量子力学的前沿发现，越看越像佛教经典？2000年前的东方智慧正被现代科学一一验证！！#文化 #历史 #认知觉醒 #哲学 #马未都 #中国智慧

量子力学前沿发现与两千年前东方智慧的契合 节目围绕中华文明的源头及其独特认知体系展开深入探讨。内容从先民通过立表测影、观察黄道周期确立“昆仑”秩序与二分二至同心圆讲起，质疑了西方以文字、青铜器、城市为硬性标准的文明界定，提出中华文明以道德体系、认识论与礼制体系为基石，具有长达八千年的渊源。同时，嘉宾们结合秭归骨表、牛河梁遗址与《易经》《大学》等典籍，解析了“信”与“天人合一”如何起源于精确的天象运行，并对比了古希腊理念论及毕达哥拉斯对无理数√2的恐慌，阐明了中国传统思想重功能功用、克制欲望以及敬畏天道规律的人本务实精神。 先民通过立表测影确立秩序，中华文明以道德、认识论和礼制为基石，质疑了西方传统的文明界定标准。 结合秭归骨表、牛河梁遗址及多部典籍，解析了“信”与“天人合一”源于精确天象运行的渊源。 对比古希腊哲学理念，阐明了中国传统思想注重功能功用、克制欲望及敬畏天道的人本务实精神。

节目中学者冯时等人提出，中华文明的源头应基于本土天文学与道德伦理体系重塑为八千年，而非受限于西方“文字、青铜、城市”的国家起源指标。先民通过立表测影、观象授时所建立的天文律则，构成了早期中华思想、礼制结构乃至王权合法性的核心根基。 立表测影与时空认知破题 (2:16) 早期人类面对冬夏太阳升落位置和温度的变化，直觉上曾认为每日升起的都是全新的太阳，并演化出“十日神话”。直到先民采用立表测影（以人体为天然表木，后演化为代称腿骨与仪轨的“髀”），长期追踪日影与晨昏指示星，才确立了太阳沿固定黄道运行的规律。这一认识凝结于汉字“昆”（代表同一个太阳）与“仑/轮”（以理性建立起周而复始的秩序），进而由后羿射日的秩序神话将多元认知统摄为周期运转。 在湖北秭归门头遗址出土的距今约8000年的测影石碑，证实了该技术在新石器时代早期的应用。通过持续测算正午日影最短的夏至点，先民发现影长以365天为周期精确重合，从而掌握了回归年规律。这种天道守时不爽的自然经验，催生了“信”（诚实不欺）的伦理哲学，将天象规律上升为“天人合一”的早期道德基石。 观象授时转化为早期王权与升天信仰 (31:38) 农耕文明的生产对物候天时具有极高依赖性，但天文观测长期被少数巫覡祭司垄断。通晓天道者能够发布春耕秋收的指令，因而自然获得了代天宣令的神圣权威，演变为世俗统治者与“天子”。古代文献中所述的“绝地天通”，其政治实质即朝廷严禁民间私习天文历法，确立起君权神授的独占性。 河南濮阳西水坡距今约6500年的M45号墓葬，以蚌壳摆塑的青龙、白虎及由胫骨与三角贝壳构成的北斗星象，对应着真实的星宿空间方位，显示了高等级巫覡借星宿升天的原始宗教意图。此外，夏至、冬至与春秋分三条关键太阳视运动轨迹在天穹形成的同心圆，被先民称为“昆仑丘”，该几何形态直接映射到红山文化牛河梁三层圆坛与后世天坛圜丘的祭天礼制中，构成了天子通天的神圣空间。 星图考古还原易经与河图洛书 (41:05) 冯时指出，被后世视为神秘玄学的太极图与“河图洛书”，其本质是极为具象的天文星图。在西南彝族文化中，“太极图”原指宇宙天体图，早期图像仅为包含青龙卷曲巡天的圆盘。苍龙星象由角、亢、氐、房、心、尾六宿组成，《易经》乾卦各爻辞（如“潜龙勿用”、“见龙在田”、“飞龙在天”）实际上是对苍龙星象随季节变迁从地平线下升至中天位置的如实描摹。 “河图”中的“河”实为银河，反映了东升苍龙跃出星汉的天象；“洛书”则指向“天地之中”的地理空间布局。安徽含山凌家滩出土的距今约5300年的玉龟及夹带的八角星纹玉版，证明在夏代前先民已通过定向技术发展出“四方”、“五位”直至“九宫”的时空规划模型。这些跨越数千年的图像与战国曾侯乙墓漆箱星象图高度吻合，体现了天文知识系统的惊人延续性。 反思西方标准与重构八千年文明论 (10:06) 西方传统考古学多以青铜冶金、成熟文字和防御性城市作为跨入“文明”的三要素，据此常将中国文明上限断在商代晚期（约3700年前）。冯时等人主张将“文明（Wenming）”与政治意义上的“国家（Bang）”解耦。中国先民强调“重德立政”的形而上修养，距今7000年的湖北柳林溪陶支座已出现具象空间观念的刻画符号，而西水坡等遗存更证明早期社会已具备高度精密的天文认识论、道德系统与礼制雏形。 在数学与宇宙观的对比上，古希腊追求抽象理念论，因无理数√2的不可通约性引发了第一次数学危机甚至学派内部的保密惩戒；而红山文化三层圆坛直径（11米、15.6米、22米）经测量连续呈现以√2为倍率的比例，体现出中国先民重实用、直接将数理秩序融入天地礼制的务实认知态度。 该学术观点突破了唯物质论的文明界定，为探索中华文明源流提供了天文学视角的严密解释系统；但与会者亦指出，将这些新石器时代天文符号全面对接成熟文字体系及宏大历史叙事，在当今主流考古与历史学界中仍属具有争鸣的学说，尚待更多地下出土材料的持续互证。

[0:00] We used to sing that all living things [0:02] rely on the sun to grow, right? Yes, [0:06] that's the truth, but is the sun that [0:08] rises today the same one you saw [0:10] yesterday? [0:12] >> In the eyes of the ancients? [0:14] >> Right, from the perspective of [0:16] primitive thinking, would they consider [0:18] it the same one? [0:19] >> Not the same one. [0:21] >> Definitely not the same one. Why is [0:23] that? [0:23] >> Hmm. [0:25] >> Because if you look closely at the [0:26] sun's rising position, it's different [0:28] every single day. [0:30] >> It’s always shifting; it moves [0:32] between the summer and winter solstices [0:34] . Its rising time is also different [0:37] every day. The warmth the sun provides [0:41] also feels different in each season. [0:44] >> Exactly, winter and summer are not the [0:46] same. [0:47] >> Right, they are all different. [0:49] >> How could these differences lead people [0:51] to reach the preconceived conclusion? [0:54] That there is only one sun in the sky? [0:56] Impossible. [0:57] >> Like the legend of Hou Yi from the past [0:59] . Right, there were ten, and he shot [1:01] down nine, right? [1:04] >> Yes, these are all Kunlun myths, [1:06] legends that are actually related to it [1:08] . In other words, when people didn't [1:13] know there was only one sun in the sky, [1:15] their primitive thinking told them that [1:17] a new sun rose every day, and that suns [1:19] were infinite. Thus, a myth was born in [1:24] China called the Myth of the Ten Suns. [1:27] >> That there were ten suns in the sky. [1:30] >> The myth of the ten suns doesn't [1:32] actually tell you there are only ten in [1:34] the sky. It’s actually a positional [1:36] notation in Chinese mathematics. [1:38] >> What is Chinese mathematics? [1:39] >> It's traditional Chinese arithmetic, in [1:42] other words, Chinese math. [1:44] >> Ah, it’s a decimal place value unit. [1:47] Meaning that after ten, there is [1:49] another ten. And after that ten, there [1:52] is another ten. The Zuo Zhuan mentions [1:54] that the sky has ten suns. [1:56] >> Yes, the sky has ten suns. [1:57] >> And people are divided into ten ranks. [1:59] >> Exactly, because of these "ten suns," [2:01] people later created the ten Heavenly [2:03] Stems to record them: Jia, Yi, Bing, [2:04] Ding, Wu, Ji, Geng, Xin, Ren, and Gui. [2:06] After reaching Gui, there is another [2:08] set of ten Heavenly Stems. This allows [2:10] for recording things infinitely. So, [2:11] initially, people must have perceived [2:13] the suns in the sky as infinite. [2:15] >> Mm. [2:16] >> As civilization progressed, or rather, [2:18] as the demand for knowledge increased. [2:22] And the most important part of this [2:24] knowledge was the planning of space and [2:26] time. The ancients later thought of [2:29] observing the sun's shadow. [2:31] >> Mm. [2:32] >> By observing the shadow—setting up a [2:34] gnomon, a pole—and watching the [2:36] shadow, since it changes direction and [2:38] length throughout the year, right? [2:42] People used these changes in the shadow [2:44] to plan their space. But if you use a [2:47] gnomon to measure the shadow, it [2:49] requires a certain understanding of the [2:51] sun; if a new sun appeared every day, [2:53] this measurement would be meaningless. [2:57] >> Meaningless. [2:58] >> Wouldn't it be completely meaningless? [3:01] So, there arose a need to establish the [3:03] understanding that it is the same sun. [3:07] To make such observations, people had [3:09] to observe the sun. Which star appears [3:12] before the sun rises in the morning. [3:15] >> And after the sun sets, which star [3:17] follows it down below the horizon. This [3:20] was a very important method of [3:22] observation for the ancient Chinese. If [3:25] people observed it over a long period, [3:27] they would find that the sun actually [3:29] moves along the same path in the sky. [3:32] >> Hmm. [3:34] >> The ancients called this path the [3:36] ecliptic. [3:37] >> That is where the term "ecliptic" comes [3:39] from. [3:39] >> Yes, it is the orbit along which the [3:41] sun travels. Today, our scientific [3:43] explanation is the orbit of the Earth [3:45] revolving around the sun; this is [3:47] called the "ecliptic." Right. Well, [3:51] once we recognize it as the same sun— [3:54] meaning the sun we see today is the [3:56] same celestial body as the one seen [3:58] yesterday—the character used to [4:00] express this concept is "Kun"(昆). [4:03] >> Hmm. [4:04] >> Ah. [4:04] >> So, how do you write the character "Kun [4:06] "? A sun on top. [4:07] >> A "bi"(比) at the bottom. " [4:09] >> Bi" means close together; look, we are [4:12] very close, this is "bi." [4:13] >> Exactly, it's called "bi." This is "bi, [4:17] " meaning what we see today is the same [4:19] as what we saw yesterday. This is "Kun, [4:22] " so how is it explained in the*Shuowen [4:25] Jiezi*? "Kun" means the same, one and [4:28] the same. [4:28] >> Exactly. [4:29] >> It means the same. [4:31] >> It means the sun that rises today and [4:33] the one from yesterday. Are one, and [4:36] this is. [4:36] >> A great discovery. [4:38] >> This is "Kun." It means people realized [4:41] there is only one sun in the sky, not [4:43] countless, right? This explanation [4:47] leads to another myth, the one you [4:49] mentioned about Hou Yi. [4:52] >> People used this myth to resolve the [4:54] transition from the idea of countless [4:56] suns to the realization that there is [4:58] only one. It is said that one year ten [5:00] suns appeared at once; all the suns [5:02] came out, they all appeared together, [5:04] right? [5:04] >> It was scorching hot. [5:05] >> Yes, it was scorching, so the Emperor [5:07] gave a bow and arrows to the hero Hou [5:09] Yi, telling him to shoot down the extra [5:12] ones. So he shot the others down, [5:14] leaving only one, which solved the [5:16] problem; its operational characteristic [5:18] is that only one appears each day. [5:20] >> Yes, the suns take turns, "lun-ci"(轮 [5:22] 次); that is why the character "lun"( [5:24] 轮) carries the meaning of taking [5:26] turns. Oh, like "lunli"(伦理-ethics/ [5:28] order), it also implies order, yes, [5:30] order and turns. [5:31] >> It also implies flow, the meaning of [5:33] flowing. [5:33] >> It's like this, oh, this question is so [5:35] important, it's about flow, about [5:37] movement, so look at how this character [5:38] is written; the top part, in our modern [5:40] regular script, is a stroke to the left [5:41] , a stroke to the right, and a closure, [5:43] right? [5:44] >> The ancients pronounced it "ji," as in [5:46] "jihe"(to gather). [5:47] >> Meaning to collect. What's at the [5:49] bottom? A bamboo slip book, because [5:52] ancient books were all compiled using [5:55] bamboo slips, right? [5:57] >> Yes, tied with string. [5:58] >> Yes, threaded together. After you [6:00] thread them together, if you read them [6:02] often, like Confucius reading the I [6:04] Ching three times, the string breaks, [6:06] right? Once it breaks, you have to [6:08] reassemble them, and you must follow [6:10] the original order. Re-editing it, [6:13] right? This is the essence of the word [6:15] "lun"(order/sequence), it means "lun ci [6:18] "(orderly sequence), so to "lun" is to [6:20] think, meaning you use your intellect [6:22] to arrange the sequence, it cannot be [6:25] disordered. You put it in "lun ci"( [6:27] sequential order). So, this "Kunlun," [6:29] in today's plain language, actually [6:32] means the same sun. The sun travels in [6:35] a daily sequence. A romantic [6:38] interpretation of "Kunlun" is that [6:40] while the sun is always in the sky, as [6:42] just mentioned, its rising position [6:45] varies, so it traces countless arcs [6:47] across the sky, right? But which arcs [6:50] are the most important to us humans? [6:53] Actually, there are only three arcs. [6:55] That is, the sun's trajectory during [6:57] the two equinoxes and the two solstices [6:59] . That is, the spring equinox, autumn [7:01] equinox, summer solstice, and winter [7:03] solstice. On the summer solstice, the [7:05] sun rises from the furthest northern [7:07] point in the east, traces an arc in the [7:09] sky, and sets at the furthest northern [7:10] point in the west. [7:11] >> That's the day with the longest [7:13] sunlight. [7:13] >> Exactly, the day with the longest [7:15] daylight hours. [7:16] >> The winter solstice is the shortest [7:18] point. [7:18] >> Yes, on the winter solstice, it rises [7:20] from the furthest southern point in the [7:22] east. Then it traces an arc in the sky [7:24] and sets at the furthest southern point [7:26] in the west. This is how we observe the [7:28] two solstices. The winter and summer [7:31] solstices create two arcs in the sky, [7:33] while the spring and autumn equinoxes [7:35] rise due east. And then they set due [7:38] west. So, if we observe the sun's [7:41] movement during the two equinoxes and [7:44] two solstices, we can actually trace [7:46] three concentric circles in the sky. [7:49] >> Hmm. [7:50] >> These three concentric circles. The [7:52] ancients called them the "Kunlun Qiu"( [7:55] Kunlun Mound). Kunlun Qiu—today we [7:57] have discovered the earliest Kunlun Qiu [8:00] in the Hongshan culture, which is the [8:02] circular mound used by the Hongshan [8:04] people to worship the heavens. [8:07] >> This is in Liaoning, Liaoning [8:09] Niuheliang. [8:10] >> It was discovered at Niuheliang and [8:12] dates back over 5,000 years. [8:14] >> 5,500 to 5,700 years ago. [8:17] >> This site of the Hongshan culture is [8:18] called the Yuanqiu. [8:20] >> There is an overhead view of three [8:22] concentric circles. If this is still a [8:27] bit puzzling, let's look at the Altar [8:29] of Heaven here in Beijing; those three [8:31] tiers and then you see— [8:34] >> The Yuanqiu, the Altar of Heaven in [8:36] Beijing, was used to worship Heaven [8:38] even up until the Qing Dynasty. [8:40] >> For thousands of years, look at this [8:41] Altar of Heaven. [8:43] >> The mound. [8:45] >> It represents a form of knowledge [8:47] spanning 5,000 years. These three [8:50] concentric circles actually depict the [8:52] sun's trajectory in the sky during the [8:54] two equinoxes and two solstices. Later, [8:56] people used this knowledge to build the [8:58] Yuanqiu for worshipping Heaven. Because [9:00] when worshipping Heaven, the ancient [9:02] Chinese held the belief that "what is [9:03] worshipped must resemble the object of [9:05] worship." If I am to worship Heaven, my [9:07] altar must resemble Heaven. [9:08] >> Since Heaven is round—as the ancients [9:10] said, "Heaven is round and Earth is [9:12] square"—my Yuanqiu must also resemble [9:13] Heaven, which is why it is named [9:15] Yuanqiu (Round Mound). That "round" is [9:17] exactly that circle. [9:18] >> It is the shape of the celestial body. [9:20] That "round" is not just an abstract [9:23] concept. To describe it in further [9:25] detail, it consists of three concentric [9:27] circles representing the sun's path [9:29] during the equinoxes and solstices. [9:30] This structure is something we have [9:32] already seen at the Hongshan site. [9:34] >> Archaeology generally classifies this [9:36] as the Neolithic Hongshan culture, [9:38] dating back over 5,000 years. In global [9:42] archaeology, are there other similar [9:43] examples, such as Stonehenge, that we [9:45] can compare from the same period? [9:49] >> Stonehenge is much later than this. [9:51] >> Mhm. [9:51] >> The only one related to it is actually [9:53] Babylon. [9:54] >> Mhm. [9:55] >> Babylon produced an image that also [9:57] features three concentric circles. [10:00] >> It is quite similar. [10:01] >> But it is later than this. [10:03] >> Even later than that. [10:04] >> Still later than that. [10:06] >> You see, among current Oriental and [10:08] Western scholars combined, there is [10:11] debate over how many years of history [10:13] Chinese civilization really has. [10:17] >> Western archaeology used to have a [10:19] standard: the discovery of writing. The [10:22] discovery of bronze ware, and the [10:24] discovery of cities. [10:25] >> Cities. [10:26] >> According to this standard, some say it [10:29] is 3,700 years. Some in the West do not [10:31] accept our claim of 5,000 years of [10:33] civilization. They argue that only [10:35] oracle bone script counts as "writing," [10:37] dating back to the Shang Dynasty, which [10:39] is 3,700 years. However, our country [10:41] traditionally claims our civilization [10:43] is 5,000 years old. [10:44] >> Professor Feng, what is your current [10:46] definition of how old our civilization [10:48] is? [10:48] >> I personally propose 8,000 years. [10:51] >> What is the evidence? [10:53] >> First, we must establish what concept? [10:56] That civilization and the state are [10:58] different. The Western "three elements [11:01] of civilization" standard actually [11:03] defines a state. Right, the root of the [11:05] word "civilization" in the West [11:07] actually refers to citizens or [11:09] nationals, right? It is that kind of [11:11] concept, correct. In China, [11:13] establishing a state or a dynasty is [11:15] not called a civilization. We call it a [11:19] "Bang." There are very clear records of [11:20] this in the scriptures of the Western [11:22] Zhou. It is called "Bang," which means [11:24] establishing a state, and "civilization [11:26] " is a concept native to China; for [11:28] example, the words "civilization" [11:30] appear in the Book of Documents and the [11:32] I Ching. Therefore, we have our own [11:34] conceptual system. Because based on [11:37] this re-conceptualization of [11:38] civilization, we can push the history [11:41] of Chinese civilization further back. [11:43] Push it back to 8,000 years. [11:45] >> So, for an 8,000-year-old civilization, [11:47] in your definition, what elements does [11:50] it contain? [11:53] >> I have proposed three so-called [11:55] elements, meaning that China—that is, [11:58] Chinese civilization itself—actually [12:00] places more emphasis on the [12:01] metaphysical than the physical. For [12:05] example, the ancients always spoke of " [12:07] valuing virtue and establishing [12:09] governance." Technical things cannot [12:12] serve as a standard for civilization. [12:15] For instance, bronze ware is a [12:17] technical indicator. Does having bronze [12:20] ware necessarily mean it is more [12:21] civilized than not having it? Not [12:23] necessarily. Moreover, this technical [12:26] indicator is variable; it is dynamic. [12:29] Right? Once iron tools appeared, bronze [12:31] ware seemed less civilized. If such a [12:34] dynamic indicator could be used to [12:36] define civilization, people might only [12:38] reach one conclusion: that we today are [12:40] more civilized than anyone else. [12:44] >> So, what is the core issue of human [12:47] civilized society? It is the issue of [12:52] people; in other words, a human [12:54] civilized society must first be a [12:57] society built by civilized people. It [13:01] is not a machine society. Nor is it a [13:04] barbaric society, right? So a civilized [13:06] society cannot be built by barbaric [13:08] individuals; therefore, what the [13:09] Chinese mean by civilization is, first [13:11] and foremost, the civilization of [13:13] people. That is, the individual is [13:14] civilized; only with civilized [13:16] individuals can a collective [13:18] civilization be formed, and finally, a [13:20] social civilization; this is the basic [13:22] logic of our thinking. So how do we [13:24] achieve an individual or how do we [13:26] achieve a civilized society? I have [13:29] researched three standards for this, [13:31] and the first is the moral system. It [13:34] is the human moral system. This is the [13:36] way of becoming a person, the [13:37] foundation of becoming a person. That [13:39] is to say, the moral system in ancient [13:41] Chinese culture is more profound than [13:44] that of the West. We don't have it [13:47] today, so I am immediately curious to [13:50] ask: you mentioned three standards for [13:52] civilization 8,000 years ago, and just [13:54] talked about the first, the moral [13:56] system, so where were the moral [13:58] concepts or systems of 8,000 years ago [14:01] manifested? [14:04] >> We have very solid archaeological [14:06] evidence today. [14:08] >> According to ancient scholars, the term [14:11] "civilization"(文明) means to have " [14:14] patterns"(文) and "brightness"(明). [14:17] In the Chinese conceptual system, how [14:20] is "civilization" defined? The ancients [14:23] called it "patterns." What does " [14:25] patterns" mean? The name Wentao [14:28] contains this "wen," which is a very... [14:32] >> This research... [14:33] >> The "wen" in Wentao is the "wen" of [14:35] Chinese civilization. [14:36] >> But "civilization"(wenming) isn't [14:38] exactly ancient Chinese, is it? [14:40] >> It is. [14:41] >> Was it used as a single term in ancient [14:42] Chinese? [14:43] >> It's in the Commentary on the I Ching. [14:45] Hmm. " [14:45] >> The dragon appears in the field, and [14:47] the world is civilized (wenming)." [14:50] >> Hmm. " [14:50] >> Civilization" appeared. In the Canon of [14:53] Shun in the Book of Documents, it [14:55] mentions "Jun Wenming"(the monarch was [14:57] civilized), these all date back to [14:59] pre-Qin times. Look at this character [15:01] in ancient scripts, like oracle bone or [15:03] bronze script; what was its original [15:05] meaning? You see, in the center, it [15:09] depicts a heart, a fleshy organ. If you [15:12] look at how Shang Dynasty oracle [15:14] scripts describe animals, they are all [15:16] pictographic. [15:18] >> None of them include the heart. [15:20] >> Animals have hearts, too. But they [15:22] aren't written that way. Only the "wen" [15:24] in "civilization" is written with a [15:26] heart. It tells you: What is the [15:28] standard to distinguish humans from [15:30] beasts? It is to cultivate one's heart [15:32] through morality. That is how the [15:34] ancients understood it. [15:35] >> Looks like my studies in Chinese [15:36] literature were right; focusing on the [15:38] heart is key. Exactly. [15:39] >> Right, right, right. [15:40] >> The heart governs the spirit, as they [15:42] say, the heart governs the spirit, yes. [15:44] >> Don't get cocky; Wentao has " [15:45] civilization," but it's not that you [15:47] are civilized, your dad had the " [15:49] civilization." He chose the name for [15:50] you. [15:51] >> My father's name is Baoming. [15:53] >> Ah, these two characters together make [15:55] "civilization." [15:56] >> The characters of civilization. In [15:58] reality, it embodies civilization. It's [16:01] exactly about the "patterns." [16:02] >> What does "patterns" mean? It means the [16:04] inner morality is manifested outwardly. [16:06] >> Uh-huh. The Chinese believe that humans [16:09] are transparent. [16:09] >> Hmm. [16:11] >> Whatever you think in your heart can [16:12] surely be seen on your face. [16:14] >> Hmm. [16:15] >> People are transparent, so Confucius [16:17] said, "If substance exceeds refinement, [16:19] one is boorish," right? [16:20] >> Hmm. [16:21] >> If you look at a face that hasn't been [16:22] cultivated, it appears savage. But if [16:24] one is cultivated and well-read, as the [16:26] ancients said, "Poetry and books enrich [16:28] the mind; elegance shines through." [16:29] >> It becomes transparent, also known as [16:31] ... [16:31] >> What about the concept of "human face, [16:33] beast heart"? [16:34] >> Yes, "human face, beast heart,""a beast [16:36] in human clothing," they all relate to [16:38] the saying, "The appearance is born [16:40] from the heart." [16:41] >> Yes, exactly. [16:42] >> Your appearance must surely stem from [16:44] your heart; this is what is called " [16:46] wen-zhang"(culture/literary composition [16:48] ). Look at "wen-zhang": in ancient [16:49] texts, like the "Canon of Shun" in the [16:51] Book of Documents, it mentions a ruler [16:53] who is "civilized and accomplished."" [16:55] >> The dragon appears in the field"—this [16:56] is from the I Ching, which speaks of [16:58] the world being civilized. [16:59] >> Then, if you look at Kong Yingda from [17:01] the Tang Dynasty, he interpreted the I [17:03] Ching by saying, "Thus the world has ' [17:05] wen-zhang'(culture), and there is [17:07] brightness." This is equivalent to [17:09] saying that the "civilization" we use [17:11] today is a translation from English, [17:12] which we repurposed from the character [17:14] "wen" in ancient texts. But in reality, [17:18] it was translated by the Japanese. [17:20] >> We already had this concept ourselves. [17:22] >> The "civilization" we speak of [17:24] >> has been discarded. [17:25] >> However, the civilization we speak of [17:28] is cultivating inner morality, which [17:30] then shines outwardly—that is the " [17:32] zhang"(manifestation/splendor). It also [17:34] implies pattern and display. Only in [17:37] this way—and that is why we propose " [17:39] governing by virtue"—does it have [17:41] such deep roots in our national culture [17:42] . Yes. [17:44] >> For example, I used to find one thing [17:46] very mysterious and baffling, which is [17:48] that in ancient Chinese classics, it [17:50] says, "From the Son of Heaven down to [17:52] the common people,"" [17:53] >> all must take self-cultivation as the [17:55] foundation." [17:56] >> That's correct. [17:57] >> Now, don't you find that hard to [17:58] understand? It means that from the [18:00] highest Son of Heaven to ordinary folk, [18:02] you are all practitioners of [18:03] self-cultivation. Also, look at Yao, [18:06] Shun, and Yu—I don't know where it's [18:08] recorded—but these legendary [18:10] sage-kings of antiquity all talked [18:12] about the heart: "The human heart is [18:14] precarious.""The Taoist heart is subtle [18:17] ; be refined and be single-minded, [18:19] holding fast to the mean." You would [18:21] think that for a national ruler, you'd [18:23] be pondering other things. It's saying [18:26] this human heart is the "precarious" [18:28] kind, but that heart of the Tao, as [18:30] Laozi also spoke of, is extremely [18:32] subtle. What makes me curious is this: [18:37] Why would an emperor be pondering this [18:38] state of mind? That's something we [18:42] usually think monks or Taoist [18:44] practitioners ponder. But why do you [18:49] see ancient sage-kings talking about [18:50] the subtlety of this heart and nature, [18:52] as if you need a great awakening? It [18:57] feels like your main task as an emperor [18:59] is inner achievement. [19:01] >> Mm. [19:01] >> That was what made me so curious at the [19:03] time; I said, you aren't thinking about [19:05] governing the country? "Inner [19:06] sageliness and outer kingliness," it's [19:08] the inner part. [19:09] >> To be an emperor, you must be a sage at [19:11] heart. But you mentioned three things, [19:14] the first is [19:14] >> morality, [19:15] >> morality, [19:16] >> morality; the second is? [19:17] >> The second is knowledge. The third is [19:19] ritual. [19:21] >> How is this knowledge embodied? [19:22] >> Knowledge is embodied in two aspects. [19:25] >> Mm. [19:25] >> One is epistemology. [19:27] >> Mm. [19:27] >> One is this theory of limited knowledge [19:30] —that is, the Chinese epistemology— [19:32] which is that if humanity wants to [19:34] develop, it needs knowledge. Right, but [19:37] knowledge involves two issues; one is [19:39] how to acquire knowledge. You just [19:42] mentioned Kunlun. So where does this [19:44] knowledge come from? It is obtained [19:46] through the observation of nature. It [19:48] is not something conjured up out of [19:50] thin air in the mind. This way of [19:51] understanding was summarized by the [19:53] ancient Chinese in four characters: " [19:55] Gewuzhi"(investigating things to extend [19:57] knowledge). [19:58] >> What does "Ge" mean? " [19:59] >> Ge" means going from here to there; [20:02] that is what "Ge" is. "Wu" refers to [20:04] external objects. So "Gewu," as we [20:07] would say today, is human observation [20:10] and analysis of nature to acquire [20:12] knowledge. Therefore, all ancient [20:15] Chinese knowledge was acquired through [20:17] this kind of method. In other words, [20:19] the ancients saw many things for [20:21] themselves. And this kind of " [20:22] investigating things" is not like what [20:24] we say about Wang Yangming watching [20:26] bamboo for seven days, getting sick, [20:28] and then giving up; it’s not like [20:30] that. [20:30] >> For the ancients, "Gewu" might take [20:32] several generations. Only then might [20:34] they be able to gain a tiny bit of [20:36] knowledge. So this time span is quite [20:38] long. There is another layer of meaning [20:40] to the theory of limited knowledge: [20:42] ancient Chinese people realized very [20:44] early on. That knowledge is not [20:45] necessarily always good. [20:47] >> Oh. [20:47] >> People only need knowledge that is [20:49] beneficial to the advancement of [20:50] humanity. We don't need knowledge that [20:53] hinders human development, and even [20:54] more so, we must discard knowledge that [20:57] can destroy humanity. This is why later [20:59] Chinese philosophy considered these [21:01] questions—why do you think Laozi [21:03] wanted to "go"? You say the common [21:05] people's pursuit of material things is [21:07] bad, but is a scientist's pursuit of [21:10] spiritual things necessarily good? Not [21:12] necessarily. Furthermore, if those [21:14] pursuits lead to the acquisition of [21:16] knowledge that destroys humanity. Then [21:19] the harm brought to humanity is far [21:21] greater than the harm caused by the [21:22] common people's pursuit of material [21:24] goods. [21:26] >> It’s like not being wasteful. Later, [21:28] Xunzi proposed "nurturing desires"— [21:30] nurturing doesn't mean letting desires [21:32] grow bigger and bigger, but keeping [21:34] them within a reasonable and moderate [21:36] range, because we still have to live, [21:39] and there are necessities for life, [21:41] right? They must be adjusted to remain [21:43] within a reasonable and moderate range. [21:45] Taoism is even more absolute; it wants [21:47] to "go," to remove all desires. [21:49] Therefore, in Chinese philosophy, no [21:51] school advocates for indulgence. This [21:53] is the principle. Well, well... [21:55] >> But how do you explain, for example, [21:57] the economic prosperity brought about [21:59] by Western technology over the past few [22:01] centuries; isn't that driven by desire? [22:04] >> Yes. [22:06] >> Not to mention that certain Western [22:08] economic models rely on consumerism to [22:10] drive growth, right? What the ancient [22:13] Chinese talked about was what is [22:15] long-lasting, not what is momentary. Ah [22:17] , this question is actually quite [22:19] sensitive. [22:20] >> True. Would you say the Industrial [22:22] Revolution was actually a good thing? [22:25] Our understanding today is quite [22:27] different from what it was 200 years [22:29] ago. When the Industrial Revolution was [22:32] new, everyone thought it was great, as [22:34] if it were the only way to solve human [22:36] problems, right? But 200 years have [22:39] passed; has the world really become a [22:41] better place? That is why many people [22:44] are now reflecting on what kind of form [22:46] we should use to solve the problems of [22:48] human development. [22:51] >> Professor Feng, I would like to return [22:53] to my original question: some say [22:55] Chinese civilization is 3,000 or 5,000 [22:57] years old, but you say 8,000. Through [23:01] what kind of archaeological evidence is [23:03] that 8,000-year history presented, [23:05] regarding the three elements you [23:06] mentioned? [23:09] >> What we discussed about Kunlun earlier [23:11] is already related to this. As I said, [23:13] ancient people first needed to plan [23:15] space and time; this was the earliest [23:17] knowledge system humans established, [23:19] right? [23:20] >> So how did the ancients go about [23:22] planning it? They used a gnomon to [23:24] measure shadows. We can trace the [23:26] origins of Chinese civilization by [23:28] deducing when people first learned the [23:30] technique of setting up a gnomon to [23:32] measure shadows. And we have found it. [23:36] >> This dates back 8,000 years. A gnomon. [23:40] It is the site where ancients set up a [23:43] gnomon to measure shadows, at Zigui [23:45] Mentou in Hubei. Hubei. [23:47] >> This is the earliest tool for shadow [23:48] measurement that we have found today. [23:51] >> It not only has the form of a gnomon, [23:53] but also includes drawings. [23:54] >> This at the top must be the sun. [23:56] >> Exactly. [23:57] >> The very top is a sun. [23:58] >> Below is a little figure. [24:00] >> This signifies the earliest form of [24:01] human civilization 8,000 years ago. [24:04] >> It is for measuring shadows—what we [24:06] call the gnomon today—this is when [24:09] people learned to measure shadows. [24:11] >> Like the Huabiao at Tiananmen, right? [24:14] >> But that came later. Regarding this [24:19] gnomon, I’ve learned from Professor [24:20] Feng that when people first defined [24:22] time and space, wasn't it just the [24:24] shadow cast by the sun? You set up a [24:29] pole now. [24:30] >> Right. [24:30] >> But the earliest form was just a person [24:32] standing there casting a shadow. [24:33] Exactly, standing there. This means the [24:36] first shadow humans recognized had to [24:38] be their own. [24:39] >> So, in that sense, the earliest tool [24:41] for measuring shadows was the human [24:44] body. [24:44] >> Right, we have plenty of such evidence [24:46] now. [24:48] >> However, this only satisfies the three [24:50] criteria you mentioned. [24:52] >> And that brings up the question: what [24:54] about "De"(virtue)? " [24:57] >> De" is built upon the attainment and [24:59] content of being human. "De" is not [25:02] something empty. If we don't clarify [25:05] the connotation of "De"(virtue), then [25:07] this concept becomes an empty shell. [25:11] The ancients defined "De" very clearly [25:14] a long time ago. It comes down to one [25:16] word: trust. The trust of integrity. [25:19] >> The trust of integrity. Cultivating [25:21] virtue means cultivating integrity; it [25:23] means keeping one's word and not [25:24] deceiving. Lacking virtue simply means [25:26] not keeping one's word—it's that [25:28] simple. Therefore, the ancients [25:29] considered this matter to be of utmost [25:31] importance. But 8,000 years ago, we [25:32] didn't even have a written language yet [25:34] . [25:34] >> That's right. [25:35] >> Words like "virtue" or "trust" did not [25:37] even exist yet. [25:39] >> Let's first record this concept: the [25:41] core of virtue is integrity. But how [25:45] did the concept of integrity arise? How [25:48] did the ancients develop the concept of [25:50] integrity? It was through measuring [25:53] shadows with a gnomon. [25:56] >> Yes, you will find that time never [25:58] deceives anyone. [26:01] >> For example, by using a gnomon, we can [26:03] easily find the day of the year when [26:05] the shadow is shortest. [26:08] >> After that, people continued to measure [26:11] and discovered that after 365 days... [26:14] ... [26:14] >> it was short again. [26:15] >> It was the shortest again. [26:17] >> Ah. [26:17] >> People discovered the tropical year. [26:19] This cycle is 365 days. Then, after [26:23] another 365 days, they found it again. [26:27] This tropical year value returns again, [26:29] right? One or two years wouldn't mean [26:32] much, nor would eight or ten years, and [26:34] even 100 or 200 years wouldn't [26:36] necessarily make the ancients reflect. [26:38] But if it happens for 1,000 years like [26:40] this......isn't it time to reflect? [26:43] They felt that even though we never [26:45] made a pact with time, it arrived right [26:47] on schedule. Thus, they established a [26:51] philosophy: trust. What is the greatest [26:55] trust? Time. And so the concept of [26:58] integrity was born. Why do you call it [27:01] "Feng Shi"? It is destined, you will [27:03] discover it. [27:06] >> Mr. Feng, in his later years, said [27:08] excitedly one day that the core of [27:10] Chinese culture is the unity of heaven [27:12] and humanity, seemingly with deep [27:14] realization. How do I understand what [27:18] Mr. Feng meant? It is that back in [27:22] ancient times, before civilization and [27:24] even before the invention of writing... [27:26] ...a belief system had already emerged. [27:29] >> This belief system...... [27:30] >> was through observing celestial [27:31] phenomena. [27:31] >> Yes, it has a humanistic aspect. [27:33] >> Astronomy was the very first field of [27:35] study. [27:35] >> Exactly, that is humanism. And the [27:38] unity of heaven and humanity means the [27:39] heavens are like this. The stars are so [27:42] trustworthy and so constant. How do we [27:44] judge how a person should be? We look [27:46] at how the heavens are. [27:47] >> Yes, learn from it: humans follow the [27:49] earth, the earth follows heaven, and [27:51] heaven follows the Tao. [27:54] >> The people concerned were of high [27:55] status, such as a king about to go to [27:58] war, who would look and say, "Hmm, an [28:00] inauspicious start, don't move now." [28:02] >> Right, most concerned. [28:03] >> Many of the people concerned were of [28:05] high status, weren't they? They were [28:08] all very high-ranking and could judge [28:10] what could or could not be done; this [28:12] was definitely not something done by [28:13] commoners. [28:16] >> It must have been done by those in [28:17] power at the time. [28:19] >> Hmm. [28:20] >> By what we would call the monarchs of [28:22] that time. [28:22] >> Ah, that’s 8,000 years ago, right? [28:26] With a 1,000-year foundation of [28:27] observation, people were able to [28:29] recognize sincerity as the core of [28:32] morality, and thus we see writing in [28:34] materials from 7,000 years ago. To be [28:36] precise, we see the character "wen" [28:39] from "wentao." You mean 7,000 years [28:41] before oracle bone script, so today's [28:44] Chinese characters, the earliest ones, [28:46] are no longer oracle bone script. [28:48] >> Ah. [28:49] >> They are already scripts from 7,000 [28:51] years ago. [28:51] >> What is the specific name for this [28:53] script? [28:56] >> We discovered pottery from 7,000 years [28:58] ago at sites like Zhigui and Liulinxi [29:01] in Hubei. This pottery was shaped like [29:07] stands, like supports. These supports [29:12] weren't just randomly drawn on; they [29:14] were decorated with ancient Chinese [29:16] spatial symbols and images, [29:17] representing the five directions, the [29:20] nine palaces, and the sun. All of this [29:23] was completed 7,000 years ago, and [29:25] carved very clearly. Some of these [29:30] supports even had writing on them; we [29:32] saw three Chinese characters on an [29:34] image representing the nine palaces, [29:36] reading "Wu Tian Wen."" [29:40] >> Wu"(five)? [29:41] >> The number five. "Tian"(field), and " [29:44] Wen"(culture/script). [29:46] >> Wow. You are so impressive, okay. [29:48] >> Seven thousand years. [29:51] >> Seven thousand years. [29:53] >> Seven thousand years. [29:54] >> What does "Wu Tian" mean? It actually [29:58] reflects the ancient Chinese spatial [30:00] view of the world, dividing the world [30:02] into five regions. If we go to see the [30:05] Altar of Land and Grain in Zhongshan [30:07] Park, the altar from the Ming and Qing [30:08] dynasties, it has five-colored soil on [30:10] it. It uses five-colored soil to [30:12] represent the world. Because [30:14] five-colored soil represents the five [30:16] directions of the world, right? "Wu [30:18] Tian" means the soil of the five [30:20] directions of the world, and as we [30:22] discussed the meaning of "Wen,""Wu Tian [30:25] Wen" can be interpreted as the [30:27] civilization of the world. This is on [30:31] materials from 7,000 years ago. [30:34] >> Is this just your own theory, or has it [30:36] been recognized by the academic field? [30:38] >> No one has recognized this yet; it is [30:41] my own discovery, but if I were to put [30:43] these characters in front of you, you [30:45] would easily recognize them. Because [30:47] they are exactly the same as the oracle [30:49] bone script. Because Jia-Gu-Wen (Oracle [30:51] Bone Script) cannot possibly be the [30:52] earliest form of writing; it already [30:54] consists of 4,000 characters, so there [30:56] must have been something before it. [30:57] >> There certainly must have been a [30:59] prototype for this script. What kind of [31:01] concept is 4,000 characters? 4,000 [31:03] characters can be said to be [31:04] >> our level of literacy. [31:06] >> Yes, it's almost more than what most [31:07] people in our country today master in [31:09] their entire lives. [31:10] >> Yes, we only know about 3,000 [31:12] characters. [31:13] >> Exactly, that's how it is. [31:14] >> It couldn't have just appeared out of [31:16] thin air. Moreover, Jia-Gu-Wen is an [31:18] original script, not a derivative one. [31:20] Some ethnic scripts that emerged later [31:22] were derivative; they had a prototype [31:24] they could follow to create them. But [31:26] for this kind of original script, every [31:28] concept had to be derived through [31:29] observation and investigation. Only [31:30] then could it be created successfully. [31:32] Therefore, it could not have been [31:34] completed in a short period of time. [31:38] This is why the key position of [31:40] archaeoastronomy today lies in [31:42] understanding how the ancients observed [31:44] , how they corresponded with celestial [31:46] phenomena, and then manifesting this [31:48] understanding in human rituals, [31:50] institutions, [31:54] >> and symbols. Yes, exactly. [31:56] >> Can we understand it this way? [31:58] >> Absolutely. We can say that astronomy [32:00] is the origin of Chinese civilization. [32:03] >> Mm. Many core ideas of Chinese culture [32:06] ultimately lead back to astronomy. [32:09] >> Can it be said to be the origin of [32:10] human civilization worldwide? [32:12] >> Not just for Chinese civilization, [32:14] >> At least for China, it is this way. The [32:17] connection is too deep and profound. [32:19] For nomadic peoples, it might play a [32:21] role in certain aspects, but it’s not [32:23] like in Chinese culture, where it [32:25] directly influenced every facet. For [32:28] instance, observing celestial phenomena [32:30] is beneficial for farming. Like how the [32:33] Nile would flood when a certain star [32:35] appeared, right? This is the commonly [32:39] accepted view, but the consistent way [32:40] of thinking starts from the material. [32:43] >> Yes. [32:44] >> This is a principle Marxism taught us: [32:46] what do we use to judge a civilization? [32:50] What things did that era have? [32:53] >> Whether they had mud, bricks, stone, or [32:55] wood—using these things to judge the [32:57] stages of historical development. So, [33:01] your perspective is a bit of a [33:02] challenge. [33:04] >> It’s not entirely different from them [33:06] . [33:07] >> Ah. [33:08] >> If we purely restrict our understanding [33:10] to the material, I think that is too [33:12] narrow. [33:13] >> Mm. [33:13] >> What level do we elevate it to? It's [33:15] where knowledge comes from. It also [33:17] comes from the observation and analysis [33:19] of material, doesn't it? [33:20] >> Yes, it is [33:21] >> still materialistic. [33:23] >> What I find interesting is this: There [33:25] is a kind of knowledge. And this kind [33:26] of knowledge, for example, we are an [33:28] agricultural people, right? Mm. [33:30] >> So, for example, how was the farming [33:32] season determined in the past? For [33:34] example, the seasonal cycles, [33:36] >> are related to production. [33:37] >> When should we sow seeds? [33:38] >> Those who observed the heavens were the [33:40] ones who mastered this knowledge. They [33:42] must have been the earliest power [33:43] holders, right? [33:44] >> Because they made the decisions; they [33:46] told you to sow today. [33:47] >> Yes. Why did they tell you to sow today [33:50] ? Because they saw a specific celestial [33:53] sign, or when to harvest; they saw a [33:55] certain star. You see, this knowledge [33:57] wasn't necessarily held by the whole [33:59] tribe. Of course, it was mastered by [34:01] people like the high priests, or what [34:03] we call "Shamans." Often, these masters [34:06] of celestial knowledge were, in fact, [34:08] god-kings. That is to say, the person [34:10] who mastered this knowledge was [34:12] inevitably the person who held the [34:13] power. Right. Look, Wentao, he’s [34:16] already your star pupil; he’s added [34:18] countless interpretations to your ideas [34:20] . [34:21] >> This is very interesting. When you go [34:24] to the National Museum, one of the [34:26] first things you see, brought there [34:28] exactly as it was found, is from [34:29] Xishuipo in Puyang, Henan. [34:32] >> What era is this from? [34:33] >> This is 1,000 years older than the [34:35] Hongshan cultural remains we just [34:37] mentioned, 6,000— [34:39] >> 6,500 years. [34:42] >> 6,500 years ago, we can now infer that [34:44] this person was a priest or someone [34:46] similar, otherwise they wouldn't have [34:48] had such an elaborate burial. [34:50] >> They were the holder of the highest [34:52] power at the time. [34:53] >> So, and then there are the clam shells. [34:56] >> Right. [34:56] >> Arranged with clam shells. Look at what [34:59] we call the Azure Dragon on the left. [35:00] The White Tiger on the right. Isn't [35:02] there a dragon on one side? And a tiger [35:05] on the other. [35:06] >> This is a relic of primitive religion, [35:08] a relic of that primitive religion from [35:10] 6,500 years ago. Actually, its main [35:12] purpose was to serve the person we saw [35:14] earlier, the owner of that tomb, to [35:16] help their soul ascend to heaven. [35:18] >> Their soul ascends to heaven after [35:20] death. This soul ascension is related [35:22] to the Kunlun we just discussed. [35:24] We’ve been talking about the second [35:26] half of the Kunlun story, leaving him [35:28] completely stunned. [35:30] >> Regarding that Kunlun, the ancients [35:32] believed, who could perform the [35:33] sacrifice to heaven? Only the Son of [35:35] Heaven could sacrifice to heaven. Mm. [35:38] >> Right? Even the feudal lords didn't [35:40] have the qualification to sacrifice to [35:42] heaven. Why? Because, as Wentao just [35:44] mentioned, the role of astronomy was [35:46] essentially to provide time-keeping [35:47] services for agricultural production; [35:49] it had to solve the problem of [35:51] agricultural timing. But who observed [35:53] the heavens? Was it the general public? [35:56] No, everyone else was oblivious to the [35:58] heavens. So there must have been a very [36:01] small number of sages who, through [36:03] their own intelligence and diligent [36:05] observation, learned that when a [36:07] certain star reached a certain position [36:09] , it was time to sow. [36:11] >> They had to earn the trust of the [36:12] emperor. [36:14] >> And this person is the emperor; every [36:16] time he receives the mandate, he gets [36:18] this harvest. To those who are ignorant [36:23] of the world, who is this person? [36:27] >> That is the ultimate tool for literary [36:29] and political struggle. [36:32] >> He is the one who holds the power. This [36:35] establishes the foundation of royal [36:37] power. Therefore, throughout the long [36:40] history of ancient Chinese society, [36:42] astronomy was always monopolized by the [36:45] royal family. In ancient China, the [36:47] private study of astronomy by commoners [36:49] was forbidden, because it was [36:51] considered the knowledge of the rulers, [36:53] the rulers ' [36:53] >> court secrets. [36:54] >> Yes, exactly, court secrets, this is [36:57] >> This is what they call "severing the [36:58] communication between heaven and earth. [36:59] " [36:59] >> So, as time went on, everyone felt that [37:01] he was the person who understood the [37:03] will of heaven. He communicates with [37:05] heaven, so who gave him his power? [37:06] >> Heaven grants it to him. [37:08] >> Right, and this developed into the " [37:09] divine right of kings." [37:10] >> Mm. [37:11] >> Right, so with the divine right of [37:12] kings, your power while alive is given [37:14] by heaven, but where do you go after [37:15] you die? This developed into a [37:17] primitive religion, known as deity [37:19] worship. This is where it originated. [37:21] >> This whole thing is a primitive [37:22] religious group from 6,500 years ago; [37:24] the sacrifice to heaven is performed by [37:26] this ruler, right? [37:27] >> He performs it, but after he dies, he [37:28] ascends to heaven; where does he ascend [37:30] from? From Kunlun Mound, from the very [37:32] place where he performed the sacrifices [37:33] to heaven. It's called Kunlun Mound, [37:35] that is, the circular mound composed of [37:37] three concentric circles where [37:38] sacrifices to heaven were held. [37:40] >> Mm. [37:40] >> So Kunlun became the place of ascension [37:42] , and in Chinese culture, it became [37:44] that place; since ascension must happen [37:46] at a high place, and sacrifices must be [37:49] held at a high place, right? Ascension [37:51] must be high because he needs to be [37:53] closer to heaven. [37:54] >> Mm. [37:55] >> Therefore, by the Warring States and [37:57] Qin periods, [37:58] >> people had a new understanding of [38:00] Kunlun. What is the geographic [38:02] characteristic of China's northwest? [38:05] >> High. [38:06] >> A plateau? The northwest is high and [38:08] the southeast is low. [38:10] >> Exactly. [38:10] >> China's natural geography is this [38:12] northwest plateau, so looking at the [38:14] Qin script we saw earlier, how was " [38:16] Kunlun" written? "Lun" had a radical, [38:19] and then "lun" on one side, right? What [38:21] does this character mean? It means a [38:23] mountain plateau, it means a highland. [38:25] >> Ah, and in the Eight Trigrams we talk [38:27] about now, the northwest trigram is [38:29] >> Heaven. [38:30] >> Exactly. Good student. So it uses this [38:36] natural geography to mirror its own [38:38] religious tradition. The northwest [38:42] plateau is four or five thousand meters [38:44] above sea level, right? While the [38:46] southeast is only about 1,200 meters, [38:48] right? From a position at 1,200 meters, [38:50] looking up at a position of four or [38:51] five thousand meters, isn't that [38:53] already the place where one ascends to [38:55] heaven? So, by leveraging this physical [38:57] geography, he shaped a Kunlun ideology [38:59] from the Warring States to the Qin era. [39:02] >> That's why he used this character "Lun, [39:04] " which refers to mountain ranges, [39:05] representing the vast wilderness in the [39:07] northwest. That is the meaning. So I'm [39:10] saying that Professor Feng's [39:12] scholarship is currently controversial, [39:14] right? Or rather, we need more evidence [39:17] . Some in academia say the same, but I [39:21] personally find some points quite [39:23] persuasive, for example, the Hetu and [39:25] Luoshu. [39:27] >> Those are all just legends. [39:31] >> Look, Professor Feng, I'm showing off [39:33] my meager skills, but let me set the [39:35] stage for you. [39:38] >> The Hetu and Luoshu are very mysterious [39:40] artifacts from ancient China. Legend [39:44] has it that a dragon-horse emerged from [39:46] the Yellow River with a diagram on its [39:48] back, which is called the Hetu. The [39:52] Luoshu comes from the Luo River; a [39:53] turtle appeared from the Luo River near [39:56] Luoyang. On this turtle's back, there [39:58] was a Luoshu. Even Confucius lamented [40:02] that the river did not produce the map, [40:04] and the Luo did not produce the book; I [40:06] am in despair. It is said that when the [40:09] Hetu and Luoshu appear, a sage shall [40:11] know, meaning their appearance is of [40:13] great significance. So, what exactly [40:16] are the Hetu and Luoshu? [40:18] >> Ah Cheng published a book and gave it [40:20] to me, but I was completely confused [40:22] after reading it. The book by Mr. Ah [40:25] Cheng cites Professor Feng Shi's* [40:27] Chinese Archaeoastronomy*. [40:30] >> Yes, during the Southern Song Dynasty [40:32] in China, Zhu Xi... [40:34] >> He wrote a book, and look, he [40:36] specifically marked the Hetu... [40:38] >> Yes. ... [40:39] >> and the Luoshu. It's quite magical; [40:41] it's said that one of his students went [40:43] to the southwest region...... [40:46] >> found this diagram, and brought it to [40:48] his teacher, Zhu Xi, but the student, [40:50] surnamed Cai...... [40:52] >> kept one copy for himself. He kept a [40:54] copy. So, where was that specific copy [40:57] discovered later? I think you, you, you [41:01] can talk to us about this diagram now, [41:03] Professor Feng. [41:05] >> Yes, we all call this diagram the Taiji [41:08] Diagram. [41:09] >> Right? Actually, its original name, or [41:12] the original name of the Yi script, is [41:15] "Universe." Using Yi script, it came [41:18] from the Yi script, it was derived from [41:20] the Yi script. The original Yi script [41:22] word is "Universe." [41:23] >> Does "Universe" here equal the Chinese [41:26] character for "Universe"? [41:27] >> What we translate from the Yi script is [41:29] "Universe." [41:30] >> Yes. It is actually an astronomical [41:33] chart. [41:35] >> This matter actually continues from [41:37] what Wentao just mentioned. That is to [41:41] say, the Han social hierarchy idealized [41:43] and standardized it somewhat, [41:45] introducing modifications, whereas in [41:47] the heritage of ethnic minorities, it [41:50] remains simpler and more primitive, [41:52] manifesting simply as a dragon. [41:54] >> Dragon. [41:55] >> Dragon. [41:56] >> Dragon. [41:58] >> You see, in ancient texts, the [41:59] so-called Taiji diagram didn't [42:01] originally have the contrasting yin and [42:03] yang; it was just plain white. [42:06] >> At the center, [42:07] >> it was just a blank, a dragon, and a [42:10] sheep. Painted on a round plate, a [42:13] circular dragon; that dragon is very [42:15] simple. So we know that the Taiji [42:18] diagram, the so-called Taiji diagram, [42:20] might actually be an astronomical chart [42:22] , and the primary star constellation it [42:24] depicts is the dragon. The stars in the [42:27] sky are divided into 28 mansions, [42:29] groups of stars connected together, [42:31] just like how Westerners have [42:32] constellations like Leo or Capricorn, [42:35] right? Ours is, for example, the Dragon [42:37] constellation, right? Jiao, Kang, Di, [42:39] Fang, Wei...You've mentioned so many [42:41] constellations, which one should I [42:43] really look at? Of course, the most [42:45] important ones are those directly [42:47] related to agricultural production, [42:49] those that can guide farming seasons; [42:51] those are the most critical. And which [42:53] constellations guide farming? It's the [42:55] Dragon constellation. Ah, the Dragon [42:58] constellation actually forms the first [43:01] six mansions in the system of the 28 [43:03] mansions. The first mansion is Jiao; [43:06] the 28 mansions start from there. [43:08] >> Not that "foot" mansion. [43:10] >> The name "Jiao"(Horn) is derived from [43:12] the dragon's horn. Then come Kang, Di, [43:14] Fang, and Wei. Wei, as the name implies [43:17] , is the dragon's tail. Right, and then [43:19] there is also Xin. Xin is the dragon's [43:22] heart. These six mansions form a [43:24] massive celestial phenomenon, which the [43:26] ancients called the Dragon. So what [43:29] does "Dragon" mean? What is the meaning [43:31] of the pronunciation "Long"? It means " [43:34] huge." [43:35] >> The pronunciation means "huge." So, [43:38] what is the meaning conveyed by the [43:40] sound of "Long"? It means huge. [43:42] >> Oh, so Dragon means big. [43:44] >> Exactly, Dragon means big, in ancient [43:46] Chinese astronomy. This Dragon [43:49] constellation is composed of six [43:51] mansions, making it the largest one. If [43:54] the weather is good, we can see that [43:56] when the Dragon constellation leaps out [43:59] from the east, it occupies almost half [44:01] the sky—it's a spectacular sight. And [44:04] others...yes, Dragon is the Dragon [44:06] phenomenon, the Dragon star; that is [44:09] what it signifies. The other [44:11] constellations are composed of either [44:13] one or two mansions and are very small, [44:15] unlike the Tiger. In feng shui, the [44:17] Tiger is associated with just two [44:19] constellations in astronomy, the Zi and [44:21] Shen, which form a very small tiger. [44:23] Right. But the Dragon consists of six [44:25] stars. It is very spectacular, so the [44:28] ancients used it to determine their [44:30] agricultural cycles. If so, we can [44:33] connect those six stars of the Dragon [44:35] constellation. Once connected, you will [44:38] see it matches the character for " [44:39] Dragon" in oracle bone script, which is [44:41] the same as the modern Chinese [44:43] character for "Dragon." [44:44] >> Because if you look at the others, we [44:46] used to speak of gods in the four [44:48] cardinal directions, like the Vermilion [44:50] Bird and the White Tiger—these are [44:52] based on real things, but look at the [44:54] Dragon. [44:55] >> Where does the dragon come from? People [44:57] generally say it’s a composite of [44:59] various animals. True. [45:01] >> But if you look at the dragon shape in [45:02] ancient scripts, [45:03] >> Yes, that one. [45:05] >> It is identical to the actual Azure [45:07] Dragon constellation. [45:09] >> It is the same; that is to say—please [45:12] , go on, go on. [45:14] >> I mean, we see many animal characters [45:17] in oracle bone script, right? For [45:19] instance, the elephant or the pig, they [45:21] have living counterparts in reality, [45:23] but you cannot find a dragon in the [45:25] real world. That is why I mentioned [45:27] that the epistemology of ancient [45:28] Chinese was called "investigating [45:29] things to extend knowledge." [45:30] >> Hmm. [45:31] >> Everything was not just something they [45:33] conjured up out of thin air. So where [45:36] could they see this dragon? In the sky. [45:38] >> What does "The Dragon Raises Its Head [45:40] on the Second Day of the Second Lunar [45:41] Month" mean? [45:42] >> The Dragon Raising Its Head is actually [45:44] what the I Ching refers to as "The [45:46] dragon appears in the field." [45:47] >> What does the Qian hexagram talk about? [45:49] It speaks of six dragons. Hidden dragon [45:51] , dragon appears in the field, leaping [45:53] into the abyss, flying dragon in the [45:55] sky, soaring dragon, and dragon without [45:57] a head. The whole thing describes the [45:59] periodic changes of the stars moving [46:01] across the sky. [46:02] >> So what does the Qian hexagram discuss? [46:04] It discusses observing celestial [46:05] phenomena to determine the seasons. It [46:06] talks about the dragon. What is the [46:07] dragon? The Dragon constellation [46:09] consists of stars in the sky. [46:10] >> These stars, for example, on the second [46:11] day of the second lunar month, right? [46:13] >> Yes, that is the Jiao constellation. [46:15] The second day of the second month is [46:16] that Jiao constellation. And "hidden [46:17] dragon," what does that mean? It means [46:19] the Dragon constellation has hidden [46:20] below the horizon, and you cannot see [46:21] it. At this time, you cannot find the [46:23] Dragon constellation in the sky. Then, [46:25] after a period of time, after the sun [46:27] sets, the Jiao constellation of the [46:28] Dragon—that first lunar mansion— [46:30] rises from the eastern horizon. This [46:32] phenomenon is called "dragon appears in [46:35] the field" in the I Ching, and known as [46:37] "the dragon raises its head" in [46:39] folklore. [46:39] >> And then, finally, the flying dragon in [46:41] the sky. [46:42] >> Exactly, and then, next is the leaping [46:44] into the abyss. "Dragon in the field" [46:46] follows "Dragon in the abyss." Being in [46:49] the abyss means these six [46:50] constellations—Jiao, Kang, Di, Fang, [46:53] Xin, and Wei—leap out from the [46:54] eastern horizon. Then it continues to [46:56] move across the sky until it reaches [46:58] the due south position. This is what [47:00] the I Ching refers to as "Flying dragon [47:02] in the heavens."" [47:03] >> Flying dragon in the heavens" [47:04] corresponds precisely to the line of [47:05] the nine-five. That is why the number [47:07] ninety-five holds a special [47:08] significance in Chinese culture. [47:10] >> The Exalted Ninety-Five. [47:11] >> The Exalted Ninety-Five. [47:12] >> Mm. [47:13] >> Because at this time, the Dragon [47:14] constellation is at its highest point. [47:16] >> It perfectly represents the supreme, [47:18] which we have studied together from [47:20] elementary school through graduate [47:21] school. [47:22] >> Regarding the legends of the past, we [47:24] often assume the "Yellow River Map" [47:26] refers to the Yellow River, with a [47:28] dragon-horse emerging from it. But [47:29] according to this interpretation, it [47:31] actually refers to the eastern Dragon [47:33] constellation leaping out above the [47:35] Milky Way. If you observe the sky [47:37] yourself, you will understand. This is [47:38] why I keep emphasizing that Chinese [47:40] epistemology is based on the [47:42] investigation of things. Mm. [47:43] >> When you observe the sky in reality, [47:45] you will see that once Jiao, Kang, Di, [47:48] Fang, Xin, and Wei have all emerged, [47:50] the Milky Way follows. The Milky Way is [47:52] located just below the dragon's tail. [47:54] When you look at the sky, it appears [47:56] exactly as if the dragon is leaping out [47:57] of the river. [47:58] >> So, that "river" is the Milky Way. [48:00] >> Right, so for the River Map and the Luo [48:02] Script, the Luo emerges... [48:03] >> Luo signifies the center of the earth. [48:05] >> It means the center of heaven and earth [48:06] . [48:07] >> The Luo River, after all. [48:08] >> Yes, the Luo River. [48:09] >> But now Professor Feng is saying the " [48:11] River" refers to the Milky Way. One is [48:13] a celestial map. [48:14] >> The other is a geographical map. [48:15] >> Oh, so the Luo is still the Luo River, [48:17] geographically speaking? [48:18] >> The Luo is indeed the Luo River, but [48:20] there are differences depending on the [48:21] era. [48:22] >> Mm. [48:23] >> Taking the Luo River as the center of [48:25] heaven and earth is something that [48:26] actually dates back to the late Xia [48:28] Dynasty in Chinese history. Today, we [48:31] have very reliable evidence to prove [48:33] this. Before that, the Luo River was [48:35] not considered the center of heaven and [48:37] earth by the ancient Chinese. Therefore [48:39] , if the "Luo Script" signifies the [48:40] center of heaven and earth, the name [48:42] cannot predate the Xia Dynasty. [48:44] Actually, today we have already found a [48:46] 5,300-year-old "Luo Script," which at [48:49] the time was held by a turtle—a [48:51] stone-carved one. [48:53] >> This turtle was excavated at the [48:55] Lingjiatan site in Hanshan, Anhui. How [48:58] many years ago was this? [48:59] >> 5,300 years ago. [49:01] >> 5,300 years ago, you see, it was a [49:03] turtle... [49:04] >> Held by a turtle. [49:05] >> Clasping a jade tablet. This... [49:07] >> What is drawn on this jade tablet is [49:08] the so-called geographical space. [49:10] >> This is the jade tablet, this is the [49:12] turtle; this is the legend of the [49:14] turtle emerging from the Luo River [49:15] bearing the Luo Script, but it has a [49:17] pattern like this on it. [49:19] >> Yes. In the center is an octagon [49:22] pointing in four directions. It points [49:26] to the four cardinal directions, but it [49:28] has eight corners; what is this figure? [49:31] It is actually the ancients' planning [49:33] of geographical space, which is what we [49:35] just emphasized: the ancients 'planning [49:38] of space and time. What was the [49:40] earliest knowledge system established [49:41] by the ancients? It was their conscious [49:43] planning of space and time, called " [49:45] determining direction and position." [49:47] Called determining orientation. First, [49:49] they measured the east, west, south, [49:51] north, and center. Then they recognized [49:54] the four corners, creating the "nine [49:56] palaces," thus establishing this [49:58] nine-directional space. From five [50:00] directions to nine, this space combines [50:02] these two concepts into this unique [50:04] eight-cornered shape pointing to the [50:06] four directions. [50:11] >> Professor Feng's explanation of the [50:13] dragon just now is the same as your [50:15] deduction regarding the M45 pit; this [50:17] is the origin of the dragon. The one [50:22] from Xishuipo 6,500 years ago, you [50:24] mentioned the M45 one—the dragon and [50:26] tiger there are both celestial [50:28] phenomena. [50:28] >> Hmm. [50:29] >> Look here. [50:30] >> It was like this at the time. This is [50:32] not left Green Dragon and right White [50:34] Tiger; is this the priest in the middle [50:35] ? Or at the feet. [50:37] >> Very interesting, it's very interesting [50:40] at the feet, a triangle, this is made [50:42] of clam shells, a triangle, and two [50:44] sticks below the triangle. [50:45] >> These are tibia bones. [50:47] >> It is human, human leg bones. [50:49] >> Human leg bones. [50:50] >> Placed on the side. Yes, look, there [50:52] are several others around, there are [50:54] several others around that could be [50:56] considered skulls, right? So why do you [50:59] see this as a celestial phenomenon? To [51:01] prove it is a celestial phenomenon, the [51:03] most crucial part is the nature of the [51:04] Big Dipper. Once you have the nature of [51:06] the Big Dipper, the celestial aspect [51:08] becomes self-evident. Right? Because [51:10] when we see a dragon and tiger, we [51:11] naturally imagine the Four Symbols of [51:13] the heavens. Right. [51:14] >> Green Dragon on the left, White Tiger [51:16] on the right, Vermilion Bird in the [51:17] front, Black Tortoise in the back, [51:18] right? But the Four Symbols in Chinese [51:20] culture... [51:21] >> They were later endowed with many [51:22] connotations; they aren't necessarily [51:24] just images. That is to say, the dragon [51:26] and tiger themselves cannot prove what [51:28] they really are. [51:30] >> Right, when you look at Feng Shui later [51:32] , they are all left dragon and right [51:34] tiger; they can represent orientation, [51:36] they can represent auspiciousness, [51:38] right, many meanings. But if we can [51:40] solve the image at the tomb owner's [51:42] feet, the nature of the dragon and [51:43] tiger will be easily resolved. So what [51:46] is this image? It means the thing at [51:48] the tomb owner's feet is the Big Dipper [51:49] . This can be argued from three aspects [51:52] . First, in terms of its image, it [51:54] resembles it. The Big Dipper consists [51:56] of two parts: one is the ladle, right, [51:58] and the other is the handle. Here, the [52:01] clam shell part represents the ladle, [52:03] and the tibia bones...It represents the [52:05] handle of the Dipper, right? That's the [52:07] first point. Second, if it represents [52:09] the Big Dipper, the positions of the [52:11] Big Dipper, the Dragon constellation, [52:13] and the Tiger constellation in the sky [52:15] are fixed. They have a fixed positional [52:17] relationship, and this relationship [52:19] does not change. What does it [52:21] demonstrate? It shows the handle of the [52:22] Dipper pointing toward the dragon's [52:24] head, and the bowl of the Dipper [52:25] pointing toward the tiger's head. That [52:27] is the astral configuration in the sky. [52:29] Now look inside this tomb; if this [52:31] image is the Big Dipper, are those two [52:33] bones pointing toward the handle of the [52:35] Dipper? They point exactly toward the [52:38] dragon's head. [52:39] >> Yes, you see these bones pointing [52:40] toward the head of the Azure Dragon. [52:43] >> And the clam shells arranged in a [52:45] triangle, do they represent the bowl of [52:47] the Dipper? They are positioned exactly [52:49] on the tiger's head, which matches the [52:51] celestial records and the "Treatise on [52:52] the Celestial Offices" in the Records [52:54] of the Grand Historian perfectly. So, [52:56] why use human shinbones? Right, this is [52:59] what you just mentioned; we said the [53:01] first shadow humans recognized was [53:03] whose shadow? The human shadow. Okay, [53:07] so what is the most crucial part that [53:09] supports the human body in an upright [53:11] position to measure shadows? [53:13] >> It is the human leg. So, after people [53:16] invented the gnomon, they had to give [53:18] it a name. Since the gnomon was created [53:21] to imitate human measurement, what [53:23] should I call it? The ancients were [53:25] very simple; they took the name of the [53:27] leg bone that supports the upright [53:29] human body and gave it to the gnomon, [53:31] using it as the name for the gnomon. [53:33] This is an ancient Chinese character [53:35] that is not commonly used now; it has [53:37] the "bone" radical on the left. And the [53:39] character "bei" on the right. " [53:41] >> Bei." That is [53:42] >> the word still exists in colloquial [53:44] language. [53:45] >> In Cantonese, it's "bei.""Bei da, bei [53:49] da,""bei" refers to the leg; it's still [53:51] found in colloquial Cantonese. [53:55] >> This is the ancient mathematical text [53:57] called the Zhou Bi Suan Jing. And you [54:00] see, back then at Xishuipo, you really [54:02] should go see it. Xishuipo, what we see [54:05] is just the bottom-most part. In the [54:07] National Museum, this actually spans a [54:10] distance of 100 meters. [54:11] >> Along the meridian line, in a [54:13] north-south direction over a 100-meter [54:15] distance, at intervals of about every [54:17] 25 meters, [54:18] >> there is another site, another site, [54:20] another site. The one at the very top [54:22] is a small person, a human being. [54:24] >> That person is missing this [54:26] >> Yes, the shinbone. [54:27] >> Shin, look. [54:28] >> It is highly likely that the "jin"(shin [54:30] /gnomon) of this Big Dipper is that [54:32] person's shinbone. [54:34] >> Then, who was that person? [54:36] >> You see, as we mentioned in the ancient [54:39] texts, it says that "bi" refers to the [54:41] human leg bone, and "biao" refers to [54:43] the gnomon used for shadow measurement, [54:46] so they linked the human leg bone with [54:48] the gnomon. Ah, this formed an image of [54:51] the Big Dipper; now that we have this [54:53] Big Dipper. What else could the dragon [54:56] and tiger coexisting with it be? In [54:58] this tomb, besides the tomb occupant, [55:00] there are actually three other people. [55:03] >> Mm. [55:04] >> These three individuals actually carry [55:06] cultural symbolism. The ancient Chinese [55:08] had a concept; just as we discussed [55:10] earlier regarding Kunlun, where the sun [55:13] circles the sky in three concentric [55:14] paths, representing the two equinoxes [55:17] and two solstices, right? The ancients [55:19] wondered how these two equinoxes and [55:21] two solstices could arrive punctually [55:23] without an appointment; there must be [55:25] deities in charge of them. Thus, the [55:27] concept of the four seasonal deities [55:29] was developed. These four deities were [55:32] arranged in space; the deity of the [55:34] vernal equinox lived in the east, and [55:36] the deity of the autumnal equinox lived [55:38] in the west. The winter solstice deity [55:40] lived in the north, while the summer [55:42] solstice deity lived in the south. [55:44] Let’s look at these four people: one [55:46] in the east, one in the west, one in [55:49] the north—but one is missing. [55:51] Furthermore, if you carefully observe [55:53] the person in the north, there is [55:55] another meaning. He wasn't placed along [55:57] the direction of the tomb; he was [55:59] placed at an angle. I’ve calculated [56:01] this angle. What is the significance of [56:03] this angle? It points exactly toward [56:06] the position where the sun rises on the [56:08] winter solstice, as seen from Puyang. [56:11] It is exactly at sunrise, indicating [56:13] that he is the deity of the winter [56:15] solstice, the deity of the solstice, [56:17] but in this tomb, the summer solstice [56:19] deity is actually missing. Where is the [56:21] summer solstice deity? [56:22] >> It's this one. [56:23] >> This is the complete floor plan we see, [56:25] on the southernmost side, also called [56:27] the very top. [56:29] >> On the southernmost side, as Cai Wentao [56:31] said, this person’s lower leg bone is [56:33] missing—it was detached. In the tomb, [56:38] it serves as the handle of the Big [56:40] Dipper. We say that the handle of the [56:41] dipper is the "Zhou Bi." What does it [56:43] represent? It represents the gnomon [56:45] used for measuring the shadow, right? [56:47] That raises a question: when did the [56:49] ancients set up the gnomon to measure? [56:52] Did they measure every day? No. The [56:55] most important gnomon-measuring [56:57] activity of the ancients is recorded [56:59] very clearly in the "Shangshu." So, the [57:04] ancients took the bone of the deity [57:06] symbolizing the summer solstice and [57:08] detached it. To serve as the handle of [57:10] the Zhou Bi, symbolizing the gnomon [57:12] used for measuring shadows. You mean to [57:14] say all this knowledge was produced [57:16] 6,500 years ago. [57:17] >> Is it south at the top and north at the [57:19] bottom? [57:19] >> The spirit of the southern expansion [57:21] system. [57:21] >> What kind of impact do you think it can [57:23] have on us? [57:24] >> No wonder they concluded that many [57:26] scholars of ancient texts are poets; it [57:28] truly requires imagination. [57:31] >> Besides imagination, there is also [57:33] documentary evidence. In our program, [57:36] it's impossible to cite all the texts, [57:38] but there is evidence in ancient books [57:40] for all of this. That is to say, people [57:43] and events may change over time, right? [57:45] But the inheritance of knowledge and [57:47] thought remains constant. [57:49] >> Yes, for example, as a layman, like a [57:51] primary school student, some things [57:53] require more evidence, but others I am [57:55] more inclined to believe. For instance, [57:58] the relationship between the Azure [57:59] Dragon of the East, the White Tiger of [58:01] the West, and the Big Dipper in the [58:03] Puyang Xishuipo tomb, dating back 6,500 [58:05] years. I have also visited the Marquis [58:07] Yi of Zeng tomb. That tomb belongs to [58:09] the Warring States period. [58:10] >> Exceeding the graduate student's [58:12] standard. [58:13] >> No, it's from the Warring States period [58:15] , depicting an astrological chart where [58:17] the relationship between the Azure [58:18] Dragon and White Tiger is the same. It [58:21] means a form of astronomical knowledge [58:23] was passed down to the Warring States [58:25] period. [58:25] >> Four thousand years. [58:27] >> Inherited for four thousand years. [58:28] >> It hasn't changed. [58:29] >> It hasn't changed at all. The chart [58:32] from the Puyang Xishuipo tomb in Henan, [58:35] carbon-dated to 6,500 years ago, [58:37] matches this one. [58:40] >> When we look them up and compare, they [58:42] are identical, and it even clearly [58:44] states: Big Dipper, Azure Dragon, White [58:46] Tiger, and the 28 Lunar Mansions. [58:50] >> This proves that knowledge of the 28 [58:52] Lunar Mansions existed 6,500 years ago, [58:54] even though we didn't believe so until [58:56] now. That's why I find Professor Feng's [58:59] research so intriguing for further [59:01] exploration. What is civilization? If [59:05] they possessed such a system of [59:07] astronomical knowledge—a system that [59:09] is even metaphysical and celestial— [59:11] then this ethnic group or community [59:12] that produced this knowledge...Should [59:14] it be called a civilization? Or should [59:18] it be called primitive savagery? [59:20] >> You mention these things. [59:21] >> It raises this very question. [59:22] >> Exactly. You tell me, could such a [59:26] massive knowledge system have been [59:27] created by barbarians? [59:29] >> So, this directly relates to how we [59:31] define ourselves. [59:33] >> Therefore, we cannot continue to rely [59:34] solely on material perspectives when [59:36] considering the evolution of [59:38] civilization. [59:40] >> We must break the Western standards for [59:41] defining a state. Your research on [59:46] defining states might face opposition [59:48] from those holding traditional views on [59:50] material civilization, but you will [59:52] definitely gain two pillars of support. [59:57] The first is that it pushes the [59:58] timeline of Chinese civilization [60:00] further back. This is certainly [60:04] something that makes everyone happy; [60:06] whether it's 3,000, 5,000, or even [60:08] 6,000 years, the second point—and [60:10] it’s a very popular and important one [60:12] now—is the need to create an [60:14] autonomous discourse system. Right? He [60:21] tries his best to avoid using modern [60:22] Western discourse when looking for the [60:24] causes and effects of these things [60:26] within traditional Chinese discourse. [60:30] >> Yes. [60:31] >> That’s for sure. [60:32] >> Yes, Professor Xu, what you just said [60:34] relates to Professor Feng’s [60:35] introduction of his studies. I feel [60:38] that the topic you are discussing is [60:39] actually very worth debating. I think [60:42] the issue raised by Chinese [60:44] archaeologists is indeed one. It is a [60:47] question of definition; that is to say, [60:49] what do you call civilization? Does [60:52] every civilization have its own unique [60:54] concepts and characteristics? I’ll [60:58] even hypothesize: if a people developed [61:00] a knowledge system thousands of years [61:02] ago—regardless of whether it’s true [61:04] or false—and they lived by it, [61:06] established a code of conduct, and [61:08] practiced virtues like "the five [61:09] stresses and four beauties," right? And [61:15] even if they didn't have bronze ware [61:17] and perhaps lived in grass huts—or [61:19] maybe they didn't live in huts, right [61:20] —if you encountered such a group, [61:22] would you consider them savage and [61:24] uncivilized? Or would you think they [61:27] possess some form of civilization? I [61:29] think this question is well worth [61:30] exploring. That is why it’s a hot [61:33] topic now; it’s a hot topic in the [61:35] social sciences field, called " [61:36] discourse system," the discourse system [61:38] . [61:39] >> Of course, if you want to rebuild [61:41] China’s own civilization confidence, [61:43] you must sort things out within [61:45] China’s own conceptual framework, [61:46] right? You cannot use other people’s [61:49] concepts to define your own. [61:50] >> The main thing is that many concepts [61:52] are different from the Western ones [61:54] borrowed later on. [61:55] >> Yes, to put it bluntly, what kind of [61:58] state have we been in for a long time? [62:00] It’s using Chinese characters to [62:02] learn Western culture. [62:04] >> How so? [62:05] >> It means we are learning using Chinese [62:06] characters. But the entire set of [62:09] concepts and standards we study are all [62:11] Western. Simply put, if we want to [62:15] publish papers in universities and get [62:17] them into SCI journals, no matter how [62:19] much sense you make in plain language, [62:21] it’s useless; you have to use some [62:22] jargon, right? You must use that to be [62:26] accepted. [62:28] >> You'd be better off citing the original [62:30] text; otherwise, take this phrase " [62:32] autonomous discourse system" for [62:34] example. The word "discourse" comes [62:38] from elsewhere; Chinese didn't [62:40] originally have this term. So, when you [62:44] bring it up now, it presents many [62:46] challenges, you know? But I actually [62:51] think this is quite meaningful, because [62:53] in previous years, it had reached a [62:55] point—I don’t know about your [62:56] fields of astronomy or archaeology— [62:58] but in our field, it had basically [62:59] reached a stage where if you didn't [63:01] cite foreign theorists, your paper [63:03] wouldn't get published. [63:10] >> You couldn't get it published, so [63:12] students would finish writing first, [63:14] and then—to put it plainly—go find [63:16] someone else to attribute it to, saying [63:18] this is New Criticism, this is [63:20] something else, and so on, just to add [63:22] citations. This trend is really not [63:27] good. [63:28] >> Actually, professors are well aware of [63:31] this, many in academia. [63:32] >> Humanists. Back to when I saw that wood [63:37] and those various materials, I thought [63:39] it was quite fun, so I gave it a… [63:41] mentioning a poet, what did you say? [63:45] >> Poetic imagination. [63:47] >> Poetic imagination, I’ll let my [63:49] poetic imagination run a little wild. I [63:53] find it very poetic, very rare; a rare [63:55] kind of imagination, for instance, [63:57] those bones or various stones, somehow [63:59] corresponding to a certain position in [64:01] the sky. It's as if, even after you die [64:08] , you are still signaling to a certain [64:09] point in the heavens. In English, it's [64:13] like "I see you"—I know you, I [64:15] understand you, I have grasped you— [64:17] like there's a code or a secret [64:19] language. I think that's too poetic, [64:21] too rare, that kind of hidden secret [64:23] language. At that time, besides its [64:27] practical use in agricultural society, [64:29] there's another interpretation. In my [64:34] view, if I were to set a standard for [64:35] civilization, it’s when you start to [64:37] consider where you are positioned. Yes, [64:42] your position. Your place between [64:44] heaven, earth, and humanity. When we [64:46] look at various astronomical phenomena, [64:49] besides just knowing when to plant or [64:51] harvest—no, imagine a circle and a [64:53] rod. [64:54] >> On the same day, the sun sets. [64:57] >> At sunrise, the shadow falls on a point [64:59] , and you draw a line, right? At sunset [65:02] , the shadow cast by this rod creates a [65:04] focus point on the circle, right? [65:10] Connecting these two focal points [65:11] creates a straight line, which is due [65:13] east and due west, and then drawing [65:15] another line through the center creates [65:17] due south and due north; this method is [65:19] called "two ropes." [65:23] >> A rope made of two ropes. [65:25] >> You've learned well. [65:26] >> Oh, this...this... [65:28] >> Look at this. [65:30] >> Does it look like the shape of a rope [65:32] to you? [65:33] >> It means that when measuring east, west [65:35] , north, and south, you must use two [65:37] ropes to ensure it is straight. So the [65:39] ancients were very practical; they [65:41] called the line pointing east-west the [65:43] "Mao-You line," and the line pointing [65:45] north-south the "Zi-Wu line," thus [65:47] forming what we call the Mao-You and [65:49] Zi-Wu axes. [65:50] >> Actually, what I’m thinking is... [65:52] It’s about this position of Jiahui. [65:54] It’s about the Chinese people; [65:56] sometimes we need to understand our [65:58] traditional culture, a culture that has [66:00] remained unbroken for thousands of [66:02] years. You can really imagine what kind [66:04] of people they were; they first [66:06] established... [66:08] >> People just like us. [66:09] >> East, west, north, south, and center— [66:11] they defined it this way, called the " [66:13] four directions and five positions," [66:15] and from the center, they developed the [66:17] Nine Palaces and Eight Trigrams, [66:18] believing heaven was round like a lid. [66:20] Then, the peak that props it up, like [66:23] the top of a tent, is the North Star. [66:25] The Ziwei star; that's why the [66:27] Forbidden City is called the "Purple [66:29] Forbidden City," and the order of the [66:30] human world was completely established [66:32] based on this. Chinese science is [66:35] exactly in correspondence with the [66:37] order of the human world. [66:40] >> This concept of "heaven and man" is [66:42] truly different from Greece, where [66:44] early explorations focused on the [66:45] relationship between man and nature, [66:47] asking what humans are actually made of [66:49] . [66:50] >> Right. [66:51] >> For example, what is poetry? What do we [66:53] call poetry? Aristotle said poetry is [66:56] about fiction, while history is about [66:59] reality. Chinese people don't discuss [67:01] ...hmm. [67:01] >> Chinese people don't discuss this; what [67:04] do Chinese people discuss? "The purpose [67:06] of words." It can be beautiful, it can [67:08] be functional—it serves all sorts of [67:10] purposes, but we don't discuss what it [67:12] essentially*is*. So, when Chinese [67:15] science began, it inherently had a [67:17] correspondence with human order, with [67:19] what we call logic and morality. Yes, I [67:24] think Professor Feng, I believe you are [67:27] also a nationalist, right? He is [67:30] certainly full of pride for his own [67:32] nation's culture, that's for sure. [67:34] However, from much of the knowledge he [67:36] shares, I feel there is a lot worth [67:38] discussing. For instance, there is [67:40] another point of his that left an [67:41] impression on me. Just like what you [67:43] said about ancient Greece. Well, [67:46] actually, in ancient Greek philosophy, [67:48] Plato and his contemporaries believed [67:50] the real world was imperfect, or not [67:52] entirely true. They believed that there [67:55] is a perfect world, which is the world [67:57] of ideas. It is the world of ideas. [68:00] >> Plato, however, compared to Professor [68:02] Feng's perspective, the ancient Greeks [68:04] were actually very idealistic, quite [68:07] preoccupied with abstraction, whereas [68:09] the exploration by ancient Chinese [68:11] ancestors was characterized by a [68:12] particularly pragmatic attitude. For [68:16] instance, look at the three circles of [68:18] the Hongshan culture. These three [68:20] circles actually present a mathematical [68:22] relationship, a form of understanding [68:24] within ancient Chinese mathematics. [68:26] What emerged later was a truly [68:28] incredible number. The three-tiered [68:31] circular altar we see before us has [68:33] another magical feature: its diameters [68:35] from inner to outer are 11 meters, 15.6 [68:38] meters, and 22 meters respectively. At [68:42] first glance, these three numbers seem [68:44] unrelated, but after calculation, one [68:46] finds that the ratio of the diameters [68:48] of adjacent circles is the square root [68:50] of two. [68:52] >> Just this number, the square root of [68:54] two. This number, the square root of [68:57] two, is actually quite challenging in [68:59] the history of human mathematics. When [69:02] people study mathematics, realizing [69:05] that 3 squared is 9 or the square root [69:07] of 9 is 3 is nothing remarkable. But if [69:12] you realize that a number squared [69:14] equals 2, that is an amazing discovery; [69:16] the square root of 2 is that number, [69:18] and while this number did not trigger [69:20] any crisis in China, it was different [69:23] in ancient Greece. It almost triggered [69:27] a situation that would overturn the [69:29] entire academic system built by [69:31] Pythagoras, including many knowledge [69:33] systems based on it. [69:35] >> I heard that the Pythagorean school [69:37] even killed someone because of this [69:38] square root of two. [69:39] >> Yes, they killed someone. [69:41] >> How did that happen? [69:42] >> Because in ancient Greece, they used [69:44] geometry to represent this concept—a [69:46] square, the ratio of its side to its [69:48] diagonal, which is also a special right [69:51] triangle; if the side length is 1, the [69:53] diagonal is the square root of two. The [69:58] Pythagorean school then discovered that [70:00] this ratio of the side to the diagonal [70:02] could not be measured by any common [70:03] unit of measurement. You couldn't [70:07] measure it. If you could measure the [70:11] side, you couldn't measure the diagonal [70:13] ; to the ancient Greeks, such a number [70:15] was considered inexpressible. It had no [70:19] ratio; it was irrational. If this fact [70:22] were acknowledged, then Pythagorean [70:24] philosophy would be overturned. [70:26] >> According to the earliest scientific [70:28] definitions, if one premise doesn't [70:30] hold, the whole theory falls apart. [70:32] >> How was this matter handled later? The [70:34] Pythagorean school decreed that this [70:36] matter must not be spoken of, keeping [70:38] it a secret. Later, a follower revealed [70:41] it, and that person was thrown into the [70:43] sea. They were silenced. [70:45] >> They believed it was an integer. [70:47] >> Right, an integer or a ratio of [70:49] integers. It is impossible for these [70:51] irrational numbers to exist, because [70:53] the Chinese did not have this [70:55] preconceived notion that it must be an [70:57] integer ratio, so we can confidently [70:59] calculate the decimal approximation of [71:01] those irrational roots. You can [71:03] calculate as many decimal places as you [71:05] want. That is the Chinese concept.