```mermaid
flowchart LR
accTitle: Lop Nur Solo Trek and Rescue Tracking
accDescr: Diagram showing Lei Diansheng walking with wolf pack following and rescue team trailing.
subgraph S1["雷殿生徒步前行"]
A["雷殿生徒步单人行进"]
end
subgraph S2["潜伏尾随"]
B["群狼平行尾随<br/>（距离极近/夜宿帐外）"]
end
subgraph S3["后方救援搜寻"]
C["救援越野车循迹追踪<br/>（累计追踪90余公里）"]
end
C -->|"发现狼足迹与人足迹重合"| B
B -->|"引擎声惊走狼群（仅距数百米）"| A
```
```mermaid
flowchart TD
accTitle: Analysis of Fatal Hazards in Lop Nur Expeditions
accDescr: Chart outlining the contributing factors behind the deaths and disappearances of explorers like Peng Jiamu and Yu Chunshun.
subgraph Hazards["罗布泊客观环境凶险"]
H1["雅丹地貌易坍塌掩埋"]
H2["非法盗采金矿者出没危害安全"]
H3["极端高温与酷暑脱水"]
end
subgraph Psychology["遇险者主观致命链条"]
P1["轻微路线偏差迷途"]
P2["身体中暑/机能衰竭"]
P3["心理防线崩溃引发绝望"]
end
```mermaid
flowchart LR
accTitle: Lop Nur Location Relationships
accDescr: Spatial relationships of landmarks around the Lop Nur center point visited by Lei Diansheng.
subgraph Landmarks["罗布泊核心区域参照"]
A["罗布泊湖心标志碑"] -->|"约3-5 km"| B["余纯顺墓"]
A -->|"约20 km"| C["楼兰古城遗址"]
end
```
```mermaid
flowchart TD
accTitle: Ecological Destruction and Encounter Flow
accDescr: Causes and dangerous confrontations during environmental documentation on the road.
A["家乡呼兰河生态恶化触动"] --> B["确立徒步主题：环保与民俗考察"]
B --> C["目睹江河源头污染与恶性盗伐松树"]
B --> D["暗中拍摄盗猎分子活剥藏羚羊"]
D --> E["相机闪光灯意外暴露遭枪托围殴追杀"]
```
```mermaid
flowchart TD
accTitle: 雷殿生十年行前筹备流程
accDescr: 展示雷殿生在体能、负重及医疗预防等方面的十年筹备历程
subgraph 体能淬炼
A["每日基础力量训练<br/>(2000个仰卧起坐 + 800个俯卧撑)"]
B["每日耐力长跑"]
end
subgraph 极限模拟
C["阶梯式沙袋负重跑<br/>(30斤逐步提升至70斤 / 10公里)"]
end
subgraph 医疗预防
D["预见野外突发急症风险<br/>(吸取前人阑尾炎遇险教训)"]
E["提供16份相关证明"]
F["行前两个月主动切除健康阑尾"]
end
A --> C
B --> C
C --> D
D --> E --> F
```
```mermaid
flowchart TD
accTitle: 绝境生还与寻访村庄流程
accDescr: 雷殿生在野外以生蛇充饥、辨别兽道寻路并最终在深山村庄获得补给的经历。
subgraph Survival["野外绝境求生"]
A["柴草湿透无法生火"] --> B["刮刀切片生蛇肉撒盐"]
B --> C["蛇肉神经跳动下硬咽"]
C --> D["半小时后恢复体力"]
end
subgraph Navigation["辨识山林踪迹"]
D --> E["辨别路迹（排除挂毛兽道）"]
E --> F["徒步近两天发现深山村庄"]
end
subgraph Village["进村获取补给"]
F --> G["村民惊吓避走、闭门不纳"]
G --> H["出示科考证件与照片消除敌意"]
H --> I["购得啤酒罐头与泡面饱腹"]
end
```
[01:05:23](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR42ViYAcaQ&t=3923s) Leveraging Strengths, Preparation, and Laozi's Wisdom
Lei Diansheng reflects humbly on learning from others, pointing out that the guests and host possess a depth of knowledge and cultural background that he could never match. He explains his core personal philosophy: an individual must maximize their unique strengths and work around their weaknesses, just as a team, family, or company must complement each other. Forcing someone to become a scientist or an astronaut when they are not cut out for it is pointless; instead, one should focus on doing the one thing they truly love to the absolute limit. Life, Lei emphasizes, is entirely about the experience itself rather than obsessing over or blaming fate for the harvest.
To illustrate this, Lei quotes the *Daodejing* by Laozi: "Knowing others is wisdom; knowing yourself is enlightenment. Conquering others is power; conquering yourself is true strength" (*知人者智，自知者明；胜人者有力，自胜者强*). He notes that parents cannot be an eternal shelter—eventually, a person must stand strong on their own feet. The host playfully interjects that Laozi himself did not walk across the country on foot, but famously rode a green ox through Hangu Pass.
Addressing whether embarking on such high-risk wilderness treks is reckless, Lei draws a comparison to his earlier days working in construction, where fatal accidents and life-threatening hazards happen every single year across all industries. He explains that it was precisely out of a profound reverence for his own life that he spent a full ten years meticulously preparing. For instance, he deliberately avoided crossing Lop Nur during June, knowing well that the lethal summer heat was beyond what he could safely manage.
---
[01:07:06](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR42ViYAcaQ&t=4026s) The Inner Dialogue, "The Way", and Desert Asceticism
The table discusses how surviving extreme hazards is not merely a matter of lucky breaks, but the synthesis of practical knowledge spanning physics, geography, and ecology. The discussion then turns to psychological and philosophical curiosity: when a traveler is marooned in absolute isolation, what does the internal dialogue between the self and the soul look like?
```mermaid
flowchart TD
accTitle: Transformation from Grief to Self-Discovery in Wilderness Walking
accDescr: Flowchart showing the psychological progression from external duty to radical internal honesty during an extreme pilgrimage.
subgraph Departure ["Initial Motivation"]
A["Loss & Distance:<br/>Father misunderstands son"] --> B["Carrying Son's Ashes:<br/>Walking the Camino trail"]
end
subgraph Ordeal ["The Crucible of the Trail"]
B --> C["Stripping Distractions:<br/>Life-and-death stakes eliminate pretense"]
C --> D["Spiritual Crisis:<br/>Irritability, anxiety, cursing heaven & earth"]
end
subgraph Transformation ["Inner Resolution"]
D --> E["Profound Honesty:<br/>'Setting off is the destination'"]
E --> F["Self-Realization:<br/>Ascetic trial yields ultimate inner peace"]
end
```
The hosts compare Lei’s solitary odyssey to the film *The Way*, which depicts the pilgrimage along the Camino de Santiago. In that story, an estranged father sets out carrying the ashes of his deceased son to fulfill his son's bucket list, only to realize along the grueling journey that he was fundamentally walking for himself. As Lei notes, "setting off is the destination"—the act of moving forward matters far more than arriving at a fixed coordinate. In confronting raw wilderness, one cannot bluff or deceive oneself about whether they can take the next step.
The panel compares this trial to the solitary desert asceticism of early Christian Desert Fathers: people imagine wilderness as pure serenity, but true tranquility only arrives after enduring an agonizing spiritual ordeal filled with venting, cursing, and conquering extreme anxiety.
---
[01:08:44](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR42ViYAcaQ&t=4124s) Writing Poetry under Bridges and Transcending the Urban Machine
Lei acknowledges that when someone is pushed to the edge of survival in the wild, isolation can easily trigger volatility, profound irritability, and deep mental strain. Yet once basic food and water are secured, the wild reveals an entirely different dimension: taking in snow-capped peaks, sunsets, catching a frog or a small snake, and quietly communing with living creatures brings an unmatched sense of inner peace. Lei remarks that constant urban noise dulls the spirit; one needs solitude to truly settle down.
While resting on the road, Lei often felt moved to write poems in his notebook by the dim light of candles he was hesitant to burn down, penning verses with rhythm and rhyme under highway overpasses and bridges—something he could never have conceived of while living in the city.
The hosts observe that at such moments, an ordinary human ceases to be a functional cog in a machine and regains poetry, romance, and a connection to things deemed "useless" by pragmatic society. They debate the meaning of life: if the planet itself will eventually perish, is risking one's life on foot across barren frontiers any less or more meaningful than grinding away inside a corporate tower striving to become a CEO? Setting an aspiration and seeing it through is what validates life and ensures one hasn't "lived in vain."
---
[01:10:37](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR42ViYAcaQ&t=4237s) Inspiring the Youth, Rejecting "Lying Flat", and the Healing Field of Nature
Lei shares that after completing his epic trek, invitations poured in from all over the country. He ended up delivering more than 2,000 public speeches to audiences ranging from small gatherings of dozens to stadium crowds of over 20,000 people. At his peak, he gave four speeches in a single day, collapsing from physical and emotional exhaustion each evening, his body trembling while eating dinner. While some talks paid nothing and merely sold a few books, large corporations offered speaking fees far exceeding what he used to earn in an entire year of construction labor.
Lei reflects that on his busiest days, his words reached 70,000 to 80,000 listeners. He states that if his story could steer even seven or eight young people away from severe anxiety, relentless rat-race competition (*involution* / 内卷), lack of direction, or resignation to "lying flat" (躺平), the effort was completely worth it:
- **Stance on "Lying Flat":** Lei expresses strong disapproval of passive surrender at any age, emphasizing that as long as a person breathes, they should strive for their dreams; "lying flat" may feel comfortable for a brief moment, but prolonged stagnation causes far more psychological distress than physical struggle.
- **The Energy Field of Nature:** In contrast to children glued to the virtual realm, spending time in natural landscapes—mountains, grasslands, forests, or the Gobi desert—grounds the human spirit within days.
- **Escape from Urban Competition:** While metropolitan life forces people into cutthroat rivalry and endless scheming, the primeval wilderness strips away all artificial friction.
---
[01:13:38](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR42ViYAcaQ&t=4418s) Awakening Primitive Instincts and Literary Resonance
Lei describes how immersing oneself in primitive living conditions awakens dormant sensory faculties and heightens raw survival instincts. Aside from dealing rationally with dangerous predators, waking up in the morning to the crisp scent of grass and the singing of birds brings deep, unshakeable serenity. In those moments, petty urban entanglements dissolve, leaving a profound sense of oneness with the natural cosmos: one feels as if nobody else exists and that they are the "King of the World."
The hosts warmly salute him, noting his nickname "God of Thunder" (雷神, a nod to his surname Lei). They draw literary and historical comparisons to Lei's life and adventures:
- The evocative, rugged regional spirit found in Xiao Hong's *Tales of Hulan River* (*呼兰河传*).
- The raw wilderness survival ethos of Jack London's adventure novels and Daniel Defoe's *Robinson Crusoe*.
- The tragic, heroic era of pioneering Chinese exploration, such as the fatal expeditions rafting down the Yangtze River.
- The grand geological perspective of the Himalayan orogeny rising from ancient oceans, framing Lei's physical endurance as an ultimate personal upgrade of human potential.
subgraph EmergencyRescue["荒野毒蛇自救流程"]
A["毒蛇咬伤伤口"] --> B["绳索紧缚伤口两端阻断毒血"]
B --> C["持刀生生剜除被咬伤的皮肉"]
C --> D["随身烈性白酒浇注冲洗消毒"]
D --> E["饮酒麻醉神经以缓解剧烈痛楚"]
end
```
[0:00] When I came out of the Qaidam Basin, it
[0:01] was the first time I felt like I was
[0:03] going to die in there, where you
[0:05] couldn't even find a blade of grass to
[0:06] eat.
[0:07] >> Sigh,
[0:08] >> Later I managed to collect a little bit
[0:10] , and drank some. The point is, there
[0:13] was nothing, I was just too thirsty. So
[0:15] I used a blade to cut two small slits
[0:18] in my fingertips, disinfected them with
[0:20] alcohol, and wrapped them with bandages
[0:23] . I wondered if I was going to die in
[0:25] there, but eventually I found the road
[0:27] and forced myself to flag down a car.
[0:29] When the car wouldn't stop, I stood
[0:30] right in the middle of the road,
[0:32] thinking I'm a person, they can't just
[0:33] run me over. I held up my documents and
[0:35] everything for them to see. The driver
[0:37] started cursing at me, telling me to
[0:38] get lost, asking why I was stopping
[0:40] their car. I said, "Driver, I'll pay
[0:41] you, just give me some water and food."
[0:43] "I can give you extra money." He said,
[0:46] "We don't have much, if something goes
[0:47] wrong with the car, we won't even be
[0:49] able to save ourselves." I said, "Just
[0:50] drain some water from the radiator for
[0:52] me to drink, that'll do." In the end,
[0:53] he actually drained some water from the
[0:55] radiator for me to drink. When I drank
[0:57] it, it was a bit discolored and had a
[0:59] slight metallic taste. But after
[1:01] drinking it, I was full. Finally, he
[1:03] got in the car and asked, "Where, where
[1:04] are you going?" I said, "Heading
[1:06] towards Xining." He said, "You, if you
[1:08] walk, you won't get there even in 20
[1:10] days." I said, "I've been walking for
[1:12] years, it's fine, even 30 days, that's
[1:13] just how it is.""You, I see you'd even
[1:15] drink radiator water, and I've seen
[1:17] your documents, you're a serious
[1:19] explorer.""Get in my car, I'll drive
[1:21] you to Xining, I'll pay for a hostel,
[1:22] you stay for two days, take a shower,
[1:24] wash your clothes, then keep walking."
[1:25] I said, "Driver, I am, I'm walking
[1:27] across China, I won't ride in a car."
[1:29] He got worked up, "You'd even drink
[1:30] radiator water, and you still won't get
[1:32] in the car?""I swear to you, I won't
[1:34] tell anyone you hitched a ride." I said
[1:36] , "I'm sorry, I really won't get in the
[1:38] car." Later, he threw a bag of biscuits
[1:39] from the car, a bottle of mineral water
[1:41] , and those few bottles of radiator
[1:42] water, which helped me survive a few
[1:44] more days. In the end he said, "You're
[1:45] really not getting in the car?" I said,
[1:47] "I'm really not getting in the car." He
[1:49] said, "I'm going to Xinjiang, I'll load
[1:50] up my cargo and rest for two days, then
[1:52] I'll head toward Lhasa. If I see you on
[1:53] the road, I'll bring you some things."
[1:55] As it turned out, a few days later, I
[1:56] really did see him. He stopped the car
[1:58] —this person was Jian Fang. I was so
[2:00] happy when I got out of the car,
[2:01] carrying this plastic bag. A 1.25-liter
[2:03] bottle of cola, a few apples, and a few
[2:05] packs of instant noodles. I opened the
[2:07] cola, holding the handlebars with one
[2:09] hand and the bottle with the other, and
[2:10] drank it all in one go. That drink was
[2:12] just so refreshing.
[2:13] >> So refreshing.
[2:15] >> Burping, you know.
[2:17] >> With all those bubbles, you know.
[2:18] >> Why can't I do it?
[2:20] >> I set these rules for myself.
[2:22] >> No one is going to manage me regardless
[2:25] of what I do. It's like plagiarizing
[2:27] when writing a book.
[2:28] >> If you plagiarize, you might get caught
[2:29] , but with this, no one would know—
[2:31] it's a solo world journey.
[2:32] >> People who win gold medals are
[2:33] sometimes found to have cheated, like
[2:35] taking a car along the way, secretly
[2:36] getting on for a stretch.
[2:38] >> Three masters, and there was also that
[2:39] time I encountered a wolf pack the day
[2:41] after I burned my clothes, remember?
[2:43] >> I met soldiers from the Xinjiang
[2:44] Military District. Later, I took out my
[2:46] documents, and they were like, "Oh,
[2:47] you've been walking for so many years!"
[2:49] They gave me food and water. Then they
[2:51] thought, "No, you should take a ride,"
[2:52] and told us to go back to the military
[2:54] district headquarters. "These thousands
[2:56] of kilometers, you definitely can't
[2:58] walk them in a month. There are
[3:00] snow-capped mountains over 5,000 meters
[3:02] high, leopards, bears, and wolves. If
[3:05] you can make it across alive, it's a
[3:07] miracle." Forty-some days later, I
[3:09] arrived at the military district
[3:10] headquarters, and they invited me to
[3:12] eat there again.
[3:13] >> That’s quite an achievement too.
[3:14] >> That young soldier reasoned with me, "
[3:16] Our commander says take a ride. Just
[3:18] get in the car. We are soldiers; we
[3:20] won't tell outsiders that you rode for
[3:21] these 1,000-plus kilometers." I said, "
[3:23] I'm sorry, I won't take a ride." Just
[3:25] very stubborn.
[3:26] >> You feel that if you took the ride...
[3:28] >> I would feel like I had broken my own
[3:29] rules. I would know it myself, you see?
[3:31] >> I can understand that very easily.
[3:32] >> But in reality, no one is supervising
[3:34] you.
[3:34] >> Right.
[3:35] >> But the thing has already happened.
[3:37] >> On the road, people have offered me
[3:39] donkeys on that route, the Pamir
[3:40] Plateau. People have offered me tents,
[3:42] but I didn't take them. Cats, no either
[3:45] . They offered me bicycles.
[3:47] >> A donkey might be worth considering.
[3:48] >> People have offered me bikes, and even
[3:50] motorcycles—second-hand motorcycles
[3:51] —saying, "I'll just give it to you."
[3:52] I declined all of them. I told them, "
[3:54] You can invite me for a meal, but I
[3:56] won't accept any of these other things.
[3:57] "
[3:57] >> You see, self-standard, self-discipline
[3:59] , holding yourself accountable, right.
[4:01] >> It's for that,
[4:02] >> So I feel if you slack off for a moment
[4:04] , you might not make it.
[4:05] >> If you slack off a few times, you might
[4:07] not want to go on, you can't keep going
[4:08] .
[4:08] >> Right, it's—it's a kind of devotion.
[4:11] >> Hey, that’s philosophical.
[4:13] >> The journey was still completed.
[4:14] >> Otherwise, there would be no need to
[4:16] travel across China,
[4:16] >> Or it would just be a half-hearted
[4:17] attempt to cover the ground.
[4:18] >> I mean, if you only care about the
[4:20] result, I don't think you can do this.
[4:21] >> Right?
[4:22] >> I must be doing it for the process. If
[4:24] I looked at the end result on the very
[4:26] first day, I'd collapse. You couldn't
[4:28] go on. Just do what’s in front of you
[4:30] , today’s tasks. Wherever I go, I
[4:32] have a map, indicating where I am, what
[4:34] the weather is like, what it’s like
[4:36] there. I have expectations because I
[4:38] haven't been there, hoping I might
[4:40] discover some truly interesting people
[4:42] and stories.
[4:43] >> I have also provided some information
[4:45] to the Chinese Academy of Sciences, um,
[4:47] >> Like this Lop Nur matter, wasn't Peng
[4:49] Jiamu the Vice President of the Academy
[4:51] back then?
[4:51] >> Um,
[4:53] >> Isn't that right? The most famous thing
[4:55] is that they couldn't be found, right?
[4:57] >> I actually have a photo of Peng Jiamu,
[4:59] let's take a look, he reached there too
[5:01] .
[5:01] >> But in that canister of his, there was
[5:03] an organic polymer box. When I opened
[5:05] it, I found this photo of him from
[5:07] before he passed.
[5:08] >> In the history of New China, there are
[5:10] a few names that I feel share a sense
[5:13] of legacy, you see, they all relate to
[5:15] Lop Nur. He was the first to cross Lop
[5:18] Nur since the Tang Dynasty, and Peng
[5:20] was part of this Chinese Academy of
[5:22] Sciences expedition team.
[5:24] >> It was in the 1970s,
[5:27] >> In 1980, he led an expedition team in,
[5:29] and then ultimately, he went missing.
[5:32] Back then, look, this was from Peng’s
[5:34] wife and colleagues at the institute: "
[5:36] Should any respected comrades pass by
[5:38] this place one day and be able to find
[5:41] the remains and belongings of Peng
[5:43] Jiamu, we are immensely grateful and
[5:45] hopeful." There are many legends online
[5:47] , some are a bit gossipy, like about
[5:50] aliens or whatever, but in recent years
[5:52] , some people who went in found some
[5:54] mummified remains, but in the end, they
[5:57] didn't seem to be his. Which is to say,
[5:59] to this day, his remains have still not
[6:02] been found. You arrived here, at Peng
[6:05] Jiamu's...
[6:06] >> When I arrived here, I didn't have that
[6:08] much water, but later on, others drove
[6:10] by. Look, why did Peng Jiamu's
[6:13] colleagues have so much water then?
[6:15] It's because he was in Lop Nur looking
[6:17] for water; they were short on water.
[6:19] >> He said he was going to look for water,
[6:20] heading east to find water, and finally
[6:22] ...
[6:22] >> Finally, he left a note, look.
[6:24] >> Just this note.
[6:26] >> It is the last thing he left behind in
[6:28] this world, that he was heading east to
[6:30] look for a well.
[6:31] >> But we never found him again. This is
[6:33] Peng Jiamu, and then there's Yu
[6:35] Chunshun, you know. So Professor Xu is
[6:38] interesting; Peng Jiamu also worked in
[6:41] Shanghai, and Chunshun was also from
[6:43] Shanghai, but he was a spiritual icon
[6:45] in the 80s.
[6:46] >> Yu Chunshun also wanted to travel, to
[6:48] travel on foot, and in the end,
[6:50] Chunshun also sacrificed his life in...
[6:52] >> Lop Nur.
[6:54] >> Lop Nur, and on one hand he was
[6:56] inspired by Xu Xiake, and on the other
[6:58] hand, when Chunshun was walking through
[7:01] Heilongjiang...
[7:02] >> I met him.
[7:04] >> I ran into him; that was back in 1989.
[7:08] In the Greater Khingan Mountains, I saw
[7:10] him carrying a pack; by then he had
[7:12] already started preparing, for over a
[7:14] year. I was so excited, and I didn't
[7:16] even know where he came from. Then on
[7:19] his pack, there was a small piece of
[7:21] cloth, quite impressive: "Across China,
[7:24] Shanghai-Taiwan-Shanghai, Yu Chunshun."
[7:27] I tried to strike up a conversation
[7:29] with him, but he didn't really want to
[7:31] talk to me because my questions were a
[7:33] bit off-base.
[7:34] >> Why is that?
[7:35] >> He thought I was a layman, too much of
[7:38] a layman, too amateurish.
[7:40] >> So what kind of spiritual connection do
[7:42] you think you have with him? I think
[7:45] seeing those stamps of Xu Xiake
[7:47] influenced me. But that was 400 years
[7:50] ago. You...
[7:52] >> This was right there in my living
[7:54] memory, him walking past me with that
[7:56] big pack. I can instantly reconstruct
[7:59] his outfit at that time, a set of
[8:01] camouflage clothes. A pair of white
[8:03] Huili sneakers with red soles. And
[8:06] carrying a big pack. His physique was
[8:09] compact; he was much stronger than me.
[8:11] Don't you think that's a strange
[8:12] encounter?
[8:13] >> I didn't think of it that way at the
[8:14] time.
[8:14] >> Because you both were talking about the
[8:16] same thing.
[8:17] >> Right.
[8:17] >> To actually run into each other.
[8:19] >> But he didn't know that.
[8:20] >> Right.
[8:21] >> He didn't know, but I knew I was
[8:23] looking for him. I was really excited;
[8:25] I was on those railroad tracks, the
[8:27] logging train tracks. It was right
[8:29] after the Great Fire of May 6th, 1987,
[8:31] when they were clearing out a lot of
[8:33] the burnt timber. He was there filming
[8:35] the scene of them loading the logs onto
[8:38] the train. I envied him so much. His
[8:41] hair was already covering his forehead
[8:44] by then, because he had been out for
[8:46] more than a year, right?
[8:50] >> Yu Chunshun was eventually found in Lop
[8:53] Nur; when I went to Lop Nur, I also
[8:55] heard them say that outside his tent
[8:58] was just a knife.
[9:01] >> Was he trying to dig for water?
[9:04] >> There’s no way to verify that now; he
[9:07] did dig a pit. Uh, because it wasn't
[9:10] deep. That area is a junction between
[9:12] the small earthen mounds on the
[9:14] northern desert shore of Lop Nur and
[9:16] the salt crust. It's very hard. He
[9:19] didn't dig very deep. I’ve tried
[9:22] digging there myself; you just can't
[9:24] get down.
[9:24] >> There’s no water.
[9:26] >> And even if you did dig some up, you
[9:27] couldn't drink it. It’s basically
[9:29] salt water. The kind with minerals in
[9:31] it. It's undrinkable. Why didn't Yu
[9:34] Chun make it out, but you did?
[9:36] >> Maybe I was just lucky. Also, I spent a
[9:39] lot more time preparing. That’s
[9:42] second. And third, I didn't set out
[9:45] during that month. He set out in June.
[9:47] >> Peng Jiamu was also around June 17th, I
[9:49] think.
[9:50] >> I went in October.
[9:52] >> The summer months are exceptionally
[9:54] difficult, yes. When I was in the
[9:55] Taklamakan Desert and the Flaming
[9:57] Mountains—you mentioned going to the
[9:58] Flaming Mountains, right?
[9:59] >> I brought a thermometer, and the
[10:01] surface temperature reached 74 degrees
[10:03] Celsius at its hottest.
[10:04] >> We boiled eggs there, you know?
[10:07] >> The eggs actually cooked.
[10:09] >> So June and July are the hottest. I
[10:12] didn't choose that time.
[10:13] >> I’ve seen comments online comparing
[10:15] him and Yu Chun. Actually, Yu Chun was
[10:18] idolized by many young people back in
[10:20] the 80s. People tried to persuade him
[10:22] not to go in June, but he was full of
[10:24] youthful passion, saying, "I’m going
[10:26] to make it out and show you all." It
[10:28] seems there was a Shanghai TV station
[10:30] involved, too.
[10:31] >> They followed him to film.
[10:33] >> June of '96.
[10:34] >> It caused quite a stir because he was
[10:36] making a program, a documentary.
[10:38] >> And it was meant as a National Day
[10:40] tribute. People who knew the area
[10:42] warned him that Lop Nur, the Land of
[10:44] Death, was impassable in June. The
[10:46] temperatures were too high, but he
[10:48] refused to believe it. When they were
[10:51] drinking before departure, someone
[10:53] noticed he wasn't in high spirits. I
[10:55] think he had hesitations, and in the
[10:57] end, they asked him, "Are you really
[10:59] going or not?" I think he felt backed
[11:01] into a corner and felt he had to finish
[11:03] it, no matter what.
[11:05] >> What does this "traveling across the
[11:07] whole country" mean? Does it mean
[11:09] visiting one place in every province,
[11:11] or do you have to travel through every
[11:12] single inch of the province?
[11:14] >> No, for me, traveling across all of
[11:16] China is like this:
[11:18] >> It’s visiting every provincial
[11:20] capital.
[11:21] >> And every prefecture.
[11:23] >> And counties with stories and deep
[11:25] cultural heritage, including some
[11:26] villages that are historically and
[11:28] culturally significant, or have ancient
[11:30] sites—those are marked. Plus,
[11:32] visiting the various ethnic groups.
[11:34] >> For instance, which places did you go
[11:36] to in Jiangxi?
[11:37] >> In Jiangxi? I traveled through every
[11:39] region.
[11:40] >> Jinggang Mountain.
[11:41] >> Yes, exactly.
[11:42] >> And the provincial capital, Nanchang.
[11:44] >> I went through it all.
[11:45] >> I was in those
[11:46] >> Nanfeng and Nancheng counties, walking
[11:49] through most of them. In the end, I
[11:51] spent the Spring Festival of my sixth
[11:53] year in Xinfeng County.
[11:54] >> Mm-hmm.
[11:55] >> And then from Xinfeng County.
[11:57] >> So where did you stay? I'd just find
[12:00] any small inn. In the county towns and
[12:03] villages back then, there were hostels
[12:05] and guesthouses.
[12:06] >> Mm-hmm.
[12:07] >> Yeah, there were inns.
[12:09] >> They were all really quite cheap.
[12:11] >> Quite cheap. The cheapest I stayed in
[12:13] was 1.5 yuan, and they even ripped me
[12:15] off for 50 cents—what do you mean by
[12:16] "ripped off"?
[12:17] >> The locals were all in a large
[12:18] dormitory, mostly small business owners
[12:20] , and at night I slept in a sleeping
[12:22] bag—you couldn't even tell the
[12:24] original color of the bedding. The men
[12:26] were on one side, separated by
[12:27] something, and the women were on the
[12:29] other. I asked them, "How much do you
[12:31] pay to stay here?" They all said one
[12:33] yuan. I got up to find the boss. I said
[12:36] , "Boss, why do you charge them one
[12:38] yuan, but you charge me 1.5?" He said
[12:39] they were there doing business, and if
[12:41] I stayed long-term, it would also be
[12:43] one yuan. I let it go, I was
[12:45] half-joking anyway, but staying there
[12:47] meant I could get a cup of hot water.
[12:49] And shelter from the wind and rain.
[12:51] Young people today call you "Thor."
[12:54] >> Yes, some call me that.
[12:55] >> Because of the Lop Nur incident—let's
[12:57] just talk about that, as it was your
[12:58] final battle, right? You also lost
[13:00] contact for several days, I heard you
[13:02] were disconnected twice.
[13:03] >> It was just like with Yu Chun back then
[13:05] . Everyone was worried sick because I
[13:07] didn't show up on the day we agreed
[13:09] upon. So, was there anyone checking on
[13:11] your whereabouts every day?
[13:12] >> When I went in, there were media
[13:14] personnel who wanted to do a live
[13:15] broadcast with me,
[13:16] >> Mm-hmm,
[13:17] >> and I also signed a life-or-death
[13:19] agreement.
[13:19] >> Mm-hmm,
[13:20] >> Life and death had nothing to do with
[13:23] them. Because many people climb Mount
[13:25] Everest every year, but after Yu Chun
[13:27] died in Lop Nur, no one has officially
[13:29] applied to cross it since. So, they
[13:31] went in to find me. A few times they
[13:34] didn't, but a few times they did, and
[13:36] we did live broadcasts, each lasting
[13:39] about two hours. I brought a satellite
[13:41] phone and a solar charging panel that a
[13:44] friend had set up for me, but it
[13:45] wouldn't charge. So, it only had a tiny
[13:48] bit of power left—just a little—and
[13:51] I’d only turn it on to call out in an
[13:54] emergency. But since it had no
[13:56] coordinates or GPS positioning, they
[13:58] couldn't find me.
[13:59] >> You could notify them, that you were
[14:02] still alive,
[14:03] >> but they didn't know where you were and
[14:05] couldn't find you. That's why one time,
[14:08] a pack of wolves and they couldn't find
[14:10] me. They drove off-road looking for me
[14:13] in Lop Nur; there were no buildings,
[14:15] mostly just Gobi Desert and rocky
[14:17] terrain. Then they saw the wolf tracks
[14:20] running parallel to my footprints; it
[14:23] was following right behind me. It was
[14:25] staying very close to me.
[14:27] >> My rescue team drove along, worried
[14:29] something had happened to me, seeing
[14:31] the tracks of a wolf pack—are lone
[14:33] wolves even more dangerous? They chased
[14:35] after us for several hours. They
[14:37] checked their speedometer, and when
[14:39] they were just a few hundred meters
[14:41] from me, the wolf ran off upon hearing
[14:43] the cars. They pulled up and asked, "
[14:45] Old man, there was a pack of wolves
[14:47] right by you, didn't you know?" I said
[14:49] I hadn't noticed and didn't know. They
[14:51] said they clocked over 90 kilometers of
[14:53] tracking, which is more than two days
[14:55] of my walking, meaning those wolves
[14:56] were nearby even when I was sleeping in
[14:58] my tent at night.
[14:59] >> Following you the whole time.
[15:01] >> And you didn't know?
[15:02] >> I didn't know, I wasn't paying
[15:04] attention.
[15:04] >> Weren't those wolves hungry?
[15:06] >> How could they not be hungry?
[15:07] >> No, why didn't they attack you?
[15:09] >> I don't know the answer to that. I
[15:11] think it was divine.
[15:13] >> Maybe it was meant to be, as they say.
[15:15] >> It was like two lonely souls colliding;
[15:18] it didn't necessarily want to eat me.
[15:21] I've asked experts in animal science
[15:24] why predators, whether hunting humans
[15:27] or animals, always pick the young, the
[15:29] old, or the weak and sick. They can
[15:33] sense it; they can literally smell it,
[15:35] you know?
[15:36] >> When my body was at its peak, it didn't
[15:39] quite dare to attack me, so it just
[15:41] followed me.
[15:42] >> But when your body is weak, they smell
[15:45] that scent on you and pounce.
[15:47] >> They'll finish you off in seconds, so I
[15:50] guess I need to get some hormones or
[15:52] something.
[15:52] >> Like the wolf story I just told, out
[15:54] there, it's not just a "nine deaths,
[15:56] one life" situation, it's more like
[15:58] ninety-nine deaths, one life.
[15:59] >> I've truly faced life and death 180
[16:02] times; why do I say that? Many friends
[16:04] ask me this, including when I was
[16:05] having a drink with them last night.
[16:07] They ask, "What was the most dangerous
[16:09] time?" I say there isn't just one "most
[16:11] dangerous" time. There have been at
[16:12] least a hundred times—why a hundred?
[16:14] Nineteen times I was robbed, and they
[16:15] all had knives.
[16:16] >> It was a real struggle. Why would they
[16:18] use iron bars to beat me while robbing
[16:20] me?
[16:20] >> Some even mistook me for a foreigner,
[16:22] thinking only a foreigner would do
[16:23] something like this, and they'd say "
[16:24] Hello" to me. I'd reply, "Hello what?
[16:27] I'm Chinese."
[16:28] >> My hair was long, and my Northeast
[16:30] accent finally came out.
[16:31] >> You can no longer tell who you are,
[16:32] with long hair, a long beard, and a
[16:34] large camera exposed on your back,
[16:36] right?
[16:37] >> They think you have a camera and
[16:39] definitely carry cash, that’s one
[16:42] danger, and another is encountering
[16:44] sandstorms, black blizzards, or
[16:47] avalanches—natural—
[16:50] >> Natural disasters.
[16:52] >> And then there are wild animals.
[16:55] Honestly, except for wild tigers,
[16:57] I’ve seen everything else: snow
[17:00] leopards, wolf packs, wild boars, bears
[17:03] ...
[17:04] >> Bears too? There are bears over there?
[17:07] >> There are a lot. Where?
[17:10] >> In both the Southwest and Northwest
[17:12] regions.
[17:12] >> In the Southwest region. One time, in
[17:15] the Ngari Prefecture of Tibet, I saw a
[17:17] lake that was just brilliant blue. I
[17:19] walked over a hill and headed down to
[17:21] find the river. As I kept walking, the
[17:23] ground became wetter and wetter. When I
[17:26] got close to the riverbed, I thought, "
[17:28] Wait, is someone here?" Those were big
[17:30] footprints. I took a closer look and
[17:32] realized something wasn't right in the
[17:33] gully ahead. I turned around and saw, a
[17:35] few hundred meters away, two bears—
[17:37] one big, one small. The big one must
[17:39] have weighed at least 300 to 400 jin.
[17:42] It was looking at me, too, so I didn't
[17:44] dare move. I had some things on me, and
[17:46] maybe it wasn't hungry, you know? After
[17:48] it looked at me, I just stood still.
[17:51] They slowly walked away, went over the
[17:53] hill, and disappeared. I went to drink
[17:55] that water, but it was salty and didn't
[17:57] taste good, though I filled up my water
[17:59] bottles anyway. So there are a lot of
[18:00] wild animals, and even wild yaks will
[18:02] attack people. Wild boars also attack
[18:05] people. Of course, there are also cute
[18:07] animals like giant pandas and red
[18:09] pandas.
[18:10] >> I even saw a giant panda in the
[18:12] Wanglang Nature Reserve, but it ran
[18:14] away, and I couldn't catch up.
[18:16] >> Let's take a look at some of his photos
[18:18] . Oh, this was the first day I set off
[18:21] as a young man.
[18:22] >> You weren't a young man then; you were
[18:24] 35.
[18:24] >> I look young there! That’s me waving
[18:27] goodbye to my family and friends.
[18:29] >> What's this?
[18:30] >> This was in the ninth year of my
[18:32] journey, on the coast in Macau.
[18:33] >> Oh, you look like...
[18:34] >> A Jin Yong novel character. A hero from
[18:36] a Jin Yong novel. You look like a
[18:37] martial arts hero with that long hair.
[18:39] >> Ouyang Feng.
[18:40] >> Exactly.
[18:41] >> This is at Mount Kailash. The altitude
[18:43] isn't actually this high.
[18:44] >> It was written wrong; I verified it
[18:46] later. It’s a little under 6,000
[18:48] meters. You’re still very meticulous.
[18:50] >> That was how I looked after walking for
[18:52] nearly five years.
[18:53] >> Hmm.
[18:54] >> On the left, I'm crossing the Dulong
[18:56] River on a small wooden bridge, and on
[18:59] the right is a tattooed Dulong person.
[19:01] Hey, that pipe we have there is from
[19:03] the Dulong tribe.
[19:04] >> Yes, yes, yes, that on the left is the
[19:06] glacier of Mount Everest; didn't I burn
[19:08] that set of clothes? Previous equipment
[19:11] .
[19:11] >> Ah.
[19:12] >> On the right is the pancake, on the
[19:14] left is the...
[19:15] >> He encountered the golden mountain peak
[19:16] at sunrise; I know Meili Snow Mountain
[19:18] is famous.
[19:19] >> Actually, no one has ever successfully
[19:20] climbed this mountain.
[19:21] >> No one. There was once a China-Japan
[19:24] joint mountaineering team. 17 people,
[19:26] 17 people.
[19:27] >> All perished. Since then, even though
[19:30] people have been up Everest, it seems
[19:31] it's forbidden to climb here now, right
[19:33] ?
[19:33] >> Not allowed; one is Mount Kailash.
[19:36] >> Hmm.
[19:37] >> Mount Kailash, and the other is Meili
[19:38] Snow Mountain.
[19:39] >> So you can only go to a certain spot
[19:41] and look at it from afar, but at sunset
[19:42] , the golden mountain view is a
[19:43] magnificent sight. Look how much it
[19:45] looks like a pyramid.
[19:46] >> This is...this is in the Himalayas.
[19:48] >> Himalayas.
[19:49] >> It was before encountering the pack of
[19:52] wolves.
[19:52] >> In the Ngari region of Tibet, this...
[19:55] >> On the left is the "World's First Road
[19:57] Maintenance Squad" at Tanggula Mountain
[19:59] ; there's a road squad there, the
[20:01] highest altitude one in China, and on
[20:03] the right is the Tanggula Mountain Pass
[20:05] . I was on my way from Lhasa to Qinghai
[20:07] , and there were dozens of military
[20:08] trucks going for training exercises.
[20:10] Then, many days later when they
[20:12] returned, they saw me still walking on
[20:14] the road, and the lead vehicle was
[20:15] commanded by a military officer, who
[20:17] ordered a stop; once the lead vehicle
[20:19] stops, they all stop. "What do you need
[20:21] right now?" I said, "Water." Each truck
[20:24] gave me two bottles of water, dozens of
[20:26] bottles in total. I said, "It's too
[20:27] much to carry, I only need one." He
[20:29] said, "Then let's take a picture
[20:30] together." I said, "Sure." This was
[20:33] taken with my own camera.
[20:34] >> Dozens of soldiers.
[20:35] >> Oh, that's wonderful.
[20:37] >> Yangtze River.
[20:38] >> Yangtze River.
[20:39] >> Yu Chunshun.
[20:40] >> Yu Chunshun's tomb.
[20:41] >> He had walked to Lop Nur.
[20:42] >> His body is buried behind here; he
[20:44] liked alcohol when he was alive. I
[20:45] brought him some liquor and a few
[20:47] cigarettes.
[20:47] >> And then he slept right next to Yu
[20:49] Chunshun's tombstone for...
[20:50] >> This is in the Yunnan region.
[20:52] >> Did you stay right at his grave? Just
[20:53] slept here.
[20:54] >> Slept for one night.
[20:55] >> Pioneer.
[20:56] >> He is buried right here.
[20:58] >> He died in the end because of
[20:59] dehydration, right?
[21:00] >> Uh, he wasn't lacking water; he was
[21:02] only about two kilometers away from the
[21:03] camp, enough to take a bath, with
[21:05] plenty of water.
[21:05] >> He got lost, didn't he? Lost his way.
[21:08] >> He took a small, faint path—a small
[21:10] fork in the road—and went the wrong
[21:12] way. He had actually already purchased
[21:14] these supplies, but perhaps a big storm
[21:16] blew in or something, so he...
[21:17] >> There was no storm at the time; the
[21:19] storm came after he met with the
[21:20] accident.
[21:21] >> So when he reached that fork in the
[21:22] road, he didn't turn,
[21:23] >> and he got lost.
[21:25] >> Lost. You think the reason for his
[21:27] death was getting lost.
[21:29] >> Uh, in my own opinion—not necessarily
[21:31] accurate, just one perspective—
[21:33] >> one is Mr. Peng Jiamu, the other is Mr.
[21:36] Yu Shunhuang. As for their accidents,
[21:39] of course, there are many versions
[21:41] online, but let's not discuss others '
[21:44] versions. I myself have entered Lop Nur
[21:47] several times. That one time I went
[21:49] alone, while those other times there
[21:52] were a few people. First, he couldn't
[21:54] find water; he might have been resting
[21:56] in the Yardang landform when the wind
[21:58] and sand were heavy. Sometimes the
[22:00] Yardang landforms just collapse. They
[22:03] collapse quite often. In that era,
[22:05] survival surveying and exploration were
[22:08] really difficult because the area was
[22:11] just too vast. Second, there were gold
[22:13] prospectors in there, on the edge of
[22:16] Lop Nur or the Gobi Desert, which
[22:17] wasn't allowed—it's considered
[22:19] illegal mining. Since he was a veteran
[22:22] scholar, it's very likely—I once saw
[22:24] them sleeping in the earthquake rifts,
[22:26] and it scared me to death, you know?
[22:28] Those people in there, some don't even
[22:30] want to come out for the rest of their
[22:33] lives. They might have issues back home
[22:35] , and they could kill you with the
[22:37] slightest effort.
[22:38] >> He also encountered people on the road
[22:40] who were the type to want to kill him.
[22:43] >> But you say it was stupidity?
[22:45] >> That stupidity—first, he took the
[22:48] wrong path and perhaps got scared. When
[22:51] a person's mind breaks or collapses,
[22:54] death is near. Death draws near. Second
[22:58] , he might have suffered from
[23:00] heatstroke; so it was heatstroke and
[23:03] fear. He walked about 40 kilometers. In
[23:07] just one day, leaving from the Yardang
[23:09] earth formations toward Lop Nur, he
[23:11] hadn't yet reached the center of the
[23:13] lake. He wanted to reach the lake but
[23:16] hadn't arrived, then he went a bit
[23:18] further west-south. The straight-line
[23:20] distance was only about 25 kilometers;
[23:22] he had already surveyed the Loulan
[23:24] route beforehand. He bought items, food
[23:27] , water skins, flatbread, and supplies,
[23:29] but he just made a slight error in
[23:32] direction. Maybe his body started
[23:34] having problems, coupled with the fear.
[23:36] It could have been heatstroke.
[23:38] >> Isn't he considered a brave and daring
[23:41] person? Would he also collapse under
[23:44] those circumstances?
[23:45] >> I didn't collapse in the desert, but I
[23:48] did experience desert syndrome.
[23:50] >> What does that mean?
[23:51] >> It's that feeling where you just want
[23:53] to lose your temper and get angry.
[23:55] Especially when you think about
[23:57] yourself or some friends and family who
[24:00] once treated you poorly. You're in
[24:02] there, cursing and crying, like a
[24:05] madman—that's what they call "desert
[24:07] syndrome."
[24:08] >> Facing yourself in total solitude. You
[24:11] know, they say he was the first person
[24:12] since the Tang Dynasty to walk out of
[24:14] Lop Nur, but wasn't there Master
[24:15] Xuanzang during the Tang Dynasty? Tang
[24:17] Seng, you mean? His "Great Tang Records
[24:19] on the Western Regions." I’ve always
[24:21] been interested in a passage in his
[24:23] records describing the Lop Nur and
[24:24] Taklamakan Desert area; I believe he
[24:26] was experiencing hallucinations. Look
[24:28] at what he says: "Traveling east from
[24:30] here into the vast quicksand, where the
[24:31] sands shift and scatter with the wind,
[24:33] leaving no paths; all around is vast
[24:35] and featureless, with nothing to guide
[24:37] one.""Therefore, travelers often rely
[24:38] on the dried bones of those who passed
[24:39] before to find their way." So, you
[24:41] still see dried bones in there today,
[24:43] right? Using those bones as trail
[24:45] markers, that's the method. "There is
[24:47] no water or grass, and there are many
[24:48] hot winds. When the wind rises, people
[24:50] fall into a stupor, often leading to
[24:51] illness.""Hearing singing or crying,"
[24:53] sometimes he'd hear singing or crying,
[24:55] and he'd say that in the midst of it,
[24:57] he'd feel dazed and not know why, which
[24:59] led to many deaths among travelers.
[25:01] Doesn't that sound a bit like the "
[25:03] desert syndrome" you mentioned?
[25:04] >> I think it’s hallucinations, but
[25:06] I’ve experienced it myself a few
[25:08] times. At night, when you're alone in
[25:11] the tent, especially near ancient tombs
[25:14] , there's a strange phenomenon—that
[25:16] feeling at night of not quite crying,
[25:19] not quite laughing. I’d pinch myself
[25:21] to see if it was a hallucination or an
[25:24] auditory illusion, but no, it actually
[25:27] happens. And then, during the day, you
[25:30] can hear it across hundreds of
[25:32] kilometers—like a caravan from
[25:34] ancient times, or like the old wooden
[25:37] carts with big wheels I saw when I was
[25:40] a kid, that creaking sound, the bustle
[25:43] of life, carrying children, with dogs
[25:46] and camels...that kind of feeling. I
[25:48] kept wondering if my hearing was
[25:50] failing, if it was an auditory
[25:52] hallucination, but I’d walk a bit
[25:53] further and it would be gone. To verify
[25:56] it, I went back to that spot, and it
[25:58] turned out this sensation was confined
[26:00] to a small area.
[26:01] >> It’s still there.
[26:02] >> Is that like the feeling of a mirage?
[26:04] >> I’ve even filmed mirages before.
[26:06] >> Oh.
[26:07] >> There was water, houses, trees ahead;
[26:10] at first I thought it was real, but
[26:12] later I realized as you keep walking,
[26:15] it just vanishes.
[26:16] >> Many people have died because they saw
[26:18] a lake or something there.
[26:19] >> Right.
[26:20] >> They walk and walk, and when they reach
[26:21] it, it’s gone, and they fall into
[26:23] absolute despair. This—this mirage,
[26:25] we know now it’s just a phenomenon of
[26:27] atmospheric refraction. I asked this
[26:29] artificial intelligence the other day,
[26:31] asking what kind of crying sound the
[26:33] scepter was referring to. Of course,
[26:35] it’s mysterious, but the scientific
[26:37] explanation is that it’s an acoustic
[26:39] phenomenon of sand, strange sounds made
[26:41] by wind blowing through sand.
[26:43] >> Xinjiang has a "Ghost City," which is
[26:46] the Yardang landform.
[26:47] >> The Yardang landform has its own sounds
[26:49] , which are different from the wind and
[26:52] sand. I’ve been in wind and sand in
[26:54] Xinjiang and Gansu; I’ve walked
[26:56] through all the deserts in China. That
[26:58] sound was completely different from
[27:00] what I heard; it’s not the same thing
[27:02] at all.
[27:03] >> In the desert, there’s no sense of
[27:05] orientation; visually, everything looks
[27:08] exactly the same forever.
[27:10] >> Oh, especially at the center of Lop Nur
[27:13] .
[27:13] >> It was only because I kept a daily
[27:15] diary that I realized there was a stone
[27:18] tablet at that center. It was about
[27:21] three or four kilometers, maybe four or
[27:23] five kilometers, from the tomb of the
[27:26] remains, and about 20 kilometers from
[27:28] the Loulan ruins. That center was at an
[27:31] elevation of about [a certain number of
[27:33] ] meters; my altimeter wasn't accurate,
[27:35] so there was some margin of error. When
[27:37] I looked around, it was like being at
[27:39] the bottom of a giant pot, and walking
[27:42] felt like constantly climbing out of
[27:44] that bottom. It wasn't exhausting, but
[27:47] your vision could never reach more than
[27:49] a few kilometers away.
[27:51] >> Hmm.
[27:52] >> Hmm.
[27:53] >> Your vision is just confined to a very
[27:55] small area; no matter which way you
[27:57] walk, it’s always like that.
[27:58] >> You have to walk for a very, very long
[28:00] time to get out.
[28:00] >> Yes, you have to walk for a day or two.
[28:02] >> So, what is a person’s mental state
[28:04] like then? Is it self-dialogue? Or is
[28:06] the brain just empty?
[28:07] >> The brain is not empty. Uh, why did I
[28:10] choose to leave Lop Nur for last?
[28:12] >> I once wrote a letter to my sister from
[28:14] the uninhabited region of Ali in
[28:15] Xinjiang and Tibet. I encountered a
[28:17] wolf pack there, and I walked through
[28:19] Xinjiang without stopping for 13 months
[28:20] . I wanted to enter Lop Nur twice, in
[28:23] the fourth and fifth years, but I
[28:25] didn't dare to go in either time—once
[28:27] in Ruoqiang County, and once in Korla.
[28:30] I thought, I’ve walked halfway; it
[28:32] would be a shame to die in there. I
[28:34] decided to finish walking all of China,
[28:37] and then do Lop Nur last. When I was
[28:39] planning it before—I spent ten years
[28:41] planning before I started walking—I
[28:43] never thought about entering from
[28:45] Dunhuang and coming out through
[28:46] Xinjiang, I really didn't. I’m not
[28:48] making this up; it’s because I had
[28:50] ten years of preparation and ten years
[28:52] of experience, so I had a bold idea: to
[28:54] head west out of Yangguan Pass. So, to
[28:56] say I wasn't afraid to go in there is
[28:58] impossible; I was definitely scared.
[29:00] But I’ve always been a bit
[29:02] competitive, and I remembered what my
[29:03] father said before he passed away: "Son
[29:05] , you have to make something of
[29:07] yourself." I have no education, only
[29:09] about three years of elementary school.
[29:11] I dropped out at 11, lost my mother at
[29:13] 13, and my father at 15, so I went out
[29:15] to work. I still wanted to achieve
[29:17] something in this life, but given the
[29:19] family I was born into, I had no choice
[29:21] but to find a path that suited me. I
[29:23] feel that this challenge isn't about
[29:25] challenging nature, but rather
[29:27] challenging myself. After walking for
[29:29] ten years, especially in Lop Nur, many
[29:30] friends and relatives, and even the
[29:32] media, told me not to go: "Just walk
[29:34] around the edge, take some photos, and
[29:35] that counts as being in Lop Nur." I’m
[29:37] a bit stubborn, so I said no, I must
[29:40] cross it entirely. So, the second
[29:42] suicide note I wrote to my sister, I
[29:44] wrote it in Dunhuang, inside my diary,
[29:46] and I’ve carried it with me ever
[29:47] since. In the end, it took 31 years to
[29:50] walk out. The fear is something you
[29:52] just can’t describe; you can’t put
[29:55] that feeling into words. Of course,
[29:57] there were times when the weather was
[29:59] good, and when I had enough food and
[30:02] water, I could appreciate the scenery
[30:04] of the vast desert.
[30:05] >> The scenery in the morning and evening,
[30:07] the sun shining over the long river at
[30:10] sunset, and seeing the Milky Way—the
[30:12] nights were just so beautiful. And
[30:14] sometimes, looking at the moon, it
[30:16] really had such a bright, brilliant
[30:18] feeling. Sigh, this life has been worth
[30:20] it. The things I was meant to see,
[30:22] which many others haven't seen, I have
[30:24] seen them all. In the end, I gritted my
[30:26] teeth and persisted step by step to
[30:29] complete this small dream of mine. I
[30:31] set a theme: environmental protection
[30:34] and ethnic exploration. This focus on
[30:36] the environment actually has a direct
[30:38] connection to my parents' gravesite.
[30:41] >> Because my parents are buried by the
[30:43] Hulan River. When I was a child, that
[30:46] river was so beautiful, so wonderful.
[30:49] The mountains were once where the Jin
[30:51] Dynasty soldiers trained. And there
[30:53] were historical sites too.
[30:56] >> Every year, I would go mountain
[30:58] climbing there; there were wild animals
[31:00] , and sometimes we could even find bird
[31:03] eggs and such. But as I grew older,
[31:05] those mountains and that era...well, no
[31:08] one cared. People started quarrying
[31:10] stones, building houses and pigpens,
[31:12] until the mountains didn't look like
[31:15] mountains anymore, and the river was
[31:17] polluted—it didn't even look like a
[31:19] river. Later, as I traveled, I decided
[31:21] I would document and film the
[31:23] environment along the way. Because of
[31:25] this, I was chased and nearly killed
[31:27] several times, for example—
[31:28] >> Why?
[31:30] >> About the Tibetan antelope, one night I
[31:32] heard them shooting at the antelopes
[31:33] and skinning them alive. I was there
[31:35] taking photos secretly when the flash
[31:37] went off, and they saw me. They almost
[31:39] beat me to death, you know? Using their
[31:41] rifle butts—my camera wasn't great, I
[31:44] just wanted to get something decent.
[31:46] I'm not a professional photographer, I
[31:48] just wanted to leave some visual record
[31:50] , but I got exposed and they went after
[31:53] me.
[31:53] >> They were a professional group. They
[31:56] were professional enough that back then
[31:59] , from the sources of the Yangtze and
[32:01] Yellow Rivers to the Nanchang and
[32:04] Lancang Rivers, everywhere people lived
[32:06] , the pollution began. That was just
[32:10] how that era was. In the mountains, no
[32:12] matter what kind of wood it was—the
[32:15] most brutal thing I saw was, uh, large
[32:17] pine trees about 80 centimeters to a
[32:19] meter in diameter, tens of meters high,
[32:21] with pine cones on top. They wanted the
[32:24] pine nuts.
[32:26] >> Since people couldn't climb up, afraid
[32:28] of accidents, they used tools to fell
[32:31] the trees just to get those cones, and
[32:33] in the end, those trees just rotted
[32:36] away there.
[32:38] >> Did you try to report them?
[32:40] >> I did report them, yes I did.
[32:43] >> So you were being hunted down because
[32:45] of that? My god, you mentioned there
[32:48] was a robber, and you actually ended up
[32:50] befriending him? There were people
[32:52] intercepting me on horseback, sometimes
[32:54] waiting in ambush, that happened once.
[32:56] It was two large motorcycles and four
[32:59] people. It was almost dark, in the
[33:02] evening, when I went up a mountain.
[33:05] Normal cars couldn't make it up there.
[33:08] After they revved their engines and
[33:10] drove up, they didn't hit or curse me,
[33:13] but there was a small cliff next to me,
[33:16] with deep, jagged ravines below. They
[33:18] were short on cash and told me to leave
[33:21] all my money and valuables. I had
[33:23] always been wearing a gold ring, over
[33:25] 20 grams, pinned inside my clothes; I
[33:27] didn't dare wear it out. I thought,
[33:29] this is for emergencies, if you ever
[33:31] run into something like this, just give
[33:33] it to them. I didn't take that out; I
[33:35] just pulled out a wad of cash. There
[33:37] were two 100-yuan bills on the outside,
[33:40] with small change inside to make it
[33:41] look thicker. I said, "Guys, this is
[33:44] all the money I have." I was prepared
[33:46] for how many times I might be robbed—
[33:48] I’d encountered this before, so I
[33:50] just gave them the money.
[33:52] >> Before they left, they asked what I was
[33:54] doing. I said I was walking across all
[33:55] of China. They asked, "Who is giving
[33:57] you money to support you?"
[33:58] >> All across China.
[33:59] >> He said, he asked, "Who supports you?
[34:01] Who is giving you money to travel?" I
[34:03] said I’m self-funded, I even sold my
[34:05] house, I really did sell my house
[34:06] before I left. Then I said, "This is
[34:08] all the money I have for you. My camera
[34:10] was dropped and doesn’t work well;
[34:12] the back is covered in plastic wrap
[34:14] because of light leaks." He looked at
[34:16] me and asked, "Where are you going?" I
[34:18] replied, "I’m going to spend ten
[34:20] years walking across China," and I
[34:21] repeated it again. Then this guy, who
[34:23] clearly looked like the leader, told
[34:25] the other three, "He’s had it rough,
[34:27] let him go." My heart was pounding; I
[34:29] was holding my tripod, which had a
[34:31] self-defense tool inside, ready to
[34:33] fight.
[34:34] >> I thought, if they try to hit me,
[34:35] I’ll fight them.
[34:36] >> As it turned out, they just rode their
[34:38] bikes down the mountain. Oh, I breathed
[34:39] a sigh of relief and started walking
[34:41] forward. But I hadn't gone very far.
[34:43] The motorcycle came back up. I thought,
[34:45] they aren't letting me go. As long as
[34:47] you don't take my life, you can have
[34:49] whatever you want. They came right up
[34:51] to me, almost right in front of me.
[34:53] Could you outrun them? If I ran uphill,
[34:55] they wouldn’t be able to catch up.
[34:57] You'd definitely be a target. I was
[35:00] right there beside them. I was ready;
[35:02] if they wanted the camera, I’d give
[35:04] it, and all that money, I’d give it
[35:05] too. They reached me without even
[35:07] getting off the bike, just resting one
[35:09] foot on the ground. "Can we be friends?
[35:11] " I was stunned. Just ten or twenty
[35:14] minutes ago, they were going to rob me,
[35:17] and now they want to be friends.
[35:19] >> I just nodded, I just kept nodding. "
[35:21] It's because we see you've had it tough
[35:23] and you're a real man. We’re heading
[35:25] down to the Ten Great Halls." Yes,
[35:27] it’s a small village, and that’s
[35:29] where I walked from. "We bought you
[35:31] some stuff." A plastic bag with a few
[35:33] bottles of mineral water—back then,
[35:36] that was the one-yuan local water—and
[35:38] a few packs of biscuits, the rolled-up
[35:41] kind, about that long and thick. "You
[35:43] definitely won't make it out of these
[35:45] mountains tonight, so take some food."
[35:47] Oh, I was speechless. After I took it,
[35:50] he asked me—right after I took it. "
[35:51] Do you have a pen and paper?"
[35:53] >> Hmm.
[35:54] >> I said, "I do, I write a diary every
[35:56] day.""Write down my number. If anyone
[35:58] bullies you within a few dozen
[35:59] kilometers, you call me." The phone.
[36:01] >> A phone? So you had cell phones back
[36:03] then, right?
[36:04] >> Yes, we did.
[36:05] >> You could receive calls anytime?
[36:06] >> Yes, could you use an analog phone?
[36:08] Back then.
[36:09] >> Uh, could you go online? That...that...
[36:12] >> No internet, no internet. Then I wrote
[36:15] down the number, and they rode down the
[36:17] mountain.
[36:17] >> This is a story of ice and fire that
[36:20] I’m sharing.
[36:20] >> No. They didn't rob me; they helped me.
[36:24] They’re quite well-known in that area
[36:26] , within a radius of dozens of
[36:28] kilometers. If I ever run into trouble,
[36:30] I can just give them a call.
[36:32] >> A hero, right? Isn't he a hero who just
[36:35] walked over?
[36:36] >> This person doing something like this,
[36:38] if you really think about it. It's
[36:40] something that can be stopped at any
[36:42] time.
[36:42] >> Right.
[36:43] >> It can be abandoned at any time. Why do
[36:45] I think he’s different from us? Take
[36:47] losing weight, for example. If I say
[36:49] I’ll eat one salad a day but get
[36:50] hungry, will you forgive yourself? If
[36:52] you're hungry, you indulge yourself a
[36:54] little. He isn’t a real primitive
[36:56] person. Mhm.
[36:57] >> He can return to the city or end this
[36:59] life-or-death situation at any time,
[37:02] right? But can you step back? No one is
[37:05] pressuring you, but here is someone
[37:08] voluntarily placing themselves in a
[37:10] desperate situation—a situation they
[37:13] could retreat from or abandon—so what
[37:16] makes them push forward to the very end
[37:18] ?
[37:19] >> Well, for one thing, I feel that my
[37:21] childhood wishes and dreams were never
[37:24] realized. Back when I was in elementary
[37:26] school, I wanted to be a doctor. I
[37:28] loved reading, and my grades were
[37:30] actually really good. Just a while ago,
[37:33] I went to visit my homeroom teacher. I
[37:35] went to see my teacher; she’s 77
[37:37] years old now. I even cried that day. I
[37:40] only finished three and a half years of
[37:43] elementary school. Elementary school.
[37:45] Back then, I wanted to be a doctor. I
[37:47] didn't ask for anything else; I just
[37:49] wanted to heal my parents 'illnesses.
[37:51] But in the end, I didn't even finish
[37:52] elementary school, so I couldn't be a
[37:54] doctor. Then, for my second dream, I
[37:55] wanted to join the army. I started
[37:57] working away from home when I was 15.
[37:59] My mother passed away when I was 13,
[38:00] and my father passed away when I was
[38:02] 15. I was the one who buried my father.
[38:03] Many people know I have older brothers
[38:05] and sisters. Why, if you have siblings,
[38:07] were you the youngest one to bury your
[38:09] father? Because it was from Hunan. My
[38:11] mother passed away in Hunan, then my
[38:13] father took me to a mountain in Wuchang
[38:15] . And two years later, my father passed
[38:17] away there. My older brothers and
[38:19] sisters...my sister was married, some
[38:20] of my brothers were married, and others
[38:22] were out working, so I was the one
[38:24] staying by my father's side. I borrowed
[38:26] the coffin and the burial clothes.
[38:28] Later, I sold everything we had in the
[38:30] house. Back then, we had less than 200
[38:33] yuan. The coffin and burial clothes
[38:35] cost 170 yuan. After I paid everything
[38:37] back, I was left with only 27.40 yuan.
[38:40] Carrying a bag and heading towards the
[38:41] assembly point, I wondered, how could I
[38:43] support myself until I'm 18? I decided
[38:45] to join the army. At 18, I went to the
[38:47] local armed forces department to sign
[38:49] up. I passed the physical, but everyone
[38:50] wanted to join back then. Life was
[38:52] tough, wasn't it?
[38:53] >> Joining the army wasn't easy. I wanted
[38:55] to join. I thought, I have no parents,
[38:57] so I'll give my life to the army. But
[38:59] that wish didn't come true, so I worked
[39:01] odd jobs to earn money and support
[39:02] myself first. That's how it went. In
[39:04] '87 I saw the oil stamps, and in '89 I
[39:06] saw "A Foolish Attempt." Of course,
[39:08] Xuanzang and—I really love "Journey
[39:09] to the West"—this Xuanzang also gave
[39:11] me some inspiration. I feel that going
[39:13] out into the world is still rewarding.
[39:15] >> I am especially curious about those ten
[39:17] years he spent preparing.
[39:18] >> Right. It just shows how strong a sense
[39:21] of purpose he had. For example, we
[39:23] might have these grand ideals or
[39:25] impulses, but for those ten years, he
[39:27] did a certain number of push-ups every
[39:29] day. He was preparing in such a
[39:31] concrete way for ten years; it's easy
[39:33] to give up.
[39:34] >> Right. During those ten years, to put
[39:37] it in one sentence—and I joke with
[39:38] them—I was just putting myself
[39:39] through the wringer, but it was a
[39:41] purposeful struggle.
[39:42] >> One thing was every day
[39:44] >> running kilometers, sometimes more,
[39:46] sometimes less, 2,000 sit-ups, 800
[39:49] push-ups in four sets—that's 500
[39:51] sit-ups and 200 push-ups per set. I
[39:53] wouldn't let it affect my work or my
[39:56] business; I had to finish them.
[39:57] >> Everyone thinks this pack is very heavy
[40:00] . Before I finally set off, I spent
[40:02] about half a year increasing my sandbag
[40:04] weight from 30 jin to 70 jin, and I ran
[40:06] 10 kilometers with the sandbags. Of
[40:08] course, it's different from actually
[40:10] going out there. Training your body is
[40:12] not the same as being out on the road.
[40:14] You're in a small environment, but once
[40:16] you set off, there's no turning back,
[40:18] and plus
[40:18] >> Hmm.
[40:19] >> Teacher Wentao, I did one more thing,
[40:21] and many people really thought I was a
[40:23] bit mentally...Less than two months
[40:25] before departure, I went to the
[40:26] hospital and told the doctor, "Doctor,
[40:28] I want to have my appendix removed."
[40:30] The doctor, who was busy with work,
[40:32] asked, "Do you have acute appendicitis
[40:34] or chronic?" I said, "I don't have
[40:36] appendicitis. I'm going to the
[40:37] Northeast.""What nonsense are you
[40:39] spouting? I'm busy right now. You don't
[40:41] have appendicitis, so why remove it?
[40:43] Get out of here, go somewhere else!"
[40:45] >> You are just truly visionary.
[40:47] >> This is stupidity—getting
[40:49] appendicitis on the road, almost dying
[40:50] on the road. I learned that from him.
[40:52] >> Oh. I said, why can’t I get my
[40:54] appendix removed if I don’t have
[40:55] appendicitis? So I took those documents
[40:57] , those 16 medical certificates, and
[40:59] showed them to him. I said I want to
[41:01] hike across China for 10 years, I’ll
[41:02] be exploring, exploring uninhabited
[41:04] areas; I need to get my appendix
[41:05] removed, or I won’t be able to save
[41:07] myself. And the next day, they removed
[41:09] the appendix.
[41:10] >> Oh, my. So, you see, he’s a tough guy
[41:13] , just like we said at the beginning.
[41:15] Why would someone do that? You are the
[41:18] first person like this that I have ever
[41:20] met. We know there are people like
[41:22] hikers, climbers, those who engage in
[41:24] these dangerous activities, but I
[41:26] really think you’re the first one
[41:28] I’ve met face-to-face. I mean, why?
[41:31] To be blunt, why? Is it worth risking
[41:34] your life for? See, I at least seem to
[41:36] have found a reason: he is very filial.
[41:38] Before his father passed away, he told
[41:40] him he had to make something of himself
[41:42] . And what does "making something of
[41:43] yourself" mean?
[41:44] >> I didn't understand it at the time.
[41:46] What is "the look"? I thought it meant
[41:49] making money, working hard, being a
[41:52] law-abiding citizen. So, back then, I
[41:54] did a lot of small businesses. Then I
[41:57] learned masonry. I was a small mason, a
[42:00] steel worker; I even took on some small
[42:03] construction jobs. In that era, by the
[42:06] late 80s, I was already doing quite
[42:08] well in that region. But I felt like I
[42:12] was killing myself just to make money.
[42:14] In my life, I’ve had no education, no
[42:17] diploma, and many people looked down on
[42:20] me, especially when I was young. I
[42:22] still come back to that: I have a bit
[42:24] of a competitive spirit. I’m walking
[42:26] across China; no one controls me, and I
[42:28] don’t need to register with anyone.
[42:30] I’ll just do it myself. So, actually,
[42:33] I spent ten years preparing. To be
[42:35] honest, I am someone who is afraid of
[42:37] death. I am quite afraid of death. If I
[42:39] weren't afraid of dying, I wouldn't
[42:41] have prepared for so many years. First
[42:43] of all, I entered society at 15. I
[42:45] started preparing at 25 and didn't set
[42:47] out until 35. That means I spent 20
[42:49] years making money and 10 years
[42:51] preparing. I think, if I had set out in
[42:53] my 20s, I would ask myself: could I
[42:55] have persisted? There were too many
[42:58] temptations. In my 30s, at the age of "
[43:00] standing firm," maybe my experience and
[43:02] self-control are a little bit better.
[43:04] That’s why I chose to set out in my
[43:07] 30s. I could have done it in my 20s,
[43:09] but I didn’t. Besides, I felt I
[43:11] wasn't fully prepared. With 9.6 million
[43:14] square kilometers of vast land, where
[43:16] do you go, how do you go, and why? I
[43:19] asked myself, I asked others, and they
[43:21] all said I was crazy. They’d say I
[43:24] had too much money and time on my hands
[43:26] , or that I was just trying to escape
[43:28] something. But I wasn't escaping
[43:30] anything at all.
[43:31] >> How did you answer yourself?
[43:33] >> I thought of those from that era—
[43:35] those who drifted down the Yangtze and
[43:37] Yellow Rivers, walked the Great Wall,
[43:39] and Yu Chunshun who traveled on foot. I
[43:41] truly envied those people. To be able
[43:44] to take the one thing you love most in
[43:46] life and push it to the limit. Many of
[43:48] them even died in the Yangtze, the
[43:51] Yellow River, or the Yalu River, just
[43:53] disappearing while on the road. I
[43:55] realized I could do this too. If they
[43:58] could do it, why couldn't I? There’s
[44:00] no barrier to entry. What if I actually
[44:02] managed to finish it? What if I could
[44:05] see it through? Is it to become famous?
[44:07] Not entirely for fame, but I did think,
[44:10] if I succeed, I can show those friends
[44:12] and relatives who looked down on me
[44:14] when I was young—look, just look.
[44:16] >> He had a fire in his belly; he was
[44:18] determined to make a name for himself.
[44:20] >> That’s true ambition; it really is
[44:22] ambition, isn't it?
[44:23] >> But you know, many people have that
[44:25] drive, yet they never commit to it for
[44:27] the long haul.
[44:27] >> They just hold that breath.
[44:29] >> Action, exactly. Yes, putting it into
[44:32] action—in a planned, sustainable way
[44:34] —that’s a different story. Plenty
[44:37] of people have drive.
[44:38] >> Some people compare Yu Chunshun to him.
[44:41] They say Yu represents the 80 s—he
[44:44] was more emotional and impulsive. But
[44:47] Lei Dian is more about rational
[44:49] exploration. He isn't out to die;
[44:52] he’s fully prepared. Besides, with
[44:56] GPS now, it’s not a suicidal mission,
[44:59] right? That’s why you see him
[45:01] coaching hikers and trekkers now. He
[45:04] has so much survival knowledge and
[45:07] expertise. Of course, the risk of death
[45:10] is still very real.
[45:12] >> To be able to spend a lifetime doing
[45:15] one thing, to pull off such a feat.
[45:20] >> As science advances, will this kind of
[45:22] trekking become less risky in the
[45:24] future? The risk, the risk still exists
[45:28] . Every year, people still perish in
[45:30] uninhabited areas. It happens every
[45:33] year. Do you think before people die—
[45:36] since you’ve likely experienced those
[45:38] near-death moments—what do you think
[45:40] goes through their minds? At the time,
[45:44] I didn't have any thoughts; I just
[45:46] focused on surviving the present moment
[45:48] . Whether encountering sandstorms,
[45:51] mudslides, avalanches, wild animals, or
[45:53] extreme weather, I just thought about
[45:56] making it through. I went to Motuo,
[45:58] because back then, it was the only
[46:00] county with no road access. I went in
[46:02] from Bomi and climbed over the
[46:04] snow-capped mountains. Even in July and
[46:06] August, the ice and snow there were
[46:08] several meters thick. And that night,
[46:11] it was raining and snowing. I didn't
[46:14] really have any gear; it was too
[46:16] primitive, but even with that, I found
[46:18] a way. I even farmed in the countryside
[46:20] , and the way I farmed was different.
[46:23] On the north bank of the Songhua River,
[46:25] I grew two crops a year. In the 1980s,
[46:27] nobody could beat me. I grew "sticky
[46:30] corn"—in the spring, I’d start the
[46:33] seedlings indoors until they were this
[46:35] tall. By May, I would transplant them
[46:38] into the fields. While others were just
[46:40] sowing seeds, my seedlings had already
[46:43] grown quite tall. After harvesting my
[46:45] corn, I sold it, plowed the stalks back
[46:47] in, and planted radishes and cabbage.
[46:50] Two crops a year, that’s how it was.
[46:52] >> Well said, and our Mr. Xu has also
[46:55] plowed fields and grown rice.
[46:58] >> I’ve also done a lot of farm work,
[47:00] including what we mentioned earlier
[47:02] about death. I’ve seen death on
[47:05] construction sites; I’ve watched all
[47:08] kinds of people pass away right beside
[47:10] me. It happens. Actually, none of us
[47:13] can control the length of our lives.
[47:16] What we can control is the substance
[47:18] within it. We can control achieving
[47:21] some of our little dreams. So this path
[47:24] could be called a journey of living
[47:26] toward death, but I had ten years of
[47:29] full preparation, burning my bridges—
[47:31] I haven't lived a normal life, and I'm
[47:34] planning to push on for another ten
[47:37] years. I sold my house, and I like
[47:40] collecting small things—stamps, coins
[47:43] , silver—I sold it all and told
[47:45] myself: Whatever you do, whatever you
[47:48] want to do, take it to the extreme; the
[47:51] result isn't that important, I just
[47:53] really love the process. Including the
[47:57] process of eating raw snake meat?
[47:59] >> Yes.
[48:00] >> Isn't that miserable?
[48:02] >> Pain mixed with joy. You see it as
[48:05] misery, but I am admiring the beautiful
[48:07] landscapes, the mountains, the rivers,
[48:09] and the songs and dances of different
[48:11] ethnic groups.
[48:11] >> We're not talking about adventure today
[48:13] ; we're talking about philosophy.
[48:15] >> Right.
[48:16] >> You're a philosopher, aren't you? Your
[48:18] philosophy is one forged by walking.
[48:21] >> No, no, not at all. What you just said
[48:24] reminds me of when I went to the
[48:25] Northwest, where there was zero light
[48:27] pollution on the ground. The Milky Way
[48:29] was incredibly bright then. When you're
[48:32] all alone at night, doesn't it feel
[48:34] like the whole world is so far away?
[48:36] You're there all by yourself, thinking
[48:38] about how many people are still
[48:39] struggling and feeling miserable over
[48:41] things that don't matter. It’s that
[48:43] sense of helplessness. You realize, I'm
[48:45] here enjoying nature, and this land
[48:47] belongs to me for now. So, do you feel
[48:49] lonely? Don't you wish someone were
[48:51] there to share it? Did you want someone
[48:53] by your side at the time?
[48:54] >> Uh, there were lonely moments. I felt
[48:56] very lonely when I got sick, thinking
[48:58] about this and that, missing my family,
[49:00] wishing a friend were there to give me
[49:02] some water or a few pills. No,
[49:04] everything had to be done by myself.
[49:06] >> It wouldn't be bad if you ran into a "
[49:08] White Bone Spirit" out there.
[49:10] >> I’ve met people on the road, I have.
[49:13] >> Really?
[49:14] >> They tracked me all the way from
[49:16] Beijing to Xinjiang just to find me. Oh
[49:18] , look at that—beauty loves a hero,
[49:21] right?
[49:21] >> The manager of the Mosuo Villa in
[49:24] Yunnan let me stay there for a few days
[49:26] for free, just to really experience the
[49:29] Mosuo culture.
[49:30] >> Later, in the land of daughters, at
[49:32] night, a girl...
[49:33] >> She wanted to "walk marriage" with me.
[49:36] You can't say I wasn't tempted, but I
[49:37] thought, they’re providing my food
[49:39] and board, and if I did that, what
[49:41] would I be? So I just kept the
[49:42] discomfort to myself.
[49:43] >> I'm throwing questions at you.
[49:45] >> That’s impressive, very impressive.
[49:48] You’re still the impressive one. You
[49:50] really would have stayed long ago and
[49:52] never been able to set off. That was
[49:55] back in 2008, but you see, hiking today
[49:58] ......
[50:00] >> has become a new lifestyle for many
[50:03] young people. I know some young people,
[50:05] and I ask them why they always go
[50:07] hiking in the Beijing suburbs on
[50:09] weekends. They say it's great
[50:10] specifically because there's no signal,
[50:12] so the boss can't reach them, right?
[50:14] They actually look for places with no
[50:16] cell service, and there are many guides
[50:19] for that now. It's a kind of spiritual
[50:22] experience. Many think young people are
[50:26] deteriorating, but I think, perhaps,
[50:28] they are evolving past us. Every day is
[50:32] about the "996" work schedule, all that
[50:34] pressure, and the cutthroat competition
[50:36] . They find ways to torment themselves;
[50:39] sometimes there’s even a sense of
[50:41] competition in it. They measure
[50:42] themselves by the amount of hardship
[50:44] they can endure.
[50:45] >> That’s a high level of dedication.
[50:47] Are you a thunder god? So, have you
[50:49] become a god? Don't you think people
[50:52] have a bit of that spirit in them? Last
[50:54] time, I remember hearing a scholar say
[50:56] there is a pleasure center in the brain
[50:59] .
[50:59] >> But this pain center and pleasure
[51:02] center are located very close to each
[51:04] other; when the pain center discharges,
[51:06] the pleasure center is affected. So
[51:09] this sometimes explains why, after
[51:11] enduring some torment or suffering, the
[51:14] sweetness one feels is considered—
[51:17] well, we think this person has, say,
[51:19] intensity, or strength, or that this
[51:22] kind of enjoyment has a real kick.
[51:25] It’s like you need to have some
[51:27] bitterness so that the joy you reach
[51:29] feels even higher.
[51:31] >> In aesthetics, this is called the "
[51:34] sublime." The sublime, for instance,
[51:37] involves crashing waves, the vast ocean
[51:40] , or jagged rocks; its classic
[51:42] definition is fear at a distance.
[51:45] People like fear with a distance, but
[51:46] this fear—take Huangshan Mountain,
[51:48] for example; when you reach the Tiandu
[51:50] Peak, you feel very scared, right? But
[51:52] there’s an iron chain there. If that
[51:54] iron chain weren't there, you wouldn't
[51:56] be able to appreciate it; you’d just
[51:58] flee immediately.
[51:59] >> They are the ones challenging that very
[52:02] line.
[52:02] >> Without the chain—I was chatting with
[52:04] two buddies the other day, and you see,
[52:06] there are two types of people. One type
[52:09] just doesn't like chasing girls. They
[52:11] say, "I only like those who like me; if
[52:13] you don't like me, I’m not willing to
[52:15] chase you, I’m afraid of being
[52:17] rejected." I think that's just no fun.
[52:20] But the other is the exact opposite; he
[52:21] says, "I like the one I keep chasing
[52:23] but can't catch, who's always
[52:24] dismissing me, hitting me down, and
[52:25] being wrong.""The more wrong they are,
[52:27] the more I forget myself.""I just want
[52:29] to pursue them," he says. After going
[52:31] through thousands of hardships and
[52:32] finally winning them over, he adds, "
[52:34] That is what I find the most enjoyable.
[52:36] "
[52:36] >> I’ve also come across the idea that
[52:38] suffering gives you a particularly
[52:41] strong sense of the present moment.
[52:43] Because at that time, you have to focus
[52:45] everything on dealing with this pain,
[52:47] or this danger, or this fear; that is
[52:50] your so-called presence. Take hiking,
[52:52] for example: step by step, with every
[52:55] step you think, "Do I stop or go?"
[52:57] Every step is a choice, and you are the
[52:59] sum of your choices. At that moment,
[53:02] every step is the present; you have no
[53:04] distractions, you are highly focused.
[53:06] Just like the rock climbing we
[53:08] mentioned earlier, every single moment
[53:11] is the present. In reality, we often
[53:13] don't live in the present; we live in
[53:15] anxiety about the future, or regret
[53:17] over the past; we are not living in
[53:19] this very moment.
[53:20] >> So this moment is actually a byproduct
[53:23] of deep immersion—a sense of joy and
[53:26] happiness.
[53:26] >> Ah, you’ve provided the best
[53:28] explanation for that classic line.
[53:30] Every step counts.
[53:32] >> Right. Isn't it?
[53:34] >> It's not about where you end up in the
[53:36] process.
[53:36] >> Let me tell you a story about when I
[53:38] went to Shennongjia.
[53:39] >> Mm-hmm.
[53:40] >> Uh, there’s always been a legend
[53:42] about a wildman in Shennongjia. I
[53:44] consider myself a grassroots explorer,
[53:46] and I've trekked through all the
[53:48] primary forests in Shennongjia. I went
[53:50] to Shennongjia, bought plenty of film,
[53:52] some flatbreads, crackers, and packed
[53:54] some pickled vegetables before heading
[53:56] in. It was rainy and misty with high
[53:59] humidity, so I protected my camera with
[54:02] several layers of covering. If I could
[54:05] spot a wildman, I’d snap a picture
[54:06] immediately; that would be such an
[54:08] achievement. I searched for about ten
[54:11] days. I didn't even see a hair of a
[54:13] wildman; I became a wildman myself.
[54:14] >> I ran out of food.
[54:16] >> Your look just now was quite similar,
[54:18] too. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[54:20] >> I had no food left, so I started to
[54:23] panic and headed back out. Back then, I
[54:26] just had a compass and a map to roughly
[54:29] figure out the direction. My sense of
[54:32] direction is decent; even if you
[54:34] dropped me anywhere, even in a
[54:35] sandstorm with visibility under ten
[54:37] meters, I could basically find my way
[54:40] out. I’ve never gotten lost in these
[54:42] ten years. But as you walk, you're
[54:44] burdened with a heavy pack, and I was
[54:46] even chased by a herd of wild boars. I
[54:49] had some odds and ends on me, and they
[54:51] were basically all smelly. So when the
[54:54] wild boars came, I climbed up a tree. I
[54:56] had a pack of firecrackers wrapped in
[54:59] plastic, so I lit them and tossed them
[55:01] down. The way those boars ran and
[55:03] crashed into the trees—that scene was
[55:05] just incredible, you know. Later on,
[55:08] when I was hungry, I ate tree leaves
[55:10] and some plant roots. If I didn't
[55:13] recognize something, I’d pile up
[55:16] different varieties, squeeze out the
[55:18] juice, and force some big ants to eat
[55:21] it. If they died after a while, I
[55:24] wouldn't eat it, but if they stayed
[55:26] lively, I’d eat it. But that wasn't
[55:28] accurate; my hands swelled up like
[55:31] carrots afterward—it was toxic, or at
[55:33] least had traces of poison. Ah.
[55:36] >> After eating leaves for three days, I
[55:38] finally caught a snake; technically, as
[55:40] a so-called grassroots environmentalist
[55:42] , catching a snake didn't feel quite
[55:44] right. Of course, it’s not a
[55:46] protected species, just a grass snake.
[55:49] I was starving. After dressing it, it
[55:52] was nearly two meters long even without
[55:54] the head. I skinned it, carried it, and
[55:56] looked for dry wood, but it was raining
[55:59] and there was nothing dry. I couldn't
[56:01] just throw it away, so I used a razor
[56:02] to slice it up and sprinkled some salt
[56:04] on the strips. When I put it in my
[56:06] mouth, the nerves were still active,
[56:08] jumping around in my mouth—that’s
[56:10] how I ate the snake. Sure enough, half
[56:11] an hour after eating, I had the
[56:13] strength to keep going. I walked for
[56:15] nearly two more days until I found a
[56:17] small village. You see paths made by
[56:19] people looking for things in the
[56:21] mountains, but some aren't made by
[56:23] humans. Bears have bear paths, wild
[56:25] boars have theirs, and wild animals
[56:27] have their own tracks. You can see fur
[56:30] snagged on things—that’s not right;
[56:32] you shouldn't follow those paths. Yeah.
[56:35] >> So.
[56:36] >> I ended up in a bear’s den.
[56:38] >> I found a small village, a tiny one
[56:40] deep in the mountains. When I entered,
[56:43] I saw women and elderly people chatting
[56:46] and watching over children. As soon as
[56:48] they saw me, they all ran inside. I
[56:50] thought, I just want to buy something,
[56:52] I finally found a village! They
[56:54] wouldn't open the door when I knocked,
[56:55] so I eventually found a grocery store
[56:57] made of cardboard. After fumbling with
[56:59] a pen, there were three characters, "
[57:00] Grocery Store," hanging by the door. I
[57:02] just walked in. Once I was inside, a
[57:04] man came at me, ready to hit me, "Who
[57:06] are you?""Get out now!" I said, "I'm
[57:08] just a customer.""What? What kind of
[57:10] customer?""You're not a customer!" I
[57:12] said, "I have my credentials. I went to
[57:13] the Shennong area looking for wildmen
[57:15] but didn't find any. I haven't eaten in
[57:16] days; I just want to buy some food." I
[57:18] showed him my ID and photos. After he
[57:20] looked at them, I bought some things—
[57:22] I noticed everything was covered in
[57:24] dust. I bought a bottle of beer to
[57:25] soothe myself, along with a can of
[57:27] sardines.
[57:27] >> Ah.
[57:28] >> Then some pickled mustard greens and
[57:30] instant noodles. After soaking them, it
[57:32] smelled so good. Before they were even
[57:35] fully cooked, I started eating. While
[57:37] eating, I thought about the journey,
[57:38] how I had been to Shennong and although
[57:40] I didn't find the wildman, I made it
[57:42] out, which was a good thing. It tasted
[57:44] so good that I intentionally burped,
[57:47] you know? Four items, I was carefully
[57:49] checking the labels, three out of the
[57:51] four were expired, some for over two
[57:53] years. But they still tasted great, you
[57:56] know, that feeling of happiness in that
[57:58] moment. There’s one way to be happy,
[58:00] which is self-indulgence, but there’s
[58:02] another way—to suffer first before
[58:04] enjoying. You’ll truly understand it
[58:06] once you’ve been hungry for a few
[58:08] days; anything you eat will be
[58:09] delicious, better than lobster.
[58:11] >> It’s about connecting with basic
[58:13] human nature. But in reality, your
[58:16] story is like Robinson Crusoe. Your
[58:19] whole story is about someone from
[58:21] modern society. Arriving in a natural
[58:25] place with no social conditions. How
[58:28] does a person survive there?
[58:30] >> Do you think it’s a bit like your
[58:32] favorite, Jack London?
[58:33] >> Yes, it’s along the same lines.
[58:36] >> It’s all like Robinson Crusoe; it
[58:38] involves elements of civilization, like
[58:41] the camera you brought, right? You have
[58:44] scientific tools, a compass. But
[58:47] essentially, you intentionally placed
[58:49] yourself in an unsocialized situation
[58:52] where there are no people. There’s no
[58:55] way to get supplies, and at that moment
[58:57] , the greatest test is testing yourself
[59:00] . You also inspire others; you could
[59:04] start a school in the future, where
[59:06] many people come to learn basic safety
[59:08] guidelines for hiking, but your core
[59:11] message is that we are all connected,
[59:13] we are all like this. After a certain
[59:19] age, you choose your own path, and for
[59:22] that path—whether you’re doing
[59:24] research, climbing mountains, making
[59:26] programs, or running a factory—you
[59:29] pour your entire life into it.
[59:32] >> Right.
[59:34] >> People around you will ask, "For what?"
[59:37] You’ve opened a factory, made shows,
[59:40] published ten books—what for? For
[59:43] nothing. It’s just that we don't know
[59:46] when we decided we wanted to do this.
[59:50] You chose an extreme path to do this,
[59:53] but the spirit is the same for all of
[59:56] us.
[59:57] >> After this journey, do you feel like
[59:59] you’ve changed as a person?
[60:01] >> I have changed. First of all, following
[60:04] what Teacher Xu said, I’m actually
[60:07] not that high-minded. I only finished
[60:09] about three years of elementary school,
[60:11] so these ten years were like a solitary
[60:14] study for me. I went out alone to see
[60:16] the world, to temper myself, and to
[60:19] challenge myself.
[60:20] >> To travel ten thousand miles is to read
[60:22] ten thousand books. When I was young, I
[60:25] was looked down upon by my relatives
[60:27] and friends, especially my relatives.
[60:30] We couldn't even afford cornmeal
[60:32] porridge, let alone a simple corn bun.
[60:35] I wanted to use this first journey to
[60:37] prove myself; to be honest, I even
[60:39] hated them back then. But before I even
[60:41] finished the walk, I let it all go; I
[60:44] let everything go. I realized life
[60:47] shouldn't be lived with so much
[60:49] struggle. I learned that going from
[60:51] pain to endurance, from acceptance to
[60:53] enjoyment, is just a part of life's
[60:55] journey.
[60:56] >> A learning process.
[60:58] >> From pain to endurance, from acceptance
[61:00] to enjoyment. This is a path of
[61:03] spiritual cultivation. On the road, I
[61:05] met and visited many masters and
[61:08] mentors in various fields. I remember
[61:10] most clearly when I reached Anqing,
[61:13] Anhui, where there is a Yingjiang
[61:15] Temple on the north bank of the Yangtze
[61:17] River. I have a deep love for ancient
[61:20] pagodas, and I have found most of the
[61:22] ancient pagodas in China.
[61:24] >> Oh, that’s wonderful! I love them too
[61:27] .
[61:27] >> There is a pagoda there called the
[61:29] Zhenfeng Pagoda. I went to see it, and
[61:31] the abbot introduced me to the
[61:33] vice-abbot. We talked for a long time,
[61:35] and he finally said to me, "Child,
[61:37] walking is a form of practice." I
[61:39] didn't dare to contradict him at the
[61:41] time; he was a great and virtuous monk.
[61:43] As just a common person, I accepted
[61:46] whatever he said. Two years later, when
[61:48] I reached Tibet, I heard that he had
[61:51] passed away. I bowed deeply three times
[61:53] in the direction of Anqing. It suddenly
[61:56] occurred to me: isn't life everywhere a
[61:58] form of practice? If walking is
[62:00] practice, isn't reading also practice?
[62:02] Isn't working in a factory a form of
[62:03] practice? Everything is practice. What
[62:06] kind of practice? Practicing your
[62:07] behavior and cultivating your heart.
[62:09] >> It is not an outward practice, but an
[62:11] inward one. Cultivating oneself; so at
[62:13] that moment, I let go of all those past
[62:16] grudges.
[62:16] >> So you have now become, for example, a
[62:18] more optimistic person, or someone who
[62:20] is less calculating?
[62:21] >> I am very optimistic.
[62:23] >> After you finished these 10 years, look
[62:25] , you finished in 2008. But do you ever
[62:28] feel empty? You aren't doing those
[62:29] large-scale projects anymore either,
[62:31] right?
[62:31] >> I don't; I don't feel empty at all. In
[62:33] these 17 years, apart from the pandemic
[62:36] —and I even had some activities
[62:38] during the pandemic—I’ve given over
[62:40] 2,000 talks, and not a single one was
[62:42] initiated by me. To put it bluntly,
[62:44] aside from crematoriums and mental
[62:46] hospitals, I’ve been everywhere. You
[62:49] name a place, and I’ve been there to
[62:51] share my experiences. From the start, I
[62:53] didn't know what to say when I went up
[62:55] there. I just couldn't connect. Later,
[62:57] performing for the troops, they were
[62:59] all so young. I had some stage fright,
[63:01] so I’d drink three or four ounces of
[63:03] liquor to get myself tipsy. Back then,
[63:05] liquid courage was the trick. You just
[63:07] go for it, thinking, "I'm drunk anyway.
[63:09] "
[63:09] >> I think doing over 2,000 shows is even
[63:11] harder than traveling across the
[63:13] country.
[63:13] >> So he talks about suffering and
[63:16] enduring. Accepting.
[63:18] >> Accepting, enjoying, one after another
[63:20] —originally, both things were...
[63:21] >> Originally, it was all practiced and
[63:24] honed.
[63:24] >> It’s truly a total transformation.
[63:27] >> I think this is a form of wealth—like
[63:29] what you just said, being in the desert
[63:31] , like a giant cauldron, with only you
[63:33] there.
[63:33] >> Small as an ant.
[63:35] >> Yes, that sense of cosmic scale—when
[63:37] you're completely different from the
[63:39] reference frame, I think every time you
[63:41] reflect on it, you realize everything
[63:43] in daily life is nothing.
[63:44] >> Right. Have you ever experienced a
[63:47] sense of self-dissolution? Like feeling
[63:49] as if you no longer exist. Only when
[63:51] walking alone in that vast, empty space
[63:54] —in the primeval forest, the desert,
[63:57] or the snow-capped mountains—just me,
[63:59] alone.
[64:00] >> Hmm, how does that change a person?
[64:02] Faced with such a vast scale, I feel
[64:05] that in this life, when you compare
[64:07] yourself to the earth and the universe,
[64:10] you're smaller than an ant. What’s
[64:12] the point of being so petty? So, I
[64:14] often tell my friends, "Everyone has
[64:17] difficulties. If you haven't had hard
[64:19] times, you haven't really lived. If
[64:22] you've never encountered a villain, it
[64:24] proves you haven't done anything. You
[64:27] only have no villains when you've done
[64:29] nothing at all." So, I say learn to let
[64:32] go, but don't give up. Don't give up on
[64:34] your dreams, but let go of those
[64:35] trivial matters.
[64:36] >> But give up.
[64:38] >> But learn to relax without being
[64:39] self-indulgent.
[64:40] >> And let go.
[64:41] >> Learn to relax without being
[64:42] self-indulgent—that’s how the 2,000
[64:44] -plus performances came out.
[64:45] >> If your life's strings are pulled too
[64:47] tight, you're really just fighting
[64:49] against your own fate. It's not worth
[64:51] it. Let go of those minor entanglements
[64:53] ; time is the best medicine. It really
[64:56] is. The things you’re struggling with
[64:58] today, in two or three years, when you
[65:00] look back, you'll wonder why you were
[65:01] like that. That’s like many people
[65:03] who have had near-death experiences.
[65:05] >> Sometimes they reach that kind of
[65:07] realization. Wouldn't you say the whole
[65:10] journey is a form of learning? Does it
[65:12] increase your knowledge?
[65:15] >> It doesn't increase knowledge much, but
[65:17] it definitely grows with age and
[65:20] experience.
[65:21] >> Also, you get to meet many respected
[65:23] people you want to learn from,
[65:25] including the three of you. The kind of
[65:28] knowledge and experience you three have
[65:31] is something I can't catch up to,
[65:33] though I often say something that may
[65:35] not even be right. A person must play
[65:37] to their strengths and hide their
[65:38] weaknesses throughout their life.
[65:40] >> A family, a team, or a company must be
[65:42] about leveraging strengths and
[65:44] compensating for weaknesses. If you
[65:46] force me to be a scientist, I’d be
[65:48] finished! I couldn't be one, and if you
[65:50] wanted to be an astronaut, I couldn't
[65:52] do that either. So, just take the one
[65:54] thing you love and do it well. Reaching
[65:56] the ultimate is enough. As for what the
[65:59] outcome will be or what you'll harvest,
[66:01] don't blame fate. Just doing it is
[66:03] enough; life is all about the
[66:04] experience, after all. That’s why I
[66:06] really like this quote from Laozi: "
[66:08] Knowing others is wisdom; knowing
[66:10] yourself is enlightenment.""Conquering
[66:12] others is power; conquering yourself is
[66:13] true strength." When you aren't strong,
[66:15] your parents won't be something you can
[66:17] rely on for a lifetime. You still have
[66:18] to be strong yourself, right?
[66:20] >> But Laozi didn't seem to walk across
[66:22] the whole country. He rode an ox, a
[66:24] green ox, when he passed through the
[66:26] Hangu Pass, right?
[66:28] >> I specifically...
[66:29] >> So, should we avoid high-risk
[66:31] activities?
[66:32] >> Well, I used to work in construction.
[66:34] Problems arise in construction every
[66:36] year. Every industry will face
[66:38] life-threatening risks. Look, in this
[66:41] life, who knows when I might just be
[66:43] gone or pass away? But it’s precisely
[66:45] because I cherish my life that I spent
[66:47] 10 years preparing; I’ve done my best
[66:50] to protect it. Why didn't I cross the
[66:52] Lop Nur in June? I wasn't sure I could
[66:55] handle it.
[66:56] >> Turning dangers into safety isn't
[66:58] entirely about luck; it involves
[67:00] integrating a great deal of knowledge,
[67:02] from physics to ecology and more. Where
[67:04] does his curiosity lie?
[67:06] >> My curiosity lies in: when you are in a
[67:08] completely deserted place, what is the
[67:10] dialogue between the self and the self
[67:12] like?
[67:12] >> See, we are all interested in this
[67:14] question. Yes, there is a movie called
[67:16] "The Way," about the pilgrimage trail.
[67:19] It’s about a father who is a bit like
[67:21] you; he really didn't understand his
[67:23] child, because his child loved hiking.
[67:25] Then, he really passed away in an
[67:27] accident. The father found his son's
[67:30] bucket list, which said "I must finish
[67:32] this trail," so the father set off
[67:35] carrying his ashes. At the beginning,
[67:37] he only wanted to fulfill a wish. He
[67:39] felt, "I have to do this for my son;
[67:41] perhaps I didn't understand him enough.
[67:44] " But throughout the process, he
[67:45] eventually realized he was actually
[67:47] doing it for himself. It's just as Mr.
[67:49] Lei said: setting off is the
[67:51] destination. It’s not about having to
[67:53] reach that specific place. In this
[67:55] process, because you are facing nature,
[67:57] you tend to be exceptionally honest.
[67:59] It’s a matter of life and death, or
[68:01] rather, you can't deceive yourself.
[68:03] Will you take this next step or not?
[68:05] You are constantly tapping into the
[68:07] deepest part of your heart, with no
[68:09] distractions and no impure thoughts
[68:11] left. This is like the solitary
[68:13] asceticism that many European monks
[68:16] practiced in the desert. We once
[68:18] thought this leads to tranquility, but
[68:21] experience shows that one must first go
[68:23] through a spiritual ordeal.
[68:25] >> During this process, you might even
[68:27] curse the heavens and the earth, and
[68:29] experience many negative emotions. When
[68:31] a person is truly in a desperate
[68:33] situation with no one around, they
[68:34] might first release what's inside—you
[68:36] see, he said it's easy to get irritable
[68:38] . A great deal of anxiety, and even
[68:41] mental instability, can occur.
[68:44] There’s another side to it: when you
[68:47] have enough food and drink, you can
[68:49] appreciate the snowy mountains, the
[68:51] sunrise and sunset, or sometimes catch
[68:54] a frog, some small insects, or a little
[68:57] snake, and just play around, conversing
[68:59] with them. That feeling, it's just a
[69:02] sense of profound inner peace. I feel
[69:05] that one cannot always live in a noisy
[69:08] environment; occasionally, you need to
[69:10] let yourself be still. So, while on the
[69:13] road, even with my level, I often write
[69:16] poems. You see, I could never write
[69:18] such poems back in the city.
[69:20] >> They have a poetic quality.
[69:22] >> They even have some rhythm and rhymes.
[69:25] I basically write them all down in my
[69:27] notebook. When I stay under a bridge, I
[69:29] write them down—that’s the mood of
[69:31] the moment. You can truly feel it.
[69:34] >> Experience is simply experience.
[69:36] >> Look, right in a place like this.
[69:38] >> Yes, yes, yes, this one.
[69:40] >> Writing poetry; this is the true
[69:42] essence of living today.
[69:43] >> I even hate to use the candles I
[69:45] brought along.
[69:45] >> At a time like this, a person is
[69:47] suddenly no longer a machine.
[69:49] >> Right.
[69:50] >> They gain poetic quality, romance, and
[69:53] a lot of things that seem "useless." Or
[69:56] , if we consider that the Earth will
[69:58] eventually perish, and you say that a
[70:01] person walking across the country
[70:03] risking their life is meaningless, then
[70:05] what is the meaning of choosing a job
[70:07] at a company and eventually climbing to
[70:10] become the CEO? Compared to each other,
[70:13] both are either meaningful or
[70:15] meaningless.
[70:15] >> Working in an office has its own
[70:18] hardships, but your kind of journey,
[70:20] right, straddling the line between life
[70:22] and death—it’s actually just
[70:25] setting a random aspiration, yeah.
[70:27] >> But fulfilling this aspiration seems to
[70:31] be a way to
[70:32] >> truly live one's life.
[70:34] >> You haven't lived in vain.
[70:36] >> Right.
[70:37] >> I never expected that after I finished
[70:39] this walk, others would seek me out to
[70:41] share my story. I’ve given over 2,000
[70:43] talks, ranging from audiences of a few
[70:45] dozen to over 20,000 at once. At my
[70:47] busiest, I gave four talks in a single
[70:49] day, and I was exhausted. At night, I
[70:51] felt a bit drained. Even when eating or
[70:54] drinking, I felt like my body was
[70:56] trembling. Later, I asked myself. Oh,
[70:59] maybe I should give fewer talks. Some
[71:01] really don't pay anything, they just
[71:03] buy some books, while others pay a lot,
[71:05] like large corporations; they really
[71:07] pay fees that I might not have earned
[71:09] in a whole year before. Wow, I never
[71:11] imagined that with my level, I could
[71:14] gain so much, get paid, and at the same
[71:16] time, inspire those parents, children,
[71:19] teachers, and especially students.
[71:21] I’d say on my busiest days, I’ve
[71:23] influenced 70,000 to 80,000 people.
[71:26] Even if just seven or eight kids can
[71:27] change their current worries, anxiety,
[71:29] internal competition, lack of direction
[71:31] , and lack of goals because of my
[71:33] experience. Or even "lying flat," if I
[71:35] can influence seven or eight kids, I
[71:37] know it's worth it. What is your
[71:39] attitude toward children "lying flat"?
[71:42] >> I strongly disapprove of "lying flat,"
[71:45] regardless of age. As long as we are
[71:48] alive for a day, we should—to put it
[71:51] nicely—work for our own ideals or
[71:54] dreams for that day. In fact, truly
[71:58] lying flat is more uncomfortable than
[72:00] going out and struggling. Lying flat is
[72:03] uncomfortable; it might be comfortable
[72:06] for a short while, but over time,
[72:08] it’s better to just do something.
[72:10] >> Kids today definitely live more in a
[72:13] virtual time, isn't it true that pure,
[72:15] natural things, without needing to say
[72:18] much, can give them a
[72:19] >> completely different feeling?
[72:21] >> This is what mothers are concerned
[72:23] about. I personally believe that nature
[72:25] has energy; it has an energy field.
[72:27] >> Mm.
[72:28] >> Whether it's mountains, lakes, deserts,
[72:30] grasslands, forests, or the Gobi, when
[72:32] you go there. Or with three or five
[72:34] friends, or a group, even if you are
[72:36] just well-prepared for safety, going
[72:38] there to pitch a tent and staying for a
[72:40] few days with some food. You are
[72:42] completely different when you come back
[72:44] ; your spirit is truly grounded.
[72:47] >> Especially in the big city, the
[72:49] cutthroat competition is 100%there, and
[72:53] the scheming; but in there, none of
[72:55] that exists. When a person fully enters
[72:58] a lifestyle similar to that of a
[73:01] primitive human, don't you feel like
[73:03] some of your senses or instincts...
[73:06] >> Yeah, they become sharper, more
[73:08] restored—that sense of survival.
[73:11] >> And especially in the primeval forest,
[73:14] aside from those few fierce beasts,
[73:16] since your mind is clearer than theirs,
[73:19] >> If they attack you, you know how to
[73:21] deal with them. Beyond that, you are
[73:23] just there to appreciate nature,
[73:25] especially the scent of grass and
[73:27] flowers in the morning; the birds are
[73:29] singing, and before you can even get up
[73:32] , the little birds call you out.
[73:34] >> You watch them, admiring them for a
[73:36] while—that comfort, that peace of
[73:38] mind.
[73:38] >> No matter how conflicted or tangled you
[73:41] were, you slowly settle down.
[73:42] >> This nature is still so beautiful. You
[73:45] are one with the world.
[73:47] >> Right, you are embedded in that nature.
[73:50] >> And then you feel like no one else
[73:53] exists, I am King of the World! Awesome
[73:55] , thank you, thank you, that’s great,
[73:57] that’s why you're called the God of
[73:59] Thunder. Yes, God of Thunder, God of
[74:01] Thunder, God of Thunder.
[74:02] >> Thank you, thank you. You are a bit
[74:16] like that hero—what's his name—the
[74:19] one being blessed? Is it that one you
[74:45] see in the museum, the novel called...
[74:48] what is it?
[74:55] >> Tales of Hulan River.
[74:57] >> Hu. Is it where you once lived? Do you
[75:34] think it's a bit like Jack London, whom
[75:37] you like? But in reality, your story is
[75:47] more like Robinson Crusoe. Some people
[76:06] even died in the Yangtze River. Hi. The
[76:35] Himalayan orogeny started from the sea.
[76:53] This is bound to be your most
[76:55] spectacular one. Thank you, thank you,
[76:58] we still have to have a session. I just
[77:00] feel he has completed an enhancement of
[77:03] himself—that is, his capabilities in
[77:05] every aspect. But he was also lucky;
[77:08] there was a lot of luck involved, but
[77:10] luck can't be with you for ten years.
[77:12] Planning is important; life is about
[77:15] planning.
[77:15] >> Many Westerners I know now are actually
[77:18] taking this path, just not as extremely
[77:21] .
[77:21] >> Mhm.
[77:22] >> They don't, for example, ever buy
[77:24] designer brands. They spend all day
[77:26] traveling the world to participate in
[77:27] marathons.
[77:28] >> Mhm.
[77:29] >> Spending all their money on marathons
[77:31] everywhere, staying in hotels on
[77:33] weekends. I heard about it, though I
[77:35] didn't go; they originally asked me to
[77:38] go, just for fun. You drive up, all the
[77:41] way to a mountaintop. At the top,
[77:44] there's an open-air hot spring and
[77:46] nothing else. Of course, basic living
[77:50] amenities are there, but it's expensive
[77:53] and takes forever to book these tent
[77:55] hotels. They are just
[77:58] >> Just facing the stars,
[78:00] >> Just feeling like the stars are so
[78:02] close, like what you just said, and all
[78:04] around you, there are insects chirping
[78:06] and birds calling. It’s like the fear
[78:11] of being behind a railing—it protects
[78:13] your basic survival but still makes you
[78:16] feel afraid. They have to run from the
[78:22] tent to the hot spring pool, almost
[78:25] completely naked.
[78:28] >> Back to nature.
[78:29] >> I saw a scientific study the other day
[78:32] and finally understood why smelling the
[78:34] scent of soil makes people happy. They
[78:37] say it contains something called
[78:38] geosmin, or some kind of bacteria that
[78:41] enters your serotonin and makes you
[78:43] feel exceptionally excited.
[78:44] >> Science hasn't discovered some of the
[78:47] energy fields that interact with us yet
[78:49] .
[78:49] >> You originally made your living in
[78:51] nature, so maybe it's deeply ingrained.
[78:54] In this purely natural environment,
[78:56] your body and mind feel comfortable.
[78:58] Why do you feel comfortable by the
[79:00] seaside? It’s said to be our ancient
[79:03] genes from when we were marine
[79:05] organisms, so it just feels...
[79:07] >> It just feels comfortable.
[79:09] >> That's because you're not a fisherman.
[79:12] >> You mean you've even fought people
[79:14] along the way? Like when people tried
[79:16] to rob you, have you ever...
[79:17] >> Fought them.
[79:19] >> Then in the end...
[79:20] >> They were trying to kill me, so I
[79:22] definitely had to fight back. But in
[79:24] the end, how did you manage to escape
[79:26] alone?
[79:26] >> Sometimes I just beat them until they
[79:28] ran away.
[79:29] >> You, by yourself?
[79:30] >> I can handle three or four people no
[79:32] problem.
[79:32] >> He’s prepared.
[79:34] >> Did you practice martial arts before?
[79:35] Or is it?
[79:36] >> Right now, I could even blindfold
[79:38] myself and fight nine people.
[79:39] >> Oh.
[79:40] >> Is it like Qigong or something?
[79:43] >> I practiced hard-body kung fu, I really
[79:45] didn't know anything else, just went
[79:48] for it. I'd train for one or two hours,
[79:50] taking those big green beer bottles and
[79:53] smashing twenty of them over my own
[79:55] head at once.
[79:56] >> Wow, my god, this is a tough guy.
[79:59] >> Look at this, I was bitten by a
[80:01] venomous snake in the primeval forest,
[80:04] so I tied both ends with rope and cut
[80:06] the flesh out.
[80:07] >> Oh my, this part here?
[80:09] >> Cut the flesh out. If I didn't do that,
[80:11] I would have been dead in three or four
[80:12] hours.
[80:12] >> Wouldn't you have passed out from the
[80:14] pain?
[80:14] >> No, I was fine.
[80:15] >> Cutting out the flesh...
[80:17] >> My god.
[80:18] >> This is like Guan Yu scraping the bone
[80:19] to remove the poison.
[80:20] >> Then I untie the rope myself, taking
[80:22] some of this rugged path, many people
[80:24] who wanted to learn give up.
[80:26] >> But I'm not lacking.
[80:27] >> So I am afraid of death. I think, I
[80:30] thought if you felt a sharp pain, or if
[80:32] you couldn't squeeze out all the venom,
[80:34] you'd just die right there.
[80:35] >> You might pass out from the pain of
[80:37] cutting that piece of flesh.
[80:38] >> No, it's not that serious; I just tie
[80:40] it with a rope, and after that, I don't
[80:42] look at that spot. What about
[80:44] sterilization? You need to sterilize it
[80:46] .
[80:46] >> I carry baijiu (white spirits) with me.
[80:48] Oh, baijiu.
[80:50] >> I haven't been without baijiu for ten
[80:52] years; there isn't a major distillery
[80:54] in China I haven't visited.
[80:55] >> And they even gifted me their best
[80:58] liquor.
[80:58] >> See, baijiu can be used for
[80:59] sterilization along the way.
[81:01] >> Right, and it can temporarily help you
[81:03] forget the pain of the wound.
[81:04] >> Did you ever have that fear back then
[81:06] that if I died here, no one would know?
[81:08] >> No one would know, and you also had
[81:10] financial issues; how did you make a
[81:11] living? On this journey, I lived off
[81:13] the money I earned for 20 years. I
[81:15] earned money for 20 years, from the age
[81:17] of 15 to 35. I even earned nearly
[81:19] 70,000 yuan on the road. I bought jade
[81:22] pebbles in Hotan, I collected cordyceps
[81:24] ; I didn't buy in large quantities,
[81:26] just from families who didn't have much
[81:29] to sell, so I bought them.
[81:31] >> After collecting them, I carried them
[81:33] to the cities.
[81:34] >> So, after these ten years of walking,
[81:36] did you spend all your money?
[81:38] >> Not enough, then I gave a few speeches
[81:40] and definitely earned some.
[81:43] >> So what do you mainly rely on for a
[81:45] living now?
[81:46] >> I can take entrepreneurs or teenagers
[81:48] out on study trips.
[81:50] >> Right.
[81:51] >> And I also have some royalties.
[81:53] >> Mm.
[81:54] >> Oh, from the books you wrote.
[81:56] >> I have written quite a few books,
[81:58] several books.
[81:58] >> And things like "Ten Years,""
[82:00] >> Ten Years of Breaking Through," and "31
[82:02] Days Crossing the Lop Nur." Mm, but at
[82:04] this age, it's impossible to have
[82:07] adventures like that again. Two years
[82:10] ago, I went to the Altun Mountains
[82:12] no-man's land, carrying 22 jin of
[82:14] live-streaming equipment, that is, the
[82:16] satellite-connected one.
[82:18] >> Oh.
[82:19] >> Then I did a live stream with the CCTV
[82:22] News app, with 27 million people online
[82:24] .
[82:24] >> Mm.
[82:27] >> And I filmed many wild yaks, wild
[82:30] donkeys, foxes, and wolves.
[82:35] >> Do you still have similar trekking
[82:37] plans to go out now?
[82:39] >> But I go out alone less often.
[82:41] >> Is this kind of thing addictive? Like,
[82:43] definitely.
[82:44] >> Right? If you haven't hiked for a long
[82:45] time, you want to go to some mountain
[82:47] again.
[82:47] >> Staying outside at night really keeps
[82:48] you grounded.
[82:49] >> Mm.
[82:50] >> Just look for a place with a better
[82:51] environment. Out in the tent,
[82:52] everything you eat tastes delicious,
[82:54] and you sleep so well. People often
[82:55] tell me they have insomnia and can't
[82:57] sleep. I tell them, "Walk with me for a
[82:59] week; if you still can't sleep...""I'll
[83:00] ...how much money do you want? I'll bet
[83:02] with you."
[83:03] >> I suffer from insomnia.
[83:05] >> Come walk with me.
[83:06] >> Walk with me, alright? Let's practice.
[83:09] >> This has got to work, this guy.
[83:12] >> Walking Through the World, Season 5.
[83:14] >> Hiking.
[83:15] >> Let's follow him.
[83:16] >> We're going outside to do this, this,
[83:18] this.
[83:19] >> When there are wolves, keep the door
[83:20] pushed from the outside.
[83:22] >> Bears and shrimp along the way.
[83:24] >> I'll play the part of the bear.
[83:26] >> You can play the egg. Actually, what
[83:28] does it mean to walk everywhere?
[83:30] >> I visited every provincial capital,
[83:33] prefecture-level city, all 56 ethnic
[83:35] groups, every famous mountain, river,
[83:37] and historical site. From the source of
[83:40] the Yangtze to the sea, the source of
[83:42] the Yellow River to the sea, the Great
[83:45] Wall from Jiayuguan to Shanhaiguan,
[83:47] then most of the border and coastline.
[83:49] At the time, there were 2,600 counties
[83:51] and districts; I covered two-thirds,
[83:54] over 1,600 of them, and more than 5,000
[83:56] townships. Unless there was something
[83:58] special, a famous historical site, I
[84:00] just walked through it. No need to loop
[84:02] around, just pass through.
[84:04] >> How could someone break your record?
[84:06] For example, someone might challenge it
[84:08] in the future. Well.
[84:09] >> I don't know, I haven't thought that
[84:10] much about it.
[84:11] >> For instance, in 10 years, I walked
[84:13] 81,000 kilometers.
[84:14] >> Maybe one day, someone else will appear
[84:16] .
[84:16] >> In 12 years, they walk 100,000
[84:18] kilometers, taking even more detailed
[84:21] routes. That would be setting a second
[84:23] record. I don't have much desire for
[84:26] that. Before achieving it, I had some
[84:28] expectations, but once it's done, it's
[84:31] nothing special. The biggest gain is
[84:34] the experience itself.
[84:36] >> Does that mean you can't take any
[84:38] transport at all? It must be all on
[84:40] foot.
[84:41] >> In frontier regions where there’s
[84:43] only one road in and out, if I’ve
[84:44] already covered that path, I’ll hitch
[84:46] a ride if I can. If there’s no
[84:48] vehicle, I’ll just climb over a
[84:50] mountain pass. I only took a plane to
[84:52] Taiwan, a boat to the Xisha Islands, a
[84:54] boat to Hainan Island, and a boat from
[84:56] Hainan to Beihai. Everything else was
[84:59] done on foot. I'm telling you, even
[85:01] scholars cheat and forge data, right?
[85:03] He is a person who holds himself to his
[85:06] own standards. So, what is hiking? He
[85:09] has a principle: if the road is
[85:10] repetitive, you can hitch a ride, or
[85:12] take a plane to Taiwan, but apart from
[85:14] that, it's all walking.
[85:15] >> Don't worry.
[85:16] >> Can you actually be lazy? Just tell
[85:19] them the stories I've told before.
[85:21] >> Hasn't set off yet.
