11] >> $30 million in a paid off house. I I can [106:14] do with maybe a a uh [106:17] >> I guess, you know, a third of that in a [106:19] paid off house. [106:20] >> That's a great number. That's what a lot [106:22] of people say. A lot of people say is 10 [106:24] in a paidoff house. [106:24] >> Yeah. [106:25] >> Yeah. [106:26] >> Yeah. [106:26] >> Cool. All right. Well, Hunter, thank you [106:28] so much for coming on the Ice Coffee [106:30] Hour. This was an honor. Such an honor. [106:32] >> No, mine. I'd love you guys. So, thanks. [106:34] >> I'm coming back. [106:35] >> Yes, we would love to have you back on. [106:37] >> Okay. All right. [106:38] >> Thank you guys so much for watching. All [106:40] of his information will be linked down [106:41] below in the description, including the [106:43] gallery. [106:44] >> So, if you want to check it out, you [106:46] know where to find it. Thank you so much [106:48] for watching. Till next time. [106:49] >> This something that the left is [106:50] fundamentally right about that the right [106:52] does not want to acknowledge. [106:54] >> Nothing. [106:56] >> Get the out OF MY FACE. GO TO HELL. [106:58] >> AND WHO THE HELL LETS YOU back on THIS [107:00] CAMPUS? [107:01] >> GOOD LUCK BECAUSE THEY DON'T GIVE A [107:03] >> How difficult is it to change someone's [107:05] mind? [107:07] >> Depends. [107:08] >> You ass you. [107:10] >> So I have plenty of friends. I'm fine [107:12] having a few enemies. They're all in the [107:13] same room. They're all going to the same [107:15] parties. And when they all share the [107:17] same world [music] view, it's a blind [107:19] spot. [107:19] >> How much money have you lost by not [107:22] being PC? [107:24] >> Many tens of millions of dollars. I've [107:26] had people say that I was a hate speaker [107:28] because I said soccer was [107:29] >> I do. I think so. [107:31] >> What political beliefs have you changed [107:32] your mind on? [107:33] >> I don't know that anyone has ever [107:34] actually convinced me to take a more [107:37] left position. [107:37] >> Who's been the most intelligent person [107:39] you've debated? [107:39] >> People aren't going to like this answer. [107:48] >> Hey, how about this? If that wasn't [107:50] enough, you get our next episode as well [107:52] for a limited time. So, if you join as a [107:54] channel member, you get now two of our [107:57] following episodes right now to watch. [107:59] Our next one's actually with Joshua [108:00] Weissman. So, if you want the preview of [108:02] that, here you go. Enjoy. So, you [108:04] started out as an overweight teenager [108:06] who loved food and now you're shredded, [108:08] rich, successful YouTuber with 10 [108:10] million subscribers. How much time is [108:12] realistically needed to get to like a [108:14] decently impressive home chef? I didn't [108:16] go to culinary school. I [music] worked [108:17] in restaurants in real life scenarios [108:19] learning real life techniques and [108:21] tricks. Where's the lamb? [108:24] >> What's the worst thing you've seen [108:25] [music] in a restaurant? [108:26] >> State officials today looking to address [108:28] the growing issue of substance abuse [108:30] within the restaurant and hospitality [108:32] industry. [music] [108:32] >> There have been people that I've worked [108:33] with that were like addicted and then [108:35] one day they just disappeared. [108:37] >> Someone was standing up with their chef [108:39] knife. [music] The person stood up and [108:40] turned into their knife. They got rushed [108:42] to the hospital, got stitched up, went [108:44] back to service. How much money do you [108:45] think your restaurant's going to make? I [108:47] have no idea. I mean, how much does [108:49] Gordon Ramsay make on [music] his [108:50] restaurant? It's like $200 million a [108:51] year. This is my new restaurant which [108:52] officially opens today and it's called [108:54] Ben & Linds. What's the most you've ever [108:56] paid for a meal? [108:57] >> One of the most expensive ones was for [108:58] you guys. [108:59] >> I wouldn't say it's phenomenal. [109:00] >> Not my cup of tea. It's too buttery. [109:02] >> Buttery buttery. What is the biggest [109:05] mistake that you have [music] made? [109:12] [music] [109:18] >> [music]